One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: one-eyed on August 25, 2012, 04:19:15 AM
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VIDEO: Hardwick and Nahas in the post-match media conference ...
http://bigpondvideo.com/RichmondTV/483183/Hardwick,%20Nahas%20Press%20Conference/
Year gets an F
By Luke Holmesby
11:46 PM Fri 24 Aug, 2012
RICHMOND coach Damien Hardwick may be closing out the most successful season of his time at the Tigers, but 2012 has still been a failure in his eyes.
Friday night's win over Essendon was Richmond's 10th victory of the season and they will be hot favourites to secure an 11th win in next week's season finale against Port Adelaide.
Hardwick, who had not coached more than eight wins in either of his first two seasons at the Tigers said the club could not have a sense of achievement until it made the finals.
"Every season's a fail when you don't make finals, that's the reality of it and that is what we and the media certainly gauge by the importance of the season," Hardwick said.
"We certainly felt we had the capabilities of playing at the level, we just dropped some games we should have won. We've got no one else to blame but ourselves."
The Tigers defeated by Essendon by 45 points on Friday in a game that is unlikely to be remembered for its aesthetic appeal.
The Tigers kicked 13 goals from 37 scoring shots, which Hardwick said was an issue that needed addressing.
"Our ability to finish our work probably wasn't one of the prettiest things. It probably wasn't our best work on the night, we kicked 20-odd points and the wind was relatively swirly out there as we know," he said.
"The thing that was a little bit disappointing was our composure to get the ball inside 50 to a marking target. We've just got to improve in that area."
But Hardwick did say his team's solid finish to 2012 was encouraging and would serve as a launching pad for the 2013 campaign.
"We spoke after the Carlton game (round 18) about wanting to go 5-0, I think we have been 3-1 since that game. We dropped the Fremantle game but they're a good side and we didn't play overly well," he said.
"We're looking to finish off the season well. We're 10-11 now and if we finish off 11-11 it's certainly a stepping stone in the right direction."
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/145626/default.aspx
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Wow...seems like no excuses to me.....funny how the club and the players can see it.... :whistle
"Hardwick, who had not coached more than eight wins in either of his first two seasons at the Tigers said the club could not have a sense of achievement until it made the finals."Every season's a fail when you don't make finals, that's the reality of it and that is what we and the media certainly gauge by the importance of the season," Hardwick said.
"We certainly felt we had the capabilities of playing at the level, we just dropped some games we should have won. We've got no one else to blame but ourselves."
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Sack the lot of them.
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Wow...seems like no excuses to me.....funny how the club and the players can see it.... :whistle
"Hardwick, who had not coached more than eight wins in either of his first two seasons at the Tigers said the club could not have a sense of achievement until it made the finals."Every season's a fail when you don't make finals, that's the reality of it and that is what we and the media certainly gauge by the importance of the season," Hardwick said.
"We certainly felt we had the capabilities of playing at the level, we just dropped some games we should have won. We've got no one else to blame but ourselves."
Cmon guys please get around and give WAT a round of applause, not to sure what for but he seems proud of himself for soemthing.
FFS 30 years of not give WAT the credit he deserves :banghead
No excuses give it up to him.
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wait for it......
wait for it........
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Hardwick has improved Richmond FC in every season he has been coach. Its great that he considers this to be no good. At least we have a coach who is driven to succeed. :clapping
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I would say Dimma's judgement of a "F" for the year is based on the quality of football (or rather lack of it at stages) we are playing. There's still way to big a gap between our best and worst football and our worst is deplorable with all the dumb basic schoolboy errors. I would argue the football we played in the first half of the season against the better sides even in losses was superior to what we've dished up in the second half fof the year even when we've won easily. As we lost players to injury and our lack of depth exposed, the standard of our play has fallen away as well. There's a reason why we are not playing finals this year and that's because we and our thin list ain't good enough to sustain the level required over 22/23 rounds. Dimma must have been doing his head in last night with all the Benny Hill mistakes out there even though we were always going to win.
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I'm content to finish 11-11 and positive percentage. Definite improvement in my eyes.
