One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: wayne on October 14, 2010, 05:03:49 PM
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Richmond list changes
Richmond has trimmed its playing list after the completion of the 2010 trade period.
During the trade period, Richard Tambling and Andrew Collins moved to Adelaide and Carlton respectively, while Shaun Grigg arrived at Punt Road from Carlton.
Ben Cousins, Graham Polak and Troy Simmonds all announced their retirements in 2010.
Tom Hislop, Jordan McMahon, Dean Polo, Adam Thomson, Relton Roberts and rookie Alroy Gilligan have been delisted.
The Tigers return to training in early November, ahead of the 2010 National Draft on November 18.
http://www.richmondfc.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/6301/newsid/104150/default.aspx
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This looks like a clean out of nine midfield type places on the list
1. Bling
2. Collo
3. Cuz
4. Sloppy
5. Jordie
6. Deano
7. Thomson
8. Relton
9. Gilligan
We already have Grigg. Assuming that Houli gets to RFC (wonders why) and that Sloppy gets rookied, is it reasonable to think that we will be looking for at least six mids and, say, two talls in the ND and rookie drafts?
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All up 11 changes this time around. Hardwick has done a terrific job cleaning out the list. thats 50%-60% in the space of about 13 months.
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All up 11 changes this time around. Hardwick has done a terrific job cleaning out the list. thats 50%-60% in the space of about 13 months.
yep spot on ramps
and polo has paid the price for opening his mouth too much early in the season and having major attitude issues
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Well done Hardwick and the football dept. I would think another cleanout of 8-9 next year and we will have turned our list over and should have the core list capable of playing finals footy for many years.
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Richmond has trimmed its playing list after the completion of the 2010 trade period.
During the trade period, Richard Tambling and Andrew Collins moved to Adelaide and Carlton respectively, while Shaun Grigg arrived at Punt Road from Carlton.
Ben Cousins, Graham Polak and Troy Simmonds all announced their retirements in 2010.
Tom Hislop, Jordan McMahon, Dean Polo, Adam Thomson, Relton Roberts and rookie Alroy Gilligan have been delisted.
The Tigers return to training in early November, ahead of the 2010 National Draft on November 18.
http://www.richmondfc.com.au/tabid/6301/default.aspx?newsid=104150
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All up 11 changes this time around. Hardwick has done a terrific job cleaning out the list. thats 50%-60% in the space of about 13 months.
25 gone in the space of 12 months isn't it?
Agree X. It's all been downhill for Deano since making one of the best debuts and having one of worst hairstyles (leopard). In the end he just wasn't good enough. Not overtly, not highly skilled and never found a position on the ground to settle into.
Not Hardwick's fault but 5 of those 6 delistings were brought to the club in just the past 3 draft years. Rookies are always a risk but the other three were all recycled players who should never have been picked up in the first place. A 2nd, 3rd and 4th round picks down the drain. Almost a full drafts worth of decent picks :P.
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all of them ... waste of time!
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7 spots now free on our senior list with Cuz, Simmo, Tambo, Collo, Jordie, Polo, Thomson, Hislop gone and Grigg coming in.
So that gives us 6 ND picks (6, 29, 46, 50, 63, 80) plus the PSD pick (Houli). Pick 80 will be used for a promoted rookie (Gourdis) so that's 5 live National draft picks.
4 spots on our rookie list are now free - Polak, Roberts, Gilligan, Gourdis (promoted) out. Hislop and Miller will take two of those four spots ::). So two live rookie draft picks at 8 and 25.
All up that'll give us 9 new faces on our whole list for next year including Grigg and Houli.
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This looks like a clean out of nine midfield type places on the list
1. Bling
2. Collo
3. Cuz
4. Sloppy
5. Jordie
6. Deano
7. Thomson
8. Relton
9. Gilligan
We already have Grigg. Assuming that Houli gets to RFC (wonders why) and that Sloppy gets rookied, is it reasonable to think that we will be looking for at least six mids and, say, two talls in the ND and rookie drafts?
Cuz is the only genuine midfielder lost from that group. This seems to be a midfielders draft so I think you'll be right Muscles with us going for around 6 mids including Grigg and Houli. Although the latter two I wouldn't call genuine mids either :-\. Hislop is another waste of a rookie spot.
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hislop ::)
why why why did we ever get him
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and polo has paid the price for opening his mouth too much early in the season and having major attitude issues
That's very funny very funny indeed :rollin :jump :jump
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Well done Hardwick and the football dept. I would think another cleanout of 8-9 next year and we will have turned our list over and should have the core list capable of playing finals footy for many years.
Highly doubt it. I'd say Nahas and Tuck will probably go next year and maybe White. Hard to write any others off
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These delistings or trades have really brought a smile to my face.
Never would i have imagined that all of Hislop, Tambling, Mcmuffin and Thomspson would all be gone at seasons end.
Hardwick is right on the money what a great job his doing with this list.
Hislop is a joke but that Thompson is something else. Honestly those recruiters must have been on ice or that Meow stuff for recruting him.
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With a turnover of 25 players since he has arrived leaves only 20 players left from the full list both senior and rookie in 2009. Hardwick has turned over this list by somewhere in the vicinity of about 55-60%. There could be another half dozen from that list at a minimum that may be in the firing line next year.
Newman Thursfield Deledio Riewoldt Cotchin
Edwards McGuane Rance Connors Morton
Tuck Jackson Graham Nahas King
Vickery White Post Moore Foley
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Good decisions by the club - with the exception of Miller and Hislop, 2 mature players as rookies is a joke.
