One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: Stripes on October 29, 2012, 10:50:48 AM
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Now that the trade period is over what do you feel is our best 22? Our first draft pick may get a game this year but we seem to be moving away from gifting younger players spots for experience alone.
What's your team and why?
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Bit early seems we haven't had the draft. But here goes:
B: Steven Morris, Troy Chaplin, Dylan Grimes
HB: Bachar Houli, Alex Rance, Jake Batchelor
C: Brett Deledio, Shane Tuck, Shaun Grigg
HF: Shane Edwards, Tyrone Vickery, Chris Newman
F: Jake King, Jack Riewoldt, Dustin Martin
R: Ivan Maric, Trent Cotchin, Nathan Foley
INT: Matthew Dea, Reece Conca, Brandon Ellis
SUB: Robin Nahas
Left Overs: Ben Griffiths, Chris Knights, Aaron Edwards, Brad Helbig, Todd Elton, David Astbury, Daniel Jackson, Jayden Post.
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Mine would be slightly different -
B: Steven Morris, Troy Chaplin, Dylan Grimes
HB: Bachar Houli, Alex Rance, Chris Newman
C: Brett Deledio, Shane Tuck, Shaun Grigg
HF: Shane Edwards, Ben Griffiths , Jake King
F: Tyrone Vickery, Jack Riewoldt, , Aaron Edwards
R: Ivan Maric, Trent Cotchin, Nathan Foley
INT: Dustin Martin, Chris Knights , Brandon Ellis, sub: Reece Conca
Left Overs: Robin Nahas, Jake Batchelor, Brad Helbig, Todd Elton, David Astbury, Daniel Jackson, Jayden Post, Matthew Dea
IMHO - that is a very strong team ! :thumbsup
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I think you'll find a number of varying sides in this thread. Was very hard to leave some guys out and where to place others. Then that's excluding any of our draftees doing well and I haven't got Knights or A.Edwards in my team who fair chance that they play round 1 at least.
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I think you'll find a number of varying sides in this thread. Was very hard to leave some guys out and where to place others. Then that's excluding any of our draftees doing well and I haven't got Knights or A.Edwards in my team who fair chance that they play round 1 at least.
I'm sure your right tigs. There is plenty of options there. I would be happy if you team lined up too which I think is a clear indicators that we have an increasing level of options/competition for spots now.
I noticed you had Newman in your forwardline - was that because you couldn't find room for him in your backline? You didn't have A. Edwards or Knights in the team - is that because you feel they need to earn their spots or aren't as good as other options we already have?
I decided to go tall in the forwardline with Griffiths, Jack and Vickery but I easily see Griffiths making way for a small forward such as Nahas if match ups required.
King is an interesting decision - he is one of the first picked each week based on structure and defensive pressure but does not have the ability of some of our better players. I wonder if he will be forced out of the team later in the year by another small forward such as Edwards, Knights, or a draftee? They would need to lift their defensive game if this was to happen imo.
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Can't see any of this year's draft picks in the starting 22 to begin the season.
Can anyone honestly see Whacko Jacko in the line-up? I'd love to hear your argument.
B: Steven Morris, Troy Chaplin, Dylan Grimes
HB: Jake Batchelor, Alex Rance, Chris Newman
C: Brett Deledio, Shane Tuck, Shaun Grigg
HF: Dustin Martin, Ben Griffiths, Chris Knights
F: Ty Vickery, Jack Riewoldt, Jake King
R: Ivan Maric, Trent Cotchin (c), Nathan Foley
INT: Bachar Houli, Reece Conca, Shane Edwards, Robbie Nahas
EMG/DEPTH:
Brandon Ellis, Brad Helbig, Matt Dea, Dan Jockson, Aaron Edwards, Greg White, Dave Astbury, Jane Post, Tom Derickx, Hot Toddy Elton
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I think you'll find a number of varying sides in this thread. Was very hard to leave some guys out and where to place others. Then that's excluding any of our draftees doing well and I haven't got Knights or A.Edwards in my team who fair chance that they play round 1 at least.
I'm sure your right tigs. There is plenty of options there. I would be happy if you team lined up too which I think is a clear indicators that we have an increasing level of options/competition for spots now.
I noticed you had Newman in your forwardline - was that because you couldn't find room for him in your backline? You didn't have A. Edwards or Knights in the team - is that because you feel they need to earn their spots or aren't as good as other options we already have?
I decided to go tall in the forwardline with Griffiths, Jack and Vickery but I easily see Griffiths making way for a small forward such as Nahas if match ups required.
King is an interesting decision - he is one of the first picked each week based on structure and defensive pressure but does not have the ability of some of our better players. I wonder if he will be forced out of the team later in the year by another small forward such as Edwards, Knights, or a draftee? They would need to lift their defensive game if this was to happen imo.
I put Newman forward, half because I couldn't find a spot for him in the back half and half because we need a good user delivering inside 50. I think of the guys vying for HBF he's the best option on a HFF. Better than Houli/Batchelor IMO. Could probably swap Deledio/Newman as well.
Edwards and Knights I think certainly need to prove themselves. I think Edwards will play Round 1 but also think a lot of games we will go with 2 talls in Vickery/Riewoldt only or Griffiths will hopefully go past him during the year. Knights I think has a lot to prove, through either the NAB Cup or Coburg before he walks into the team.
Before I posted I didn't have King but think he's important to the side and will be picked most weeks. Round 1 he's likely to get Yarran and could go a long way to us winning. I had him starting with Nahas as sub as he could be really damaging late in games, coming on half way through 3rd quarter and burning opponents off. Still think he could kick 25 odd playing this role all year.
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Can anyone honestly see Whacko Jacko in the line-up? I'd love to hear your argument.
Yep, I can. The Coaches love him.
(http://www.omgif.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/blowjob-simulation.gif)
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Who would go out for him though?
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Who would go out for him though?
the drunk guy
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Who would go out for him though?
the drunk guy
Probably right now. Has a long road back to respectville does Aaron. Just get smashed at home next time :banghead
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this islike rocking up peeed on the first day of your new job ,,sheeesh
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F:- A Edwards, Post......wait hang on
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b/ grimes - chaplin - morris
hb/ conca - rance - batchelor
c/ grigg - tuck - deledio
r/ maric - martin - cotchin
hf/ knights - griffiths - s edwards
f/ a edwards - riewoldt - vickery
int/ foley - ellis - helbig - pick 9 stringer.
depth nahas, houli, jackson, newman, king. arnott,
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b/ grimes - chaplin - morris
hb/ conca - rance - batchelor
c/ grigg - tuck - deledio
r/ maric - martin - cotchin
hf/ knights - griffiths - s edwards
f/ a edwards - riewoldt - vickery
int/ foley - ellis - helbig - pick 9 stringer.
depth nahas, houli, jackson, newman, king. arnott,
Stringer isn't be a Tiger.
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Jacko will continue to get games for the time being because what all the teams above show up is that we still have a lack of midfield depth. Most of the above sides have a starting mid/centreline of Cotchin, Foley, Deledio, Tuck and Grigg. Then rotations come from Martin, Conca, S Edwards, Knights, Nahas. Of the rotations, only Martin and Conca are going to be quality midfielders (the others more forwards who can part time in the middle); and not many of those can play as defensive mids. Unless Ellis and Helbig and any new recruits come on quickly as midfielders, Jacko will still be getting games.
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I think you'll find a number of varying sides in this thread. Was very hard to leave some guys out and where to place others. Then that's excluding any of our draftees doing well and I haven't got Knights or A.Edwards in my team who fair chance that they play round 1 at least.
I'm sure your right tigs. There is plenty of options there. I would be happy if you team lined up too which I think is a clear indicators that we have an increasing level of options/competition for spots now.
I noticed you had Newman in your forwardline - was that because you couldn't find room for him in your backline? You didn't have A. Edwards or Knights in the team - is that because you feel they need to earn their spots or aren't as good as other options we already have?
I decided to go tall in the forwardline with Griffiths, Jack and Vickery but I easily see Griffiths making way for a small forward such as Nahas if match ups required.
King is an interesting decision - he is one of the first picked each week based on structure and defensive pressure but does not have the ability of some of our better players. I wonder if he will be forced out of the team later in the year by another small forward such as Edwards, Knights, or a draftee? They would need to lift their defensive game if this was to happen imo.
I put Newman forward, half because I couldn't find a spot for him in the back half and half because we need a good user delivering inside 50. I think of the guys vying for HBF he's the best option on a HFF. Better than Houli/Batchelor IMO. Could probably swap Deledio/Newman as well.
Edwards and Knights I think certainly need to prove themselves. I think Edwards will play Round 1 but also think a lot of games we will go with 2 talls in Vickery/Riewoldt only or Griffiths will hopefully go past him during the year. Knights I think has a lot to prove, through either the NAB Cup or Coburg before he walks into the team.
Before I posted I didn't have King but think he's important to the side and will be picked most weeks. Round 1 he's likely to get Yarran and could go a long way to us winning. I had him starting with Nahas as sub as he could be really damaging late in games, coming on half way through 3rd quarter and burning opponents off. Still think he could kick 25 odd playing this role all year.
is newman a better option forward than edwards, edwards, knights, and martin or even nahas for that matter. i have to say no. only two possibilities for newman midfield or hb.
theres a fair few players who they will pick who are the problem i think people forget we didnt achieve a thing this yr we finished 12th again we finished 12th because of your jacksons nahas whites mcguanes kings etc they just arent good enough and importantly skilled enough.
we must change to improve and it will mean ordinary hacks no longer get a game.
oh yeah come on down jake stringer the best player in the 2012 nd. surely we will take him if we are lucky enough to have him there at 9. i can just drool now over stringer and martin rotating mid / forward. or even in the forward half together. who needs genuine forward flankers with these two in your side geez with stringer who needs kpfs.
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AFL site's Richmond best 22:
B: Morris Rance Grimes
HB: Deledio Chaplin Newman
C: Grigg Tuck Houli
HF: Martin Vickery Griffiths
F: Knights Riewoldt Edwards
R: Maric Cotchin Foley
Int: Ellis, Batchelor, Astbury
Sub: Conca
Richmond
The Tigers were ruthlessly efficient during the Gillette AFL Free Agency Period. A key defender and an experienced midfielder were their clear targets and within 24 hours they had brought both Adelaide's Chris Knights and Port Adelaide's Troy Chaplin to the club. Knights can swing through the midfield and sneak forward, while Chaplin adds height, strength and experience to a backline that was probably the club's main weakness in 2012. The Tigers are putting together a strong side as they push for their first finals appearance in 12 years, and at this stage and at full strength, Robin Nahas and Jake King would battle to get a game.
- Ashley Browne
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/150669/default.aspx
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AFL site's Richmond best 22:
B: Morris Rance Grimes
HB: Deledio Chaplin Newman
C: Grigg Tuck Houli
HF: Martin Vickery Griffiths
F: Knights Riewoldt Edwards
R: Maric Cotchin Foley
Int: Ellis, Batchelor, Astbury
Sub: Conca
Richmond
The Tigers were ruthlessly efficient during the Gillette AFL Free Agency Period. A key defender and an experienced midfielder were their clear targets and within 24 hours they had brought both Adelaide's Chris Knights and Port Adelaide's Troy Chaplin to the club. Knights can swing through the midfield and sneak forward, while Chaplin adds height, strength and experience to a backline that was probably the club's main weakness in 2012. The Tigers are putting together a strong side as they push for their first finals appearance in 12 years, and at this stage and at full strength, Robin Nahas and Jake King would battle to get a game.
- Ashley Browne
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/150669/default.aspx
why would they name astbury on the bench. surely with rance, chaplin, grimes down back theres no spot for him unless he actually replaces one of them.
with riewoldt, griffiths, and vickery forward there is no place for him unless he actually replaces one of them.
hes not going to be the second ruckman surely.
what the hell are they doing naming vickery at chf is he or is he not to be the second ruckman. they better hurry up and decide. if he is surely he must play out of a pocket as a long target with significant time in the ruck, a damn site more than in the past.
if hes not our ruck stocks are even worse.
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Conca>Ellis.
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Conca>Ellis.
Yessss big man :clapping
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Conca>Ellis.
Absolutely
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AFL site's Richmond best 22:
B: Morris Rance Grimes
HB: Deledio Chaplin Newman
C: Grigg Tuck Houli
HF: Martin Vickery Griffiths
F: Knights Riewoldt Edwards
R: Maric Cotchin Foley
Int: Ellis, Batchelor, Astbury
Sub: Conca
Richmond
The Tigers were ruthlessly efficient during the Gillette AFL Free Agency Period. A key defender and an experienced midfielder were their clear targets and within 24 hours they had brought both Adelaide's Chris Knights and Port Adelaide's Troy Chaplin to the club. Knights can swing through the midfield and sneak forward, while Chaplin adds height, strength and experience to a backline that was probably the club's main weakness in 2012. The Tigers are putting together a strong side as they push for their first finals appearance in 12 years, and at this stage and at full strength, Robin Nahas and Jake King would battle to get a game.
- Ashley Browne
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/150669/default.aspx
why would they name astbury on the bench. surely with rance, chaplin, grimes down back theres no spot for him unless he actually replaces one of them.
with riewoldt, griffiths, and vickery forward there is no place for him unless he actually replaces one of them.
hes not going to be the second ruckman surely.
what the hell are they doing naming vickery at chf is he or is he not to be the second ruckman. they better hurry up and decide. if he is surely he must play out of a pocket as a long target with significant time in the ruck, a damn site more than in the past.
if hes not our ruck stocks are even worse.
dont get too worked up craw, its just some journo, not the club itself.
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why would they name astbury on the bench. surely with rance, chaplin, grimes down back theres no spot for him unless he actually replaces one of them.
with riewoldt, griffiths, and vickery forward there is no place for him unless he actually replaces one of them.
hes not going to be the second ruckman surely.
what the hell are they doing naming vickery at chf is he or is he not to be the second ruckman. they better hurry up and decide. if he is surely he must play out of a pocket as a long target with significant time in the ruck, a damn site more than in the past.
if hes not our ruck stocks are even worse.
dont get too worked up craw, its just some journo, not the club itself.
:lol x 2
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Is it Aaron or Shane Edwards in the forward line?
If Aaron, he is effectively getting rid of 90 odd goals in our forward line by not having Titch, Jake and Nahas in our forward line.
It might be "only" be a journo view but they do get paid to do this crap. Least they can do is put some critical thought into it or log onto this forum and thread!
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B: Morris Rance Grimes
HB: Newman Chaplin Houli
C: Grigg Deledio Conca
HF: King Vickery Knights
F: A.Edwards Riewoldt Nahas
R: Maric Cotchin Martin
Int: Foley, Tuck, Griffiths
Sub: Ellis
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B: Morris Rance Grimes
HB: Newman Chaplin Houli
C: Grigg Deledio Conca
HF: King Vickery Knights
F: A.Edwards Riewoldt Nahas
R: Maric Cotchin Martin
Int: Foley, Tuck, Griffiths
Sub: Ellis
A Edwards over S Edwards?
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AFL site's Richmond best 22:
B: Morris Rance Grimes
HB: Deledio Chaplin Newman
C: Grigg Tuck Houli
HF: Martin Vickery Griffiths
F: Knights Riewoldt Edwards
R: Maric Cotchin Foley
Int: Ellis, Batchelor, Astbury
Sub: Conca
Richmond
The Tigers were ruthlessly efficient during the Gillette AFL Free Agency Period. A key defender and an experienced midfielder were their clear targets and within 24 hours they had brought both Adelaide's Chris Knights and Port Adelaide's Troy Chaplin to the club. Knights can swing through the midfield and sneak forward, while Chaplin adds height, strength and experience to a backline that was probably the club's main weakness in 2012. The Tigers are putting together a strong side as they push for their first finals appearance in 12 years, and at this stage and at full strength, Robin Nahas and Jake King would battle to get a game.
- Ashley Browne
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/150669/default.aspx
why would they name astbury on the bench. surely with rance, chaplin, grimes down back theres no spot for him unless he actually replaces one of them.
with riewoldt, griffiths, and vickery forward there is no place for him unless he actually replaces one of them.
hes not going to be the second ruckman surely.
what the hell are they doing naming vickery at chf is he or is he not to be the second ruckman. they better hurry up and decide. if he is surely he must play out of a pocket as a long target with significant time in the ruck, a damn site more than in the past.
if hes not our ruck stocks are even worse.
dont get too worked up craw, its just some journo, not the club itself.
Yep. The journo has Lids on a HBF when Lids no longer plays there.
The 3rd tall/CHF spot is still one I find difficult to pinpoint even if Vickery returns to his 2011 form. The Club brought in Aaron Edwards but he's just a fill in even if he commits himself after his latest misdemeanour. Griffiths has the potential to fill the void but he played all last year in defence. With Chaplin now in the side it's time to push him forward. Elton and Astbury are still unknowns or different reasons - Elton is still developing while Astbury will hopefully improve significantly next year with a full preseason under his belt.
My best 22 at this stage:
B: Morris Rance Grimes
HB: Batchelor Chaplin Houli
C: Conca Tuck Deledio
HF: Martin Griffiths Grigg
F: Vickery Riewoldt S.Edwards
R: Maric Cotchin Foley
Int: Ellis, Newman, Knights
Sub: Pick 9 (assuming we draft a mid)
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Expecting to be howled down but based solely on form in the 2nd half of the season I really do wonder if Newman is still in our best 22 :huh :-\
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Expecting to be howled down but based solely on form in the 2nd half of the season I really do wonder if Newman is still in our best 22 :huh :-\
Yep. I think his 2012 form would have him right on the cusp. Although i'm keen to see how he goes without the Captaincy tag.
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Expecting to be howled down but based solely on form in the 2nd half of the season I really do wonder if Newman is still in our best 22 :huh :-\
IMO he was playing injured. Remember he hurt his shin earlier in the season. He was fine the week after but his form dipped and became inconsistent after that.
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Expecting to be howled down but based solely on form in the 2nd half of the season I really do wonder if Newman is still in our best 22 :huh :-\
IMO he was playing injured. Remember he hurt his shin earlier in the season. He was fine the week after but his form dipped and became inconsistent after that.
Perhaps but he wouldn't be the only player running around playing injured during the latter part of a season.
Thing that stood out to me all season was he seemed a lot slower this year
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Expecting to be howled down but based solely on form in the 2nd half of the season I really do wonder if Newman is still in our best 22 :huh :-\
IMO he was playing injured. Remember he hurt his shin earlier in the season. He was fine the week after but his form dipped and became inconsistent after that.
Perhaps but he wouldn't be the only player running around playing injured during the latter part of a season.
Thing that stood out to me all season was he seemed a lot slower this year
The thing that I noticed was the penetration in his kicking was short by about 5m or so. Sure that can be sign of age (he's 30 now) but it also can be a sign of someone carrying a leg injury. He did his PCL late last year and then injured his shin this year which also resulted in a huge haematona in his leg. So we'll have to wait until next year to see if it was injury-related or 'old' age catching up.
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Expecting to be howled down but based solely on form in the 2nd half of the season I really do wonder if Newman is still in our best 22 :huh :-\
You make a good point
But bacha the squib houli is surely in the same boat
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Expecting to be howled down but based solely on form in the 2nd half of the season I really do wonder if Newman is still in our best 22 :huh :-\
You make a good point
But bacha the squib houli is surely in the same boat
::) Did you even watch games this year?
Agree on Newman though.
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There.is only.21 spots
Helbig could go past him. Or sea.
Don't.forgot Jack doesn't need to earn his place so its only 20 spots.
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AFL site's Richmond best 22:
B: Morris Rance Grimes
HB: Deledio Chaplin Newman
C: Grigg Tuck Houli
HF: Martin Vickery Griffiths
F: Knights Riewoldt Edwards
R: Maric Cotchin Foley
Int: Ellis, Batchelor, Astbury
Sub: Conca
Richmond
The Tigers were ruthlessly efficient during the Gillette AFL Free Agency Period. A key defender and an experienced midfielder were their clear targets and within 24 hours they had brought both Adelaide's Chris Knights and Port Adelaide's Troy Chaplin to the club. Knights can swing through the midfield and sneak forward, while Chaplin adds height, strength and experience to a backline that was probably the club's main weakness in 2012. The Tigers are putting together a strong side as they push for their first finals appearance in 12 years, and at this stage and at full strength, Robin Nahas and Jake King would battle to get a game.
- Ashley Browne
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/150669/default.aspx
why would they name astbury on the bench. surely with rance, chaplin, grimes down back theres no spot for him unless he actually replaces one of them.
with riewoldt, griffiths, and vickery forward there is no place for him unless he actually replaces one of them.
hes not going to be the second ruckman surely.
what the hell are they doing naming vickery at chf is he or is he not to be the second ruckman. they better hurry up and decide. if he is surely he must play out of a pocket as a long target with significant time in the ruck, a damn site more than in the past.
if hes not our ruck stocks are even worse.
dont get too worked up craw, its just some journo, not the club itself.
Yep. The journo has Lids on a HBF when Lids no longer plays there.
The 3rd tall/CHF spot is still one I find difficult to pinpoint even if Vickery returns to his 2011 form. The Club brought in Aaron Edwards but he's just a fill in even if he commits himself after his latest misdemeanour. Griffiths has the potential to fill the void but he played all last year in defence. With Chaplin now in the side it's time to push him forward. Elton and Astbury are still unknowns or different reasons - Elton is still developing while Astbury will hopefully improve significantly next year with a full preseason under his belt.
My best 22 at this stage:
B: Morris Rance Grimes
HB: Batchelor Chaplin Houli
C: Conca Tuck Deledio
HF: Martin Griffiths Grigg
F: Vickery Riewoldt S.Edwards
R: Maric Cotchin Foley
Int: Ellis, Newman, Knights
Sub: Pick 9 (assuming we draft a mid)
Nailed it MT. Good team. Hopefully pick 9 is that good too. :thumbsup
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Expecting to be howled down but based solely on form in the 2nd half of the season I really do wonder if Newman is still in our best 22 :huh :-\
You make a good point
But bacha the squib houli is surely in the same boat
::) Did you even watch games this year?
Agree on Newman though.
Are you trying to deny that Houli is soft? He has less of a crack than McMahon. At least Jordy didn't try to hide his softness. I love it when Houli has the opportunity to go back with the flight and take a grab but he chooses to stay where he is and rove the crumbs. It's especially good to watch when the contest is only a 1 on 1 yet he still refuses to go back with the flight :lol
Weak as pee but can kick a footy.
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FB morris chaplin ellis
HB grimes rance batchelor
C edwards cotchin conca
HF king vickery knights
FF griffiths reiwoldt nahas
FOLL maric martin deledio
INT grigg jackson foley tuck
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Expecting to be howled down but based solely on form in the 2nd half of the season I really do wonder if Newman is still in our best 22 :huh :-\
IMO he was playing injured. Remember he hurt his shin earlier in the season. He was fine the week after but his form dipped and became inconsistent after that.
Perhaps but he wouldn't be the only player running around playing injured during the latter part of a season.
Thing that stood out to me all season was he seemed a lot slower this year
i think your spot on WP, went a long way back from his 2011 form. Looks to have lost a little bit of everything (pace, penetration in his kicking etc.).
I think Newman knows this as well, hence him stepping down from the captaincy as the season closed. I wouldn't be surprised if, in the 2nd half of 2013, he is being used as the sub. Really, that would be good for us as it means others have stepped up and gone past him.
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A good thing Hardwick has done is created pressure for positions.
Knights, King, Nahas, Edwards, Nahas are all battling for one or two positions.
Would seem Aaron Edwards will slot into the forward line with Riewoldt and Vickery, so one or two positions left leaving one position open for Cotchin, Martin or Deledio to play.
Batchelor, Dea fighting for a spot too in defence.
Grigg, Conca, Foley rotating on the wings??? Would like to have another midfielder.
Jackson unfortunately will NEVER lose his position :(
Where do we play Ellis in 2013???
Cotchin, Martin, Deledio are our midfield.
Tuck ever the durable man will keep playing and i have this feeling will get better with age!
You would like to think they settle Griffiths, Astbury in a position!
Hope Helbig, Arnot begin to develop into that hard, tough inside midfielder.
Would target two good inside midfielders this draft, a genuine forward and key defender ...
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Foley on a.wing? Pure rover in my book
Then again I think grimes is a full back while others don't agree
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i reckon you throw A Edwards in that list with king, knights and co, torch
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I agree with this with the exception of two selections. I believe bachelor has shown enough to play ahead of A Edwards. I would also go with the Dutchman over Jake King.
Edit good work MT.
Mine would be slightly different -
B: Steven Morris, Troy Chaplin, Dylan Grimes
HB: Bachar Houli, Alex Rance, Chris Newman
C: Brett Deledio, Shane Tuck, Shaun Grigg
HF: Shane Edwards, Ben Griffiths , Jake King
F: Tyrone Vickery, Jack Riewoldt, , Aaron Edwards
R: Ivan Maric, Trent Cotchin, Nathan Foley
INT: Dustin Martin, Chris Knights , Brandon Ellis, sub: Reece Conca
Left Overs: Robin Nahas, Jake Batchelor, Brad Helbig, Todd Elton, David Astbury, Daniel Jackson, Jayden Post, Matthew Dea
IMHO - that is a very strong team ! :thumbsup
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headaches headaches come round 1 for the boys plenty to choose from know which we haven't really had for sometime... players don't perform next year see yeah later... must say the following guys are at the roads
1- jackson 2- king, 3- nahas, 4- ashbury 5- Griffiths
drunk Edwards will certainly play a role we would be silly not to try him early specially if vickery is up and running to have 3 prong attack would haunt any teams backline
go u tigers
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b/ morris - chaplin - grimes.
hb/ batchelor - rance - vlastuin.
c/ grigg - tuck - conca.
r/ maric - deledio - cotchin.
hf/ s edwards - riewoldt - martin.
f/ vickery - griffiths - a edwards.
int/ ellis - knights - foley - helbig/newman/nahas/houli/king/jackson.
the one deficiency is leg speed though all the talls bar jack and ivan are quick for their size.
would be tempted to play someone like helbig back and release morris to a midfield run with role.
2nds
b/ newman - darrou - mcintosh
hb/ dea - astbury - verrier
c/ nahas - arnot - houli.
r/ derickx - jackson - king
hf/ ohanlon - elton - white
f/ mcdough - mcguane - ??????
int/ mcbean /?????/?????/?????.
the lack of genuine mids is plain to see along with tall kpfs.
one has to question the rucks as well.
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Expecting to be howled down but based solely on form in the 2nd half of the season I really do wonder if Newman is still in our best 22 :huh :-\
You make a good point
But bacha the squib houli is surely in the same boat
::) Did you even watch games this year?
Agree on Newman though.
Are you trying to deny that Houli is soft? He has less of a crack than McMahon. At least Jordy didn't try to hide his softness. I love it when Houli has the opportunity to go back with the flight and take a grab but he chooses to stay where he is and rove the crumbs. It's especially good to watch when the contest is only a 1 on 1 yet he still refuses to go back with the flight :lol
Weak as pee but can kick a footy.
In fairness he's getting better. Coming off a low base though. :whistle
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Getting better at what? Shirking contests?
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b/ morris - chaplin - grimes.
hb/ batchelor - rance - vlastuin.
c/ grigg - tuck - conca.
r/ maric - deledio - cotchin.
hf/ s edwards - riewoldt - martin.
f/ vickery - griffiths - a edwards.
int/ ellis - knights - foley - helbig/newman/nahas/houli/king/jackson.
the one deficiency is leg speed though all the talls bar jack and ivan are quick for their size.
would be tempted to play someone like helbig back and release morris to a midfield run with role.
2nds
b/ newman - darrou - mcintosh
hb/ dea - astbury - verrier
c/ nahas - arnot - houli.
r/ derickx - jackson - king
hf/ ohanlon - elton - white
f/ mcdough - mcguane - ??????
int/ mcbean /?????/?????/?????.
the lack of genuine mids is plain to see along with tall kpfs.
one has to question the rucks as well.
That's a strong senior list and an impressive reserves list, though despite what you, I or anyone else here thinks... Newman, king and jackson will be in the seniors more often than not
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Newman will be an interesting prospect this year without the burden of captaincy. Will he regain his dash and impact of years gone by or will he continue to fade a la 2012.
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Getting better at what? Shirking contests?
Nah he goes in harder than the start of his RFC career. Hard to notice unless you take the low base he began with into consideration. :lol
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Bachelor. Grimes. Chaplin.
Vlastuin. Rance. Conca / Ellis.
Grigg. Cotchin. Knights / Newman.
Martin. Griffiths. S.Edwards.
Deledio. Riewoldt. Vickery.
Maric. Morris. Tuck / Foley
Sub - Houli
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That's a pretty strong list there bents, is houli the sub?
I think hed make a good sub with his pace
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That's a pretty strong list there bents, is houli the sub?
Yes sir.
I think hed make a good sub with his pace
I concur.
Bachelor. Grimes. Chaplin.
Vlastuin. Rance. Conca / Ellis.
Grigg. Cotchin. Knights / Newman.
Martin. Griffiths. S.Edwards.
Deledio. Riewoldt. Vickery.
Maric. Morris. Tuck / Foley
Sub - Houli
1st XXII Above.
2nd XXII:
Mcintosh. McBean. Verrier/Darrou
Dea. Astbury. Gideon Simon.
Jackson. McDonough. White.
OHanlon. Elton. Nahas.
McGaune. A.Edwards. King.
Derick. Helbig. Aarnot.
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McDonut is a centreman?
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HFF when Toy is drafted :pray
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Chaplin needs to do an I Maric job in his first season.
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McDonut is a centreman?
Definitely can play there. How many minutes he spends in there depends how quickly he can shed that donut attached to his stomach.
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McDonut is a centreman?
Definitely can play there. How many minutes he spends in there depends how quickly he can shed that donut attached to his stomach.
im glad to see your optimistic about that. from what i can glean on him he has a long way to go to become a proficient afl midfielder.
while he has managed to spend limited time in the midfield as a part of rotations etc he is primarily a forward who we will have to develop into a mid. with our develoment record i wont be holding my breath.
but rather than just focus on the negatives if we can turn him into a mid he could be a very good player. ive been looking at what i can get on him he certainly kicks goals he certainly has very good skills both sides now that is unrichmond like.. not sure about pace and at 179cm have a question about height though hes a solid kid which is good.
dont know about motor at a guess would say its not great and probably one reason he plays primarily forward.
will say with his skills which look great even if he does not become a mid he looks an upgrade on the other sml forwards we have.
dont have a problem with him as a player but again i do ask if we wanted a mid why did we not just take a proven one. that is the only gripe. i dont really have a problem with any of the players we took but i will question what the roles they will perform and actually have performed regularly.
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doubt he will ever be a pure mid, but if comes on he will be a forward who can rotate through the middle. he has raked up 30+ possession games and has the skill, particularily dual sided precise kicking, to play stints in the midfield, but like most draftees he is a long way off even making the grade.
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McDonut is a centreman?
Definitely can play there. How many minutes he spends in there depends how quickly he can shed that donut attached to his stomach.
im glad to see your optimistic about that. from what i can glean on him he has a long way to go to become a proficient afl midfielder.
while he has managed to spend limited time in the midfield as a part of rotations etc he is primarily a forward who we will have to develop into a mid. with our develoment record i wont be holding my breath.
but rather than just focus on the negatives if we can turn him into a mid he could be a very good player. ive been looking at what i can get on him he certainly kicks goals he certainly has very good skills both sides now that is unrichmond like.. not sure about pace and at 179cm have a question about height though hes a solid kid which is good.
dont know about motor at a guess would say its not great and probably one reason he plays primarily forward.
will say with his skills which look great even if he does not become a mid he looks an upgrade on the other sml forwards we have.
dont have a problem with him as a player but again i do ask if we wanted a mid why did we not just take a proven one. that is the only gripe. i dont really have a problem with any of the players we took but i will question what the roles they will perform and actually have performed regularly.
He's very good in the middle when played there. He's just unfit and also the fact he is a very crafty/damaging forward he's best suited to primarily playing there. I think King's spot in the side is the one for him to aim for. King didn't play much as a shutdown forward this year with Jackson playing that role alot. King was a small forward who pinch hit in the middle.
McDonough could play this role and is better in the air (marking) and on the ground (goal sense), is a better kick and is also a better midfielder. King has him covered for pressure/tackling and leadership.
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Chaplin needs to do an I Maric job in his first season.
And I need a new mansion
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I've seen some posters on this thread happy to have A. Edwards already locked in the starting 22.
IMO he's got more to prove now than ever in his career and he's already off to a bad start with his off-field discretion 3 days after getting traded.
Don't think he's fairdinkum about his footy and he's still acting like a teenager.
I wouldn't have him in the starting team unless their was no one else left because of injury.
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I've seen some posters on this thread happy to have A. Edwards already locked in the starting 22.
IMO he's got more to prove now than ever in his career and he's already off to a bad start with his off-field discretion 3 days after getting traded.
Don't think he's fairdinkum about his footy and he's still acting like a teenager.
I wouldn't have him in the starting team unless their was no one else left because of injury.
Just not sure now whether he is a small forward and would therefore be completing with S. Edwards or Nahas for the attacking small role, a defensive forward and therefore be competing with King for the role or he is a quasi tall and Griffiths is his competition? I think it would be S.Edwards and Nahas would he is fighting for a spot with but regardless he needs to earn his spot on the training track and/or VFL side first now imo.
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would tend to think he plays a quasi tall.I certainly cant see him crumming off packs etc.But agree needs to earn his spot.And after his less than auspicious debut to things black and yellow .i would make him double earn his spot
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I've seen some posters on this thread happy to have A. Edwards already locked in the starting 22.
IMO he's got more to prove now than ever in his career and he's already off to a bad start with his off-field discretion 3 days after getting traded.
Don't think he's fairdinkum about his footy and he's still acting like a teenager.
I wouldn't have him in the starting team unless their was no one else left because of injury.
i place edwards in our 22 because i consider him a better player than king nahas and edwards. he also offers us flexability in the forwrd line something the other 3 dont.
most sides will play a third quick tall on this bloke and that means jack has one less coming over the top. really good on the lead do we have a player who actually leads well, good at crashing packs do our forwards do this deadly accurate omg a player at richmond who can kick straight at goal. and for his size superb in the air warranting someone who can combat this.
he gives us something different. yes he has weaknesses in other areas but as a pure forward id take him over all of our small forwards.
i dont get the hate. we have tried to find a player of edwards type for ages, does taylor, connors, morton, macdonald, and ohanlon ring any bells all cost yet we basically get edwrds for nothing and your not even prepared to give him a chance unbelievable.
you carry on as though he has no talent but hes actually a better forward than many we have. hes an upgrade on our list who cost nothing. he doesnt miss traing seesions he works damn hard on the track hes easy going but sometimes he likes a beer.
hes been in trouble 3 times or mucked up 3 times in how many yrs hes probably doing better than most afl players they just havent got caught out.
so lets see he works hard he trains hard he fits in hes an upgrade on what we have, he offers flexability and something different but because he has a few beers too many every now and then hes worthless. give me a freakin break and get in the real world.
daniel you do drink if you dont dont ever reply to one of my posts dont even read em one cannot trust a man who doesnt drink. i believe they are called wowsers.
i said it before your hung up on player age and you think all players should be angels grow up bud and get real.
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He's a FF mate
Pretty sure that's how he kicked 100 vfl goals
If he gets a game it'd be in place ofvickery Griffin jack
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:lol hes 184 cm, hardly KP size in the AFL.
i dont get the hate.
just something he has plenty to spare and tries to make the world a better place by sharing it around as much as possible
one cannot trust a man who doesnt drink. i believe they are called wowsers.
:clapping
you addressed it to the wrong bloke, but it helps explain point 1
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True - but he plays a led / mark based game based from the goal square
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The interesting call for me is, now that the draft and free agency are both finished, to judge whether any of our recruits are worthy of a game straight up and if so who's spot will they take?
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I've seen some posters on this thread happy to have A. Edwards already locked in the starting 22.
IMO he's got more to prove now than ever in his career and he's already off to a bad start with his off-field discretion 3 days after getting traded.
Don't think he's fairdinkum about his footy and he's still acting like a teenager.
