One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: tigs2011 on November 21, 2012, 12:43:19 AM
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http://m.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/trent-bucks-leading-trend-20121120-29o3l.html
THE inevitable decision to appoint Trent Cotchin as Richmond's next captain has been hit with a numerical twist - the 22-year-old Tigers' star wants to retain his old number.
Rather than follow the relatively recent tradition of taking the No. 17 made famous by club legend Jack Dyer, Cotchin has told the club he wishes to keep the No. 9 that he has worn for the length of his football career on the back of his guernsey.
The Cotchin bid is understood to have been raised at Tuesday night's board meeting following the club's announcement on Monday of a record $3 million profit. His captaincy is expected to be announced in the coming days.
While the Cotchin captaincy has long been considered a formality, Gary March and his directors would have to ratify the break from the No. 17 tradition that was put in place by the Clinton Casey board shortly after Dyer's death in 2003.
Wayne Campbell adopted the No. 17 in the last year of his captaincy and two subsequent Richmond skippers in Kane Johnson and Chris Newman, who quit the captaincy at the end of the season, followed the tradition. Campbell also wore No. 9 for seven years of his eight-year captaincy.
Whatever the board's decision on the captaincy number, Newman is expected to revert to his old No. 1 next season.
March was tight-lipped on the issue on Tuesday, but confirmed that
the new Richmond captain would probably be announced before the team leaves for its North Queensland training camp next week. The Tigers depart next Monday for a 10-day camp in Cairns.
Cotchin is at present with the bulk of his senior teammates from the 2012 leadership group at a two-day leadership camp on the Mornington Peninsula. Also there is a a group of coaches all under the guidance of Campbell, who now holds a senior position in Richmond's football department.
Cotchin, who is also in contract negotiations with Richmond with his current deal ending at the end of 2013, finished runner-up in the Brownlow this year and won his second successive club championship - also named after Dyer, who won six best-and-fairests and captain-coached Richmond to the 1943 flag.
Dyer's statue holds pride of place outside the Punt Road Oval and there is also a room named in his honour at the club.
Tiger greats Barry Richardson and Maurice Rioli are among those to have worn 17.
According to Richardson, a three-time premiership player with the Tigers who also coached and was president of the club, it was the lure of Dyer's number that led to him choosing Richmond over Melbourne in 1964.
''Jack came down to visit us on the farm in Barnawartha and was very charming,'' Richardson recalled. ''He complimented my mother on her scones and as he left he told me if I joined the Tigers I could have his number.
''Melbourne had offered me an MCC membership, which was a big thing, but it was Jack's number that got me over the line to Richmond.''
Richardson said he had some sympathy with Cotchin's call. ''I tend to think that numbers are made by players themselves,'' he said, ''and if a player wants to create his own history then they should have that choice.
''Mind you, if the No. 17 tradition was named after me I might be a bit dirty on him.''
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Good.
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Good.
What, that players are still running the club?
It's not his decision
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A number of players like wearing the same number throughout their career. I didn't mind the idea of the captain wearing #17 but in Cotch's case he should stick to the #9. It's the number we all associate with him and he's arguably our most popular player along with Jack especially with our young supporters. It wouldn't surprise me if Cotch has taken this stand because he's thinking of the kids (he runs the Cotch's cubs footy clinics). You'll have all these kids out there with #9 on their back who adore him and all of a sudden their no longer wearing the number of their hero just because he has been made captain.
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I think JD has enough already. He has a statue, a stand, the B&F, and the mascot named after him.
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Agree, the captain should be allowed to wear his own number in keeping with his own identity.
Remember what he really represents is "Richmond" not "Jack Dyer"
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WTF has it got to do with the board?
It should be the football depts decision.
surely if the bloke is worthy of being captain, then his wish in such a matter should be accepted?
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Why can't we retire the #17 like we should have when he died, and the captain retain their own number and simply have a small '17' on the front under the AFL logo or something, to signify they are captain?
More than happy for him to keep running around in 9 though :clapping
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Example I found:
(http://www.bomberblitz.com/~rmered/images/Richmond-17.gif)
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great idea :clapping
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WTF has it got to do with the board?
It should be the football depts decision.
surely if the bloke is worthy of being captain, then his wish in such a matter should be accepted?