I really hope that the club remains both committed and focussed on bringing new players into our development system and avoids the trap of taking players from other clubs.
We have de-listed/retired 5 players who were originally taken from opposition clubs - Thomson, Hislop, Polak, Cuz and Simmonds.
Cuz is the only clear win from the group, the foreign legion approach has not worked for 10 years.
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Well done Hardwick and the football dept. I would think another cleanout of 8-9 next year and we will have turned our list over and should have the core list capable of playing finals footy for many years.
Highly doubt it. I'd say Nahas and Tuck will probably go next year and maybe White. Hard to write any others off
Tuck and White I believe are both contracted until 2012. They don't appear to have worthwhile trade value either based on recent trade periods. Nahas, Thursty, King, Rance, Gourdis plus all our current rookies would need a strong 2011 to survive this time next year IMO. If Foley has another year interrupted by injury the club may try to trade him. Both he and McGuane are also contracted until 2012.
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Oh my goodness, whos going to be our whipping boy from now on.
Oh well I guess there will be someone who will step down so we can all slag off on and withdraw support of - if need be - LOL
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Oh my goodness, whos going to be our whipping boy from now on.
Oh well I guess there will be someone who will step down so we can all slag off on and withdraw support of - if need be - LOL
Oh, there will be ... and i am tipping Shane Edwards to be just that!
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Oh my goodness, whos going to be our whipping boy from now on.
Oh well I guess there will be someone who will step down so we can all slag off on and withdraw support of - if need be - LOL
Oh, there will be ... and i am tipping Shane Edwards to be just that!
Not if he plays like he did this year.
I think Nahas may have taken that mantle.
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Oh my goodness, whos going to be our whipping boy from now on.
Oh well I guess there will be someone who will step down so we can all slag off on and withdraw support of - if need be - LOL
Oh, there will be ... and i am tipping Shane Edwards to be just that!
Nahas wont get a match next year.
Only way Nahas will, is if players are injured.
Not if he plays like he did this year.
I think Nahas may have taken that mantle.
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Good work Dimma
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and polo has paid the price for opening his mouth too much early in the season and having major attitude issues
That's very funny very funny indeed :rollin :jump :jump
You will defend him to the day you die WP..... :thumbsup
On another note, we don't really have anyone to bag next year now do we, the list looks pretty good..... no doubt someone will cop it though.. :lol
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You will defend him to the day you die WP..... :thumbsup
Hmmm... not really. When things are true you cant defend when things are not true I find them funny, have a laugh and move on ;D :lol
BTW WAT I'm not surprised at all he got de-listed ;)
On another note, we don't really have anyone to bag next year now do we, the list looks pretty good..... no doubt someone will cop it though.. :lol
Oh we do .. I would think Nahas currently holds the title with all Tiger eyes on poor Grigg who will take up the mantle if he plays one bad game ;D
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Very happy with the delistings. Good work by Club. I feel sorry for Roberts I hope he sorts out his personal issues. Polo just never developed. Hislop and Thomson were never up to scratch. McMahon was just one of the many terrible decisions Wallace made.
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Very happy with the delistings. Good work by Club. I feel sorry for Roberts I hope he sorts out his personal issues. Polo just never developed. Hislop and Thomson were never up to scratch. McMahon was just one of the many terrible decisions Wallace made.
roberts was just really missing his son and family, they were his issues
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If Dimma achieves nothing else in his time at RFC at least he has the achievement of de-spudding the Tiges
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If Dimma achieves nothing else in his time at RFC at least he has the achievement of de-spudding the Tiges
I would suggest that if he achieves nothing else then he will also have re-spudded the Tiges! :o
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Good decisions by the club - with the exception of Miller and Hislop, 2 mature players as rookies is a joke.
I really hope that the club remains both committed and focussed on bringing new players into our development system and avoids the trap of taking players from other clubs.
We have de-listed/retired 5 players who were originally taken from opposition clubs - Thomson, Hislop, Polak, Cuz and Simmonds.
Cuz is the only clear win from the group, the foreign legion approach has not worked for 10 years.
By the same token you could say that drafting youth has not worked for us either Y&B.
Recycling players itself has not been the problem, it's the players selected, just the same as with our drafting of youth.
I found Blair Hartlty's comment about drafting for talent and trading for need interesting.
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well that was very much needed, well done tiges
Just dissapointed we're wasting 2 rookie spots on Hislop and Miller.
Can you imagine if Tuck, White, Graham & King didn't save/extend their careers this season? it would have been 15 changes - 29 changes in 2 seasons yikes! :o
A bit of perspective for those who sometimes get ahead of themselves as to where this club is at
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well that was very much needed, well done tiges
Just dissapointed we're wasting 2 rookie spots on Hislop and Miller.
Can you imagine if Tuck, White, Graham & King didn't save/extend their careers this season? it would have been 15 changes - 29 changes in 2 seasons yikes! :o
A bit of perspective for those who sometimes get ahead of themselves as to where this club is at
Good post. Istill think that people are judging the club's decision to take Miller and Hislop in the rookie draft is a bit harsh. I think if it was an uncompromised draft this criticism would be justified but given the diluted draft I think their inclusion is more than valid. While the talent pool in considered excellent this year in the early rounds, clubs are concerned about finding players in the later stages of the Nation Draft. By the time the PSD is finished the pickings will be incredibly slim come the Rookie Draft. Any players we would take in the 3rd and 4th rounds of the rookie draft would not even be speculative, they would be a waste if time and resources. At least with Hislop and Miller we can fill any holes for the short term until the draft is untampered with once again.