I wouldn't have him in the starting team unless their was no one else left because of injury.
i place edwards in our 22 because i consider him a better player than king nahas and edwards. he also offers us flexability in the forwrd line something the other 3 dont.
most sides will play a third quick tall on this bloke and that means jack has one less coming over the top. really good on the lead do we have a player who actually leads well, good at crashing packs do our forwards do this deadly accurate omg a player at richmond who can kick straight at goal. and for his size superb in the air warranting someone who can combat this.
he gives us something different. yes he has weaknesses in other areas but as a pure forward id take him over all of our small forwards.
i dont get the hate. we have tried to find a player of edwards type for ages, does taylor, connors, morton, macdonald, and ohanlon ring any bells all cost yet we basically get edwrds for nothing and your not even prepared to give him a chance unbelievable.
you carry on as though he has no talent but hes actually a better forward than many we have. hes an upgrade on our list who cost nothing. he doesnt miss traing seesions he works damn hard on the track hes easy going but sometimes he likes a beer.
hes been in trouble 3 times or mucked up 3 times in how many yrs hes probably doing better than most afl players they just havent got caught out.
so lets see he works hard he trains hard he fits in hes an upgrade on what we have, he offers flexability and something different but because he has a few beers too many every now and then hes worthless. give me a freakin break and get in the real world.
daniel you do drink if you dont dont ever reply to one of my posts dont even read em one cannot trust a man who doesnt drink. i believe they are called wowsers.
i said it before your hung up on player age and you think all players should be angels grow up bud and get real.
First of all I'm not Daniel.
I don't think this guy is fairdinkum. It's my opinion which was somewhat vindicated by his actions 3 days after getting traded to us.
I personally wouldn't pin the teams finals hopes on this guy at all. The forward line would look far better with a host of players that could and would play together for the next 5 years. He won't be.
I'm not hung up on any one player I just don't beleive he was the correct fit for our club and once again his actions after being traded proved that he's never learnt anything in his years in the system which underlines his immaturity as a person.
We don't need these type of blokes in our team especially one who could influence other youngsters into bad behavior.
Secondly you tell me to grow up? You dont know me. I'll let this slide this time after all we all love the same team. :thumbsup
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I've seen some posters on this thread happy to have A. Edwards already locked in the starting 22.
IMO he's got more to prove now than ever in his career and he's already off to a bad start with his off-field discretion 3 days after getting traded.
Don't think he's fairdinkum about his footy and he's still acting like a teenager.
I wouldn't have him in the starting team unless their was no one else left because of injury.
i place edwards in our 22 because i consider him a better player than king nahas and edwards. he also offers us flexability in the forwrd line something the other 3 dont.
most sides will play a third quick tall on this bloke and that means jack has one less coming over the top. really good on the lead do we have a player who actually leads well, good at crashing packs do our forwards do this deadly accurate omg a player at richmond who can kick straight at goal. and for his size superb in the air warranting someone who can combat this.
he gives us something different. yes he has weaknesses in other areas but as a pure forward id take him over all of our small forwards.
i dont get the hate. we have tried to find a player of edwards type for ages, does taylor, connors, morton, macdonald, and ohanlon ring any bells all cost yet we basically get edwrds for nothing and your not even prepared to give him a chance unbelievable.
you carry on as though he has no talent but hes actually a better forward than many we have. hes an upgrade on our list who cost nothing. he doesnt miss traing seesions he works damn hard on the track hes easy going but sometimes he likes a beer.
hes been in trouble 3 times or mucked up 3 times in how many yrs hes probably doing better than most afl players they just havent got caught out.
so lets see he works hard he trains hard he fits in hes an upgrade on what we have, he offers flexability and something different but because he has a few beers too many every now and then hes worthless. give me a freakin break and get in the real world.
daniel you do drink if you dont dont ever reply to one of my posts dont even read em one cannot trust a man who doesnt drink. i believe they are called wowsers.
i said it before your hung up on player age and you think all players should be angels grow up bud and get real.
First of all I'm not Daniel.
I don't think this guy is fairdinkum. It's my opinion which was somewhat vindicated by his actions 3 days after getting traded to us.
I personally wouldn't pin the teams finals hopes on this guy at all. The forward line would look far better with a host of players that could and would play together for the next 5 years. He won't be.
I'm not hung up on any one player I just don't beleive he was the correct fit for our club and once again his actions after being traded proved that he's never learnt anything in his years in the system which underlines his immaturity as a person.
We don't need these type of blokes in our team especially one who could influence other youngsters into bad behavior.
Secondly you tell me to grow up? You dont know me. I'll let this slide this time after all we all love the same team. :thumbsup
thats laughable. you feel vindicated because you think yes only think a player is not fair dinkum. what having a few beers admitedly too many with your ex team mates who you just left for another club in a period where you are allowed to drink and relax is proof that hes not fair dinkum unbelievable.
in his time at north can you point to one thing that says hes abad influence on others.. if anything the opposite has happened. so once again without any proof or any vindication you write off a badly needed experienced player of a type we have few of because you think he might corrupt the young adults at our club.
in his time at north can you point to just one scenario where he has failed to train or work consistently hard.
i could go on but i have to agree you arent hung up on one player your just hung up on the silly expectations you have for all players.
me ive have regularly stated whyi think hes is a decent get i havent pre judged him on footy or what i think his behavior should be away from the team. clearly you have.
id argue hes a perfect fit for our team atm. he is a now selection you clearly have a problem with that as well.
as far as i can see he improves us in areas we are weak in and lack depth. he brings experience and his character seems pretty good apart from lets say he works hard and when allowed he partys hard but according to you that is not on. prety good reason to get peeed if you like meeting up with your just departed team mates in a period where you are allowed to imbide in even a few too many.
can i ask why did we keep newman and tuck they wont be around in 5 yrs time. why get ivan or knights. do you even agree you can address holes in the list with mature players or even veterans. do you even acknowledge we have age gaps in the list and games played problems. can and do clubs do both short term recruiting and long term recruiting.
finally what are you gonna let go. have a go say what you really think. im just someone pointing out how petty and bloody minded you are being and unrealistic. tell me how many afl players get drunk in the off season or what percentage would you think.
i dont need to know you to see your hoisting your morals and the way you expect players to behave upon not just our players but all players. i say again if not grow up get real.
hmm a question what is your stance with dayle garlett. now this will be interesting.
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B....Morris Rance Grimes
HB..Houli Chaplin Batchelor
C....Deledio Foley Grigg
HF..Martin Vickery Edwards
F....Nahas Reiwoldt Griffiths
Foll.Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Conca, Newman, Ellis sub:Vlastuin
Thats the side I'd like to see, in truth Im very tempted to leave Newman out but have to be realistic he will get a game. Im living in lala land as it is without having Daniel jackson in the side... ::)
3 talls down back 2 of which are very agile and can player on smaller players, plus Batchelor plays tall so plenty of options as we have newman, ellis and conca on the pine and all able to offer some run out of the backline if required.
Our full starting centreline and followers are as good as any going around, if fully fit we will smash sides.
Fwd line was hard, Im NOT a fan of 3 tall fwds, dont think it works very often unless one of the talls is exceptionally agile and can get on his bike and play very high half forward. Depending on matchups and sides we play Id be looking at Griffiths out for A.Edwards/Knights or King. But Im willing to give it a shot, can always sub out. Nahas has his critics but his ability to put pressure on defenders and keep them honest is undervalued. Has proven he can hurt opposition on the scoreboard so they are wary of him.
Hopefully Helbig, Arnott, Astbury, O'Hanlon and Dea put presure on selectors by stepping up and developing well at coburg. Then you have players like King, Jackson, A.Edwards, Knights, McGuane, White as depth players. No pressure on our draftees, but Vlastuin is afl ready and will play from round 1 barring any hicups
List has come a long way.
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Good post t_m. But you lost me when you started hoping players would develop at Coburg. :lol
-
I've seen some posters on this thread happy to have A. Edwards already locked in the starting 22.
IMO he's got more to prove now than ever in his career and he's already off to a bad start with his off-field discretion 3 days after getting traded.
Don't think he's fairdinkum about his footy and he's still acting like a teenager.
I wouldn't have him in the starting team unless their was no one else left because of injury.
i place edwards in our 22 because i consider him a better player than king nahas and edwards. he also offers us flexability in the forwrd line something the other 3 dont.
most sides will play a third quick tall on this bloke and that means jack has one less coming over the top. really good on the lead do we have a player who actually leads well, good at crashing packs do our forwards do this deadly accurate omg a player at richmond who can kick straight at goal. and for his size superb in the air warranting someone who can combat this.
he gives us something different. yes he has weaknesses in other areas but as a pure forward id take him over all of our small forwards.
i dont get the hate. we have tried to find a player of edwards type for ages, does taylor, connors, morton, macdonald, and ohanlon ring any bells all cost yet we basically get edwrds for nothing and your not even prepared to give him a chance unbelievable.
you carry on as though he has no talent but hes actually a better forward than many we have. hes an upgrade on our list who cost nothing. he doesnt miss traing seesions he works damn hard on the track hes easy going but sometimes he likes a beer.
hes been in trouble 3 times or mucked up 3 times in how many yrs hes probably doing better than most afl players they just havent got caught out.
so lets see he works hard he trains hard he fits in hes an upgrade on what we have, he offers flexability and something different but because he has a few beers too many every now and then hes worthless. give me a freakin break and get in the real world.
daniel you do drink if you dont dont ever reply to one of my posts dont even read em one cannot trust a man who doesnt drink. i believe they are called wowsers.
i said it before your hung up on player age and you think all players should be angels grow up bud and get real.
First of all I'm not Daniel.
I don't think this guy is fairdinkum. It's my opinion which was somewhat vindicated by his actions 3 days after getting traded to us.
I personally wouldn't pin the teams finals hopes on this guy at all. The forward line would look far better with a host of players that could and would play together for the next 5 years. He won't be.
I'm not hung up on any one player I just don't beleive he was the correct fit for our club and once again his actions after being traded proved that he's never learnt anything in his years in the system which underlines his immaturity as a person.
We don't need these type of blokes in our team especially one who could influence other youngsters into bad behavior.
Secondly you tell me to grow up? You dont know me. I'll let this slide this time after all we all love the same team. :thumbsup
thats laughable. you feel vindicated because you think yes only think a player is not fair dinkum. what having a few beers admitedly too many with your ex team mates who you just left for another club in a period where you are allowed to drink and relax is proof that hes not fair dinkum unbelievable.
in his time at north can you point to one thing that says hes abad influence on others.. if anything the opposite has happened. so once again without any proof or any vindication you write off a badly needed experienced player of a type we have few of because you think he might corrupt the young adults at our club.
in his time at north can you point to just one scenario where he has failed to train or work consistently hard.
i could go on but i have to agree you arent hung up on one player your just hung up on the silly expectations you have for all players.
me ive have regularly stated whyi think hes is a decent get i havent pre judged him on footy or what i think his behavior should be away from the team. clearly you have.
id argue hes a perfect fit for our team atm. he is a now selection you clearly have a problem with that as well.
as far as i can see he improves us in areas we are weak in and lack depth. he brings experience and his character seems pretty good apart from lets say he works hard and when allowed he partys hard but according to you that is not on. prety good reason to get peeed if you like meeting up with your just departed team mates in a period where you are allowed to imbide in even a few too many.
can i ask why did we keep newman and tuck they wont be around in 5 yrs time. why get ivan or knights. do you even agree you can address holes in the list with mature players or even veterans. do you even acknowledge we have age gaps in the list and games played problems. can and do clubs do both short term recruiting and long term recruiting.
finally what are you gonna let go. have a go say what you really think. im just someone pointing out how petty and bloody minded you are being and unrealistic. tell me how many afl players get drunk in the off season or what percentage would you think.
i dont need to know you to see your hoisting your morals and the way you expect players to behave upon not just our players but all players. i say again if not grow up get real.
hmm a question what is your stance with dayle garlett. now this will be interesting.
He went out with mates but he got locked up and fined. Where were his mates? Why didn't they get locked up also?
Have you ever asked why he was let go? Was it bad behavior maybe? Or was he a bad influence on others? Or both?
I'd expect more from an older aged player especially one that has been let go from 2 previous clubs?
Both Tuck & Newman have been excellent servants of the club and great leaders both on and off the field. No reason to cut them if they're still required players.
Edwards is completely different in that he has to prove he's willing to do anything to show he's fairdinkum and give it one last crack. His actions prove opposite in my opinion.
On Dayle Gartlett I don't have an strong opinion on it either way because I don't know much about him at all except on what I've read.
Apparently hes got some discipline issues and likes to party as most youngsters do and he has freakish ability on field.
Our club has shown it hasn't a clue on dealing with the issues associated with indigenous youngsters with our ordinary record in that regard. But that also may have a lot to do with our poor recruiting and poor development in the past.
I'd hope that the club has learnt from issues in the past and we'd be a lot better accommodating and settling aboriginal players because we need more in our team for dreamtime @ the G. ;D
Seriously though, any youngster can be moulded and taught especially with good mentors around them. A chance to make his dreams a reality in the big league and I'd love to see our club succeed with a player like Dayle
A.Edwards has had numerous chances to show he's matured and fairdinkum about his footy but instead he showed he still hasn't grown up yet and he hasn't learnt anything from his past.
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Good post t_m. But you lost me when you started hoping players would develop at Coburg. :lol
:lol fair call - how about develop at training through the season with our bigger and improved coaching panel?
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Backs: Rance/Chaplin/Morris
H/Backs: Houli/Griff/Batchelor
Centres: Newman/Cotchin/Grigg
H/Forwards: Martin/Vicks/Knights
Forwards:King/Reiwoldt/D. Astbury
Followers: Maric/Deledio/Tuck
Bench: Ellis/Conca/S.Edwards/Foley
Emergencies: Edwards/Vlaustin/Nahas/Elton
Grimes left out for obvious reasons.
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B Morris Chaplin Grimes
HB. Conca Rance Batchelor
C. Deledio Foley Grigg
HF. Martin Griffiths Vickery
F. Nahas Riewoldt S Edwards
R. Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int. A Edwards Vlaustin Houli Ellis
Depth left out of 22 IMHO, Dea, Astbury,McGuane,O'Hanlon, Jackson,King,Knights, Helbig,McIntosh, McBean, McDonough,White,Derickx,Elton,Arnot,Darrou,Verrier plus 2 PSD. I left out Newman, I just could not fit him in across half fwd which I think is where he should be played. Let the back 6-8 settle, Newman long term will not be a part of any success the team may have if his position is the backline.
I can finally see some depth in our side and the number of cloggers at this point in time is at its lowest for a long long time. We finally look like getting somewhere with our list although we need a few kids to come on and some more recruits to be picked up. :thumbsup
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Vlaustin wouldn't get a gig over Newman Tucker. I also can't imagine King being excluded either while he still exemplifies the coaches style of play. Knights too would be unlucky to miss out after just being convinced to come over from Adelaide. I'm thinking Ellis would make way for him unless a spot is created through injury.
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Vlaustin wouldn't get a gig over Newman Tucker.
I've done my preferred 22 and I can't fit Newie in. Wishingful thinking though probably.
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Vlaustin wouldn't get a gig over Newman Tucker. I also can't imagine King being excluded either while he still exemplifies the coaches style of play. Knights too would be unlucky to miss out after just being convinced to come over from Adelaide. I'm thinking Ellis would make way for him unless a spot is created through injury.
Whilst the case for Newman, Knights, Vlaustin etc may be compelling what I truly love about this exercise is that 30 does not go into 22. It's called depth. Two years ago we were having discussions we can't play this guy he has no experience or he's past it or blah blah blah.
While you may be right in your logic I in mine cannot fit him in given we have 42 players available to pick our best 22 as per the criteria of this exercise and given the fact that Grimes and Foley come round 1 or for a few weeks after that may not be available.
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Vlaustin wouldn't get a gig over Newman Tucker.
I've done my preferred 22 and I can't fit Newie in. Wishingful thinking though probably.
im in the same boat. whatwill happen though is newman will play the yr out and he will be shown the respect a 200 plus game recent captain of the club deserves.
i think newmans role in the backline does need reviewing by the club.
my personal preference is to see morris go into the midfield as our tagger. id like to see helbig given a crack at morriss role down back and i definately prefer to see vlastuin to start his career of a hbf working his way into the middle.
i also would like to see conca go back to the hb line. lots of hb options with sml/med sized platers conca ellis vlastuin helbig imo, morris batchelor and if mcintosh is to be a running player definately mcintosh.
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Vlaustin wouldn't get a gig over Newman Tucker.
I've done my preferred 22 and I can't fit Newie in. Wishingful thinking though probably.
im in the same boat. whatwill happen though is newman will play the yr out and he will be shown the respect a 200 plus game recent captain of the club deserves.
i think newmans role in the backline does need reviewing by the club.
my personal preference is to see morris go into the midfield as our tagger. id like to see helbig given a crack at morriss role down back and i definately prefer to see vlastuin to start his career of a hbf working his way into the middle.
i also would like to see conca go back to the hb line. lots of hb options with sml/med sized platers conca ellis vlastuin helbig imo, morris batchelor and if mcintosh is to be a running player definately mcintosh.
Why fix what's not broken? Leave Morris he's been a defender his whole career why be fancy and try and change him. Its Mcintosh, Vickery, Astbury, Griffiths all over again :banghead :banghead
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:lol
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B Morris Chaplin Grimes
HB. Conca Rance Batchelor
C. Deledio Foley Grigg
HF. Martin Griffiths Vickery
F. Nahas Riewoldt S Edwards
R. Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int. A Edwards Vlaustin Houli Ellis
Depth left out of 22 IMHO, Dea, Astbury,McGuane,O'Hanlon, Jackson,King,Knights, Helbig,McIntosh, McBean, McDonough,White,Derickx,Elton,Arnot,Darrou,Verrier plus 2 PSD. I left out Newman, I just could not fit him in across half fwd which I think is where he should be played. Let the back 6-8 settle, Newman long term will not be a part of any success the team may have if his position is the backline.
I can finally see some depth in our side and the number of cloggers at this point in time is at its lowest for a long long time. We finally look like getting somewhere with our list although we need a few kids to come on and some more recruits to be picked up. :thumbsup
That's a quality centre line and on ball division :clapping
Just quietly, there is probably 200+ goals each season in that forward line if Griffiths can get going.
You only need the mids to kick another 4-5 goals and there's 15 goals per game.
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B: Morris Grimes Rance
I truly believe Morris has the chance to be a premier lock down defensive player on opposition smalls if he isn't already. Grimes and Rance really will float between holding down full back/ third tall option depending on the team. I truly believe that Troy Chaplin will allow both to play more flexible and enable them both to attack more.
HB: Batchelor Chaplin Houli
Chaplin obvisouly will take the monster CHF types. Batchleor has long been recognized as one of the best readers of the ball in flight, being a floating 4th tall who can also counter punch and play off the wing with good footskills gives him the nod for me. Houli/ Newman for mine off the back line for that running break the lines sort of back flanker.
C: Newman Deledio Grigg
Griggs ability to find space we all know about. Deledio was an All Australian last year so obviously he needs to be in there. The difficulty I think is whether you play Newman or Conca here. Of the few times that Newman played on the wing last year and wasn't tagged, he looked very damaging. It also gives the backline the floating 7th defender which was played quite well by Conca I thought at the beginning of last year.
HF. Martin Vickery Knights
Entry inside forward 50 is a big weakness of last season. Having Martin and Knights with booming kicks who can hit a target is a massive requirement going forward. I thought that Nahas and King were asked to many times last year to be leading marking targets 60-80 meters out last year. Knights and Martin give solid marking targets as well as play makers to enter the ball into the forward 50. Vickery is more of a classic CHF at the moment than a third tall. Go back two seasons when Jack and Ty were the two highest combined goal kicking partnership for all teams and it reminds of how important Ty is to the team.
F. A Edwards Riewoldt S Edwards
Riewoldt for obvious reasons. I picked Shane Edwards ahead of King and Nahas because I think he's better in the air, and a little more opportunistic on the ground. I personally think the forward pocket/s are the two most competitive positions on the ground with whom you can slot in there. I went with Aaron Edwards over Astbury or Griffiths because I think he is a better leading mark. One thing I think that RFC can improve on going forward is not creating congestion in the air. Vickery is handy on the lead, and A Edwards is very good, creating space in the forward 50 and allow firstly Jack more room at the footy, but also more opportunities in front of goal.
R. Maric Tuck Cotchin
Pretty self explanatory one would think.
Int. Ellis Foley Conca SUB: King
Really where it gets interesting. Foley at 100% is a must as most people would probably agree with. I think that Ellis may be groomed as a tagging option to replace Jackson because of his tank as well as being a big body. Conca being an inside/ outside mid who did quite well I thought being a floating 7th defender at the end of last season. Most people have said over multiple boards, he is primed for a breakout year is Conca. King I just cannot leave out. Barometer for the team sort of guy, hard at the footy, competitive, guy people can rally around. I doubt he will be the sub at any stage of the 2013 season but cannot leave him out.
Depth: Jackson, Astbury, Griffiths, Vlaustin, Nahas, Helbig, Dea, Arnot
This is what I am most excited about, our depth. Its starting to get a compination of potentially gun players (Elton, Vlaustin, Griffiths etc.) with a good spread of midfielders, and key position players. Guys like Nahas, Jackson and White add experience whilst not being potentially gun players. Depth creates competition. Compeitition initiates improvement. Griffiths and Astbury battling for title of 3rd tall or 3rd back should an injury strike. Arnot, Jackson, Vlaustin (who will probably find his way into the best 22 at some stage if not already) and Arnot competiting for a role in the guts going forward as well.
Thats my hap-hazard thoughts on the best 22. It's extremely hard to pick, which is never a bad thing.
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Cause Morris is a huge upgrade on Jackson.
Vlaustin wouldn't get a gig over Newman Tucker.
I've done my preferred 22 and I can't fit Newie in. Wishingful thinking though probably.
im in the same boat. whatwill happen though is newman will play the yr out and he will be shown the respect a 200 plus game recent captain of the club deserves.
i think newmans role in the backline does need reviewing by the club.
my personal preference is to see morris go into the midfield as our tagger. id like to see helbig given a crack at morriss role down back and i definately prefer to see vlastuin to start his career of a hbf working his way into the middle.
i also would like to see conca go back to the hb line. lots of hb options with sml/med sized platers conca ellis vlastuin helbig imo, morris batchelor and if mcintosh is to be a running player definately mcintosh.
Why fix what's not broken? Leave Morris he's been a defender his whole career why be fancy and try and change him. Its Mcintosh, Vickery, Astbury, Griffiths all over again :banghead :banghead
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Morris is the best lockdown small defender this club has had in too stuffing long and people want to move him out of there after 20 games... FFS...
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If u were coaching with Richmond, would u rather Jackson or Morris in there?
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If u were coaching with Richmond, would u rather Jackson or Morris in there?
Jackson.....
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If u were coaching with Richmond, would u rather Jackson or Morris in there?
*coaching against Richmond
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If u were coaching with Richmond, would u rather Jackson or Morris in there?
Morris so then one of my hack small fwds would kick a lazy bag of 5-6 bc there'd be no-one to stop him ::)
Jackson can be replaced in midfield much more readily than Morris in our backline
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Vlastuin. Helbig. Deaa would slot inti morris' spot, allowing Morris to move into the guts
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Vlastuin. Helbig. Deaa would slot inti morris' spot, allowing Morris to move into the guts
As easy as that hey? 20 odd yrs we haven't been able to find a lockdown small defender that can do a number on the small fwds and all of a sudden we have 3 replacements that can just slot straight into the role ;D
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even the most experienced of the trio, Dea has a long way to go to catch up to morris. At this point only in courage could he be compared to Morris Helbig hasnt played a lot of footy at any level in recent times and hasnt shown a great deal when he has, and Vlastuin has had no more than a dozen training sessions at AFL level
It would be asking a lot for any of them to step up and replace morris next year and If I was an opposition coach I'd much rather any of them taking my best small/mid forward than Morris.
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Vlastuin. Helbig. Deaa would slot inti morris' spot, allowing Morris to move into the guts
would rather slot newman into the guts
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I rekon Helbig could slot into the tagging midfielder role easier than lockdown defender and then that leaves Morris where he is and where he does a damn good job
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Vlaustin wouldn't get a gig over Newman Tucker.
I've done my preferred 22 and I can't fit Newie in. Wishingful thinking though probably.
im in the same boat. whatwill happen though is newman will play the yr out and he will be shown the respect a 200 plus game recent captain of the club deserves.
i think newmans role in the backline does need reviewing by the club.
my personal preference is to see morris go into the midfield as our tagger. id like to see helbig given a crack at morriss role down back and i definately prefer to see vlastuin to start his career of a hbf working his way into the middle.
i also would like to see conca go back to the hb line. lots of hb options with sml/med sized platers conca ellis vlastuin helbig imo, morris batchelor and if mcintosh is to be a running player definately mcintosh.
Why fix what's not broken? Leave Morris he's been a defender his whole career why be fancy and try and change him. Its Mcintosh, Vickery, Astbury, Griffiths all over again :banghead :banghead
;D
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Vlaustin wouldn't get a gig over Newman Tucker.
I've done my preferred 22 and I can't fit Newie in. Wishingful thinking though probably.
im in the same boat. whatwill happen though is newman will play the yr out and he will be shown the respect a 200 plus game recent captain of the club deserves.
i think newmans role in the backline does need reviewing by the club.
my personal preference is to see morris go into the midfield as our tagger. id like to see helbig given a crack at morriss role down back and i definately prefer to see vlastuin to start his career of a hbf working his way into the middle.
i also would like to see conca go back to the hb line. lots of hb options with sml/med sized platers conca ellis vlastuin helbig imo, morris batchelor and if mcintosh is to be a running player definately mcintosh.
Why fix what's not broken? Leave Morris he's been a defender his whole career why be fancy and try and change him. Its Mcintosh, Vickery, Astbury, Griffiths all over again :banghead :banghead
touche .
how about in the pre season we try helbig in morris role and we play morris in the midfield as a tagger. if it fails of course we revert back to what has worked. if it works we add a string to morris bow and we add a hard at it defensive stopper to the backline. we create options.
the main reason i want to do this is because i believe helbig could do just as well as morris as a lock down medium defender.
morris imo has all the tools to lock down on any player anywhere on the ground mid forward back. besides id trade my own mother in to see the back of jackson and morris in the midfield would do that.
for the last 30 yrs we have not just been looking for a lock down sml/med defender but a bloody decent midfield tagger as well.
oh comparing running players to talls well its just a bit different dont you think. we can play morris down back depending on matchups that would be his role we can play helbig midfield but lets also develop him down back.
we have one player on the list of morris ilk anything that may help us uncover another like him is okay by me. its more about finding out if helbig can do his role. what the hell do we do if morris does an acl.
with our talls we have singlemindedly played them out of positionand tried to turn them into something they are not its okay to try something but when it doesnt work.
you trying to tell me morris can shut down a player in the forward line but cant do the exact same role elsewhere. i disagree im happy to try and im happy to move him if a player like helbig can do his role well.
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Vlaustin wouldn't get a gig over Newman Tucker.
I've done my preferred 22 and I can't fit Newie in. Wishingful thinking though probably.
im in the same boat. whatwill happen though is newman will play the yr out and he will be shown the respect a 200 plus game recent captain of the club deserves.
i think newmans role in the backline does need reviewing by the club.
my personal preference is to see morris go into the midfield as our tagger. id like to see helbig given a crack at morriss role down back and i definately prefer to see vlastuin to start his career of a hbf working his way into the middle.
i also would like to see conca go back to the hb line. lots of hb options with sml/med sized platers conca ellis vlastuin helbig imo, morris batchelor and if mcintosh is to be a running player definately mcintosh.
Why fix what's not broken? Leave Morris he's been a defender his whole career why be fancy and try and change him. Its Mcintosh, Vickery, Astbury, Griffiths all over again :banghead :banghead
touche .
how about in the pre season we try helbig in morris role and we play morris in the midfield as a tagger. if it fails of course we revert back to what has worked. if it works we add a string to morris bow and we add a hard at it defensive stopper to the backline. we create options.
the main reason i want to do this is because i believe helbig could do just as well as morris as a lock down medium defender.
morris imo has all the tools to lock down on any player anywhere on the ground mid forward back. besides id trade my own mother in to see the back of jackson and morris in the midfield would do that.
for the last 30 yrs we have not just been looking for a lock down sml/med defender but a bloody decent midfield tagger as well.
oh comparing running players to talls well its just a bit different dont you think. we can play morris down back depending on matchups that would be his role we can play helbig midfield but lets also develop him down back.
we have one player on the list of morris ilk anything that may help us uncover another like him is okay by me. its more about finding out if helbig can do his role. what the hell do we do if morris does an acl.
with our talls we have singlemindedly played them out of positionand tried to turn them into something they are not its okay to try something but when it doesnt work.
you trying to tell me morris can shut down a player in the forward line but cant do the exact same role elsewhere. i disagree im happy to try and im happy to move him if a player like helbig can do his role well.
I can't take your argument seriously after the stuff you've said about McIntosh.
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Our best 22 now?
Considering the Richmond injury list: Foley, Grimes, King, Chaplin, Knights, Maric, Riewoldt, Deledio, Helbig.
Griffiths Rance Houli
Morris Astbury Batchelor
Ellis Tuck Grigg
Martin McGuane Edwards A
Nahas Elton Derickx
Vickery Cotchin Edwards S
Jackson, Conca, Newman, White
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Our best 22 now?
Considering the Richmond injury list: Foley, Grimes, King, Chaplin, Knights, Maric, Riewoldt, Deledio, Helbig.
Griffiths Rance Houli
Morris Astbury Batchelor
Ellis Tuck Grigg
Martin McGuane Edwards A
Nahas Elton Derickx
Vickery Cotchin Edwards S
Jackson, Conca, Newman, White
Realistically the team probably will look like that at some stages throughout the year. That team is called the 'Depth Team' and looks ordinary in comparison. Most of the Injury list besides Helbig and possibly Knights at this stage, are first choice players so lets hope they all come good for round one. :pray
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Our best 22 now?
Considering the Richmond injury list: Foley, Grimes, King, Chaplin, Knights, Maric, Riewoldt, Deledio, Helbig.
Griffiths Rance Houli
Morris Astbury Batchelor
Ellis Tuck Grigg
Martin McGuane Edwards A
Nahas Elton Derickx
Vickery Cotchin Edwards S
Jackson, Conca, Newman, White
Grimes appears to be the only definite long-term query at this stage. So Griffs will need to remain in defence. Foley is probably the next one in doubt as to whether his achilles can hold up. So at the moment I think our best 22 in the Club's eyes is:
,
B: Rance Chaplin Morris
HB: Houli Griffiths Batchelor
C: Grigg Deledio Conca
HF: S.Edwards Riewoldt Knights
F: Vickery A.Edwards Martin
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Ellis, Newman, Jackson
Sub: Vlastuin
I wouldn't have Jacko and Aaron Edwards in the side but the coaches love Jacko and I've got a feeling, as they did with Miller, the Club will play Edwards to begin with until his form drops away and one of the young talls pushes him out.
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Vlaustin wouldn't get a gig over Newman Tucker.
I've done my preferred 22 and I can't fit Newie in. Wishingful thinking though probably.
im in the same boat. whatwill happen though is newman will play the yr out and he will be shown the respect a 200 plus game recent captain of the club deserves.
i think newmans role in the backline does need reviewing by the club.
my personal preference is to see morris go into the midfield as our tagger. id like to see helbig given a crack at morriss role down back and i definately prefer to see vlastuin to start his career of a hbf working his way into the middle.
i also would like to see conca go back to the hb line. lots of hb options with sml/med sized platers conca ellis vlastuin helbig imo, morris batchelor and if mcintosh is to be a running player definately mcintosh.
Why fix what's not broken? Leave Morris he's been a defender his whole career why be fancy and try and change him. Its Mcintosh, Vickery, Astbury, Griffiths all over again :banghead :banghead
touche .
how about in the pre season we try helbig in morris role and we play morris in the midfield as a tagger. if it fails of course we revert back to what has worked. if it works we add a string to morris bow and we add a hard at it defensive stopper to the backline. we create options.
the main reason i want to do this is because i believe helbig could do just as well as morris as a lock down medium defender.
morris imo has all the tools to lock down on any player anywhere on the ground mid forward back. besides id trade my own mother in to see the back of jackson and morris in the midfield would do that.
for the last 30 yrs we have not just been looking for a lock down sml/med defender but a bloody decent midfield tagger as well.
oh comparing running players to talls well its just a bit different dont you think. we can play morris down back depending on matchups that would be his role we can play helbig midfield but lets also develop him down back.
we have one player on the list of morris ilk anything that may help us uncover another like him is okay by me. its more about finding out if helbig can do his role. what the hell do we do if morris does an acl.
with our talls we have singlemindedly played them out of positionand tried to turn them into something they are not its okay to try something but when it doesnt work.
you trying to tell me morris can shut down a player in the forward line but cant do the exact same role elsewhere. i disagree im happy to try and im happy to move him if a player like helbig can do his role well.
I can't take your argument seriously after the stuff you've said about McIntosh.
to be honest i really dont care either way. i have an opinion on a tagger yes morris is a tagger i happen to think he can tag in the midfield as well.we have a dumb arse hack in jackson who manages to tag okay at times matt white is as poor as they come yet hes done resonable at times with the tag role all im saying is we have a bloke who is already a run with player does a good job i can see no reason why he cant perform that role on a mid.
mcintosh is a 192 cm tall defender whos played his whole career in defense.
we openly state we are after mids and then try and tell everyone we took one in mcintoish because peel gave him a few games on the wing.
if you cant tell the difference well whats the point as i said i dont care either way what you think. your entitled to your opinion.
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to be honest i really dont care either way. i have an opinion on a tagger yes morris is a tagger i happen to think he can tag in the midfield as well.we have a dumb arse hack in jackson who manages to tag okay at times matt white is as poor as they come yet hes done resonable at times with the tag role all im saying is we have a bloke who is already a run with player does a good job i can see no reason why he cant perform that role on a mid.
mcintosh is a 192 cm tall defender whos played his whole career in defense.
we openly state we are after mids and then try and tell everyone we took one in mcintoish because peel gave him a few games on the wing.
if you cant tell the difference well whats the point as i said i dont care either way what you think. your entitled to your opinion.
Actually McIntosh played his juniors as a forward. Why don't you want to try Helbig in the taggers role? Instead of swapping 2 players around and possibly screwing us over in two positions, leave Morris where he had a very good year and let Helbig make his own position.
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ROUND ONE
B Grimes, Chaplin, Griffiths
HB Morris, Vlas, Rance
C Cothcin Lids, Conca
HF Martin, Knights, Nahas
FF Vickery, Riewoldt, S. Edwards
R Jackson, A. Edwards, Foley Ivan Maric
Int: Ellis, Newman, Batch Sub: King
NAB
I wanna see
Elton Arnot, Mctosh and Bean and if we get Toy as wellm
Also play griffiths in full forward and see how he gose
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Grimes appears to be the only definite long-term query at this stage. So Griffs will need to remain in defence. Foley is probably the next one in doubt as to whether his achilles can hold up. So at the moment I think our best 22 in the Club's eyes is:
,
B: Rance Chaplin Morris
HB: Houli Griffiths Batchelor
C: Grigg Deledio Conca
HF: S.Edwards Riewoldt Knights
F: Vickery A.Edwards Martin
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Ellis, Newman, Jackson
Sub: Vlastuin
I wouldn't have Jacko and Aaron Edwards in the side but the coaches love Jacko and I've got a feeling, as they did with Miller, the Club will play Edwards to begin with until his form drops away and one of the young talls pushes him out.
That I do beleive is the team that will run out unless there are futher injuries. I personally want Griffith to be a foward but I agree he will have to stay back for now until sombody steps up. I would also like sombody to step up and take Jacksons and S.Edwards spot, that would make it a very good team IMHO.
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Grimes appears to be the only definite long-term query at this stage. So Griffs will need to remain in defence. Foley is probably the next one in doubt as to whether his achilles can hold up. So at the moment I think our best 22 in the Club's eyes is:
,
B: Rance Chaplin Morris
HB: Houli Griffiths Batchelor
C: Grigg Deledio Conca
HF: S.Edwards Riewoldt Knights
F: Vickery A.Edwards Martin
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Ellis, Newman, Jackson
Sub: Vlastuin
I wouldn't have Jacko and Aaron Edwards in the side but the coaches love Jacko and I've got a feeling, as they did with Miller, the Club will play Edwards to begin with until his form drops away and one of the young talls pushes him out.
That I do beleive is the team that will run out unless there are futher injuries. I personally want Griffith to be a foward but I agree he will have to stay back for now until sombody steps up. I would also like sombody to step up and take Jacksons and S.Edwards spot, that would make it a very good team IMHO.
Riewoldt can't play CHF
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Tigger at CHB???
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Tigger at CHB???
yeh i have been thinking about that and trying ask is he the BEST option at CHB
people for that spot
Houli
Griffiths
Ellis
astbury
batch (but i think he will play on teh wing )
Morris
Tigger
All are in compition for that those spost and its a problem we havent ahd in years .. its GREAT :scream
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Tigger at CHB???
