One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: tiger till i die on September 21, 2010, 11:35:39 PM
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im stealing this from BF.com ...i think....:P ..but thought it would be interesting on here from tiger perspectives :thumbsup
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Top 8 finish, the Dogs won't be that strong, neither will the Cats, Crows, Blues (most overated side in the comp), Eagles are not going anyware, Dee's will be up, Port will get worse, the rest speak for them selves.
We have the talent to build the one of the best midfield and forwad line's in the comp, build a decent backline and it's time to stand up. No more finishing 9th, finish in the top 8 or finish last IMO.
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Not that focused on wins or ladder positioning. Its still about getting games into the cubs.
However I have got the feeling Cotch is going to have a very very strong season next year and if pick 6 is a ready to play AFL from day one then who knows.........
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14th.
Our focus should remain on getting games into the kids, finding out who plays best in what position and with the other players and fine tuning our game plan. The minute we deviate from that and start focusing on wins is the minute we fall back into the same trap that has got us no where for the past 30 years. It will be hard enough over the next two years to find players to rebuild with without playing unnecessary pressure on the club to succeed.
Keep the expectations for the list as low as possible until we have the platform to build from.
Stripes
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If we can finish with a percentage around the 100 mark, I'll be happy.
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A top 8 finish would be nice :pray .. but if we dont get there might as well be last as long as we beat carlton and the pies i would sleep easier :thumbsup :gotigers
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Steady improvement from the youngsters
Our focus should remain on getting games into the kids, finding out who plays best in what position and with the other players and fine tuning our game plan. The minute we deviate from that and start focusing on wins is the minute we fall back into the same trap that has got us no where for the past 30 years. It will be hard enough over the next two years to find players to rebuild with without playing unnecessary pressure on the club to succeed.
Keep the expectations for the list as low as possible until we have the platform to build from.
This ^
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For how many years? Til the current crop of talent crack the sh!ts and leave or retire injured lol
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Finals should always been the pass mark.
We won 5 out of 6 so cant be that bad.
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For how many years? Til the current crop of talent crack the sh!ts and leave or retire injured lol
Totally agree, when the hell are our players supposed to actuall perform, we have been saying develop for how many years??? Deledio, Cotchin, Foley etc......time to get it going boys. Aim high for a change. The Dees have more youth than us, do you think they will be aiming for 14th next year???
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For how many years? Til the current crop of talent crack the sh!ts and leave or retire injured lol
Totally agree, when the hell are our players supposed to actuall perform, we have been saying develop for how many years??? Deledio, Cotchin, Foley etc......time to get it going boys. Aim high for a change. The Dees have more youth than us, do you think they will be aiming for 14th next year???
so very true :thumbsup
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Totally agree, when the hell are our players supposed to actuall perform,
I would imagine they are expected to perform every match to the best of their ability
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Top 12
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RICHMOND has embraced a vision for a golden decade with an ambitious plan to more than double membership, clear debt and play finals three times, all within five years.The Tigers are determined to rouse the sleeping giant of football and their dormant fans through their plan, which carries a motto of 3-0-75. The motto stands for playing finals three times, having zero debt and signing 75,000 members within the next five years.The five-year plan is about positioning the club for where it will be by the end of the decade, with a vision for 2020 that they return not just to being one of the top four Victorian clubs, but the top Victorian club.Significant in the short term is the intention to play finals three times by 2014, which would require the Tigers to make the eight no later than 2012 �� and stay there.Left unstated was if, when or how many premierships the club hoped to win by 2020.The five-year written plan, drafted by Brendon Gale after he took over as chief executive last year, pledges the club to the surprisingly bullish targets, which exceed the stated goals of any rival.All staff at the club �� players, coaches and administration �� as well as the board gathered in the players' gym at Punt Road on Tuesday night for the presentation, and all "signed up" to the goals.The plan has been driven by Gale and reflects the belief at the club that, after two years of significant personnel change, the Tigers have the critical people in place to attack such broad goals.Gale has taken over as chief executive, Craig Cameron as general manager of football, Damien Hardwick is the new senior coach, Simon Derrick has been appointed