Godd delistings IMHO :thumbsup
Stripes
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well that was very much needed, well done tiges
Just dissapointed we're wasting 2 rookie spots on Hislop and Miller.
Can you imagine if Tuck, White, Graham & King didn't save/extend their careers this season? it would have been 15 changes - 29 changes in 2 seasons yikes! :o
A bit of perspective for those who sometimes get ahead of themselves as to where this club is at
Couldn't agree more. These were terrific delistings and all part of the cleansing process but as i said earlier i still think another 8-9 will/need to go.
With the new interchange rules and the possibility of us drafting a ruckman i think there is a good chance that either graham or browne will be gone next year. Know that may sound harsh as they are both young but i dont think that both can remain on the list. Nahas seems like an obvious to go unless things change drastically. White, Farmer, King and Thursfield will need to perform i believe next year to consolidate their place on the list. Hislop and Miller (if they are indeed rookied) could be gone next year and some of the other rookies will need to perform to remain. Mcguane and Rance could potentially be traded (as i think they may have some currency, even if it aint much) if Gourdis, Grimes and Astbury continue to develop in the backline so i think it is very easy to see how at least another 8-9 could potentially be gone next year.
Still a long way to go indeed.
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All up 11 changes this time around. Hardwick has done a terrific job cleaning out the list. thats 50%-60% in the space of about 13 months.
yep spot on ramps
and polo has paid the price for opening his mouth too much early in the season and having major attitude issues
What a load of rubbish that is ! He paid the price for not being able to get a game in a bottom team coz he's no good...simple
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Hey Pee Pee i think the link to your avatar is broken.
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The new whippping boy is the same as the old whipping boy - Luke McGuane
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Great delisting but I dont think people should get ahead of themselves, just because we have got rid of a bunch of players that couldn't do it for us, doesn't mean the young kids we have can.
Drafting is a weeding process and we should draft as many new kids for as much possible talent as we can and weed out those who can't. We aren't in any kind of finals shape and wont be so for 2 or 3 years at best.
From last years draft of 14 new faces, we have already lost 1. I would not be surprised if we lose 6 more in the next 2-3 years as it becomes obvious they can't perform at AFL level. That would be a %50 hit rate which is about average.
From this years 11 (I really do hope we take 11 new faces and not 9) we will keep about 5, with half a dozen or so originals, 7 from last year and 5 from this year in 2 years we could have a competitive team.
I still think we will need this years and the next two years drafts to go well too.
We are so far away from being finals competitive at the moment, only 3 players have player 100+ games and 13 in total 50+, lets not get ahead of ourselves.
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All up 11 changes this time around. Hardwick has done a terrific job cleaning out the list. thats 50%-60% in the space of about 13 months.
yep spot on ramps
and polo has paid the price for opening his mouth too much early in the season and having major attitude issues
What a load of rubbish that is ! He paid the price for not being able to get a game in a bottom team coz he's no good...simple
shows how much u know, sweet FA
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Inwould much rather giving relton Roberts another chance
ahead of getting brad miller >:(
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Inwould much rather giving relton Roberts another chance
ahead of getting brad miller >:(
That's funny. :rollin
Roberts aint coming back to Punt Rd.
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Inwould much rather giving relton Roberts another chance
ahead of getting brad miller >:(
That's funny. :rollin
Roberts aint coming back to Punt Rd.
x 2
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All up 11 changes this time around. Hardwick has done a terrific job cleaning out the list. thats 50%-60% in the space of about 13 months.
yep spot on ramps
and polo has paid the price for opening his mouth too much early in the season and having major attitude issues
What a load of rubbish that is ! He paid the price for not being able to get a game in a bottom team coz he's no good...simple
shows how much u know, sweet FA
this the same bloke who thought "Dimma had a role earmarked for Tambo all year hence the way he performed all year"
Give me a spell i been reading your crap and it is you pal who has NFI
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I've seen nothing about hislop being rookied. I've just heard a rumour
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yeah some wink wink coterie insider types in love with his pecks have been jizzing that rumour all over the internet since Hissy went under the knife mid-season ;) ;) ;)
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Great delisting but I dont think people should get ahead of themselves, just because we have got rid of a bunch of players that couldn't do it for us, doesn't mean the young kids we have can.
Drafting is a weeding process and we should draft as many new kids for as much possible talent as we can and weed out those who can't. We aren't in any kind of finals shape and wont be so for 2 or 3 years at best.
From last years draft of 14 new faces, we have already lost 1. I would not be surprised if we lose 6 more in the next 2-3 years as it becomes obvious they can't perform at AFL level. That would be a %50 hit rate which is about average.
From this years 11 (I really do hope we take 11 new faces and not 9) we will keep about 5, with half a dozen or so originals, 7 from last year and 5 from this year in 2 years we could have a competitive team.
I still think we will need this years and the next two years drafts to go well too.
We are so far away from being finals competitive at the moment, only 3 players have player 100+ games and 13 in total 50+, lets not get ahead of ourselves.
Top post tidyman :clapping :thumbsup. I agree we are a fair way away from finals. Not sure where Craig Cameron gets 2012 from ???.
The problem in the past is we've not only been well below the 50% hit rate but we've compounded the problem by having/using so few picks on kids to begin with :-\. Hopefully using 7 ND picks last year and 5 ND picks this year (with one up our sleeve for the future) are of sign we're starting to understand how to use the National draft properly. It of course could've been much better if we had tanked (less than 4 wins in each of 2009-10) and collected another top 4 and top 20 pick ;).
