One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: mightytiges on September 18, 2004, 02:01:17 AM
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Ottens a man in demand
18 September 2004
Herald Sun
Mike Sheahan
ALL things being equal, Terry Wallace will construct the Richmond forward division around the imposing frame of Brad Ottens next year.
The new coach has earmarked Ottens for the goalsquare, with Matthew Richardson, Richmond's leading goalkicker for 10 of the past 11 seasons, to be operate from just inside the 50m arc.
The wily Wayne Campbell would play alongside Ottens, with Nathan Brown and Andrew Krakouer roaming the forward 50 for spoils at ground level.
It's an exciting scenario, but there's one major proviso: the availability of Ottens.
The ruckman-forward is out of contract and up to six clubs are after him.
It is understood Ottens' managers are seriously considering two offers, with Sydney leading the chase ahead of Geelong.
Ottens, 24, has been told his financial arrangements are about to change after three disappointing seasons.
The Tigers's offer is believed to have a significantly reduced guaranteed payment with incentives that would enable him to earn as much as he was paid this year, about $400,000, if he performs to the expected required level.
To date, he has been paid on potential, even allowing injuries, including a major back problem and an ankle he carried for much of the past season.
Richmond needs money spend and room in its salary cap if it is to land an established player such as Fremantle's out-of-contract ruckman-forward Troy Simmonds.
That money will come from the senior group, including Darren Gaspar and Ottens, two of the club's best paid players.
Sydney's general manager of football operations Andrew, Ireland, has confirmed his club's interest in Ottens.
"We've spoken to his management (Elite Sports Properties)," Ireland said last night.
"As (coach) Paul (Roos) has said, we're keen to secure experienced players during the trade period."
The Swans see Ottens as a ruckman who could relieve and then replace Jason Ball, who turns 32 in November.
The Cats see him as a key forward, probably centre half-forward.
Ottens recently had an operation to repair damage to an ankle that has bothered him for most of the season.
He played 18 of 22 games but failed to deliver on expectations. He averaged 13 disposals and five marks and kicked 16 goals.
His best season was 2001 when he kicked 46 goals in 24 games.
http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,10797246%255E19771,00.html
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Just keep him!!!! HE said at hte end of last season did not want to renegotiate as he wanted to wait and see how his form was rather than on potential. Time for him to repay us and stay loyal.
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The new coach has earmarked Ottens for the goalsquare, with Matthew Richardson, Richmond's leading goalkicker for 10 of the past 11 seasons, to be operate from just inside the 50m arc.
The wily Wayne Campbell would play alongside Ottens, with Nathan Brown and Andrew Krakouer roaming the forward 50 for spoils at ground level.
Finally a coach that realises Richo isn't a FF and Otto is a forward!
I always liked the idea of Cambo playing forward. He's a good mark for his size and good on a lead. Unfortunately resting midfielders up forward has been a rarity at Tigerland.
The Tigers's offer is believed to have a significantly reduced guaranteed payment with incentives that would enable him to earn as much as he was paid this year, about $400,000, if he performs to the expected required level.
If the above is true then this sort of performance based contract for Otto seems a fair deal to me. If Otto doesn't accept it then it's for the long term best of the RFC that he gets traded.
Not sure what we would get from the Swans or Cats in any case. Their first round picks will be in the mid-teens so I'd expect more than that in exchange and they can only offer midfielders that we'd be interested in such as a Bolton or Bartels.
I agree Shawry and I hope Otto realises that, accepts our offer and stays. Unlike Spud, Wallace actually understands modern footy and I'd reckon Otto will blossom underneath him.
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The new coach has earmarked Ottens for the goalsquare, with Matthew Richardson, Richmond's leading goalkicker for 10 of the past 11 seasons, to be operate from just inside the 50m arc.
The wily Wayne Campbell would play alongside Ottens, with Nathan Brown and Andrew Krakouer roaming the forward 50 for spoils at ground level.
THANK YOU :bow :bow :bow :bow :bow
Amazing how simple it is,huh ?
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Now all we need is about 5 capable midfielders to deliver the ball to them and we're in the mix
LMFAOOOOOO@Hyde
LMFAOOOOOO@Fleming
LMFAOOOOOO@Tivendale
LMFAOOOOOO@Fiora
LMFAOOOOOO@Rodan
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It is understood Ottens' managers are seriously considering two offers, with Sydney leading the chase ahead of Geelong.
Funny I didn't think it was his managers' decision. Why are they considering the offers - shouldn't Brad be considering the offers?
Actually why are they "entertaining offers" from rival clubs - I thought their client had said he wanted to stay at Richmond? >:(
Oh that's right commission - silly me ::)
Ottens, 24, has been told his financial arrangements are about to change after three disappointing seasons.
The Tigers's offer is believed to have a significantly reduced guaranteed payment with incentives that would enable him to earn as much as he was paid this year, about $400,000, if he performs to the expected required level.
To date, he has been paid on potential, even allowing injuries, including a major back problem and an ankle he carried for much of the past season.
If this is true then this is a very very fair and reasonable deal.
Just keep him!!!! HE said at hte end of last season did not want to renegotiate as he wanted to wait and see how his form was rather than on potential. Time for him to repay us and stay loyal.
Spot on Shawry - as I said if Sheahan's article is true then it is a very fair and it puts the challenge to the player to perform. If it is good enough for others.........
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Because he hasnt signed yet and because of our teams financial troubles
I cant help but think that perhaps Richmond are seriously looking at trading Ottens.
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Ottens set to quit the Tigers and head north to Sydney
Greg Denham
September 22, 2004
OFF-contract Richmond ruckman Brad Ottens is poised to leave Punt Road to join Sydney next year.
The Swans have moved quickly on Ottens, who could become the highest-profile player to swap clubs via the AFL's official player-exchange period early next month.
The 24-year-old has been offered a reduced new contract by the cash-strapped Tigers.
Ottens played this season on about $450,000, but has been asked to take a pay cut of up to $130,000 a year for at least the next two seasons.
Sydney has sounded out Ottens and is understood to be preparing to offer his management a long-term deal with the capacity to earn up to $500,000 a year.
The Swans, who have up to $1million to spare under their salary cap limit, are desperate to recruit one or two high-profile players over the next 12 months, their first since snaring full-forward Barry Hall from St Kilda three years ago.
Sydney coach Paul Roos yesterday said he had identified a ruckman and a midfielder as priority recruits before the Swans could be consistently competitive against the best.
"I've spoken to Brad and he's certainly of interest to us," Roos said.
"We certainly need a ruckman and Ottens fits the model."
Sydney has decided to increase its total player payments next year to attract class players after severe cost-cutting because of combined operating losses of more than $3m in 2002 and 2003.
Ottens is believed to have had a change of heart since he declared in June that he wanted to play out his career with Richmond.
His management group, ESP, yesterday did not want to buy into Ottens' future, only to say he was "undecided". He is scheduled to return from holiday next week.
Sydney will attempt to satisfy the Tigers by offering a player, most likely to be defender Jason Saddington, and an early draft choice for Ottens.
Richmond, set to post a $2.2m loss this year, is implementing severe cuts to its football department of up to $800,000 before next season.
The two most affected players are Darren Gaspar, who has agreed to serve out the final two years of his contract by accepting a $300,000 cut, and Ottens, who has had a wretched past two seasons because of injury and poor form. He failed to poll a Brownlow Medal vote this season.
In 2003 a back injury kept him out for the first half of the year, and, after playing below par for most of the first 18 rounds this season, he fractured his lower leg.
http://http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,10838561%255E2722,00.html
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For all his faults...we'd want more than Saddington :banghead
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pee off Brad if you're chasing the money
You're overrated anyway :o
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Pee off Brad whether you want to stay or whether you want to go. You are overrated!
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If this is true,I wish him complete failure and may career debilitating injuries be the throng of his downfall.
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I just hope his mother follows him to Sydney - the dog deserves it lol
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i also rekkonn roos is a dikhed and will struggle in the next 3 years
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I will hold my tongue until it is a done deal :shh
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LMFAOOOOOOOOOOOOO@Saddington and a pick. Would rather lose him for nothing than cop that insulting offer.
450,000 clear on the salary cap. We are off to a good start already!
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LMFAOOOOOOO@me thinking he is overrated and thinking a draft pick and saddington aren't good enough for him.
lmfaoooooooo@this paradox.
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Not happy that he is going (thank you Spud!) but if he wants to leave then in the long run it's better that he goes. The way the article is written it comes across as he's money chasing.
It's amusing how everyone lays into brisbane for having the extra cap to retain their players yet the Swans are never mentioned. How are the Swans allowed to use it to poach players? $500K offer for Otto, $400K for Simmonds plus they want a midfielder as well.
It now appears we'll chase hard after Simmonds but replacing players isn't going to improve our list. We are short of talls as it is and now only have the aging and injury prone Stafford as a ruckman.
As for a trade - the Swans first pick will be around 14 or 15. Not really an early first round pick. And as for Saddington - please NO!
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At least with Saddington you'd know he was behind the club - he's always wanted to come to the Tiges.
Isn't Col Saddington his dad?
That old bloke behind the goals up there would be a good trade for Ottens!
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this is all about money guys, lets move him on, sydney will have to do some shopping around to get us a better draft pick, they can stick their pick 14 up their ass, we want at least a pick in the top 5-10 and a player with at least some ability.
this is when as a club hold our ground here and let it be known that we wont be dictated to by greedy players anymore, we have wasted too much coin on this under achiever.
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this is when as a club hold our ground here and let it be known that we wont be dictated to by greedy players anymore
Totally agree, but i really don't blame the players - the clubs are the stupid ones for letting them dictate. Should be the clubs saying, if you want more money than you're worth, then go - should have done it with Gaspar years ago, but we were too stupid.
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He has been extremely disappointing over the past three years and its no secret he is chasing money.
Collingwood offered him heaps and now the swans have stepped in.
You will find he will leave the Tigers against his wishes of his family ;)
Bye Brad, lets all move on and close an era of the RFC we arent proud of which you have been a major part of.
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Greg Miller was on SEN just before 8.00am and said in summary:
- The only true bit of the article is the fact that Ottens is out of contract.
- He is aware that Sydney & Geelong have spoken to Ottens.
- Brad understands why he has been offered a reduced contract - he's been paid on potential for too long.
- Brad's management would know that it is not in thier client's best interest to leave Melbourne.
- It isn't smart to take an offer to play for money - the pressure is enormous.
- There still has to be a trade and Sydney's record at trade time isnt great - he cited last years Ray Hall situation when the Swans contacted the Tigers at 10.00am on the last day.
and finally....
- He (Miller) is still confident that Ottens will be at Richmond next year.
We will wait and see what happens....
Oh yeah as a sidebar - the team will be going for a training run next week (Tuesday)
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$200,000 a year more might be the thing, for a 24 year old, thats good money !
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$200,000 a year more might be the thing, for a 24 year old, thats good money !
There are far more important things in the world than money :cheers ;)
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You tell Brad that as his family cant !
he is aware that he has under performed though
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WP's summary of what Miller said is a good indication of the situation.
The artilcle is too clever - says that he has "the potential" to earn $500k in Sydney but neglects to say he has the same potential to earn as much at Richmond as he did this year if he hits performance targets.
Jackstar - I understand from a very good source that he hasn't been approached by Collingwood.
He and his family are well settled in Melbourne. He has purchased a house. His mother has recently invested serious dollars into a franchise business and his brother has moved back from Adelaide. It would be a major upheaval for him to move interstate.
It's not fair to accuse him of chasing the dollar. The simple fact is that his contract is up for renewal
and the club has made him an offer that is structured very differently to the one that he had previously (it's more performance based but could end up close to what he earned this year.)
Surely he is entitled to take his time in deciding his future? He has stated publicly that he would prefer to stay so let's just give him some time to make a decision - there is a very good chance that he will stay.
He's only 24 - I can't believe we can bag the guy who has been carrying serious back and ankle injuries for the past two years and has 6 or 7 years of service ahead of him. Guys his size and ability don't come easily - and we aren't exactly overflowing with talent are we?
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Maybe some of the stuff being said and written is unfair on Otto, but you have to wonder why it’s taken so long for him to sign. His season ended a few weeks before Round 22 and he’s had more than ample time to consider his situation. How difficult is it to know whether you want to stay or go?
According to Miller on SEN this morning, Otto would have no real gripe with Richmond about how he’s been treated and looked after, off the field.
You have to wonder why then he would want to leave and why he’s being ‘shopped around’. And, unless there’s something else we don’t know about, money would seem to be the major reason, because it looks as though Otto and his management are milking this to see what they can get. Good on them for looking after their own interests, but there are two parties involved here and we don’t need Otto at any inflated price.
Setting aside whether he’s overrated or not, you have to think that whatever it is that helps Brisbane retain their players, we just don’t have it. So it could be seen as an indictment on RFC that he would want to leave now, especially when a new coach has just been appointed. Then again, when Cogs re-signed, with all the turmoil that was going on at the time, you would think he had every reason to look elsewhere, but instead signed without any fuss.
So, if Otto’s just interested in the money then let him go. Because, unless a Coach/Club can get something different out of him, in the long run, these sorts of players generally aren’t of any real value to any team.
Headland has been the only player Brisbane has ‘lost’ over the last few seasons and he left because he wanted to go back home. Even though he may have ability, you have to question where his priorities are and how committed he really is when he needs the comfortable surrounds of his home and family to play at his best.
And if Otto needs money to play at his best and, after all these years of being at RFC, he repays them by kicking them in the guts and needs to be convinced to stay put then let him go.
Players don’t do themselves any favours by allowing these things to drag on and on, without good reason. And in situations like this, you just have to wonder how serious some of them are about the game, why they play and where their priorities are.
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Collingwood have approached Ottens manager, FACT !
Stop making excuses for players, dont see Michael Voss complaining about seriously breaking a leg and playing 12 months later.
Dont seem James Hird complaining either, get over him please.
No Brownlow votes says it all. thats why we are on the bottom of the ladder
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I can't believe we can bag the guy who has been carrying serious back and ankle injuries for the past two years
Sounds like even more reason to get rid of him - if he can't shrug these injuries, what good is he? He played since half way through the season (when it was over for us). If it's not Ottens, it's bad player management again, not allowing him to recuperate from injuries. We had nothiing to lose by resting him.
It's not fair to accuse him of chasing the dollar.
Very fair in my book. If he wasn't chasing money, and squeezing the club for whatever he can get, he would have signed on the dotted line ages ago, even if that was for less money - because he ain't worth what he was getting, and even he would have known that.
I say good luck to him if he can get good money elsewhere, but don't try and bleed us dry. He hasn't performed to expectations, and i don't care if he's got another 6 or 7 years in front of him, to me at this moment, he's just another Fiora - unfulfilled potential.
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LMFAOOOOOOO@me thinking he is overrated and thinking a draft pick and saddington aren't good enough for him.
lmfaoooooooo@this paradox.
The hazards of Anarchy mate ~
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I'll post what I have posted earlier today
Tell the swans to stick saddington
We want O'Keefe and their first round pick, if not sell Ottens off to the best offer from anyone else wanting him
450,000 a year? i almost choked on my breakfast............. We should make Ottens pay back atleast 400,000 of that money.
No wonder we are broke with players like Ottens and Gaspar bleeding us dry!!!
and I'm actually loving this I been saying it all year WE DONT NEED BRAD NOTTENS!!! I hope he does go, we will be better off in the long run!
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wow - you guys/gals are soooooooooooooooo hard.
Hate to be negotiating with you lot - you're scary :help
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Surely he is entitled to take his time in deciding his future? He has stated publicly that he would prefer to stay so let's just give him some time to make a decision - there is a very good chance that he will stay.
Believe me RonB I am not going to bag him - far to early because no decision has been made.
Personally, I want him to stay because of the very reason you state, a bloke his size and agility don't drop from the sky and I also because I honestly believe that with a new coach he has a great chance to improve.
Having said that, I think with Brad saying publicly he wants to stay and now this thing being dragged on longer and longer people are questioning whether he really wants to stay. Call me naive but if you wanted to stay you wouldn't be talking to other parties - even if your management is tapping you on the shoulder saying "look at this look at this". At the end of the day his management must do what he wants.
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Maybe we are sick of being the easybeats Ronnie.
Get rid of Brad Ottens please.
Even you were telling me about his ruck work, well I am sorry to inform you that his ruck work is crap, No votes in Brownlow proves that. What about contested MARKS.
Brad Ottens is a dreamer, let him go.
