According to Tiger71 on the BF podcast last night:
* We're having a crack at two forwards next offseason. It times with Riewoldt retiring at the end of next year. We'll trade players out to get the currency.
* One of the forwards is Ben King. We've been showing interest over the past 8-10 months. If King hasn't re-signed with the Suns by the middle of next year then we're in with a show.
* They also mentioned as the other option - Jacob Koschitzke or Jake Riccardi. Hoping they may be a cheap option.
Go to around the 6 min mark: https://twitter.com/BFtigercast/status/1599699367975596032
You're correct, lamington.According to Tiger71 on the BF podcast last night:
* We're having a crack at two forwards next offseason. It times with Riewoldt retiring at the end of next year. We'll trade players out to get the currency.
* One of the forwards is Ben King. We've been showing interest over the past 8-10 months. If King hasn't re-signed with the Suns by the middle of next year then we're in with a show.
* They also mentioned as the other option - Jacob Koschitzke or Jake Riccardi. Hoping they may be a cheap option.
Go to around the 6 min mark: https://twitter.com/BFtigercast/status/1599699367975596032
Isn’t Ben king contracted till end of 2024?
Should the Tigers chase Harry Himmelberg?
Callum Twomey's idea.
WATCH HERE: https://twitter.com/AFL/status/1646045926912589824
We must let Broady go as a FA and get a pick around 30 for it. He has been a wonderful servant for us but something needs to give in order to get back into this draft.
I can’t see any other trade value for us unless we let Nano go, which the way he is playing might be an option.
Can't see us being any hope for Ben King.
Sadly, broad may have to go. he would be worth a pick in the 20's im sure of that. Hopefully he goes to eagles for a 4 year deal.
HH is about to turn 27 and will cost 800k for a season.
another mitch mcgovern for me. Does he ever string consecutive good games this bloke? I wouldnt know.
also he wouldnt be free, we would have to trade wouldnt we.
Sadly, broad may have to go. he would be worth a pick in the 20's im sure of that. Hopefully he goes to eagles for a 4 year deal.
HH is about to turn 27 and will cost 800k for a season.
another mitch mcgovern for me. Does he ever string consecutive good games this bloke? I wouldnt know.
also he wouldnt be free, we would have to trade wouldnt we.
Sadly, broad may have to go. he would be worth a pick in the 20's im sure of that. Hopefully he goes to eagles for a 4 year deal.
HH is about to turn 27 and will cost 800k for a season.
another mitch mcgovern for me. Does he ever string consecutive good games this bloke? I wouldnt know.
also he wouldnt be free, we would have to trade wouldnt we.
HH is a free agent so will only cost us $, not draft capital. No brainer.
We could cash in some players (Graham, Broad, Soldo, Vlastuin etc) and line up picks in the 2nd and 3rd rounds but our recent drafting has shown that this part of the draft is hit and miss. We really need a top 5 pick to bring in an A grader. Only player that I think we could trade for that sort of pick is Bolton. He is elite no doubt but more of a cream on top player and, unfortunately, we don't really have the cake to put the cream on top of at this stage.
Simplest way to get the top 5 pick is to do a Hawthorn and release multiple established players this year then play the kids all through 2024. Will result in a bottom 5 finish
HH would be a quick fix for losing Jack, as I don’t believe Ryan is a long term replacement. But depends on the cost.. we won’t pick up a decent forward in this draft at least unless we acquire more picks so I wouldn’t be totally against acquiring him to try and keep us afloat a little.
I don't really want to pay over the cap. I don't know who else is, but it just seems like blatant mismanagement to me.Simplest way to get the top 5 pick is to do a Hawthorn and release multiple established players this year then play the kids all through 2024. Will result in a bottom 5 finish
worked for carlton and nought.
Thats a no for me. Invest in the footy department and pay over the cap ya tightarses if need be
HH would be a quick fix for losing Jack, as I don’t believe Ryan is a long term replacement. But depends on the cost.. we won’t pick up a decent forward in this draft at least unless we acquire more picks so I wouldn’t be totally against acquiring him to try and keep us afloat a little.
Samson Ryan is only 22 years old. Too early IMO to make a call on him methinks.
Has never impressed me that much. Would wanna come at an affordable price.
Has never impressed me that much. Would wanna come at an affordable price.
Agree. Fairly average player for mine.