For mine if you gain 3 best 22 players from one draft then your on par. Anything below that is a shocker. Gaining 4 best 22 players is a good draft and 5+ is an excellent draft (such as Geelong in 1999, 2001 and the Pies in 2006). You also want to find at least one A-grader per year in that lot. So going through our list ...
2000 - FAIL
Chris Newman - National Draft (No.53)
2001 - FAIL ..... so much for the superdraft :P
2002 - FAIL
Kelvin Moore – Rookie Draft (No.3) – promoted to senior list 2004
2003 - PAR :o. .....Foley being injured though has hurt us.
Daniel Jackson – National Draft (No.53)
Shane Tuck - National Draft (No.71)
Nathan Foley – Rookie Draft (No.4) – promoted to senior list 2005
2004 - FAIL ....Lids is A-grade but Thursty and McGuane on borrowed time for mine. All those other picks goneski :P
Brett Deledio – National Draft (No.1)
Luke McGuane - National Draft (No.36)
Will Thursfield – Rookie Draft (No.1) – promoted to senior list 2005
2005 - FAIL ...... just 3 picks in the ND was pathetic for a club meant to be rebuilding.
Matthew White – Pre-Season Draft (No.5)
Angus Graham – Rookie Draft (No.5) – promoted to senior list 2008
2006 - PAR-ish .... Jack is A-grade but jury still out on the rest. Kingy on borrowed time for mine despite his year
Jack Riewoldt – National Draft (No.13)
Shane Edwards – National Draft (No.26)
Daniel Connors – National Draft (No.58)
Jake King – Rookie Draft (No.24) - promoted to senior list 2007
2007 ..... Cotch has the ability to be A-grade. Need at least two of the other 3 to make it to score a PAR.
Mitch Morton - Exchange period (traded by West Coast)
Trent Cotchin – National Draft (No.2)
Alex Rance – National Draft (No.18 )
David Gourdis - Pre-Season Draft (No.1)
2008 ..... Jury still out on TV, Postie and Browne as talls take longer to develop. Nahas will be lucky to survive this time next year. Tempting to give it a FAIL just for the fact that there's only 4 left just two years later and only 2 picks on kids in the National draft was a disgrace ::).
Tyrone Vickery - National Draft (No.8 )
Jayden Post - National Draft (No. 26)
Robin Nahas - Rookie Draft (No.8 )
Andrew Browne - Rookie Draft (No.39)
2009 ..... Too early to tell after just one year. Has the potential to be our only above-par to excellent draft of the past decade. No guarantees at this stage though. Here's hoping we get 5+ best-22ers and even a couple of future A-graders from this group
Mitch Farmer - Exchange period (traded by Port Adelaide)
Dustin Martin - National Draft (No.3)
Ben Griffiths - National Draft (No.19)
David Astbury - National Draft (No.35)
Matthew Dea - National Draft (No.44)
Troy Taylor - National Draft (No.51)
Jeromey Webberley - National Draft (No.67)
Ben Nason - National Draft (No.71)
Dylan Grimes - Pre-Season Draft (No.2)
Robbie Hicks - Rookie Draft (No.7)
Pat Contin - Rookie Draft (No.23)
Nick Westhoff - Rookie Draft (No.51)
Jamie O'Reilly - Rookie Draft (No.70)
2010 ..... yet to conclude. At least we'll have 5 picks in the ND
Shaun Grigg - Exchange period (traded by Carlton)
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We have de-listed/retired 5 players who were originally taken from opposition clubs - Thomson, Hislop, Polak, Cuz and Simmonds.
Cuz is the only clear win from the group, the foreign legion approach has not worked for 10 years.
Actually Simmonds was an excellent pick-up and the only reason Cuz is more of a win is positive PR which cost nothing at the trade table.
* He was needed when traded for, we had just lost the Donut to Geelong.
* We got him by sending Fiora to St Kilda (genius)
* He had an almost All Australian season in 2006 and another good season in 2008.
The fact is we gave him too long a contract and he was injured too often in his time for the Tiges. But are either of those his fault?
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well that was very much needed, well done tiges
Just dissapointed we're wasting 2 rookie spots on Hislop and Miller.
Can you imagine if Tuck, White, Graham & King didn't save/extend their careers this season? it would have been 15 changes - 29 changes in 2 seasons yikes! :o
A bit of perspective for those who sometimes get ahead of themselves as to where this club is at
Good post. Istill think that people are judging the club's decision to take Miller and Hislop in the rookie draft is a bit harsh. I think if it was an uncompromised draft this criticism would be justified but given the diluted draft I think their inclusion is more than valid. While the talent pool in considered excellent this year in the early rounds, clubs are concerned about finding players in the later stages of the Nation Draft. By the time the PSD is finished the pickings will be incredibly slim come the Rookie Draft. Any players we would take in the 3rd and 4th rounds of the rookie draft would not even be speculative, they would be a waste if time and resources. At least with Hislop and Miller we can fill any holes for the short term until the draft is untampered with once again.
Godd delistings IMHO :thumbsup
Stripes
Sorry Stripes but I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one. I understand what you're saying as far the talent pool is thin at late rookie picks. No issue with that. However, that doesn't mean we then clog our rookie list with mature players who we know 100% are not going to last. That is a waste of time, money and resources. Every year there are teenagers who are overlooked by every single AFL club in one draft year only to picked up in a later draft having shown form in a state league which finally attracts interest from AFL clubs - Michael Barlow, Liam Anthony, Harry Taylor, Jason Porplyzia, Matthew Priddis, Ben McGlynn, Nick Maxwell, Aaron Davey, Matthew Boyd were all drafted in subsequent drafts from state leagues after being overlooked at 18 years of age. Any of those players could have been picked up with a late rookie pick at 18 or even the year before they eventually were. Then there are just the good finds late in the rookie draft - in 2007 we re-rookied Cam Howat at pick 47 in the rookie draft using the insurance and weak pool arguments; at pick 57 Geelong drafted Shane Mumford from their VFL side. In 2008 we passed on our last rookie pick (67) yet Greg Broughton was picked up by Freo at 74 from East Fremantle. Sure the chance of finding a player with a late rookie pick is slim but it isn't 0% and the rewards are great for recruiters who can spot late developers before anyone else does. Clubs that put their faith and resources into the drafts are more likely to succeed than clubs that recycle known players with no future.