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I would say Dimma's judgement of a "F" for the year is based on the quality of football (or rather lack of it at stages) we are playing. There's still way to big a gap between our best and worst football and our worst is deplorable with all the dumb basic schoolboy errors. I would argue the football we played in the first half of the season against the better sides even in losses was superior to what we've dished up in the second half fof the year even when we've won easily. As we lost players to injury and our lack of depth exposed, the standard of our play has fallen away as well. There's a reason why we are not playing finals this year and that's because we and our thin list ain't good enough to sustain the level required over 22/23 rounds. Dimma must have been doing his head in last night with all the Benny Hill mistakes out there even though we were always going to win.
Agree with that in stages of games we switch off and stupid basic footy smarts let us down classic example the Freo game at the MCG and suns game and last week to etc.We got to eradicate this all else we cant go forward as a group.I think it comes with maturity and experience to tho guys.He was pulling his head out last night in the box Dimma at times.
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gotta be happy with a coach who labels the year an F yet still finish with 11 years.
if it was leather face or spud they would be calling it a massive successful year
good on him as i agree the year is barely a pass mark.
waited 30 can wait another. Finals next year :thumbsup
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AFRICATiger's ability to constantly draw attention to himself and then play the victim is quite outstanding! :thumbsup
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gotta be happy with a coach who labels the year an F yet still finish with 11 years.
if it was leather face or spud they would be calling it a massive successful year
good on him as i agree the year is barely a pass mark.
waited 30 can wait another. Finals next year :thumbsup
11 years? C'mon daniel, we're allowed to be critical but a bit harsh to suggest he do some time ;D
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Wow...seems like no excuses to me.....funny how the club and the players can see it.... :whistle
"Hardwick, who had not coached more than eight wins in either of his first two seasons at the Tigers said the club could not have a sense of achievement until it made the finals."Every season's a fail when you don't make finals, that's the reality of it and that is what we and the media certainly gauge by the importance of the season," Hardwick said.
"We certainly felt we had the capabilities of playing at the level, we just dropped some games we should have won. We've got no one else to blame but ourselves."
Well done OE, you removed the name of the person this post was aimed at so it looks like I was trying to make myself look good...
OE: I removed the insults (calling the poster "idiot" twice)
But you didn't remove that persons post form another thread when they abused me...pathetic.
OE: The posts involving the reply "no excuses" to your post in the other thread were removed also as it just resorted into a non-topic slanging match
Double standards on this forum for the chosen ones, always has been.....stuffing joke!!!
Gee let me guess the response from the slimy dogs that usually circle......"leave if you don't like it"
I post less and less on this forum becasue of what its become....no wonder!!
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WAT why do you tear up? WGAF if others edit your posts stuff em
Truth is Dimma nailed what you and a few others have said and some don't like it
Have we improved? Yes wins/losses suggest so but overall we have failed as a footy club
Achievement is measured in September not February
Finals 2013..
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Could I just ask if there are NO EXCUSES and we failed this year, then where to from here.
Is the term no excuses empty words or how is the premise fulfilled?
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WAT why do you tear up? WGAF if others edit your posts stuff em
Truth is Dimma nailed what you and a few others have said and some don't like it
Have we improved? Yes wins/losses suggest so but overall we have failed as a footy club
Achievement is measured in September not February
Finals 2013..
If we win next week, and with us it is always an 'if', then we are 11 wins and 11 losses. In academic terms that is a pass, a 'd' in fact. So therefore it is not a fail imo.
Also improvement can be measured more than in terms of win/loss and finals action. last night showed that we have better depth than the bummers, therefore we improed in that area also, imo.
Finals a must next year though i think.
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WAT why do you tear up? WGAF if others edit your posts stuff em
Truth is Dimma nailed what you and a few others have said and some don't like it
Have we improved? Yes wins/losses suggest so but overall we have failed as a footy club
Achievement is measured in September not February
Finals 2013..
If we win next week, and with us it is always an 'if', then we are 11 wins and 11 losses. In academic terms that is a pass, a 'd' in fact. So therefore it is not a fail imo.
Also improvement can be measured more than in terms of win/loss and finals action. last night showed that we have better depth than the bummers, therefore we improed in that area also, imo.
Finals a must next year though i think.
thats your opinion and you are more than entitled to it.
Bombers will finish the year equal to or a little better than last year so you think they have improved. I dont
so let me ask you this if next year we finish on 12 wins you still happy as we have improved on 11 wins?
for mine the season is barely a pass. It wouldve been a pass if we didnt get mentally crumble and get embarrassed against GC. That shows mentally we are still not strong enough.