Not terrible, but wouldn’t pay much.
Hopefully we'll get something decent for Cumberland when he asks to be traded at season's end.... :shh
Yeah let’s poach everyone and up like the blues(pies) having to eventually salary dump those players anyway
.
I’m not against HH but what another 5-7 year contract? :shh
He is 28 next year and we aren’t contending.
I think our recruiting has been terrible and they are to blame as much as anyone. Amazing they couldn’t find one half forward they are willing to play to help jack. No ash Johnson anywhere in the country, ffs even mason cox is doing good things.
.
Surely we jump on that..... :shhNa Fiorini is just a tad big for the types we like. :snidegrin
Surely we jump on that..... :shh
Is HH on 800k per year the best we can do with that money in the whole country?
Pies get blokes like ash Johnson for a third of that.
He was very underwhelming yesterday and IMV has a touch of the Mitch McGoverns about him in terms of output.
28 next year as well. Not convinced but that’s me.
As I've said I'd much prefer Georgiades and I wouldn't even pay close to that for him.....and from GWS you could probably get Riccardi for less than half that.....obviously picks would be involved but it'd be like 4th rounder, 3rd at the most......:shhI would definitely take Riccardi
Geelong want De Koning from Carlton and are apparently offering Freo's Sean Darcy $5m over 5 years.
https://twitter.com/FOXFOOTY/status/1666981027368275970
Greater Western Sydney has offered Harry Himmelberg a new long-term deal and is confident he will stay despite his free agency status.
Rival clubs including Sydney and Richmond are interested in dragging Himmelberg out of the Giants given his capacity to play as a dangerous forward or intercept defender.
GWS football boss Jason McCartney said during the week the club was prepared to offer him a deal as long as five seasons.
On Sunday he confirmed that the Giants had finally lodged a deal with Himmelberg’s agent David Trotter at Hemisphere Management.
The Giants believe the Riverina-raised 27-year-old wants to stay at the club.
While GWS might have secured a top-10 compensation pick if Himmelberg departed as a free agent he said the Giants were desperate to retain such a valuable asset.
https://www.codesports.com.au/afl/trade-hq/afl-2023-latest-trade-free-agency-and-contract-news/news-story/ee29ce5f5a84307fe83efc41e6ea66ae
Georgiades and Riccardi uncontracted beyond this season? Surely we can pry one of them over to punt road.
Time to shop Graham around.Laughable
Time to shop Graham around.Laudable
Time to shop Graham around.
It’s not even worthy of printing that dribble. Of course we want pick 7 - why wouldn’t we? But how are we going to achieve that, what the hell do we have in collateral to even get pick 30 let alone pick 7.Given the Suns have academy kids to pick up, collecting more draft points is worth more to them than a single late top 10 pick. So, the Suns will be looking to turn their first round pick into more draft points than what their first pick is worth.
I would take Riccardi in a flash
Reckon Gibcus is shortening as a forward by the day.
While I’m still a doubter, Young is definitely improving each week playing the gorilla forward.
Balta, Broad, Grimes
Rioli, Young, Short
Can work as a back 6.
Gibcus can work as a swingman but showed he can lead and is a lovely kick. Can plug gaps down back.
This Ollie Lord kid looks like a very promising power forward based off this 1 game I’ve watched of him. His kicking is quite shocking but if you could fix that up he looks the goods. Think the commentators mentioned he was a bit disgruntled with his game time which I don’t see changing with Dixon and Marshall holding down their key posts.I was thinking the same thing. I would go after him for sure
This Ollie Lord kid looks like a very promising power forward based off this 1 game I’ve watched of him. His kicking is quite shocking but if you could fix that up he looks the goods. Think the commentators mentioned he was a bit disgruntled with his game time which I don’t see changing with Dixon and Marshall holding down their key posts.I was thinking the same thing. I would go after him for sure
Dreaming - they'll give up Georgiades before they give up Lord. :shh
Mitch Cleary on 7news last night said a key forward to partner Tom Lynch is on the menu this year after chasing Taranto and Hopper last year.
There's not many around is the issue and when they are traded in they are costly.Mitch Cleary on 7news last night said a key forward to partner Tom Lynch is on the menu this year after chasing Taranto and Hopper last year.
Mitch Cleary with the surprising footy news releases
I am all in on DES - Think he'll be a player
Ben King looks miserable.
