One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: dwaino on June 18, 2012, 06:39:13 PM
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Today on my lunch break I was reading through a few threads and noticed a bit of chat about rucks and moving blokes on at the end of the year. Towards the start of the season I remember there was a ruck discussion but I can't for the life of me find it. So here we go again.
So if everyone can be as sensible and realistic as they can be for a moment, in our list turn over at the end of the year, which, if any, ruck or rucks do people think will be moved on? Granted that besides the Mullet, our ruck stocks are some of the most lack luster in the comp. But only a handful of teams have solid and reliable 2nd/3rd ruck options.
Derrickx - I'm leaning towards this bloke. He appears to be last in the pecking order, is yet to play a senior game, at mature age and not producing any thing at all at VFL level. IMO was average at best in the NAB Cup too.
Browne - age on his side I guess. Every Coburg game I've seen (which is only the 2 on telly and half of one game in person, so granted I haven't seen a great deal) he is rucking mostly as first option but doesn't have much game outside that yet. Showed in last year's Dreamtime game that there might be something there. Kind of reminds me a bit of Sam Jacobs and I assume he's an asset to our ranga brigade. Given the time it takes these blokes to develop I assume we would hold on to him for security in case first ruck options fall down.
Graham - Probably at peak or near to peak development. IMO one of the better VFL ruckmen from the AFL affiliate sides. No world breaker but a reliable short term back up should anything happen to Maric. Could also hold trade value to any club desperate for a ready-to-go ruckman.
Vickery - I can't see him going any where for ages. Current form aside, is more versatile than other options and still has years to make the most of his upside. Required player.
Maric - .... ;D
In the past few years clubs have been scouting for ruckmen who have spent a few years on another club's rookie list. I guess it's easy to lure them by promising a senior list spot and some games, and they've already had a few years to develop. Do people/you guys think we should use a rookie spot to start on our next ruck project? This way we have another senior list spot for a ready made, big bodied 18 year old mid straight out of the draft who could be in the mix to play round 1.
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Get Paton
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Which which ever one of Browne/Gus who is out of contract first
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I'd keep vickery. Young, agile and can kick goals. We've all seen a glimpse of what he can produce so i'd expect more improvement in the years ahead.
Gus and the big pear Browne i'd move on maybe there's a team stupid enough to trade for them.
Derickx I haven't seen enough of to make a call either way.
What is obvious to me is that maybe hartley can find another gem from outside the club as a backup come seasons end.
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Derrickx is gone. Graham contracted and second best ruck at club, so he will stay or leave via trade (if any takers) and not sure about Browne. Might get another year.
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Derrickx is gone. Graham contracted and second best ruck at club, so he will stay or leave via trade (if any takers) and not sure about Browne. Might get another year.
Agree.
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Contracts aside, can we really risk moving on two? I wouldn't lose any sleep if we moved on Derrickx and Browne in one go, but then I would fear going through what happened to St. Kilda recently. But moving on those two we would still have Maric, Vickery, Gus, and I assume we would at least rookie someone in that case. Then again, the more I think about it, the more I like having rucks other than the first 3 on the senior list. More room for new mids ;D
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graham will seek a trade I would think, browne and derikz likely delistings ...so to answer the OP , all of them
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All of them. Draft a young ruck prospect and develop him for when Ivan is 33. :whistle
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One is definitely gawn, most likely Derickx. Could do with moving all 3 of Gus, Xman and Brown on as all 3 are not long term prospects, but cant leave yourself exposed, get rid of 1 per year and upgrade with better prospects
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Miller. Worst ruck on the list.
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graham
Miller
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:lol
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Derickx might be the one to go.
They may give Graham a one year deal as he can play up forward with limited capabilities while they groom Browne to do what I don't really know.
Miller is merely back up but until someone steps up and makes a ruck spot their own or Vickery takes the bit between his teeth and plays like a man then lamentably he may remain on the list for the purpose he was put on the list in the first place. Insurance.
Fortunantely keeping those that stay on the list won't cost us much leaves room in the salary cap to possibly land a ruckman through free agency or a trade.
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Both Derickx & Browne are coming out of contract at years end
Would think Derickx would most likely be the one who goes.