I hope that changes and we make finals as 4 years in a job you would expect to be in the 8
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WAT why do you tear up? WGAF if others edit your posts stuff em
Truth is Dimma nailed what you and a few others have said and some don't like it
Have we improved? Yes wins/losses suggest so but overall we have failed as a footy club
Achievement is measured in September not February
Finals 2013..
If we win next week, and with us it is always an 'if', then we are 11 wins and 11 losses. In academic terms that is a pass, a 'd' in fact. So therefore it is not a fail imo.
Also improvement can be measured more than in terms of win/loss and finals action. last night showed that we have better depth than the bummers, therefore we improed in that area also, imo.
Finals a must next year though i think.
thats your opinion and you are more than entitled to it.
Bombers will finish the year equal to or a little better than last year so you think they have improved. I dont
so let me ask you this if next year we finish on 12 wins you still happy as we have improved on 11 wins?
for mine the season is barely a pass. It wouldve been a pass if we didnt get mentally crumble and get embarrassed against GC. That shows mentally we are still not strong enough.
I hope that changes and we make finals as 4 years in a job you would expect to be in the 8
Fair point on GC game.
on the other points... 12 wins, well that could mean finals but under Dimma we have gone from 6 wins to 8 and half to perhaps 11 wins. Thats a 27 % win percentage in the first year, a 38. 6 win percentage to a 50 % win percentage in each season. Thats good progress.
Essendon finishing equal to or better than year? Unless they win next week then they won't be either equal to better than than year.
Also i believe this year is more difficult to others when comparing improvement, especially in terms of wins and losses and making finals or not. Some teams such as North have played GWS and Suns twice.
This year has not been a failure for the club.
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Daniel, it is horse poo to pick out a game here and there to sum up a year.
If you do that, then Hawks failed by losing to the Tigers by 10 goals.
The notion of us playing finals is a fair summary of success but to be honest finishing 8th or 11th doesn't change the weaknesses in our list, in some ways it would allow us as supporters to paper over the cracks.
Look at Bombers and their supporters as one example.
Fact is, we are where most if us expected to be, a solid year of improvement but glaring holes that still need repairing.
We get a top 10 pick in the draft, 2 2nd rounders a free agency pick and a pre season gem to continue building.
It ain't all bad.
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Mate if I was asked in feb would I be happy with this I wouldn't said yes but we blew it this year because we don't have the mental capacity to finish sides off
GC game, dads army game, nought, GWS u name it there were plenty
Am I happy with the coach? Yes. Comments he made few days ago re: our year IMO further illustrates the great decision it was to select him
The facts are he and the club measures achievement on finals as I do
We move forward to 2013 as I said years another year really
Just hope we finally nail those cheats Rd 1
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If we had made the Finals this year we would have gone out backwards in a big way after the first week. We need to be threatening the top four to ensure at least 2 games in the Finals and hopefully at least one win. We know how far we are behind (not much), what we need to improve (Key: back and forward and Ruck support) and a tweak to the game-plan when sides go one-on-one. At 11-11 I would say a 'D' given where we have come from.
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All the scribes giving us an F were sucked in by where we were at the half way point of the season and got carried away in the emotion of it all, jumping on the Tiggy bandwagon. When we had (the inevitable) unexpected losses they took it badly and now can only see our season as a failure. If any of them were marking our season as 11-11 with 110% and most losses under 20 points at the start of the season then they would have given us C's or D's.
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Mate if I was asked in feb would I be happy with this I wouldn't said yes but we blew it this year because we don't have the mental capacity to finish sides off
GC game, dads army game, nought, GWS u name it there were plenty
Am I happy with the coach? Yes. Comments he made few days ago re: our year IMO further illustrates the great decision it was to select him
The facts are he and the club measures achievement on finals as I do
We move forward to 2013 as I said years another year really
Just hope we finally nail those cheats Rd 1
Mate, I won't be truly happy until we win a flag but Ill always enjoy the ride and the check points that show we are heading in the right direction.