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wow - you guys/gals are soooooooooooooooo hard.
We're pussycats, Ronnie :-*
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What about contested MARKS.
I haven't got the exact numbers with me but Brad Ottens was running second at Richmond in contested marks before his injury this season (could have finished second behind Richo).
I think he took around 30 contested marks which at the time he was injured was just behind Nick Reiwoldt - who contested marks % against total marks is terrible.
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Honestly, I cant remember Brad taking a pack mark all year. Can remember Richos many
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A lot of angst and anger in this thread.........How come I can always rely on Ox and JohnF to bring that smile to my face with a killer post...... :bow to you guys, farken classic...
Me personally, I aint going to jump any guns but I do feel that he is overated. He was never a ruckman...his performances have been pathetic to say the least.
I take the opinion that if he wants to stay its for less money, otherwise he can leave. Whatever he chooses, I dont personally care....Im not fussed if he leaves and well if he stays for less money we wont hammer for under-performing.
As for the Saddington deal......I would take that in a flash. For the way Otto has performed, and for the release it will provide on the cap, its a fair deal.
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The offer we have before Otto is fair. If he chooses to leave then so be it but as Ronny B said big men of his quality (and you'll see it under Paul Roos' coaching if he ends up at the Swans) don't grow on trees. We do have some quality players on our list but it's hard to shine when your coaches have NFI and most of your teammates have the skills and decision making of a little leaguer. Our foot skills have the been by far the worst of any VFL/AFL for the past 20 years. For crying out loud we even de-skill many of our good players over time :help.
Trading Otto isn't going to solve our problems when he is just another case of our Club's inability to develop and get the best out of our players. What confidence is there based on our past recent history that our current crop of young kids and the first rounder draftees we draft this year won't become similar casualities of this Club's "player with potential" tag. Because right now that's all they are - kids with potential. When was the last talented kid we've had that has reached their full potential? I can't remember!
Add to this a playing list that thanks to Frawley and Geischen is made up of mostly flanker types (most not up to AFL standard) and where one injury to our inadequate number of talls destroys any from of structure required to win modern games of footy.
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FWIW I am begging to hope we have ourselves a bidding war boys.
Hopefully the western bullfrorgs acn pass around the hat and get the big dope fired up enough.
Then it will be pick 3 here we come!!!!
Pick 1 3 4
Now thats setting up the club for the next 10 years.
I am gunna have to rename my cat Coggles :banghead
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Trading Otto isn't going to solve our problems when he is just another case of our Club's inability to develop and get the best out of our players.
I understand your point MT, but I think it well help our cause. And the reason why I think we should let him go, if he wants out, has nothing to do with what he is capable of. We know that, at another Club with a better system in place, any play could do better.
But you have to question Otto’s change of heart, since saying that he wanted to stay at RFC a few months ago to now having himself ‘shopped around’ for a better deal. Why does he play the game, where’s his motivation?
If he has valid reasons for wanting to go then so be it. What I can’t get my head around is that Otto’s first season at Richmond was in 1998. You would think that, in that time, he would have developed some sort of relationship with the Club and teammates.
For whatever reason, whenever these contract renewals come around, some players just seem to forget all about those things that some of us see as important and relevant and chase the money. If that’s what his motivation for playing footy is then someone else can have him.
And because these players aren’t motivated by the things that drive competitive players and the best players, in a big game, or crunch situation, these sorts of players become of little value to a team.
If he can go to another Club and play better then good luck to him, but from what this situation tells us about Otto, it doesn’t seem to me that he will be of any more value to us than he has been to now.
So, unless Terry Wallace can work some magic with him, we are better off to bring in some more youth into the side. As cold as it may sound, he can be a bigger help to us by leaving than staying. Because Miller has shown that, if you know what you are doing, you can draft players who already have the desire and commitment to play and also have a competitive edge to them.
I wanted to believe that Otto could be turned around, but his contract re-negotiation shows that it could be a hard task to do that when he’s driven by money, rather than playing the game and the challenge ahead.
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Trading Ottens will go a long way into solving our problems
For a start it would be a reminder to anyone joining Richmond that we no longer tolerate non performances or players looking to make a quick buck.
I hope he does go, he has given this club nothing in his time here, so what if he goes to the swans and becomes a star, good for them my patience has run out for under performing half hearted peas.
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It's not quite true to say that this has been dragging on for too long. Ottens has been overseas for two weeks and the offer from Richmond was only put to him around three weeks ago. It's also presuming a lot to say that he is chasing the dollar - how does anybody know that?
This is out of his mouth on August 29...
He said he had met new coach Terry Wallace and was keen to end his career as a one-club player.
"Hopefully, we can get it all sorted out as soon as possible," Ottens said.
"I would be rapt to stay in Melbourne and hopefully we can get it all organised as soon as possible and get on with training and thinking about 2005.
"It's my main priority. Staying my whole career at one club is pretty important to me and I'd love to stay a Tiger."
Ottens said he and Wallace had already had a face-to-face discussion.
"I have spoken briefly to Terry and I hadn't had a whole lot to do with him in the past, so it was just good to meet him and see where he thought I was at and get a few of his ideas," Ottens told Triple M.
"He said he can see a bit of improvement in the role that I play and a few changes and I took a lot out of the talk I had with him.
"I spoke to him in person to touch base and see where he saw the club going and the changes and improvements he was going to make was a pretty big benefit for me."
Ottens failed to make an impact this year before an ankle injury brought a premature end to the season and he admitted he needed to lift.
"I would be the first to admit it hasn't been my best year," he said. "I have a lot of work to do in a lot of areas."
Here's a scenario:
Take an 18 year old guy in the national draft, see him make All Australian in his 4th year, offer him a strong contract for the following three years, carry him through two serious injuries in the last two of those, see him average over a goal per game for his whole time with the club as a ruckman, offer him a reduced contract to stay, see him chased by a large number of clubs that are not stupid - and then let him go ?????
As Johny Howard would say........Hello !! - Hello !!
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As Johny Howard would say........Hello !! - Hello !!
or as i would say
Goodbye - Goodbye !!!
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Eat our own Alive
yep
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Hear hear fellow Nottens baggers!
Fact is he has produced 1 good year in 7 and has become a millionaire as a result. You just know he's the type of player who will produce 3 good years in his whole career and milk any club he belongs to.
Personally I couldn't care whether he wants to stay or leave. He deserves to be treated like a red-headed stepchild.
Trade him and the mum he rode in on!
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Ottens set to quit the Tigers and head north to Sydney
Greg Denham
September 22, 2004
Ottens is believed to have had a change of heart since he declared in June that he wanted to play out his career with Richmond.
His management group, ESP, yesterday did not want to buy into Ottens' future, only to say he was "undecided". He is scheduled to return from holiday next week.
Fair enough RonBranton. Your quotes are from Otto, whereas The Australian states things like, “Ottens is believed …”, etc. Just the same, there are a few more twists and turns to this than just a regulation re-signing.
And you have to wonder about these things when it didn’t seem to take Andrew Krakouer too long to re-sign.
Might be a different set of circumstances, but I can never work out why some players re-sign without so much as a murmur and others seem to need a major rumble before they sign.
More trouble than they're worth sometimes.
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Ronnie, i think most Richmond supporters would see the damage already done in signing guys on big contracts - remember Daffy - and then getting no return. Isn't it time we changed our policy? No use wishing and hoping Ottens will come good any more - he's had time enough to repay the "faith" the RFC has put in him. He has to his own admission admitted he has not come up to expectations and said he has a lot to do in a lot of areas. Doesn't this warrant him reviewing his own salary downwards? If he wants to stay at the Tiges, he has to take a cut or is performance based. If the club get sucked in by another player bleeding us dry, heaven help them.
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Trading Otto isn't going to solve our problems when he is just another case of our Club's inability to develop and get the best out of our players.
I understand your point MT, but I think it well help our cause. And the reason why I think we should let him go, if he wants out, has nothing to do with what he is capable of. We know that, at another Club with a better system in place, any play could do better.
But you have to question Otto’s change of heart, since saying that he wanted to stay at RFC a few months ago to now having himself ‘shopped around’ for a better deal. Why does he play the game, where’s his motivation?
If he has valid reasons for wanting to go then so be it. What I can’t get my head around is that Otto’s first season at Richmond was in 1998. You would think that, in that time, he would have developed some sort of relationship with the Club and teammates.
For whatever reason, whenever these contract renewals come around, some players just seem to forget all about those things that some of us see as important and relevant and chase the money. If that’s what his motivation for playing footy is then someone else can have him.
And because these players aren’t motivated by the things that drive competitive players and the best players, in a big game, or crunch situation, these sorts of players become of little value to a team.
If he can go to another Club and play better then good luck to him, but from what this situation tells us about Otto, it doesn’t seem to me that he will be of any more value to us than he has been to now.
So, unless Terry Wallace can work some magic with him, we are better off to bring in some more youth into the side. As cold as it may sound, he can be a bigger help to us by leaving than staying. Because Miller has shown that, if you know what you are doing, you can draft players who already have the desire and commitment to play and also have a competitive edge to them.
I wanted to believe that Otto could be turned around, but his contract re-negotiation shows that it could be a hard task to do that when he’s driven by money, rather than playing the game and the challenge ahead.
I don't disagree with anything you're saying TS and if he's just after money then I agree it's better that he goes. However, a player or more likely in Otto's case his manager checking out other offers doesn't necessarily mean Otto doesn't want to play for us or doesn't have some connection or loyalty to Richmond. For example Dean Solomon had one foot in Punt Road Oval last year before changing his mind at the last minute out of loyalty towards his teammates and Essendon. Some like Cogs have no hesistation in re-signing while others look at more security, money, a better lifestyle, a life after footy, less media attention, etc...
Given to stay he needs to take a base pay cut (he can still earn roughly the same as now if he performs to the level we expect of him), if Otto comes out in the next week or so and says something like "I gave my future much thought but in the end playing for the Tigers with my teammates and wanting to be a one-team player was the overriding factor" then I don't think he would shown any disloyalty or contradiction nor bent the Club over a barrel.
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At the end of the day. Ottens has under achieved big time. The man they call BIG SEXY is nothing than a BIG DUD.
Can anyone tell me when this $400,000 player won a game of his own boot. ?Ahhhhhh The silence is deafening. I thought it was the case , really
His management spoke to possible deal with the pies as early as July/ August.
Any player comimg out of contract is usually contacted at least 3 months before.
John F is 100 % correct, 1 good year in 7. Enough said and dont forget where on the bottom. I wonder why !
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Lets turn the tables and milk him for all his worth or should that be worthlessness!?
If we can snare another first round draft pick and some recycled hacks rather than pay Nottens $400,000 i think we can turn this club around.
Enough with paying on potential! Lets get everyone on performance based earning.
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The man they call BIG SEXY is nothing than a BIG DUD.
I tend to disagree......Big Sexy to me is Kevin Nash....one of the most overrated wrestlers in the industry. He demands everything but is a disgrace of a performer......
Ring any bells? Maybe thats why he got the nickname and he didnt even know it......
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lmfaoooo@Big Sexy, another thing he is being overrated on, his looks!
Agree with Disco about putting everyone on performance based contracts. We'd quickly fix our problems with debt.
Ottens if he stays should be put on a 50k base salary with the potential to earn up to 600k if he performs up to scratch. Would be surprised if he earns over 100k - and that's over a two year period!
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If we can snare another first round draft pick and some recycled hacks rather than pay Nottens $400,000 i think we can turn this club around.
I agree Disco - get the club using it's bargaining power in times like this. Miller's not gonna let this guy play hardballl with us surely - i see a good result out of this one hopefully, as long as the club hold their ground. Pay cut for Ottens or nothing at all!
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ROFLFMAOOo om21, when you look at it that way he does deserve the title.
Or maybe its becuase he likes to rest his nutbag on guys heads before he slams them.
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ROFLFMAOOo om21, when you look at it that way he does deserve the title.
Or maybe its becuase he likes to rest his nutbag on guys heads before he slams them.
HAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH
LMAO @ Otto doing the 'square up' hand motion before he goes for a nothing hitout in the ruck....
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;D :lol ROFLMFAOOOOOooo!!
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Until he actually gets back from holidays (perhaps he's cruising down the Nile with Clinton ;D) and makes his decision and then announcement it is all speculation.
We still hold the aces if it comes to a trade situation - Greg Miller said as much this morning. Remember back in '95 when Lockett original said I wanna go to Richmond and we couldn't do a trade - same thing can happen here
But I have to hand it to these Player Managers - they are the pits sometimes. I really do wonder if they do concern themselves with their clients futures or just worry about their own 10% ::)
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We really can't lose from this situation. Either -
a) he decides to stay at a significantly lower amount; or
b) he is traded to the highest bidder of which there seems to be plenty of interested parties willing to offer quite a bit; or
Miller must now stand his ground and wait till October 4-8. If Ottens doesn't sign then it's auction time.
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Miller must now stand his ground and wait till October 4-8.
Got that exact feeling when listening to Greg Miller this morning HarryH that is what he intends to do.
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However, a player or more likely in Otto's case his manager checking out other offers doesn't necessarily mean Otto doesn't want to play for us or doesn't have some connection or loyalty to Richmond.
I don’t disagree with that MT. Anyone has the right to do what’s in their best interests, and maybe it’s just a coincidence, but this is contract renewal number two for Otto where he seems to need to be convinced to stay.
You’d reckon he’d know by now whether he wants to be here or not. Just doesn’t seem that difficult a decision to make.
You have to wonder about players who let Managers ‘further their cause’, because it doesn’t actually help the player at all. It just paints them in a bad light and maybe Otto’s management has a lot to answer for here, as you say.
You wonder too about these managers sometimes, because it’s the Players who suffer by having their name dragged around in some long winded saga that makes them seem money hungry. I suppose the managers don't care as long as they get their cut.
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I reckon this is the solution. The club says Brad, you are on $250,000 a year. Win the best and fairest and there,s an extra $100,000. If you dont like that deal, go to the Swans for $500,000 as the Richmond Club is not a charity, not anymore anyway
No wonder we are 2m in debt ! ::)
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You have to wonder about players who let Managers ‘further their cause’, because it doesn’t actually help the player at all. It just paints them in a bad light and maybe Otto’s management has a lot to answer for here, as you say.
You wonder too about these managers sometimes, because it’s the Players who suffer by having their name dragged around in some long winded saga that makes them seem money hungry. I suppose the managers don't care as long as they get their cut.
If a manager is on a % then a salary cut means less money for the manager. I'm sure they're not happy about that. Add to that while the player's name gets dragged through the mud as you say TS, the manager's reputation in his job probably goes up as he can boast to future clients about the time he scored this great deal for so and so by putting such and such club over the barrel.
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I reckon this is the solution. The club says Brad, you are on $250,000 a year. Win the best and fairest and there,s an extra $100,000. If you dont like that deal, go to the Swans for $500,000 as the Richmond Club is not a charity, not anymore anyway
That offer is most likely on the table as we type and IMO will become common amongst all out "better" players as their contracts come up for renewal. If Brown is on $375K, Cogs $300K and Johnson $275K then no one else at Tigerland bar probably Richo should be near those figures until they prove over a few years that they deserve them.
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Ottens 'should stay a Tiger'
By Lyall Johnson
realfooty.theage.com.au
September 23, 2004
Richmond is confident out-of-contract ruckman Brad Ottens has "every reason" to stay at the club despite being asked to accept a pay cut believed to be more than $120,000.
Due largely to injury, Ottens has performed well below expectation in the past two years. This year did not poll a Brownlow vote.
The Sydney Swans, with up to a $1 million buffer under their salary-cap restriction, have spoken to Ottens and Geelong is also believed to be a strong contender for Ottens' services with significant room to move under the salary cap.
Yet according to Greg Miller, Richmond's director of football, Ottens, who until the end of this season was on a reputed $450,000 a year, feels an obligation to the Tigers, who have looked after him through injury and poor form. "We think Brad's got every reason to stay and no reason to leave," Miller said last night. "We think the relationship is good. He's one of the leaders of our club and he understands his pay had to come back a little bit.
"We've made a good offer to him - not as much as he used to get paid - but I think that's fair enough under the circumstances and he knows that's fair enough, too.
"I don't think players play for money that often, and I don't think that's a healthy circumstance for anyone to be in. We paid him on potential and if he goes for money it is a very hard weight to carry on your back."
New coach Terry Wallace spoke to Ottens soon after his appointment and told the ruckman he was an important part of his plans for Richmond.