I think having 5 people at the centre bounce is a genius move, so I back Bird Man with his idea of playing someone probably 10cm shorter on the CHF, it may just work.
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Grimes appears to be the only definite long-term query at this stage. So Griffs will need to remain in defence. Foley is probably the next one in doubt as to whether his achilles can hold up. So at the moment I think our best 22 in the Club's eyes is:
,
B: Rance Chaplin Morris
HB: Houli Griffiths Batchelor
C: Grigg Deledio Conca
HF: S.Edwards Riewoldt Knights
F: Vickery A.Edwards Martin
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Ellis, Newman, Jackson
Sub: Vlastuin
I wouldn't have Jacko and Aaron Edwards in the side but the coaches love Jacko and I've got a feeling, as they did with Miller, the Club will play Edwards to begin with until his form drops away and one of the young talls pushes him out.
That I do beleive is the team that will run out unless there are futher injuries. I personally want Griffith to be a foward but I agree he will have to stay back for now until sombody steps up. I would also like sombody to step up and take Jacksons and S.Edwards spot, that would make it a very good team IMHO.
Riewoldt can't play CHF
Wont catch a Tiger with that sort of bait :P
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I highly doubt A "lockup" Edwards will play round 1.
If we have a great run without injuries I'd be very suprised if we will see him play at all.
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foley wont be in the side.
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Foley is in our best 10-12
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Foley is in our best 10-12
He'll play 5-12 games next year
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Foley is in our best 10-12
I don't believe that's his point
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torch's Best 22 ...
B: Morris, Chaplin, Newman
HB: Houli, Rance, Grimes
C: Grigg, Cotchin, Deledio
HF: Griffiths, Vickery, Knights
F: A.Edwards, Riewoldt, S.Edwards
R: Maric, Martin, Foley
I: Tuck, Conca, King
S: Nahas
What I like about Richmond NOW is that we have players that are fighting for positions.
Where do you fit: Jackson, Ellis, Batchelor, Astbury, White, McGuane, Vlastuin???
Dea, Derickx, Elton ... just to name a few are in that third group that are a long way from playing in our team.
Daniel Jackson will always be in Richmond's 22 as long as Hardwick is coach.
So who would come out of my team if that's the case???
No idea ...
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torch's Best 22 ...
B: Morris, Chaplin, Newman
HB: Houli, Rance, Grimes
C: Grigg, Cotchin, Deledio
HF: Griffiths, Vickery, Knights
F: A.Edwards, Riewoldt, S.Edwards
R: Maric, Martin, Foley
I: Tuck, Conca, King
S: Nahas
What I like about Richmond NOW is that we have players that are fighting for positions.
Where do you fit: Jackson, Ellis, Batchelor, Astbury, White, McGuane, Vlastuin???
Dea, Derickx, Elton ... just to name a few are in that third group that are a long way from playing in our team.
Daniel Jackson will always be in Richmond's 22 as long as Hardwick is coach.
So who would come out of my team if that's the case???
No idea ...
A Edwards
King
Nahas
Stiff on Nahas but cant fit everyone in. Id have Newman and Houli in the gun. You left out Helbig, hopefully he can give headaches to the selection panel. I have left out Jackson for discussion sake. :-\ Everyone drops back a spot if Jacko continues to get game without merit. I would argue this is not good for the long term development of some players on our list.
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torch's Best 22 ...
B: Morris, Chaplin, Newman
HB: Houli, Rance, Grimes
C: Grigg, Cotchin, Deledio
HF: Griffiths, Vickery, Knights
F: A.Edwards, Riewoldt, S.Edwards
R: Maric, Martin, Foley
I: Tuck, Conca, King
S: Nahas
So who would come out of my team if that's the case???
Sadly, I believe Foley won't be ready (or Grimes for that matter) so I would bring in Eliis. Batchelor in for Grimes (if he's still injured). I would like to see Nahas drop out of the team, Dea into the HB line and Houli the sub - just my take of course.
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Any changes now?!
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Any changes now?!
2013 changes, no more nominated rookies since you have the ability to expand senior list to 40 if you wish, isn't it? (To replace the previous two vet listed/nominated rookies). If so, none of the rookies will get a gig unless covering for a LTI listed player
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they should shorten the LTI list qualification down to a 4 week injury, that's a substantial lay-off these days, give the rookies more opportunity
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they should shorten the LTI list qualification down to a 4 week injury, that's a substantial lay-off these days, give the rookies more opportunity
If the AFLPA gets their way then lists will be expanded to 46 (I think) senior spots and completely abolish the rookie system. Reckon I agree. Any bloke on the team should be eligible for match selection.
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or they could do that
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Just watching this poo http://youtu.be/9LpMhcI7LYI and they mentioned that the 6 Collingwood rookies will be competing for the two nominated spots. So I must have got it wrong before, where I read that there will be no nominated rookies might have been from clubs who already have 40 on their list or something. If you only have 38 senior listed players do you get to nominated two rookies? And if you have 39 it would be one nomination?
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Just watching this poo http://youtu.be/9LpMhcI7LYI and they mentioned that the 6 Collingwood rookies will be competing for the two nominated spots. So I must have got it wrong before, where I read that there will be no nominated rookies might have been from clubs who already have 40 on their list or something. If you only have 38 senior listed players do you get to nominated two rookies? And if you have 39 it would be one nomination?
So how many do collinwood have on there primary list?
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Just watching this poo http://youtu.be/9LpMhcI7LYI and they mentioned that the 6 Collingwood rookies will be competing for the two nominated spots. So I must have got it wrong before, where I read that there will be no nominated rookies might have been from clubs who already have 40 on their list or something. If you only have 38 senior listed players do you get to nominated two rookies? And if you have 39 it would be one nomination?
So how many do collinwood have on there primary list?
They passed in the PSD and took 6 rookies, so I'm guessing 38? Without looking it up.
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Just watching this poo http://youtu.be/9LpMhcI7LYI and they mentioned that the 6 Collingwood rookies will be competing for the two nominated spots. So I must have got it wrong before, where I read that there will be no nominated rookies might have been from clubs who already have 40 on their list or something. If you only have 38 senior listed players do you get to nominated two rookies? And if you have 39 it would be one nomination?
So how many do collinwood have on there primary list?
They passed in the PSD and took 6 rookies, so I'm guessing 38? Without looking it up.
Noooooo Surely not! A club of Collingwoods caliber not filling the full 40 spots on the list!! God forbid....
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its a head stuff.
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Noooooo Surely not! A club of Collingwoods caliber not filling the full 40 spots on the list!! God forbid....
:lol
See, that's where you don't get it TFT. Collingwood are smart, the Hawking's of the competition if you will. If they only have 38 then that's what all clubs need to emulate because if Collingwood do it then others must follow. The reason for doing it will not be obvious yet to all the other 'mortal' clubs but you can rest assured there is a very good and smart tactical reason that will leave the opposition clubs breathless and gasping in their wake yet again when their cunning plan is revealed. One thing you can be 110% safe on though - it will have absolutely and categorically nothing to do with the fact they have no room in their salary cap. No-one is as smart as Collingwood. ::)
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Noooooo Surely not! A club of Collingwoods caliber not filling the full 40 spots on the list!! God forbid....
:lol
See, that's where you don't get it TFT. Collingwood are smart, the Hawking's of the competition if you will. If they only have 38 then that's what all clubs need to emulate because if Collingwood do it then others must follow. The reason for doing it will not be obvious yet to all the other 'mortal' clubs but you can rest assured there is a very good and smart tactical reason that will leave the opposition clubs breathless and gasping in their wake yet again when their cunning plan is revealed. One thing you can be 110% safe on though - it will have absolutely and categorically nothing to do with the fact they have no room in their salary cap. No-one is as smart as Collingwood. ::)
This one must have been posted as soon as the toast popped up :lol
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how does toast pop up when you use a coathanger :huh
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how does toast pop up when you use a coathanger :huh
Did that once.
Only once.
:help
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Thoughts after NAB 1?
Mine assuming Chaplin and King will be available either in next week or two while Foley and Grimes will miss the early rounds.
B: Morris Rance Batchelor
HB: Houli Chaplin Petterd
C: Newman Martin Ellis
HF: Knights Riewoldt Deledio
F: S.Edwards Vickery King
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Grigg, Conca and one of Griffiths/Astbury as another tall.
Sub: Vlastuin
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Thoughts after NAB 1?
Mine assuming Chaplin and King will be available either in next week or two while Foley and Grimes will miss the early rounds.
B: Morris Rance Batchelor
HB: Houli Chaplin Petterd
C: Newman Martin Ellis
HF: Knights Riewoldt Deledio
F: S.Edwards Vickery King
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Grigg, Conca and one of Griffiths/Astbury as another tall.
Sub: Vlastuin
I read that Grimes would hopefully be right for week 3 of NAB Cup, so he'd be a round 1 starter.
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I read that Grimes would hopefully be right for week 3 of NAB Cup, so he'd be a round 1 starter.
Great news if true Danog.
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What if everyone fit?
Ie. Round 10.
Hypothetical
Thoughts after NAB 1?
Mine assuming Chaplin and King will be available either in next week or two while Foley and Grimes will miss the early rounds.
B: Morris Rance Batchelor
HB: Houli Chaplin Petterd
C: Newman Martin Ellis
HF: Knights Riewoldt Deledio
F: S.Edwards Vickery King
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Grigg, Conca and one of Griffiths/Astbury as another tall.
Sub: Vlastuin
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What if everyone fit?
Ie. Round 10.
Hypothetical
That's the thing with say Foley. We don't know when he'll return. So I've stuck to those we know will be available in round 1.
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We may only be 2 or 3 a grade players away from being a very very decent side indeed. Next national draft is massive for us.
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What if everyone fit?
Ie. Round 10.
Hypothetical
That's the thing with say Foley. We don't know when he'll return. So I've stuck to those we know will be available in round 1.
Infidel
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We may only be 2 or 3 a grade players away from being a very very decent side indeed. Next national draft is massive for us.
Having arguably the 3 worst players in the AFL still on our list and getting regular games... :nope
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This year I just hope that Jackson, McGuane and Nahas are well and truly pushed out of the side plus White and Derickx never given the opportunity to come in.
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best 22 to 25 for me is based on potential and the need to continue to develop because we dont have all the pieces in place. performance over a sustained period. the need for good structure and experience. the 25 front runners for me.
b/ morris 185/83/ 21games/ 24yo - chaplin 195/100/ 140games/27yo - grimes 193/88/ 17games/21yo.
hb/ batchelor 188/87/ 30 games/21yo - rance 194/96/ 66games/23yo - helbig 185/85/15games/21yo ellis/houli plus other options. reckon one hbf can be used to develop players.long term mcintosh as a tall running player.
c/ grigg 190/85/86games/24yo - tuck 189/92/162games/31yo - deledio 188/88/172games/25yo
hf/ martin 187/89/63games/22yo - griffiths 200/104/18games/21yo - s edwards 182/83/109games/24yo
f/ vickery 200/97/ 54games/22yo - riewoldt 195/94/112games/24yo - king 178/82/87games/29yo. atm hes there for his defensive qualities, pace and experience.
r/ maric 200/102/98games/27yo - cotchin 185/85/86games/22yo - foley 178/79/120games/ 27yo
int/ newman 183/81/214games/30yo - conca 185/83/35games/20yo - vlastuin 187/86/0 games/19yo - ellis 181/81/21games/19yo
emg/ houli 180/84/70games/24yo - knights 184/84//96games/26yo these two in fact the last 6 mentioned could feasably be in the starting 18. the experience of these two probably will see them get games in front of some mentioned.
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Not bad but the back half of that side looks too slow to me clawsy.
B: Morris Chaplin Grimes
HB: Houli Rance Ellis
C: Deledio Tuck Grigg
HF: Martin Vickery Conca
F: King Riewoldt SEdwards
R: I Maric Cotchin Foley
IC: Petterd Newman Griffiths S: Vlastuin
Em: Nahas Batchelor Astbury
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People keep ignoring the fact that Griff is now a CHB and IMO a potentially great one.
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Griff.
Rance
Chaplin
Grimes
Is a tall back line..
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Might have missed somebody but my 22 would be something like this
Grimes Chaplin Morris
Pettard Rance Newman
Houli Deledio Ellis
Grigg Vickery Conca
King Riewoldt Edwards
Maric Martin Cotchin
Batchelor Griffiths Tuck & Vlastuin
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People keep ignoring the fact that Griff is now a CHB and IMO a potentially great one.
the griff myth keeps on being perpetuated. when will people start rating him on performance and not potential.
he may play chb but he sure hasnt done anything back there to show he is one.i still firmly believe he should have been developed as a genuine ff.
chaplin - rance - grimes - mcintosh - astbury and the rookie darrou are all key backs. or do we ignore the fact the club is developing them there.
in the mean time we have just jack at ff and imo can and should play chf , elton who is not ready to play chf and vickery who is over rated and being asked to perform laughably both the chf role and 2nd ruck role.
just 3 tall forwards being played as forwards and we do nothing to alleviate and fix this problem. the obvious fix to both the second ruck and chf problem is play vickery as a genuine resting ruckman forward and bring in a bloke who has every single attribute imaginable to play ff thus when ivan has a deserved rest vickery rucks and we keep our structure at all times.
surely this is preferable to playing luke mcguane as a third tall.
the club has regularly got it wrong when it comes to developing talls they continue to stuff it up.
riewoldt was a chf and has become a lazy ff.albeit a good one.
post was a chb and was never ever allowed to settle in one position. we the club imo contributed greatly to his demise. he was literally pulled from pillar to post.
griffiths was touted as the next plugger thats how impressive as a ff he was. yet we refuse to play him forward because he struggled in his early yrs with injury. and need again over rides proper development.
astbury was a very good hit up chf and he played some reasonable games in his first yr as a forward and has never been seen there since. geez a hit up chf.
mcguane was actually a forward but in their wisdom turned him into a very poor defender. hes just ordinary anyway.
rance was a running hb when we drafted him but in their wisdom they plonked him on the last line of defense where his lack of judgment in the air is regularly found wanting.
vickery was the most promising young ruckman behind only natanui yet we hardly play him in the ruck and try to turn him into a chf. placing enormous pressure on maric foregoing a second ruckman and key forward when he actually does go in to the ruck.
they have allowed poor development or attempted to develop talls out of position because of poor list management and a dire need to play em out of position. seems they are continually hedging their bets with just about every young tall they take.
ya know if they look like a key forward act like a key forward have the attributes of a key forward and play like a key forward they likely are a key forward ditto for the backs. yet we constantly refuse to look at the obvious and try to turn em into something they arent.
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i dont think we have traditional field positions anymore we have team structure. i know some still get hung up on chf or ff or chb but seriously they dont exist as they did in the past...
What i see on the field is we generally play a 7 man defence and a 5 man forward structure with the rest up around the middle.
so with no injuries:
Our defenders Morris, Rance, Griffiths, Houli, Grimes, Chaplin and one of Batchelor or Petterd
forwards Jack, Vickery, Jake and McGuane???need this spot fixed and Edwards
Mids Conca, Tuck, Cotch, Delideo, Grigg, Ellis, Vlastuin, Foley, Martin
Ruck Maric
The backs look tall but as you know the midfielders all run forward and back so its a nil argument. Grimes and Rance are both very mobile as well.
So what i see is glaring is that 3rd tall forward spot that does the blocking to clear paths for Jack and Vickery. The names getting thrown around arent able to fill this spot so IMO that makes it difficult for those players to be placed forward.
Griffiths is almost definitely now a backman, his kick ins are such an asset to the team, probably more than what he offers forward and he was a huge reason we beat Hawthorn
The interesting thing i see is Chaplin and Grimes because both play a similar style
We'll see oue mids go forward again and Martin and Cotch will kick plenty of goals.
We have some serious depth now so players will come in and out of form and be in and out of the team.
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i dont think we have traditional field positions anymore we have team structure. i know some still get hung up on chf or ff or chb but seriously they dont exist as they did in the past...
They don't what the flood started the full press finished and traditional positions are a thing of the past
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Griff.
Rance
Chaplin
Grimes
Is a tall back line..
You're right. But Grimes and to a lesser degree Rance can play Small.
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People keep ignoring the fact that Griff is now a CHB and IMO a potentially great one.
the griff myth keeps on being perpetuated. when will people start rating him on performance and not potential.
he may play chb but he sure hasnt done anything back there to show he is one.i still firmly believe he should have been developed as a genuine ff.
chaplin - rance - grimes - mcintosh - astbury and the rookie darrou are all key backs. or do we ignore the fact the club is developing them there.
in the mean time we have just jack at ff and imo can and should play chf , elton who is not ready to play chf and vickery who is over rated and being asked to perform laughably both the chf role and 2nd ruck role.
just 3 tall forwards being played as forwards and we do nothing to alleviate and fix this problem. the obvious fix to both the second ruck and chf problem is play vickery as a genuine resting ruckman forward and bring in a bloke who has every single attribute imaginable to play ff thus when ivan has a deserved rest vickery rucks and we keep our structure at all times.
surely this is preferable to playing luke mcguane as a third tall.
the club has regularly got it wrong when it comes to developing talls they continue to stuff it up.
riewoldt was a chf and has become a lazy ff.albeit a good one.
post was a chb and was never ever allowed to settle in one position. we the club imo contributed greatly to his demise. he was literally pulled from pillar to post.
griffiths was touted as the next plugger thats how impressive as a ff he was. yet we refuse to play him forward because he struggled in his early yrs with injury. and need again over rides proper development.
astbury was a very good hit up chf and he played some reasonable games in his first yr as a forward and has never been seen there since. geez a hit up chf.
mcguane was actually a forward but in their wisdom turned him into a very poor defender. hes just ordinary anyway.
rance was a running hb when we drafted him but in their wisdom they plonked him on the last line of defense where his lack of judgment in the air is regularly found wanting.
vickery was the most promising young ruckman behind only natanui yet we hardly play him in the ruck and try to turn him into a chf. placing enormous pressure on maric foregoing a second ruckman and key forward when he actually does go in to the ruck.
they have allowed poor development or attempted to develop talls out of position because of poor list management and a dire need to play em out of position. seems they are continually hedging their bets with just about every young tall they take.
ya know if they look like a key forward act like a key forward have the attributes of a key forward and play like a key forward they likely are a key forward ditto for the backs. yet we constantly refuse to look at the obvious and try to turn em into something they arent.
Um, do we follow the way the club develops someone or not? Can't have it both ways
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People keep ignoring the fact that Griff is now a CHB and IMO a potentially great one.
the griff myth keeps on being perpetuated. when will people start rating him on performance and not potential.
he may play chb but he sure hasnt done anything back there to show he is one.i still firmly believe he should have been developed as a genuine ff.
chaplin - rance - grimes - mcintosh - astbury and the rookie darrou are all key backs. or do we ignore the fact the club is developing them there.
in the mean time we have just jack at ff and imo can and should play chf , elton who is not ready to play chf and vickery who is over rated and being asked to perform laughably both the chf role and 2nd ruck role.
just 3 tall forwards being played as forwards and we do nothing to alleviate and fix this problem. the obvious fix to both the second ruck and chf problem is play vickery as a genuine resting ruckman forward and bring in a bloke who has every single attribute imaginable to play ff thus when ivan has a deserved rest vickery rucks and we keep our structure at all times.
surely this is preferable to playing luke mcguane as a third tall.
the club has regularly got it wrong when it comes to developing talls they continue to stuff it up.
riewoldt was a chf and has become a lazy ff.albeit a good one.
post was a chb and was never ever allowed to settle in one position. we the club imo contributed greatly to his demise. he was literally pulled from pillar to post.
griffiths was touted as the next plugger thats how impressive as a ff he was. yet we refuse to play him forward because he struggled in his early yrs with injury. and need again over rides proper development.
astbury was a very good hit up chf and he played some reasonable games in his first yr as a forward and has never been seen there since. geez a hit up chf.
mcguane was actually a forward but in their wisdom turned him into a very poor defender. hes just ordinary anyway.
rance was a running hb when we drafted him but in their wisdom they plonked him on the last line of defense where his lack of judgment in the air is regularly found wanting.
vickery was the most promising young ruckman behind only natanui yet we hardly play him in the ruck and try to turn him into a chf. placing enormous pressure on maric foregoing a second ruckman and key forward when he actually does go in to the ruck.
they have allowed poor development or attempted to develop talls out of position because of poor list management and a dire need to play em out of position. seems they are continually hedging their bets with just about every young tall they take.
ya know if they look like a key forward act like a key forward have the attributes of a key forward and play like a key forward they likely are a key forward ditto for the backs. yet we constantly refuse to look at the obvious and try to turn em into something they arent.
Um, do we follow the way the club develops someone or not? Can't have it both ways
lol probably should have rephrased it but im sure you can get over being pedantic and get the gist of what was said.
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People keep ignoring the fact that Griff is now a CHB and IMO a potentially great one.
the griff myth keeps on being perpetuated. when will people start rating him on performance and not potential.
he may play chb but he sure hasnt done anything back there to show he is one.i still firmly believe he should have been developed as a genuine ff.
chaplin - rance - grimes - mcintosh - astbury and the rookie darrou are all key backs. or do we ignore the fact the club is developing them there.
Perhaps 'great' was a little over the top but he shows all the characteristics of a very good Key Back: height, size, closing speed, good spoiler and a mammoth kick. In time he will also start to take hangers. He would be wasted up forward imo and in the clubs opinion (you seem to ignore the fact that he also is being developed there ;)). In any case we already have 2 quality full-time talls down forward and that is enough. We need a 190/92 lead up forward, 2 crumbers and a resting mid or ruck depending on match ups.....imo.
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Hey claw, just going outside of your passion for list management etc. for a moment, did you see anything in any of the newbies on Friday night that tickled the tender bits?
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Pettard seems to have a spot.
Mcgaune wont be. Surely to Geez.
i dont think we have traditional field positions anymore we have team structure. i know some still get hung up on chf or ff or chb but seriously they dont exist as they did in the past...
What i see on the field is we generally play a 7 man defence and a 5 man forward structure with the rest up around the middle.
so with no injuries:
Our defenders Morris, Rance, Griffiths, Houli, Grimes, Chaplin and one of Batchelor or Petterd
forwards Jack, Vickery, Jake and McGuane???need this spot fixed and Edwards
Mids Conca, Tuck, Cotch, Delideo, Grigg, Ellis, Vlastuin, Foley, Martin
Ruck Maric
The backs look tall but as you know the midfielders all run forward and back so its a nil argument. Grimes and Rance are both very mobile as well.
So what i see is glaring is that 3rd tall forward spot that does the blocking to clear paths for Jack and Vickery. The names getting thrown around arent able to fill this spot so IMO that makes it difficult for those players to be placed forward.
Griffiths is almost definitely now a backman, his kick ins are such an asset to the team, probably more than what he offers forward and he was a huge reason we beat Hawthorn
The interesting thing i see is Chaplin and Grimes because both play a similar style
We'll see oue mids go forward again and Martin and Cotch will kick plenty of goals.
We have some serious depth now so players will come in and out of form and be in and out of the team.
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Mcgaune wont be. Surely to Geez.
Like him or not Bents, its hard to knock his first 2 outings so far this season. If he can produce that type of performance as a depth player when needed then we are a stronger side for it.
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yep,
until a kid (or mature player i suppose) can at least match him in performance for coburg he will probably stay
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Love him or loathe him he is another tall.
Goes better in the fwd line nowadays.
Merely a depth player but right now would have him in front of A Edwards.
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I've spoken to non Richmond fans - who have said his lack of skill this year had been a stand out to them
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My update after NAB 2:
B: Morris Rance Batchelor
HB: Houli Chaplin Petterd
C: Newman Martin Ellis
HF: Vlastuin Riewoldt Deledio
F: S.Edwards Vickery Knights
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Grigg, Conca and one of Astbury/Griffiths as another tall.
Sub: one of King/Nahas/Arnot
nb. Grimes would replace one of Astbury/Griffiths and Foley would replace one of King/Nahas/Arnot if they were fit to play in round 1.
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I like aarnot but he's a few spots back o would think.
What is helbig status?
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What is helbig status?
I've been wondering the same :huh
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Probably back this week according to Dimma
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My update after NAB 3:
B: Morris Rance Batchelor
HB: Houli Chaplin Petterd
C: Newman Martin Ellis
HF: Vlastuin Riewoldt Deledio
F: S.Edwards Vickery Knights
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Grigg, Conca, Griffiths
Sub: King
nb. Grimes would replace one of Griffiths/Batchelor and Foley would replace one of King/Knights if they were fit to play in round 1.
For round 1 though I've got a feeling Dimma will have Jacko as a tagger in instead of Knights.
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My update after NAB 3:
B: Morris Rance Batchelor
HB: Houli Chaplin Petterd
C: Newman Martin Ellis
HF: Vlastuin Riewoldt Deledio
F: S.Edwards Vickery Knights
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Grigg, Conca, Griffiths
Sub: King
nb. Grimes would replace one of Griffiths/Batchelor and Foley would replace one of King/Knights if they were fit to play in round 1.
For round 1 though I've got a feeling Dimma will have Jacko as a tagger in instead of Knights.
Strong squad there MT. Based purely on form, reckon you could almost argue White as an inclusion over Jackson or Knights. They all play slightly different games, but horses for courses, if we weren't required to hard tag anyone rather than just give a particular player a hard time at certain times, White's speed and carry would be really handy. Both White and Houli streaming through the guts and capitalising from midfield turnovers would really give some opposition teams headaches.
Is a poo ruck, but could even take a look at McGuane for Vickery. On form has earned it, and what I've liked about McGuane since the end of last season and this NAB Cup is his awareness of his limitations and not trying to fool anyone. At least he has a contest, clunks a few, kicks a few, and has even taken a few blokes on carrying the footy. Probably one of our more reliable set shots at the moment too :help Vickery has had plenty of time to recover from his injuries and has had heaps of minutes in the pre-season, so there isn't really any excuse for being soft and a plodder by Round 3.
With the three rounds over my major observations have been,
Pros:
VLASTUIN!
Petterd.
For the first time in yonks we have a really solid back line. Can lose a bloke or two and have viable backups. I really like Batchelor and always have, but like last year the same key areas may hold him back from being a lock. Still comfortable with him in the side though.
Midfield is elite. Today aside, inside and outside IMO we're match up for match up right there with the best sides.
Depth. Lonergan and A. Edwards and co. may not have been recruited as starting replacements, but at least we don't have blokes like Webberly to come in anymore.
Cons:
Forward line.
Forward 50 entry.
Still getting skittish when opposition teams come string and ramp up the pressure.
Vickery.
There are more, but these are just the most important ones I could pick out at the moment.
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Newman Rance Ellis
Houli Chaplin Petterd
Conca Martin Grigg
Vlastuin Riewoldt Deledio
S.Edwards Griffiths Nahas
Maric Tuck Cotchin
Knights McGuane Jackson White
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I wonder how many that had "lockup" in their best 22 would still have him in now.
...... What about it Claw?
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I reckon jackson, white and mcguane may all be considered for rd 1, don't know I agree with that but that's the feeling I get. White has shown a lot more than the other 2 but it just comes down to who is the best for each role and who can perform dual roles which is equally important ie: miidfield/fwd rotations and not be just making up the numbers
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Gerard Healy best 22 does not include
Conca
Pettard.
Bachelor.
Griffiths.
Jackson.
White
Dea
Etc
Does include mcgaune. Who I think Tony Shaw caller a "very good player"...
Nahas, King, Knights are some borderline players included.
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The games I've. Watched I've noticed Ellis more than Conca, maybe due to Reece coming back from a foot/ankle injury? Might have to watche replay and see again what I think
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Chaplin. Grimes. Vlastuin.
Ellis. ARance. Houli/Bachelor.
Grigg. Cotchin. S.Edwards.
Newman. Griffiths. Conca.
Martin. Riewoldt. Vickery.
Maric. Deledio. Foley.
Morris. Nahas. Pettard. Tuck.
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The games I've. Watched I've noticed Ellis more than Conca, maybe due to Reece coming back from a foot/ankle injury? Might have to watche replay and see again what I think
Different types of player too EEA. Conca is more in and under while Ellis is a Grigg clone. Without taking notice, I reckon you will always notice what Ellis does more easily. Having said that, I thought Conca was serviceable yesterday while Ellis played well.
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Petterd is not in our best 22. He's depth and will have to do a lot to even be considered best 22 this year.
Here's my 22
FB Ellis Rance Houli
HB Grimes Chaplin Morris
C Edwards Cotchin Conca
HF King Vickery Newman
FF Nahas Reiwoldt Griffiths
FOLL Maric Martin Deledio
INT Foley Vlastuin Tuck Grigg
EMER Batchelor Astbury Jackson Ohanlon
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Reckon white will be sub round 1
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Petterd is not in our best 22. He's depth and will have to do a lot to even be considered best 22 this year.
Here's my 22
FB Ellis Rance Houli
HB Grimes Chaplin Morris
C Edwards Cotchin Conca
HF King Vickery Newman
FF Nahas Reiwoldt Griffiths
FOLL Maric Martin Deledio
INT Foley Vlastuin Tuck Grigg
EMER Batchelor Astbury Jackson Ohanlon
Petterd seems to be a much better player than Morris IMHO.
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Petterd is not in our best 22. He's depth and will have to do a lot to even be considered best 22 this year.
Here's my 22
FB Ellis Rance Houli
HB Grimes Chaplin Morris
C Edwards Cotchin Conca
HF King Vickery Newman
FF Nahas Reiwoldt Griffiths
FOLL Maric Martin Deledio
INT Foley Vlastuin Tuck Grigg
EMER Batchelor Astbury Jackson Ohanlon
Petterd seems to be a much better player than Morris IMHO.
No way. Morris is a machine
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AND ESSENDON are the WAR MACHINE ;D
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Petterd is not in our best 22. He's depth and will have to do a lot to even be considered best 22 this year.
Here's my 22
FB Ellis Rance Houli
HB Grimes Chaplin Morris
C Edwards Cotchin Conca
HF King Vickery Newman
FF Nahas Reiwoldt Griffiths
FOLL Maric Martin Deledio
INT Foley Vlastuin Tuck Grigg
EMER Batchelor Astbury Jackson Ohanlon
Petterd seems to be a much better player than Morris IMHO.
Worst thing you have ever said
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Petterd is not in our best 22. He's depth and will have to do a lot to even be considered best 22 this year.
Here's my 22
FB Ellis Rance Houli
HB Grimes Chaplin Morris
C Edwards Cotchin Conca
HF King Vickery Newman
FF Nahas Reiwoldt Griffiths
FOLL Maric Martin Deledio
INT Foley Vlastuin Tuck Grigg
EMER Batchelor Astbury Jackson Ohanlon
Petterd seems to be a much better player than Morris IMHO.
Worst thing you have ever said
I thought he was trolling
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I wonder how many that had chris knights in their best 22 would still have him in now.
...... What about it?
Edited for accuracy
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I wonder how many that had chris knights in their best 22 would still have him in now.
...... What about it?
Edited for accuracy
We'll see Y&B......we'll see.
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Based on pre-season form and injuries
B: Morris Rance Griffiths
HB: Houli Chaplin Ellis
C: Newman Deledio Grigg
R: Maric Cotchin Tuck
HF: Conca Martin Jackson
F: S.Edwards Riewoldt Vickery
Int: Vlastuin King Petterd White
Emg: Arnot, McGuane, Nahas
Foley and Grimes would be in that 22 if not injured.
Batchelor and Knights have had poor pre-seasons IMO, Knights probably underdone.
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It's a fair stab Gerks and a half decent side. One question - can we elevate Petterd off the rookie list straight up?
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It's a fair stab Gerks and a half decent side. One question - can we elevate Petterd off the rookie list straight up?
Yeah I think we can re: Terd
If it's a half decent side, name the half that aren't decent ;D
Still a few quality senior players off the top sides for mine and rely on too many kids whilst still carrying a couple of hacks
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Based on pre-season form and injuries
B: Morris Rance Griffiths
HB: Houli Chaplin Ellis
C: Newman Deledio Grigg
R: Maric Cotchin Tuck
HF: Conca Martin Jackson
F: S.Edwards Riewoldt Vickery
Int: Vlastuin King Petterd White
Emg: Arnot, McGuane, Dea
Foley and Grimes would be in that 22 if not injured.
Batchelor and Knights have had poor pre-seasons IMO, Knights probably underdone.
Martin at CHF? Interesting
What's your reasoning enlightened one?
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Martin at CHF? Interesting
What's your reasoning enlightened one?
Means we get to play with one less hack was at the forefront of the thought
Gives us an extra midfielder and he'd probably be a gun at it, at worst better than most of our options
All based on current form/injuries mind you
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Martin at CHF? Interesting
What's your reasoning enlightened one?
Means we get to play with one less hack was at the forefront of the thought
Gives us an extra midfielder and he'd probably be a gun at it, at worst better than most of our options
All based on current form/injuries mind you
But will we beat the scum?
I still reckon we just plop Griff there for the season. A high CHF to open up the forward 50.
If Grimey is back where do you put Griffiths?
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Awhile back Royce hart suggested that Dusty would be the ideal CHF
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Martin at CHF? Interesting
What's your reasoning enlightened one?
Means we get to play with one less hack was at the forefront of the thought
Gives us an extra midfielder and he'd probably be a gun at it, at worst better than most of our options
All based on current form/injuries mind you
But will we beat the scum?
I still reckon we just plop Griff there for the season. A high CHF to open up the forward 50.
If Grimey is back where do you put Griffiths?
If Grimey is back he takes Ellis' spot, Ellis goes to the bench, and either White or Petterd eat burgers
Just get the best 22 players out there
Work out positions and match-ups during the week.
Punters put too much emphasis on naming a side to look like how it has been formatted in the paper for the last 100 years. We all do it. But it's a bit outdated IMO.
Awhile back Royce hart suggested that Dusty would be the ideal CHF
He looks like one. And who are we to disagree with Royce?
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Royce would know
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Martin at CHF? Interesting
What's your reasoning enlightened one?
Means we get to play with one less hack was at the forefront of the thought
Gives us an extra midfielder and he'd probably be a gun at it, at worst better than most of our options
All based on current form/injuries mind you
But will we beat the scum?
I still reckon we just plop Griff there for the season. A high CHF to open up the forward 50.
If Grimey is back where do you put Griffiths?
If Grimey is back he takes Ellis' spot, Ellis goes to the bench, and either White or Petterd eat burgers
Just get the best 22 players out there
Work out positions and match-ups during the week.
Punters put too much emphasis on naming a side to look like how it has been formatted in the paper for the last 100 years. We all do it. But it's a bit outdated IMO.
Awhile back Royce hart suggested that Dusty would be the ideal CHF
He looks like one. And who are we to disagree with Royce?
You still haven't told me where you'd rather play Griff. You had him in the back 6 but if Grimey canes back where do you put Griff against the scum?
I'm talking round 1 here and we MUST beat the cheats.
Tell us Obe one. Your our only hope.
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Grimes wont play round 1 :thumbsup
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Grimes wont play round 1 :thumbsup
Oh yes your right. My mistake.
Do then you prefer griff down back or up forward?
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IMO Round 1 v Carlton
B: Morris Rance Vlastuin
HB: Houli Chaplin Ellis
C: Conca Deledio Grigg
HF: Newman Vickery Martin
F: S.Edwards Riewoldt King
R: Maric Cotchin Tuck
Int: Griffiths, Jackson, Nahas (White)
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My update after NAB 3:
B: Morris Rance Batchelor
HB: Houli Chaplin Petterd
C: Newman Martin Ellis
HF: Vlastuin Riewoldt Deledio
F: S.Edwards Vickery Knights
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Grigg, Conca, Griffiths
Sub: King
nb. Grimes would replace one of Griffiths/Batchelor and Foley would replace one of King/Knights if they were fit to play in round 1.
For round 1 though I've got a feeling Dimma will have Jacko as a tagger in instead of Knights.
Strong squad there MT. Based purely on form, reckon you could almost argue White as an inclusion over Jackson or Knights. They all play slightly different games, but horses for courses, if we weren't required to hard tag anyone rather than just give a particular player a hard time at certain times, White's speed and carry would be really handy. Both White and Houli streaming through the guts and capitalising from midfield turnovers would really give some opposition teams headaches.
Is a poo ruck, but could even take a look at McGuane for Vickery. On form has earned it, and what I've liked about McGuane since the end of last season and this NAB Cup is his awareness of his limitations and not trying to fool anyone. At least he has a contest, clunks a few, kicks a few, and has even taken a few blokes on carrying the footy. Probably one of our more reliable set shots at the moment too :help Vickery has had plenty of time to recover from his injuries and has had heaps of minutes in the pre-season, so there isn't really any excuse for being soft and a plodder by Round 3.