commercial operations manager and Cain Liddle is membership manager.Richmond carries about $4 million in debt, although importantly the new final stage of its Punt Road redevelopment is being done without further capital input by the club. The existing debt would be wiped out and the club would enjoy strong profit growth after retiring the debt.The financial improvement would ride from a doubling of membership to hit a target of 75,000 members. The Tigers last year enjoyed a record membership of 37,000, which was primarily seen as a spike in response to the arrival of Ben Cousins.The long-held belief at Richmond, and broadly in football, is that there is a huge reserve of support that has drifted from the club over the past two decades, which have been marked by upheaval and poor on-field performance.However, Gale reminded staff on Tuesday that Richmond was the first club in the VFL to attract one million fans to its games in a year �� 1972 and again in 1973 �� while the next club to do so, Collingwood, took until 1979. Essendon did not do so until 1993 and Carlton 1995.The belief is not just that Richmond can get back to being one of the top four Victorian clubs but that it can get back to being the top club.On the field, Richmond comes from a long way back in its push to make the finals, having finished 15th last year and being the bookmakers' favourite for the wooden spoon this year.Complicating matters is that to fill holes remaining in their list the Tigers confront drafts weakened by the concessions for the Gold Coast and Western Sydney.Gale last night declined to comment on the strategic plan, saying he wanted to send the information to members first.TIGERS��5-YEAR PLANBrendon Gale��s vision 3YEARS OF FINALS 0DOLLARS DEBT 75THOUSAND MEMBERSTHE MAIN GAMETo return Richmond to the statusit enjoyed in decades past when itwas the No. 1 club in Victoria
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Get more games into the cubs and hopefully find another 7-8 players that will be long termers on our list. If that can happen, I will be confident that we have a solid core to build from starting from our potential A graders in Lids, Martin, Cotch, Reiwoldt. If we do that I have no doubt a REAL sustained rise up the ladder will follow suit from 2012 and beyond, probably start to see some real good signs halfway through next season tbh.
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Totally agree, when the hell are our players supposed to actuall perform,
I would imagine they are expected to perform every match to the best of their ability
Thats right, you would expect that wouldn't you..but do they??
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Totally agree, when the hell are our players supposed to actuall perform,
I would imagine they are expected to perform every match to the best of their ability
Thats right, you would expect that wouldn't you..but do they??
There starting to do this ... they didnt give up during the Port game and sydney game but still holes to fill and mistakes to change :thumbsup
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Results still don't matter its the performance and getting games into the kids.
Whether we pass next year or not still depends on trade week and the draft. We trade away picks for recycled blokes then it will be a fail. Pick kids up and continue to invest in the youth and trying to find the right mix then that to me is a pass. To win more than 6 doing this would be a great result IMO.
To win 8-10 or more with the bulk of recycled draftees next year whilst still passing it off as the fruits that were picked in the 2009 draft would be a monumental fail.
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For how many years? Til the current crop of talent crack the sh!ts and leave or retire injured lol
Totally agree, when the hell are our players supposed to actuall perform, we have been saying develop for how many years??? Deledio, Cotchin, Foley etc......time to get it going boys. Aim high for a change. The Dees have more youth than us, do you think they will be aiming for 14th next year???
Time to start getting the chicken poo ready then! If we don't make finals I say we should get rid of our coach and find a new one too. We are a winning club and if we aren't playing finals then its time to start eatting our own... ::) Have I stepped into a time machine have I? :o Come on guys. I thought we were all on the same page here.
Firstly - The players and coach should always be striving to win every game and play finals at minimum. The Dees are developed than we are buts that not to say we shouldn't be aiming as high (if not higher) than them next year as a list.
We need to be realistic and realise where we are at as a list. We are miles off competing with the likes of Collingwood - we just don't have the cattle yet. We are still trying to find players for most positions. This year was an audition and next year will be rehearsals. 2012 will be the start of the show imho :thumbsup
The players and coaches should be aiming to win the flag but as supporters i say we shouldn't expect anything more than continued development from individuals, the team as a whole and our overall game plan. If we make finals while still focusing on these essentials then I think we would have well and truly over-achieved.
So 14th seems realistic to me :shh
Stripes
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For how many years? Til the current crop of talent crack the sh!ts and leave or retire injured lol
Totally agree, when the hell are our players supposed to actuall perform, we have been saying develop for how many years??? Deledio, Cotchin, Foley etc......time to get it going boys. Aim high for a change. The Dees have more youth than us, do you think they will be aiming for 14th next year???