Ottens is on holiday for a couple of weeks and the club feels no great urgency in signing him up because it sees there is no grievance between the parties. "We don't need to close the door at all. We can take it through to the first choice in the pre-season draft," Miller said.
http://www.realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2004/09/22/1095651394716.html
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"We don't need to close the door at all. We can take it through to the first choice in the pre-season draft," Miller said.
http://www.realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2004/09/22/1095651394716.html
That pretty much should sum it up for anyone trying to poach Otto and Otto himself.
Its 2004, gone are the huge contracts, paid for performance not for potential.
And most importantly, this club will not be held to ransom.
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The man they call BIG SEXY is nothing than a BIG DUD.
I tend to disagree......Big Sexy to me is Kevin Nash....one of the most overrated wrestlers in the industry. He demands everything but is a disgrace of a performer......
Ring any bells? Maybe thats why he got the nickname and he didnt even know it......
Big Sexy is nothing without Scott Hall ;)
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Tigers play hard ball with Ottens
23 September 2004
Herald Sun
Jon Pierik
SYDNEY will have to look elsewhere for a new ruckman after Richmond last night emphatically reiterated its desire to keep Brad Ottens.
And in a warning for the out-of-contract big man, Tigers coach Terry Wallace said he would look to use the club's No. 1 pick in the pre-season draft to hold on to Ottens, if he wanted out.
Sydney and Geelong are believed to be the frontrunners in a group of six clubs racing to snare Ottens' signature, with Swans coach Paul Roos having spoken to the 24-year-old.
But Wallace, into his fourth week in charge at Punt Rd, scotched rumours yesterday that Ottens was poised to sign with the Swans.
"I've had two conversations with Brad and he told me that he wanted to stay," he said.
"Unless I hear something different from him or his management, which I haven't heard, we're not going to jump to anything that is speculated by newspapers."
Wallace said Ottens, who is likely to play from the goalsquare next year with Matthew Richardson roaming around the 50m arc, was a required player.
"The Richmond Footy Club is in a position where we have first pick in the second draft," Wallace said. "So if you're an uncontracted player, we have the ability to pick them up, whether that be our own or others. That puts us in the pole position."
Ottens collected about $450,000 this year but has been asked to take a cut of more than $100,000 a year in the deal he is considering from the Tigers.
Richmond director of football Greg Miller believes Ottens has been paid on potential for too long -- and it's now time for results.
If the two parties cannot reach agreement, and Ottens wants out, the Tigers can either organise a trade or leave him to nominate for the pre-season draft.
The Tigers, as they do in the national draft, have the first pick there, with Hawthorn at No. 2, the Western Bulldogs at No. 3 and Collingwood at No. 4.
Geelong chief executive Brian Cook confirmed the Cats had spoken to Ottens' management but he was just one of several players the club was interested in.
http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,10850187%255E20322,00.html
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Tigers coach Terry Wallace said he would look to use the club's No. 1 pick in the pre-season draft to hold on to Ottens, if he wanted out.
"We can take it through to the first choice in the pre-season draft," Miller said.
Just curious what all this actually means?
I thought you couldn't re-draft your own delisted player in the PSD. However Weaver on BF says you still can but need the player's consent ???. It would be a waste of a PSD pick just to re-sign a player :-\ plus can't he then nominate his own terms? I also thought every Club had to lodge their list (including delistings) to the AFL well before both the National and PS drafts. Say the end of October!?!
On the other hand, does it mean that we're trying to send a message that if you want to be overpaid then don't expect us to help you leave to another club of your choosing and you'll be asked to take your chances in the PSD ??? Why would you want to keep him if he wants out!
I hope the Club knows the drafting rules better than I do at the minute lol.
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MT, I think you pretty much answered it yourself.
If we delist him, we cannot pick him up. We aren't delisting him.
I believe his contract runs until the end of the year
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One thing on Wallaces comment re picking him back up in draft( if possible )
Take note terry, if somebody wants to leave, let them go, dont be held to ransom by them.
Irrelevent in what is said in the papers, Brad must not be that happy at Tigerland otherwise he would have signed up again, its that simple !
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Just curious what all this actually means?
I thought you couldn't re-draft your own delisted player in the PSD. However Weaver on BF says you still can but need the player's consent ???. It would be a waste of a PSD pick just to re-sign a player :-\ plus can't he then nominate his own terms? I also thought every Club had to lodge their list (including delistings) to the AFL well before both the National and PS drafts. Say the end of October!?!
Your curious, I'm confused. He can nominate his own terms - and if he has to give consent to be re-drafted - it is likely that a player wouldn't so .... what does it all mean? I am confused.
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Jack,
I get a feeling this talk is all about increasing his trade value.
Ie if you don't get us a top 5 pick in the draft buldogs or sydney even if he walks we will redraft him.
I get the feeling that he will be traded for sure I also get the feeling that his back ia absolutely stuffed, and that is why he will go to the highest bidder, he probably has 2-3 years left.....heres hoping
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Spot on Blaisee, judgeing by how slow he was this year there is something wrong with him, I doubt he will see his true potential, whatever that might be?
Lets ramp his value up and get rid of him, inject some youth into our side the likes of Jackson and I think we have a fair trade!
Lets turn this club around once and for all!
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Lets have a team of goers, agree with you disco
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You really dont rate him do you Jackstar?
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out with the old in with the new.
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And I will explain why Shawry.
he is on $425 plus a year and i cant remember him winning a game off his own boot.
I can remember guys like Andrew Krakouer kicking 5 against the bombers last year and winning the game for us.Sorry but I cant remember Brad.
I have an issue with $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ If he was on the same money as Ray Hall, i probably wouldnt mind. Just remember we use 100 % of the salary cap and finished on the bottom , so its fair to say that something isnt right.
Gas has accepted a pay cut ($125,000) and has also stated he owes the club. Pity Brad doesnt do the same , except his Management go and talk to other clubs
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Spot on Jack!
Overated over paid Hack who didnt poll a vote in the brownlow!
The sooner we realise as a club that we need drastic change and by that i mean a youth policy which develops players into 300 gamers that are interested in the club and what the jumper stands for not. "How much can I squeeze out of this club!
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Again, all I will say is I'll wait and see what Brad has to say before giving him a spray...Like it or not, he is still currently an RFC employee, and I'll support him until he happens to officially become a money-grubbing, backstabbing idiot. :lol
Thank you for your time. :rollin
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Fence sitter Fwoy lol
Hey Shawry, the umps didn't rate him either - no votes!
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A leopard never changes its spots and I remember his contract renewal back in 2001. It might just be a quirky coincidence that things are unfolding in a similar-ish manner and it’s just in my nature to be cynical about these things.
However, your approach is probably a reasonable one at this stage Fwoy3. After all, do we know for sure whether it’s RFC who is stalling things or Otto and his management? And Otto isn't even here to defend himself.
We’ll see what unfolds … and then go all out attack. :rollin
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Fwoy = a fair and reasonable Richmond supporter lol
What's the world coming to hey!
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Again, all I will say is I'll wait and see what Brad has to say before giving him a spray...Like it or not, he is still currently an RFC employee, and I'll support him until he happens to officially become a money-grubbing, backstabbing idiot. :lol
Thank you for your time. :rollin
I'm with you Fwoy3.
I heard Ottens say he wants to stay and that he owes the club. Until I hear him say otherwise he's a champ who has the best interests of the club at heart.
The media twist the truth, omit facts and add bits for spice to sell stories. I doubt their normal practice has changed in reporting speculation about Ottens.
Example:
Tigers play hard ball with Ottens
Jon Pierik - Herald Sun
23sep04
"SYDNEY will have to look elsewhere for a new ruckman after Richmond last night emphatically reiterated its desire to keep Brad Ottens.
And in a warning for the out-of-contract big man, Tigers coach Terry Wallace said he would look to use the club's No. 1 pick in the pre-season draft to hold on to Ottens, if he wanted out."
Someone please set me straight, but I'm sure you can't redraft a player who puts himself into the PSD unless you meet his demands for $$$ and length of contract. If so, I'd say Jon Pierik is making it up because I have no doubt Wallace would know the rules.
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Fencesitting FishFinger-Fwoy - must be something in the letter F lol
FFS lol - this little effer doesn't share your opinion thank God :rollin
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Again, all I will say is I'll wait and see what Brad has to say before giving him a spray...Like it or not, he is still currently an RFC employee, and I'll support him until he happens to officially become a money-grubbing, backstabbing idiot. :lol
Thank you for your time. :rollin
I am with you on this one Fwoy3 - I am sure we will know soon. The moment he steps off the plane I sure some credible journo will be there to get the scope :lol
A leopard never changes its spots and I remember his contract renewal back in 2001. It might just be a quirky coincidence that things are unfolding in a similar-ish manner and it’s just in my nature to be cynical about these things.
The problems in 2000 - well I am not sure there was one because Brad said very little but the papers said alot about him going home.
The contract extension in early 2002 was a Mark Brayshaw special - promised members good news early in the season but it took until mid-season. Brayshaw had a habit of telling us good news when there was actually no news :thumbsup
Someone please set me straight, but I'm sure you can't redraft a player who puts himself into the PSD unless you meet his demands for $$$ and length of contract. If so, I'd say Jon Pierik is making it up because I have no doubt Wallace would know the rules.
Well FF I'm confused too but Weaver said on Big Footy that a player in the pre-season draft can be re-drafted by their old team if the player consents. Don't quite understand how it works to be honest. I have never ever seen a player re-drafted by their old team in the PSD.
Because if it comes to him nominating for the PSD (and I am now thinking it wont) then Brad Ottens can put a price on his head and if we were to re-draft him at his said price then that would defeat the purpose of them asking him to take a pay cut wouldn't it?
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Let's put some perspective on this.
Otto was All Australian in 2001 so I think he was entitled to a good contract (he was out of contract end of 2001.) His new one was for three years - low 300s, mid 300s and this year low 400s.
It was substantially below what was offered by Port Adelaide.
His contract is now up for renewal. He has been offered a reduced contract. His only public statements have been well considered, moderate and perfectly reasonable. He has been overseas for the past two weeks. Let's all take a deep breath and see what transpires - too much aggro being directed towards him imho.
;D ;D
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Journalists with little dix are responsible for this latest outburst.
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LMAO @ Ox breaking it down to it's bare...erm...bones ;D
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Caro strikes again lol
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Caro strikes again lol
Reminds me of a curse I once saw a guy put on someone:
"May all your children grow up with small penises, including the girls" :scream :bow :thumbsup :lol :shh :rollin
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Its time to be Argro!
He has only performed once in seven years which gave him his all Australian position, he hasnt performed and his salary is over the top!
As Miller said he owes the Tigers, and not having signed and with his management speaking with other clubs it doesnt take an Eistein to workout that he's going to change clubs.
Wallace and Miller aint no Spud! Hence the talk of drafting him back, lets ramp his price up and get young guys that want to perform!
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Whether he wants to stay or go I think it's in the club's best interests to trade him whilst he is still being overrated.
We'll never get another opportunity to get a first round draft pick and a player for a guy who has played one good season in seven.
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That may well be true John, but having seen 'journalists' put two and two together to come up with five often enough, I am willing to take the wait and see approach on this. No quotes from Ottens saying he wants out or doesn't accept the terms and conditions as yet.
Plenty of time to crucify him once his gone... :lol
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Whether he wants to stay or go I think it's in the club's best interests to trade him whilst he is still being overrated.
We'll never get another opportunity to get a first round daft pick and a player for a guy who has played one good season is seven.
Again I agree with you JohnF
the talk of wallace saying they would waste 1st pick in the PSD on him even if he leaves makes me feel ill.
WHY CANT PEOPLE SEE that he is a DUD?
I'll scream out until im blue in the face.... IM SICK OF RICHMOND PEOPLE OVERATING OUR OWN PLAYERS
get rid of him while there is interest from other clubs because in 2 years time when he has done jack poo he will be worth nothing.
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It's a bit harsh calling Ottens a dud and useless. He is an OK player, not great, and as such deserves to have his salary reduced. As his perceived value is greater than his actual value, we can really benefit from this situation if we play our cards right. We must portray the image that he is a required player and that we are desperate to hold onto him, even if it means we will re-draft him in the PSD. This will only increase his already inflated market value. It's working out well. We either hold onto Ottens at a reduced salary or we realise a great trade for him. The worst thing that can occur is if we bend over to his alleged demands, or if we do in fact re-draft him in the PSD with his hefty price tag.
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Whether he wants to stay or go I think it's in the club's best interests to trade him whilst he is still being overrated.
We'll never get another opportunity to get a first round daft pick and a player for a guy who has played one good season is seven.
Well, believe it or not JohnF, I think I’ve finally taken the blinkers off on this one and I’m starting to agree with you too.
I know a few months back I argued black and blue with you that we should keep Otto, but since then we’ve seen the difference in the quality of players recruited last season, compared to previous years. So I can now see the merit in what you say and that there’s probably more risk involved in keeping Otto than letting him go.
And if we’re ever going to take advantage of a bad situation then now is the time. It all sounds a bit cut throat and clinical, but unless we get ruthless and go about things for the long-term good of the Club, rather than the individual, then we’ll never get anywhere.
What’s more painful, letting one player go for the likes of another Hartigan or Jackson, or living with eternal mediocrity?
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TS :thumbsup
As far as I see it TS, there is nothing cut throat or clinical in getting rid of a player who has produced one good season in seven years and who became a millionaire as a result.
Far be it from cut throat and ruthless, we have been a charity to the guy and if he looks at it any other way he is delusional as to who he is and what he has produced.
Ottens is centainly not the only player at our club in such a position, but he is one of the few guys in such a position who we can capitalise on whilst there is still market value for him.
If I seem to be picking on him and leaving others like Gaspar off the hook its because Gaspar's worth has plummeted to zilch since his injury and there would really be no benefit in getting rid off him at this time.
Whilst there is no guarantee that with the trades we would get for Ottens we would develop any stars, I struggle to believe that we would end up with some players that have less of an influence on the game than Ottens.So I think it's worth taking a risk in trading him. We have more to gain than we do to lose.
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I will go on record as saying I want Ottens to stay. I understand that he has been paid on potential for a long time but I think he has given more than 1 good season. The offer before him is a good one and as I have said until he comes back and says he wants to go .....
1998/99 it is hard to know - he was a kid who made cameos.
Obviously, 2001 was his best, but 2000 when Richo was out for most of the year with that foot injury Ottens was one of our best.
2002 - well I cannot comment because for some reason that season is wiped from my memory :'(
I don't think he can be judged for 2003 because he missed half the season with a very serious back injury (having a family member who this year had the same surgery I know what rehab is involved and it is tough). That he played at all in 2003 was a credit to him.
2004 has been a huge disappointment - I agree and even Brad Ottens has agreed with that.
But I cannot get away from the fact that I think he will improve with a new coach that has obviously ear marked him to play forward rather than in the ruck. This is a good move because when he has played well it has been as forward who occassionally rucks not the other way around.
I understand that you have trade some decent to get high draft picks but I still think there are others who need to go before him. But we aren't exactly over stocked with talls.
Am I the only one who thinks that Terry Wallace can improve Brad Ottens?
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WP I think Terry can get a good season out of him.
The question is whether he will be able to maintain that form for a 3,4,5 year period.
I can see Ottens taking the path of someone like Jeff White. Has about 3 good years in his career and spends the intermittent years carrying a reputation bigger than what he deserves.
If we do keep him I hope I'm wrong...
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Your on drugs Ronnie, to say that he was an Australian makes no diiference as you are only as good as your last game. Andrew kellaway was an All Australian. ::)
We just hope that with new people making decisions , that we improve our list ,if we dont ,we are heading for back to back spoons, we will have a cutlery set at this rate if we dont change
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I will go on record as saying I want Ottens to stay. I understand that he has been paid on potential for a long time but I think he has given more than 1 good season. The offer before him is a good one and as I have said until he comes back and says he wants to go .....
But I cannot get away from the fact that I think he will improve with a new coach that has obviously ear marked him to play forward rather than in the ruck. This is a good move because when he has played well it has been as forward who occassionally rucks not the other way around.
I understand that you have trade some decent to get high draft picks but I still think there are others who need to go before him. But we aren't exactly over stocked with talls.
Am I the only one who thinks that Terry Wallace can improve Brad Ottens?
I'm with you WP. I believe Otto will improve under a real AFL coach like Wallace who understands that Otto is mainly a forward and not a ruckman and we drill into us how to play modern footy.