With the three rounds over my major observations have been,
Pros:
VLASTUIN!
Petterd.
For the first time in yonks we have a really solid back line. Can lose a bloke or two and have viable backups. I really like Batchelor and always have, but like last year the same key areas may hold him back from being a lock. Still comfortable with him in the side though.
Midfield is elite. Today aside, inside and outside IMO we're match up for match up right there with the best sides.
Depth. Lonergan and A. Edwards and co. may not have been recruited as starting replacements, but at least we don't have blokes like Webberly to come in anymore.
Cons:
Forward line.
Forward 50 entry.
Still getting skittish when opposition teams come string and ramp up the pressure.
Vickery.
There are more, but these are just the most important ones I could pick out at the moment.
I personally think we need to move on from the likes of Whitey, Jacko and McGuane so that's why I didn't have them in my best 22. A friend of mine has a theory that the most frustrating players are what he calls "75%ers". They do things right a lot of the time so coaches can be seduced and persist with them year after year but their stuffs up on-field are too frequent to make them reliable players to take us up the ladder. I would have those three in that category.
Having said that I can see Jacko being in the side round 22 as Dimma loves Jacko and sees him as our lock-down tagger. I could also see Whitey being a surprised selection simply as a match-up to lock-down as a defensive half-forward on Yarran to curb his run off Carlton's half-back. Whitey did that job once before with some success.
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My update after NAB 4:
B: Morris Rance Batchelor
HB: Houli Chaplin Petterd
C: Newman Martin Ellis
HF: Vlastuin Riewoldt Deledio
F: S.Edwards Vickery King
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Grigg, Conca, Griffiths
Sub: Arnot
nb. Grimes, Knights, Astbury & Foley not considered due to being on the injury list or underdone.
I know there's a push by some for McGuane to play ahead of Vickery after the game in the wet on the weekend but I still went with TV as it's forecast to be a warm dry night on Thursday and Vickery can rotate with Ivan between ruck and the forward line.
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Wonder if Carlton's tradition tall forwardline against us may change that team MT. Griffiths may get the gig over Batch for that reason. McGuane and Vickery may also play forward. Other than that I like the look of the team. Really interested to see what difference Chaplin and Petterd make to our backline :thumbsup I hope Knights earns a gig as a high HF or wing soon too.
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IMHO (for the Carlton game):
Morris Chaplin Griffiths
Houli Rance Pettard
Grigg Cotchin Newman
Martin Vickery Edwards
McGuane Reiwoldt King
Foll: Maric Deledio Tuck
Int: Conca Ellis Vlaustin sub: Nahas
If it rains remove McGuane and replace with Nahas.
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Morris Chaplin Griffiths
Houli Rance Pettard
Grigg Cotchin Newman
Martin Vickery Edwards
McGuane Reiwoldt King
Foll: Maric Deledio Tuck
Int: Conca Ellis Vlaustin sub: Nahas
#2 Grimes
#11 Bachelor
#41 Foley
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Morris Chaplin Griffiths
Houli Rance Pettard
Grigg Cotchin Newman
Martin Vickery Edwards
McGuane Reiwoldt King
Foll: Maric Deledio Tuck
Int: Conca Ellis Vlaustin sub: Nahas
#2 Grimes
#11 Bachelor
#41 Foley
I agree with Foley and Grimes down the track but right now I am considering fit players only. ....form wise I think batch is struggling
atm
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B: Morris Rance Batchelor
HB: Houli Chaplin Grimes
C: Newman Deledio Grigg
HF: Nahas Riewoldt Martin
F: S.Edwards Vickery King
R: Maric Tuck Cotchin
Int: Ellis, Conca, Griffiths
Sub: Vlastuin
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Sorry that is my guess for the team for Round One
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Foley is now training with senior team. Assuming he returns to his best form, what is our best 21 +1 for the middle / latter parts of the season. [Lonergan / Astbury too]
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b/ morris - chaplin - grimes.
hb/ batchelor - rance - vlastuin.
c/ grigg - tuck - conca.
r/ maric - deledio - cotchin.
hf/ s edwards - riewoldt - martin.
f/ vickery - griffiths - a edwards.
int/ ellis - knights - foley - helbig/newman/nahas/houli/king/jackson.
the one deficiency is leg speed though all the talls bar jack and ivan are quick for their size.
would be tempted to play someone like helbig back and release morris to a midfield run with role.
2nds
b/ newman - darrou - mcintosh
hb/ dea - astbury - verrier
c/ nahas - arnot - houli.
r/ derickx - jackson - king
hf/ ohanlon - elton - white
f/ mcdough - mcguane - ??????
int/ mcbean /?????/?????/?????.
the lack of genuine mids is plain to see along with tall kpfs.
one has to question the rucks as well.
How many more KPFs do you want on the list?
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Bump
What is our best 22 right now for this week exc injured players?
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What I expect the team to look like for Saturday night when released on Thursday.
B Morris Chaplin Rance
HB Houli Grimes Ellis
C Grigg Deledio Martin
HF Knights Vickery McGuane
F King Riewoldt S Edwards
Foll Maric Cotchin Tuck
Int Stephenson Vlaustin Jackson sub Newman
Emerg A Edwards Batchelor Dea
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close tb, only difference is personally I wouldnt go a 3rd ruckman
B. Morris Rance Grimes
HB Houli Chaplin Batchelor
C. Ellis Cotchin Martin
HF Jackson Vickery Edwards
F McGuane Reiwoldt King
R. Maric Tuck Deledio
Int:Vlastuin, Grigg, Knights, Newman
Emerg: A.Edwards, White, Nahas
Cannot wait until Foley and Conca are part of that.
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close tb, only difference is personally I wouldnt go a 3rd ruckman
B. Morris Rance Grimes
HB Houli Chaplin Batchelor
C. Ellis Cotchin Martin
HF Jackson Vickery Edwards
F McGuane Reiwoldt King
R. Maric Tuck Deledio
Int:Vlastuin, Grigg, Knights, Newman
Emerg: A.Edwards, White, Nahas
Cannot wait until Foley and Conca are part of that.
Likewise Tony I just put O in as I think he has been okay for Coburg, Maric needs a chop out and we are playing his old side and he may know a few things about their centre square, stoppage set ups and we can use that to our advantage.
Furthermore with Orren in the side Vickery can concentrate on playing fwd and given Rivers may miss we can stretch them at the back with Vickery Jack and Luke. I was even tempted to include Aaron Edwards given his form to stretch them further in the backline but......... we may be far too top heavy and it may come out the other way easier when it hits the ground and with their precision we may fall away once initial effort and commitment starts to wear off.
At least 5 rounds in I am having trouble picking a 22 for a team against a premiership fancy so at least I am consoled by the fact that we have depth there. However as you put it Tony boy it would've been good to have Axel and Conca out there in the 22 also. :thumbsup
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Good team tucker, hope the club chooses close to that. Just to think concs and foley in there and we are really looking dangerous.
Will be interesting to see who comes out
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What I expect the team to look like for Saturday night when released on Thursday.
B Morris Chaplin Rance
HB Houli Grimes Ellis
C Grigg Deledio Martin
HF Knights Vickery McGuane
F King Riewoldt S Edwards
Foll Maric Cotchin Tuck
Int Stephenson Vlaustin Jackson sub Newman
Emerg A Edwards Batchelor Dea
Sorry but you and Tony are way off the mark, why would we waste our best CHF in a pocket?
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close tb, only difference is personally I wouldnt go a 3rd ruckman
B. Morris Rance Grimes
HB Houli Chaplin Batchelor
C. Ellis Cotchin Martin
HF Jackson Vickery Edwards
F McGuane Reiwoldt King
R. Maric Tuck Deledio
Int:Vlastuin, Grigg, Knights, Newman
Emerg: A.Edwards, White, Nahas
Cannot wait until Foley and Conca are part of that.
Likewise Tony I just put O in as I think he has been okay for Coburg, Maric needs a chop out and we are playing his old side and he may know a few things about their centre square, stoppage set ups and we can use that to our advantage.
Furthermore with Orren in the side Vickery can concentrate on playing fwd and given Rivers may miss we can stretch them at the back with Vickery Jack and Luke. I was even tempted to include Aaron Edwards given his form to stretch them further in the backline but......... we may be far too top heavy and it may come out the other way easier when it hits the ground and with their precision we may fall away once initial effort and commitment starts to wear off.
At least 5 rounds in I am having trouble picking a 22 for a team against a premiership fancy so at least I am consoled by the fact that we have depth there. However as you put it Tony boy it would've been good to have Axel and Conca out there in the 22 also. :thumbsup
I see where you're coming from but I still wouldnt play the 3 of them in the same side. If Vickery had another stinker last week, I'd have no hesitation in bringing in big O for him and letting him help out Maric in the ruck. As it is, he can give us the low down on their setups in the prepping during the week :thumbsup
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What I expect the team to look like for Saturday night when released on Thursday.
B Morris Chaplin Rance
HB Houli Grimes Ellis
C Grigg Deledio Martin
HF Knights Vickery McGuane
F King Riewoldt S Edwards
Foll Maric Cotchin Tuck
Int Stephenson Vlaustin Jackson sub Newman
Emerg A Edwards Batchelor Dea
Sorry but you and Tony are way off the mark, why would we waste our best CHF in a pocket?
Who are you talking about CHF in a pocket King or Titch?
Do you mean CHB? If that is the case no worries but as I said the way I expect to see them named on Thursday. Does not mean the 22 will line up like that on Saturday night once the official teamsheet has been lodged in.
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What I expect the team to look like for Saturday night when released on Thursday.
B Morris Chaplin Rance
HB Houli Grimes Ellis
C Grigg Deledio Martin
HF Knights Vickery McGuane
F King Riewoldt S Edwards
Foll Maric Cotchin Tuck
Int Stephenson Vlaustin Jackson sub Newman
Emerg A Edwards Batchelor Dea
Sorry but you and Tony are way off the mark, why would we waste our best CHF in a pocket?
I like to think of fwd pockets and HF's as floating fwds.
Fwd setup is 3 talls that rotate between FF, CHF and leadup fwd. 1 permanent small in King and 2 floaters between fwd and midfield in S.edwards and 1 of Martin/Knights/Lids and Cotch
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close tb, only difference is personally I wouldnt go a 3rd ruckman
B. Morris Rance Grimes
HB Houli Chaplin Batchelor
C. Ellis Cotchin Martin
HF Jackson Vickery Edwards
F McGuane Reiwoldt King
R. Maric Tuck Deledio
Int:Vlastuin, Grigg, Knights, Newman
Emerg: A.Edwards, White, Nahas
Cannot wait until Foley and Conca are part of that.
Likewise Tony I just put O in as I think he has been okay for Coburg, Maric needs a chop out and we are playing his old side and he may know a few things about their centre square, stoppage set ups and we can use that to our advantage.
Furthermore with Orren in the side Vickery can concentrate on playing fwd and given Rivers may miss we can stretch them at the back with Vickery Jack and Luke. I was even tempted to include Aaron Edwards given his form to stretch them further in the backline but......... we may be far too top heavy and it may come out the other way easier when it hits the ground and with their precision we may fall away once initial effort and commitment starts to wear off.
At least 5 rounds in I am having trouble picking a 22 for a team against a premiership fancy so at least I am consoled by the fact that we have depth there. However as you put it Tony boy it would've been good to have Axel and Conca out there in the 22 also. :thumbsup
I see where you're coming from but I still wouldnt play the 3 of them in the same side. If Vickery had another stinker last week, I'd have no hesitation in bringing in big O for him and letting him help out Maric in the ruck. As it is, he can give us the low down on their setups in the prepping during the week :thumbsup
That's cool Tony. :thumbsup
My thinking is that whilst yes he can offer the knowledge during the week in prep he can also be of benefit on the ground and tell some of our lads where to go. After all we know too well some of our boys are reactive to things as opposed to other teams being naturally proactive. On field advice could be valuable. :cheers
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LOL pay that ;D
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It was more a joke in reference to Dimma consistently listing Shane Edwards as our CHF week in and week out
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:lol
went straight over my head yeahright :facepalm
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:lol
went straight over my head yeahright :facepalm
Haha I thought maybe it was just a stinker. On a serious note both teams look good but I personally wouldn't want to see 3 ruckman
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what i hope the team looks like come rnd 18 onwards.it means a few kids have to take step ups. its a team limiting as many as we can poor kicks and poor decision makers.
morris - chaplin - grimes
mcintosh - rance/astbury - vlaustin
conca - tuck - deledio
s edwards - riewoldt - knights
vickery - griffiths/elton - king. no other option but king atm.
maric - cotchin - foley
ellis - helbig - newman - grigg/houli one of.
emg batchelor - dea
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The interesting thing for mine was Tucks exclusion last week even when we were down a quality midfielder in Conca. This forced Edwards up the ground too. So far we have had little return from our resting midfielders too. I wonder if a more permanent small forward is in order such as was broached in another thread?
I don't think we should play three rucks at present. Our strength is our run and spread and we would lose this advantage if we went too tall against the Cats.
How did Foley go on the weekend? Would he be ready to come in as a sub?
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How did Foley go on the weekend? Would he be ready to come in as a sub?
Club have made it very clear that he is going ot play at least 3-4 weeks at the VFL. Personally wouldn't want them to deviate from that plan
Cannot not under-estimate the gap between the 2 comps. Look at Helbig on Friday night. He's been playing great at VFL level comes in the AFL and was very much off the pace (ie pace of the game).
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Thanks WP! :thumbsup
So he could play but it is unlikely.
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Needs more strength in his peg leg
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Jackson
Houli
Pettard
White
Mcgaunr
Best22?
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Mcguane and Houli yes.
Tuck, Foley, Conca and one of Batch or dea need to be playing.
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B Morris Chaplin Grimes
HB Vlastuin Rance Houli
C Newman Deledio Grigg
HF Martin Vickery A. Edwards
F King Riewoldt S. Edwards
Foll Maric Cotchin Foley
Int Knights Conca Tuck
Sub Ellis
EMG: Nahas, Petterd, Mcguane
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an irrelevant thread really because it doesnt matter who our best 22 are they arent good enough to do anything substantial anyway.
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an irrelevant thread really because it doesnt matter who our best 22 are they arent good enough to do anything substantial anyway.
How do you know?
We have not seen the like of Arnot, Dea, Bachelor, Helbig, Astbury, Elton, McBean have a chance or at least a chance to build something together cause the Jackson types continue to play.
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an irrelevant thread really because it doesnt matter who our best 22 are they arent good enough to do anything substantial anyway.
How do you know?
We have not seen the like of Arnot, Dea, Bachelor, Helbig, Astbury, Elton, McBean have a chance or at least a chance to build something together cause the Jackson types continue to play.
Arnot cant kick, Dea and Bachelor are list players only, Helbig has struggled when he has been given the chance, Astbury is always injured, Elton has a chance of coming through and McBean can play for sure. Thats not enough for us to be able to do anything.
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So - who is not in the 22 that is in Richmonds best side?
RFC def Brisbane:
B - Astbury. Chaplin. Morris.
HB - Houli. Rance. Vlastuin.
C - Ellis. Cotchin. Deledio.
HF - Foley. Vickery. Newman
F - Conca. Riewoldt. McGaune.
OB - Maric. Martin. Jackson.
I - Grigg. White. Nahas.
+1 - Tuck
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So - who is not in the 22 that is in Richmonds best side?
Grimes, S.Edwards at the moment. Have high hopes for the Beanstalk and the Donut if they can show that they can play. Would really help the cause if they become good players and get us closer to having a side that can challenge down the track. This next trade period and draft is huge for us, get it right and anything could happen in the next 3 years.
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I am pleased over all with the off season
Lennon & hampson are 22 and improvements to the best side
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I am pleased over all with the off season
Lennon & hampson are beat 22 and improvements to the best side
I don't think Lemmon is best 22 just yet..
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Hampsoj as sad as that seems right now, maybe. Lennon not much engine. A fit Knights ahead til June
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I think you're right Judge - Hampson will play Round one and Lennon will be a permanent addition by midyear.
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What's dimma thinking?
Morris. Grimes. Chaplin.
Vlastuin. ARance. Houli.
Conca. Cotchin. Ellis.
Lennon. Vickery. Knights.
Mcbean. Riewoldt. Shane Edwards.
Maric. Deledio. Martin.
Hampson. Foley. King. Jackson.
Almost picks itself :shh
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McBean, McDonagh, Lennon, Gordon, Lloyd.
Rebuilt a forward line around Jack in two years of recruiting.
+ Knights?
+ Resting ruck?
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What's dimma thinking?
Morris. Grimes. Chaplin.
Vlastuin. ARance. Houli.
Conca. Cotchin. Ellis.
Lennon. Vickery. Knights.
Mcbean. Riewoldt. Shane Edwards.
Maric. Deledio. Martin.
Hampson. Foley. King. Jackson.
Almost picks itself :shh
Yeah I reckon thats spot on. Very important that McBean and Lennon come on as expected and that Knights stays injury free.
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What's dimma thinking?
Morris. Grimes. Chaplin.
Vlastuin. ARance. Houli.
Conca. Cotchin. Ellis.
Lennon. Vickery. Knights.
Mcbean. Riewoldt. Shane Edwards.
Maric. Deledio. Martin.
Hampson. Foley. King. Jackson.
Almost picks itself :shh
If this side loses to Collingwood I'll lose it
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based on output and performance to date the best 22 is vastly different to where we need to get.
mooriss is best 22 is as tough as they come and gives 200% every time. but geez he has to improve some shocking areas of his game.
chaplain- very servicable player he plays for us exactly like he did for port.with his size would really like to see him become a better one on one player.
grimes - skinny injury prone tall defender. is a good spoiler but really hes not likely to ever play on big players and really needs to add a running component to his game.
vlastuin - looks great. with tuck gone i think he must be now played almost entirely as a mid.
houli - soft one sided panic merchant yep i know you all disagree.
grigg - for a running player his skills are poo, while provides great run and spread he fails in most other areas.
cotchin - very good player but hes not a great user of the ball by foot.
jackson - cant believe im saying it but he has done enough to keep his spot. has eliminated a lot of mistakes from his game and it needs to stay that way.
s edwards - really is a liability far too often. managed a good season only to follow it up with another poor one. seems his best is the abnormal and his worst the normal.
a edwards - played some good footy for us but hes very hit and miss would love a better skilled ground player he a bit one dimensional.
hampson - sheesh is best 22 andhasnt played a game. mediocre is the best way to sum up his career to date. at 26 will it change.
riewoldt - has a knack of always kicking goals but he has some terrible traits in his game.
king - gives his all has a go and sometimes the only one who will stand up and fly the flag. but jeezus h Geez hes an ordinary player.
maric - been a great pick, always competes and gives a contest. but this yr that was about what it was rarely won his position.with his groin issues hes in decline imo.
martin - does he really want to be at richmond. sorry but you have to ask the question with what has gone on. the more his motor builds the better he will become.
deledio - a model of consistency every yr. but he does have issues when given a tight tag.
newman - imo he should have retired. hes been in gradual decline and we now have players clamboring for his position. better players we will have to wait and see.
petterd - sorry people but no his skills are deplorable and again we are playing him in a position that is keeping better skilled players out of the side.
ellis - very poromising start looks very outside to me. has good skills and will become more rounded as he gets games.
conca - decent player but i dont get the hype. lacks awareness and vision and i have doubts about him becoming a real decent mid.
hampson aside thats the team that had its pants pulled down in a final by the 9th placed side. need at least 30% improvement to make finals again and we aint gonna get it with that lot.
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Claw - I rarely hear a positive word about our players from you. The players are ordinary, the recruiters are ordinary, the coaches are ordinary and the supporters are ordinary. Maybe its time to start drinking some half full glasses/beers for a change.
I think we have a very strong team at the moment which is evident by our 5th place finish last year. We need to upgrade on some players and continue to create a very competitive culture where spots are fought for, but reading your last post makes it seem like we need to delist 3/4 of the squad. This is just not factual. No player in the league in perfect and no side can contain 22 A grade players.....(GC and GWS excepted of course :shh)
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:bow Stripes :bow
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Stripes, you're taking things out of context, hes not negative, just realistic....blah blah blah...just shoot me now
Imagine what its like like for those poor souls that have to be constantly dragged down by this in real life, rather than just some posts on an interweb forum.
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houli - soft one sided panic merchant yep i know you all disagree.
If this isn't racism then I don't know what is
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Only read the first one - but what area is morris "shocking in?
Who are these AFL back pockets that are light years ahead?
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Hip hip hooray!!!!!!!....
.......We finished 5th.
I agree with claw here.
Facts Losing to the cheating scum in a final was totally unacceptable and purely our own fault.
It was wrong. The club failed us...twice.
stuff me we made the finals only to undo all the great work by losing to the enemy. :banghead
They need to make it up to us big time in 2014!
We are NEVER finished achieving until we've achieved everything.
I demand satisfaction!!!!!!
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Decent
2.
of an acceptable standard; satisfactory.
"people need decent homes"
synonyms: satisfactory, reasonable, fair, acceptable, adequate, sufficient, sufficiently good, good enough, ample, up to scratch, up to the mark, up to standard, up to par, competent, not bad, all right, average, tolerable, passable, suitable
Conca will be decent
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Claw - you seem a depressed character. I rarely hear a positive word about our players from you. The players are sh.te, the recruiters are sh.te, the coaches are sh.te and the supporters are sh.te. Maybe its time to start drinking some half full glasses for a change.
I think we have a very strong team at the moment which is evident by our 5th place finish last year. We need to upgrade on some players and continue to create a very competitive culture where spots are fought for, but reading your last post makes it seem like we need to delist 3/4 of the squad. This is just not factual. No player in the league in perfect and no side can contain 22 A grade players.....(GC and GWS excepted of course :shh)
Is the whole world poo?
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houli - soft one sided panic merchant yep i know you all disagree.
If this isn't racism then I don't know what is
::) taking the pee arent you?
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houli - soft one sided panic merchant yep i know you all disagree.
If this isn't racism then I don't know what is
::) taking the pee arent you?
Do you have proof of this?
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houli - soft one sided panic merchant yep i know you all disagree.
If this isn't racism then I don't know what is
Yes, a quarter filled bag of some yellow type fluid, labelled "pisstake"
::) taking the pee arent you?
Do you have proof of this?
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Look I'm not meaning to insult claw personally. I'm saying that perhaps we need to balance the negatives out with the positives. We are building as evident by our 5th place finish and should celebrate that fact. Should we be content with dropping out in the first week of finals - hell no, but we should at least see that we are trending upwards and our list is improving.
We have a strong list now. Our midfield is one of the best in the league and still developing. Our backline is stable and assisted the side in becoming one of the most miserly in the league. We have spread the load with scoring and no longer rely on Jack alone. All of this should be celebrated.
Looking at individual players - they have weaknesses. Some more than others. What the coaches and players alike need to do is create roles and structures to best highlight their strengths and hide their weaknesses. Weaknesses need to be worked on of course, but we are never going to have a side where we have no players without flaws in their game.
I'm probably guilty of being too optimistic with the players and club but I go by the theory that you should celebrate success because you never know when it may come again. Preparing for the worst is one thing, continually focusing on our flaws is another.
A little off topic but I saw a study where they asked a group of 100 Uni Students who had never bowled (10 pin) to have a game. They had them play a game and divided them evenly. They then gave one group professional coaches who pinpointed their weaknesses and gave them tips/strategies to make improvements on their game. The other group they gave coaches who were only positives, cheering their game and telling them all the good things they did. They game taught them nothing but rather just acted as cheerleaders. Both groups then played off against each other for the rest of the afternoon.
The team that had professional coaching improved by 16%. The team that only received positive feedback improved 92%. Confidence is an amazing thing :thumbsup
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Although claw brings up some valid points, he way too critical. Honestly if I didn't know the team I was reading about, I would have thought that I was reading about the wooden spooner rather than a team that finished with 15 victories.
Every player has some deficiency. So what? As long as they follow the game plan and play within their limitations, we will be more than competitive next year!
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I wonder if Thomas will take Foley's spot after the first few rounds? If Foley improves his speed and ball delivery he will be well and truly safe but Thomas will have him for clearances.
A.Edwards may struggle to return back into the team too if any of Lennon, Banfield, Lloyd or Gordan step up quickly :-\
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Ze-torch-man
Top-Ups
Richmond AFL Team Round 1
Newman Chaplin Morris
Houli Rance Grimes
Ellis Martin Deledio
Knights Riewoldt A.Edwards
McBean Vickery Lennon
R: Maric Cotchin Conca
I: Hampson, Jackson, Vlastuin
Sub: Foley
Ze-stripe-man
Richmond AFL Team Round 1
Newman Chaplin Morris
Houli Rance Grimes
Ellis Martin Deledio
Knights Riewoldt S.Edwards
Maric Vickery King
R: Hampson Cotchin Conca
I: Grigg, Jackson, Vlastuin
Sub: Foley
---
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1. Does grigg get hard wick let automatic selection? Houli too? Knights?
2. Is king best beyond doubt?
3. Where does newman fit in?
4. Who is 2nd best defender Grimes or Chappy?
5. How will the forward look?
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King isn't best 22
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King isn't best 22
No one plays the defensive forward role better than he does at the moment so even though there are better players than him on the list, he remains in the 22 until someone can do his role better than he can.
Here are my answers Judge :thumbsup
1. Does grigg get hard wick let automatic selection? Houli too? Knights?
All of them will play round one. Knight is probably the player most likely to drop out though Grigg needs to keep providing outside run and deliver well (something he is not always achieving) if he is to retain his spot. Houli's spot is a lock.
2. Is king best beyond doubt?
No - but as I mentioned in my last post - but best defensive forward we have atm.
3. Where does newman fit in?
Have to be the wing or as the the '7th defender' pushing up the ground. On output alone his spot is vulnerable but he is virtually untouchable when you add his leadership value.
4. Who is 2nd best defender Grimes or Chappy?
Chappy by a long way. I would rate over Rance even. :shh
5. How will the forward look?
Initially I think it will look -
HF: S.Edwards Riewoldt Conca
FF: Maric Vickery King
Changing to by mid-year -
HF: S.Edwards Riewoldt Knights/Arnot
FF: McBean Vickery Lennon
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I wonder if Thomas will take Foley's spot after the first few rounds? If Foley improves his speed and ball delivery he will be well and truly safe but Thomas will have him for clearances.
Actually Foley averages more clearances.
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I wonder if Thomas will take Foley's spot after the first few rounds? If Foley improves his speed and ball delivery he will be well and truly safe but Thomas will have him for clearances.
Actually Foley averages more clearances.
Really?! That's interesting. Apparently Thomas has improved in that area considerable last year but he was playing at a lower level of course. Perhaps I'm under-rating Foley :huh :-\
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I wonder if Thomas will take Foley's spot after the first few rounds? If Foley improves his speed and ball delivery he will be well and truly safe but Thomas will have him for clearances.
Actually Foley averages more clearances.
Really?! That's interesting. Apparently Thomas has improved in that area considerable last year but he was playing at a lower level of course. Perhaps I'm under-rating Foley :huh :-\
Foley roughly doubles Thomas' clearances (not quite) and has averaged more for every year. From my lazy look only Cotchin and Tuck have averaged more with Martin not far behind.
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Best 22 for round 1 next year, according to the AFL website ...
Richmond
B: Dylan Grimes, Alex Rance, Steven Morris
HB: Jake Batchelor, Troy Chaplin, Bachar Houli
C: Shaun Grigg, Trent Cotchin, Reece Conca
HF: Daniel Jackson, Ty Vickery, Nick Vlastuin
F: Shane Edwards, Jack Riewoldt, Dustin Martin
FOLL: Ivan Maric, Brett Deledio, Brandon Ellis
INT: Shaun Hampson, Nathan Foley, Matt Dea
SUB: Chris Newman
NOTES: It is expected that the Tigers will take a relatively settled line-up into the start of the 2014 season. Former Carlton ruckman Shaun Hampson is the only new face, and Ivan Maric is sure to appreciate his support, which is likely to mean that Ty Vickery will spend less time in the ruck. Jake King and Aaron Edwards are among the regular senior players not included in this team. - Adam McNicol
TOTAL PLAYER RATINGS VALUE: 6664 points
TOP PLAYER: Trent Cotchin, 470 points
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-11-30/your-clubs-best-22-for-round-one-part-one
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Sif no pettard ::)
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Batch....after the year he had ....really... :o
Maybe I could get a gig.. :lol
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And Dea apparent steps straight in :-\
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And Dea apparent steps straight in :-\
Yeah, that's another one, amazing.
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FIRSTS
BACKS Grimes, Dylan Rance, Alex Morris, Steven
1/2 BACKS Newman, Chris Chaplin, Troy Ellis, Brandon
CENTRE Houli, Bachar Deledio, Brett Grigg, Shaun
RUCKS Maric, Ivan Cotchin, Trent Foley, Nathan
1/2 FWDS Knights, Chris Vickery, Tyrone Martin, Dustin
FORWARDS Edwards, Shane Riewoldt, Jack King, Jake
I'CHANGE Conca, Reece Hampson, Shaun Vlastuin, Nick
SUBSTITUTE Jackson, Daniel
SECONDS
BACKS McIntosh, Kamdyn Griffiths, Benjamin Dea, Matthew
1/2 BACKS Petterd, Rick Elton, Todd Arnot, Matthew
CENTRE McDonough, Matt O'Hanlon, Brett Darrou, Ben
RUCKS Stephenson, Orren Helbig, Bradley Lloyd, Sam
1/2 FWDS Edwards, Aaron McBean, Liam Batchelor, Jake
FORWARDS Williams, Cadeyn Astbury, David Lennon, Ben
I'CHANGE Gordon, Nathan Banfield, Todd Miles, Anthony
SUBSTITUTE Thomas, Matt
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FIRSTS
BACKS Grimes, Dylan Rance, Alex Morris, Steven
1/2 BACKS Newman, Chris Chaplin, Troy Ellis, Brandon
CENTRE Houli, Bachar Deledio, Brett Grigg, Shaun
RUCKS Maric, Ivan Cotchin, Trent Foley, Nathan
1/2 FWDS Knights, Chris Vickery, Tyrone Martin, Dustin
FORWARDS Edwards, Shane Riewoldt, Jack King, Jake
I'CHANGE Conca, Reece Hampson, Shaun Vlastuin, Nick
SUBSTITUTE Jackson, Daniel
SECONDS
BACKS McIntosh, Kamdyn Griffiths, Benjamin Dea, Matthew
1/2 BACKS Petterd, Rick Elton, Todd Arnot, Matthew
CENTRE McDonough, Matt O'Hanlon, Brett Darrou, Ben
RUCKS Stephenson, Orren Helbig, Bradley Lloyd, Sam
1/2 FWDS Edwards, Aaron McBean, Liam Batchelor, Jake
FORWARDS Williams, Cadeyn Astbury, David Lennon, Ben
I'CHANGE Gordon, Nathan Banfield, Todd Miles, Anthony
SUBSTITUTE Thomas, Matt
Not to shabby at all, well done and welcome to the forum.. :thumbsup
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Not to shabby at all, well done and welcome to the forum.. :thumbsup
Thanks - it's great to be part of the discussion - We are still 2-3 A-grade footballers away but with the seconds at home and stability in the club we're in the best shape we have been for years... :gotigers
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needs.
quality kpd, ruck/for, genuine sml for, genuine med forward. possibly kpf. decent run and carry players with good footskills. an inside replacement for tuck.
in an attempt to find and fill these holes id be going with the following. my attitude is that we have taken mature players and you take em to immediately improve your team not to prop up the reserves side.
i al;so think with the nunber of forwards we have taken a quality player like lennon should come of hb as a part of his education.
me im looking to the future still and dont believe many of our regulars are capable of taking us to top 4 and a flag hence im still looking to play and find out what some of the younger blokes have to offer.
b/ morris - chaplin - grimes.
hb/ mcintosh - rance - lennon.
c/ ellis - martin - deledio
r/ maric - cotchin - vlastuin.
hf/ knights - riewoldt - gordon.
f/ lloyd - vickery - hampson.
int/ jackson - conca - foley - arnot.
regulars who are not named.
king - replaced by lloyd this is an area we all know we must improve in but geez its kingy we cant do it. well imo we can and need to.
grigg - ive got ellis in his spot but bought a id/for in knights into the team for him.
houli - well imo lennon is the way to go if we dont play houli back where do we play him. where do we play lennon with so many mature forwards newly drafted.
petterd - replaced by mcintosh geez a 192 cm running player who defends well and can actually kick properly.
vikery - while not replaced in the side his job as a ruckman is taken by hampson. with vickery now doing mcguanes job that is stay at home kpf with no ruck duties.
newman - now i know it wont happen but for mine id rather now give games to the likes of genuine mids like arnot or helbig. the back half is coverd with numerous options.
a edwards - replaced by gordon. a 24yo forward who can actually form a part of midfield rotions. i say again we surely didnt take mature players just to have em rot in the magoos.
s edwards - well hes no mid imo and hes forced out by the likes of knights lloyd gordon.
finally i did a reserves side and the scary thing is the lack of what i would term GENUINE MIDS. The lack of tall defenders. the lack of real quality pushing thru. and the lack of development in our talls.
imo we need to improve a fair bit on about a third of regular players we wont become a top 4 bside until this happens.
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b/ morris - chaplin - grimes.
hb/ mcintosh - rance - lennon.
c/ ellis - martin - deledio
r/ maric - cotchin - vlastuin.
hf/ knights - riewoldt - gordon.
f/ lloyd - vickery - hampson.
int/ jackson - conca - foley - arnot.
I actually don't mind that team and understand your explanations for the changes I bolded above. I would like to see Gordon and Lennon in the team before the middle of the year. I would also add McBean to those two. The one thing I differ from you philosophically is how these three get in the team - I feel they need to earn their place and push out those established players. I don't think they should just be given a chance. I believe this creates healthy competition across every level.
Gordan will probably be the first played I feel in A.Edwards place or Kingy's if his form drops off. Lennon next but I believe he will be played as a sub first and then off a wing.
Houli is our number one defender delivering the ball our of defense. I believe he started more delivery chains ending in a scoring opportunity than any other player in our side. He is the first choice for kick outs too. With the ball in his hands we are a much cleaner team. He won't be making way for a new recruit.
Grigg's position is less secure but he still offers run and carry which we still need. He may be pushed into the sub position if Ellis, Lennon and Vlaustin into more prominent midfield roles and others take their current half back etc roles.
Newman has another year of security before he is moved on I feel. He still our leader and life blood.
King plays his role better than almost every other defensive forward. Until he begins to fail in this role and another can win his place he is safe. His attitude retain his place alone.
:thumbsup
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B: Morris, Chaplin, Grimes
HB: Vlastuin, Rance, Houli
C: Deledio, Cotchin, Ellis
HF: Lennon, Riewoldt, Knights
F: A.Edwards, Vickery, McBean
R: Maric, Conca, Martin
I: Jackson, Hampson, Foley
S: Newman
E: Grigg, S.Edwards, King
:gotigers
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B: Morris, Chaplin, Grimes
HB: Vlastuin, Rance, Houli
C: Deledio, Cotchin, Ellis
HF: Lennon, Riewoldt, Knights
F: A.Edwards, Vickery, McBean
R: Maric, Conca, Martin
I: Jackson, Hampson, Foley
S: Newman
E: Grigg, S.Edwards, Kingb
:gotigers
Take the Edwards brothers out
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They're not brothers jm
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They're not brothers jm
Sorry my bad
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They're not brothers jm
Sorry my bad
:thumbsup
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In what I think are their best positions (mostly):
B: Morris, Chaplin, Grimes
HB: Vlastuin, Rance, Deledio
C: Arnot, Cotchin, Ellis
HF: Lennon, Riewoldt, Petterd
F: McDonough, Vickery, McBean
R: Maric, Conca, Martin
I: Jackson, Hampson, Houli
S: S. Edwards
Tempted to put in an upgraded Banfumbles just for his badly needed pace alone, would also love to find a spot for Darrou but he also needs to be elevated first. Have Arnot there because I rate him and we look a bit soft without him.
Would actually prefer Jack at FP - but I can't really see anyone else good enough to play permanent CHF at this stage.Cameron or bust 2016. Would play Vickery in Petterd's position if Griffith, Elton or even that Lloyd bloke finally come on.
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b/ grimes - chaplin - morris
hb/ conca - rance - batchelor
c/ grigg - tuck - deledio
r/ maric - martin - cotchin
hf/ knights - griffiths - s edwards
f/ a edwards - riewoldt - vickery
int/ foley - ellis - helbig - pick 9 stringer. (Vlastuin)
depth nahas, houli, jackson, newman, king. arnott,
:gotigers
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Same as last year
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Miles upgrade on tucky so that's a win.