Would suit perfectly
I’m sure most on here might listen to a popular Tiger Monday night podcast - it’s been suggested on there that we have been working on getting Ben King to Tigerland for the past 12 months .
I’m sure most on here might listen to a popular Tiger Monday night podcast - it’s been suggested on there that we have been working on getting Ben King to Tigerland for the past 12 months .Meh
I’m sure most on here might listen to a popular Tiger Monday night podcast - it’s been suggested on there that we have been working on getting Ben King to Tigerland for the past 12 months .
Out of contract end of 2024, when Dusty is also coming off his huge money.
I can see Dusty staying beyond 2024 if he wants it and his form is OK but he will be taking half of his current contract, surely?
I’m sure most on here might listen to a popular Tiger Monday night podcast - it’s been suggested on there that we have been working on getting Ben King to Tigerland for the past 12 months .
Out of contract end of 2024, when Dusty is also coming off his huge money.
I can see Dusty staying beyond 2024 if he wants it and his form is OK but he will be taking half of his current contract, surely?
Less than half - $1.3 to 500k
With what trade capitol? Overpriced, overrated and injury prone anyway... :shhIf we were brave enough to trade Jack Graham we could potentially walk away with B. King and a 1st round draft pick.
I refuse to join the coterie until YBB is reinstated.... :shh:shh :shh
I refuse to join the coterie until YBB is reinstated.... :shh
I refuse to join the coterie until YBB is reinstated.... :shh
Was he serious punted? ::). Who would want to join a group that Harrison Petty.
Wasn't talking about here was talking about the coterie group and also his club membership which last he said they were considering revoking. :shh
Wasn't talking about here was talking about the coterie group and also his club membership which last he said they were considering revoking. :shh
Needs more Jack Graham. :shh
JGTI > JHF :shh
JGTI > JHF :shh
Thought it was
JGTM
Jack Graham
Aka “The Machine”
If we could fit him under the salary cap absolutely. Bloke is a quality footballer, better than any ruck we've had since Ottens and Gale. Can't see us making a play for him as clubs normally don't play their captain in the 2's....:shh
Unfortunately I think Melbourne will want Jack Graham in return and we cannot give them that...
Himmleburg has signed for 5 years at GWS. Confirmed.Good
There are surely better & cheaper options than Hindenberg. :shh
This is not a rumour just putting it out there for discussion.
If you could get pick 5 for Dusty and pick 1 for Shai Bolton (eagles) would you consider it?
This is not a rumour just putting it out there for discussion.
If you could get pick 5 for Dusty and pick 1 for Shai Bolton (eagles) would you consider it?
How many more years do people think we're actually going to get out of Dusty? :shh
This is not a rumour just putting it out there for discussion.
If you could get pick 5 for Dusty and pick 1 for Shai Bolton (eagles) would you consider it?
Personally you could offer me the messiah ( insert favourite religion) before I’d consider trading shae Bolton
This is not a rumour just putting it out there for discussion.
If you could get pick 5 for Dusty and pick 1 for Shai Bolton (eagles) would you consider it?
Only way we get it is if Dusty leaves
Would have to involve trading our 2024 picks for some 2023 picks to bundle up for pick 5
Would have to involve trading our 2024 picks for some 2023 picks to bundle up for pick 5
I thought you were allowed to do it if you were trading back into R1?
Regardless, unless we lose a player or two that's actually got currency I don't see how we have the capital this year to trade for P5.
Do we have the cap space to take on a player and get a pick like Geelong? I don't think so with Lynch, Dusty and Bolton probably on a combined 3.25-3.5 million next year.
I thought you were allowed to do it if you were trading back into R1?
Regardless, unless we lose a player or two that's actually got currency I don't see how we have the capital this year to trade for P5.
Do we have the cap space to take on a player and get a pick like Geelong? I don't think so with Lynch, Dusty and Bolton probably on a combined 3.25-3.5 million next year.
I thought you were allowed to do it if you were trading back into R1?
Regardless, unless we lose a player or two that's actually got currency I don't see how we have the capital this year to trade for P5.
Do we have the cap space to take on a player and get a pick like Geelong? I don't think so with Lynch, Dusty and Bolton probably on a combined 3.25-3.5 million next year.
is it worth talons to N0rt about the compo they got. Wasnt it Extra picks that they must trade out and bring in established players?