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You will defend him to the day you die WP..... :thumbsup
Hmmm... not really. When things are true you cant defend when things are not true I find them funny, have a laugh and move on ;D :lol
BTW WAT I'm not surprised at all he got de-listed ;)
On another note, we don't really have anyone to bag next year now do we, the list looks pretty good..... no doubt someone will cop it though.. :lol
Oh we do .. I would think Nahas currently holds the title with all Tiger eyes on poor Grigg who will take up the mantle if he plays one bad game ;D
Yeah true WP there will always be some one in our team eh.. ;)
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well that was very much needed, well done tiges
Just dissapointed we're wasting 2 rookie spots on Hislop and Miller.
Can you imagine if Tuck, White, Graham & King didn't save/extend their careers this season? it would have been 15 changes - 29 changes in 2 seasons yikes! :o
A bit of perspective for those who sometimes get ahead of themselves as to where this club is at
Good post. Istill think that people are judging the club's decision to take Miller and Hislop in the rookie draft is a bit harsh. I think if it was an uncompromised draft this criticism would be justified but given the diluted draft I think their inclusion is more than valid. While the talent pool in considered excellent this year in the early rounds, clubs are concerned about finding players in the later stages of the Nation Draft. By the time the PSD is finished the pickings will be incredibly slim come the Rookie Draft. Any players we would take in the 3rd and 4th rounds of the rookie draft would not even be speculative, they would be a waste if time and resources. At least with Hislop and Miller we can fill any holes for the short term until the draft is untampered with once again.
Godd delistings IMHO :thumbsup
Stripes
Sorry Stripes but I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one. I understand what you're saying as far the talent pool is thin at late rookie picks. No issue with that. However, that doesn't mean we then clog our rookie list with mature players who we know 100% are not going to last. That is a waste of time, money and resources. Every year there are teenagers who are overlooked by every single AFL club in one draft year only to picked up in a later draft having shown form in a state league which finally attracts interest from AFL clubs - Michael Barlow, Liam Anthony, Harry Taylor, Jason Porplyzia, Matthew Priddis, Ben McGlynn, Nick Maxwell, Aaron Davey, Matthew Boyd were all drafted in subsequent drafts from state leagues after being overlooked at 18 years of age. Any of those players could have been picked up with a late rookie pick at 18 or even the year before they eventually were. Then there are just the good finds late in the rookie draft - in 2007 we re-rookied Cam Howat at pick 47 in the rookie draft using the insurance and weak pool arguments; at pick 57 Geelong drafted Shane Mumford from their VFL side. In 2008 we passed on our last rookie pick (67) yet Greg Broughton was picked up by Freo at 74 from East Fremantle. Sure the chance of finding a player with a late rookie pick is slim but it isn't 0% and the rewards are great for recruiters who can spot late developers before anyone else does. Clubs that put their faith and resources into the drafts are more likely to succeed than clubs that recycle known players with no future.
You are spot on WA tiger. Old players who aren't going to make it should not be drafted for any kind of insurance. we dont need insurance, we need to build a core.
Miller and Hislop would be stupid picks.
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I would suggest that there is scope for both ways of thinking. Miller would be brought in for not only as a back up but as a development coach for such a young list- good move if he has the right qualities of say a Cuz
I dont know the full story will Hislop but he might not make to our list but I would imagine if there is anther prospect that is available he might be left out. If he has done all the right things by the club we could do worse than having him as a backup.
PS: noy all kids are star either, so I just hope our recruiters are still doing their homework - but I would be surprised if they are not
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non of those player you mention are 195cm plus chfs
ie. Miller
well that was very much needed, well done tiges
Just dissapointed we're wasting 2 rookie spots on Hislop and Miller.
Can you imagine if Tuck, White, Graham & King didn't save/extend their careers this season? it would have been 15 changes - 29 changes in 2 seasons yikes! :o
A bit of perspective for those who sometimes get ahead of themselves as to where this club is at
Good post. Istill think that people are judging the club's decision to take Miller and Hislop in the rookie draft is a bit harsh. I think if it was an uncompromised draft this criticism would be justified but given the diluted draft I think their inclusion is more than valid. While the talent pool in considered excellent this year in the early rounds, clubs are concerned about finding players in the later stages of the Nation Draft. By the time the PSD is finished the pickings will be incredibly slim come the Rookie Draft. Any players we would take in the 3rd and 4th rounds of the rookie draft would not even be speculative, they would be a waste if time and resources. At least with Hislop and Miller we can fill any holes for the short term until the draft is untampered with once again.