The bolded areas IMO concern.
Lacking polish and pace in the back line. Cooney maleski griffin O'Rourke Christiason frawley etc. Would of been Handy
Thankfully Nahas and king are gone. Sadly houli still viewed as un-droppable.
Funny to see claw include Vickery-griffiths-riewoldt-aedwards in same fwd line. Hopefully mcbean isngiven a go. Ditto arnot. Shame about helbig
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B Chaplin Astbury Vlastuin
HB Grimes Rance Batchelor
C Houli Cotchin Conca
HF Deledio Griffiths Martin
F Vickery Riewoldt Edwards
R Maric Ellis Miles
Int Lennon McDonough Foley
Sub Petterd
No room for Newy.
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That backline would not hold up IMO. Despite his flaws we need Morris back there to play on the dangerous smalls
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b/ grimes - chaplin - morris
hb/ vlastuin - rance - astbury
c/ Ellis - Martin - Conca
r/ maric - Miles - cotchin
hf/ Deledio - griffiths - s edwards
f/ gordon - riewoldt - vickery
int/ foley - Houli/Grigg (can have one but not both) - Lennon - petterd
I'd like to squeeze the biscuit in there but he was only given 4 games this year and its hard to decide.
EDIT: adapted from Claw and yeah not a lot's changed.
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I like it lamington - nice lineup. Backline looks solid. Would also have batchelor in the 22 ahead of petterd, would slot him in the backline and put Vlas in the guts on a wing and conca on the bench.
Hoping lennon with a full preseason will step up and ahead of Gordon and petterd. Hoping Arnott can be an extra bash and crash midfielder to take pressure of Cotch and Miles and allow Martin to spend more time deep fwd. Hoping Conca can have a big preseason and step up to also assist adequately. Want to see Lids play High HF all season, think he can be a 30-40 goal HF.
Im saying the word hoping a lot :lol
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Same as it was last year. :gobdrop
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Same as it was last year. :gobdrop
Meet the new boss.
Same as the old boss
(1971) Pete Townshend
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Same as it was last year. :gobdrop
:lol :clapping
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b/ grimes - chaplin - morris
hb/ conca - rance - batchelor
c/ grigg - tuck - deledio
r/ maric - martin - cotchin
hf/ knights - griffiths - s edwards
f/ a edwards - riewoldt - vickery
int/ foley - ellis - helbig - pick 9 stringer. (Vlastuin)
depth nahas, houli, jackson, newman, king. arnott,
:gotigers
nothing much has changed from 2012. that team was never good enough and the only new face i can think of is miles who has done enough to be considered a good player.
3 yrs of stagnation. 3 yrs of locked and loaded.
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our best 22 based on games and performance this yr.
b/ morris - astbury- chaplin
hb/ houli - rance - vlastuin
c/ ellis - martin - grigg
r maric - cotchin - miles
hf/ deledio - vickery - newman
ff/ edwards - riewoldt - griffiths.
int/ conca - foley - petterd - thomas.
it was a battle to find a dozen half decent consistently good players yet alone 22. this is the best 22. on every line at least one dud underperformer or questionable player.
our trouble when you look at whats in the wings well its down right laughable. they all fall uder the dud, underperforming, or questionable banner
me id like to see the following team knowing it will struggle a little and given the hand we have. to improve many in this team will have to step up and force out the numerous duds.
b/ morris - astbury - chaplin/grimes
hb/ dea - rance - mcintosh
c/ ellis - martin - pick 12.
r/ maric - cotchin - miles
hf/ deledio - griffiths - knights
ff/ lloyd - riewoldt - lennon.
int/ mcbean, vlastuin, conca, edwards.
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r maric - cotchin - miles
on every line at least one dud underperformer or questionable player.
This line looks okay to me :shh
Other than that I'd like Knights out of your second team and maybe an Arnot or McDonut or even a later pick from this draft (FJ special so unlikely ;D) in.
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#1
Deledio. Astbury. Grimes.
#12. Rance. Lennon.
Conca. Miles. Ellis.
Edwards. Griffith's. Knights.
Riewoldt. Mcbean. Martin.
Maric. Vlastuin. Cotchin
Vickery
Morris - tagger
#32
arnot
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No matter what 22 you pick I can always see at least 2, sometimes 3-4 blokes that I would love to F off and wouldn't be sentimental about at all.
It's always the proverbial weakest 6 that count as opposed to the strongest 6 blokes in the side. But these 2-4 blokes are just unacceptable.
Hoping to get 1 good kid every year in the draft is going to kill us. One at a time is too slow and will end with us sliding down the ladder. Get our first pick wrong and we're in real trouble IMO.
Need the improve this list dramatically and we've blown our chance to do that this year unless we pull a couple of gems out of the PSD again like Miles last year.
Should have traded/free agented in another 2 good players, then drafted another 2 and tried to get some depth through the PSD.
I'm tipping we miss the 8 next year.
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My best 22.
Mostly done on form/talent but a few on hope...
I must admit I did have a few spots that just didn't fill themselves which tells me we are still a few short. Players like Houli, Grigg, Petterd, Thomas, Gordon should all be depth players pushing our best 22 but should only be getting games if we have injuries and can come in and play a roll.
The other guys on our list I just don't see making it, I hope I'm wrong on a few like Lloyd, McIntosh and McDonough but I'm not holding my breath.
Definately need a quick quick wingman, small forward and more outside run in the midfield. Hopefully pick 12 is one of those.
Imo our best 22 is pretty good but players like Newman and Foley need to be upgraded with better players but at the moment they are both in our best 22
Vickery, Griffiths and McBean hold the answers to us improving from a middle of the table side to a top 4 side. Our forward line is by far our weakest link. Need something special from one or all of those blokes to become a better side.
I would have been wrapped if we had of traded Conca for a pick in the teens to pick up something we lack as I mention. I just don't see him getting any better and still has currency but would not be missed at all.
Grimes Rance Morris
Dea Chaplin Newman
Ellis Foley Vlastuin
Dusty Griffiths Lids
Edwards Jack Vickery
Maric Miles Cotch
Lennon McBean Conca Arnot
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Grimes Rance Morris
Dea Chaplin Newman
Ellis Foley Vlastuin
Dusty Griffiths Lids
Edwards Jack Vickery
Maric Miles Cotch
Lennon McBean Conca Arnot
Pretty much go with that
Of course the club will have Perttard and Grigg in there and probably Flash as well
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Backs: morris Rance Astbury
HBACKS: Valstuin Chaplin Grimes
WING: Edwards Cotchin Ellis
HFORWARDS: Dids griff Dusty
Forwards: Gordon jack Conca
Ruck : Maric
RRover: Miles
Rover: ROBINSON ( we will pick him up in the draft with a late pick watch this space)
Inter from: Foley,Mcbean (Vickery), lennon, newman
I still worry about pace I cant find it anywhere specially of the backline :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead maybe pick 12 can be that hbf runner
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Rover: ROBINSON ( we will pick him up in the draft with a late pick watch this space)
Good we always need new whipping boys and with his lack of discipline he will be a monty for it
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Backs: morris Rance Astbury
HBACKS: Valstuin Chaplin Grimes
WING: Edwards Cotchin Ellis
HFORWARDS: Dids griff Dusty
Forwards: Gordon jack Conca
Ruck : Maric
RRover: Miles
Rover: ROBINSON ( we will pick him up in the draft with a late pick watch this space)
Inter from: Foley,Mcbean (Vickery), lennon, newman
I still worry about pace I cant find it anywhere specially of the backline :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead maybe pick 12 can be that hbf runner
Menadue :pray
we may not have quality but we got some quanity pace from the 3rd pick onwards
hunt > robinson :cheers
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No matter what 22 you pick I can always see at least 2, sometimes 3-4 blokes that I would love to F off and wouldn't be sentimental about at all.
It's always the proverbial weakest 6 that count as opposed to the strongest 6 blokes in the side. But these 2-4 blokes are just unacceptable.
Hoping to get 1 good kid every year in the draft is going to kill us. One at a time is too slow and will end with us sliding down the ladder. Get our first pick wrong and we're in real trouble IMO.
Need the improve this list dramatically and we've blown our chance to do that this year unless we pull a couple of gems out of the PSD again like Miles last year.
Should have traded/free agented in another 2 good players, then drafted another 2 and tried to get some depth through the PSD.
I'm tipping we miss the 8 next year.
hopefully ellis (49%) and hunt come stright into the 22
Menadue :pray
one of the fast ones too
thats sees; grigg, houli, newman and someone else out :clapping
-
Forwards: Petterd -- Riewoldt -- Gordon
Half Forwards: Edwards -- Vickery -- Deledio
Centre Line: Vlastuin -- Martin -- Ellis
Rucks: Maric -- Miles -- Cotchin
Half Backs: Morris -- Chaplain -- Houli
Backs: Grimes -- Rance -- Astbury
Interchange: Conca -- Hunt -- Newman -- Thomas
I'd start with this group and i'd be utterly ruthless with performance, basic development is over with this lot, its time to put out or get out.
Players in this lot with the most to loose are Petterd, Vickery, Conca, Newman, Grimes, and Thomas. That's 6 positions really, that are up for grabs.
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its sposed to go backs -> fwds :(
very interesting year in regards to favoritism
does hardwick like gordon ??
Forwards: Petterd -- Riewoldt -- Gordon
Half Forwards: Edwards -- Vickery -- Deledio
Centre Line: Vlastuin -- Martin -- Ellis
Rucks: Maric -- Miles -- Cotchin
Half Backs: Morris -- Chaplain -- Houli
Backs: Grimes -- Rance -- Astbury
Interchange: Conca -- Hunt -- Newman -- Thomas
intersting to see how these guys goes in games vs people drafted in last couple years such as new foley and mr 49%, donuts, arnot, helbig ;)
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U can't make strawberry jam out of rocking horse poo
no matter which way you count it.
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conca guts dont look that fat in that pick well done concs :clapping
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conca guts dont look that fat in that pick well done concs :clapping
He was reaching up so he flattened it out
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B: Morris Chaplin Astbury
HB: Vlastuin Rance B.Ellis
C: Menadue Miles Drummond/Butler
HF: Sheds Lids McKenzie
F: Griff Jack C.Ellis
R: Ivan Dusty Cotch
Int: Vickery Grimes Butler sub: Petterd
Outs: Grigg. Houli. Plus any other slow thinking or stupid players
Now, let me explain ...
I gifted games to draftees for no real reason, mainly just to see how it looks. Couldn't decide between Drummond or Butler, time will tell, but speedy wingers with elite endurance is the idea. Reality may be a lot different, wait & see. Would love to name Lambert but he's only rookie listed. Apologies to Gordon (didn't do much wrong), there's always next week. Vickery only to relieve Ivan & staying the hell out of the F50. I wanted to name C.Ellis in the centre but couldn't justify an all-draftee centre line, not yet anyway. Plenty of rotations there but I want Ivan, Dusty, Cotch & Miles as starting 4.
Gameplan: Forget positions. Behind the ball - everybody! Stay Home Forward - McKenzie with Sheds/Cotch to crumb. Leading Forwards with licences to roam & fly - Jack & Lids. Play a Pagan's Paddock style, try to get the ball to Griff around halfway & deliver 80mtr bombs to Jack/McKenzie/Lids.
Can't believe I based a forward gameplan around a draftee over a dual Coleman Medalist, but I think Jack is better suited to roam & create than McKenzie. Based on feedback from our pre-season training McKenzie can mark anything, anywhere, anytime over anybody - I just had to put him in the square, only question is on his running & stamina.
:gotigers
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B: Morris Chaplin Astbury
HB: Vlastuin Rance B.Ellis
C: Menadue Miles Drummond/Butler
HF: Sheds Lids McKenzie
F: Griff Jack C.Ellis
R: Ivan Dusty Cotch
Int: Vickery Grimes Butler sub: Petterd
Outs: Grigg. Houli. Plus any other slow thinking or stupid players
Now, let me explain ...
I gifted games to draftees for no real reason, mainly just to see how it looks. Couldn't decide between Drummond or Butler, time will tell, but speedy wingers with elite endurance is the idea. Reality may be a lot different, wait & see. Would love to name Lambert but he's only rookie listed. Apologies to Gordon (didn't do much wrong), there's always next week. Vickery only to relieve Ivan & staying the hell out of the F50. I wanted to name C.Ellis in the centre but couldn't justify an all-draftee centre line, not yet anyway. Plenty of rotations there but I want Ivan, Dusty, Cotch & Miles as starting 4.
Gameplan: Forget positions. Behind the ball - everybody! Stay Home Forward - McKenzie with Sheds/Cotch to crumb. Leading Forwards with licences to roam & fly - Jack & Lids. Play a Pagan's Paddock style, try to get the ball to Griff around halfway & deliver 80mtr bombs to Jack/McKenzie/Lids.
Can't believe I based a forward gameplan around a draftee over a dual Coleman Medalist, but I think Jack is better suited to roam & create than McKenzie. Based on feedback from our pre-season training McKenzie can mark anything, anywhere, anytime over anybody - I just had to put him in the square, only question is on his running & stamina.
:gotigers
No room for conca?
-
He's fat
-
B: Morris Chaplin Astbury
HB: Vlastuin Rance B.Ellis
C: Menadue Miles Drummond/Butler
HF: Sheds Lids McKenzie
F: Griff Jack C.Ellis
R: Ivan Dusty Cotch
Int: Vickery Grimes Butler sub: Petterd
Outs: Grigg. Houli. Plus any other slow thinking or stupid players
Now, let me explain ...
I gifted games to draftees for no real reason, mainly just to see how it looks. Couldn't decide between Drummond or Butler, time will tell, but speedy wingers with elite endurance is the idea. Reality may be a lot different, wait & see. Would love to name Lambert but he's only rookie listed. Apologies to Gordon (didn't do much wrong), there's always next week. Vickery only to relieve Ivan & staying the hell out of the F50. I wanted to name C.Ellis in the centre but couldn't justify an all-draftee centre line, not yet anyway. Plenty of rotations there but I want Ivan, Dusty, Cotch & Miles as starting 4.
Gameplan: Forget positions. Behind the ball - everybody! Stay Home Forward - McKenzie with Sheds/Cotch to crumb. Leading Forwards with licences to roam & fly - Jack & Lids. Play a Pagan's Paddock style, try to get the ball to Griff around halfway & deliver 80mtr bombs to Jack/McKenzie/Lids.
Can't believe I based a forward gameplan around a draftee over a dual Coleman Medalist, but I think Jack is better suited to roam & create than McKenzie. Based on feedback from our pre-season training McKenzie can mark anything, anywhere, anytime over anybody - I just had to put him in the square, only question is on his running & stamina.
:gotigers
No room for conca?
Nup! Check your own avatar & compare it to my list of outs ...
Conca will get his chances though, I actually think he is a very good player that we just haven't seen the best of yet for various reasons, injury being one of them.
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Your club's best 22 for round one, 2015
Jennifer Phelan
afl.com.au
December 6, 2014, 4.40pm
AFTER all the de-listings, trades and drafting, how is your club looking for round one next year? Our reporters name the ultimate line-up you can expect for each team when the opening skirmishes begin next April.
Richmond
B: Dylan Grimes, Alex Rance, David Astbury
HB: Bachar Houli, Troy Chaplin, Steven Morris
C: Nick Vlastuin, Reece Conca, Brandon Ellis
HF: Dustin Martin, Ben Griffiths, Brett Deledio
F: Shane Edwards, Jack Riewoldt, Nathan Gordon
R: Ivan Maric, Trent Cotchin, Anthony Miles
I/C: Chris Newman, Taylor Hunt, Ricky Petterd
Sub: Nathan Foley
New: Taylor Hunt (Geelong)
Unavailable: Nil
Comment:
The Tigers are playing Carlton in round one and the Blues have some tall options in their forward line, which could see the yellow and black go in with a bigger backline. Later on, a need for more run could see a reshuffle with Grimes a casualty in favour of Morris moving to a back pocket, Vlastuin to a back flank and Shaun Grigg onto a wing. Astbury's early season form before his knee injury this year sees him get the nod over Jake Batchelor. There's also scope to move the forward line around and bring in another tall, with Ty Vickery missing out based on the Tigers' preferred set-up late in the season that used Griffiths instead. Liam McBean could push for a senior debut at some stage after finishing fourth in the VFL's goalkicking. The likes of Sam Lloyd, Chris Knights and Matt McDonough will compete with Gordon for a spot in the forward line. The Tigers spent much of last season trying to discover Ben Lennon's best position and he'll be looking to break into the team early after off-season hip surgery.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-12-06/your-clubs-best-22
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Slow back linewith four kpd
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Slow back linewith four kpd
Yeah not too much run coming from that back 6 bar Houli....
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Pfffft
With Astbury, Chaplin and Grimes there you can just use Rance to run the ball out. Grimes is very quick too. I'd be using him as a small/medium defender and teaching him to play a rebounding role with his leg speed.
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Grimes is fast. For mine he doesn't seem a natural rebounding defender and I'm not sure if he is good enoughs kick, Yet he's very young for a tall back.
Astbury is pretty much a full back now. Good kick but is he much of a runner?
Chaplin is a liability. Worst 7th defender in the league IMO regardless of intercept mark stats. And get a found out when having to defend. Would like to see him win as but in the grigg-thomas-hampson boat
If you had Burgoyne or mcveigh in the back pocket its be less of an issue - as good as morris is when fit, his strength isn't attacking rebound
Further more you lose a midfielder / half back rotation which potential make the side slower
In a perfect world deledio would be your 4th tall back , IMO. Not troy
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Geeees ... Jennifer must be a keen archeologist during the off-season, I think she found that side on a Pyramid wall! ;D
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Geeees ... Jennifer must be a keen archeologist during the off-season, I think she found that side on a Pyramid wall! ;D
Or she is aware ofdimma favoritism ppolicy's
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Your AFL club’s best 22: Who makes the cut?
Herald-Sun
January 23, 2015 4:02PM
RICHMOND
B: Troy Chaplin, David Astbury, Steven Morris
HB: Dylan Grimes, Alex Rance, Bachar Houli
C: Brandon Ellis, Dustin Martin, Shane Edwards
HF: Brett Deledio, Ben Griffiths, Nick Vlastuin
F: Ty Vickery, Jack Riewoldt, Ben Lennon
FOLL: Ivan Maric, Anthony Miles, Trent Cotchin
I/C: Chris Newman, Shaun Grigg, Taylor Hunt, Reece Conca
Not picked: Jake Batchelor, Nathan Foley, Nathan Gordon, Sam Lloyd, Chris Knights
Astbury returns from a knee injury and takes Batchelor’s spot. Ben Lennon will get more chances in his second season but Gordon, Lloyd and Knights are all contenders for that small forward spot. The Tigers say they want to play Riewoldt, Griffiths and Vickery in the same side.
http://www.news.com.au/sport/breaking-news/your-afl-clubs-best-22-who-makes-the-cut/story-fnect155-1227194808450
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Best 22 with grigg, newman, chaplin and vickery :huh
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Best 22 with grigg, newman, chaplin and vickery :huh
All are best 22 bar Grigg as of last game last year IMO.
Hoping other players will overtake these guys is a different argument.
On record, those 3 mention are better preformed than any others.
Putting Lennon in front of others is shear hope, on form he has been below AFL standard.
We all hope these kids are going to improve and push older players out but until they preform it's only hope.
Interested who you think replaces Chaplin and Vickery?
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Astbury and Chaplin in makes us pretty slow. I'd go Batch for Chaplin. Vickery out and Knights in. Also you would probably go Gordon over Lennon at this stage.
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Alot of talls in the back line.
Does Grimes get a gig with Astbury in?
I'd have a fit knights on a hff in place of Vlastuin, and shift vlas back to take Newmans place on the bench. Newman Po.
Vickery, I'm giving him one year to prove himself. It's counter intuitive for me but apparently he's the size of a house now...
Grigg yeah well....what do you do
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Alot of talls in the back line.
Does Grimes get a gig with Astbury in?
I'd have a fit knights on a hff in place of Vlastuin, and shift vlas back to take Newmans place on the bench. Newman Po.
Vickery, I'm giving him one year to prove himself. It's counter intuitive for me but apparently he's the size of a house now...
Grigg yeah well....what do you do
I'd like to say no because I'd rather another small/medium defender in there but Grimes can play small pretty well so depending on match ups he probably will get a game with Astbury.
I'd personally like Gordon in before Knights purely because he's had a year with us to get used to everything and he performed now and then last year and Knights can get a few gigs in the VFL just to see whether Gordon is worth persisting with, but Knights probably is the better player
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could Taylor Hunt play off half back. He is quick and would give good run of half back.
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:banghead :banghead :banghead
We finally brought in a proven run with player WHY STUFF WITH IT?! Oh I know we have Grigg ::) ::)
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Best 22 with grigg, newman, chaplin and vickery :huh
All are best 22 bar Grigg as of last game last year IMO.
Hoping other players will overtake these guys is a different argument.
On record, those 3 mention are better preformed than any others.
Putting Lennon in front of others is shear hope, on form he has been below AFL standard.
We all hope these kids are going to improve and push older players out but until they preform it's only hope.
Interested who you think replaces Chaplin and Vickery?
tone based on record grigg is easily best 22, so is petterd.
based on record the best 22 would go.
fb/ morris - chaplin - grimes
hb/ houli - rance - newman.
c/ ellis - martin - grigg
hf/ edwards - vickery - deledio
ff/ knights - riewoldt - griffiths
r/ maric - cotchin - miles.
int from/ foley - hunt - petterd - vlastuin thomas conca.
we all know our best 22 will get us nowhere near a flag thus we need to play others to improve. we should have been doing this the last 2 yrs but went with mainly so so mature types from both within and without.
my concern has been and remains when you look at where we really need to improve there is little competition coming thru.
the other concern remains the fact that we do need to improve on about half of our best 22 players. and im not saying they are all duds they just have no more upside and cant take us further.
the hope is blokes like c ellis lennon menadue mcintosh mcbean and some others can out perform the current lot when they earn a game.
i think just about every poster on this site is guilty of wanting to see more of the kids get games. what very few of us are prepared to admit at times is the kids are not as good ATM AS THOS WHO GET GAMES.
Its a catch 22 play lesser performing kids and maybe drop a few games we cant afford to drop if finals is the aim, or play those older players who give a fair bit more and give ourself the best chance to play finals.
me i think the bigger picture has to be looked at. we must make hard calls on those who HAVE SHOWN THEY HAVE NO MORE TO GIVE. Play lesser performing kids who have upside IN THEIR STEAD.
It may mean we miss finals but long term it may unearth enough players that can take us further down the track.Clearly so far or the last 2 seasons playing more kids would mean no finals it seems no one is really prepared to maybe miss finals but complain about not enough kids getting a game. Imo atm we cant have it both ways. play the senior players who are easily out performing most of the juniors and development players, but have reached their ceiling thus they give us the best chance at finals. or we cut the senior players play lesser performing juniors fast tracking them and likely miss finals.
it could be we miss finals either way so play the kids imo and be prepared to cop a little pain now so we get some joy later.
geez i can imagine the reaction of most supporters if we dont make finals this yr. because of this i think the older blokes who give a bit more will very much be getting games over the kids.
we all talk about the kids earning a game the stark reality is few so far have out performed incumbent players.
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I want us to play kids, give them game time to develop them. They also create enthusiasm which spreads to the senior players. Of course, the older types can still get games if they play well. When guys like Chaplin last year were stinking it up in the first half of the season, I was screaming to drop them and give the kids a go. We couldn't have gone any worse, as we were losing games continually with our seniors. If the seniors are winning games against good opposition they should be played.
Bottom line is if you are earning your spot in the team by playing your role well each week then you hold your spot. If you don't, you make way for a junior to allow them to be fast tracked in the seniors. You can quickly tell if they can become comfortable with the pace of the game. You play the juniors in 4 week blocks to give them a good taste and continue to play them if they play well. Too many times a junior is elevated then dropped after showing something or not having had the chance to show anything.
Just my 2 cents worth.
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Alot of talls in the back line.
Does Grimes get a gig with Astbury in?
I'd have a fit knights on a hff in place of Vlastuin, and shift vlas back to take Newmans place on the bench. Newman Po.
Vickery, I'm giving him one year to prove himself. It's counter intuitive for me but apparently he's the size of a house now...
Grigg yeah well....what do you do
I'd like to say no because I'd rather another small/medium defender in there but Grimes can play small pretty well so depending on match ups he probably will get a game with Astbury.
I'd personally like Gordon in before Knights purely because he's had a year with us to get used to everything and he performed now and then last year and Knights can get a few gigs in the VFL just to see whether Gordon is worth persisting with, but Knights probably is the better player
Makes sense :gotigers
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I want us to play kids, give them game time to develop them. They also create enthusiasm which spreads to the senior players. Of course, the older types can still get games if they play well. When guys like Chaplin last year were stinking it up in the first half of the season, I was screaming to drop them and give the kids a go. We couldn't have gone any worse, as we were losing games continually with our seniors. If the seniors are winning games against good opposition they should be played.
Bottom line is if you are earning your spot in the team by playing your role well each week then you hold your spot. If you don't, you make way for a junior to allow them to be fast tracked in the seniors. You can quickly tell if they can become comfortable with the pace of the game. You play the juniors in 4 week blocks to give them a good taste and continue to play them if they play well. Too many times a junior is elevated then dropped after showing something or not having had the chance to show anything.
Just my 2 cents worth.
:clapping :clapping
Agree
Great post
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Best 22 with grigg, newman, chaplin and vickery :huh
All are best 22 bar Grigg as of last game last year IMO.
Hoping other players will overtake these guys is a different argument.
On record, those 3 mention are better preformed than any others.
Putting Lennon in front of others is shear hope, on form he has been below AFL standard.
We all hope these kids are going to improve and push older players out but until they preform it's only hope.
Interested who you think replaces Chaplin and Vickery?
tone based on record grigg is easily best 22, so is petterd.
based on record the best 22 would go.
fb/ morris - chaplin - grimes
hb/ houli - rance - newman.
c/ ellis - martin - grigg
hf/ edwards - vickery - deledio
ff/ knights - riewoldt - griffiths
r/ maric - cotchin - miles.
int from/ foley - hunt - petterd - vlastuin thomas conca.
we all know our best 22 will get us nowhere near a flag thus we need to play others to improve. we should have been doing this the last 2 yrs but went with mainly so so mature types from both within and without.
my concern has been and remains when you look at where we really need to improve there is little competition coming thru.
the other concern remains the fact that we do need to improve on about half of our best 22 players. and im not saying they are all duds they just have no more upside and cant take us further.
the hope is blokes like c ellis lennon menadue mcintosh mcbean and some others can out perform the current lot when they earn a game.
i think just about every poster on this site is guilty of wanting to see more of the kids get games. what very few of us are prepared to admit at times is the kids are not as good ATM AS THOS WHO GET GAMES.
Its a catch 22 play lesser performing kids and maybe drop a few games we cant afford to drop if finals is the aim, or play those older players who give a fair bit more and give ourself the best chance to play finals.
me i think the bigger picture has to be looked at. we must make hard calls on those who HAVE SHOWN THEY HAVE NO MORE TO GIVE. Play lesser performing kids who have upside IN THEIR STEAD.
It may mean we miss finals but long term it may unearth enough players that can take us further down the track.Clearly so far or the last 2 seasons playing more kids would mean no finals it seems no one is really prepared to maybe miss finals but complain about not enough kids getting a game. Imo atm we cant have it both ways. play the senior players who are easily out performing most of the juniors and development players, but have reached their ceiling thus they give us the best chance at finals. or we cut the senior players play lesser performing juniors fast tracking them and likely miss finals.
it could be we miss finals either way so play the kids imo and be prepared to cop a little pain now so we get some joy later.
geez i can imagine the reaction of most supporters if we dont make finals this yr. because of this i think the older blokes who give a bit more will very much be getting games over the kids.
we all talk about the kids earning a game the stark reality is few so far have out performed incumbent players.
Totally understand what you said about Grigg and Petterd, I should have been a bit clear on what I meant. Those two have better "records" than say Vlastuin and even Grimes but on what they have shown to date indicates that both are going to be very good AFL players. In Lennons case, and I really like the look of the kid, but what he has shown to date isn't all that much, that's why I said it was more hope than anything else.
I'd play all 3 in place of Petterd, Grigg and Houli. These guys have taken us as far as they are going to.
I also think if it's done right we can play a couple of kids at a time and not loose any ground. Dimma just needs to be smart with how he does it. He needs to give the kids confidence that even though they are young they can still play a roll in our team. I think a lot of the time a kid comes in and thinks he needs to get 20 touches to prove himself. All he should be thinking is about doing his particular role. I tend to think we still think like individuals and not a collective group.
Every time I hear a Hawthorn player speak it's always about playing his role for the team, and when it's said I actually believe that the player means it and it's not just a throw away line.
-
I want us to play kids, give them game time to develop them. They also create enthusiasm which spreads to the senior players. Of course, the older types can still get games if they play well. When guys like Chaplin last year were stinking it up in the first half of the season, I was screaming to drop them and give the kids a go. We couldn't have gone any worse, as we were losing games continually with our seniors. If the seniors are winning games against good opposition they should be played.
Bottom line is if you are earning your spot in the team by playing your role well each week then you hold your spot. If you don't, you make way for a junior to allow them to be fast tracked in the seniors. You can quickly tell if they can become comfortable with the pace of the game. You play the juniors in 4 week blocks to give them a good taste and continue to play them if they play well. Too many times a junior is elevated then dropped after showing something or not having had the chance to show anything.
Just my 2 cents worth.
i agree and in pretty well much the same camp.
oh and tone i also agree with your post.
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so after our first pre season game and going by what has been said by hardwick we can be pretty sure that the following side will go very close to being the team for rnd1.
by the sound of things most of the younger blokes have had their hit out now its time for the favorites.
fb: hunt - astbury - chaplin
hb: houli - rance - vlastuin.
mid: ellis - martin - grigg
foll: maric - cotchin - miles
hf: knights - vickery- deledio
ff: morris - riewoldt - griffiths
int: newman - conca - petterd - foley.
emg: one of lambert, thomas, arnot.
if morris plays fwd then hunt will play back. im not keen on this i think hunt poor by foot and decision making. reckon knights will come in also at the expense of lennon.
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Think Gordon plays before Knights
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Think Gordon plays before Knights
Don't think either will play round 1 TBH
Gordon was average at best yesterday, thought he was very disappointing
Knights needs game time after missing 18 months of footy
Based on yesterday Lambert has to play
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Think Gordon plays before Knights
na too big a dud. knights didnt have a big game his first in almost 18mths but the poise and polish was there for all to see. imo hes a monty if he gets thru the pre season unscathed.
any way its not what i would do its what im pretty sure the club will do.
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I'd like to see a couple more games before predicting this.
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Knights has class. That play in the last keeping the ball in front of him from way out not panicking and kicking the ball to Gordon who goaled was what we miss generally from our small forwards.
Class, poise and situational awareness both for the current play and the game in general.
If he is fit IMHO he should build on those four games in two seasons.
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I'd like to see a couple more games before predicting this.
why to watch the kids who may push there way in. it isnt going to happen read hardwicks presser. hes basically written of the juniors.
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:nopity
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I'd like to see a couple more games before predicting this.
why to watch the kids who may push there way in. it isnt going to happen read hardwicks presser. hes basically written of the juniors.
he's probably read you posts and come to the conclusion that we drafted the wrong kids so why bother persisting with them?
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B Lennon Rance Grimes
HB Houli Chaplin Batchelor
C Conca Miles Vlastuin
HF Martin Griffiths Deledio
F Edwards Reiwoldt Morris
R Maric Cotchin Ellis
Int Hunt
Foley
Newman
Grigg (sub)
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Hardwick: “The majority of the players we played [against the Dogs] probably won’t be participating early in the season ...”
http://www.richmondfc.com.au/news/2015-03-03/top-tigers-ease-into-it
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:phew
thats a relief !!!
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B Lennon Rance Grimes
HB Houli Chaplin Batchelor
C Conca Miles Vlastuin
HF Martin Griffiths Deledio
F Edwards Reiwoldt Morris
R Maric Cotchin Ellis
Int Hunt
Foley
Newman
Grigg (sub)
Probably close though I hope for a couple of changes. I would definitively have Asbury in before Batchelor and I hope we can find a couple to replace Grigg and Newman. Not sure Lennon will get in yet, though l do hope the next few preseason games he shows a bit more and makes it into the team.
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My current 'best' 22 after NAB 2:
B: Grimes Chaplin Batchelor
HB: Houli Rance Vlastuin
C: Ellis Martin Hunt
HF: Deledio Vickery Lennon
F: Edwards Riewoldt Morris
R: Maric Miles Cotchin
Int: Grigg, Conca, Petterd
Sub: Lloyd
Emg: Knights, McIntosh, Lambert
I didn't consider Newy, Astbury, Griffiths, Foley or C.Ellis due to injury/absence so far in preseason matches.
I have Morris in a FP because that's where Dimma wants him to apply defensive pressure. Quiet yesterday though.
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My current 'best' 22 after NAB 2:
B: Grimes Chaplin Batchelor
HB: Houli Rance Vlastuin
C: Ellis Martin Hunt
HF: Deledio Vickery Lennon
F: Edwards Riewoldt Morris
R: Maric Miles Cotchin
Int: Grigg, Conca, Petterd
Sub: Lloyd
Emg: Knights, McIntosh, Lambert
I didn't consider Newy, Astbury, Griffiths, Foley or C.Ellis due to injury/absence so far in preseason matches.
I have Morris in a FP because that's where Dimma wants him to apply defensive pressure. Quiet yesterday though.
Pretty much what I would of said after yesterday. The two big questions that have to be answered are both Griffiths and Astbury. If they come up who makes way for them as for me they are both top 22. The obvios answers are Batch and Vickery but it realy depends on how they want to structure the side. 3 tall fowards? 4 tall backs? Might be a little top heavy. Some defentate selection headaches which is a good thing.
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Pretty much what I would of said after yesterday. The two big questions that have to be answered are both Griffiths and Astbury. If they come up who makes way for them as for me they are both top 22. The obvios answers are Batch and Vickery but it realy depends on how they want to structure the side. 3 tall fowards? 4 tall backs? Might be a little top heavy. Some defentate selection headaches which is a good thing.
Thought Batch went ok and I'm not normally his biggest fan but like so much in yesterday's game it was nearly impossible to draw a line through the form because the 2 sides were so mismatched.
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Vickery IMHO is not best 22.
He'd be best 26 or 27. That is of course Astbury and Griffiths are fit.
Did we miss Ty in the lead in to the finals while Griff was at CHF.?
Ty just doesn't do enough.
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Thought I'd bump this.
would like to see your best 22. :thumbsup
In light of yesterday, 3 talls forward line doesn't appear to work for us so which tall do we take in with Jack.
Is Chaplin in our best defensive lineup?
The Morris experiment? Does he have a place in our best 22?
Who do we use for sub?
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Chaplin is a very good player, anyone who doesn't have him best 22 should do the honourable thing and close their OER account so as not to waste the time of people who know the game.
Morris has a place but it should be as a small defender. I think Astbury will miss as will Vickery who I would play.
I'd also play Morris back and play Knights forward if fit with Batchelor or Lennon getting squeezed out.
I reckon it will be something like:
B: Grimes Chaplin Batchelor
HB: Houli Rance Vlastuin
C: Ellis Martin Hunt
HF: Deledio Griffiths Lennon
F: Edwards Riewoldt Morris
R: Maric Miles Cotchin
Int: Grigg, Conca, Lambert
Sub: Lloyd
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I would go with
Grimes Chaplin Morris
Houli Rance Vlastuin
Ellis Martin Hunt
Deledio Griffiths Lennon
Lloyd Riewoldt Edwards
Maric Miles Cotchin
Lambert Grigg Conca Vickery
Maric was struggling yesterday and we need to have someone who can take some ruck duties, in that event I would have Griff as the 2nd ruckman and Vickery could take the 2nd key forward spot or we could move Jack to CHF and place big Ivan down at Full Forward
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Chaplin is a very good player, anyone who doesn't have him best 22 should do the honourable thing and close their OER account so as not to waste the time of people who know the game.
Morris has a place but it should be as a small defender. I think Astbury will miss as will Vickery who I would play.
I'd also play Morris back and play Knights forward if fit with Batchelor or Lennon getting squeezed out.
I reckon it will be something like:
B: Grimes Chaplin Batchelor
HB: Houli Rance Vlastuin
C: Ellis Martin Hunt
HF: Deledio Griffiths Lennon
F: Edwards Riewoldt Morris
R: Maric Miles Cotchin
Int: Grigg, Conca, Lambert
Sub: Lloyd
Basically on the money
Swap McIntosh for Lennon ??