In 2001 Otto played as forward and got plenty of plaudits because people saw him do the spectacular things and kick plenty of goals. In 2002, he was moved into the ruck and had to carry the tall division virtually by himself when Stafford, Richo, Hall and Holland were all out injured for most of that year. IMO he still played well considering our lack of structure but obviously he didn't have the influence and spectacular games he had the year before. 2003 was a whitewash due to his back but his last few games back were very good IMO. 2004 was by far the poorest of the lot. He seemed disinterested like most of the team - did the tapwork and that was it. I partly blame playing under Spud and having skillless twits as teammates for that. The rest is Otto needing a kick up the backside like Richo got this time last year and Bowden received in round 6. I see his new contract offer and messages coming out of Miller and Wallace as Otto's kick up the backside. If he stays I'd reckon we'll see the real Otto next year; if he decides to leave then it's in our best interests anyway. We can't lose either way.
I agree with fwoy about giving Otto some slack. All this speculation now is just media driven. Let's wait until we hear from Otto himself.
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The trouble with Otto is if he re-signs with us it will be for probably about 3 years. What if he doesn't improve under Wallace and we miss the opportunity to probably get a pretty good trade for him. He has to take a major pay cut if he stays - if not, bye bye. Wish we could learn to let go of players and take advantage of situations like these. I don't support the player, i support the club, and we really have to do what's in the long benefit of the club. I say trade him and not risk seeing more of the same for another 3 years.
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Agree Froars,it really is that simple .
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Well, i figure it's like any business, if you recruited some highflyer based on reputation and seven years down the track he hasn't delivered the goods, you'd be giving him the heave-ho - certainly wouldn't be signing him to a long term, lucrative contract.
What's the difference with a footy club?
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There is no difference.
May I be the first to congradulate you next time you reply as it will be 1000 posts. Well Done Froars ! :cheers
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Shucks Jackstar, i didn't even realise that - just goes to show i need to get a life :rollin
But thanks anyway.
:birthday Happy Thousand to Me :birthday lol
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well it looks like ottens is off, the age article seemed pretty strong.
he wants to rejuvenate his career, oh well we need to make it work for us.
hope that miller and walletman have backup plan as we need another ruckman, simmonds still doesnt appeal at this stage, seen alot of him over here in w.a. and to me he lacks the tensity or something.
god i hope we play hard ball with this, the thing that makes me a bit peeed is that he comes out publicily and says he wants to stay and confides to walletman he wants to stay, but now changed his mind.
i think young bradley has a problem telling the truth.
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Ottens to tell Tigers: 'I'm out'
By Jake Niall
September 24, 2004
Richmond ruckman-forward Brad Ottens will tell the Tigers today of his wish to leave Punt Road and continue his 129-game career elsewhere.
Ottens, 24, who is out of contract and the subject of frenzied bidding from rival clubs, has indicated he wishes to play with either Geelong or Sydney next year.
He will tell the Tigers of his desire to be traded today when he speaks with Richmond football director Greg Miller.
Ottens, who has been in Bali, will leave Melbourne for Thailand within 24 hours of telling Richmond of his wish to find another club.
Sources last night said that contrary to speculation, Ottens' motivation for seeking a new club was not so much the prospect of a reduced salary - cash-strapped Richmond has offered him a significant reduction to his present contract - but his desire to rejuvenate his football career.
He is also believed to be concerned that, with the bottom-of-the-ladder Tigers committed to a rebuilding of the list that might take a few years, he faces the prospect of spending more years at a struggling club; Richmond has played finals only once in his seven seasons at Tigerland.
The ruckman and sometime forward has struggled since he hurt his back in 2002 after a stellar 2001 season in which he booted 46 goals.
Richmond is unlikely to agree to trade Ottens without significant compensation because as the team holding first pick in the pre-season draft (for uncontracted players), the Tigers can draft him back should he threaten to walk through to the pre-season draft. Ottens could, however, put a price on his head that would make it difficult for Richmond to re-draft him.
Whether he ultimately nominates Geelong or Sydney as his preferred destination, Ottens will get to his chosen club only via a trade.
Richmond has been fearful of losing Ottens and, recognising that its big-men stocks would be severely depleted without him, has been a strong bidder for Fremantle's uncontracted ruckman-forward Troy Simmonds.
Geelong midfielder David Spriggs has requested a trade to another club, but will be retained by the Cats if they are unable to strike a deal.
The Cats yesterday confirmed that Spriggs had reached "a mutual agreement" that he seek a new club, while they have offered one-year deals to veterans Ben Graham, Peter Riccardi and Brenton Sanderson.
Graham, Sanderson and Riccardi all have indicated their desire to continue their careers for at least another season.
The future of St Kilda veterans Justin Peckett and Andrew Thompson might not be settled until next month's trade period, while the club will hold further talks with Heath Black's management to determine whether he will remain at Moorabbin next year.
The Saints also are confident of re-contracting Luke Ball within a few days after his management met coach Grant Thomas yesterday.
Essendon has re-signed Damian Cupido to a one-year contract after a disappointing 2003. Cupido booted 36 goals for the Bombers in an encouraging first year at Essendon, but fell away this year following an early-season knee injury.
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Now that's music to my ears! One less invertebrate on our list!
A first and second (or third round) pick from either Geelong or Sydney should suffice.
Farewell Nottens, and thanks for establishing a big reputation which should see us land a couple of good players for your useless self!
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Bradley, when you say you want to play for a successful club, remember the name Nathan Buckley leaving Brisbane to play for the Pies.
I hope it bites you on your bony arsse lol
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Bradley, when you say you want to play for a successful club, remember the name Nathan Buckley leaving Brisbane to play for the Pies.
I hope it bites you on your bony arsse lol
Good point Froars.
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the thing that makes me a bit peeed is that he comes out publicily and says he wants to stay and confides to walletman he wants to stay, but now changed his mind.
Ditto tigers80.
In the immortal words of one Pauline Hanson, Brad.....PLEASE EXPLAIN
If the Age article is true ......... >:(
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Well, i figure it's like any business, if you recruited some highflyer based on reputation and seven years down the track he hasn't delivered the goods, you'd be giving him the heave-ho - certainly wouldn't be signing him to a long term, lucrative contract.
What's the difference with a footy club?
Fair call froars.
But if you have an employee that you have treated really well and as the employer you are happy with the job he/she is doing because they have done what you have asked of them wouldn't you expect a little loyalty in return???
PS:
At the end of the day I may have a signed Brad Ottens Jumper for sale :'( :'( ;D
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This is out of his mouth on August 29...
He said he had met new coach Terry Wallace and was keen to end his career as a one-club player.
"Hopefully, we can get it all sorted out as soon as possible," Ottens said.
"I would be rapt to stay in Melbourne and hopefully we can get it all organised as soon as possible and get on with training and thinking about 2005.
"It's my main priority. Staying my whole career at one club is pretty important to me and I'd love to stay a Tiger."
And this is where I have a problem and very big problem - PLEASE EXPLAIN
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I will be totally amazed if he stays, totally
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I will be totally amazed if he stays, totally
I am just about resigned to him leaving now. Though if he wants to go - I'd be making sure the deals a good one - if it aint I wouldn't be trading. I would think Geelong has more to offer us that Sydney.
Bradley, when you say you want to play for a successful club, remember the name Nathan Buckley leaving Brisbane to play for the Pies.
Great point froars - and what about Leigh Colbert? He left Geelong, chose North for finals and they haven't played in that many since he's been there.
On another issue that relates to this saga ....
And can anyone give a few pointers on how I explain to my niece why her favourite player (the guy in the photo) cannot be her favourite player anymore? :-[
Just planning ahead
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if the club makes hard decisions, we will climb the ladder.
hard decsions were made in 1994 when we traded our captain at the time and we made the finals next year. lets see what happens next year
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Im glad if he goes! Clearly he is injury prone, and his grab for money is an insurance policy against this, the Tigers are once bitten twice shy, and so we should be!
Lets auction "The Big sexy" off and see what we can get for his sorry @rse!
Bring on 2005, better 3 young high draftees than some over paid hack who cant run, it might give a wakeup call to the other freeloaders on our list!
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Im glad if he goes! Clearly he is injury prone, and his grab for money is an insurance policy against this, the Tigers are once bitten twice shy, and so we should be!
Lets auction "The Big sexy" off and see what we can get for his sorry @rse!
Bring on 2005, better 3 young high draftees than some over paid hack who cant run, it might give a wakeup call to the other freeloaders on our list!
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if the club makes hard decisions, we will climb the ladder.
No doubt Jackstar. And taking full advantage of the draft will make those hard decisions worthwhile. No more short-term, quick fixes.
Richmond has been fearful of losing Ottens and, recognising that its big-men stocks would be severely depleted without him, has been a strong bidder for Fremantle's uncontracted ruckman-forward Troy Simmonds.
I was wondering, if it wasn’t for the fact that Otto is a ruck/kpp, would there be all this fuss about him, or would he be thought of in the same way as Fiora / Pettifer?
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Hey team,
Nice site, and my first post.
What's the whisper on Porter? Has be been given the opportunities at the Blues/Roo's, and if not, it surely has not been due to injuries.
Would come in handy as a backup for Staff in 2005, and wouldn't cost us the world. Con's are that he's not a known forward.
Billy
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But if you have an employee that you have treated really well and as the employer you are happy with the job he/she is doing because they have done what you have asked of them wouldn't you expect a little loyalty in return???
Not sure i totally get this WP. Are you saying Brad has done what he's been expected to do and the club should show some loyalty?
I don't think he's lived up to expectations, full stop, even before he got injured. As Jack said, how many games has he won off his own boot? Not many, and most of his good games were down forward when the Twin Towers created chaos for a couple of games. We need more consistency out of our marquee players. And when we don't get that, you have to question their value. And Brad's only value at the moment is, sadly, not his playing ability, but his trade-worthiness!
Can we take loyalty out of the equation these days? I think we can. Is a very cut throat business now - both from clubs, players, player (scum) managers etc. And when clubs do stay loyal to a player, is usually to acknowledge a player's past onfield deeds etc. which i don't think Brad has yet reached or ever will.
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Nice site, and my first post.
Welcome to OER, Billy.
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Welcome Billy.
Has anyone heard the latest on Lance Franklin? I know he's been a bit of a ratbag, probably no more than our local resident gangster Zantuck, would he be worth considering?
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lance (buddy) franklin got all the equipment but not keen on going east, and at this stage i still think vic born and bred players way to go.
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Not sure i totally get this WP. Are you saying Brad has done what he's been expected to do and the club should show some loyalty?
No froars - I am saying Brad should show some loyalty not the Club. The Club are showing their loyalty by offering him another contract. I am not talking about expectations either I am talking about doing what he may have been asked to do.
I agree he has not delivered on his obvious ability, however.....
Let me try and explain. If the previuos coaching panel gave him speific instructions (whether they were the right ones is another topic all together) on match day and he has followed those instrustions and done everything that has been asked of him then he has done a good job to the level that his employer wanted and as a result is employer is offering him another contract.
My question is doesn't the employer in this case the RFC deserve some loyalty from Brad Ottens in return for everything they have done for him.
Can we take loyalty out of the equation these days? I think we can. Is a very cut throat business now - both from clubs, players, player (scum) managers etc. And when clubs do stay loyal to a player, is usually to acknowledge a player's past onfield deeds etc. which i don't think Brad has yet reached or ever will.
I agree with you it is a cut throat business and in particular that player managers are scumbags. I also know I am old fashion but loyalty is important to me, even in business. And the truth is the RFC have rewarded Brad Ottens very well for a long time and I beleive he owes the RFC.
Having said allthat I don't think this is over yet not by a long way.
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Hey team,
Nice site, and my first post.
Welcome Billy :thumbsup
What's the whisper on Porter? Has be been given the opportunities at the Blues/Roo's, and if not, it surely has not been due to injuries.
Would come in handy as a backup for Staff in 2005, and wouldn't cost us the world. Con's are that he's not a known forward.
Billy
I wouldn't go for Porter - we need to find a young ruckman. If we have to trade for one I'd go with Jamar form Melbourne and here's my offer:
Jamar and Melbourne's 2nd round pick for either Fiora or Zantuck and Chaffey and our third round pick
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Welcome Billy (Blunder 8)) Nicholls.
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Welcome Billy (Blunder 8)) Nicholls.
:o :o
Hey FF is it really the Blunder one for Y&B info???? It couldn't be could it :bow :bow :bow
I read Y&B info daily ;)
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Party time!!!!
:cheers :thumbsup :cheers :thumbsup :bow :rollin :cheers
R.O'Keefe come on down !!!!!!!!!!!!
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I have no doubt WP. He's a star.
Now he's delisted he must be branching out. :)
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Ottens quits Tigers
Fox Sports
September 24, 2004
RUCK-forward Brad Ottens has quit AFL club Richmond, accusing the Tigers of having lost faith in him.
Ottens, 24, will now seek an opportunity at another club after seven seasons at Punt Road and Geelong and Sydney are understood to be the clubs most desperate to attain him.
Ottens said Richmond had asked him to take a "substantial" pay cut and although he acknowledged his recent form was below his best, was not prepared to accept the proposed offer.
"The proposed reduction was above what he felt reasonable and indicated the club had lost faith in him," said a statement from his management Elite Sports Properties.
"I need a new environment to get the best out of myself and enjoy my football." Ottens said.
"This is purely a football decision which I believe is in my best interests."
Ottens played 129 games for Richmond but finished eighth in the 2004 best and fairest in a side that finished last and won only four games.
Ottens was the No.2 pick in the 1997 national draft and as a 202cm rucking option who can also play forward, will appeal to several clubs come next month's trade period.
The Swans, who want a back-up ruckman for Jason Ball, are understood to be one of his potential suitors along with Geelong, which needs a key forward.
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RUCK-forward Brad Ottens has quit AFL club Richmond, accusing the Tigers of having lost faith in him.
You're right Brad I have lost faith in you. It happened at about 12.40pm today when I heard this crap excuse >:(
Ottens said Richmond had asked him to take a "substantial" pay cut and although he acknowledged his recent form was below his best, was not prepared to accept the proposed offer.
"The proposed reduction was above what he felt reasonable and indicated the club had lost faith in him," said a statement from his management Elite Sports Properties.
"I need a new environment to get the best out of myself and enjoy my football." Ottens said.
Yeah but it is not about money. Give me a break
So what you said back on August 29 - you know the bit about being a one club player, a Tiger - what was that exactly? :banghead
>:( >:(
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Can I just add - if he doesn't want be there then he should go.
But I really have a problem with a player, any player coming out and saying "I want to stay, I want to be a one club player, I want to be a Tiger" less than 1 month ago and then in the space of 27 days changing their mind. What's changed, really changed?
And then to come up with "they've lost faith in me" what a crock :banghead
Am I angry - bloody oath I am.
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Plenty of time to crucify him once his gone...
Hey Fwoy, can we crucify him now lol. Can we... can we... can we please lol.
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Plenty of time to crucify him once his gone...
Hey Fwoy, can we crucify him now lol. Can we... can we... can we please lol.
I don't know about Fwoy - but I know I am ready to let rip :rollin
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Might as well get it out of your system WP. Strangely enough, I think I already have. Maybe coz I saw it coming when the negotiations started going the way they did.
He did the same thing last time, but we some how convinced him to stay. Probably paying him enough is what convinced him and, at the time, I was glad we kept him. To keep him now would have been for all the wrong reasons.
Especially when this time round he has to take a pay cut and instead wants out. I hope he and his money will be very happy together and will share many memorable moments down the track.
If we’re going to get anywhere then we don’t need his selfish, self-interested type.
When you go down the track of developing a list and creating the sort of environment and spirit that a Club such as Brisbane has then it’s going to sort out the selfish individuals from the team players.
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Ronnie said the other day we should put this all into perspective. Well here goes:
Ottens is a money-hungry, no-talented hack lol
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I look forward to seeing him play against us again, if his form this year has been a guide we'll have a field day!
Lets get something out of the useless hack who's now a millionaire! :banghead
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Might as well get it out of your system WP. Strangely enough, I think I already have. Maybe coz I saw it coming when the negotiations started going the way they did.
He did the same thing last time, but we some how convinced him to stay. Probably paying him enough is what convinced him and, at the time, I was glad we kept him. To keep him now would have been for all the wrong reasons.
If he had of said at the very beginning - I am not sure, I will weigh everything up and make decision - then fine. But to publicly say what he did and now blame the club by saying they have lost faith. Get real. The RFC has been very very good to Brad Ottens and that is a fact!