Time to start getting the chicken poo ready then! If we don't make finals I say we should get rid of our coach and find a new one too. We are a winning club and if we aren't playing finals then its time to start eatting our own... ::) Have I stepped into a time machine have I? :o Come on guys. I thought we were all on the same page here.
Firstly - The players and coach should always be striving to win every game and play finals at minimum. The Dees are developed than we are buts that not to say we shouldn't be aiming as high (if not higher) than them next year as a list.
We need to be realistic and realise where we are at as a list. We are miles off competing with the likes of Collingwood - we just don't have the cattle yet. We are still trying to find players for most positions. This year was an audition and next year will be rehearsals. 2012 will be the start of the show imho :thumbsup
The players and coaches should be aiming to win the flag but as supporters i say we shouldn't expect anything more than continued development from individuals, the team as a whole and our overall game plan. If we make finals while still focusing on these essentials then I think we would have well and truly over-achieved.
So 14th seems realistic to me :shh
Stripes
No chicken poo Stripes, just the truth IMO, mate honestly look at North, look at the Dees, look at the Crows years ago when Craig took over. Tell me mate, really, when do you honestly think our club will need to stand up.
I know where we are at but to aim for 14th... really mate please!! It's not a realistic position for us next year.
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Totally agree, when the hell are our players supposed to actuall perform,
I would imagine they are expected to perform every match to the best of their ability
Thats right, you would expect that wouldn't you..but do they??
There starting to do this ... they didnt give up during the Port game and sydney game but still holes to fill and mistakes to change :thumbsup
Agreed !!!
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8 wins minimum, if we snagged 2 of the first 9 this year we would of had that so expect that.
No more floggings - there will allways be 1 or 2 but no huge losses al la Geelong.
Spose this is where % as mentioned counts 100 is a good starting point for next year.
I believe anything up to 12 may be possible.
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Keep playing the kids, developing the game plan, play with a never give up attitude and the results IMO will take care of themselves
Our best footy when we play it is good
What we need to do is continue to make the gap between our best & worst smaller and smaller (that's what the good sides do) and again the results will take care of themselves
Steady improvement and always being competitive should be our goal and I repeat the results will take care of themselves
:gotigers
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expect jack will kick a bag again next year?
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Keep playing the kids, developing the game plan, play with a never give up attitude and the results IMO will take care of themselves
Our best footy when we play it is good
What we need to do is continue to make the gap between our best & worst smaller and smaller (that's what the good sides do) and again the results will take care of themselves
Steady improvement and always being competitive should be our goal and I repeat the results will take care of themselves
:gotigers
So what year WP will you start to hold our team and players accountable??? As a team WP and the players??
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Keep playing the kids, developing the game plan, play with a never give up attitude and the results IMO will take care of themselves
Our best footy when we play it is good
What we need to do is continue to make the gap between our best & worst smaller and smaller (that's what the good sides do) and again the results will take care of themselves
Steady improvement and always being competitive should be our goal and I repeat the results will take care of themselves
:gotigers
So what year WP will you start to hold our team and players accountable??? As a team WP and the players??
WAT I agree with your sentiments up to a point. I think with a developing side such as ours we need to lay some foundations first and learn all the basics and then once the wins start taking place then can we start raising the bar. I think the kids need to master the game plan(s) and then once we start getting wins then can we reassess our goals. I am sure if we are 6-0 after 6 next year including some respectable scalps that the goals will be reassessed as will be the case if we are 0-6. The difference this time around is I feel that Dimma will make the players accountable rather than hearing excuses about players from previous coaches.
Players who won't adhere or can't cut it will be cut under the Dimma regime.
Furthermore I feel that once we are at that 8-10 win stage which under natural progression I am hoping we will be I feel that yes the goals can be realigned again based on the teams performance. Again if we are below that expectation Damian won't hesitate I feel to be more hard nosed as he would have had 18 months with the kids to try and get them to learn his idealogy.