Godd delistings IMHO :thumbsup
Stripes
Sorry Stripes but I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one. I understand what you're saying as far the talent pool is thin at late rookie picks. No issue with that. However, that doesn't mean we then clog our rookie list with mature players who we know 100% are not going to last. That is a waste of time, money and resources. Every year there are teenagers who are overlooked by every single AFL club in one draft year only to picked up in a later draft having shown form in a state league which finally attracts interest from AFL clubs - Michael Barlow, Liam Anthony, Harry Taylor, Jason Porplyzia, Matthew Priddis, Ben McGlynn, Nick Maxwell, Aaron Davey, Matthew Boyd were all drafted in subsequent drafts from state leagues after being overlooked at 18 years of age. Any of those players could have been picked up with a late rookie pick at 18 or even the year before they eventually were. Then there are just the good finds late in the rookie draft - in 2007 we re-rookied Cam Howat at pick 47 in the rookie draft using the insurance and weak pool arguments; at pick 57 Geelong drafted Shane Mumford from their VFL side. In 2008 we passed on our last rookie pick (67) yet Greg Broughton was picked up by Freo at 74 from East Fremantle. Sure the chance of finding a player with a late rookie pick is slim but it isn't 0% and the rewards are great for recruiters who can spot late developers before anyone else does. Clubs that put their faith and resources into the drafts are more likely to succeed than clubs that recycle known players with no future.
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McMahon highest paid VFL footballer ever :lol
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well that was very much needed, well done tiges
Just dissapointed we're wasting 2 rookie spots on Hislop and Miller.
Can you imagine if Tuck, White, Graham & King didn't save/extend their careers this season? it would have been 15 changes - 29 changes in 2 seasons yikes! :o
A bit of perspective for those who sometimes get ahead of themselves as to where this club is at
Good post. Istill think that people are judging the club's decision to take Miller and Hislop in the rookie draft is a bit harsh. I think if it was an uncompromised draft this criticism would be justified but given the diluted draft I think their inclusion is more than valid. While the talent pool in considered excellent this year in the early rounds, clubs are concerned about finding players in the later stages of the Nation Draft. By the time the PSD is finished the pickings will be incredibly slim come the Rookie Draft. Any players we would take in the 3rd and 4th rounds of the rookie draft would not even be speculative, they would be a waste if time and resources. At least with Hislop and Miller we can fill any holes for the short term until the draft is untampered with once again.
Godd delistings IMHO :thumbsup
Stripes
Sorry Stripes but I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one. I understand what you're saying as far the talent pool is thin at late rookie picks. No issue with that. However, that doesn't mean we then clog our rookie list with mature players who we know 100% are not going to last. That is a waste of time, money and resources. Every year there are teenagers who are overlooked by every single AFL club in one draft year only to picked up in a later draft having shown form in a state league which finally attracts interest from AFL clubs - Michael Barlow, Liam Anthony, Harry Taylor, Jason Porplyzia, Matthew Priddis, Ben McGlynn, Nick Maxwell, Aaron Davey, Matthew Boyd were all drafted in subsequent drafts from state leagues after being overlooked at 18 years of age. Any of those players could have been picked up with a late rookie pick at 18 or even the year before they eventually were. Then there are just the good finds late in the rookie draft - in 2007 we re-rookied Cam Howat at pick 47 in the rookie draft using the insurance and weak pool arguments; at pick 57 Geelong drafted Shane Mumford from their VFL side. In 2008 we passed on our last rookie pick (67) yet Greg Broughton was picked up by Freo at 74 from East Fremantle. Sure the chance of finding a player with a late rookie pick is slim but it isn't 0% and the rewards are great for recruiters who can spot late developers before anyone else does. Clubs that put their faith and resources into the drafts are more likely to succeed than clubs that recycle known players with no future.
I can completely see where you are coming from MT but I juest think that Miller and perhaps even Hislop are more to do with protecting and developig our current players rather than finding new players in a position where it is likely such late picks will be just as bigger a waste. For every success story that comes from the rookie list their are scores who don't. More money is wasted on these prospective players than two mature aged players that can definately fill a short term need at the club.
If we were using all our rookie picks on Mature Aged players I'd be upset but the last two picks in an extremely dilluted talent pool I can certainly live with. I wouldn't recommend it in a normal draft but in the next two, I think most clubs will be looking to develop what they have rather than grab a player who is extremely unlikely to come on.
In my opinion I think we are still bringing in at least 5 young players through the ND, traded for 2 young midfielders and are rerooking one young player leaving us to bring in only one mature aged rookie/development coach. Seems like we are trying to make the most of an unusual position.
Just my opinion of course MT
Stripes
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Crazy delisting a player like Polo. Another club will snap him up
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well that was very much needed, well done tiges
Just dissapointed we're wasting 2 rookie spots on Hislop and Miller.
Can you imagine if Tuck, White, Graham & King didn't save/extend their careers this season? it would have been 15 changes - 29 changes in 2 seasons yikes! :o
A bit of perspective for those who sometimes get ahead of themselves as to where this club is at
Good post. Istill think that people are judging the club's decision to take Miller and Hislop in the rookie draft is a bit harsh. I think if it was an uncompromised draft this criticism would be justified but given the diluted draft I think their inclusion is more than valid. While the talent pool in considered excellent this year in the early rounds, clubs are concerned about finding players in the later stages of the Nation Draft. By the time the PSD is finished the pickings will be incredibly slim come the Rookie Draft. Any players we would take in the 3rd and 4th rounds of the rookie draft would not even be speculative, they would be a waste if time and resources. At least with Hislop and Miller we can fill any holes for the short term until the draft is untampered with once again.