Carlton round 1 followed by finals are the checkpoints in 2013 :thumbsup
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it's all just dependent on what your opinion of pass/fail mark was...
if Dimma & the club have decided that we needed to play finals for a pass mark then it's obviously an F...
sure we've shown improvement & look like we are on the right track but that doesn't necessarily equate to a pass...we lost too many games that we should have won (not just games we were in, but games we held winning positions in) & this needs to be rectified....
future looks good but don't get caught up on semantics re pass/fail - lets just make sure this offseason (which is the biggest I can remember re drafting & trading) is done right
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Despite what has come out of the club,my own opinion is that the club packed up its bucket and spade and went home when it mothballed foley,vicks,and grimes and decided to dig up punt road mid season
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Despite what has come out of the club,my own opinion is that the club packed up its bucket and spade and went home when it mothballed foley,vicks,and grimes and decided to dig up punt road mid season
And?????
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Despite what has come out of the club,my own opinion is that the club packed up its bucket and spade and went home when it mothballed foley,vicks,and grimes and decided to dig up punt road mid season
why is timing the punt rd oval revelopment to be ready for next pre-season packing up your bucket and spade and going home?
...or mothballing players with injuries that prevent them from actually playing for that matter?
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Al to be honest I really cant answer your question with any inside knowledge,just a gut feel i have..i guess its more to do with the relative closeness of those announcements.Vicks was playing injured from the beginning and initially they were prepared to let him play the season out ,and suddenly half way through they sent him off for surgery
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I had a similar gut feel last sunday, but that was probably due to the bad influence I was drinking with watching the freo game on Saturday ;D
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Al to be honest I really cant answer your question with any inside knowledge,just a gut feel i have..i guess its more to do with the relative closeness of those announcements.Vicks was playing injured from the beginning and initially they were prepared to let him play the season out ,and suddenly half way through they sent him off for surgery
Hmmm don't you think that had something to do with his form? Dimma said on SEN yesterday that he came into the season with sore shoulders but they were hoping to get him through the season, in the last couple of games he play he couldn't even get his arms above his head! Somit was decided to get him fixed up so he was right for the pre season. I think the mistake they made was playing him for as long as they did, and not sending him for surgery sooner.
As for the other two, I'm not sure exactly how they were mothballed? Grimes hammy, had to go OS for surgery, Foley achelies season ending period!
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All the scribes giving us an F were sucked in by where we were at the half way point of the season and got carried away in the emotion of it all, jumping on the Tiggy bandwagon. When we had (the inevitable) unexpected losses they took it badly and now can only see our season as a failure. If any of them were marking our season as 11-11 with 110% and most losses under 20 points at the start of the season then they would have given us C's or D's.
There was nothing inevitable about that loss to Gold Coast, or the loss to Carlton and North Melbourne. Or any of the other close losses. We had similar performances the year before. Poor coaching cost us all of those games. Our form when we beat Hawthorn and Sydney was much more reflective of our list than these losses when Hardwick coaches competitively. People who judge our list hard forget that every other club faces the same list management issues that we do. The mark of a great coach is the performances he can achieve with the list he has, not the list he wishes he had.
The year was a fail. Our playing list is capable of making the finals. We didn't make it. It doesn't get more simple than that. Our win ratio the last couple of years has gone up. But lets not forget the freeby with the introduction of GWS in the comp and the shocking form of Port, Essendon, WBulldogs, Brisbane etc. You can improve win/loss when the bottom teams are that bad and still not amount to anything.
The only comfort is our list is as good as Carlton's and they were expecting top 4 and didn't make it. Ratten is a coach that has failed on a massive level. If we don't make the finals next year, Hardwick's head will roll. Personally I would rather we grabbed Malthouse before someone else does and make a certainty of it and avoid the inevitable excuses for failure that have come from another year in the wildnerness.
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It seems to me too many people on here are of the belief that no matter what Dimma has done with this list he has failed and merely because Malthouse is available Dimma will be scrutinized even more harshly. Hence the vindictiveness towards him. Yet people so easily forget that 3 years ago we were a basket case in terms of a list and 7 games into 2010 we were compared to Fitzroy in 1996 and didn't win a game until round 10.
Yet some 3 years ago wanted Jade the Blade as opposed to Dimma.
Yep its two finals series in 30 years but the sustainability in the list that is developing is far more superior to the tokenism anyone of the previous 4 coaches achieved at the club in the last 16 years.
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It seems to me too many people on here are of the belief that no matter what Dimma has done with this list he has failed and merely because Malthouse is available Dimma will be scrutinized even more harshly. Hence the vindictiveness towards him. Yet people so easily forget that 3 years ago we were a basket case in terms of a list and 7 games into 2010 we were compared to Fitzroy in 1996 and didn't win a game until round 10.