In essence WAT there is absolutely nothing wrong with what you are saying hence I am saying you are half right as we are still learning. Once the game plans are mastered and our realistic goals are more higher then we can fully hold everyone accountable as all systems should have been learnt our best and worst football should be not that far apart and we would have the expectation of winning every game. We are on the way there and I figure by mid to late 2012 or the start of 2013 then we can honestly say that all we have learnt this year and will learn in 2011 will bear some real fruit and make your demand a realistic and reasonable one. :thumbsup
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No chicken poo Stripes, just the truth IMO, mate honestly look at North, look at the Dees, look at the Crows years ago when Craig took over. Tell me mate, really, when do you honestly think our club will need to stand up.
I know where we are at but to aim for 14th... really mate please!! It's not a realistic position for us next year.
I don't want us to aim for 14th as a club but as supporters I would be happy to finish 14th as long as we have continued to develop our players and game plan. I just want us to not take any short cuts and ensure we finally have the foundation to get in the finals and stay there for a long time.
I understand what you are saying but I'm just tired of short term gains hurting us long term.
Stripes
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Keep playing the kids, developing the game plan, play with a never give up attitude and the results IMO will take care of themselves
Our best footy when we play it is good
What we need to do is continue to make the gap between our best & worst smaller and smaller (that's what the good sides do) and again the results will take care of themselves
Steady improvement and always being competitive should be our goal and I repeat the results will take care of themselves
:gotigers
So what year WP will you start to hold our team and players accountable??? As a team WP and the players??
WAT I agree with your sentiments up to a point. I think with a developing side such as ours we need to lay some foundations first and learn all the basics and then once the wins start taking place then can we start raising the bar. I think the kids need to master the game plan(s) and then once we start getting wins then can we reassess our goals. I am sure if we are 6-0 after 6 next year including some respectable scalps that the goals will be reassessed as will be the case if we are 0-6. The difference this time around is I feel that Dimma will make the players accountable rather than hearing excuses about players from previous coaches.
Players who won't adhere or can't cut it will be cut under the Dimma regime.
Furthermore I feel that once we are at that 8-10 win stage which under natural progression I am hoping we will be I feel that yes the goals can be realigned again based on the teams performance. Again if we are below that expectation Damian won't hesitate I feel to be more hard nosed as he would have had 18 months with the kids to try and get them to learn his idealogy.
In essence WAT there is absolutely nothing wrong with what you are saying hence I am saying you are half right as we are still learning. Once the game plans are mastered and our realistic goals are more higher then we can fully hold everyone accountable as all systems should have been learnt our best and worst football should be not that far apart and we would have the expectation of winning every game. We are on the way there and I figure by mid to late 2012 or the start of 2013 then we can honestly say that all we have learnt this year and will learn in 2011 will bear some real fruit and make your demand a realistic and reasonable one. :thumbsup
Went for a great bike ride today...then I have to read your post......unfortunately the bike ride wins out.....just. :clapping :clapping :clapping :bow :bow
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No chicken poo Stripes, just the truth IMO, mate honestly look at North, look at the Dees, look at the Crows years ago when Craig took over. Tell me mate, really, when do you honestly think our club will need to stand up.
I know where we are at but to aim for 14th... really mate please!! It's not a realistic position for us next year.
I don't want us to aim for 14th as a club but as supporters I would be happy to finish 14th as long as we have continued to develop our players and game plan. I just want us to not take any short cuts and ensure we finally have the foundation to get in the finals and stay there for a long time.
I understand what you are saying but I'm just tired of short term gains hurting us long term.
Stripes
Can't argue with you Stripes.. :thumbsup. We all think the same eh!!
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So what year WP will you start to hold our team and players accountable??? As a team WP and the players??
I actually hold them accountable every year WAT.
But do I hold them to account based on what say Melb or Collingwood does or is doing or where we are at as a team in 2010 going into 2011? For me it has to be based on where we are at.
Previously I have had unrealistic expectations. This year I actually had very little expectations because I thought we needed to go back before we went forward especially when we went with such a young list
Based on where we are at as a CLub and as List I think we made progress this season, improved alot as the year wore on (mid season) but then the last month was disappointing because IMHO the kids (in alot of cases) simply got tired in their first year.
I think there are some players who let themselves down this year with there efforts. I also believe there are some players who got games when they shouldn't have and others who didin't get games when they should have.
As a team the Geelong game was totally unacceptable. Not because we lost but because as I said at the time because we as Club basically conceded the game before we headed down the highway with our selections on the Thursday. The 2nd game against Carlton was diabolical and again unacceptable.