Browne at 21 is likely to given another year
Some are saying Gus is coming out of contract others say he has another year. If he is contracted then he will stay unless they try and trade him.
I suppose Free agency may also play a role in the decision in that who's available? If we seek another ruckman via FA then maybe soemone like Gus will say "I want to be traded"
I know people are saying this years drafts a ripper but does anyone know how it's looking regarding young ruckmen
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Browne is v v young.
Why delist him?
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I suppose Free agency may also play a role in the decision in that who's available? If we seek another ruckman via FA then maybe soemone like Gus will say "I want to be traded"
I know people are saying this years drafts a ripper but does anyone know how it's looking regarding young ruckmen
Not sure on the coming draft at all since I don't follow TAC or anything much during the year. But everyone is saying it's a good draft without saying much else, I guess the rest of us are just going by that.
And then moving onto Gus, I'm not sure what sort of trade we could expect. I imagine (just guessing) after the past couple compromised drafts that clubs will holding on to their early draft picks, and off the top of my head I'm not sure who could use him straight up to validate a 2nd or 3rd round pick. Possibly GWS or Collingwood? What if Warnock goes on the market too? Both would be really devalued.
I imagine the club is backing most of who we have in for now. There were a few half decent prospects even available for rookie selection this year and we overlooked him. I'll trust their judgement but I would preferred to rookie someone like Bolger instead of Verrier.
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Not sure why you would delist a 21 y/o 203cm 105kg ruckman who has shown he can play at AFL level (dreamtime game) and who has dominated on occasions at VFL level. Plenty more development in him.
Derickx should be delisted. Not showing enough for a 24 y/o.
Graham I would trade if we can, otherwise keep.
If we trade Graham we pick up a junior ruck in the draft.
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Derrickx is gone. Graham contracted and second best ruck at club, so he will stay or leave via trade (if any takers) and not sure about Browne. Might get another year.
Derickx will be gone. Graham will likely be traded (because on VFL form he probably deserves to be a no.1 ruck. Look at Collingwood if Jolly goes down/retires Wood becomes a no.1 ruck. Then we draft a junior.
Maric 26
Browne 22
Draftee 18
If worse comes to worse play Vickery with Elton as back-up.
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vickery - wont make it as a #1 ruckman may be a slight chance as a back up ruckman. imo hes a forward or bust. wont go into reasons why as it will just become an anger fest for some.
derivckx - would love to see the club continue down this path in taking more mature players from state leagues weather they work out or not. if any one had seen him at claremont they would not help but be impressed.
thing is its now 2 yrs on hes turning 25 and he doesnt do anywhere near enough to earn a game. takes the odd contested mark looks good at times but doesnt deliver. id say hes gone we cant hang onto these types for too long.imo has not done enough in two yrs to warrant keeping. he did have a fair bit of injury last yr though.
browne - main concern well dinosaur says it in a word.to make it he needs to be a clearance king when the ball hits the ground a bit like ben hudson. is still young and may be kept would look at putting him back on the rookie list and freeing up a space. he really has stagnated though and the key to keeping them is they show enough improvement to warrant it.
graham - dont see the point of keeping him if we are not going to play him. needs to go and we need to find a more rounded replacement.
maric - well hes had a big yr to date. hes 26 and we need to find genuine swing man to help him. we also need to find a quality long term replacement for him now.cant say we have him on our list can anyone say it.
me i think we need to invest a reasonable pick on a talented young ruckman. a bit like we were going to take scott lycett at pick 30 but the eagles jumped in at 29 a couple of seasons ago. geez a lycett type would have 2 yrs under his belt now and would be looking at a good chunk of games next yr.
i also would be looking for another mature age ruckman who can cover for maric without us losing too much. in the past graham has been uncompetetive and we have been smashed. go down the derickx and state league path again if need be. bring em in try em. if any good keep em if no good go again dont hang on too long though.
i think in time griffiths and elton if they make it and god knows maybe even vickery can do the second ruck duties.
so for me id like to see
# 1 - maric.
back up - mature player from state league or retread from other club that cost nothing more than a late nd or psd pick. some would say keep graham for this.
pick 30-40 - quality long term prospect. this is ivans likely replacement in 3 or 4 yrs time.
browne - probably not possible but re rookie him or keep him for another yr. will be 23 next yr has to start earning some afl games. in a lot of ways if ivan gets hurt he should be the one who comes in.