Yet some 3 years ago wanted Jade the Blade as opposed to Dimma.
Yep its two finals series in 30 years but the sustainability in the list that is developing is far more superior to the tokenism anyone of the previous 4 coaches achieved at the club in the last 16 years.
3 years running he has improved our win loss record, we have never gone backwards under Hardwicks leadership and people wanna boot him. Its unbelievable IMHO.
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cmon people get on the messiah bandwagon.
only the great one can lead his people to the promised land
all hail mick :bow :bow :bow :bow :bow :bow :bow
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All the scribes giving us an F were sucked in by where we were at the half way point of the season and got carried away in the emotion of it all, jumping on the Tiggy bandwagon. When we had (the inevitable) unexpected losses they took it badly and now can only see our season as a failure. If any of them were marking our season as 11-11 with 110% and most losses under 20 points at the start of the season then they would have given us C's or D's.
There was nothing inevitable about that loss to Gold Coast, or the loss to Carlton and North Melbourne. Or any of the other close losses. We had similar performances the year before. Poor coaching cost us all of those games. Our form when we beat Hawthorn and Sydney was much more reflective of our list than these losses when Hardwick coaches competitively. People who judge our list hard forget that every other club faces the same list management issues that we do. The mark of a great coach is the performances he can achieve with the list he has, not the list he wishes he had.
The year was a fail. Our playing list is capable of making the finals. We didn't make it. It doesn't get more simple than that. Our win ratio the last couple of years has gone up. But lets not forget the freeby with the introduction of GWS in the comp and the shocking form of Port, Essendon, WBulldogs, Brisbane etc. You can improve win/loss when the bottom teams are that bad and still not amount to anything.
The only comfort is our list is as good as Carlton's and they were expecting top 4 and didn't make it. Ratten is a coach that has failed on a massive level. If we don't make the finals next year, Hardwick's head will roll. Personally I would rather we grabbed Malthouse before someone else does and make a certainty of it and avoid the inevitable excuses for failure that have come from another year in the wildnerness.
something about Malthouse and Carlton that just works. stuff em both
Maybe we wouldn't have lost to GC if Mick was in charge but can you guarantee we would be playing finals. :nope :nope
we asked for a massive cut, we got it, we asked for less thrashings we got it. now all we want is finals
I barely see the year as a pass as i think we blew it, but i think we will get there in 2013 if we keep at it and make one more cut of about 8.
Hardwick is 100% correct. Season is a F. Achievement is measured in September.
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I had a similar gut feel last sunday, but that was probably due to the bad influence I was drinking with watching the freo game on Saturday ;D
Hey hey hey, I resemble that! Actually, I was not at my optimum myself but fortunately I didn't have to front for a game the next day. :cheers
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All the scribes giving us an F were sucked in by where we were at the half way point of the season and got carried away in the emotion of it all, jumping on the Tiggy bandwagon. When we had (the inevitable) unexpected losses they took it badly and now can only see our season as a failure. If any of them were marking our season as 11-11 with 110% and most losses under 20 points at the start of the season then they would have given us C's or D's.
There was nothing inevitable about that loss to Gold Coast, or the loss to Carlton and North Melbourne. Or any of the other close losses.
What's it like living up there in Cloudland? As sure as God (if you believe in Him) made little green apples, we were at the VERY stage in our rebirth and development where we were going to win the unwinnable and lose the unloseable. Anything else meant we weren't really a young side improving who showed the signs of it's immaturity and lack of strength, it would have indicated deeper more problematic issues.
We had similar performances the year before.
Really? I would say we didn't get within a bull's roar of last year's performances, in performance, competitiveness, closeness or number of wins.
Poor coaching cost us all of those games. Our form when we beat Hawthorn and Sydney was much more reflective of our list than these losses when Hardwick coaches competitively. People who judge our list hard forget that every other club faces the same list management issues that we do. The mark of a great coach is the performances he can achieve with the list he has, not the list he wishes he had.