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Swap mcintosh for lambert, dreaming of another Miles
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Do u reckon Newman knows he not best 22 or would he reckon he was?
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Why all the love for Lambert?
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Do u reckon Newman knows he not best 22 or would he reckon he was?
I reckon his a walk up start when fit
No reserves side for this bloke
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What does experience actually equate to, in his case?
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Yeah I was forgetting McIntosh.
In ahead of Lambert.
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What does experience actually equate to, in his case?
a very nice salary ;D
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Thought I'd bump this.
would like to see your best 22. :thumbsup
In light of yesterday, 3 talls forward line doesn't appear to work for us so which tall do we take in with Jack.
Is Chaplin in our best defensive lineup?
The Morris experiment? Does he have a place in our best 22?
Who do we use for sub?
I'd say most people are missing the point on the 3 forwards thing not working.
2 points here:-
Golden rule of business - structure first, then people. Should be the same ina football team but it seems the match committee are trying to squeeze Ty into the forward line. Makes no sense. Tail doesn't wag the dog Dimma
Even if the structure required 3 talks - it's not that the structure isn't working, it's the dead weight playing in it!
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I don't agree with that.
Vickery can play footy at this level, there is no question about that.
But Hardwick has been on a mission to destroy the forward line for the last 3 years with almost every public comment and structural move he has made being demonstrably inept.
None of our forwards have benefited one bit from the coach. Riewoldt has managed, albeit after a dip because he is another level of player but the 'ordinary' guys have had no chance.
If we had a better coach we would have a functioning forward half, no question about it.
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I agree Richo..I think the forward line has been the Achilles heel in Dimmas side so far.he has really failed to turn it round like he has done with the midfield and backline
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Give it up tbr, vickery is a dud fwd. doesn't work hard enough, the amount of
TImes his opponent rebounds is embarrassing. Add to that he can't take a mark so what are you left with?
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A "best 22" according to Tiger fans surveyed on the RFC website.
Clearly those surveyed aren't fans of Brandon Ellis :huh3
B: Grimes Rance Astbury
HB: Houli Chaplin Vlastuin
C: Grigg Martin Conca
HF: Deledio Griffiths Gordon
F: Edwards Riewoldt Morris
R: Maric Miles Cotchin
Int: Newman, Petterd, Hunt
Sub: Lambert
Full article: http://www.richmondfc.com.au/news/2015-04-01/tiger-fans-best-22
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will probably cop a caning but the side i would like to see named for tomorrow. would go as such.
FB: Morris - Astbury - Grimes
HB: Mcintosh - Rance - Vlastuin
MID: Lambert - Martin - B Ellis
FOLL: Maric - Cotchin - Miles.
HF: Knights - Riewoldt - Deledio
FF: Griffiths - Mckenzie - Edwards.
INT: Hunt - C Ellis - Conca - Petterd/Houli/Grigg/Lennon/butler.
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will probably cop a caning but the side i would like to see named for tomorrow. would go as such.
FB: Morris - Astbury - Grimes
HB: Mcintosh - Rance - Vlastuin
MID: Lambert - Martin - B Ellis
FOLL: Maric - Cotchin - Miles.
HF: Knights - Riewoldt - Deledio
FF: Griffiths - Mckenzie - Edwards.
INT: Hunt - C Ellis - Conca - Petterd/Houli/Grigg/Lennon/butler.
I understand it, but I have to disagree. It's not copping a caning.
Let's be fair, we all have a crack at Grigg, the bloke deserves to be in our starting 22.
The bloke was one of our best in the NAB challenges.
Take C.Ellis out put Lambert on the bench and have Grigg on the wing.
Have Conca as a sub, houli starting on the bench.
Anyway who cares.
Dimma will fix it!!!!
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Ill take a punt at the side that will be named.
FB: Vlastuin - Chaplin - Grimes
HB: Hunt - Rance - Houli
MID: Grigg - Martin - B Ellis
FOLL: Maric - Cotchin - Miles.
HF: Knights - Griffiths - Deledio
FF: Morris - Riewoldt - Edwards.
INT: Mcintosh - Lambert - Conca - Lennon.
Dont think Astbury will be risked and I hope they decide that Vickery hasnt done enough to get a game.
My take anyway, not the team I would like but what I think will be there.
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i dont get what grigg offers
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Mediocrity.
The people accept it now.
They want it......
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Fair play Griggs gone alright
And yet Chaplin, Newman continue to struggle
What's happened to Gordon
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Grimes. Rance. Deledio.
Vlastuin. Griffiths. Corey Ellis.
Menadue. Miles. Mcintosh.
Lambert. Reiwoldt. Lennon?
Edwards. McBean. Vickery.
Maric. Martin. Cotchin.
Houli
Conca
B Ellis
... Hunt / Bach / Morris
8)
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Mediocrity.
The people accept it now.
They want it......
They need it
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May as well get in early. more a side that i would like rather than what they will do.
FB: Grimes - Carlisle - Vlastuin.
HB: Litherland - Rance - Mcintosh
MID: Deledio - Martin - Menadue.
HF: Lennon - Tomlinson - Butler
FF: Johnson - Riewoldt - McKenzie
FOLL: Maric - Cotchin - Miles
INT: Edwards - Lambert - C Ellis - Kerridge.
EMG: B Ellis, Houli, Grigg, Hunt, Conca, Thomas.
New - Litherland, Carlisle, Tomlinson, Johnson, Kerridge.
Possible trades B Ellis, Conca, Griffiths,Vickery,
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You going to leave Maric to ruck all by himself?
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You going to leave Maric to ruck all by himself?
no,
Vickery, Griffiths, McBean are all pinch hitting options :shh
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Griffiths isn't a KPD's bumhole unfortunately, and with this setup you can't afford to use him as ruck relief as we would be too short down back against plenty of sides.
Like Vlastuin and Ellis down there, but consider Lids wasted so deep. Best players should always play F50 generally speaking.
Would have Miles following personally.
Would be playing B Ellis and Houli over Lambert myself.
Grimes. Rance. Deledio.
Vlastuin. Griffiths. Corey Ellis.
Menadue. Miles. Mcintosh.
Lambert. Reiwoldt. Lennon?
Edwards. McBean. Vickery.
Maric. Martin. Cotchin.
Houli
Conca
B Ellis
... Hunt / Bach / Morris
8)
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You going to leave Maric to ruck all by himself?
no,
Vickery, Griffiths, McBean are all pinch hitting options :shh
Did you read Claw's side ::)
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@ Andyy
Griffiths isn't a KPD's bumhole unfortunately
where is the proof of this? Has he been tested as a key defender for a six game trail in the senior side? A shame as his kicking ability would be a weapon from the backline
if your claim is indeed true, then I would choose Elton or Astbury assuming he is hanging around.
Mcbean played back as a junior?
, and with this setup you can't afford to use him as ruck relief as we would be too short down back against plenty of sides.
This is probable true
i was taking the mickey somewhat including mcbean and griff. The coul have five min stints. Or go third man up
i quite like tryone in the ruck. maric should be rested forward more often, to try and get more years out of him as given the list - maric is still a valuable asset
Lids wasted so deep. Best players should always play F50 generally speaking.
Agree of both counts
I feel when the going gets tough our backline crumbles and we need Grimes, Vlastuin, Lids there
do we have the luxury of playing vlastuin in the middle or lids forward?
Would have Miles following personally.
rover or ruckrover? ;)
Would be playing B Ellis and Houli over Lambert myself
indeed, i struggled to seperate the three
lambert would be the less squib-like of the three? but perhaps the least talented?
You going to leave Maric to ruck all by himself?
no,
Vickery, Griffiths, McBean are all pinch hitting options :shh
Did you read Claw's side ::)
stopped @ Litherland
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Actually yes. Griffiths was played as a defender initially. His move forward has only really been the last 2 seasons.
@ Andyy
Griffiths isn't a KPD's bumhole unfortunately
where is the proof of this? Has he been tested as a key defender for a six game trail in the senior side? A shame as his kicking ability would be a weapon from the backline
if your claim is indeed true, then I would choose Elton or Astbury assuming he is hanging around.
Mcbean played back as a junior?
, and with this setup you can't afford to use him as ruck relief as we would be too short down back against plenty of sides.
This is probable true
i was taking the mickey somewhat including mcbean and griff. The coul have five min stints. Or go third man up
i quite like tryone in the ruck. maric should be rested forward more often, to try and get more years out of him as given the list - maric is still a valuable asset
Lids wasted so deep. Best players should always play F50 generally speaking.
Agree of both counts
I feel when the going gets tough our backline crumbles and we need Grimes, Vlastuin, Lids there
do we have the luxury of playing vlastuin in the middle or lids forward?
Would have Miles following personally.
rover or ruckrover? ;)
Would be playing B Ellis and Houli over Lambert myself
indeed, i struggled to seperate the three
lambert would be the less squib-like of the three? but perhaps the least talented?
You going to leave Maric to ruck all by himself?
no,
Vickery, Griffiths, McBean are all pinch hitting options :shh
Did you read Claw's side ::)
stopped @ Litherland
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griff will be 25 next year
perhaps he'd be a better defender in 2016, than what he was in 2010 or 2011
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Or 2012-2013...
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Made allowances or the growing pains of a 200cm developing body...
Missed a few games with injury then , hopefully not such future problems ...
Unless he gets a sore finger of course
#StandbyGriff
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Should be the first put on the trade table next week.
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Astbury, Griffiths
Should we offload elton too?
Another big year for jake bachelor it sounds like
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As a backman, Griffiths makes Chaplin look like Jakovich.
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I am merely curious as to the same size, as the basis of such definitive comments
How many of his 5o odd afl games were in defence?
I am willing to swap McBean and griff in my 22
Don't tell me bean cannot play there either
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As a backman, Griffiths makes Chaplin look like Jakovich.
*rance
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Chaplin makes Rance look like Rance. :shh
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Would be offering up Astbury, Griffiths and Conca for sure.
Chasing all those KPP's I keep mentioning... Henderson, Carlisle, Talia, Tomlinson. Two of any of them would be amazing. Then just a mid-20's decent ruckman and some midfield depth...
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You going to leave Maric to ruck all by himself?
This aimed at me i think.. May as well what the others offer in the role is minimal may as well just rn one of the kpp for 5 minutes a quarter and see if they cant take some marks around the ground.
We could always rotate one of the sheep dogs off the bench i suppose to give ivan a chop out.
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Grimes. Rance. Deledio.
Yarren. Astbury. Corey Ellis.
Townsend. Miles. Mcintosh.
Edwards. Reiwoldt. Lennon
Martin. McBean. Vickery.
Maric. Vlastuin. Cotchin.
Houli
Conca
B Ellis
Lambert.
:shh
lockedandloaded
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Grimes Rance Vlastuin
C. Ellis Chaplin McIntosh
Menadue Martin Edwards
Lids Vickery Yarran
Lambert Jack Lennon
Maric Cotch Miles
Ellis Castagna Houli McBean
With a centre line and HFL consisting of Menadue, Edwards, Lids and Yarran we have a real weapon with pace.
Lennon at 188cm needs to play the 3rd tall option as he is a fantastic mark and beatiful kick. He really needs to work on his fitness over the summer to be able to move around in our forwardline and present us with another leading forward to help Jack out.
I'd like to see McBean play every game during pre-season too, he need to be given game time as he could be the real difference to our forwardline if he can get a handle on the pace of the game. There is no reason why he cannot be our Jack Gunston.
Playing C. Ellis and McIntosh across half back with their bigger bodies makes us a lot stronger too. Ellis foot skills are a massive bonus there too.
Hopefully pick 12 is a big bodied mid that could take Houli's spot on the bench.
I'd like to see Morris given a chance as a tagger during the pre-season.
Hopefully Drummond and Buttler can get to AFL level and take Ellis position.
And lastly I think Elton should be given every opportunity as a KPB during pre-season as I think he has more upside than Astbury and Batchelor long term.
IMO it's time to find replacements for Grigg, Houli, Hunt and Chaplin.. Get games into some kids now and fast track their development as these other guys have taken us as far as they can.
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Castagna a long way off. Honestly think he'll go down as a worse player than Morris.
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You going to leave Maric to ruck all by himself?
no,
Vickery, Griffiths, McBean are all pinch hitting options :shh
Lol it really is hilarious. Pinch hitters who do absolutely nothing in the role. FFS if Mc bean was asked to pinch hit at afl level he would snap in two. Its one thing playing like an oversized fwd flanker an entirely different thing playing ruck which is something he hasnt been asked to do ::)
Vickery oh wow the bloke who poos his pants every single time he he competes at a centre bounce down. I keep on telling you this bloke plays the role poo scared, open your freakin eyes up.
Ah ben the heart the size of a pea griffiths, and as fragile as a pane of glass in a hail storm.Yep one knock and its busted.
Why would you bother playing them in the role? Oh i see they are tall lol.
Did you read Claw's side ::)
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To be honest I don't take much notice of hit outs, unless you're a very dominant ruck then they are all pretty pointless. Vickerys work as a ruckman outside tapping the ball ain't too shabby.
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To be honest I don't take much notice of hit outs, unless you're a very dominant ruck then they are all pretty pointless. Vickerys work as a ruckman outside tapping the ball ain't too shabby.
In what way. What does he consistently do well in the role. I can think of only one thing he does well as either a fwd or a ruckman he manages to kick one or two goals a game. An awful lot of em sodas that you would get.
In fairness kicking goals sodas or not Its a biggie, and it is the only thing that saves him as a player.In the main and nearly every other area of the game hes been a lazy soft one way player who would struggle at times to get a kick in a footy factory.
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To be honest I don't take much notice of hit outs,.
You sound like our midfield.
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To be honest I don't take much notice of hit outs,.
You sound like our midfield.
Ahhh the voice of reason and common sense. with a twist of irony and just a smidge of sarcasm.
By the way your little 3 and ten sentence could well come true again next year.
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Castagna a long way off. Honestly think he'll go down as a worse player than Morris.
He's far more creative, clever & attacking than Morris, not to mention quicker and a better tackler.....unfortunately his kicking is so utterly awful it's a liabilty and undoes everything else....it's a shame really....
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(http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/bourne/images/e/ee/12_Gauge_Double_Barreled_Shotgun.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20121101222029)
My call.
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To be honest I don't take much notice of hit outs,.
You sound like our midfield.
:clapping
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NO GRIGG in the team is a good team!
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Grimes Rance Conca
Vlastuin Chaplin Houli
McIntosh Martin B Ellis
Deledio Reiwoldt Yarran
Edwards Vickery Lennon
Maric Cothin Miles
C Ellis, Grigg, McBean, Pick 12/Lambert
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Grimes Rance Conca
Vlastuin Chaplin Houli
McIntosh Martin B Ellis
Deledio Reiwoldt Yarran
Edwards Vickery Lennon
Maric Cothin Miles
C Ellis, Grigg, McBean, Pick 12/Lambert
Grimes Rance Vlastuin
C. Ellis Chaplin McIntosh
Menadue Martin Edwards
Lids Vickery Yarran
Lambert Jack Lennon
Maric Cotch Miles
Ellis Castagna Houli McBean
:chuck
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Conca ellis chaplin grigg - all poo
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Conca ellis might improve
Age - as of April 2016 (start of the season)
30: Maric (154), Chaplin (207)
-------------------------------------------
29: Deledio (232)
28: Grigg (147), Hampson (78 )
27: Edwards (168 ), Houli (137), Morris (78 ), Riewoldt (180)
26: Cotchin (153), Lloyd (20), Rance (130)
25: Astbury (41), Hunt (86), Vickery (102), Yarran (119)
24: Batchelor (75), Griffiths (48 ), Grimes (63), Lambert (13), Martin (131), Miles (46), Moore (55)
23: Conca (74), Elton (2)
-------------------------------------------
22: B.Ellis (88), McIntosh (23), Townsend (28 ), Vlastuin (61)
21: McBean (2)
20: Drummond (1), Lennon (16), McKenzie (-), Short# (-), Soldo# (-)
19: Butler (-), C.Ellis (6), Menadue (5), Castagna# (-)
18: new draftees ....
where as the other two are list-blockers proper
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Grimes Rance Conca
Vlastuin Chaplin Houli
McIntosh Martin B Ellis
Deledio Reiwoldt Yarran
Edwards Vickery Lennon
Maric Cothin Miles
C Ellis, Grigg, McBean, Pick 12/Lambert
Grimes Rance Vlastuin
C. Ellis Chaplin McIntosh
Menadue Martin Edwards
Lids Vickery Yarran
Lambert Jack Lennon
Maric Cotch Miles
Ellis Castagna Houli McBean
:chuck
Who's ahead of Chaplin though. I agree, ideally you'd put Astbury in ahead of him, but at this stage I see Chaplin as the better option.
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mcbean, elton, astbury, griffiths, bachelor, dea, grimes, darrou, thursfeild, :whistle
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mcbean, elton, astbury, griffiths, bachelor, dea, grimes, darrou, thursfeild, :whistle
Lol
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To be honest I don't take much notice of hit outs, unless you're a very dominant ruck then they are all pretty pointless. Vickerys work as a ruckman outside tapping the ball ain't too shabby.
In what way. What does he consistently do well in the role. I can think of only one thing he does well as either a fwd or a ruckman he manages to kick one or two goals a game. An awful lot of em sodas that you would get.
In fairness kicking goals sodas or not Its a biggie, and it is the only thing that saves him as a player.In the main and nearly every other area of the game hes been a lazy soft one way player who would struggle at times to get a kick in a footy factory.
He's quite athletic and good around the packs. Seen him step around people to set up and kick goals quite a few times.
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mcbean, elton, astbury, griffiths, bachelor, dea, grimes, darrou, thursfeild, :whistle
Only one of them is a realistic option and that's Elton. Don't think it'll happen but he's the only one who could possibly go past him in that position.
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To be honest I don't take much notice of hit outs, unless you're a very dominant ruck then they are all pretty pointless. Vickerys work as a ruckman outside tapping the ball ain't too shabby.
In what way. What does he consistently do well in the role. I can think of only one thing he does well as either a fwd or a ruckman he manages to kick one or two goals a game. An awful lot of em sodas that you would get.
In fairness kicking goals sodas or not Its a biggie, and it is the only thing that saves him as a player.In the main and nearly every other area of the game hes been a lazy soft one way player who would struggle at times to get a kick in a footy factory.
He's quite athletic and good around the packs. Seen him step around people to set up and kick goals quite a few times.
Vickery is excellent in traffic for his size.....
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Castagna a long way off. Honestly think he'll go down as a worse player than Morris.
He's far more creative, clever & attacking than Morris, not to mention quicker and a better tackler.....unfortunately his kicking is so utterly awful it's a liabilty and undoes everything else....it's a shame really....
I disagree. His kicking in the games I have watched has been pretty good. Not elite like say Lids and ....... Actually not that many that are elite in our side.
George kicks it as well or better than half our side IMO.
As you said, he does have some real attributes so I hope he gets a chance in 2016. And I guess we will see who is right. :thumbsup
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A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
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A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
No spot for:
Lennon?
Vlastuin??
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A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
Don't rate Grimes? He's never going to be a pillar like Rance but I think he's one of those solid good players who really compliment a back line
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Here's my A Team
B: Vlastuin Rance Grimes
HB: Yarran Chaplin Houli
C: B Ellis Conca Edwards
HF: Lennon Vickery Martin
F: C Ellis Riewoldt Deledio
R: Maric Cotchin Miles
Int McBean, Lambert, Batchelor, McIntosh
Emg Hunt, Griffiths, Grigg
McBean to have a breakout year, Corey Ellis to play every game if fit (our best ball user)
Backline now has plenty of run, only worry is defensive side.
Reckon Todd Elton is also about to explode onto the scene as the CHB
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Ah chee could be the next Cyril.
Who goes out of the team for him though ? Starting to develop some really good depth.
Lennon. Lambert. C Ellis. Conca. B ellis. Pick 12. Drummond. Menadue. Moore. Townsend. Grigg. Any other players really fighting for a spot next year ?
mcbean
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A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
Don't rate Grimes? He's never going to be a pillar like Rance but I think he's one of those solid good players who really compliment a back line
He is as soft as they come.
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Castagna a long way off. Honestly think he'll go down as a worse player than Morris.
He's far more creative, clever & attacking than Morris, not to mention quicker and a better tackler.....unfortunately his kicking is so utterly awful it's a liabilty and undoes everything else....it's a shame really....
I disagree. His kicking in the games I have watched has been pretty good. Not elite like say Lids and ....... Actually not that many that are elite in our side.
George kicks it as well or better than half our side IMO.
As you said, he does have some real attributes so I hope he gets a chance in 2016. And I guess we will see who is right. :thumbsup
Thats more an indictement on the good kicking policy going out the window than Castagnas kicking. Horrid would sum it up every time i have taken the time to watch this kid.There is no way on earth he should be allowed to play across HB with his footskills.Yet the club continues to develop him there.
-
Dead wrong about Grimes, Santa, spot on about Castagna though....
-
A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
Don't rate Grimes? He's never going to be a pillar like Rance but I think he's one of those solid good players who really compliment a back line
He is as soft as they come.
stuffing what?
-
The oracle is on the mushrooms again :snidegrin
-
A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
Don't rate Grimes? He's never going to be a pillar like Rance but I think he's one of those solid good players who really compliment a back line
He is as soft as they come.
:gobdrop
-
A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
Don't rate Grimes? He's never going to be a pillar like Rance but I think he's one of those solid good players who really compliment a back line
He is as soft as they come.
:gobdrop
x 2
Didn't you watch the Elim final
Know it was painful but the Grimes hit was one of the few highlights of the day
He aint soft
-
Claw doesn't know what his talking about. Just bags and bags the club and has no real idea about anytying. why continue to lurk in mordor
-
Grimes soft lmao.
When you look at blokes like Chaplin, Houli etc Grimes is more akin to Jono Brown. Takes hits, gives hits, and actually attacks the ball with intent rather than worry about what his opponent is doing all the time.
-
If we ever win a flag with this crop, Grimes will be playing. That's how I see it, v good player, important, knows his role and fulfils it almost every week.
-
His head ducking is a bit soft but he makes up for it in many other ways
-
Grimes soft lmao.
When you look at blokes like Chaplin, Houli etc Grimes is more akin to Jono Brown. Takes hits, gives hits, and actually attacks the ball with intent rather than worry about what his opponent is doing all the time.
^^^^
-
A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
Don't rate Grimes? He's never going to be a pillar like Rance but I think he's one of those solid good players who really compliment a back line
He is as soft as they come.
stuffing what?
yep
#shitpost
-
His head ducking is a bit soft but he makes up for it in many other ways
Could say exactly the same about Cotchin & Miles....
-
is joel selwood soft?
-
Ducking for free kicks really has nothing to do with being soft or not.
You could argue that it's cheap, mischievous even dirty, but not soft.
Surely that's not Claw's reasoning for Grimes being soft.
-
correct
cheap / dirty / smart
do they not sell dictionaries in perth clawski ?
-
yeah not sure how deliberately taking blows to the head is soft
-
Claw doesn't know what his talking about. Just bags and bags the club and has no real idea about anytying. why continue to lurk in mordor
Claw is a champion, but has got it wrong with Grimes, if we delisted Grimes, Hawthorn would pick him up in a heartbeat.
Claw is allowed to get it wrong occassionally
-
:lol
-
Dead wrong about Grimes, Santa, spot on about Castagna though....
We all see things different. I have never been one to run with the pack or just go along with popular opinion.
Has Grimes showed courage this year? Yep he sure has.Has he played well? yep. Is he soft as butter? yep he sure is. I have seen too many instances of him being rag dolled by smaller players and he lacks aggression and allows himself to be bullied. Yes i do question his ticker.
-
A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
No spot for:
Lennon?
Vlastuin??
Sorry missed Vlastuin. I was talking about the club and what i think they would go with based on age, experience and even performances. It nothing like the side i would like us to field.
We need to change , we need to improve we need an injection of youth and potential.
The team i want us to play WHERE POSSIBLE. Meaning getting games into kids without losing the ability to win to much.
FB: Vlastuin - Elton - Grimes
HB: Yarran - Rance - McIntosh.
Mid: Deledio - Martin - Menadue/Drummond
Foll: Maric - Cotchin - Miles
HF: Edwards - Riewoldt - Lennon
FF: Vickery - McKenzie - Butler
Int: Houli - C Ellis - B Ellis - Townsend.
A few regulars miss but this is the sort of direction we must take. It is actually addressing areas that are poor. It does have some kids that are a bit raw. those kids actually replace those who really have to go if we wish to even start talking top 4.
It remains my opinion for us to become a top 4 side we have to maybe take a small step backwards and embrace some junior talent who arent quite there yet.
-
Dead wrong about Grimes, Santa, spot on about Castagna though....
We all see things different. I have never been one to run with the pack or just go along with popular opinion.
Has Grimes showed courage this year? Yep he sure has.Has he played well? yep. Is he soft as butter? yep he sure is. I have seen too many instances of him being rag dolled by smaller players and he lacks aggression and allows himself to be bullied. Yes i do question his ticker.
As far as explanations go, that sucked.
You actually look for reasons to pot our players and our club. Even if it means just making poo up.
-
lmfao.
-
His head ducking is a bit soft but he makes up for it in many other ways
Could say exactly the same about Cotchin & Miles....
yeah not sure how deliberately taking blows to the head is soft
Ducking for free kicks really has nothing to do with being soft or not.
You could argue that it's cheap, mischievous even dirty, but not soft.
Surely that's not Claw's reasoning for Grimes being soft.
Sorry guys but I reckon it's a bit soft ducking for frees. Cotchin and Miles do it differently (I actually don't agree Cotchin does but why start another debate). They actually put their head over the ball and in some cases drop down. Grimes has run himself into trouble and has ducked his head to get out of it. One soft act doesn't make a soft player.
-
Claw doesn't know what his talking about. Just bags and bags the club and has no real idea about anytying. why continue to lurk in mordor
Claw is a champion, but has got it wrong with Grimes, if we delisted Grimes, Hawthorn would pick him up in a heartbeat.
Claw is allowed to get it wrong occassionally
yep, everyone gets some of it wrong occasionally
its just the extent that is the worrying part
even for us discipleship-of-clawski like my self
... like claiming a young rance will not make it as a key defender, the night after he owned a john brown in his pomp
... or saying grimes is soft, hes was the only one to perform a heroic, non-soft, act in the losing final
A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
No spot for:
Lennon?
Vlastuin??
Sorry missed Vlastuin.
:facepalm
-
Claw doesn't know what his talking about. Just bags and bags the club and has no real idea about anytying. why continue to lurk in mordor
Claw is a champion, but has got it wrong with Grimes, if we delisted Grimes, Hawthorn would pick him up in a heartbeat.
Claw is allowed to get it wrong occassionally
yep, everyone gets some of it wrong occasionally
its just the extent that is the worrying part
even for us discipleship-of-clawski like my self
... like claiming a young rance will not make it as a key defender, the night after he owned a john brown in his pomp
... or saying grimes is soft, hes was the only one to perform a heroic, non-soft, act in the losing final
A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
No spot for:
Lennon?
Vlastuin??
Sorry missed Vlastuin.
:facepalm
maybe claw comes out of the rabbit hole to visit us?
-
Dead wrong about Grimes, Santa, spot on about Castagna though....
We all see things different. I have never been one to run with the pack or just go along with popular opinion.
Has Grimes showed courage this year? Yep he sure has.Has he played well? yep. Is he soft as butter? yep he sure is. I have seen too many instances of him being rag dolled by smaller players and he lacks aggression and allows himself to be bullied. Yes i do question his ticker.
As far as explanations go, that sucked.
You actually look for reasons to pot our players and our club. Even if it means just making poo up.
I couldnt give a stuff if you liked it or not.It is something i have seen on a regular basis. Its not writing him off it is a criticism of a part of his game. You blokes seem to struggle making those distinctions.
Claw doesn't know what his talking about. Just bags and bags the club and has no real idea about anytying. why continue to lurk in mordor
Claw is a champion, but has got it wrong with Grimes, if we delisted Grimes, Hawthorn would pick him up in a heartbeat.
Claw is allowed to get it wrong occassionally
yep, everyone gets some of it wrong occasionally
its just the extent that is the worrying part
even for us discipleship-of-clawski like my self
... like claiming a young rance will not make it as a key defender, the night after he owned a john brown in his pomp
... or saying grimes is soft, hes was the only one to perform a heroic, non-soft, act in the losing final
A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
No spot for:
Lennon?
Vlastuin??
Sorry missed Vlastuin.
:facepalm
maybe claw comes out of the rabbit hole to visit us?
yeah yeah yeah ive heard it all before. I have said on numerous occasions i would not change one criticism i had of Rance. Once again, no still posters showing they are incapable of differentiating between justified criticism and writing a player off.
Alex Rance was poor in key areas for his first 4 years but whats the point in arguing now like then with people who insist that Rance was perfect.
It is the same with Grimes, i have criticised one area of his game but wait im writing him off. You blokes need to toughen up a bit.
Okay lets criticise another area. He plays very much on smalls these days he provides no run, finds little ball, lays few tackles ffs because of blokes like him we had to get Yarran. FFS poor old Batchelor was regularly asked to play third tall because Dylan is a weak soft prick.
-
:lol
how is the queen of hearts?
-
Dylan is a weak soft prick.
:lol
Gotta love that "justified criticism" that Claw brings to the table....
-
Does getting rag dolled constitute being soft though? Weak maybe but I consider soft fairly different. Lacking mongrel I disagree with as well. He's right up there in our team for sticking into players from what I have seen.
-
Dead wrong about Grimes, Santa, spot on about Castagna though....
We all see things different. I have never been one to run with the pack or just go along with popular opinion.
Has Grimes showed courage this year? Yep he sure has.Has he played well? yep. Is he soft as butter? yep he sure is. I have seen too many instances of him being rag dolled by smaller players and he lacks aggression and allows himself to be bullied. Yes i do question his ticker.
As far as explanations go, that sucked.
You actually look for reasons to pot our players and our club. Even if it means just making poo up.
I couldnt give a stuff if you liked it or not.It is something i have seen on a regular basis. Its not writing him off it is a criticism of a part of his game. You blokes seem to struggle making those distinctions.
Claw doesn't know what his talking about. Just bags and bags the club and has no real idea about anytying. why continue to lurk in mordor
Claw is a champion, but has got it wrong with Grimes, if we delisted Grimes, Hawthorn would pick him up in a heartbeat.
Claw is allowed to get it wrong occassionally
yep, everyone gets some of it wrong occasionally
its just the extent that is the worrying part
even for us discipleship-of-clawski like my self
... like claiming a young rance will not make it as a key defender, the night after he owned a john brown in his pomp
... or saying grimes is soft, hes was the only one to perform a heroic, non-soft, act in the losing final
A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
No spot for:
Lennon?
Vlastuin??
Sorry missed Vlastuin.
:facepalm
maybe claw comes out of the rabbit hole to visit us?
yeah yeah yeah ive heard it all before. I have said on numerous occasions i would not change one criticism i had of Rance. Once again, no still posters showing they are incapable of differentiating between justified criticism and writing a player off.
Alex Rance was poor in key areas for his first 4 years but whats the point in arguing now like then with people who insist that Rance was perfect.
It is the same with Grimes, i have criticised one area of his game but wait im writing him off. You blokes need to toughen up a bit.
Okay lets criticise another area. He plays very much on smalls these days he provides no run, finds little ball, lays few tackles ffs because of blokes like him we had to get Yarran. FFS poor old Batchelor was regularly asked to play third tall because Dylan is a weak soft prick.
Hang on mate, you have said Rance would never make it as a KPD, and I'm pretty sure the last 2 years have shown you to be wrong. That's not a criticism that's a statement that you were 100% wrong about. I know you say he would be better a the 3rd tall but without doubt he has been an out and out star as a KD in the last 2 years.
On Grimes I think you are just about as wrong as you were about Rance.
Maybe he needs to get more footy or be more attacking when he does get it but "soft" no way.
-
Dead wrong about Grimes, Santa, spot on about Castagna though....
We all see things different. I have never been one to run with the pack or just go along with popular opinion.
Has Grimes showed courage this year? Yep he sure has.Has he played well? yep. Is he soft as butter? yep he sure is. I have seen too many instances of him being rag dolled by smaller players and he lacks aggression and allows himself to be bullied. Yes i do question his ticker.
As far as explanations go, that sucked.
You actually look for reasons to pot our players and our club. Even if it means just making poo up.
I couldnt give a stuff if you liked it or not.It is something i have seen on a regular basis. Its not writing him off it is a criticism of a part of his game. You blokes seem to struggle making those distinctions.
Claw doesn't know what his talking about. Just bags and bags the club and has no real idea about anytying. why continue to lurk in mordor
Claw is a champion, but has got it wrong with Grimes, if we delisted Grimes, Hawthorn would pick him up in a heartbeat.
Claw is allowed to get it wrong occassionally
yep, everyone gets some of it wrong occasionally
its just the extent that is the worrying part
even for us discipleship-of-clawski like my self
... like claiming a young rance will not make it as a key defender, the night after he owned a john brown in his pomp
... or saying grimes is soft, hes was the only one to perform a heroic, non-soft, act in the losing final
A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
No spot for:
Lennon?
Vlastuin??
Sorry missed Vlastuin.
:facepalm
maybe claw comes out of the rabbit hole to visit us?
yeah yeah yeah ive heard it all before. I have said on numerous occasions i would not change one criticism i had of Rance. Once again, no still posters showing they are incapable of differentiating between justified criticism and writing a player off.
Alex Rance was poor in key areas for his first 4 years but whats the point in arguing now like then with people who insist that Rance was perfect.
It is the same with Grimes, i have criticised one area of his game but wait im writing him off. You blokes need to toughen up a bit.
Okay lets criticise another area. He plays very much on smalls these days he provides no run, finds little ball, lays few tackles ffs because of blokes like him we had to get Yarran. FFS poor old Batchelor was regularly asked to play third tall because Dylan is a weak soft prick.
Hang on mate, you have said Rance would never make it as a KPD, and I'm pretty sure the last 2 years have shown you to be wrong. That's not a criticism that's a statement that you were 100% wrong about. I know you say he would be better a the 3rd tall but without doubt he has been an out and out star as a KD in the last 2 years.
On Grimes I think you are just about as wrong as you were about Rance.
Maybe he needs to get more footy or be more attacking when he does get it but "soft" no way.
Dont call me mate. We have been here before. Now like then you are kidding yourself, as i asked then bring up one post where i have written him off and said delist get rid of him hes no good.
My history with rance on footy forums goes
Wanting him at pick 18
Highly critical of aspects of his game
To now acknowledging him being a very good footballer who could still improve some aspects of his game..
Your trouble you get all precious when players you think are okay get criticised.
I have been thru the Rance thread and on no occasion have i called for his head. Must be 100 posts of mine there and other boards on the topic.
The one constant has been whiny bunnies like you complaining about rance copping criticism.The other constant me complaining about Rance being poor in several areas, constantly falling over, getting caught out of position, getting beaten too often 1v1, misreading the ball in the air yep i was right into him and as i have said to you before i stand by those criticisms.
Any way Paint it how you like i really dont give a stuff.
-
To now acknowledging him being a very good footballer who could still improve some aspects of his game..
T
he other constant me complaining about Rance being poor in several areas, constantly falling over, getting caught out of position, getting beaten too often 1v1, misreading the ball in the air
So what are your criticisms now?
-
Dead wrong about Grimes, Santa, spot on about Castagna though....
We all see things different. I have never been one to run with the pack or just go along with popular opinion.
Has Grimes showed courage this year? Yep he sure has.Has he played well? yep. Is he soft as butter? yep he sure is. I have seen too many instances of him being rag dolled by smaller players and he lacks aggression and allows himself to be bullied. Yes i do question his ticker.
As far as explanations go, that sucked.
You actually look for reasons to pot our players and our club. Even if it means just making poo up.
I couldnt give a stuff if you liked it or not.It is something i have seen on a regular basis. Its not writing him off it is a criticism of a part of his game. You blokes seem to struggle making those distinctions.
Claw doesn't know what his talking about. Just bags and bags the club and has no real idea about anytying. why continue to lurk in mordor
Claw is a champion, but has got it wrong with Grimes, if we delisted Grimes, Hawthorn would pick him up in a heartbeat.
Claw is allowed to get it wrong occassionally
yep, everyone gets some of it wrong occasionally
its just the extent that is the worrying part
even for us discipleship-of-clawski like my self
... like claiming a young rance will not make it as a key defender, the night after he owned a john brown in his pomp
... or saying grimes is soft, hes was the only one to perform a heroic, non-soft, act in the losing final
A literal best 22
B: Grimes - Chaplin - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Rance - Yarran. Fair dinkum its horrid Take the AA out and it is mediocre.