Also I read this great article the other day in the Hun where they interviewed Robert Copeland - he who almost came to Tigers... and he summed it up beautufully I reckon....
"ROBERT Copeland could have taken the money and run at the start of the year . . . and been part of a team that finished last.
Instead, he took far less cash to stay put and will play in his third Grand Final on Saturday.
Richmond was able to offer Copeland significantly more money than the Brisbane Lions, but it could not offer him a crack at the success every player sets out to achieve.
"You always think back (on nearly leaving), it was a hard decision. There are offers out there to play in different positions in other teams, but I am glad I made the right one," Copeland said this week.
http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,10850865%255E19771,00.html
Granted he would have come to the wooden spooners but he chose his club, his mates over the dollars and he deserves respect for that IMHO
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Ronnie, you should listen to the Jackstar more often lol :rollin
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We basically have a couple of years to snare a young quality tall to replace Nottens.
I wouldn't be phased by playing Rodan in the ruck next year. It's going to be a write-off.
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Im not sure about the rest of you guys but I feel sick in the stomach about this one!
That two faced lying @rsehole and is management team deserve a good kick in the @rse!
The games played by them are ridiculous, how can he honestly believe we have lost faith in him when we have made him a millionaire with only 1 decent season!?!
This absolutely wreaks of greed and dishonesty! :banghead
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Ottens
Enemy
Radicals
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Plenty of time to crucify him once his gone...
Hey Fwoy, can we crucify him now lol. Can we... can we... can we please lol.
stuffing oath we can now Froarsy. Dirty idiot can stuff off and try and bleed another club dry. Sorry to hear earning more than six times the average wage for 22 weeks work still wasn't enough for poor Braddles. Well, stuff him! :banghead
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If I rated him as a player Disco, I would be livid. But how can you be disappointed to see an overpaid, overrated and underperformed player go? Good riddance!
I'm wrapped at the prospect of picking up two young talented players for Notthens. LMFAOOOOOO! It's a robbery of the highest order!
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Don't rule out Jackstar's original post re going to the Pies - word is it's on in a big way, as in he will put such a high price on his head the other two clubs won't be able to compete.
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Don't rule out Jackstar's original post re going to the Pies - word is it's on in a big way, as in he will put such a high price on his head the other two clubs won't be able to compete.
Ok, so the positives is the Footy Show will die officially next year with such personalities as Nottens and Cloke on the panel with Nafan... :thumbsup
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Sorry to hear earning more than six times the average wage for 22 weeks
Fwoysie lol, i think Brad his first game this year round 11 - so 11 games x six times average wage :(
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An open letter to Richmond members and supporters from the Club’s Director of Football, Greg Miller
1:53:06 PM Fri 24 September, 2004
richmondfc.com.au
This morning I met with Brad Ottens and his management team and was informed that he wishes to be traded from the Richmond Football Club.
While we are genuinely disappointed with Brad’s decision, we also see this as a great opportunity to make some significant, exciting changes to our playing list.
It has been well documented that Brad has been paid on potential by our club for a long period of time. The new offer that we put to him for the next 2-3 years was reflective of where he’s at in his football career.
Brad also has received very handsome offers from at least two league clubs.
Richmond is in charge and will not be pressured by other clubs into paying over the odds to re-sign our own.
We have always cared very well for Brad and looked after his best interests. There can be no argument from Brad’s camp that our care, interest and development has not been first class.
So, whatever you may hear or read, Richmond is not to blame for Brad’s decision to leave Punt Road.
It’s most important that Tiger members and fans understand these circumstances because we need your support now as we turn this situation into a major positive for us.
Brad was our No. 1 pick ( and No. 2 overall) in the 1997 National AFL Draft and since then we’ve spent considerable time and money in nurturing his talent to a point where he’s ready to produce his best football over the next few seasons.
Whichever club reaps the reward of our efforts will pay handsomely for that right.
Let’s put this in perspective . . . Brad is the hottest trade choice that I can ever remember in league football. We’re talking about a ruckman/forward who has played more than 120 games, was an All-Australian representative in 2001, and is still only 24 years of age. He has the ability to become one of the game’s absolute top-liners – and that’s the price someone’s going to have to pay for his services.
Early draft choices are what we’d be looking at for an exchange. In a year where we’ve already got selections 1, 4 and 20, we’re keen to further bolster our stocks of young talent with more early picks.
Let’s also understand that if a suitable offer is not forthcoming to trade Brad, then we will reserve our right to re-sign him, or take him in the pre-season draft.
Obviously, if Brad is to be traded, then we must bring in a readymade big player, as well as draft choices, to fill the void. I can assure Richmond supporters that contingency plans are in place.
We have agreed to a new one-year deal with Greg Stafford and we are working hard behind the scenes to ensure that we won’t be disadvantaged.
The Richmond Football Club will use this as a launching pad to add some outstanding youth to those developed over the last couple of years at Tigerland.
I’m sure all members of the Yellow and Black faith are going to follow the upcoming trade period with a lot of interest. I will keep you informed . . .
http://richmondfc.com.au/default.asp?pg=news&spg=display&articleid=172784
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LMFAOOOOOO@Miller offering him 200,000k a year and telling him he is overrated and then talking him up as the biggest trade ever. :thumbsup
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Think i read somewhere Weaver said if we try and redraft him and he doesn't want to come back, it will be off to the courts under restraint of trade.
:(
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Don't rule out Jackstar's original post re going to the Pies - word is it's on in a big way, as in he will put such a high price on his head the other two clubs won't be able to compete.
Ok, so the positives is the Footy Show will die officially next year with such personalities as Nottens and Cloke on the panel with Nafan... :thumbsup
You can't be serious Fwoy3. Didn't you see the Cloke's routine of the Wiggles last night? Must see viewing I would've thought. :P
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I think it's pretty much guaranteed the side the supporters will take. Anybody who has followed this team for the last 10-15 (or more) years will realise that the animals have run the enclosure. It is now time to see the Keepers put them in their place. If it means chopping down the biggest egos to make the others realise who is in charge, then I suppport it 100%.
My disappointment lies in the fact that Brad said he wanted to be a one-team player, wanted to be a part of the rebuilding of this great club, and was aware that he had underperformed, and wasn't worth the money he was being paid. Doesn't look that way now...the air must be different up there Brad. Twenty-four years old eh? How does it feel to know you've just made 30,000+ enemies?
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Softens can go and join those weak pricks collingwood. As we are in a rebuilding phase this is a good thing. He has inhereted a losing mentality and we need to rid ourselves of this. Hopefully we can get a top 10 draft pick and a good promising youngster who has 2-3 years under his belt. This is the right move forward. Onwards and forwards.
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Think i read somewhere Weaver said if we try and redraft him and he doesn't want to come back, it will be off to the courts under restraint of trade.
:(
This is correct froars - I asked Weaver about this very thing on BF this morning. He said the AFL can block us re-drafting him because if we do re-draft him it would be considered a restraint of trade because he wants to go.
My disappointment lies in the fact that Brad said he wanted to be a one-team player, wanted to be a part of the rebuilding of this great club, and was aware that he had underperformed, and wasn't worth the money he was being paid. Doesn't look that way now...the air must be different up there Brad. Twenty-four years old eh? How does it feel to know you've just made 30,000+ enemies?
Your disappointment Fwoy3 - my anger - I agree with you 200%
He has let a lot of people down with this decision and I am not just talking about the RFC but those of us who have supported him unconditionally. :banghead
After reading his statement he certainly is full of contridictions. :-\
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Richmond is in charge and will not be pressured by other clubs into paying over the odds to re-sign our own.
:thumbsup
It’s most important that Tiger members and fans understand these circumstances because we need your support now as we turn this situation into a major positive for us.
No complaints here Mr. Miller. Do your stuff.
Early draft choices are what we’d be looking at for an exchange. In a year where we’ve already got selections 1, 4 and 20, we’re keen to further bolster our stocks of young talent with more early picks.
The Richmond Football Club will use this as a launching pad to add some outstanding youth to those developed over the last couple of years at Tigerland.
:birthday :thumbsup :cheers :thumbsup
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You will find his management has already spoken to the Hawks and the Bulldogs.
mail is that he wants Megabucks first year that puts both of these clubs out of the picture.
Next in line is , you guessed the PIES who will offered him the ""Bank ""
Now ,if Brads says yep, that will do, we get nothing for him.
lets hope Sydney and Geelong can match or better the pies offer otherwise we lose out !We will get no draft picks or no players for him
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Richmond is in charge and will not be pressured by other clubs into paying over the odds to re-sign our own.
:thumbsup
Double :thumbsup :thumbsup. It's about time the RFC stood up to not only other clubs but those scumbag Player managers.
onya Greg Miller and Terry Wallace :bow :bow :thumbsup :thumbsup
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LMFAOOOOOO@Miller offering him 200,000k a year and telling him he is overrated and then talking him up as the biggest trade ever. :thumbsup
:bow :bow :bow :bow :bow
Stafford on a one-year..................IM FOR THAT!!!! :thumbsup :thumbsup
I say good luck and get out......Id take Tarrant and a pick....or O'Keefe and a pick.....
stuff we have done alright out of this. Remember Ottens still is going on potential value so lets not think we can go nuts here....
Im loving this.....first pick in both drafts.....and the hottest commodity on the trade market....Its like eating pizza sitting back watching the 88 game against the Blues with Pym kicking them from everyone in the last while she is down there having a crack......
To quote my man JT....Im loving it babababababa
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Jack, if he wants to be traded to the Pies, there goes the theory he wants to play at a successful club and not going for the money.
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We must do a deal with Sydney or Adelaide as they will be able to afford him. And it must be done early in the trade week because if we waste too much time and the deadline is reached without a deal, then we will lose him for nothing. Miller must get into contact with Adelaide and Sydney asap and start negotiations. The last thing I want to see is him going to those maggot pie pricks for nothing via the PSD.
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What a little, ungreatful ctun of a bloke.
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My disappointment lies in the fact that Brad said he wanted to be a one-team player, wanted to be a part of the rebuilding of this great club, and was aware that he had underperformed, and wasn't worth the money he was being paid. Doesn't look that way now...the air must be different up there Brad. Twenty-four years old eh? How does it feel to know you've just made 30,000+ enemies?
Just goes to show the excuse he's all of a sudden come up with (or his management has >:( since they do all the talking for him apparently) is utter crap! Swans haven't won a flag for over 70 years, the Cats for over 40 and the Pies 1 in 46. Remember we still offered him the ability to earn as much as he does now if he performed to the standard expected of him. So where has the Club lost faith in you Brad?
Cambo was just on Ch 10 at the parade today saying he hopes Otto has a rethink but it's time to say bye bye!
Are the Hawks out of the equation? It's not like they have financial constraints like we have. Rumours have them very interested in Luke Ball and will offer $$$ (not that I can see Ball leaving the Saints). If Otto ended up at the Hawks or Dogs for nothing then I'd still be happy that the Club had made a statement like Port Adelaide did last year with Nick Stevens that it won't be blackmailed. Either way we must do what's the best deal for Richmond.
As John says next year and probably the next will now be a write off with only the injury-prone Staff in the ruck and hardly any talls :help. Plenty of top draft picks still to come our way. It ain't going to be pretty :-\.
PS. Credit to Gas for taking a pay cut.
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:-\.
PS. Credit to Gas for taking a pay cut.
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I'll second that!!!
First time in years Darren gets the :thumbsup off me.
Having said that,i still rekkon we should give him the ars
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What a little, ungreatful ctun of a bloke.
Have to disagree with you Ox. He's not little. ;D
I'm off the fence froars. Splinters are removed and I'm ready to join in lambasting the money grubbing liar.
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Ottens quits Richmond, eyes Cats
By Jake Niall, Lyall Johnson
realfooty.theage.com.au
September 25, 2004
Brad Ottens yesterday told Richmond of his decision to quit the club, and nominated Geelong as his preferred destination.
The uncontracted ruckman-forward met Richmond football director Greg Miller and told him he wanted to leave the Tigers. He confirmed through his management that he wanted to be traded to Geelong, which has beaten Sydney to be his favoured destination.
"Geelong are his preferred option, but obviously on the understanding, providing they're able to compensate Richmond appropriately," said Ottens' manager Dan Richardson, whose Elite Sports Properties issued a statement in which Ottens said he was leaving for "football" rather than financial reasons.
Miller said the Tigers were "genuinely disappointed" with Ottens' decision to leave, and vowed that any team that wanted him would have to pay heavily.
"Brad was our No.1 pick (No. 2 overall) in the 1997 national AFL draft and since then we've spent considerable time and money in nurturing his talent, to a point where he's ready to produce his best football over the next few seasons," Miller said. "Whichever club reaps the reward of our efforts will pay handsomely for that right. Brad is the hottest trade choice that I can ever remember in league football. We're talking about a ruckman-forward who has played more than 120 games, was an All-Australian representative in 2001, and is still only 24 years of age."
The former South Australian is believed to have chosen Geelong ahead of Sydney - subject to a trade - because of his preference to remain in Victoria, where his mother and brother Luke now live.
He is seeking at least three years on his new contract and is certain to command at least $400,000 from Geelong, which would not pay him as much as the Swans.
In the statement, Ottens cited his wish for a "new environment" as paramount. "I need a new environment to get the best out of myself and enjoy my football," he said.
Miller said Richmond, which has selections one, four and 20 in the national draft, would be looking for more early draft choices as well as a ready-made big man to trade in order to fill the void left by Ottens.
Miller said the Tigers also reserved the right to re-sign Ottens or take him in the pre-season draft should a "suitable offer" not be forthcoming.
Geelong coach Mark Thompson said last night it was too early to discuss who might be on the list of trade possibilities for Ottens, but said he felt the former All-Australian would be worth a "first-round draft choice and a decent player".
Ottens, who is leaving for Thailand tomorrow, also alluded to the substantial pay cut the Tigers had requested he take from his 2004 contract. In the statement, his management company said Ottens had been willing to accept a reduction, but the proposed cut was "above what he thought reasonable and indicated the club had lost faith in him".
http://www.realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2004/09/24/1095961858834.html
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Quote
Geelong coach Mark Thompson said last night it was too early to discuss who might be on the list of trade possibilities for Ottens, but said he felt the former All-Australian would be worth a "first-round draft choice and a decent player".
Thompson is sounding more than fair. Wonder what he means by "decent" player.
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The cats first pick is at #16 or 17 isn't that much better than our second round pick at #20 so we definitely deserve more than their first pick.
As for a decent player they can only really offer us one of their young midfielders - IMO someone along the lines of a Bartel, Kelly (although he's injured) and even maybe a Tenace. We don't want a Spriggs, Rahilly or Enright as some Cat and Swan fans have been posting on their forums.
It would be better if we could do a 3-way deal with another Club who has a top 10 pick.
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Quote
Geelong coach Mark Thompson said last night it was too early to discuss who might be on the list of trade possibilities for Ottens, but said he felt the former All-Australian would be worth a "first-round draft choice and a decent player".
Thompson is sounding more than fair. Wonder what he means by "decent" player.
Bomber is a very nice person and unlike frawley,also a good coach.
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From the Hun:
Adelaide football operations manager John Reid said the club had resigned itself to missing out on Ottens, until yesterday.
The Crows had offered Ottens a lucrative contract but felt he wasn't interested in returning to South Australia.
"(His) home is Melbourne. His family is over there. But we'll go and find out where it's at," Reid said.
Speaking of a Club with a top 10 (#8) pick ;).
Otto for pick #8 + Reilly at the very least. If the Cats, Swans and Crows get into a battle over Otto, add pick #24 and Adelaide can have him :thumbsup. If that's too much then even swap our #36 for the Crows #24. We would then have picks 1,4,8,20,24,.... 3 picks in the top 8 and 5 in the top 24!
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Ottens free to join Swans
Greg Denham
The Australian
September 25, 2004
RICHMOND's out-of-contract ruckman Brad Ottens yesterday quit Punt Road and is poised to kick-start his career with Sydney.
Ottens said the Tigers indicated they had lost faith in him by insisting he accept a significantly reduced contract.
As revealed in The Australian on Wednesday, Ottens is set to join the Swans to take over as the club's No.1 ruckman after seven seasons and 129 games with Richmond.
Ottens walked out on Richmond a day after coach Terry Wallace was critical of the report in The Australian, calling it newspaper speculation.
In a statement yesterday from Ottens' management ESP, Ottens said he acknowledged his recent form was below his and Richmond's expectations, despite an injury-riddled past two seasons.