:clapping
LMAO @ a bunch of gimps on our board deciding what number Chimp will wear. Chimp could put on 40kgs, stand in the square all day and I'd still be applauding that sexy beast.
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common sense has prevailed.
Cotch can create his own history
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WHO CARES JUST LET COTCHY DO WHAT HE WANTS AS LONG AS HE IS IN THE RICHMOND COLOURS IM ALL GOOD.... WHY THE BOARD NEED TO GET INVOLVED IS BEYOUND ME...... JUST PUT THE 17 IN THE CORNER FOR CAPTAIN JACK.... THINK ITS PROBABLY BEING BLOWN OUT OF THE WATER A BIT.... NOTHING MUCH TO WRITE ABOUT THE PAPERS TODAY.....
GO U TIGERS
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No player is bigger than the club!
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Why can't we retire the #17 like we should have when he died, and the captain retain their own number and simply have a small '17' on the front under the AFL logo or something, to signify they are captain?
More than happy for him to keep running around in 9 though :clapping
Really, retiring the number 17 is just as silly as making the incumbent wear it.
Don't agree with having to have the number 17 appear anywhere on the jumper at all, total waste of time
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Good.
+1
time to create a new legend
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WTF has it got to do with the board?
It should be the football depts decision.
surely if the bloke is worthy of being captain, then his wish in such a matter should be accepted?
Footy Dept recommends who should be captain and the board ratifies it - all Clubs do it
As for the number that was a "rule"/item passed at board level nearly 10 years ago. As it appears in the board minutes as an approved item then it must reversed at board level.
It is an interesting debate I must say ;D
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Footy Dept surely doesn't recommend anyone. Wouldn't they just inform the board of who the players voted in as captain? Then they approve it unless it is Dan Connors who the boys voted to represent the club ;D
Why does this number 17 thing need to be reversed at board level? Was it even a rule in the first place rather than an option for the captain? Just let Chimp wear #9 FFS WGAF ;D
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I remember Cotchin saying he would love to wear the 17, now he wants to keep the 9. I'm fine with him keeping the 9, but why say you want the 17 and what it means etc if you don't want it?
FWIW I think the board will approve he wear 9, but then what will be interesting is what happens with 17.
In any case, my opinion is that 17 be retired and not worn again. Have it on the guernsey of the captain, on the front like the example I posted earlier, and let that be it.
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Why retire it? Did Newy disgrace it that badly?
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It's only a number for gods sake! It's the jumper that is sacred. What if Cotchin becomes the greatest tiger of all and wins 4 brownlows? Do we then revere the number 9 and forget about 17?
Talk about getting your knickers in a knot for nothing.
I loved watching Barry play in the number 17 and then Maurice.
It's time to retire this tradition and look forward to a new tradition of making finals consistently and winning premierships! The rest is BS!!!
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Example I found:
(http://www.bomberblitz.com/~rmered/images/Richmond-17.gif)
THEY used these on the JD memorial game, i bought one at auction
iirc it was against the dawks when they wore it
anyway i say joint captains
cotch and lids
both keep their numbers and wear 17 on the front
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and this is why TC will be our finest leader of the modern era.
He's wonderful!
stuff that ridiculously low IQ mentality of wearing dead dudes numbers.
Bring it, Trent!!!!!!
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Example I found:
(http://www.bomberblitz.com/~rmered/images/Richmond-17.gif)
THEY used these on the JD memorial game, i bought one at auction
iirc it was against the dawks when they wore it
anyway i say joint captains
cotch and lids
both keep their numbers and wear 17 on the front
Joint captains is pointless
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and this is why TC will be our finest leader of the modern era.
He's wonderful!
stuff that ridiculously low IQ mentality of wearing dead dudes numbers.
Bring it, Trent!!!!!!
I thought you'd be pushing for 1026 to be worn by the captain! ;D
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Why retire it? Did Newy disgrace it that badly?
Nothing to do with Newy, more to do with how the club holds the number in high regard (only allowing the captain to wear it). Now the captain wants to keep his original number (nothing wrong with that, am in favour of) which means it won't be used for a while anyway.
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I like the idea of the captain wearing a little 17 as a badge of pride on their jumper while still being able to retain their original number. It's a compromise.
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I like the idea of the captain wearing a little 17 as a badge of pride on their jumper while still being able to retain their original number. It's a compromise.
That means the back number 17 will have to be retired though.