If Port won't take him then we need to somehow convince Norf that Machine Man is the perfect replacement for Cunnington.... :shh
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0.9 goals a game...less than what Jack on his last legs is giving us now....pass... :shh
Tell you what if Norf gets a first round pick for Ben McKay it will be an absolute joke. He's no good.
Tell you what if Norf gets a first round pick for Ben McKay it will be an absolute joke. He's no good.
You can blame the teams that are offering him 800k+ a season.
I wouldn’t mind Larkey playing for usThat'd be the multi-Logie winning Larkey? ;)
He could get an Oscar for yesterdayI wouldn’t mind Larkey playing for usThat'd be the multi-Logie winning Larkey? ;)
Mitch Cleary floated the possibility of 27-year-old Richmond ruckman Ivan Soldo heading down the highway after he considered a trade move to GWS last off-season.
https://www.sen.com.au/news/2023/08/25/the-trade-options-geelong-could-target-to-address-ruck-need/
From Mick McGuane in the HeraldSun:
My mail is that free-agent Jack Silvagni (Carlton) wants to work something out and stay at Princes Park, despite still not having a contract offer. But if I was Richmond, I’d be seeing if I could lure him to Punt Rd. With the retirement of Jack Riewoldt, the Tigers could do with another marking forward to support Tom Lynch and the 25-year-old Silvangi could be an answer. If the Tigers were to lose Ivan Soldo, Silvagni could also be handy as a back-up ruckman to Toby Nankervis.
Harrison Jones (Essendon) might need a fresh start. Since bursting onto the scene in 2021, the key forward hasn’t done a lot and needs to ask himself how serious he is about his footy. There is clear upside there if another club can secure Jones and get the best out of him and his body, which has had its injury issues. He’s an athletic 196cm lead-up forward, which are hard to find. Jones could fit in well at a club like Richmond, following Jack Riewoldt’s retirement.
Forward Jade Gresham (St Kilda) is still without a contract for 2024 and there are three clubs who should be having a good, hard look at him. They are Hawthorn, Richmond and Carlton. The word is that Gresham wants to play more games at the MCG and those three clubs are all regular tenants of the home of football. Gresham hasn’t had his best season this year, but he has just turned 26 and has still averaged 17.4 disposals and a goal a game for the Saints.
https://www.codesports.com.au/afl/afl-trade-2023-mick-mcguane-on-who-your-club-could-lose-and-where-they-could-be-headed/news-story/a1584cebc9cf9952d6ced61a5574e6f7
Fridge and Hugo lol 😂
Please say it’s so
Fridge and Hugo lol 😂
Please say it’s so
Random hypothetical. Would anyone take Bailey smith at the tigers considering the rumour mill has gone bonkers with him being unhappy at the kennel?
Random hypothetical. Would anyone take Bailey smith at the tigers considering the rumour mill has gone bonkers with him being unhappy at the kennel?
Yes, he's an elite talent and young enough for our next flag push
Liam Henry is bound for Victoria after lodging a trade request with Fremantle on Wednesday.
The Dockers speedster is set to play in Melbourne next year, with Hawthorn, St Kilda and North Melbourne the clubs leading the race for him.
https://www.afl.com.au/news/1020759/fremantle-dockers-speedster-liam-henry-requests-trade-set-for-move-to-victoria
Liam Henry is bound for Victoria after lodging a trade request with Fremantle on Wednesday.
The Dockers speedster is set to play in Melbourne next year, with Hawthorn, St Kilda and North Melbourne the clubs leading the race for him.
https://www.afl.com.au/news/1020759/fremantle-dockers-speedster-liam-henry-requests-trade-set-for-move-to-victoria
TT is a jet but a big risk. Prob don’t have the leadership in the playing group anymore unfortunately to take the gamble on him.
we have a lot of pain ahead here boys.
Last years call is going to stuff us as we have no cards to play with the suns for that pick.
The only way i believe we will get that pick is to give them something they want which isnt going to be picks. :shh
Dylan Shiel at Richmond or Geelong?
