One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: mightytiges on November 02, 2004, 06:17:21 PM
-
If John Northey hadn't flown north when he didn't get the extra year he was after would he have made any difference to the past 10 years?
-
No.
-
Yes :-*
-
Yes I mean :lol
-
Don't waffle on so much guys lol.
IMO in the short term he would have made a difference compared to Walls. Northey always seemed to get the best out of the group of players he coached whether at the Dees, us or Brissy. Northey regularly got his sides into finals. He also wouldn't have walked in like Walls did saying after we had just made the finals that we were predictable and then instill a possession gameplan which relied on a high precision of skills which resulted on us missing the finals ::). However in the long term we would have ended up basically where we are now given the core of our side which we had then lasted on our list for most of the following decade and we as a club deluded ourselves. I'd guess the only thing that may have been different long-term is we may have got rid of the sack coaches tag earlier if Northey stayed around longer.
What made me think of this is remembering this conspiracy theory some Richmond member from Shepparton told me who I was sitting next to at the footy one day this year. lol @ what some people resort to when we are almost 10 goals down at half time ;D. We started talking about Richo and we ended up on Northey for some reason. Anyway according to this bloke, Northey wanted to trade Richo and Cambo at the end of 95 season (Richo b/c of his knee and Cambo b/c he had a stellar year and would fetch a high price) ??? but the Club wouldn't have a bar of it because they were scared of a supporters backlash. So Northey went on his merry way. This bloke also claimed the Shepparton supporters' group (?) at the time went ape at the Club when they found out the Club had chosen player(s) over the coach.
-
Getting rid of Richo and Cambo would have been one way to change the order of things down at the club. Another way would have been to realise when it was necessary that we weren't just a player or two away from a grand final when we were finishing middle of the ladder all the time or having the odd lucky year where everything seemed to work and he finished top 4.
If Northey realised where we were at as a playing group then I'm sure he could have made the right adjustments post 95 to have us threatening for a flag by 1998 or 1999. If he was overly optimistic and deluded as to our potential, as our coaches have been in the last decade, then he would have landed us exactly where we are at this day.
-
Agree with John.
If Northey had realised where we were at in terms of the playing list and didn't think we were 1 small forward away from a flag lol, then he probably would have made us a better team and a better club in the long term. However if he was deluded about our list then he would have turned out to be another Frawley. Because in my opinion, even though we had a great year in 95, we were still far far off from being real contenders. The thrashing we received from Geelong in the prelim proved it in a way. IMHO we were a quality CHB, FF and 3-4 midfielders away from the big one. If Northey was of a similar mind set and was willing to draft and recruit accordingly then yes, we would have been better off if he stayed. However it is hard to say because none of us know what his opinion was and what plans he had.
-
I reckon we definetely would have been better off.
It wasnt Northey that overestimated the playing list. It was Mal Brown who at the time had an unhealthy influence on footballing matters with Daphne.
Brown's view was that Northey was good enough to get teams into finals, but based on his Demons experience, not good enough to win the GF.
So, with Daphne's blessing, he sounded out Sheedy who didnt have this stigma.
Northey demanded a contract extension in response to what Brown and co were doing behind the scenes, didnt get it, and was on his way.
Things would have been very different if the board backed the coach to continue to build from the good year we had in 1995.
And Northey nearly got Lockett down to the RFC. How good would that have been???
-
If you listen to what Mal Brown said at the time, then we probably would have been marginally better off than we are now if Northey had stayed longer. Because Brown was of the opinion that, although Northey was good at building team spirit, he had no tactical nous.
While Northey was able to get a lot more out of his players, I don’t know that he was good for their overall, long-term development. Because I don’t think many players had the necessary motivation and drive that his style of coaching compensated for. And I reckon it could only work for so long before it became too familiar to the players.
While his style worked against many Clubs, it really showed how flawed his approach was when up against the better teams. And it usually showed that the fire and brimstone approach wasn’t enough to cover all our deficiencies against these good teams and so came undone against them. It also showed how his style didn’t really help the players, because when the players had one of those days, as a group, it showed up the basics that were missing from the players.