However, the proposed cut in pay was above what he felt was reasonable.
"I need a new environment to get the best out of myself and enjoy my football," Ottens said. "This is purely a football decision which I believe is in my best interests."
The Swans have moved quickly on Ottens, who could become the highest-profile player to swap clubs via the AFL's official player-exchange period early next month.
Ottens announced his decision despite Tigers football director Greg Miller saying on Thursday he was confident Ottens would stay.
Miller indicated Ottens had an obligation to stay with Richmond after being paid on potential rather than results. "He's one of the leaders of our club and he understands his pay had to come back a little bit," Miller said.
Wallace claimed Ottens twice told him he wanted to stay at Punt Road, and then threatened to redraft Ottens with Richmond's first pick in the pre-season draft.
The 24-year-old played this season on about $450,000, but was asked to take a pay cut of up to $130,000 a year for at least the next two seasons.
Sydney has already sounded out Ottens and it is understood to be preparing to offer his management a long-term deal with the capacity to earn up to $500,000 a year.
The Swans, who have up to $1million to spare under their salary-cap limit, are desperate to recruit at least one high-profile player next month, their first since snaring Barry Hall from St Kilda three years ago.
Sydney coach Paul Roos said he had identified a ruckman and a midfielder as priority areas of recruitment before the Swans could be consistently competitive against the best.
"I've spoken to Brad and he's certainly of interest to us," Roos said earlier in the week. We're pro-active and we need to be to get better.
"We certainly need a ruckman and Ottens fits the model."
Sydney has decided to increase its total player payments next year to attract class players following severe cost-cutting on the back of combined operating losses of more than $3m in 2002 and 2003.
Richmond will now intensify its pursuit of out-of-contract Fremantle ruckman Troy Simmonds, who is in dispute with the Dockers over the length of his contract offer.
Fremantle has offered Simmonds a new three-year deal, but his management wants a four-year contract.
Sydney will attempt to satisfy the Tigers by offering a player or players and an early draft choice for Ottens in what could develop into a three- or four-club trade deal.
Swans defender Jason Saddington, who with Ottens was a first-round national draft pick in 1997, appears highly likely to be offered up as part of a trade deal to satisfy the Tigers. He was recruited by the Swans from the Melbourne suburb of Mitcham.
Roos revealed that the Sydney playing group had been told that some would have to be moved on to other clubs.
Saddington would need to prove his fitness after a knee reconstruction this year.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,10867809%255E2722,00.html
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I'm very disappointed with this news. Surely his ego is not that big that he can't see how badly he's played this year and swallow some pride and take a pay cut. Once again, I bring up the example of the Brisbane Lions - Michael Voss has repeatedly taken pay cuts, amongst others players, to keep their team together and look where they are today. My only concern now is who will we get to replace Ottens. We desperately need another ruckman, who unlike Ottens, really knows how to ruck, not just tap it to the opposition everytime. What was that quote from "Top Gun" about "cashing in cheques your body can't carry"???
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Does Otto honestly believe he's worth more that Akermanis and half of the Lions side.....take a long hard look at yourself Brad. We have overpaid him for at least 5 years and he's given us sweet FA. Goodbye and good riddance. My fear is that the Pies will end up getting him for nothing, still I think I'd prefer this than have him dictate to the club.
I'd love to see him do a Buckley and leave a side that starts making the finals and winning flags (please) whilst he withers away.
I still keep thinking of Ray Hall last year - definitely going and ended up staying with the Tiges...wonder if this could repeat.
Hope Staff's fit when we're due to play whoever Ottens ends up with.....may make the Everitt incident look tame.
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It could be very interesting BG 25 as big Brad wasnt the most popular bloke down there. Says that no body liked him, I wonder why ?
Footballers have very bad memories too. Brad has been known to bag Danny Frawley but when he was in trouble with the drunken episode a few years back, who does he ring to bail him out at 4 in the morning, you guessed it, Danny ! ::)
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Heard Tezza on the radio yesterday afternoon on my dirve out to the airport and someone asked him would the Tigers accept Collingwood's first round pick and Rhys Shaw for Bard Ottens (laughable I know but true ::)).
Terry said NO, NO WAY!
Terry also said that he had 2 meetings with Brad and look what had happened :rollin. He also said that we would try and trade him because Ottens had said he doesn't want to be there, however Terry added that we had to be compensated accrodingly and that if there was not a suitable trade put forward then we would re-draft him in the PSD even if it was going to costs us more than what we are prepared to pay him as per our current offer. He reiterated what Greg Miller said in his "letter" to supporters. Terry said that part of this situation was about the Tigers no longer being held to ransom by other clubs and player managers.
We are going to play hard ball and I for one will support the Club 150%.
If he wants to go to the Cats - I'd want their 1st round draft pick and a player and I'd be asking for Scarlett or Harley or King to start with. As for the Pies - give me their 1st round pick and 2 players (maybe a Cole or a Ben Johnson) and I'd have a chat.
Does Otto honestly believe he's worth more that Akermanis and half of the Lions side.....take a long hard look at yourself Brad.
I doubt it would make any difference. He would only see what he wants to see
I still keep thinking of Ray Hall last year - definitely going and ended up staying with the Tiges...wonder if this could repeat.
I think it is a possiblity - the compo is going to have to be really really good for him to be traded
Hope Staff's fit when we're due to play whoever Ottens ends up with.....may make the Everitt incident look tame.
:o :o and I thought I was the only one who had been thinking these thoughts ;) :cheers
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He also said that we would try and trade him because Ottens had said he doesn't want to be there, however Terry added that we had to be compensated accrodingly and that if there was not a suitable trade put forward then we would re-draft him in the PSD even if it was going to costs us more than what we are prepared to pay him as per our current offer. He reiterated what Greg Miller said in his "letter" to supporters. Terry said that part of this situation was about the Tigers no longer being held to ransom by other clubs and player managers.
Take a bow Terry :bow :bow :bow.
I agree WP we should demand quality in return along with another club's first pick. I wouldn't go near Ben Johnson though. He knows how to get the pill but his kicking action is dodgy IMO. From the Pies I would ask for their young ruckman Guy Richards.
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While I'm hopeful of getting some good deals, also afraid of getting screwed big time.
My sister told me tonight she heard someone on the radio - Stan Alves she thinks - say Ottens was an ungrateful sod or words to that effect. Being treated so well at RFC, to walk out like he did. Couldn't agree with him more. But nice to hear it come from someone who holds respect. Usually, it's the club being bagged - not supported like that.
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If he wants to go to the Cats - I'd want their 1st round draft pick and a player and I'd be asking for Scarlett or Harley or King to start with. As for the Pies - give me their 1st round pick and 2 players (maybe a Cole or a Ben Johnson) and I'd have a chat.
We have zero chance of getting Scarlett, Harley or King, even if you dropped the first round pick. IMO, the best we're going to get from Geelong would be James Kelly, although I doubt they'll want to part with him either. Realistically, guys like Wojcinski, Enright, Corey or Moloney fit the bill, plus their first pick obviously. Best case might be the Cats trading one of the above for a top 10 pick, then include that with another of those guys.
Nice to see alot of familiar faces here, particularly Ox! I've missed that little rocking dude. Nice looking site too.
And JohnF, glad to see you've got my dancing fat kid as your avatar. I don't know if it's fair inferring that he's related to spud though. This kid is one of the greatest suppliers of good mojo on earth.
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Either Corey or Enright would do well at Tigerland ;)
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lmfao Disco, we should do posts one after another for a comparison of before and after shots on our avatars.
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Bless your heart Disco08 :cheers
Looking forward to reading your concise yet affable posts.
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We have zero chance of getting Scarlett, Harley or King, even if you dropped the first round pick.
I know we zero chance of getting those players - but that's what I'd be asking for so everybody knows we wont be taking any teams discards. We want players who can offer something to the RFC not players who can't get a game or are near the end of their careers.
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i reckon we are in drivers seat here with otto, we have to stand our ground and by the sounds of it miller and co will be doing the talking come trade time...
about time we were in this position usually its the other way round....
i reckon geelong have been keen all along, Cook from geelong is a smart operator and they have obviously identified that Brad is the man they need to take them the next step....
whats the bet they have into brads mangement for a while, we have the merchandise they want so they will have to come to the party....
i reckon young Bradley still hasnt realised he was always gonna be expendable, thats why he was offered a reduced package, miller and co knew he would turn it down...
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I know we zero chance of getting those players - but that's what I'd be asking for so everybody knows we wont be taking any teams discards. We want players who can offer something to the RFC not players who can't get a game or are near the end of their careers.
Fair enough, although I don't see the point in asking for something you know you are no chance of getting, it kind of makes you look silly. I actually think the best result we could get from the trade would be a top 10 pick and a good player no older than 24. I'd love to get Kelly, but Moloney would also be good. 20 years old with good pace and skills. We're in a good position already to pick up a top shelf midfielder (Deledio/Franklin) and a top shelf KPP (Roughead/Griffen). The extra pick would enable us to grab an extra midfielder, hopefully Jordan Lewis, Ben Eckermann or Monfries.
LMAO JF. Yeah, I change my avatars all the time, probably because I run out of intelligent things to say pretty quickly, but still prefer to sit behind the PC than going to watch telly with the missus. :shh Did you get the dancing fat kid from me on PRE? Or are you by chance a lover of the great Boston Red Sox like myself and saw the kid in the SOSH game threads bringing unbelievably good mojo?
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RonBranton suggested Otto needed a Life Coach. Maybe he does need greater awareness to do better and a size 18 boot up the backside couldn’t hurt either.
Compared to other Clubs who have moved with the times, RFC has been coaching by standards from the dark ages and are way behind in the coaching stakes. I wish RFC would get with it, because all we’ve managed to do over recent years is produce a whole lot of robots who lack confidence, self-belief and have no feel for the Club and/or jumper and no motivation or ambition to do better. We can attribute much of that to coaching, as well as a number of other directionless and unprofessional areas within the Club.
Pity those RFC players who do have any of the necessary qualities to be top line AFL players, because they must wonder where they went wrong.
In the statement, Ottens cited his wish for a "new environment" as paramount. "I need a new environment to get the best out of myself and enjoy my football," he said.
Doesn’t Otto virtually have a new environment to work in, when there is a new Coach/coaching staff and new/young, up and coming players at the Club? :-\
Here’s a tip for those players who cite these as valid reasons for wanting to go to another Club. The only person they are kidding is themselves, because a new environment alone isn’t going to help get the best out of anyone. To do that, you actually have to make an effort to achieve anything. Why would anyone try better at one Club and not another?
There may be valid reasons for that, but no one’s going to hand anyone the perfect environment in which to get the best out of themselves. Because every Club will throw up their own challenge and it’s those who have the strongest and fiercest commitment, desire and dedication to overcome any obstacles that have the greatest chance to achieve their dreams. And still there are no guarantees and even if they don’t achieve their main goal, they can still be proud of what they have been able to do and achieve throughout their career.
At some point, these players need to take some responsibility for what they get out of the game. Because, at every Club, regardless of where they are on the ladder, there will be players who are able to achieve amazing results for themselves, even if the team doesn’t perform to expectations. And you have to wonder how and why that happens?
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Ottens can run away from his problems all he likes. The bottom line is that the problems are between his ears and under his rib cage. He is mentally soft and has the heart of a pea. Prblems like that don't seem to get solved no matter where you go.
Disco, wasn't aware you had this avatar at PRE, as I couldn't view the site for a few months there. Ox actually annointed me with this avatar at Forsaken Bunch and it has stuck (fat) ever since. :thumbsup
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Couldn't agree more JF. Apart from a couple of good games in 2001, he never stamped his authority on a game at all. Even my missus, who's dutch and doesn't really get into the footy that much (she watches a few games with me though) said about the trade: "good, he never did anything anyway!"
And, whats the forsaken bunch? I tried searching for it but couldn't find anything. If there's more pictures like the dancing fat kid I've gotta have a look!
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Top post TS.
If Otto goes elsewhere for $$$ you've got to wonder what negative effect that will have within the playing group of another Club. Paying half a million dollars a year for someone to play second fiddle to a King, Graham, Barry Hall, Jason Ball or Goodes isn't going to go down well with his future teammates who are on half that amount of dough or less. Everyone now knows he is only leaving Richmond because he wants to paid more than what he's worth based on on-field performance. A player with that kind of attitude is a risky investment for any Club as we all know too well.
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Everyone now knows he is only leaving Richmond because he wants to paid more than what he's worth based on on-field performance. A player with that kind of attitude is a risky investment for any Club as we all know too well.
Better someone else have that to deal with than us MT. I wonder who else we need to test? Could be an interesting and worthwhile exercise.
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Couldn't agree more JF. Apart from a couple of good games in 2001, he never stamped his authority on a game at all. Even my missus, who's dutch and doesn't really get into the footy that much (she watches a few games with me though) said about the trade: "good, he never did anything anyway!"
And, whats the forsaken bunch? I tried searching for it but couldn't find anything. If there's more pictures like the dancing fat kid I've gotta have a look!
Sounds like your missus has good sense Disco, and she's Dutch as well :bow
There's not that many good pics at Forsaken Bunch, but there used to be a couple of good ones of Peter North in action back in the day :thumbsup But they were taken off and the site was closed down (on multiple occasions) ;D. Forsaken Bunch has been closed down about 3 times now, its currently called Forsaken Bunch IIII. It's a website started by Ox and a few other guys (Jake, Fwoy, myself) when PRE crashed and we had nowhere to discuss matters. Not long after we were all banned from PRE anyway so the site came in handy. LOL.
It's become a bit of a ghost town lately, never really recovering from all the good material being destroyed from Forsaken Bunch I, II and III.
But give it a look if you are prepared to be disturbed. Its at feralfooty.proboards20.com
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John, it's time to bring back the Emoticon version of your Avatarial representitive.
(http://users.on.net/edsilva/emot-dance.gif)
:lol :scream :rollin :thumbsup :cheers :birthday
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John, it's time to bring back the Emoticon version of your Avatarial representitive.
(http://users.on.net/edsilva/emot-dance.gif)
:lol :scream :rollin :thumbsup :cheers :birthday
ROOOOOOFLAUGINGMAOOOO
(http://users.on.net/edsilva/emot-dance.gif)
(http://users.on.net/edsilva/emot-dance.gif)
(http://users.on.net/edsilva/emot-dance.gif)
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ROFOLAMAOOOOOOOOOOO
I also had not seen u're avatar disco.
I found it on the ssd forum.
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Three-way deal needed to land Ottens
2:08:13 PM Tue 28 September, 2004
Paul Gough
Sportal
Geelong's hopes of securing star Richmond big man Brad Ottens could well depend on being able to arrange a three way trade deal involving another club when the official AFL trade period begins next Monday.
Ottens, one of the most talented big men in the AFL, has walked out on the Tigers and declared his "preferred option" is to play for the Cats next year.
This comes after Ottens, who has performed well below his best since starring in 2001 when the Tigers reached the preliminary final, was asked to take a pay cut by Richmond - which the Tigers described as an offer which was "reflective of where he’s at in his football career.
It is Ottens' ability to also play as a key forward that has Geelong interested in the 24-year-old, who with 129 games behind him is at the peak of his career.
It was the Cats' lack of a consistent key forward which was their major weakness in a season in which they came so close to reaching the grand final in 2004.
Richmond football director Greg Miller in a recent open letter to Tiger fans on the club's website described Ottens as the "hottest trade choice that I can ever remember in league football."
"Early draft choices are what we'd be looking at for an exchange (for Ottens)," Miller said.
"In a year where we’ve already got selections 1, 4 and 20, we’re keen to further bolster our stocks of young talent with more early picks."
However Geelong does not have early picks to offer the Tigers with their first pick in the November 20 national draft not coming until pick 16.
So if the Cats are to secure Ottens, they will most likely have to try and secure earlier draft picks from another club - possibly in exchange for players.
However the Cats are believed to have put together a list of its players considered "untouchable" during the upcoming trade period and this list is also believed to include midfielder Joel Corey.
This ends speculation that Corey could have been used as part of any deal to secure Ottens after there had been rumours that Corey could have returned to his native Western Australia to play with Fremantle, which would then have given its ruckman Troy Simmons to Richmond to in turn allow Ottens to go to Geelong.