But the wins especially against Sydney, Adel and Freo were highlights and those fighting qualities displayed in those games have to be the norm rather than the exception. If they are we will win more than we lose and as I said the results will take care of themselves
As for 2011; I believe for a number of players it will be make or break time. But these aren't players who are going into their 2nd season. These are the ones who are going into season 3,4,5. They are the ones that need to perform not the kids we will draft or 2nd year guys. The 2nd year guys need to continue to improve
We won 6 games in 2010 and would expect us to better that in 2011 by how many I don't know but 8-10 wins would be acceptable if all the variables full our way.
And no I don't think we will make finals and expect to do so is IMHO unrealistic when we are most likely to have the youngest list in the comp. We are not going to have one bloke on the list over 30 next year.
On top of that with our young & developing list we need so many things to go right and we are so heavily reliant on all our good players being there for the entire season. One bad injury to one of our top players automatically changes expectations. Currently, unlike the Collingwoods of this world we cannot afford to lose our best players through injury because we just don't have the depth to cover things like that
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So what year WP will you start to hold our team and players accountable??? As a team WP and the players??
I actually hold them accountable every year WAT.
But do I hold them to account based on what say Melb or Collingwood does or is doing or where we are at as a team in 2010 going into 2011? For me it has to be based on where we are at.
Previously I have had unrealistic expectations. This year I actually had very little expectations because I thought we needed to go back before we went forward especially when we went with such a young list
Based on where we are at as a CLub and as List I think we made progress this season, improved alot as the year wore on (mid season) but then the last month was disappointing because IMHO the kids (in alot of cases) simply got tired in their first year.
I think there are some players who let themselves down this year with there efforts. I also believe there are some players who got games when they shouldn't have and others who didin't get games when they should have.
As a team the Geelong game was totally unacceptable. Not because we lost but because as I said at the time because we as Club basically conceded the game before we headed down the highway with our selections on the Thursday. The 2nd game against Carlton was diabolical and again unacceptable.
But the wins especially against Sydney, Adel and Freo were highlights and those fighting qualities displayed in those games have to be the norm rather than the exception. If they are we will win more than we lose and as I said the results will take care of themselves
As for 2011; I believe for a number of players it will be make or break time. But these aren't players who are going into their 2nd season. These are the ones who are going into season 3,4,5. They are the ones that need to perform not the kids we will draft or 2nd year guys. The 2nd year guys need to continue to improve
We won 6 games in 2010 and would expect us to better that in 2011 by how many I don't know but 8-10 wins would be acceptable if all the variables full our way.
And no I don't think we will make finals and expect to do so is IMHO unrealistic when we are most likely to have the youngest list in the comp. We are not going to have one bloke on the list over 30 next year.
On top of that with our young & developing list we need so many things to go right and we are so heavily reliant on all our good players being there for the entire season. One bad injury to one of our top players automatically changes expectations. Currently, unlike the Collingwoods of this world we cannot afford to lose our best players through injury because we just don't have the depth to cover things like
Hey WP, I never thought you were going to say hi... :thumbsup :lol. We all want the best and some of us.. me... expect it a bit sooner. You are right and I need another Shiraz...lol Great post mate.... really I know what you are saying.
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Finals - with one finals win!
:)
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Okay guys, now what is a realistic position on the ladder for us next year ???
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If Tambing leaves we say goodbye to 5 of our 8 'most games played' on the RFC list.
only Deledio, Tuck & Newman will have played more than 90 AFL games going into 2011.
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Okay guys, now what is a realistic position on the ladder for us next year ???
Knocking on the door of the 8 with somewhere between 8-12 wins. Most likely not making finals but not far away.
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I think thats around the mark smokey. A good run with injury/suspension could give an outside chance of making up the numbers come first week in september
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Will be happy to see more improvement and the continuation of the "No shortcut" policy.
8 -10 wins is a realistic goal.
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i could live with 0 wins or 10 wins. as long as the right processes are gone thru both on and off the field. its not about wins it wont be for awhile yet imo. you could win 10 and not really improve. you could win 3 or 4 and show dramatic improvement.
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i could live with 0 wins or 10 wins. as long as the right processes are gone thru both on and off the field. its not about wins it wont be for awhile yet imo. you could win 10 and not really improve. you could win 3 or 4 and show dramatic improvement.
i agree with this