Since those days, I think our problem has been, until now, that we have tended to finish just outside the 8, giving the impression that we might not be too far away, even though we were further away than most thought. I think Northey may have been too interested in looking after his job, and may have even been insecure about it, so would have kept us competitive, to keep his job, without us necessarily becoming a good team by design.
At least this way there’s no denying where we are at and can be in no doubt that we have to develop our playing list. Anyone would need their head read if they thought any different now. :P
-
And Northey nearly got Lockett down to the RFC. How good would that have been???
And Lockett nominated Richmond as the club he wanted to go to at the end of 94 but the Saints wanted something like two midfielders of the Cambo/Knights variety in exchange so we missed out and he headed on up to the Swans. What might have been with Lockett at FF and Richo and Benny Gale across half-forward in 95?! :(
-
And Northey nearly got Lockett down to the RFC. How good would that have been???
And Lockett nominated Richmond as the club he wanted to go to at the end of 94 but the Saints wanted something like two midfielders of the Cambo/Knights variety in exchange so we missed out and he headed on up to the Swans. What might have been with Lockett at FF and Richo and Benny Gale across half-forward in 95?! :(
And what did they settle on after asking us for Campbell and Richo (from memory, that was their asking price)?
Glen Nugent and Troy Gray :banghead
-
And Northey nearly got Lockett down to the RFC. How good would that have been???
And Lockett nominated Richmond as the club he wanted to go to at the end of 94 but the Saints wanted something like two midfielders of the Cambo/Knights variety in exchange so we missed out and he headed on up to the Swans. What might have been with Lockett at FF and Richo and Benny Gale across half-forward in 95?! :(
lmfaoooooo@Lockett and Richo being supplied ball by Daffy, Prescott, Rogers and Nathan Bower.
lmfaoooooooooooo@having the best and worst kick for goal in the comp in your forward line.
lmfaooooooooooo@Lockett growing his hair long to fit in with the girl impersonators in our side circa 1995.
-
And Northey nearly got Lockett down to the RFC. How good would that have been???
And Lockett nominated Richmond as the club he wanted to go to at the end of 94 but the Saints wanted something like two midfielders of the Cambo/Knights variety in exchange so we missed out and he headed on up to the Swans. What might have been with Lockett at FF and Richo and Benny Gale across half-forward in 95?! :(
And what did they settle on after asking us for Campbell and Richo (from memory, that was their asking price)?
Glen Nugent and Troy Gray :banghead
:banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead
-
And Northey nearly got Lockett down to the RFC. How good would that have been???
And Lockett nominated Richmond as the club he wanted to go to at the end of 94 but the Saints wanted something like two midfielders of the Cambo/Knights variety in exchange so we missed out and he headed on up to the Swans. What might have been with Lockett at FF and Richo and Benny Gale across half-forward in 95?! :(
And what did they settle on after asking us for Campbell and Richo (from memory, that was their asking price)?
Glen Nugent and Troy Gray :banghead
:banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead
:banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead
It's amazing how they're all in-sync.
-
And what did they settle on after asking us for Campbell and Richo (from memory, that was their asking price)?
Glen Nugent and Troy Gray :banghead
It gets worse :'( :'(..... they wanted Campbell & Richo and we offered Naish and someone else and they took Nugent & Gray.
Now I know Naish wasn't the greatest but he was a lot better than Nugent................. :banghead :banghead
:rollin :rollin
Glen Nugent and Troy Gray :banghead
:banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead
:banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead
It's amazing how they're all in-sync.
:banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead
:banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead
certainly is :banghead ;D
I reckon Tiger fans have been in-sync for years :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead
-
And what did they settle on after asking us for Campbell and Richo (from memory, that was their asking price)?
Glen Nugent and Troy Gray :banghead
Once again us finishing 9th stuffed us up :banghead. I think the Swans were down the bottom of the ladder like they had for most of the early 90's and the Saints had to take what they could get :scream.
-
uhhhhh..........maybe it would have made a difference but maybe not too. :thumbsup
-
And what did they settle on after asking us for Campbell and Richo (from memory, that was their asking price)?