MID: McIntosh - Martin - B Ellis. Again atm its one A grader.
Ruck: Maric - Cotchin - Miles. Not too shabby but the ruckman is a concern.
HF: Deledio - Vickery - Edwards. Gotta ask is there really a pure fwd amongst them.
F: Lloyd - Riewoldt - Griffith. Thank god theres an A grader here becuse the other two are shiite.
INT: Grigg - Conca - Hunt - Lambert. If there was a place called plodsville this would be it. We need to improve on 9 to 11 players who are supposed to be best 22.
No spot for:
Lennon?
Vlastuin??
Sorry missed Vlastuin.
:facepalm
maybe claw comes out of the rabbit hole to visit us?
yeah yeah yeah ive heard it all before. I have said on numerous occasions i would not change one criticism i had of Rance. Once again, no still posters showing they are incapable of differentiating between justified criticism and writing a player off.
Alex Rance was poor in key areas for his first 4 years but whats the point in arguing now like then with people who insist that Rance was perfect.
It is the same with Grimes, i have criticised one area of his game but wait im writing him off. You blokes need to toughen up a bit.
Okay lets criticise another area. He plays very much on smalls these days he provides no run, finds little ball, lays few tackles ffs because of blokes like him we had to get Yarran. FFS poor old Batchelor was regularly asked to play third tall because Dylan is a weak soft prick.
Hang on mate, you have said Rance would never make it as a KPD, and I'm pretty sure the last 2 years have shown you to be wrong. That's not a criticism that's a statement that you were 100% wrong about. I know you say he would be better a the 3rd tall but without doubt he has been an out and out star as a KD in the last 2 years.
On Grimes I think you are just about as wrong as you were about Rance.
Maybe he needs to get more footy or be more attacking when he does get it but "soft" no way.
Dont call me mate. We have been here before. Now like then you are kidding yourself, as i asked then bring up one post where i have written him off and said delist get rid of him hes no good.
My history with rance on footy forums goes
Wanting him at pick 18
Highly critical of aspects of his game
To now acknowledging him being a very good footballer who could still improve some aspects of his game..
Your trouble you get all precious when players you think are okay get criticised.
I have been thru the Rance thread and on no occasion have i called for his head. Must be 100 posts of mine there and other boards on the topic.
The one constant has been whiny bunnies like you complaining about rance copping criticism.The other constant me complaining about Rance being poor in several areas, constantly falling over, getting caught out of position, getting beaten too often 1v1, misreading the ball in the air yep i was right into him and as i have said to you before i stand by those criticisms.
Any way Paint it how you like i really dont give a stuff.
All the other fluff aside, have you in the past said Rance isn't a KPD? Pretty simple question?
And for the record I have lots of mates. :thumbsup
-
What's are your thoughts on 200cm blokes clawski?
-
What's are your thoughts on 200cm blokes clawski?
Is 200cm the new 195cm?
-
How many mates does Rance have, i wonder?
-
How many mates does Rance have, i wonder?
Is there a number that you have in your mind that will impress you? I mean does it matter if it's 5 or 15? Not sure what you are trying to indicate and if you are indicating something, please come out and say it.
-
and troy is too rubbish to be anything other than an oxygen thief
you are comparing a donkey to a rolls Royce
Maybe so, but there are horses for courses. Lids could play HBF, but not KPD.
You could play Cotchin, Martin, Deledio, Riewoldt and Rance ALL in the back six if you wanted to, but just because they're good players doesn't mean they're suited to those positions.
Lids is wasted in the D50 and with his achilles issues I don't want him playing there.
for context; we are currently playing BACHELOR on resting rucks / monster key forwards
:whistle
i am quite partial to the astbury / Elton / McBean / Griffihs option/s
but
#1 rance
#2 mini rance
#3 grimes
# 4 deledio
#5 vlastuin
#6 c ellis / yarren
looks solid as a panzer division for mine. Are least less soft that the current model
play houli higher up the ground
build from the back... are you not sick of getting spanked in elimination finals?
It might be slightly too short but would rebound good, more so with the rotation of houli / menadue
you could play one of the before mentioned young key talls as a 'swingman', like that flog from the WCE flag winning side
(http://www1.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/2015+AFL+Draft+Combine+jE4iqY0C5jYl.jpg)
#mini-Rance
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How many mates does Rance have, i wonder?
hes got me, baby 8)
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What's are your thoughts on 200cm blokes clawski?
I think you know my thoughts on 200cm key fwds. There is a difference you know between ruckmen kpfs and kpds. You tell me how many 200cm players have become gun kpfs.
You blokes can take the pee all you like but at the end of the day the truth is in the answer to the above question.
Tippett is about the best of them and im sure a champion will come along at some stage but the fact remains so few 200cm blokes have done a thing as permanent key fwds.
We have three 200cm blokes who are supposed to be kpfs and my money is on none of em becoming very good kpfs.
Yeah i will stick to my guns and at the end of the day we will see who is right.
Unlike idiots who slash their wrists to prove a point and usually ends up wrong, ive been proven right far too often to change.
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I love Claw's "I'm always right, just ask me" attitude :lol. I can't actually think of any big calls you've made and have been right. Happy to be proven wrong as everyone gets one right eventually
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lol
if you want to sprout such things and tell the world how good you are, then perhaps provide something like the number of 200+ forwards that are actually drafted and the number of them that make the grade, compared to the number of <200cm fPF forwards and what percentage make the grade.
That is the only true way to back up such a claim, but I'm sure we will told that we must take claywehs word for it
As it stands you could use the same logic to say dont draft sudanese players because "how many sudanese players have become good footballers?"
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I love Claw's "I'm always right, just ask me" attitude :lol. I can't actually think of any big calls you've made and have been right. Happy to be proven wrong as everyone gets one right eventually
Well you need to pay closer attention then dont you. I can keep saying what i say because for the last 15 or so years the club has achieved sweet stuff all on field and it aint about to change.
It aint hard for anyone to be right or do better.The club that thrives on mediocrity and the supporters lap it up.
Are things going to get better? Heres just one reason why they wont
LOL Grimes, Houli, Yarran, Chaplin in the one backline who said bruise free footy is not alive and well and thats just one area of the field. No wonder Rance looks so good hes surrounded by chumps.
WHAT HAVE THEY DONE THE LAST 6 YEARS? What have they achieved. Honest answer is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.
Maybe its a big maybe IF they actually achieve something i will have to shut up.15 plus years and counting im still waiting for them to shut me up.
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I agree with claw on the 200cm key fwd, can't recall any being a top shelf kpf.
Sure they can be handy as a bit part ruckman but dominant key fwd? can't think of one.
Buddy and richo are the tallest gun Fwds I've seen, I can't name the 200+cm kpf who are dominant year after year..
Roughead, Pavlich, reiwoldt x2, Cameron, Schulz, Jonathan Brown, Cloke, buddy, Richo, Kennedy, Darling, Hawkins, Jesse Hogan,
Vs
Tippet, Vickery, Daniher, Boyd, Mitch Clarke, westhoff, McBean, Natanui, Zac Clarke, Sinclair.
If I was going to draft a key fwd to build a fed line around I'd go for a hogan, Cloke, Roughead, Reiwoldt type over Mitch Clalrke, Vikery, Tippet type every single time
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The problem is everybody is getting taller. So what was a reasonable or ideal height 10 years ago may not be ideal in 5 years time.......
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Tell you what, if in 10 yrs time we have several 200+cm Fwds dominating then I'll change my mind
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I'm the same with sudanese players
-
Good for you
-
The problem is everybody is getting taller. So what was a reasonable or ideal height 10 years ago may not be ideal in 5 years time.......
And yet. Na stuff it i have said what i wanted say on it. It was originally posted as an observation yet the nuffies yrs later still take the pee out of.
Today i have joined the Nuffies, im here to do nothing but belittle add nothing and take the pee. Chucky where are you brother.
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Tell you what, if in 10 yrs time we have several 200+cm Fwds dominating then I'll change my mind
I don't think you'll have to wait that long. Maybe just 2 to 3 and I think many will be changing their attitude. Why?
Because until the last 5 years, 200cm players were ruck men almost exclusively. So there have been precious few forwards to make the grade at that height. Now we will get a few more like Daniher and Boyd coming through things may change.
-
Tell you what, if in 10 yrs time we have several 200+cm Fwds dominating then I'll change my mind
I don't think you'll have to wait that long. Maybe just 2 to 3 and I think many will be changing their attitude. Why?
Because until the last 5 years, 200cm players were ruck men almost exclusively. So there have been precious few forwards to make the grade at that height. Now we will get a few more like Daniher and Boyd coming through things may change.
We shall see. Both of those guys will not be amongst the dominant key Fwds of the comp imo. Boyd doesn't have the agility and Daniher will lose his when he puts on the weight he needs. Give me a Hogan, Cameron type over either of those anyday
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Tell you what, if in 10 yrs time we have several 200+cm Fwds dominating then I'll change my mind
I don't think you'll have to wait that long. Maybe just 2 to 3 and I think many will be changing their attitude. Why?
Because until the last 5 years, 200cm players were ruck men almost exclusively. So there have been precious few forwards to make the grade at that height. Now we will get a few more like Daniher and Boyd coming through things may change.
We shall see. Both of those guys will not be amongst the dominant key Fwds of the comp imo. Boyd doesn't have the agility and Daniher will lose his when he puts on the weight he needs. Give me a Hogan, Cameron type over either of those anyday
It's not 200cm per se that is the issue. Numbers are less overall so the pool of talent is much much smaller at that height. Doesn't mean that we won't find anyone though. Height is overrated either way. It works the other way too. Just because you are less than 180cm doesn't mean you won't make it. It's how well you can play. Some of the best players of all time have been less than 180cm. Sam Mitchell is under 180cm and is a star.
So if we find someone who can play the game and is over 200cm, we should grab him because he will become a dominant forward.
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They are getting bigger, people
-
Tell you what, if in 10 yrs time we have several 200+cm Fwds dominating then I'll change my mind
I don't think you'll have to wait that long. Maybe just 2 to 3 and I think many will be changing their attitude. Why?
Because until the last 5 years, 200cm players were ruck men almost exclusively. So there have been precious few forwards to make the grade at that height. Now we will get a few more like Daniher and Boyd coming through things may change.
We shall see. Both of those guys will not be amongst the dominant key Fwds of the comp imo. Boyd doesn't have the agility and Daniher will lose his when he puts on the weight he needs. Give me a Hogan, Cameron type over either of those anyday
It's not 200cm per se that is the issue. Numbers are less overall so the pool of talent is much much smaller at that height. Doesn't mean that we won't find anyone though. Height is overrated either way. It works the other way too. Just because you are less than 180cm doesn't mean you won't make it. It's how well you can play. Some of the best players of all time have been less than 180cm. Sam Mitchell is under 180cm and is a star.
So if we find someone who can play the game and is over 200cm, we should grab him because he will become a dominant forward.
Well actually it is the issue... it's a smaller talent pool but not that small - off the top of my head I named a fair few above, I'm sure there a more. Vardy, Gorringe, Essendon tried Bellchambers as a stay at home fwd, kruezer...
I'm not saying they're useless, but if you are going to get the pick of the afl schoolyard for 2 key Fwds, I doubt any will come from the 200+cm list. To date, they have proven to be bit part fwd/rucks not dominant key Fwds which is what this whole discussion is about. And your right it's about how well you can play, and right now I wouldn't have a 200Cm fwd (and there are plenty of them) in the top dozen key Fwds in the comp, would you?
"He will become a dominant forward" in your opinion.... It is my opinion that he won't
Not sure why you even brought up the point of the 180cm, not a good analogy
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those you listed failed as rucks and were tried as forwards as a last resort, no?
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No
Apart from Bellchambers and Zac Clarke
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maybe failed was the wrong wording, but they are all rucks or ruck/forwards rather than forwards
-
Paul Salmon was pretty good...
-
Paul Salmon was pretty good...
Also thought Ottens was a star for us up forward.
-
and for geelong
general patton
boyd
mcbean
hogan
hawkins
pimples
its clear as mud they are getting bigger, regardless of clawks 2 meter fetish
every position is getting larger / faster / more endurance
you have to be very good to make it as a little person
compare the size of the richmond history famous key forward and rucks to the current list
-
maybe failed was the wrong wording, but they are all rucks or ruck/forwards rather than forwards
Correct and they're ruck/forwards rather than Fwds for a reason - at that size they will always fill a need to be part time ruck - jack of all trades master of none.
-
Paul Salmon was pretty good...
Also thought Ottens was a star for us up forward.
Had one big year as a fwd, hardly what you'd classify as a dominant fwd. for Geelong he was a star as a ruckman not a fwd
-
Paul Salmon was pretty good...
Had that one purple patch half season as a fwd before doing his knee - tragedy,
he was better than pretty food, but was he a star or consistently dominant fwd? Ruck/fwd
-
and for geelong
general patton
boyd
mcbean
hogan
hawkins
pimples
its clear as mud they are getting bigger, regardless of clawks 2 meter fetish
every position is getting larger / faster / more endurance
you have to be very good to make it as a little person
compare the size of the richmond history famous key forward and rucks to the current list
Mate i made the simple observationthat over the years there have been very few 200cm players who have played kpf to a consistent high standard.
From that simple observation yrs ago a bunch of snmart arses decided to to take the pee. you lot are still procratinating about it.
The simple fact is not just at richmond but all clubs you are hard pressed to find a very good consistent 200cm bloke who regularly played kpf.
My thought remains the same on this. If i was chasing after a gun key fwd i would be reluctant to go hard at a 200cm bloke. Why because to date so few have shown they can play kpf and of those that have the best i can come up with is tippett.
I think people have got so petty about this simple observation because we have Three blokes who fall into that category and they just cant stomach the thought of them being no good.
I am not stupid enough to suggest there wont ever be a great 200cm key fwd but quite clearly even up to this point in time it will most likely remain a rarity.
-
and for geelong
general patton 198cm he may not be 200cm but hes a ruckman.
boyd 200cm LOTS OF ????
mcbean 200cm TO DATE A TOTAL DUD AS A TALL PLAYER
hogan 195cm AT 195CM HE DOESNT FIT THE CRITERIA.
hawkins 198cm AGAIN DOES NOT FIT THE CRITERIA.
pimples i presume the lad at essendon 201cm. Has done exactly what to date?
its clear as mud they are getting bigger, regardless of clawks 2 meter fetish
every position is getting larger / faster / more endurance
you have to be very good to make it as a little person
compare the size of the richmond history famous key forward and rucks to the current list
you have to be exceptional to become a very good kpf at 200cm. No one is arguing players are getting taller but the cut of for quality kpfs remains at below 200cm.
You tell me, your after a kpf. you have a quality kid at 195cm who could become a kpf and another at 200cm of similar talent. you have the info in front of you of just how many 200cm blokes become kpfs which one would you target.
-
and for geelong
general patton 198cm he may not be 200cm but hes a ruckman.
boyd 200cm LOTS OF ????
mcbean 200cm TO DATE A TOTAL DUD AS A TALL PLAYER
hogan 195cm AT 195CM HE DOESNT FIT THE CRITERIA.
hawkins 198cm AGAIN DOES NOT FIT THE CRITERIA.
pimples i presume the lad at essendon 201cm. Has done exactly what to date?
its clear as mud they are getting bigger, regardless of clawks 2 meter fetish
every position is getting larger / faster / more endurance
you have to be very good to make it as a little person
compare the size of the richmond history famous key forward and rucks to the current list
you have to be exceptional to become a very good kpf at 200cm. No one is arguing players are getting taller but the cut of for quality kpfs remains at below 200cm.
You tell me, your after a kpf. you have a quality kid at 195cm who could become a kpf and another at 200cm of similar talent. you have the info in front of you of just how many 200cm blokes become kpfs which one would you target.
of the four key forwards 200cm richmond has had on the books, since 1885
3 are currently on the list
what conclusions do you draw from that oh wise sage?
for the record, McBean, Vickery, Griffiths can all still potentially 'make it' as AFL standard key forwards. Maric goes alright in a pocket too
-
and for geelong
general patton 198cm he may not be 200cm but hes a ruckman.
boyd 200cm LOTS OF ????
mcbean 200cm TO DATE A TOTAL DUD AS A TALL PLAYER
hogan 195cm AT 195CM HE DOESNT FIT THE CRITERIA.
hawkins 198cm AGAIN DOES NOT FIT THE CRITERIA.
pimples i presume the lad at essendon 201cm. Has done exactly what to date?
its clear as mud they are getting bigger, regardless of clawks 2 meter fetish
every position is getting larger / faster / more endurance
you have to be very good to make it as a little person
compare the size of the richmond history famous key forward and rucks to the current list
you have to be exceptional to become a very good kpf at 200cm. No one is arguing players are getting taller but the cut of for quality kpfs remains at below 200cm.
You tell me, your after a kpf. you have a quality kid at 195cm who could become a kpf and another at 200cm of similar talent. you have the info in front of you of just how many 200cm blokes become kpfs which one would you target.
of the four key forwards 200cm richmond has had on the books, since 1885
3 are currently on the list
what conclusions do you draw from that oh wise sage?
for the record, McBean, Vickery, Griffiths can all still potentially 'make it' as AFL standard key forwards. Maric goes alright in a pocket too
1885 IS A LONG TIME AGO SON Lol. Your just like the rest revelling in mediocrity. So what are you saying here? They can all still become okay players. I thought we we were talking about consistenly very good key fwds.
They are freakin bums show some common sense man.
So we get to the crux of it eh. your objection about my 200cm comments is not about 200cm kpfs but the fact we have three on our list and you cant bare the thought of them being duds.
Thats freakin funny ive heard it all now. Theres a better chance of pigs flying than all three becoming very good kpfs.
-
touche'
-
maybe failed was the wrong wording, but they are all rucks or ruck/forwards rather than forwards
Correct and they're ruck/forwards rather than Fwds for a reason - at that size they will always fill a need to be part time ruck - jack of all trades master of none.
And you have nailed the reason there, generally blokes of that size will be playing ruck first and foremost, particularly at junior level. These blokes were all playing mainly ruck at u/18s. I've always felt that a ruckman that cant go forward is useless, but in modern footy with interchange restrictions the now defunct substitute rule even more so.
Bent Judge is also correct in saying that footballers are getting taller across the board.
While it may be true that very few players over 200cm have made it as KPFs, there have also been very few playes over 200cm pklayed primarily as KPFs and there are other sound logiucal reasons as why there have not been many.
The idea that 200cm is some magical number and once a player reaches that height he becomes incapable of succesfully playing as a KPF so is not sound logical reasoning, but narrow minded dogma.
As with anything the only rational way to look at it is look at each case individually, and if a bloke has the skillsets and attributes required why would you discount him just because he is "too tall"?
After all, everything else being equal, a 205 cm forward is going to be harder to keep quiet than a 195 one.
-
maybe failed was the wrong wording, but they are all rucks or ruck/forwards rather than forwards
Correct and they're ruck/forwards rather than Fwds for a reason - at that size they will always fill a need to be part time ruck - jack of all trades master of none.
And you have nailed the reason there, generally blokes of that size will be playing ruck first and foremost, particularly at junior level. These blokes were all playing mainly ruck at u/18s. I've always felt that a ruckman that cant go forward is useless, but in modern footy with interchange restrictions the now defunct substitute rule even more so.
Bent Judge is also correct in saying that footballers are getting taller across the board.
While it may be true that very few players over 200cm have made it as KPFs, there have also been very few playes over 200cm pklayed primarily as KPFs and there are other sound logiucal reasons as why there have not been many.
The idea that 200cm is some magical number and once a player reaches that height he becomes incapable of succesfully playing as a KPF so is not sound logical reasoning, but narrow minded dogma.
As with anything the only rational way to look at it is look at each case individually, and if a bloke has the skillsets and attributes required why would you discount him just because he is "too tall"?
After all, everything else being equal, a 205 cm forward is going to be harder to keep quiet than a 195 one.
You're not wrong Al, however, I have yet to see one 200cm+ guy that has the whole movement package - that is speed on the lead, agility, lateral movement and ability to repeat lead. I guess if you take out 2 of the freakiest athletes we've ever seen in richo and buddy then 195ish seems the cut off for that perfect balance of size and movement needed in a gun KPF, anything above that and movement is compromised hence they need to be ruck/Fwds. Will be interested to see if that changes over the next 5 or so years.
-
Perfect would be 203 in te lebron James Model
-
maybe failed was the wrong wording, but they are all rucks or ruck/forwards rather than forwards
Correct and they're ruck/forwards rather than Fwds for a reason - at that size they will always fill a need to be part time ruck - jack of all trades master of none.
And you have nailed the reason there, generally blokes of that size will be playing ruck first and foremost, particularly at junior level. These blokes were all playing mainly ruck at u/18s. I've always felt that a ruckman that cant go forward is useless, but in modern footy with interchange restrictions the now defunct substitute rule even more so.
Bent Judge is also correct in saying that footballers are getting taller across the board.
While it may be true that very few players over 200cm have made it as KPFs, there have also been very few playes over 200cm pklayed primarily as KPFs and there are other sound logiucal reasons as why there have not been many.
The idea that 200cm is some magical number and once a player reaches that height he becomes incapable of succesfully playing as a KPF so is not sound logical reasoning, but narrow minded dogma.
As with anything the only rational way to look at it is look at each case individually, and if a bloke has the skillsets and attributes required why would you discount him just because he is "too tall"?
After all, everything else being equal, a 205 cm forward is going to be harder to keep quiet than a 195 one.
oh penny penny penny grasping at straws. just admit your wrong. you clearly are a girl who is just not man enough to admit when wrong. cmon fess up your hopes are hanging on one of vickery mcbean griffiths.
Oh by the way im not the one who has made 200cm out to be some magical number your doing that all by yourself. Thats a nice attempt at saving face.
-
maybe failed was the wrong wording, but they are all rucks or ruck/forwards rather than forwards
Correct and they're ruck/forwards rather than Fwds for a reason - at that size they will always fill a need to be part time ruck - jack of all trades master of none.
And you have nailed the reason there, generally blokes of that size will be playing ruck first and foremost, particularly at junior level. These blokes were all playing mainly ruck at u/18s. I've always felt that a ruckman that cant go forward is useless, but in modern footy with interchange restrictions the now defunct substitute rule even more so.
Bent Judge is also correct in saying that footballers are getting taller across the board.
While it may be true that very few players over 200cm have made it as KPFs, there have also been very few playes over 200cm pklayed primarily as KPFs and there are other sound logiucal reasons as why there have not been many.
The idea that 200cm is some magical number and once a player reaches that height he becomes incapable of succesfully playing as a KPF so is not sound logical reasoning, but narrow minded dogma.
As with anything the only rational way to look at it is look at each case individually, and if a bloke has the skillsets and attributes required why would you discount him just because he is "too tall"?
After all, everything else being equal, a 205 cm forward is going to be harder to keep quiet than a 195 one.
ah jack of all trades master of none. It is plagarism that has been my phrase for how long now describing vickery griffiths and now mcbean.
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Is Penelope Al? :huh
-
maybe failed was the wrong wording, but they are all rucks or ruck/forwards rather than forwards
Correct and they're ruck/forwards rather than Fwds for a reason - at that size they will always fill a need to be part time ruck - jack of all trades master of none.
And you have nailed the reason there, generally blokes of that size will be playing ruck first and foremost, particularly at junior level. These blokes were all playing mainly ruck at u/18s. I've always felt that a ruckman that cant go forward is useless, but in modern footy with interchange restrictions the now defunct substitute rule even more so.
Bent Judge is also correct in saying that footballers are getting taller across the board.
While it may be true that very few players over 200cm have made it as KPFs, there have also been very few playes over 200cm pklayed primarily as KPFs and there are other sound logiucal reasons as why there have not been many.
The idea that 200cm is some magical number and once a player reaches that height he becomes incapable of succesfully playing as a KPF so is not sound logical reasoning, but narrow minded dogma.
As with anything the only rational way to look at it is look at each case individually, and if a bloke has the skillsets and attributes required why would you discount him just because he is "too tall"?
After all, everything else being equal, a 205 cm forward is going to be harder to keep quiet than a 195 one.
oh penny penny penny grasping at straws. just admit your wrong. you clearly are a girl who is just not man enough to admit when wrong. cmon fess up your hopes are hanging on one of vickery mcbean griffiths.
Oh by the way im not the one who has made 200cm out to be some magical number your doing that all by yourself. Thats a nice attempt at saving face.
lol oh great lord just has to say you are wrong and that is that. No need to address the arguments put forward at all.
The world of a narcissist must be a good one indeed......
....until reality sets in
-
Perfect would be 203 in te lebron James Model
Yeap,
But good luck with that
-
b Grimes Astbury C Ellis
hb Houli Rance Vlastuin
c Edwards Miles Mcintosh
hf Yarren Riewoldt Lennon
f McBean Deledio Rioli
ob Maric Martin Cotchin
Vickery
Conca
B Ellis
Townsend
:shh
-
and for geelong
general patton 198cm he may not be 200cm but hes a ruckman.
boyd 200cm LOTS OF ????
mcbean 200cm TO DATE A TOTAL DUD AS A TALL PLAYER
hogan 195cm AT 195CM HE DOESNT FIT THE CRITERIA.
hawkins 198cm AGAIN DOES NOT FIT THE CRITERIA.
pimples i presume the lad at essendon 201cm. Has done exactly what to date?
its clear as mud they are getting bigger, regardless of clawks 2 meter fetish
every position is getting larger / faster / more endurance
you have to be very good to make it as a little person
compare the size of the richmond history famous key forward and rucks to the current list
you have to be exceptional to become a very good kpf at 200cm. No one is arguing players are getting taller but the cut of for quality kpfs remains at below 200cm.
You tell me, your after a kpf. you have a quality kid at 195cm who could become a kpf and another at 200cm of similar talent. you have the info in front of you of just how many 200cm blokes become kpfs which one would you target.
of the four key forwards 200cm richmond has had on the books, since 1885
3 are currently on the list
what conclusions do you draw from that oh wise sage?
for the record, McBean, Vickery, Griffiths can all still potentially 'make it' as AFL standard key forwards. Maric goes alright in a pocket too
1885 IS A LONG TIME AGO SON Lol. Your just like the rest revelling in mediocrity. So what are you saying here? They can all still become okay players. I thought we we were talking about consistenly very good key fwds.
They are freakin bums show some common sense man.
So we get to the crux of it eh. your objection about my 200cm comments is not about 200cm kpfs but the fact we have three on our list and you cant bare the thought of them being duds.
Thats freakin funny ive heard it all now. Theres a better chance of pigs flying than all three becoming very good kpfs.
what do you make of richmond trying to draft Eric Hipwood, 200cm key forward / defender with 'pick 12' ? * - before pulling the trigger, eventually on young rioli
b mckay 198
h mckay 200
schache 198
all key forward-ish types, too, no ruckman in top 40 odd, just a bunch of guys around the 200 range in the first round ...
funny that
you may have to call for a new oecumenical council; with your ecclesiastical dignitaries are revisit some dogmatic principles :shh
-
I'm glad we didn't, I saw a lot of these 200cm types drafted yesterday, am very happy to revisit this thread in a few years to see if any of them look like going on to become dominant kpf's or ruck/Fwds
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I'm glad we didn't, I saw a lot of these 200cm types drafted yesterday, am very happy to revisit this thread in a few years to see if any of them look like going on to become dominant kpf's
i bet troy chaplin is too :whistle
-
Touche ;D
-
lol
-
b Grimes Chaplin C Ellis
hb Houli Rance Vlastuin
c Grigg Miles Mcintosh
hf Yarren Riewoldt Lennon
f McBean Deledio Rioli
ob Maric Martin Cotchin
Vickery
Conca
B Ellis
Edwards
:shh
EFA
-
b Grimes Broad C Ellis
hb Houli Rance Vlastuin
c Edwards Miles Mcintosh
hf Yarren Riewoldt Lennon
f McBean Deledio Rioli
ob Maric Martin Cotchin
Vickery
Conca
B Ellis
Townsend
-
According to the AFL website ...
Your team's best 22 and depth for 2016
Nathan Schmook
afl.com.au
November 28, 2015 3:01 PM
RICHMOND
BEST 22
B: Dylan Grimes, Troy Chaplin, Nick Vlastuin
HB: Chris Yarran, Alex Rance, Bachar Houli
C: Brandon Ellis, Anthony Miles, Kamdyn McIntosh
HF: Brett Deledio, Jack Riewoldt, Dustin Martin
F: Ben Lennon, Ty Vickery, Shane Edwards
Foll: Ivan Maric, Trent Cotchin, Jacob Townsend
I/C: Corey Ellis, Shaun Grigg, Jake Batchelor, Ben Griffiths
DEPTH
Key-position defenders: David Astbury, Nathan Broad, Todd Elton
General defenders: Taylor Hunt, Steven Morris
Key-position forwards: Liam McBean, Reece McKenzie, Callum Moore*
General forwards: Sam Lloyd, Oleg Markov, Daniel Rioli
Midfielders: Dan Butler, Jason Castagna*, Reece Conca, Nathan Drummond, Kane Lambert, Adam Marcon*, Connor Menadue, Andrew Moore, Jayden Short*
Rucks: Mabior Chol*, Shaun Hampson, Ivan Soldo*
Recruit Jacob Townsend is selected ahead of Reece Conca because of his inside strengths and the fact he was recruited to play a specific role in support of Trent Cotchin and Anthony Miles. Townsend also forces Kane Lambert out of the team. In the backline Chris Yarran is selected on a flank, where Richmond has stated it would like to play him. This gives the team two solid rebounding options. Nick Vlastuin is not expected to make a transition into the midfield in 2016 and remains a lockdown specialist in this 22, forcing Jake Batchelor (who is still required for height) on to the bench and the versatile Dylan Grimes to play tall. Corey Ellis is expected to entrench himself in the best 22 and Kamdyn McIntosh already has.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-11-28/your-teams-best-22-for-2016
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Richmond's best 22 for 2016
Sarah Olle
FOX SPORTS
22 December 2015
RICHMOND’S BEST 22
B: Jake Batchelor, Alex Rance, Dylan Grimes
HB: Bachar Houli, Troy Chaplin, Nick Vlaustin
C: Brandon Ellis, Trent Cotchin, Chris Yarran
HF: Dustin Martin, Tyrone Vickery, Brett Deledio
F: Shane Edwards, Jack Riewoldt, Ben Griffiths
FOLL: Ivan Maric, Anthony Miles, Kane Lambert
I/C: Shaun Grigg, Reece Conca, Taylor Hunt, Kamdyn McIntosh
EMERGENCY: Ben Lennon, Sam Lloyd, Steve Morris
OTHERS: David Astbury, Nathan Broad, Daniel Butler, Nathan Drummond, Corey Ellis, Todd Elton, Oleg Markov, Liam McBean, Reece McKenzie, Connor Menadue, Andrew Moore, Shaun Hampson, Daniel Rioli, Jacob Townsend
ROOKIES: Jason Castagna, Mabior Chol, Adam Marcon, Callum Moore, Jayden Short, Ivan Soldo
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/richmond-tigers-best-22-2016-ben-griffiths-needs-luck-kamdyn-mcintosh-ready-to-shine-/news-story/baa8d59a0ddfa209f99716320fcfffac
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:doh
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So she just copied the team from the EF and then replaced Newman with Yarran....hard gig this "journalism"...
...though it probably is the side Hardwick will pick come round one....(http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-violent072.gif)
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Would have Lennon in ahead of Lambert
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Corey Ellis and Lennon in, Hunt and Conca out.
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Lambert and Lloyd are best 22
If everyone were fit ?
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So I was having a bit of a think about what our best 22 would look like come end of year and below is the following.
Please note this is what I would expect by end of season/finals NOT right now. As some are green(rioli) and still injured (yarran)
Also understand that Rioli is prob 12-24 months off it but we are pretty dry in all areas of our list after the 25-28 player mark so It cant hurt to include in this list.
I Like Menadue too and want to fit him in there too.
And yes Short is in there cos he does not suffer from Tigeritis yet...
Interested to know thoughts
Our Best 22
B Grimes Astbury C Ellis
Hb Yarran Rance McIntosh
C Vlastuin Miles Houli
Hf Edwards Riewoldt Lennon
F Delidio Vickery Short
Ob Maric Martin Cotchin
Inter: Lambert, Rioli, B Ellis, Townsend/ Lloyd, Menadue (cut 2)
Pickup up an O Meara/Prestia/Tyson type and the midfield starts to look good.
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I'd be keeping Menadue in. Maybe instead of Short or Lambert
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B Grimes Astbury C Ellis
Hb Yarran Rance McIntosh
:clapping
C Vlastuin Miles Houli
Houli further up the ground is better :clapping
Hf Edwards Riewoldt Lennon
F Delidio Vickery Short
Ob Maric Martin Cotchin
:clapping
Inter: Lambert, Rioli, B Ellis, Townsend/ Lloyd, Menadue (cut 2)
Pickup up an O Meara/Prestia/Tyson type and the midfield starts to look good.
B Ellis needs to pull the finger out
id prefer Lambert, Rioli, Menadue types
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Grimes Astbury McIntosh
Yarran Rance Lennon
Vlastuin Miles Menadue
Deledio McBean Edwards
Rioli Riewoldt Butler
Cotchin Maric Martin
C.Ellis Lambert Vickery Castagna
...and yes I'd rather see Lennon forward.....but this is probably how he'll get into the side now....and it'll probably be the closest we'll ever get to that magical dream of having a Deledio at each end....
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Grimes Astbury McIntosh
Yarran Rance Lennon
Vlastuin Miles Menadue
Deledio McBean Edwards
Rioli Riewoldt Butler
Cotchin Maric Martin
C.Ellis Lambert Vickery Castagna
...and yes I'd rather see Lennon forward.....but this is probably how he'll get into the side now....and it'll probably be the closest we'll ever get to that magical dream of having a Deledio at each end....
Hence, why lids is required backline
Although I don't mind idea Lennon hbf
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They can rotate. Totaalvoetbal. :shh
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rip Johan Cruyff :(
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Lennon can't play back. He's a half forward through and through.
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Lennon can't play back. He's a half forward through and through.
So, given our list
Lids needs to play back
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there is an in position between position from half back to half forward
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Lennon can't play back. He's a half forward through and through.
Yes he can - have seen him do it with ease in the VFL. Looked a class above.
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Like a quarter back ?
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No.....didn't see him throw the ball even once...
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Best 22 based on what. Performance or potential. Either way its not good haarrggghhh.
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Best 22 based on what. Performance or potential. Either way its not good haarrggghhh.
:lol :lol :lol you made a funny Har Har haarrggghhh :lol :lol :lol
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Best 22 based on what. Performance or potential. Either way its not good haarrggghhh.
Based on the rubbish Dimmas mates serve up year after year
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Grimes. Astbury. Yarren.
Castanja. Rance. Mcintosh.
Rioli. Vlastuin. C Ellis.
Edwards. Riewoldt. Lennon.
Deledio. Chol. Cotchin.
Maric. Martin. Miles.
Menadue.
McBean.
Lambert.
:shh
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Maybe not our best 22 right now but te one we should be playing fir the rest of the year.
Grimes Griffiths/Elton/C.Moore Yarran
Castagna Rance C.Ellis
Miles Vlastuin Martin
McBean Edwards Butler
Rioli Riewoldt Deledio
Cotchin Vickery Lambert
Lennon
McIntosh
Menadue
Short
Rest some of our senior /best players and give games to Townsend, Markov & Broad towards the end of the year as well as farewell/good riddance games to spuds like Conca, Grigg , Houli, Chaplin, Maric (not a spud but cooked), Hamspud, A.Moore, B.Ellis...etc...which should improve our draft position...:shh
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Rioli needs to not be dropped ...
Well done miles lids matin
Vlastuin needs to stay in the middle ...
Grimes and rance need help ...
Jack is a machine
Short serviceable again
Lloyd keeps his spot for a while ...
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So many full of hope with the inclusions of the cream on the cake with Broad, Moore, let's not forget that big fish Townsend to help buffett those pesky taggers trying to bully our captain.
Superstar youngsters waiting in the wings like Elton Struggled and the highly regarded stick insect McBean.
Does anyone truly think our club can develop any of these types? Are we capable of actually building a list that can enjoy a sustained high level pushing for top four and even grand finals?
If Ol' man Jackson can pick 'em, does anyone really expect Chewing-gum Chocco's sideline barking is going to really develop a team of hardened psycho's that won't sleep until the ultimate prize is won?