@Josh__Barnes assesses every Bomber and names four clubs who could make a trade play for Shiel:
https://twitter.com/superfooty/status/1696846748382269904
9. Dylan Shiel
Age: 30 Games: 211 (2023 games: 12) Contract ends: 2024
With Archie Perkins, Ben Hobbs, Jye Caldwell and Sam Durham all showing steady improvement this year, where does that leave Shiel? When he played early this season, Shiel was still very strong inside the contest and the Bombers were happy with him as a midfielder who could push forward. Should the Bombers dangle him in the trade period? Geelong, Richmond, Sydney, could use a midfielder who has acceleration and he would be a good teacher at North Melbourne. But he also could drive Essendon into the finals. Shiel will put his head down and demand minutes ahead of his younger teammates.
Status: Staying
https://www.codesports.com.au/afl/afl-2023-every-essendon-players-contract-status-and-future-analysed/news-story/a316324581d21759c2aea290edde3b21
we have a lot of pain ahead here boys.
Last years call is going to stuff us as we have no cards to play with the suns for that pick.
The only way i believe we will get that pick is to give them something they want which isnt going to be picks. :shh
Who do you think they want?
Who is untraceable?Dylan Shiel at Richmond or Geelong?
@Josh__Barnes assesses every Bomber and names four clubs who could make a trade play for Shiel:
https://twitter.com/superfooty/status/1696846748382269904
9. Dylan Shiel
Age: 30 Games: 211 (2023 games: 12) Contract ends: 2024
With Archie Perkins, Ben Hobbs, Jye Caldwell and Sam Durham all showing steady improvement this year, where does that leave Shiel? When he played early this season, Shiel was still very strong inside the contest and the Bombers were happy with him as a midfielder who could push forward. Should the Bombers dangle him in the trade period? Geelong, Richmond, Sydney, could use a midfielder who has acceleration and he would be a good teacher at North Melbourne. But he also could drive Essendon into the finals. Shiel will put his head down and demand minutes ahead of his younger teammates.
Status: Staying
https://www.codesports.com.au/afl/afl-2023-every-essendon-players-contract-status-and-future-analysed/news-story/a316324581d21759c2aea290edde3b21
Shiel, Geez who thinks this BS up.
He's 30 ffs. Will be nowhere near our next flag and has been modest at best with Dons.
we have a lot of pain ahead here boys.
Last years call is going to stuff us as we have no cards to play with the suns for that pick.
The only way i believe we will get that pick is to give them something they want which isnt going to be picks. :shh
Who do you think they want?
Who is untraceable?Dylan Shiel at Richmond or Geelong?
@Josh__Barnes assesses every Bomber and names four clubs who could make a trade play for Shiel:
https://twitter.com/superfooty/status/1696846748382269904
9. Dylan Shiel
Age: 30 Games: 211 (2023 games: 12) Contract ends: 2024
With Archie Perkins, Ben Hobbs, Jye Caldwell and Sam Durham all showing steady improvement this year, where does that leave Shiel? When he played early this season, Shiel was still very strong inside the contest and the Bombers were happy with him as a midfielder who could push forward. Should the Bombers dangle him in the trade period? Geelong, Richmond, Sydney, could use a midfielder who has acceleration and he would be a good teacher at North Melbourne. But he also could drive Essendon into the finals. Shiel will put his head down and demand minutes ahead of his younger teammates.
Status: Staying
https://www.codesports.com.au/afl/afl-2023-every-essendon-players-contract-status-and-future-analysed/news-story/a316324581d21759c2aea290edde3b21
Shiel, Geez who thinks this BS up.
He's 30 ffs. Will be nowhere near our next flag and has been modest at best with Dons.
Meatball is my guess and we pay some of his wage.
id be happy with that.
Throw in HRS and Dow to fulfill their list clogging requirements, and we have a deal.
If Blair and Livingston have the courage to put some value on the trade table we can turn it around and get back in the draft.
My picks
Vlastuin or Short
Hugo
Graham
Soldo
If Blair and Livingston have the courage to put some value on the trade table we can turn it around and get back in the draft.
My picks
Vlastuin or Short
Hugo
Graham
Soldo
Short would probably fetch the most at the trade table and plays a position which we have a surplus of players and can easily cover. Plus we'd still have Balta for the shots outside 50. No way the club would have the balls or foresight to do it though.:shh
We’re we silly to move him on??
Word is it's Koschitzke from Hawthorn but it's probably Matt Taberner or Ash Johnson.... :badidea
Shane McAdam has requested a trade to Melbourne.
Melbourne is in the box seat to secure exciting Adelaide forward Shane McAdam after the playmaker told the Crows he wanted to be traded.Club.Shane McAdam has requested a trade to Melbourne.