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Richmond legend Kevin Bartlett says Trent Cotchin should keep No.9
Al Paton
From: Herald Sun
November 21, 2012 12:37PM
RICHMOND legend Kevin Bartlett says Trent Cotchin should ignore tradition and keep his No.9 if he is named Tigers captain.
Cotchin is expected to be named Richmond's new skipper as soon as next week.
Following recent tradition, that would mean trading in his No.9 guernsey for No.17.
But the Brownlow runner-up is reluctant to make the switch, according to reports in Fairfax Media.
He received backing from Bartlett today, who tweeted: "Richmond has to dump the notion all captains have to wear number17. Let each individual carve out their own history #cotchin9"
http://www.couriermail.com.au/sport/afl/richmond-legend-kevin-bartlett-says-trent-cotchin-should-keep-no9/story-e6frepf6-1226521212646
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Why can't we retire the #17 like we should have when he died, and the captain retain their own number and simply have a small '17' on the front under the AFL logo or something, to signify they are captain?
More than happy for him to keep running around in 9 though :clapping
Superb idea.
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let him keep the 9.
if the board rejects it and forces cotchy to wear the no.17, they are flogs.
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Footy Dept surely doesn't recommend anyone. Wouldn't they just inform the board of who the players voted in as captain? Then they approve it unless it is Dan Connors who the boys voted to represent the club ;D
Why does this number 17 thing need to be reversed at board level? Was it even a rule in the first place rather than an option for the captain? Just let Chimp wear #9 FFS WGAF ;D
Coach in answer to the 2nd part - it needs to be ratified/reversed because the RFC is a registered company and bound by Corps Law. Board resolutions (that was the word I was looking for before not rule ;D) are recorded in the the board minutes which are legal documents of a company (they are actually reviewed as part of an audit). Anything passed as a resolution becomes binding, therefore anything that is "binding" to bypass it must be put forward as a another resolution and an ratified for it to be reversed. The Number 17 for the captain was a resolution and therefore is binding.
As for the first bit, your are correct the footy dept will pass all the info onto the board but I think you will find buried away somewhere in the constitution it says the appointment of captain must be ratified by the board. As I said all clubs do it. Who could forget at Port Adel Mark Williams wanted Kane Cornes for Captain and the Board vettoed it and appointed Carsisi instead ;D
As I said it's a very interesting debate ;D
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Example I found:
(http://www.bomberblitz.com/~rmered/images/Richmond-17.gif)
THEY used these on the JD memorial game, i bought one at auction
iirc it was against the dawks when they wore it
Nah it was against Port Adelaide at Etihad
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Example I found:
(http://www.bomberblitz.com/~rmered/images/Richmond-17.gif)
THEY used these on the JD memorial game, i bought one at auction
iirc it was against the dawks when they wore it
Nah it was against Port Adelaide at Etihad
It was against Hawthorn ...
(http://cache2.asset-cache.net/gc/2456729-leon-cameron-of-the-tigers-is-challenged-by-an-gettyimages.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=OCUJ5gVf7YdJQI2Xhkc2QH0TrzD06M4rnrFDEpyHxLAymUtqoD1h4xjmNVqu2JtgYzo2lnEqHMCgamQ5K40b1A%3d%3d)
Happy little campers weren't we then :lol
(http://cache1.asset-cache.net/gc/2456744-the-richmond-tigers-pose-stuff=2&d=OCUJ5gVf7YdJQI2Xhkc2QIA2zqHqeyVb6%2foz5xHnXwqjzHI119Mrq08g7n1oslQUUDI%2fzyC2CzU87UBvRstiqg%3d%3d)
The Port game at Etihad had the Jack Dyer tribute banner
(http://cache3.asset-cache.net/gc/2426927-the-richmond-team-run-through-their-banner-gettyimages.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=OCUJ5gVf7YdJQI2Xhkc2QMcLUaU5BKdv65NOEC1mXgHgXWyoMUmqhKJ7y6b87QqkbVOC2jAlZBKYgBsWka2%2bSA%3d%3d)
Source: Getty Images
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Caro said the idea was created under the Clinton Casey admininstration and anything that admin came up with you'd scrap lol.
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It was against Hawthorn ...
Stand corrected
I have Leon Cameron's guernsey from that day = his last AFL game, with the 17 on it :thumbsup
Caro said the idea was created under the Clinton Casey admininstration and anything that admin came up with you'd scrap lol.