Does anyone think that Dumma's 10 year old game plan will eventually prevail and suddenly make us the most skillful team in the league? Or able to actually prevent the opposition kicking coast to coast goals at ease? Will we ever see a tackle, shepherd or a hip & shoulder under this regime? Will we ever have a functional forward line consistently kicking over 100+ points a match? Will they ever demand excellence and expect only high standards?
We're just living the dream at Tigerland. :rollin
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hmm best 22 based on Mature players worth keeping and only includes players who have shown they can consistently play to a decent afl level.
FB: Grimes - #### - ####
HB: #### - Rance - ####
OB: #### - Cotchin - Miles
MID: Deledio - Martin - Yarran
HF: #### - Riewoldt - ####
FF: #### - #### - ####
INT: Vlastuin - McIntosh - Edwards - ####
Obviously it does not include juniors as none have reached a good level of afl consistency. The blank spots where possible should be filled with juniors or at seasons end with very good mature recruits.
juniors for the backline
Castagna, Menadue. there are no decent talls mature or junior to fill the holes. Mcintosh, Vlastuin and Conca are options
Mids/Onballers
we dont have a top flight ruckman or decent junior. juniors are
Drummond, C Ellis, Menadue, Markov. there are mature options. Greatest need here is a high quality big bodied mid.
Forwards
We have no junior tall fwds ready.
McBean is as good as gone it leaves McKenzie, Chol, C Moore, sml/med fwds who could fill the blanks are Lennon, Rioli, Butler.
There are 20 odd players not mentioned and over the next few years i would be looking to trade them out or delist them.
We are going to have to go into a very heavy rebuild phase .
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hmm best 22 based on Mature players worth keeping and only includes players who have shown they can consistently play to a decent afl level.
FB: Grimes - #### - ####
HB: #### - Rance - ####
OB: #### - Cotchin - Miles
MID: Deledio - Martin - Yarran
HF: #### - Riewoldt - ####
FF: #### - #### - ####
INT: Vlastuin - McIntosh - Edwards - ####
Obviously it does not include juniors as none have reached a good level of afl consistency. The blank spots where possible should be filled with juniors or at seasons end with very good mature recruits.
juniors for the backline
Castagna, Menadue. there are no decent talls mature or junior to fill the holes. Mcintosh, Vlastuin and Conca are options
Mids/Onballers
we dont have a top flight ruckman or decent junior. juniors are
Drummond, C Ellis, Menadue, Markov. there are mature options. Greatest need here is a high quality big bodied mid.
Forwards
We have no junior tall fwds ready.
McBean is as good as gone it leaves McKenzie, Chol, C Moore, sml/med fwds who could fill the blanks are Lennon, Rioli, Butler.
There are 20 odd players not mentioned and over the next few years i would be looking to trade them out or delist them.
We are going to have to go into a very heavy rebuild phase .
I don't get why you have 3 guys on the bench and not in the starting 18?
Don't you think Vlastuin is in our best 18?.. And even Edwards?
And up until this year I wasn't sold on McIntosh but him playing across HB has been good for us. And he will get better the more he plays there.
We need to be tougher..
We draft such soft kids IMO. It seems like a prerequisite of late. CEllis, Menadue, Rioli I know are all young but all are pretty soft if we are being truthful.
Like you said we need a big bodied mid that can actually use it to his advantage. North's midfielders last night made ours look small and skinny. We need a couple of 190cm beasts who can bully teams in the centre. Cripps would be handy right about now. In stead we have Lennon who realiscly a very one dimensional player, that cannot even force himself into our side. Hardwick in his wisdom wants to try and play him everywhere except as a leading forward. He is not a backman or a midfielder.
The rest of your team is 100% right which is really sad after 7 years with Dimma. And FJ.
The likes of Grigg, Houli, Hunt, Maric, Moore, Townsend, Chaplin, Ellis, Astbury, Vickery, Griffiths, Morris and Batchelor should be shown the door. All have shown they are either past their best or let the club down too many times to be retained.
Some decent picks should come from the likes of Vickery, Griffiths and BEllis. And even Lennon if we were serious.
The other I think might get us a decent pick is Miles. I like the kid but I just don't think he is damaging enough. He works his arse off but we need better. We have Vlastuin that should be playing that roll and another big bodied mid that is needed. I know that's probably not that popular but I've thought that for a while. We need guys that can break lines and be damaging and Miles is dower and really quite slow.
And of course the last one is Lids. But it's all been said before.
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Pretty much agree w claw
- vlastuin mid
- Edwards forward
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We draft such soft kids IMO. It seems like a prerequisite of late. CEllis, Menadue, Rioli I know are all young but all are pretty soft if we are being truthful.
Is Rioli soft, or just weak? Doesn't appear to be all that soft to me, just tries to use his pace but doesn't have the strength to keep his feet and break tackles. I hope this falling over business is just that though, and not a permanent thing.
We need a couple of 190mm beasts
That's definitely outside the box
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We draft such soft kids IMO. It seems like a prerequisite of late. CEllis, Menadue, Rioli I know are all young but all are pretty soft if we are being truthful.
Is Rioli soft, or just weak? Doesn't appear to be all that soft to me, just tries to use his pace but doesn't have the strength to keep his feet and break tackles. I hope this falling over business is just that though, and not a permanent thing.
We need a couple of 190mm beasts
That's definitely outside the box
Weak, soft, it's the same thing.
I saw him go to ground the other night in the centre of the ground just chasing after the footy. Not tackled, just decided to go to ground because that's an easy way out. I know he is young and skinny but if you allow it to happen without pulling him up on it, he will keep doing it.
Not good enough for a first round draft choice IMO.
I know this sounds ridiculous but it wouldn't happen at the Sydney Swans.
What are your thoughts on the other two I mentioned?
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Rioli will mature into a good player, Macca and Vlastuin are fine, agree with the rest. Reckon Chol will be a good player, moves like a cat for a bloke his size. Not sure what the hell is going on with Lennon, he should of been playing, now is injured...must of dumped in the coaches hat.
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We draft such soft kids IMO. It seems like a prerequisite of late. CEllis, Menadue, Rioli I know are all young but all are pretty soft if we are being truthful.
Is Rioli soft, or just weak? Doesn't appear to be all that soft to me, just tries to use his pace but doesn't have the strength to keep his feet and break tackles. I hope this falling over business is just that though, and not a permanent thing.
We need a couple of 190mm beasts
That's definitely outside the box
Weak, soft, it's the same thing.
I saw him go to ground the other night in the centre of the ground just chasing after the footy. Not tackled, just decided to go to ground because that's an easy way out. I know he is young and skinny but if you allow it to happen without pulling him up on it, he will keep doing it.
Not good enough for a first round draft choice IMO.
I know this sounds ridiculous but it wouldn't happen at the Sydney Swans.
What are your thoughts on the other two I mentioned?
To me it's a little different. Soft = mental, shirking contests, taking the easy way out. Weak = lacking strength, still attempts the hard stuff. Hence why I questioned if you think he's soft or weak but you answered it either way.
CEllis I think is soft but I'm going to give him time before I start berating him. Menadue I think more lacks strength than guts but his non-decision to use his pace and run is worrisome
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Rioli. C Ellis. Menadue. Are weak
Not soft. Soft is Chaplin. Houli.
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We draft such soft kids IMO. It seems like a prerequisite of late. CEllis, Menadue, Rioli I know are all young but all are pretty soft if we are being truthful.
Is Rioli soft, or just weak? Doesn't appear to be all that soft to me, just tries to use his pace but doesn't have the strength to keep his feet and break tackles. I hope this falling over business is just that though, and not a permanent thing.
We need a couple of 190mm beasts
That's definitely outside the box
Weak, soft, it's the same thing.
I saw him go to ground the other night in the centre of the ground just chasing after the footy. Not tackled, just decided to go to ground because that's an easy way out. I know he is young and skinny but if you allow it to happen without pulling him up on it, he will keep doing it.
Not good enough for a first round draft choice IMO.
I know this sounds ridiculous but it wouldn't happen at the Sydney Swans.
What are your thoughts on the other two I mentioned?
To me it's a little different. Soft = mental, shirking contests, taking the easy way out. Weak = lacking strength, still attempts the hard stuff. Hence why I questioned if you think he's soft or weak but you answered it either way.
CEllis I think is soft but I'm going to give him time before I start berating him. Menadue I think more lacks strength than guts but his non-decision to use his pace and run is worrisome
That one contest I'm talking about with Rioli was as soft as I've seen from him and as I said should be bought up with him in there meetings. No question.
I'd like to see it again but I couldn't put myself through watching that game again.
Menadue and Ellis have also had moments like this too.
Not writing any of them off and still want them playing but they need to be told.
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I fear that our youngsters model themselves on the group above them. Guys like Brandon Ellis......
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hmm best 22 based on Mature players worth keeping and only includes players who have shown they can consistently play to a decent afl level.
FB: Grimes - #### - ####
HB: #### - Rance - ####
OB: #### - Cotchin - Miles
MID: Deledio - Martin - Yarran
HF: #### - Riewoldt - ####
FF: #### - #### - ####
INT: Vlastuin - McIntosh - Edwards - ####
Obviously it does not include juniors as none have reached a good level of afl consistency. The blank spots where possible should be filled with juniors or at seasons end with very good mature recruits.
juniors for the backline
Castagna, Menadue. there are no decent talls mature or junior to fill the holes. Mcintosh, Vlastuin and Conca are options
Mids/Onballers
we dont have a top flight ruckman or decent junior. juniors are
Drummond, C Ellis, Menadue, Markov. there are mature options. Greatest need here is a high quality big bodied mid.
Forwards
We have no junior tall fwds ready.
McBean is as good as gone it leaves McKenzie, Chol, C Moore, sml/med fwds who could fill the blanks are Lennon, Rioli, Butler.
There are 20 odd players not mentioned and over the next few years i would be looking to trade them out or delist them.
We are going to have to go into a very heavy rebuild phase .
I don't get why you have 3 guys on the bench and not in the starting 18?
Don't you think Vlastuin is in our best 18?.. And even Edwards?
And up until this year I wasn't sold on McIntosh but him playing across HB has been good for us. And he will get better the more he plays there.
We need to be tougher..
We draft such soft kids IMO. It seems like a prerequisite of late. CEllis, Menadue, Rioli I know are all young but all are pretty soft if we are being truthful.
Like you said we need a big bodied mid that can actually use it to his advantage. North's midfielders last night made ours look small and skinny. We need a couple of 190cm beasts who can bully teams in the centre. Cripps would be handy right about now. In stead we have Lennon who realiscly a very one dimensional player, that cannot even force himself into our side. Hardwick in his wisdom wants to try and play him everywhere except as a leading forward. He is not a backman or a midfielder.
The rest of your team is 100% right which is really sad after 7 years with Dimma. And FJ.
The likes of Grigg, Houli, Hunt, Maric, Moore, Townsend, Chaplin, Ellis, Astbury, Vickery, Griffiths, Morris and Batchelor should be shown the door. All have shown they are either past their best or let the club down too many times to be retained.
Some decent picks should come from the likes of Vickery, Griffiths and BEllis. And even Lennon if we were serious.
The other I think might get us a decent pick is Miles. I like the kid but I just don't think he is damaging enough. He works his arse off but we need better. We have Vlastuin that should be playing that roll and another big bodied mid that is needed. I know that's probably not that popular but I've thought that for a while. We need guys that can break lines and be damaging and Miles is dower and really quite slow.
And of course the last one is Lids. But it's all been said before.
There are 22 players on a field. The interchange makes up part of those 22. They are mids and they will spend just as much time on the ground as the starting 18. Does it really matter whostarts on the bench
The blank spaces should be taken up by genuine fwds and defenders whose primary role has always been specialised in those roles.Ben Lennon is one he is primarily a fwd.
If i had to pick a side to take us thru the rest of the year and players were available i would do the following
FB: Grimes - Elton - Conca
HB: Yarran - Rance - McIntosh
C: Deledio - Martin - Edwards
R: Hampson - Cotchin - Miles
HF: Lennon - Chol/McBean - Lloyd
FF: Rioli - Riewoldt - C Moore.
Int: C Ellis - Menadue - Vlastuin - Drummond - Griffiths could come to the bench as a utility player if need be. second ruck and flexability for the talls.Would also give Townsend a few games primarily as a lock down tagger on the bigger opposion mids.
Plenty of kids 10 or 12 aged 22 and under with enough experience and quality around them.
Those blanks are basically filled with specialists who are primarily fwds or defenders.
You know as well as me this is never going to happen while Hardwick coaches for his life.
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George. Rance. Grimes.
Markov. . Markov. Markov.
C Ellis. Martin. Menadue.
Deledio. McBean. Lloyd.
Rioli. Jack. Cotchin.
Chol/Soldo. Vlastuin. Miles.
Lennon. Short. Lambert. Yarren.
C moore. Mcintosh. Drummond.
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Markov is so good he got picked twice! ;D
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George. Rance. Grimes.
Markov. Elton/Broad. Yarren
C Ellis. Martin. Menadue.
Deledio. McBean. Lloyd.
Rioli. Jack. Cotchin.
Chol/Soldo. Vlastuin. Miles.
Lennon. Short. Lambert. Edwards.
C moore. Drummond. Mcintosh.
:shh
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Reckon come rd1 next year our team will could look drastically different
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Reckon it'll be same old hack list blockers
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Reckon come rd1 next year our team will could look drastically different
Even an altered beast perhaps?
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Reckon come rd1 next year our team will could look drastically different
Even an altered beast perhaps?
Now your taking me back....1989 IIRC
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Reckon come rd1 next year our team will could look drastically different
Even an altered beast perhaps?
Now your taking me back....1989 IIRC
Yesssssssss big man :clapping
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Reckon come rd1 next year our team will could look drastically different
Even an altered beast perhaps?
Now your taking me back....1989 IIRC
Yesssssssss big man :clapping
:dancing :dancing :dancing :dancing :dancing
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Reckon come rd1 next year our team will could look drastically different
Even an altered beast perhaps?
Now your taking me back....1989 IIRC
Yesssssssss big man :clapping
Or 2005 for the "new" one
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hmm best 22 based on Mature players worth keeping and only includes players who have shown they can consistently play to a decent afl level.
FB: Grimes - #### - ####
HB: #### - Rance - ####
OB: #### - Cotchin - Miles
MID: Deledio - Martin - Yarran
HF: #### - Riewoldt - ####
FF: #### - #### - ####
INT: Vlastuin - McIntosh - Edwards - ####
Obviously it does not include juniors as none have reached a good level of afl consistency. The blank spots where possible should be filled with juniors or at seasons end with very good mature recruits.
juniors for the backline
Castagna, Menadue. there are no decent talls mature or junior to fill the holes. Mcintosh, Vlastuin and Conca are options
Mids/Onballers
we dont have a top flight ruckman or decent junior. juniors are
Drummond, C Ellis, Menadue, Markov. there are mature options. Greatest need here is a high quality big bodied mid.
Forwards
We have no junior tall fwds ready.
McBean is as good as gone it leaves McKenzie, Chol, C Moore, sml/med fwds who could fill the blanks are Lennon, Rioli, Butler.
There are 20 odd players not mentioned and over the next few years i would be looking to trade them out or delist them.
We are going to have to go into a very heavy rebuild phase .
FB: Grimes - #### - ####
HB: #### - Rance - ####
OB: Nankervis - Prestia - Miles
MID: Deledio - Martin - Yarran
HF: #### - Riewoldt - Cotchin
FF: #### - #### - ####
INT: Vlastuin - McIntosh - Edwards - ####
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##### = dud player who is only vfl level .
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##### can't be that bad if he's able to cover 9 positions and a spot on the bench all at once....
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##### = dud player who is only vfl level .
Looks like caddy takes one of them.
Claw has special rules we can't include rioli and Markov
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Your club's best 22 for 2017
AFL.com.au
October 24, 2016
WITH trade period finished and lists almost finalised ahead of next month's NAB AFL Draft, we predict your club's best 22 for next year.
These teams don't include players who have suffered long-term injuries and will miss the bulk of the 2017 season.
RICHMOND
B: Dylan Grimes, Alex Rance, Chris Yarran
HB: Bachar Houli, David Astbury, Nick Vlastuin
C: Shaun Grigg, Dustin Martin, Brandon Ellis
HF: Shane Edwards, Jack Riewoldt, Josh Caddy
F: Sam Lloyd, Ben Griffiths, Daniel Rioli
R: Shaun Hampson, Trent Cotchin, Dion Prestia
INT: Oleg Markov, Anthony Miles, Kamdyn McIntosh, Corey Ellis
EMG: Jayden Short, Reece Conca, Connor Menadue
Short played 16 games last season but will be pushed out by the returning Yarran. By bringing in Prestia and Caddy, the Tigers have an abundance of inside midfielders but need their runners such as McIntosh and Menadue pushing through. Nathan Drummond is not far off making the team while Ben Lennon's talent should have him on the brink of the senior side.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-10-24/your-clubs-best-22-for-2017
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The Herald-Sun's view of our best 22 for 2017
B: David Astbury, Alex Rance, Nick Vlaustin
HB: Brandon Ellis, Dylan Grimes, Bachar Houli
C: Josh Caddy, Dustin Martin, Anthony Miles
HF: Shane Edwards, Jack Riewoldt, Sam Lloyd
F: Oleg Markov, Ben Griffiths, Daniel Rioli
R: Toby Nankervis, Dion Prestia, Trent Cotchin
IC: Shaun Hampson, Reece Conca, Shaun Grigg, Chris Yarran
Others: Jayden Short, Taylor Hunt, Kamdyn McIntosh, Andrew Moore, Reece Conca, Corey Ellis, Kane Lambert, Connor Menadue
Source: Herald-Sun website (http://www.news.com.au/sport/why-your-team-wont-play-finals/news-story/5983e154e91210f17808897f5dee7863)
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##### = dud player who is only vfl level .
Looks like caddy takes one of them.
Claw has special rules we can't include rioli and Markov
not sure what part of the following was so hard to comprehend. It went
the best 22 are based on mature players WORTH KEEPING imo . It only includes who play consistently to a decent afl level imo.
Obviously it does not include juniors. The blank spots should be filled with juniors or at seasons end with very good mature recruits.
Now how hard was that it seems too hard for some too busy playing the smart arse.
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Short gets a game ahead of Houli
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B: Dylan Grimes, Alex Rance, Nick Vlastuin
HB: Bachar Houli, David Astbury, Oleg Markov
C: Chris Yarran, Dustin Martin, Brandon Ellis
HF: Shane Edwards, Jack Riewoldt, Josh Caddy
F: Sam Lloyd, Ben Griffiths, Daniel Rioli
R: Toby Nankervis, Trent Cotchin, Dion Prestia
INT: Sean Grigg, Anthony Miles, Kamdyn McIntosh, Corey Ellis
EMG: Jayden Short, Reece Conca, Connor Menadue
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Based on what we currently have Should go something like this but it wont.
Short - Astbury - Grimes
McIntosh - Rance - Vlastuin
Menadue - Martin - Markov
Rioli - Riewoldt - Lennon
Lloyd - Griffiths = Chol or C Moore or mature recruit.
Nankervis - Cotchin - Prestia
Caddy - C Ellis - Miles -
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B: Dylan Grimes, Alex Rance, Kamdyn MCIntosh
HB: Jayden Short, Xavier Richards/Mitch Brown/Cam O'Shea, Oleg Markov
C: Connor Menadue, Dustin Martin, Nick Vlastuin
HF: Ben Lennon, Mabior Chol/Jack Riewoldt, Chris Yarran
F: Sam Lloyd, Jack Riewoldt/Mabior Chol, Daniel Rioli
R: Toby Nankervis, Trent Cotchin, Dion Prestia
INT: Josh Caddy, Shane Edwards, two from Corey Ellis/Anthony Miles/Michael Barlow
EMG: Jason Castagna, Pick 27, Callum Moore, Willie Rioli
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Even on paper it still looks like a patched up,old pair of cheap jeans.
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That's actually a good side Oxxford - pity it won't happen because 1 - Yarran will likely never play. 2 - Barlow, Willie Rioli or any of the blokes named at CHB won't be on our list because 3- It's just my internet fantasy side & 4- The coach is an unimaginative fool.
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More in regards to all the "former other club players)
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To complete the fantasy - the coach of that side is either Stuart Dew or Nathan Basset.
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Grimes Rance Short
McIntosh Litherland Yarran
Vlastuin Barlow Markov
Caddy Dusty Lloyd
Rioli Jack Edwards
Nankervis Cotch Prestia
C. Moore Lambert George Conca
If you don't have AFL standard quality KPP, then don't play them. (Astbury, Griff) Play more like the Bullies did this year and move the ball quickly inside 50.
The bench is a little light on but I'd hope CEllis and Menadue can stand up take their game to the next level.
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FB: Castagna - Rance - Astbury
HB: Markov - Macintosh - Houli
OB: Hampson - Prestia - Cotchin
MID: Menadue - Martin - C Ellis
HF: Caddy - Griffiths - Edwards
FF: Rioli - Riewoldt - LLoyd
INT: Vlastuin - Miles - B Ellis - Nankervis
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FB: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
HB: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
OB: Hampson - Gigg- Houli
MID: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
HF: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
FF: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
INT: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin- Ellen
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FB: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
HB: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
OB: Hampson - Gigg- Houli
MID: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
HF: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
FF: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
INT: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin- Ellen
Like the sound of Gigg in the guts
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FB: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
HB: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
OB: Hampson - Gigg- Houli
MID: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
HF: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
FF: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
INT: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin- Ellen
Post to be reported as intentional baiting! :lol
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Our best 22 is still 14 off a flag.
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Our best 22 is still 14 off a flag.
Years?
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FB: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
HB: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
OB: Hampson - Gigg- Houli
MID: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
HF: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
FF: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin
INT: Grigg - Houli - Chaplin- Ellen
Post to be reported as intentional baiting! :lol
Calling people out for baiting/trolling is against the rules. Reported >:(
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Short gets a game ahead of Houli
ur kidding right short is nowhere near bachar mate lets be honest, light on might have pace but still along way to go
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There's still hope for Short....Houli's a proven dud....
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Short gets a game ahead of Houli
ur kidding right short is nowhere near bachar mate lets be honest, light on might have pace but still along way to go
Ur kidding. Short can actually hit targets and isn't afraid to put his body on the line..... :whistle
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It's funny watching Short try and cover someones man who is way too tall for him. Sad thing though is you hardly see Houli do that because he doesn't bother trying
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Grimes Rance Short
McIntosh Litherland Yarran
Vlastuin Barlow Markov
Caddy Dusty Lloyd
Rioli Jack Edwards
Nankervis Cotch Prestia
C. Moore Lambert George Conca
If you don't have AFL standard quality KPP, then don't play them. (Astbury, Griff) Play more like the Bullies did this year and move the ball quickly inside 50.
The bench is a little light on but I'd hope CEllis and Menadue can stand up take their game to the next level.
I understand the perception the bulldogs played short but it aint quite right. Take the G/F they had 5 blokes over 190cm going thru there at various times. Boyd 199, Stringer 192, Cordy 192, Bontompelli 193 and Roughead at 199.They get Crameri back and redpath as well also have bought in Cloke their options as far as genuine talls goes are many.
But your right we have serious problems if we are relying on Astbury and Griffiths and agree it would be great to not have to play them, but unlike the WB we dont have genuine talls who can come in and maintain good structure.Maybe we need to just play Chol and Callum Moore and see if they can not be fast tracked or if they are even good enough
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My team right now would be:
Short Astbury Grimes
Markov Rance McIntosh
Menadue Citchin B. Ellis
Edwards Riewoldt Yarran
Rioli Griffiths Lloyd
Hampson Martin Prestia
Caddy Vlastuin Conca C. Ellis
Emg Houli Lennon Miles
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Round 1
FB Vlastuin Astbury Grimes
HB Yarran Rance Markov
C C.Ellis Martin B.Ellis
HF Caddy Griffiths Lennon
F Lloyd Reiwoldt Rioli
R Hampson Prestia Cotchin
I Miles, Edwards, Conca, Nankervis
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Round 1
FB Vlastuin Astbury Grimes
HB Yarran Rance Markov
C C.Ellis Martin B.Ellis
HF Caddy Griffiths Lennon
F Lloyd Reiwoldt Rioli
R Hampson Prestia Cotchin
I Miles, Edwards, Conca, Nankervis
Not a bad side. Some would be happy that there is no Grigg or Houli. I like the fact that it means that there is competition for those spots. Not sure I like Hampson in the side as I think that is like playing a man short but others disagree. Also some think both Astbury and Griffith are not up to it but I disagree. I few unlucky not to be there but that's good (e.g. Short) as it means competition.
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My team right now would be:
Short Astbury Grimes
Markov Rance McIntosh
Menadue Citchin B. Ellis
Edwards Riewoldt Yarran
Rioli Griffiths Lloyd
Hampson Martin Prestia
Caddy Vlastuin Conca C. Ellis
Emg Houli Lennon Miles
Like it Machine
Except I'd want Miles in over Ellis B, I rate hardness at contests over outside run. Especially when the outside run is more often than not one way
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My team right now would be:
Short Astbury Grimes
Markov Rance McIntosh
Menadue Citchin B. Ellis
Edwards Riewoldt Yarran
Rioli Griffiths Lloyd
Hampson Martin Prestia
Caddy Vlastuin Conca C. Ellis
Emg Houli Lennon Miles
Like it Machine
Except I'd want Miles in over Ellis B, I rate hardness at contests over outside run. Especially when the outside run is more often than not one way
In reflection the change would be correct but i do have concerns with Miles lack of defensive run. Winning the hard ball is priority.
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I still don't know who the best 22 are but let's have another crack;
Conca Astbury Grimes
Markov Rance McIntosh
Grigg Cotchin B. Ellis
Edwards Riewoldt Rioli
Castagna Martin Griffiths
Nankervis Vlastuin Prestia
Int Caddy Lloyd Miles Butler
No Houli and Hunt please and i would also have Menadue and Short in the side but that won't happen.
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I still don't know who the best 22 are but let's have another crack;
Conca Astbury Grimes
Markov Rance McIntosh
Grigg Cotchin B. Ellis
Edwards Riewoldt Rioli
Castagna Martin Griffiths
Nankervis Vlastuin Prestia
Int Caddy Lloyd Miles Butler
No Houli and Hunt please and i would also have Menadue and Short in the side but that won't happen.
Agree Houli is an absolute liability. He plays we lose.
Griff in the fwd line only if he is 100% fit. Chol comes to mind for a key tall however endurance is still sub-afl. Maybe Lennon comes in as a lead up type. Riewoldt to be double teamed and we play a man loose off half back.
Vlastuin worrys me, maybe short comes in for him.
Conca and Ellis hmmmm.......
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Short in for Conca. Menadue for BEllis. Bolton for titch. Lennon for Grigg. Chol in for Griff.
Not our current best but what I see our best for the future.
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Short in for Conca. Menadue for BEllis. Bolton for titch. Lennon for Grigg. Chol in for Griff.
Not our current best but what I see our best for the future.
Titch played well yesterday. Would keep him in definitely and drop Houli hoops instead
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I still don't know who the best 22 are but let's have another crack;
Conca Astbury Grimes
Markov Rance McIntosh
Grigg Cotchin B. Ellis
Edwards Riewoldt Rioli
Castagna Martin Griffiths
Nankervis Vlastuin Prestia
Int Caddy Lloyd Miles Butler
No Houli and Hunt please and i would also have Menadue and Short in the side but that won't happen.
Agree Houli is an absolute liability. He plays we lose.
Griff in the fwd line only if he is 100% fit. Chol comes to mind for a key tall however endurance is still sub-afl. Maybe Lennon comes in as a lead up type. Riewoldt to be double teamed and we play a man loose off half back.
Vlastuin worrys me, maybe short comes in for him.
Conca and Ellis hmmmm.......
Its Lloyd or Lennon for mine and i would prefer B. Ellis not to be in the team and should be replaced with Menadue or Short. I like Conca and see him as a must :o
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Short Astbury Grimes
Markov Rance McIntosh
Grigg Cotchin Vlastuin
Caddy Reiwoldt Martin
Edwards Chol Rioli
Nankervis Miles Prestia
Int Castagna Lennon Menadue Lloyd
Like a few have mentioned, try playing lennon as a focal point fwd rather than on the periphery. Couldnt find room for Conca, BEllis and Griff
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Short Astbury Grimes
Markov Rance McIntosh
Grigg Cotchin Vlastuin
Caddy Reiwoldt Martin
Edwards Chol Rioli
Nankervis Miles Prestia
Int Castagna Lennon Menadue Lloyd
Like a few have mentioned, try playing lennon as a focal point fwd rather than on the periphery. Couldnt find room for Conca, BEllis and Griff
Agree with all of that except Grigg. Time to move on from him.
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Short Astbury Grimes
Markov Rance McIntosh
Grigg Cotchin Vlastuin
Caddy Reiwoldt Martin
Edwards Chol Rioli
Nankervis Miles Prestia
Int Castagna Lennon Menadue Lloyd
Like a few have mentioned, try playing lennon as a focal point fwd rather than on the periphery. Couldnt find room for Conca, BEllis and Griff
Agree with all of that except Grigg. Time to move on from him.
Ideally yes. Just need the next gen to replace the fob 4 first - Appaul McConcna, Ringo sHunt, Georgsher Howlison, and BranJohn Ellennon. Then Grigg is gone.
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Short Astbury Grimes
Markov Rance McIntosh
Grigg Cotchin Vlastuin
Caddy Reiwoldt Martin
Edwards Chol Rioli
Nankervis Miles Prestia
Int Castagna Lennon Menadue Lloyd
Like a few have mentioned, try playing lennon as a focal point fwd rather than on the periphery. Couldnt find room for Conca, BEllis and Griff
Agree with all of that except Grigg. Time to move on from him.
Ideally yes. Just need the next gen to replace the fob 4 first - Appaul McConcna, Ringo sHunt, Georgsher Howlison, and BranJohn Ellennon. Then Grigg is gone.
You are probably right, he is a touch more valuable than those other 4 but he still needs to go too. A side without those 5 replaced with young, enthusiastic, fast and hardworking kids would make us a better side not only now but with the chance of being a very good side in the future.
I really hope Dimma grows some balls this year and picks the team on form and an eye on the future in stead of just his favourites or first round selections.
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Who will the Tigers pick for Round 1?
JON RALPH,
Herald Sun
March 13, 2017
DAMIEN Hardwick will have his best 22 available and injury-free for Thursday week’s season opener against Carlton.
Now after exciting pre-season auditions by rookies Jason Castagna and Mabior Chol he has eight days to decide exactly who to pick.
Jack Riewoldt is in no doubt for that clash despite an ankle roll against Collingwood, while fellow key forward Ben Griffiths is also fit to play.
He suffered a kick to the calf against Port Adelaide but was withdrawn late as a precaution in Saturday’s narrow loss to Collingwood.
The Tigers have until Tuesday week to elevate their nominated rookie and can play a second rookie after Shaun Hampson went onto the long-term injury list.
Hampson is joined by only Steve Morris (ACL) on the injury list of players in senior contention.
Castagna looks a lock to be elevated after kicking 5.3 in a trio of JLT series games in a new-look Tigers forward line built on speed from smaller players.
But Chol’s intriguing performance after replacing Griffiths will give the Tigers match committee food for thought ahead of that decision.
The Sudanese rookie crashed packs, used his breakaway speed to worry Collingwood and kicked a goal from three shots.
On form he sits only behind Riewoldt and Griffiths as tall marking forwards, with mid-sizers Lloyd and Ben Lennon also in the mix.
Lennon kicked seven goals in the VFL on Friday night as Kamdyn McIntosh and Ivan Maric also went back to boost their game time.
Carlton and Richmond’s VFL teams next play on Thursday week at Punt Road before the MCG season opener.
The Blues look in similarly good health, with only ruckmen Daniel Gorringe, Andrew Phillips, defender Ciaran Byrne and first-round pick Sam Petrevski-Seton on the injury list.
Chol was seen to need much more development but could be elevated next week even if not played in Round 1.
“We are pretty fortunate in a way we have got a number of rookies playing well. Castagna has been playing good football, Mabior Chol I thought was terrific in bits and pieces and you can see what he can do going forward,’’ Hardwick said.
“Then big (ruckman) Ivan Soldo, the big fella at the end was really exciting for us.
“It’s a great position to be in. We have got two positions available and they are good questions to have coming into Round 1.”
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/teams/richmond/damien-hardwick-will-have-his-best-players-available-and-injuryfree-for-richmonds-round-1-clash/news-story/abbc00bb9102f5cfc36fe3ad8207e677
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Who plays for your club in round one?
Nathan Schmook
AFL.com.au
14 March 2017
IT'S RARE, if not completely impossible, for a club to have its unchallenged best 22 available at any time.
With round one approaching, AFL.com.au reporters have had a stab at picking their best 22 for the season opener for every club, leaving out those players who are injured, suspended or will miss due to poor form.
RICHMOND
Carlton v RICHMOND, MCG, Thursday, March 23, 7:20pm AEDT
B: Dylan Grimes, David Astbury, Reece Conca
HB: Bachar Houli, Alex Rance, Brandon Ellis
C: Shane Edwards, Dustin Martin, Shaun Grigg
HF: Josh Caddy, Ben Griffiths, Nick Vlastuin
F: Daniel Rioli, Jack Riewoldt, Sam Lloyd
Foll: Toby Nankervis, Trent Cotchin, Dion Prestia
I/C: Anthony Miles, Kamdyn McIntosh, Jason Castagna, Dan Butler
New faces: Dan Butler, Josh Caddy, Toby Nankervis, Dion Prestia
Missing with injury/suspension: Shaun Hampson (back, indefinite); Steve Morris (knee, 1-2 weeks); Jack Graham (hamstring, 1-2 weeks)
Notes:
Brandon Ellis has been backed to move into defence and will likely get first crack as a rebounder in round one. His form needs to improve, however, with Kamdyn McIntosh (named on the bench) and Oleg Markov other options here. Reece Conca has also returned as a small defender, forcing Jayden Short out of the team. Speed and defensive pressure should ensure Jason Castagna and Dan Butler get their chance in a smaller forward line. Nick Vlastuin is also selected as a midfielder/forward having trained and played there all pre-season. Connor Menadue, Corey Ellis and Markov are part of the future, but a lack of minutes and influence in the JLT Community Series means they're likely to be overlooked against the Blues. Mabior Chol is waiting in the wings if Ben Griffiths doesn't hit form soon, or the Tigers decide they need more forward line height and ruck support.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-03-14/who-plays-in-round-one
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Obvious now but looking back to the start of the year in the above post, Lambert (3rd in our B&F), Graham, Broad & Townsend really did come out of nowhere. They weren't even mentioned as being on the fringe of our best 22 back then. Now they are premiership players and all played key parts throughout the finals.
Start of the season ---> Grand Final
Miles was replaced by Lambert
Lloyd was replaced by Graham
Conca was replaced by Broad
Griffiths was replaced by Townsend
The remaining 18 played throughout the whole season together.
Best 22: How your club could line up in 2018
Dinny Navaratnam
afl.com.au
21 October 2017
RICHMOND
B: Dylan Grimes, Alex Rance, Bachar Houli
HB: Brandon Ellis, David Astbury, Nick Vlastuin
C: Kamdyn McIntosh, Dustin Martin, Kane Lambert
HF: Shane Edwards, Jack Riewoldt, Daniel Rioli
F: Jacob Townsend, Josh Caddy, Daniel Butler
R: Toby Nankervis, Trent Cotchin, Dion Prestia
INT: Shaun Grigg, Jack Graham, Nathan Broad, Jason Castagna
NOTES: This wasn't a hard team to put together, since the Tigers basically had a full list to pick from for the Grand Final and no players were traded in. On the fringes, the likes of Shai Bolton and Sam Lloyd have shown enough to indicate they could slot into the best-22 up forward, while Corey Ellis has the class to make this side better. If Damien Hardwick opts to pick a second tall in the forward line, Ben Griffiths looms as the obvious candidate, if he can overcome his concussion issues.
REMAINING SENIOR LIST: Jake Batchelor, Shai Bolton, Reece Conca, Nathan Drummond, Corey Ellis, Ryan Garthwaite, Ben Griffiths, Shaun Hampson, Ben Lennon, Sam Lloyd, Oleg Markov, Connor Menadue, Anthony Miles, Jayden Short
REMAINING ROOKIE LIST: Mabior Chol, Callum Moore, Ivan Soldo, Tyson Stengle
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/teams/richmond/anthony-miles-has-to-decide-whether-to-stay-at-richmond-or-find-a-new-home/news-story/7e45e5f0a515a3d7059e50855e463b54
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How lucky were we with injuries. But maybe that's the game style reminiscent of the swans.