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Watched the Port /Coburg game on Saturday. Brown was so so and Derryxkxcx was OK in defense, his delivery and kicking was excellent although he did drop one bad one, but who hasn't. I think he looks pretty good, But when will he get a chance? At 25 he is just coming into ruckman maturity, so to drop him at the level after we have carried him for 2 years would seem a waste?? He also seems pretty mobile.
How much has he played in the ruck at Coburg??
Big Gus looked so so and made a few clangers.
Watching the mullet I think it is all about second efforts and willingness to do the right thing. Are Gus Brown and Deryxk up to it? I think it is up to them to watch Ivan and see what a really good ruckman has to do, learn from that and apply it at VFL level to push for selection.
In any event whatever we say means nothing but I am sure Dimma and his brains trust have options a plenty.
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Been told twice they are now molding Derickx into a monster back that can swing fwd and/or ruck relieve
might get the extra year with moore, mcguane & post all finishing up (post will be traded)
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Browne has age on his side but doubts over his ability. Graham could be trade bait and Derrickx at risk of being dumped
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Been told twice they are now molding Derickx into a monster back that can swing fwd and/or ruck relieve
might get the extra year with moore, mcguane & post all finishing up (post will be traded)
Have heard that twice. Thought about it twice and it makes sense. Twice
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Browne has a big ticker. Big body. Getting vfl bogs.
I dont understand the hurry moving on derickx. Delisting derickx and drafting the best wafl ruckman seems to be not making progress. Still young for ruck
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Derickx's long term injury really set him back.
Quite often after a year out of football, it takes a year to get back to where you were. In his case that was a state league player going through a rapid development phase.
he needs to show something in last half of the year or he is gone, and the odds are against him.
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Been told twice they are now molding Derickx into a monster back that can swing fwd and/or ruck relieve
might get the extra year with moore, mcguane & post all finishing up (post will be traded)
Have heard that twice. Thought about it twice and it makes sense. Twice
Pull your head in FFS ::)
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Browne has a big ticker. Big body. Getting vfl bogs.
I dont understand the hurry moving on derickx. Delisting derickx and drafting the best wafl ruckman seems to be not making progress. Still young for ruck
He is the same age as Gus. Which is still young for a ruck.
:outtahere
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Late to the game so should have more development.
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vickery - wont make it as a #1 ruckman may be a slight chance as a back up ruckman. imo hes a forward or bust. wont go into reasons why as it will just become an anger fest for some.
................................................................(cut for quoting brevity)
so for me id like to see
# 1 - maric.
back up - mature player from state league or retread from other club that cost nothing more than a late nd or psd pick. some would say keep graham for this.
pick 30-40 - quality long term prospect. this is ivans likely replacement in 3 or 4 yrs time.
browne - probably not possible but re rookie him or keep him for another yr. will be 23 next yr has to start earning some afl games. in a lot of ways if ivan gets hurt he should be the one who comes in.
Good summation and post Claw, I agree with your take on all this.
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Been told twice they are now molding Derickx into a monster back that can swing fwd and/or ruck relieve
might get the extra year with moore, mcguane & post all finishing up (post will be traded)
Have heard that twice. Thought about it twice and it makes sense. Twice
Pull your head in FFS ::)
Don't be a chair sniffer :clapping
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This thread is a good read, particularly when read twice.
The problem with Gus and the Pear is that they offer very little when forward. Would be nice to see them start kicking some goals in the VFL. Personally, i dont see much of a future for either of them and I think we need to keep adding talented rucks to the list.
I still have faith that Vicks will come through with the goods. :pray
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Gus has 10 for the season and has played mostly ruck. Has the stats that would see him drafted with ease if he was not already on an AFL list.
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From what I've heard/read so far Gus sounds like he is working on his forward role.
This is great news and if he can improve his attitude in reuck duals and look at the ball and secondly not drop his head then I'm all for him replacing vickery whilst vickery finds form.
Atm its swapping like for like so work on those areas gus and let's see you take on ff or fp and rotate with maric. We need to be proactive in resting maric.
Viva los Gus!!!