But while the Tigers are interested in Simmonds, who is originally from Melbourne, it is believed the Tigers are hoping they can secure the former Melbourne ruckman in the December pre-season draft - where they will also have the first pick.
http://afl.com.au/default.asp?pg=news&spg=display&articleid=173201
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Three-way deal needed to land Ottens
2:08:13 PM Tue 28 September, 2004
Paul Gough
Sportal
Geelong's hopes of securing star Richmond big man Brad Ottens could well depend on being able to arrange a three way trade deal involving another club when the official AFL trade period begins next Monday.
Ottens, one of the most talented big men in the AFL, has walked out on the Tigers and declared his "preferred option" is to play for the Cats next year.
This comes after Ottens, who has performed well below his best since starring in 2001 when the Tigers reached the preliminary final, was asked to take a pay cut by Richmond - which the Tigers described as an offer which was "reflective of where he’s at in his football career.
It is Ottens' ability to also play as a key forward that has Geelong interested in the 24-year-old, who with 129 games behind him is at the peak of his career.
It was the Cats' lack of a consistent key forward which was their major weakness in a season in which they came so close to reaching the grand final in 2004.
Richmond football director Greg Miller in a recent open letter to Tiger fans on the club's website described Ottens as the "hottest trade choice that I can ever remember in league football."
"Early draft choices are what we'd be looking at for an exchange (for Ottens)," Miller said.
"In a year where we’ve already got selections 1, 4 and 20, we’re keen to further bolster our stocks of young talent with more early picks."
However Geelong does not have early picks to offer the Tigers with their first pick in the November 20 national draft not coming until pick 16.
So if the Cats are to secure Ottens, they will most likely have to try and secure earlier draft picks from another club - possibly in exchange for players.
However the Cats are believed to have put together a list of its players considered "untouchable" during the upcoming trade period and this list is also believed to include midfielder Joel Corey.
This ends speculation that Corey could have been used as part of any deal to secure Ottens after there had been rumours that Corey could have returned to his native Western Australia to play with Fremantle, which would then have given its ruckman Troy Simmons to Richmond to in turn allow Ottens to go to Geelong.
But while the Tigers are interested in Simmonds, who is originally from Melbourne, it is believed the Tigers are hoping they can secure the former Melbourne ruckman in the December pre-season draft - where they will also have the first pick.
http://afl.com.au/default.asp?pg=news&spg=display&articleid=173201
:o :o :gobdrop
Gee thanks for stating the obvious
What a truely original article - slow news day :help
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According to Ch 10 news, the Roos will make a formal bid tomorrow for Otto. The Roos have pick 10.
Terry reiterated that we want two first round picks for him. Said that based on Browny, Hall and Everitt trades that was about the going rate.
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great work greg and terry...
excellent game of smokes and mirrors in regards to ottens...
if this report is correct we have north joining the cats,sydney,adelaide all taking a ticket for his services...
dont you think they were always gonna make ottens expendable, only thing was he didnt know it....
by the time trade period comes around i think there will be a few more clubs joining the queue...
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Kangaroos join queue for Ottens
By Stephen Rielly, Peter Ker
realfooty.theage.com.au
September 29, 2004
The Kangaroos have joined what is developing into a posse of clubs pursuing Richmond's disgruntled ruckman Brad Ottens, the Roos confirming yesterday that they have spoken with all the parties involved in a bid to bring the 24-year-old to Arden Street.
With the retirements of Anthony Stevens and David King allowing the club to participate in the upper end of the trade market for the first time in several years, the Roos have joined Geelong and Sydney as confirmed suitors.
"It doesn't mean that we've got money to throw around but it does put us back into the market for the best players, which, because of financial and cap restraints, we haven't been able to do for a little while," said Kangaroos football manager, Tim Harrington.
Ottens has declared Geelong to be his preferred destination and while Sydney is expected to make a lucrative offer, the Roos, being a Melbourne-based club, meet with his desire to remain in Victoria, where the former South Australian's mother and brother Luke now live.
"We've spoken with his management and we want to pursue it as aggressively as we can because we believe that we can offer him something," Harrington said.
The Tigers have placed a minimum price of two first-round draft choices on Ottens, who was not at a Richmond fitness session yesterday. The ruckman/forward was the club's first pick, and second overall, in the 1997 national draft.
"That's what Richmond are saying. They've gone back over time and studied the worth of deals for top-line players and swaps and believe that two first-round picks is about the mark," Harrington said.
The Roos' first pick in the national draft is at 10, five ahead of Sydney and six ahead of the Cats, but Ottens will command as much as $400,000 a season and the Cats, in particular, have a greater number of players of appeal with which to buy the second first-round pick required to satisfy the Tigers.
The Roos also have openly pursued Fremantle's uncontracted ruckman/forward Troy Simmonds, now also a target for the Tigers as they seek to cover Ottens' loss.
"We just see that that type of player will help us in a lot of different ways, not only with what the player can bring but who can be released to play elsewhere. That's the biggest priority for us," Harrington said.
"We make no secret of that. We're working hard on Troy Simmonds as well."
http://realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2004/09/28/1096137237012.html
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Can't believe clubs are willing to offer two first round picks for this guy! Have they watched him play in the last 3 years?
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Hey John :shh
:thumbsup
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Yeah John - Shut the stuff up. The guy is a champion and is worth at least 3 first rounders. ;D
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Can't believe clubs are willing to offer two first round picks for this guy! Have they watched him play in the last 3 years?
John - very good question - it might just be scary - how come Geelong, Swans Adelaide, Kangas (and if you believe Jackstar, Collingwood) are prepared to go into a feeding frenzy for him?
What do they know that 90% of the posters on this board don't? Maybe he is a talent - God forbid - we had better tell Thompson, Roos, Craig, Laidley and Malthouse that he's a dud, they obviosly don't read OER.
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wherever he plays he'll give our team a bath.
watch him .
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Where's that spitter guy gone? :lol
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Can't believe clubs are willing to offer two first round picks for this guy! Have they watched him play in the last 3 years?
................plus someone has to tell Joel Bowden that Otto's a dud. Joel said on radio today that at 25 years of age, with 120 games already, he has to be the best trade available in the last 5 years. Joel - don't you read OER ż
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Can't believe clubs are willing to offer two first round picks for this guy! Have they watched him play in the last 3 years?
................plus someone has to tell Joel Bowden that Otto's a dud. Joel said on radio today that at 25 years of age, with 120 games already, he has to be the best trade available in the last 5 years. Joel - don't you read OER ż
Ron Joel's doing the club thing, talking Otto up to increase his value :thumbsup Probably trying to help his case for the captaincy as well ;D
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lol - never thought of that - and I thought I was the cynical one ;D
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Not only are you cynical, but you're a trouble maker, Ronnie.
Attention moderators, give him a kick up the arsse please lol
Been a bit cocky today - and I know that because i do read OER :rollin
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Not only are you cynical, but you're a trouble maker, Ronnie.
Attention moderators, give him a kick up the arsse please lol
Been a bit cocky today - and I know that because i do read OER :rollin
We will give Ronie some leeway today Froars - he is still struggling with the Ottens act of treachery ;D
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I luv it when you guys talk tuff :bow
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IN tonight's MX (so sure to be in Herald Sun tomorrow) - Joel's given Otto a bit of a serve. Said he hoped he'd give some interviews so he could tell the players why he wanted to leave. Also said the money on offer must be pretty big.
I think Jackstar's right (yes it can happen :lol,) I don't think Otto is too popular at Punt Rd.
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LOL Ron. Well Ottens must be a champion! He'd have to be to be adjudged 8th best player in a team which is at the bottom of the ladder!
It never ceases to amaze me what hype and a tag of "potential" can do for somebody's reputation.
Needless to say, I' ecstatic at the prospect of picking up at least two good players for him... incredible!
Ottens you are a gun!
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Joel's given Otto a bit of a serve. Said he hoped he'd give some interviews so he could tell the players why he wanted to leave. Also said the money on offer must be pretty big.
Why would Otto give any interviews about this whole sordid situation. I thought his management did all his talking >:(
As for his management .....
I have heard Tezza a couple of times in the past few days say that he had met with Brad twice - both times Brad said he wanted to stay. Last week Brad had to march on in to GM's office with his management team to say - "I wanna go" - that speaks volumes IMO. Couldn't he tell GM & Tezza by himself.
Geez - player managers are scumbags.... :banghead
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I think Jackstar's right (yes it can happen :lol,) I don't think Otto is too popular at Punt Rd.
I know that he didn't have many friends there (maybe none) but I have no feedback that he wasn't liked - there is a difference.
The list of people and clubs that rate him is far greater than the list of those that don't - that's becoming more and more obvious by the day. I'm just accepting the fact that it's a big loss for us and hoping that we can turn it into an advantage by getting quality trades for him - so far it's looking good on that front.
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Why would Otto give any interviews about this whole sordid situation. I thought his management did all his talking >:(
Manager: So Otto what have the Tigers offered?
Otto: They said that I had been paid on potential and asked me to a pay cut down to Cogs level with the potential to earn what I was on before.
Manager: What's that! They want me ...uh um ... you to take a pay cut.
Otto: I told them they were right and I wanted to stay and be a one club player.
Manager: Don't knock yourself Otto. You're a superstar. You came 16th in stats for 2004. How am I ... uh um ... you meant to further your career. Make it $500K. 99% of that should be for trauma alone for having to listen to Spud every day for 5 years.
Otto: Who would be stupid enough to pay me that much?
Manager ($ in his eyes): Geelong, Sydney, Kangaroos and Adelaide. Can you believe those suckers....uh um I mean ...which one of these fine clubs takes your fancy? (Under his breath: Use to be Richmond before that @#$% Miller took over.)
Otto ($ in his eyes): Geelong! Where do I sign?
Manager ($ in his eyes): Here. Now where is Cameron Bruce's phone number.
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The list of people and clubs that rate him is far greater than the list of those that don't - that's becoming more and more obvious by the day.
Ronnie,
Ofcourse he looks good from the outside, but wait until he gets into their inner sanctum.
Brad Ottens is a soft piece of crap, he doesnt work for his team mates and only thinks of himself. This is one of the most selfish acts he has shown here. I hope in Round one he tries to show some courage and drop back into our F50 and Richo plants his knee right into the middle of his back and thats his career all over.
Over rated hack.
P.S. I have never EVER wished injury upon any player before in my life.
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Wary Cats still in chase for Ottens
By Emma Quayle, Jake Niall
realfooty.theage.com.au
September 30, 2004
Geelong coach Mark Thompson will not tear apart the team that played for a grand final place this month by making Richmond any outlandish offers for the out-of-contract Brad Ottens.
Thompson, who said the club would do its best to get the disgruntled ruckman in Geelong colours, warned that to "smash" his list to bits for one player would be a waste of five years' work.
Ottens named Geelong as his club of choice last week, with Sydney and the Kangaroos also keen to snare the 24-year-old and Richmond determined to secure at least two first-round draft choices for the former No. 2 selection.
Thompson was pleased Ottens had nominated Geelong as his preferred destination, given the club's trouble attracting uncontracted forwards in recent off-seasons, and believed the Cats had strong bargaining power. But he emphasised the importance of keeping his existing list together.
"It's a delicate situation. We'll certainly try our best to get Richmond what they want, but there's a lot of work to be done to get it over the line," Thompson said yesterday. "We don't want to split the group up too much. We've got a really good group of boys and you don't want to do anything that's going to harm that and affect that."
Carlton, back in the draft's early rounds for the first time in three seasons, is committed to keeping its first pick in the trading period, which leaves Collingwood and the Kangaroos as the clubs best placed to satisfy Richmond's desire for a top-10 pick as part of any Ottens trade.
Besides their interest in Ottens the Kangaroos have offered Fremantle's ruckman-forward Troy Simmonds the temptation of a four-year contract and show a willingness to part with their first trade pick, No. 10 overall, in return for a quality tall player.
Simmonds has also fielded offers from St Kilda, Richmond and Carlton. He has expressed a preference to stick with the Dockers, who have offered him a three-year deal, but his future might hinge on whether Josh Carr decides to stick with Port Adelaide or requests a trade to Fremantle to play with his brother.
Carr is in Perth with his family, whom he will speak to before making a final decision.
Should Carr ask to be traded, the compensation Fremantle would receive for Simmonds would make it easier to acquire Carr, whose exchange would involve, at a minimum, Fremantle's first pick (No. 11).
Melbourne is confident of retaining Clint Bizzell with a revised contract offer after the defender yesterday expressed unhappiness about the first offer.
"We're still negotiating with Clint's manager and we're getting closer to an agreement," said Melbourne recruitment and list manager Craig Cameron.
http://realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2004/09/29/1096401648179.html
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RFC can talk him up as much as they want, most clubs know he has a heart the size of a pea ;)
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I'm just accepting the fact that it's a big loss for us and hoping that we can turn it into an advantage by getting quality trades for him - so far it's looking good on that front.
Ron - you really should try getting angry at him for his back flipping treachery >:(
I rate him think with a decent coach he can become a very good player but he has betrayed people like you and me who have supported him - get angry at him Ron - it could actually make you feel better :cheers
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Brad Ottens is NO LOSS. Get over it Ronnie..
Best thing that has happened for ages. Pity we never got rid of the "Duncan Kellaways" of the world when they were worth something too.
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By Dan Oakes, Jake Niall
October 1, 2004
realfooty.theage.com.au
Geelong remains no closer to reaching agreement with Richmond on a trade for the trading period's biggest name, Brad Ottens. Thus far, Geelong has been willing to part only with its first and second-round choices (16 and 32), plus Corey Enright and Charlie Gardiner. The Tigers want two first-round selections, one of those choices in the top-10 picks. Collingwood has indicated that its first draft pick (No. 7), which would enable the Ottens deal to be consummated, might be available, but only at significant cost, such as in return for James Kelly, whom the Cats have deemed untradeable.
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This fits in with the latest Otto trade rumour where we get Pies and Cats first round picks 7 and 16, Pies get Tenace and Cats get Otto. I would take that giving us picks 1,4,7,16 and 20 :thumbsup.
Pass on picks 16, 32 + Enright and Gardiner. Enright is at his "peak" now while Gardiner is a fringer player. Sure the Roos can offer better than that although they'll need to offer more than pick 10 + Corey Jones.
Good to hear both North and Geelong saying what we are asking isn't too much.
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Sydney plays it cool on Ottens
01 October 2004
Herald Sun
Jon Pierik
SYDNEY has eased off on its chase for Brad Ottens. The Swans indicated yesterday they would wait to see what unfolds between the coveted forward-ruckman and Geelong before deciding whether to re-enter the congested hunt.
Geelong is Ottens' preferred new home after quitting Richmond last week.
The Swans are his second choice, although with his family based locally, the 24-year-old is keen to stay in Victoria.
Swans coach Paul Roos said he wouldn't pursue a player who wasn't fully interested in joining his club.
Roos spoke to Ottens two weeks ago about a possible shift north.
"Our understanding is that he wants to go to Geelong, so we haven't really had any more discussion on Brad since then," he said.
"At this stage I suppose we sit back and see what happens with Geelong and Richmond. That's probably where it's at at the moment."
If Geelong cannot broker a deal acceptable to the Tigers – Cats coach Mark Thompson has admitted he is finding it difficult to come up with a suitable offer – Roos said the Swans would swoop.
"If they can't do a deal and Brad is happy to come to Sydney, we'll probably get back involved," he said.
"If Geelong can't get the job done and he changes his mind, then we're still interested."
The Tigers have said they want an established marquee player and a high draft pick in exchange for Ottens.
http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,10933097%255E19771,00.html
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I hope the club don't get too cute with this Ottens deal - he ain't that good and not only do we know it, other teams would too. To pass up the Cats 1st and 2nd draft pick plus two players, to me, seems idiotic. I would prefer that deal than the the two first round picks - the draft is a raffle, as we've experienced before - ala Lounder, Banik, Fiora, Pettifer, OTTENS, need i go on.
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I agree, we shouldnt get too cute. However - the club must get a return on their investment. The club invested heavily in Otto - both financialy and emotionally.I remember Frawley convincing the boy that the future of the RFC was to be built around him. Huge investment - need a return.
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Geelong has been willing to part only with its first and second-round choices (16 and 32), plus Corey Enright and Charlie Gardiner
I think that this would be a fantastic deal for Ottens. We get 2 players that would definately fit straight into our best 22 and another 2 early picks.
If this was on offer at 3pm next friday we would be crazy not to take it.
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Geelong has been willing to part only with its first and second-round choices (16 and 32), plus Corey Enright and Charlie Gardiner
I think that this would be a fantastic deal for Ottens. We get 2 players that would definately fit straight into our best 22 and another 2 early picks.