Godd delistings IMHO :thumbsup
Stripes
Sorry Stripes but I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one. I understand what you're saying as far the talent pool is thin at late rookie picks. No issue with that. However, that doesn't mean we then clog our rookie list with mature players who we know 100% are not going to last. That is a waste of time, money and resources. Every year there are teenagers who are overlooked by every single AFL club in one draft year only to picked up in a later draft having shown form in a state league which finally attracts interest from AFL clubs - Michael Barlow, Liam Anthony, Harry Taylor, Jason Porplyzia, Matthew Priddis, Ben McGlynn, Nick Maxwell, Aaron Davey, Matthew Boyd were all drafted in subsequent drafts from state leagues after being overlooked at 18 years of age. Any of those players could have been picked up with a late rookie pick at 18 or even the year before they eventually were. Then there are just the good finds late in the rookie draft - in 2007 we re-rookied Cam Howat at pick 47 in the rookie draft using the insurance and weak pool arguments; at pick 57 Geelong drafted Shane Mumford from their VFL side. In 2008 we passed on our last rookie pick (67) yet Greg Broughton was picked up by Freo at 74 from East Fremantle. Sure the chance of finding a player with a late rookie pick is slim but it isn't 0% and the rewards are great for recruiters who can spot late developers before anyone else does. Clubs that put their faith and resources into the drafts are more likely to succeed than clubs that recycle known players with no future.
so true MT and one of the smartest posts i have read in a while.
Hislop to protect our youngsters. Stripes you cant be serious. Hislop is a dud of the highest order. An absolute waste of time that guy.
MT is 100% right there is no such thing as diluted draft. So many rookies now play seniors and these 2 selections is a major waste of time and could've been used to find a hidden gem. Guys like Maxwell and Davey were rookies werent they.
We have to stop treating this rookie as a joke by re signing duds e.g howatt and Hislop. :banghead :banghead
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Crazy delisting a player like Polo. Another club will snap him up
Rating Deledio a 5 and wanting to keep Polo?
When are you checking into the asylum?
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These delistings or trades have really brought a smile to my face.
Never would i have imagined that all of Hislop, Tambling, Mcmuffin and Thomspson would all be gone at seasons end.
Hardwick is right on the money what a great job his doing with this list.
Hislop is a joke but that Thompson is something else. Honestly those recruiters must have been on ice or that Meow stuff for recruting him.
sheesh i would have thought the opposite. if they didnt go there would be hell to pay.
not saying all these blokes are duds or will go but they are to put it kindly players who i would definately be looking to upgrade in time ATM .
some may prove to be decent players but i have reasons why i have each in the gun. heres hoping some prove me very wrong.as i said atm.
graham, jackson, farmer, king edwards hicks mcguane nahas nason rance thursfield tuck white webberley. 8 of these i would not hesitate to trade or delist. especially if we can replicate last yrs draft.
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oh by the way meant to mention femantle in anticipation of people saying we have turned over enough and we dont need to do more.
in 3 yrs they have turned over 33 players with another 11 from the list proper alone this yr. this from a side who started with a better base than us and made finals in 06. yet i think they could still look to upgrade 5 of the remaining 11 from 08.
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Crazy delisting a player like Polo. Another club will snap him up
Will watch the draft very very very closely to hear his name be called....
To slow for AFL, average skills, poor decision making.... If he gets picked up I'll eat my shoe.
Horrible call.
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Crazy delisting a player like Polo. Another club will snap him up
Rating Deledio a 5 and wanting to keep Polo?
When are you checking into the asylum?
Hahahahaha :lol :rollin :lol
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Crazy delisting a player like Polo. Another club will snap him up
I actually heard from a reliable source that he's already been snapped up by Sony Pictures after a Hollywood talent scout stumbled upon a highlight reel of his on YouTube. They see him as a specialist stunt man for action films as one of those guys running away when a bomb is about to go off. Normally they have to slow the film down for dramatic effect, but with Dean's exceptional gift, no slow motion post production processing is required, cutting production time by 20% and saving 15% off the bottom line. Jerry Bruckheimer on set recently referred to Dean as "Mesmerising"
I was also told that he is earmarked to star in the upcoming Pedro Almodovar Art house Film "Watching Paint dry whilst the grass grows."
You heard it here first! ;)
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so true MT and one of the smartest posts i have read in a while.
Hislop to protect our youngsters. Stripes you cant be serious. Hislop is a dud of the highest order. An absolute waste of time that guy.
MT is 100% right there is no such thing as diluted draft. So many rookies now play seniors and these 2 selections is a major waste of time and could've been used to find a hidden gem. Guys like Maxwell and Davey were rookies werent they.
We have to stop treating this rookie as a joke by re signing duds e.g howatt and Hislop. :banghead :banghead
I understand your view daniel but I just think getting Miller to the club is more about developing and protecting our existing talent rather than what we have/will do with the rest of our picks which will be to uncover new talent. The club obviously rates Hislop and better prospect than any of the possible Rookies they would get with their pick 3 + in the Rookie Draft. I'll defer to their greater insight here.
Stripes
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so true MT and one of the smartest posts i have read in a while.
Hislop to protect our youngsters. Stripes you cant be serious. Hislop is a dud of the highest order. An absolute waste of time that guy.
MT is 100% right there is no such thing as diluted draft. So many rookies now play seniors and these 2 selections is a major waste of time and could've been used to find a hidden gem. Guys like Maxwell and Davey were rookies werent they.
We have to stop treating this rookie as a joke by re signing duds e.g howatt and Hislop. :banghead :banghead
I understand your view daniel but I just think getting Miller to the club is more about developing and protecting our existing talent rather than what we have/will do with the rest of our picks which will be to uncover new talent. The club obviously rates Hislop and better prospect than any of the possible Rookies they would get with their pick 3 + in the Rookie Draft. I'll defer to their greater insight here.