Glen Nugent and Troy Gray :banghead
Once again us finishing 9th stuffed us up :banghead. I think the Swans were down the bottom of the ladder like they had for most of the early 90's and the Saints had to take what they could get :scream.
Yep, Sydney got Lockett for no more than Troy Gray and Simon Minted-Colon and a pick or two. They shafted Minted-Colon to the Dorks, who in turn gave Pineapple Head to the Saints. What a joke.
-
ROFLFMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
-
Sorry but HE WOULD HAVE MADE NO DIFFERENCE AT ALL! The guy is a rat and our club was left like every other club that Northey coached....in the poo! Northey left Sydney and melbourne in a hole and he did the same to us. He squeezed the life out of the present squad and that was it.
He was another example (and with all respect to the girls in here) of a soft-$o$k....just listening to that stupid little scrag by his side. If he wanted to stay, he should have stayed. He was talking to Brisbane from June and used them as a way to get more money so frankly he can stick it.
His style was good but it was never going to carry us. You could see against the top sides it wasnt good enough, we got smacked by Geelong (more than once), Carlton took us to the cleaners in the last quarter and well we died on the ass in the second half of the year. We couldnt compete with them.....
And whats worse? Walls comes in and tries to put some structure in and talks FOOTBALL to the players and they are too dumb to understand what he was saying because it wasnt kick long and crash. He was never going to work because he was too smart for our fools (how is he going to teach Howat and neeld to play smart footy?) and the players were backlashing against the Northey decision.
Ill say one thing...in the second half of 96 we were hands down the best side in the comp. Once we got going, we were unstoppable. But the first half was too poo and we missed out because of it. Once everyone got over everything it was too late only for rubbish politics to come out in the pre-season to screw us in 97.
-
Im with you Omster ! :thumbsup
-
Sorry but HE WOULD HAVE MADE NO DIFFERENCE AT ALL! The guy is a rat and our club was left like every other club that Northey coached....in the poo! Northey left Sydney and melbourne in a hole and he did the same to us. He squeezed the life out of the present squad and that was it.
He was another example (and with all respect to the girls in here) of a soft-$o$k....just listening to that stupid little scrag by his side. If he wanted to stay, he should have stayed. He was talking to Brisbane from June and used them as a way to get more money so frankly he can stick it.
His style was good but it was never going to carry us. You could see against the top sides it wasnt good enough, we got smacked by Geelong (more than once), Carlton took us to the cleaners in the last quarter and well we died on the ass in the second half of the year. We couldnt compete with them.....
And whats worse? Walls comes in and tries to put some structure in and talks FOOTBALL to the players and they are too dumb to understand what he was saying because it wasnt kick long and crash. He was never going to work because he was too smart for our fools (how is he going to teach Howat and neeld to play smart footy?) and the players were backlashing against the Northey decision.
Ill say one thing...in the second half of 96 we were hands down the best side in the comp. Once we got going, we were unstoppable. But the first half was too poohe and we missed out because of it. Once everyone got over everything it was too late only for rubbish politics to come out in the pre-season to screw us in 97.
Northey didnt jump, he was pushed. Dont know where you got that about talking to Brisbane from June. He spoke to Brisbane after the papers published that Mal Brown, on authority from Leon Daphne, spoke to Kevin Sheedy.
He made the most out of a poor list. Any coach like Walls can win a premiership with the list he had at Carlton. A good coach makes a poor list competitive, and we were the most competitive team in 95 since we lost our last GF in 82. The draw against the bombers that year was one of the toughest displays of footy I've seen at our club in 20 years.
Northey knew he was short on talent, which is why he chased Lockett for 2 years to agree to join us. That hardly sounds like a guy preparing to jump to Brisbane.
He is the one coach we've had in 20 years that looked like he could get the RFC to play competitive footy. And he is the one coach that brought back the fans and mothballs out of the closet, and some excitment back at the club. And the club rewarded him by approaching to Sheedy.
-
File.....question for you: What is the difference between Frawley and Northey's situation? Both made the finals ONCE and both wanted an extension on the contract? First time around, we made the right decision......follow it up in 96 and you will get your contract. The second time around we thought we made a mistake in 95 so we give Dud an extra year and one psoli in the ass to go as well....