So Caro doesn't know the finer details of why they introduced it then?
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Caro said the idea was created under the Clinton Casey admininstration and anything that admin came up with you'd scrap lol.
Ditto :yep
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It was against Hawthorn ...
Stand corrected
I have Leon Cameron's guernsey from that day = his last AFL game, with the 17 on it :thumbsup
Caro said the idea was created under the Clinton Casey admininstration and anything that admin came up with you'd scrap lol.
So Caro doesn't know the finer details of why they introduced it then?
Can I have it?
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A little No.17 on the front, no thanks. The club needs to get rid of the idea altogether. It is not a 'tradition' of the club, it was only a recent idea and it was bad.
Trent Cotchin is too good to be living in anyone's shadow.
And like the Board is going to knock back Cotchin's request when they are about to re-open contract discussions with him :lol
This is one of those moments where the board realises that it is powerless to do anything. :gotigers
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The '17' idea was an emotional knee-jerk reaction.
Jack Dyer's memory will be rightly well preserved at Tigerland through many channels but it's time this gimmick was put out to pasture.
Cotchin will carve out his own piece of Richmond history and make the number 9 revered.
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Caro said the idea was created under the Clinton Casey admininstration and anything that admin came up with you'd scrap lol.
So Caro doesn't know the finer details of why they introduced it then?
Maybe not WP but it's bloody hard to argue with her line of thinking.
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The '17' idea was an emotional knee-jerk reaction.
Jack Dyer's memory will be rightly well preserved at Tigerland through many channels but it's time this gimmick was put out to pasture.
Cotchin will carve out his own piece of Richmond history and make the number 9 revered.
got it in one really, :thumbsup
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The '17' idea was an emotional knee-jerk reaction.
Jack Dyer's memory will be rightly well preserved at Tigerland through many channels but it's time this gimmick was put out to pasture.
Cotchin will carve out his own piece of Richmond history and make the number 9 revered.
Maybe but why does it becomes the players decision? :huh
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So hypothetically if cotch keeps no 9, then what becomes of no 17? does it sit and wait for our next big thing? or is there anyone who could don the jumper now?
Personally i'd prefer cotch to wear no 9, but if that happens it leaves the question what becomes of 17 and tbh I dont know what i'd do if I was in charge, its a hrad call to make... :-\
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I have Leon Cameron's guernsey from that day = his last AFL game, with the 17 on it :thumbsup
Can I have it?
No! ;D
The '17' idea was an emotional knee-jerk reaction.
Jack Dyer's memory will be rightly well preserved at Tigerland through many channels but it's time this gimmick was put out to pasture.
I think what's got lost is the fact that the decision of having the captain wear number 17 has a bit more to do with it than it simply being a memorial to Jack Dyer
A little No.17 on the front, no thanks. The club needs to get rid of the idea altogether. It is not a 'tradition' of the club, it was only a recent idea and it was bad.
Trent Cotchin is too good to be living in anyone's shadow.
This number 17 things has been in place now 9 seasons, so yes in terms of how long we've had it is relatively new but to have and create a tradition one needs to start it. that's what they did
I would think you can make a case that every player who wears a significant number at any club lives in the shadow of all previous players who wore that number until they create their own career, history and eventually legacy
The '17' idea was an emotional knee-jerk reaction.
Jack Dyer's memory will be rightly well preserved at Tigerland through many channels but it's time this gimmick was put out to pasture.
Cotchin will carve out his own piece of Richmond history and make the number 9 revered.
Maybe but why does it becomes the players decision? :huh
Yep and that's what a group of us were discussing yesterday.
the other thing that I find interesteing is that no one was up in arms when Cambo was given the number 17 (he was the first), no one was mortified that Kane Johnson had to move to 17 and give up number 28 for 4 years. No one jumped up[ and down when Newy had to put number 1 in mothbalss for the last 4 years.
But now it's Cotch it's front page news. The difference? apart from Cotchin being a much better player?