Stripes
a real lack of pace and terrible footskills sort of says you should not be deffering to anyone.
i have to ask what happened to the footskill mantra. hislop is 22 spent 4 yrs in the system managed just 20 odd games and failed to overcome chronic deficienies in those 4 yrs. one just has to question the reasoning behind rookieing him.
i really liked hislop as a junior but there comes a time when you have to say enough. we cannot hang onto players for inordinate amounts of time waiting for a miracle we have been there i hope we have learnt from being there.
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just on the difference as to why we would rookie miller and hislop.
miller is easy to understand but hislop sheesh.
simply put we have a 22 yr old to lead our forwards hes the only established tall forward we have. the entire side is lacking in experience yet alone our talls.all lack experience presence and size atm. some very sound reasons as to why you would go after an experienced tall forward weather that is miller as a rookie or bradshaw in the psd. (sorry couldnt help throwing in the bradshaw bit).
what does hislop offer as a mature rookie . we just got grigg we have jackson tuck martin. all big bodies and foley will come back and morton has entered the midfield. more big bodies and experience.
at 22 struggling to establish his own career with chronic deficiencies little experience what possible reason is there to keep him.
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I have to admit that i find the idea of putting Hislop on the rookie list perplexing.
What i also find perplexing is what is the source of this rumour? Is it offseason BS or has it come from the club?
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well that was very much needed, well done tiges
Just dissapointed we're wasting 2 rookie spots on Hislop and Miller.
Can you imagine if Tuck, White, Graham & King didn't save/extend their careers this season? it would have been 15 changes - 29 changes in 2 seasons yikes! :o
A bit of perspective for those who sometimes get ahead of themselves as to where this club is at
Good post. Istill think that people are judging the club's decision to take Miller and Hislop in the rookie draft is a bit harsh. I think if it was an uncompromised draft this criticism would be justified but given the diluted draft I think their inclusion is more than valid. While the talent pool in considered excellent this year in the early rounds, clubs are concerned about finding players in the later stages of the Nation Draft. By the time the PSD is finished the pickings will be incredibly slim come the Rookie Draft. Any players we would take in the 3rd and 4th rounds of the rookie draft would not even be speculative, they would be a waste if time and resources. At least with Hislop and Miller we can fill any holes for the short term until the draft is untampered with once again.
Godd delistings IMHO :thumbsup
Stripes
Sorry Stripes but I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one. I understand what you're saying as far the talent pool is thin at late rookie picks. No issue with that. However, that doesn't mean we then clog our rookie list with mature players who we know 100% are not going to last. That is a waste of time, money and resources. Every year there are teenagers who are overlooked by every single AFL club in one draft year only to picked up in a later draft having shown form in a state league which finally attracts interest from AFL clubs - Michael Barlow, Liam Anthony, Harry Taylor, Jason Porplyzia, Matthew Priddis, Ben McGlynn, Nick Maxwell, Aaron Davey, Matthew Boyd were all drafted in subsequent drafts from state leagues after being overlooked at 18 years of age. Any of those players could have been picked up with a late rookie pick at 18 or even the year before they eventually were. Then there are just the good finds late in the rookie draft - in 2007 we re-rookied Cam Howat at pick 47 in the rookie draft using the insurance and weak pool arguments; at pick 57 Geelong drafted Shane Mumford from their VFL side. In 2008 we passed on our last rookie pick (67) yet Greg Broughton was picked up by Freo at 74 from East Fremantle. Sure the chance of finding a player with a late rookie pick is slim but it isn't 0% and the rewards are great for recruiters who can spot late developers before anyone else does. Clubs that put their faith and resources into the drafts are more likely to succeed than clubs that recycle known players with no future.
I can completely see where you are coming from MT but I juest think that Miller and perhaps even Hislop are more to do with protecting and developig our current players rather than finding new players in a position where it is likely such late picks will be just as bigger a waste. For every success story that comes from the rookie list their are scores who don't. More money is wasted on these prospective players than two mature aged players that can definately fill a short term need at the club.
If we were using all our rookie picks on Mature Aged players I'd be upset but the last two picks in an extremely dilluted talent pool I can certainly live with. I wouldn't recommend it in a normal draft but in the next two, I think most clubs will be looking to develop what they have rather than grab a player who is extremely unlikely to come on.
In my opinion I think we are still bringing in at least 5 young players through the ND, traded for 2 young midfielders and are rerooking one young player leaving us to bring in only one mature aged rookie/development coach. Seems like we are trying to make the most of an unusual position.
Just my opinion of course MT
Stripes
Nothing wrong with differing opinions argued sensibly :thumbsup.
I should add I'm not saying the club is diverting from the young policy. It makes a refreshing change for us to back up 7 ND picks last year with another 5 this time around and if Houli is picked up in the PSD then all 5 will be used on drafting new cubs. That's the way the ND should be used. I just don't believe in the insurance argument even with the rookie list for the reasons I've already stated and especially on a 27 y.o. with no future. I don't have an issue with Miller being brought in as a development coach at Coburg. It's just that he should have been hired for just that purpose rather than wasting a rookie spot IMO. Two spots wasted if you count Hislop being rookied :P.
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I have to admit that i find the idea of putting Hislop on the rookie list perplexing.
What i also find perplexing is what is the source of this rumour? Is it offseason BS or has it come from the club?
I don't know 100% Hislop will be rookied but multiple sources (not just on the net) seem to give it some validity. I remember Greg Miller telling me Cam Howat would be re-rookied for a 3rd year. I posted it here and people had their doubts. Like now with Hislop, it was such a unbelievably poor move by the Club you couldn't blame anyone for not believing it before it was made official.