If this was on offer at 3pm next friday we would be crazy not to take it.
If it was on offer at 3pm next Friday I would be crying, because we would have missed the deadline by an hour... :lol
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Remember we want young quality players that will be peaking in 5 years time. That's why we want and need the high picks. Apart from pick 16 we are wasting our time IMO if we accepted that Geelong deal.
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This Draft will make or break Miller if the cats are offering this and we dont take it and end up getting shafted in the process then you can almost bank on the large horde of tiger masses turning on greg.
I can understand why they have said no, to hopefully get a better deal but come this time next week if we havent got better for ottens then they should accept this offer!
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LMFAOOOOOOOOOO@everyone knowing he is a dud!
Why are we catering to Ottens' wants? We should be offering him to the highest bidder, not sending him to the club of his choice. Ottens will travel aywhere anyway. Have money, will travel. That's his motto. lmfaoooooo@him wanting to stay in Victoria, just like he wanted to stay in one club for his whole career. All hogwash!
If Sydney can give us a better deal than Geelong then lets send him to Sydney.
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I'd rather the Tiges play hard ball with any deal for Ottens (more than he does :lol). If it means we re draft him, then so be it....we'd only be giving him a one year contract and if he didn't perform his career would be stuffed 'cause he'd be damaged goods.
Hanging tough sends a bigger message to the other players and the other clubs, than running scared and taking a last minute offer. The worse thing that can happen now is to have our bluff called. I don't think Port suffered at all from losing Stevens for nothing.
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Hanging tough sends a bigger message to the other players and the other clubs, than running scared and taking a last minute offer. The worse thing that can happen now is to have our bluff called. I don't think Port suffered at all from losing Stevens for nothing.
Totally agree bg. The Club must remain strong to its word. I'd reckon Miller and Wallace will.
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Got some "mail" that contrary to news reports and rumours Geelong's official offer for Ottens is Pick 16, Corey Enright, Paul Chambers and a second round pick.
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Got some "mail" that contrary to news reports and rumours Geelong's official offer for Ottens is Pick 16, Corey Enright, Paul Chambers and a second round pick.
Chambers had an arthroscopy on his knee this year to remove some cartilage and missed the middle period of the season. Still reckon the Cats are trying to offload players they'll discard eventually. Enright's a pretty good player but due to his wrist injury this year he's fallen behind a few of the up and coming young Cat midfielders IMO.
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Swans select trade bait to snare Ottens
Greg Denham
October 04, 2004
SYDNEY has stepped up its bid to recruit disgruntled off-contract Richmond ruckman Brad Ottens.
And eight days after becoming a premiership player with Port Adelaide, midfielder Josh Carr yesterday informed coach Mark Williams he wants to be traded to Fremantle.
But Port chief executive Brian Cunningham warned the Dockers that the club would demand adequate compensation for losing its vice-captain.
"Fremantle have got a lot of work to do," Cunningham said. "To trade, we would need a (Byron) Schammer or a (Matthew) Pavlich type."
On the merry-go-round, Fremantle appear certain to lose off-contract ruckman Troy Simmonds to Richmond and possibly for no compensation in return.
Simmonds' management yesterday informed the Dockers he had agreed not to be traded to another club and would move on a long-term deal to the Tigers, who had first pick in the pre-season draft.
The Swans' bid to satisfy the Tigers with two first-round draft choices for Ottens will include offering players to the Western Bulldogs and Adelaide for either selection six or eight in next month's national draft as the first five selections, which belong to Richmond (two), Hawthorn (two) and the Bulldogs, have been reserved for the draft.
If successful and coupled with Sydney's first pick, No.15 overall, two first-round choices would then be on-traded to Richmond, which is seeking a combination of the best two selections from the Swans, Geelong and the Kangaroos before exchanging Ottens.
A successful trade with the Bulldogs for their second selection in the draft would almost ensure Ottens heads north where he has been offered a four-year deal worth $2million.
Sydney is preparing to tempt new Bulldogs coach Rodney Eade with a package of three players, which would more than likely include forward Nick Davis, defender Jason Saddington and another midfielder.
Eade has left the door ajar by saying he was "90 per cent sure" he would not trade his second pick. "It's off the radar for other clubs, unless we get something really good," Eade said.
Swans coach Paul Roos said yesterday Sydney would talk today to the Bulldogs about an exchange for pick six.
"We're keen to get hold of that selection to be able to get Ottens," Roos said.
"But first we need a commitment from Richmond of what they'll accept and we need that by midweek. We're not going to be held to ransom by Richmond by taking us to the deadline because we've got other deals to go."
The official trade period starts today and ends at 2pm on Friday.
The Swans will involve the Crows, if need be, to secure Ottens by offering ruckman Stephen Doyle and Nic Fosdike, both recruited from Adelaide clubs, for pick eight.
The snag in that scenario is the Kangaroos and Geelong are attempting to trade with Collingwood, which has pick seven, but so far has demanded an extremely high alternative for its first draft selection.
The Magpies have told the Kangaroos that releasing Brent Harvey would get the deal done, while the Pies have requested any one of James Kelly, Kane Tenace, Steve Johnson or James Bartel from the Cats to complete the exchange.
Geelong has declared none of the Magpies' wish list are available as they form part of coach Mark Thompson's list of 15 untouchables.
While the Magpies yesterday denied they are in the race to trade for Ottens, they could secure him in the pre-season draft as an off-contract player with an annual $500,000 price tag as they have the fourth selection in December.
Sydney also has offered Melbourne overall selection No.31 and Mark Powell to Melbourne for disgruntled but contracted ruckman Darren Jolly, who has also attracted keen interest from the Kangaroos and Carlton.
Should the Kangaroos miss Ottens, its target will be Hawthorn's contracted ruckman/forward Nathan Thompson, who has asked to be traded.
The Kangaroos will offer the Hawks its first pick (No.10) and another selection under 20 it hopes it can secure by trading their off-contract midfielder Jess Sinclair.
West Coast is also interested in Thompson, but chief executive Trevor Nisbett said yesterday the Eagles were well behind other clubs in what it could offer.
"Our aim is to get Tyson Stenglein (from Adelaide) and we might not have the quality draft picks that Hawthorn would require," Nisbett said.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,10959631%255E2722,00.html
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Kangaroos join race for Ottens
4 October, 2004
Paul Gough
Sportal
The Kangaroos have launched an audacious bid to snatch Richmond ruckman Brad Ottens away from his preferred club Geelong on the opening day of the AFL's trade period.
And the Roos' efforts are impressing the Tigers, which will not accept anything less than two first round picks (including one pick in the first ten selections) in exchange for one of the best big men in the competition and the clear stand-out player available in this year's trading period.
Ottens has already declared he wants to play for Geelong but the Roos are desperate to lure the ruckman/forward to Arden Street and have already offered the Tigers their first round pick in the draft - pick ten - in exchange for the 24-year-old.
With no other club likely to give up any of the first nine selections in the November 20 draft - this puts the Roos ahead of Geelong in the race for Ottens with the Cats' first pick not being until selection 16.
Richmond football operations manager Greg Miller said the Kangaroos told the Tigers on Monday, as trade week got underway at Optus Oval, that they were determined to secure Ottens.
"Brad has shown a keen desire to play for Geelong so we are waiting to see what they say but we have been clear with what we want from the start and nothing is going to change," he said.
"The Kangaroos have probably been the most aggressive about the whole thing - they reckon they can do the deal and we will wait and see about that."
"They are offering their first round choice which is number ten (for Ottens) so they are certainly in the hunt."
Miller said the Tigers were not interested in securing a player plus a first round pick in exchange for Ottens.
"We have made it clear we are not interested in players, we are interested in two draft choices in the first round," he said.
Kangaroos recruiting manager Neville Stibbard says his club is working on ways to secure another first round draft pick but believes the Roos have the advantage in the race to secure Ottens through their willingness to give up pick 10.
Richmond, Hawthorn and the Bulldogs have the first six picks with Collingwood, Adelaide and Carlton having the next three but none of these clubs are expected to relinquish those prized selections meaning the highest possible pick the Tigers are likely to get in return for Ottens is the Roos' pick ten.
"We have probably got in front of Geelong (in the race for Ottens) because of where our pick is located," Stibbard told Sportal on Monday.
"That doesn't necessarily mean we will get him over the line but we are working on ways to get another first round pick."
"We have got a few things on the table but I would prefer to keep them on the table at the moment."
If the Roos can satisfy the Tigers' wishes, they would then face the task of convincing Ottens to come to Arden Street but one thing in the club's favour is that with the retirement of Anthony Stevens plus the decision by the club to spend more on total player payments in 2005 (after they paid below the full salary cap figure in 2004), the Roos would be able to fit the highly-paid Ottens into their salary cap.
http://afl.com.au/default.asp?pg=news&spg=display&articleid=173956
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The way the first 2 rounds stand are -
Rich - 1 & 4 ;D, 20
Haw - 2 & 5, 21
WB - 3 & 6, 22
Coll - 7, 23
Adel - 8, 24
Carl - 9, 25
NM - 10, 26
Freo - 11, 27
WC - 12, 28
Melb - 13, 29
Syd - 14, 30
Ess - 15, 31
Geel - 16, 32
StK - 17, 33
Bris - 18, 34
Port - 19, 35
Would we be willing to take 1 first rounder and 2 second rounders if north can't get the other first rounder ? Maybe they can trade for an early 2nd rounder and throw in their own 2nd rounder aswell. They seem quite desperate. Someone like the bulldogs might throw in their 2nd rounder (22) for a Jess Sinclair and another player. Would we be happy with picks 10, 22 and 26 for Ottens ? Remembering that Geelong rebuilt its list with minimal early picks and numerous 2nd and 3rd round picks. Depth is something we desperatley lack and having picks like 1,4,10,20,22,26,36,52 (8 in the top 50), excluding the Zantuck and other trades, would be a good starting point.
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I don't want to see Ottens go to Collingwood - so if other clubs are genuine in their offers, and they haven't been that bad so far, then we'd be stupid to play into the Pies hands and get absolutely nothing. Dermott virtually alluded to the fact on SEN tonight saying the Pies have a lot of spare cash and are eyeing the PSD for a big name player ::)
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Why are people at the club still saying that Ottens is not definitely going ????
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Would we be happy with picks 10, 22 and 26 for Ottens ? Remembering that Geelong rebuilt its list with minimal early picks and numerous 2nd and 3rd round picks. Depth is something we desperatley lack and having picks like 1,4,10,20,22,26,36,52 (8 in the top 50), excluding the Zantuck and other trades, would be a good starting point.
As far as Round 1 picks go, doesn’t look as though we can do any better than pick 10.
With depth in mind, even if we had a higher first round pick, but were able to accumulate a few more second and third round picks, as compensation, could still be happy with that.
10 – 12 picks in the top 50 could be a good basis on which to add some quality depth to the list.
Is that many picks feasible though?
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Why are people at the club still saying that Ottens is not definitely going ?
They're trying to bluff him, that if he wants to go back into the PSD we'll redraft him.
But some ppl say the AFL will step in before that happens, because Brad might take the club to court for restraint of trade etc etc.
And if he goes into the PSD and we're not able to draft him - more than likely head to the Pies when he puts a high price on his head.
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Even though the draft is risky, if we snare one decent player out of this deal we will break even. Anything else will be a win.
Picks 10, 22, 26 would be an ok deal.
I just hope we stay clear of the Spriggs' and Sinclair's of the world when doing a deal.
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Otto has decided to play hard ball himself and has said he doesn't want to go to North. He wants to go to Geelong ::).
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It's Cats, Swans or draft for Ottens
By Jake Niall, Stephen Rielly
realfooty.theage.com.au
October 5, 2004
Brad Ottens remains committed to Geelong and Sydney and is prepared even to take his chance in the pre-season draft if a trade to one of those clubs doesn't eventuate.
While Richmond yesterday suggested that the Kangaroos had made the best offer for the uncontracted follower-forward, Ottens' management last night reiterated that he was keen to join either Geelong or Sydney, not the Kangaroos or other late suitors.
"Brad has made a commitment that Geelong and Sydney were the two clubs that he prefers," said Ottens' manager Dan Richardson. "Failing him getting to those clubs, he's prepared to take his chances in the pre-season draft.
"It's nothing against the clubs like the Kangaroos, he's not saying there's anything wrong with them, it's just that he's made a decision that Geelong or Sydney are where he wants to be."
Richardson spoke with the Kangaroos last night and reiterated that Ottens wasn't keen to join them. The Roos, however, told the Ottens camp that in the event that potential deals with Geelong and Sydney failed, they would be happy to rekindle their interest.
Richmond has first pick in the draft and in the unlikely event that Ottens is not traded before the deadline, the Tigers would have the option of re-drafting him - provided they have sufficient room in the salary cap to accommodate his asking price. Ottens is prepared even for the slim chance of remaining at Tigerland.
The Tigers are believed to be keen to have the Ottens trade settled before they deal with his likely replacement, Fremantle's Troy Simmonds, for whom they are the frontrunners. Simmonds also could use the pre-season draft as a last resort, but Richmond cannot pick up both players in the draft - hence its desire to have the Ottens deal settled.
Ottens' ruling out of the Kangaroos and Simmonds' apparent preference for Richmond has placed the Kangaroos at the head of the queue for Hawthorn's Nathan Thompson. The Roos are prepared to give up their first pick, No. 10, and perhaps their second choice, No.26, for the contracted Hawk.
Assuming he cleared the Tigers in pre-season with a price on his head, Hawthorn would be the next club in line to acquire Ottens - assuming it could find the salary cap space, which is uncertain. Richmond would be more concerned, however, about the possibility that Ottens could get to Collingwood via the pre-season draft, since the Magpies - who have not expressed interest in the big man and been coy in the trading market - have the fourth pick and are cashed up with room in the salary cap.
Geelong remains confident, however, that it can do the deal to secure the first-round pick required to satisfy Richmond, though the Tigers have been open in expressing doubt about Geelong's willingness to part with a young player of sufficient quality.
West Coast and Adelaide last night were on the verge of a deal in which Tyson Stenglein would join the Eagles in return for West Coast's first pick (No.12) - a trade that is likely to mean that that pick is on-traded to Melbourne for Scott Thompson.
Melbourne, therefore, could conceivably play a part in the Ottens deal, since the Demons would have an additional first-round pick to play with.
http://realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2004/10/04/1096871814979.html
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Richmond has first pick in the draft and in the unlikely event that Ottens is not traded before the deadline, the Tigers would have the option of re-drafting him - provided they have sufficient room in the salary cap to accommodate his asking price. Ottens is prepared even for the slim chance of remaining at Tigerland.
Gee aint he a generous fella :P I am not prepared - want him gone now >:(
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he wont be back WP unless our very own Ronnie Branton stands for President. ;)
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We don't want him - he's a dud ;) ;)
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:help :help :help :help :help
Is there a doctor in the house? :rollin
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Buck Off Bradley!
Go get'em GM! :thumbsup
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he wont be back WP unless our very own Ronnie Branton stands for President. ;)
Don't want him now Jack - >:( Three weeks is a long time in footy ;D
We don't want him - he's a dud ;) ;)
That's the spirit RonB - get angry and let it rip. Just remember Brad's betrayed you :banghead :thumbsup
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SEN say a deal is almost done.
Otto to Geelong
Zantuck, Wojcinski to Bombers
Picks 14, 16 to Richmond
Simmonds hasn't said anything to Freo but his management said he wants to come to us.
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From:
http://www.footygoss.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=14709&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0
Brad Ottens has moved pen closer to paper with the three-way deal involving the Tigers, the Bombers and the Cats almost certain to go ahead.
As it stands, the deal will see Ottens go to Geelong, Ty Zantuck go to Essendon, while Geelong will depart with a draft pick and a player to secure Ottens.
The deal will more than likley see Geelong use its 16th pick and either Charlie Gardiner or Corey Enright.
It is unclear who or what Essendon is putting on the table as part of the deal.
:o ;D ;)
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The other alternative going around is:
Otto to Geelong
Zantuck, Wojcinski, Spriggs to Bombers
Picks 14, 16, 32 to Richmond
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The other alternative going around is:
Otto to Geelong
Zantuck, Wojcinski, Spriggs to Bombers
Picks 14, 16, 32 to Richmond
Geez - Sheedy is again bending everyone over at trade talks.
He wins out all the time.
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Looks like the Cats needed a big man even if it's Otto if Graham quits to become a punter in the NFL.
Looks like talk of a premiership down at the cattery was a bit premature :lol