The city or the club? :shh
Scoops says we're into Ginnivan...
Scoops says we're into Ginnivan...
After Gilligan got his only free kick for the year for a high tackle he looked exactly like a Richmond player ...
Seriously, I can't stand the little gimp! Constantly playing for free kicks is my pet hate ... :thumbsdown
How old is Jacky G? Surely he can't be worse than our current small forwards
I mean Mansell is held in the highest regard currently ffs :shh
How old is Jacky G? Surely he can't be worse than our current small forwards
I mean Mansell is held in the highest regard currently ffs :shh
have to keep the machine at all costs then.... :shh :shh :shhHow old is Jacky G? Surely he can't be worse than our current small forwards
I mean Mansell is held in the highest regard currently ffs :shh
Club's not big enough for two Jacky G's..... :shh :shh
How old is Jacky G? Surely he can't be worse than our current small forwards
I mean Mansell is held in the highest regard currently ffs :shh
have to keep the machine at all costs then.... :shh :shh :shhHow old is Jacky G? Surely he can't be worse than our current small forwards
I mean Mansell is held in the highest regard currently ffs :shh
Club's not big enough for two Jacky G's..... :shh :shh
have to keep the machine at all costs then.... :shh :shh :shhHow old is Jacky G? Surely he can't be worse than our current small forwards
I mean Mansell is held in the highest regard currently ffs :shh
Club's not big enough for two Jacky G's..... :shh :shh
#DioSidesWithFridge
SUN TO SEEK NEW HOME
Gold Coast key forward Chris Burgess is expected to look for a new home during the off-season after winning back-to-back Jim 'Frosty' Miller Medals.
The 27-year-old is contracted at the Suns in 2024, but it is understood the South Australian will explore a fresh start after being starved of opportunities across the past two seasons, managing only three AFL appearances despite dominant form in the reserves.
Two clubs have shown genuine interest in Burgess, with a couple of others keeping tabs on the West Adelaide product.
Adelaide has maintained an interest in Burgess since he joined Gold Coast along with Josh Corbett as a pre-draft selection at the end of 2018, while St Kilda has also kept tabs at different times. Brisbane, Richmond, West Coast and Hawthorn are other clubs considering key forwards this off-season.
Gold Coast is believed to be open to keeping Burgess, but the Suns are stacked with key forward depth and likely to offload some players to help acquire the draft points required to secure the four academy products they want to select in November, including underage star Jed Walter who is expected to play plenty of senior football under Damien Hardwick next year.
https://www.afl.com.au/news/1025077/inside-trading-gun-free-agents-still-unsigned-big-dog-wanted-pie-set-to-stay
Club. My tip is Lohman from lions
Club. My tip is Lohman from lions
Club. My tip is Lohman from lions
Upgrade on Cumberland :shh
Grundy to PowerPort don't have a first round pick. They traded it (pick 16 currently) to Norf for JHF last year.
Power pick 14 to Tigers
Lynch to Dee's
You blokes have nfi.
Trade jack
Trade lynch
Trade dusty
Love pies
Keep luke Meehan
Bloody hell wake up.
You blokes have nfi.
Trade jack
Trade lynch
Trade dusty
Love pies
Keep luke Meehan
Bloody hell wake up.
You blokes have nfi.
Trade jack
Trade lynch
Trade dusty
Love pies
Keep luke Meehan
Bloody hell wake up.
How would you approach our next flag then?
Willy and Georgie a bit more sensible.
You blokes have nfi.
Trade jack
Trade lynch
Trade dusty
Love pies
Keep luke Meehan
Bloody hell wake up.
How would you approach our next flag then?
Willy and Georgie a bit more sensible.
well the first thing i wouldnt have done is trade for Hopper. That pick would have been a very nice carrot for the suns for pick 4. Now we have no chance.
Looking at the GWS no wonder they were very happy to deal. It was the Green machine i believe they wanted to retain all along :shh
Lynch i wouldnt trade if it makes Pies better. stuff them. I know you love the pies Andy, but if Lynch regains top form and there is no guarantee of that at his age and his injuries, who do you want mentoring the Bauer and Samson? We would get slaughtered like North did when they offloaded all those players at once. 8 years later and they are a still a rabble.