What a load of toss. Poor coaching was a contributer to our results this year but no more than age, experience, ability, depth, attitude, fitness and the multitude of other factors that combine to produce results in a football game. Some very average coaches have been fortunate to coach teams to premierships and some great coaches have never tasted that same success. Some of the greatest ever modern day coaches (Sheedy, Malthouse and Thompson for example) suffered serious lapses and lived under the real threat of the axe early in their coaching careers before proving their worth. Hardwick has not come close to the poor results of their early teams/years.
The year was a fail. Our playing list is capable of making the finals. We didn't make it. It doesn't get more simple than that. Our win ratio the last couple of years has gone up. But lets not forget the freeby with the introduction of GWS in the comp and the shocking form of Port, Essendon, WBulldogs, Brisbane etc. You can improve win/loss when the bottom teams are that bad and still not amount to anything.
Our list was not capable of making the finals otherwise we would have. It doesn't get more simple than that. Our win ratio for the last couple of years has gone up but not by enough yet, so all the football department - coaches, players and ancillary staff - have more work to do. I would have thought that was very obvious. The bottom teams are bottom for one reason and one reason only - they are not as good as those above them - so to use them as an excuse for your own perceived lack of improvement is a distracting folly. You win a premiership by beating more teams than the other clubs. It doesn't get more simple than that.
The only comfort is our list is as good as Carlton's and they were expecting top 4 and didn't make it. Ratten is a coach that has failed on a massive level. If we don't make the finals next year, Hardwick's head will roll. Personally I would rather we grabbed Malthouse before someone else does and make a certainty of it and avoid the inevitable excuses for failure that have come from another year in the wildnerness.
Realists to the left, messiah believers to the right.
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I had a similar gut feel last sunday, but that was probably due to the bad influence I was drinking with watching the freo game on Saturday ;D
Hey hey hey, I resemble that! Actually, I was not at my optimum myself but fortunately I didn't have to front for a game the next day. :cheers
Al still having a kick? Or is the fat prick coaching :cheers I always pictured Alastair as a retired, dirty, fat drunk. Obviously just hasn't retired yet ;D
I miss you old fella. come down for Christmas this year
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still getting the occasional kick in the lemonade and sars ;D
not retired, and not too fat, so your half right
perhaps you should come to townsville in Oct and see me embarrass myself in the masters' nationals
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All the scribes giving us an F were sucked in by where we were at the half way point of the season and got carried away in the emotion of it all, jumping on the Tiggy bandwagon. When we had (the inevitable) unexpected losses they took it badly and now can only see our season as a failure. If any of them were marking our season as 11-11 with 110% and most losses under 20 points at the start of the season then they would have given us C's or D's.
There was nothing inevitable about that loss to Gold Coast, or the loss to Carlton and North Melbourne. Or any of the other close losses. We had similar performances the year before. Poor coaching cost us all of those games. Our form when we beat Hawthorn and Sydney was much more reflective of our list than these losses when Hardwick coaches competitively. People who judge our list hard forget that every other club faces the same list management issues that we do. The mark of a great coach is the performances he can achieve with the list he has, not the list he wishes he had.
The year was a fail. Our playing list is capable of making the finals. We didn't make it. It doesn't get more simple than that. Our win ratio the last couple of years has gone up. But lets not forget the freeby with the introduction of GWS in the comp and the shocking form of Port, Essendon, WBulldogs, Brisbane etc. You can improve win/loss when the bottom teams are that bad and still not amount to anything.
The only comfort is our list is as good as Carlton's and they were expecting top 4 and didn't make it. Ratten is a coach that has failed on a massive level. If we don't make the finals next year, Hardwick's head will roll. Personally I would rather we grabbed Malthouse before someone else does and make a certainty of it and avoid the inevitable excuses for failure that have come from another year in the wildnerness.
something about Malthouse and Carlton that just works. stuff em both
Maybe we wouldn't have lost to GC if Mick was in charge but can you guarantee we would be playing finals. :nope :nope
we asked for a massive cut, we got it, we asked for less thrashings we got it. now all we want is finals
I barely see the year as a pass as i think we blew it, but i think we will get there in 2013 if we keep at it and make one more cut of about 8.
Hardwick is 100% correct. Season is a F. Achievement is measured in September.
I actually want a flag. We're not ready to win one yet. We need to go back to the draft and get 2 or 3 decent kids this year and again next year. We need Hartley to do well in trading again and in 2014/2015 we will be in it up to our eyeballs.
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we also need depth .....so we have to balance getting the best youth with some quality more experienced players