I grew up when the clubs best palyer was usually given number 17 (Rioli, Broderick) until Paul Hudson came along. If that was concept was still in play right now then I reckon most people would say Cotchin should have been given & be wearing number 17. It's kind of ironic ;D
Said it before will say it again it's an interesting debate
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Why isn't this being looked at for what it is? Just a bloke who doesn't want to change number. Cambo and others were happy too. Thought it was an option to go into #17 anyway? It's been suggested elsewhere that Cotchin isn't worthy of being captain if he doesn't switch. What a joke. The club would be sitting in the bottom 5 without Chimp
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It's been suggested elsewhere that Cotchin isn't worthy of being captain if he doesn't switch.
WTF? serious? What institution do these mental cases situated haunt?
same people who think jackson is captain material? :whistle
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I have one of Paul Brodericks jumpers, signed by the whole team. Anyone recall his number??
If Cotch wants to wear number 9 then 'nuff said.
What are we becoming? we are telling players what number they have to wear and other players who they can and can't see or talk to. FM!!!!!
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I have one of Paul Brodericks jumpers, signed by the whole team. Anyone recall his number??
If Cotch wants to wear number 9 then 'nuff said.
What are we becoming? we are telling players what number they have to wear and other players who they can and can't see or talk to. FM!!!!!
Brodders was 17! Got it from Rioli. Anybody who didn't know his number was because he always had poo all over it from being deep in the mix at every stoppage. :thumbsup
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It's been suggested elsewhere that Cotchin isn't worthy of being captain if he doesn't switch.
WTF? serious? What institution do these mental cases situated haunt?
same people who think jackson is captain material? :whistle
I used haunt that mental institution until I was kicked out for being sane. One of the blokes in question is Dan Jackson's player sponsor so it's understandable. Sponsoring him means you have some serious mental problems. I think some people bagging Cotch are mainly doing it because they're not a supporter of him being captain, they would prefer someone else ;D Those people are stuffwits
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Can I say that I appreciate both sides of the argument
And that have changed my view on this a number of times in the last couple of days
That's all ;D
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It's been suggested elsewhere that Cotchin isn't worthy of being captain if he doesn't switch.
WTF? serious? What institution do these mental cases situated haunt?
same people who think jackson is captain material? :whistle
I used haunt that mental institution until I was kicked out for being sane. One of the blokes in question is Dan Jackson's player sponsor so it's understandable. Sponsoring him means you have some serious mental problems. I think some people bagging Cotch are mainly doing it because they're not a supporter of him being captain, they would prefer someone else ;D Those people are stuffwits
I was a patient at Larundel
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go to the members for a vote. :thumbsup
after the truckload of money we have
sunk into the joint lets have a say.
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I tend to agree with the article that has quotes. I mean without them they can twist what has been said (can still with quotes but less of an extent). And since theres quotes of him saying he wants/will wear 17, I believe that.
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It's been suggested elsewhere that Cotchin isn't worthy of being captain if he doesn't switch.
WTF? serious? What institution do these mental cases situated haunt?
same people who think jackson is captain material? :whistle
I used haunt that mental institution until I was kicked out for being sane. One of the blokes in question is Dan Jackson's player sponsor so it's understandable. Sponsoring him means you have some serious mental problems. I think some people bagging Cotch are mainly doing it because they're not a supporter of him being captain, they would prefer someone else ;D Those people are stuffwits
:ROTFL
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Caro said the idea was created under the Clinton Casey admininstration and anything that admin came up with you'd scrap lol.
Ditto :yep
:clapping:
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Richmond Tigers Cotchin Captain's Guernsey
Celebrate the anouncement of Trent Cotchin being named Richmond's 40th captain!
(https://shopdesq.imgstg.com/assets/shopdesq/products/images/cotchclose400.jpg) (https://shopdesq.imgstg.com/assets/shopdesq/products/images/guernsey%20close%20400.jpg) (https://shopdesq.imgstg.com/assets/shopdesq/products/images/cotchskipback400.jpg)
Pre-order your very own Trent Cotchin Captain's guernsey.
This magnificent official and authentic KooGa premium home guernsey contains Trent's signature and captaincy status sublimated into the Sash, as well as his number 9, fully sublimated on the reverse.
This is a must have for any Tigers and Cotchin fan. Get in quick though, as stock is limited!
Stock is due to arrive in time for Christmas delivery.
https://shopdesq.imgstg.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=Product&ProductID=30374&OrgID=1751
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Never have I been more glad that he kept wearing #9. Isn't worthy of running around with #17 on his back.
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Never have I been more glad that he kept wearing #9. Isn't worthy of running around with #17 on his back.
:clapping