Players who i think are replaceable are Grimes but he ant worth much. The other is Floss and Meatball. Its all hypothetical as they aint going anywhere, but they would give us a late first rounder i believe. Floss i was against trading, but i feel we may have backup.
Dusty trade is a firm no in my eyes. Its only my view but i would love to see him stay on for another 3 years, though i suspect we only get one more out of him.
All of these trades would get us some nice picks, assuming we know how to use them. What they wont do is give us elite talent like your dusty, cotch, Bont, daicos etc we may find a diamond in the rough, but what are the chances?
How many flags are won without elite match winners? Hit the draft and grab 2 top 10's next year somehow. There is no point finishing 10th or some crap like that.
I cant see a passage where this team is contending for a flag for over 5 years. Its going be 2-3 years before Brown, Banks, Samson, Bauer and co to reach 50 games barring no injuries.
Its a long road.
Would easily be the best Jack in the side. :shh
Would easily be the best Jack in the side. :shh
wouldn't be hard.
even jackstar would give JG a run for his money these days the way he played this year.
I'd go after Gresham.
Cost nothing as a RFA.
Add some class.
Can easily get an upgrade on Mansell with a late draft pick. :shh
The Bulldogs have already held conversations with Gold Coast around potentially shifting up to pick No.4 at this year's AFL Draft, with the club considering ways to best maximise its dual first-round selections.
The Suns are looking to trade down from the No.4 selection to amass draft points for Academy guns Jed Walter, Ethan Read and Jake Rogers, and to ensure their opening pick isn't swallowed by early bids for the talented trio.
The Bulldogs currently hold pick No.10 and a later first-round selection tied to Brisbane's finals finishing position.
https://www.afl.com.au/news/1025022/dogs-start-talks-with-suns-to-trade-stuff
The Dogs' picks 10 & 17 are worth 2420 points. Pick 4 is worth 2171 points.
Clearly not much confidence in Dow or Sonsie stepping up then... :shh
Is Buku Khamis worth a try with a rookie spot or cheap pick? He's listed at 191/87, the medium size we've never really sorted out.
48 goals in the VFL this year from 18 games, but comfortably starved of opportunity behind Naughton, JUH, Lobby, Darcy coming in recently.
If we could somehow get Larkey…. Any ideas??
Best idea I’ve heardIf we could somehow get Larkey…. Any ideas??
Threats & blackmail... :shh
Is Buku Khamis worth a try with a rookie spot or cheap pick? He's listed at 191/87, the medium size we've never really sorted out.
48 goals in the VFL this year from 18 games, but comfortably starved of opportunity behind Naughton, JUH, Lobby, Darcy coming in recently.
OUT-OF-CONTRACT Western Bulldogs forward Buku Khamis is contemplating his future after being starved of opportunities in 2023, despite a strong season in the VFL.
It is understood that the Western Bulldogs have tabled an offer for 2024 to Khamis' management, but multiple clubs have enquired about his services, with the athletic utility to weigh up his options over the coming weeks before making a decision.
Khamis kicked 41 goals from 18 appearances for Footscray, including five in last Saturday's semi-final loss to Box Hill after three in the first final against Casey.
https://www.afl.com.au/news/1031200/inside-trading-blues-trio-in-talks-athletic-dog-weighs-options-dons-made-to-wait
I know it's been mentioned before but think Tabener would be a decent get.
Jackson and Amiss have added to the stocks of Freo and Tabener has lost his monopoly on his spot. Good player would walk into our fwdline.
Another is Tomlinson. Just turned 30 but would be worth a look to fill that Tarrant spot and maybe free up Balta to go forward. Starved of opportunities behind May and Lever.
I know it's been mentioned before but think Tabener would be a decent get.
Jackson and Amiss have added to the stocks of Freo and Tabener has lost his monopoly on his spot. Good player would walk into our fwdline.
Another is Tomlinson. Just turned 30 but would be worth a look to fill that Tarrant spot and maybe free up Balta to go forward. Starved of opportunities behind May and Lever.
Keep away from rejects going to take us no where.
I know it's been mentioned before but think Tabener would be a decent get.
Jackson and Amiss have added to the stocks of Freo and Tabener has lost his monopoly on his spot. Good player would walk into our fwdline.
Another is Tomlinson. Just turned 30 but would be worth a look to fill that Tarrant spot and maybe free up Balta to go forward. Starved of opportunities behind May and Lever.