He wasnt pushed......all he had to do was back it up the year after and he would have been rewarded, but he had the skrofitsa in his ear pulling his strings....
BTW, what sort of idiot would read the papers and then go speak to a club? If he is that stupid to beleive the media then he deserved to go....
For the record, he went to Brisbane and left them in a hole as well.
-
The difference was, one was a Richmond premiership player, the other was a perennial winner of wooden spoons at a club where they used to let them bring VBs to training.
Wasnt just paper talk mate. The papers are usually the last to find out.
And KB was in Northey's ear. Northey was sure they were shafting him the way KB was claiming they shafted him. And they were.
-
Who knows which way things really were, but if Northey was being shafted then there must have been a good reason for it.
But how they would have justified it at the time would have been a PR nightmare, to say the least. Not that things worked out brilliantly the way they eventually did anyway. :P
Whether he went or was pushed, Northey could only ever take a team to a competitive level and even though he could get the most out of his players, he couldn’t get them a premiership, because he was too one dimensional in his approach to coaching.
Being competitive would have kept people happy for the short-term, but once the results stagnated, people would have become restless and he would have went the same way as others before him. He just saved others the trouble of moving him on at some stage.
-
Both duds of the utmost pedigree.
Frawley had biger balls than Northey and copped it on the chin (lol)as opposed to Northey
deserting on the strength of what he had HEARD.
I hated Northey's guts.
As far as his coaching ability - LMAO.
Another Fraud.
-
Northey tonight on the Front Bar said all he wanted was security and the Club wouldn't give him that despite a Prelim finish in 1995. He said loved the club he played for and always had wanted to return to coach the Tigers (which he did in 1993). Blamed the failures of those years on those running the club continually sacking coaches. Thanked that it's different now.
The Front Bar showed a news clip from that time of two Richmond officials flying to Perth to try and get Malthouse to coach us. Too bad he was on holidays and wasn't in Perth. Northey tonight replied "That would be so typical".
-
I played under Northey when he led Redan to 3 premierships in a row so I'm biased.
The idea that Northey was a poor coach who just relied on a fire and brimstone approach is laughable but a very successful PR stunt led by that 13 game champion of the RFC, Mal Brown.
For the record Northey went from Redan to St Kilda as Assistant under Mike Patterson and was sacked at the same time as Mike.
He went to Sydney but under the Edelston ownership he was deemed too quiet and didn't get enough publicity. Edelston was chasing Sheedy to take over.
He then coached the Ballarat Football League on a short term basis to 2 country championships. Something they never before or since have got close to.
He then got the job with Melbourne and got them as close as they have in years to the GF.
Stuart Spencer, a Melbourne board member warned him there were people out to get him and he came to Richmond.
At Richmond the main problem both before and since was our constant weak-hearted efforts.
Northey changed that and yet people still continue with this crap about being one-dimensional.
Northey's biggest problem was he was not a political animal like Sheedy.
The same happened at Brisbane where Starcevic (IIRC) the Assistant who shafted Walls wanted the job and did the same to Northey.
The other huge problem at Lions were half the team were from Fitzroy and were chosen by the President before Northey arrived there.
This excuse that Northey was one dimensional and thus doomed to Failure is a joke and should be treated as such.
EVERY team relies on passion to win. Without that you fail in competitive sport. just look around.
Passion is the start and flows through every successful team.
Hawthorn multiple premierships = passion under Clarkson
2016 premiership Bulldogs = passion
2017 premiership Richmond = passion
2018 premiership Eagles = passion (collingwood beats Richmond = passion)
2019 premiership Richmond = passion
-
I played under Northey when he led Redan to 3 premierships in a row so I'm biased.
What position?
-
80th birthday today :birthday.
-----------------------------
Happy 80th birthday to Richmond dual premiership player (1967 and 69) and former coach (1993-95), John "Swooper" Northey
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fzw58ptaMAAn_Bp?format=jpg&name=small) (https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fzw5-wvaIAAn7Kg?format=jpg&name=small)
https://twitter.com/Richmond_FC/status/1674277695230988288