I know it's been mentioned before but think Tabener would be a decent get.
Jackson and Amiss have added to the stocks of Freo and Tabener has lost his monopoly on his spot. Good player would walk into our fwdline.
Another is Tomlinson. Just turned 30 but would be worth a look to fill that Tarrant spot and maybe free up Balta to go forward. Starved of opportunities behind May and Lever.
Tabener = a big pass. Old and very ordinary and would only add the our VFL squad. I don't believe we will bring in KF who is not getting a game as Balta will play second forward next season.
Like I said we should be asking for one of their young KPFs - they've got at least three, four if you count Marshall and they're targeting two rucks and a tall utility to add to all that. :shh
EDIT: Forgot about Finlayson so they've actually 5/6 kpfs - yep surely they can spare us one of the kids. :shh :shh
Uh oh....
https://twitter.com/cleary__mitch/status/1703759010963632273
:chuck
Uh oh....
https://twitter.com/cleary__mitch/status/1703759010963632273
:chuck
Be wary too of a fake Tom Browne account on twitter
I cant believe im saying it but I think we actually need to keep soldo... Nank is gonna miss through injury/suspension and we have no one else
I cant believe im saying it but I think we actually need to keep soldo... Nank is gonna miss through injury/suspension and we have no one else
Rather just continue to blood Ryan, plays his best as first ruck as he demonstrated early on when Nank & Soldo were both out and frankly it was vastly superior ruckwork to anything either of those two have ever served up- he just unable to sustain it but with another pre-season under his belt he should be able to handle the duties for longer. :shh
yeah lets grab him then. :banghead
fmd the fact we are going after this bloke is a concern.
Is he a free agent
yeah lets grab him then. :banghead
fmd the fact we are going after this bloke is a concern.
yeah lets grab him then. :banghead
fmd the fact we are going after this bloke is a concern.
We are- how do you know?
Take with a grain of salt at this stage but a *relatively reliable* poster at Big Footy reckons we're into Cadman for next year and also looking at Zuurzar, McCluggage & McGrath as FA's. :shh
Coolers coming hard for Baker. :shh
They can have Bakes for the no.1 pick
Coolers coming hard for Baker. :shh
Go as hard as they like, Bakes not leaving tigerland :shh
Harmes would make a good run with/tagger. We don't really have one on our list.
Harmes would make a good run with/tagger. We don't really have one on our list.
Always thought this was going to be Graham's role but we've either never bothered or he hasn't succeeded much beyond blanketing Sloane in the '17 GF
Harmes would make a good run with/tagger. We don't really have one on our list.
Always thought this was going to be Graham's role but we've either never bothered or he hasn't succeeded much beyond blanketing Sloane in the '17 GF
It's been well documented that Dimma didn't believe in tagging. Fortunately, in 2017 Caracella did ;D
I understand the rationale. You have a tagger who plays on a jet who instead of 40 possessions gets 20. But your tagger hasn’t touched the ball so you’re effectively playing one down.
That being said Lachie Neale in 2022 I think had 40 and he torched us. Same with Sidebottom 2018 . Like everything I think flexibility helps. Like didn’t cotchin tag tim Kelly in 2019 prelim against geelong after half time?
Latest -hopefully untrue- rumour doing the rounds is that we're into Snelling from the Bumblers.... :biglaugh :facepalm :biglaugh :helpExclusive: Hearing from sources that Will Snelling could request a trade to the Tigers #gotiges
Latest -hopefully untrue- rumour doing the rounds is that we're into Snelling from the Bumblers.... :biglaugh :facepalm :biglaugh :help
Latest -hopefully untrue- rumour doing the rounds is that we're into Snelling from the Bumblers.... :biglaugh :facepalm :biglaugh :helpExclusive: Hearing from sources that Will Snelling could request a trade to the Tigers #gotiges
https://twitter.com/RichmondFCSZN/status/1707299877959704981
175 cm and 80 kg? Is he the fastest player in the AFL??Latest -hopefully untrue- rumour doing the rounds is that we're into Snelling from the Bumblers.... :biglaugh :facepalm :biglaugh :helpExclusive: Hearing from sources that Will Snelling could request a trade to the Tigers #gotiges
https://twitter.com/RichmondFCSZN/status/1707299877959704981
Omg no what the hell for
175 cm and 80 kg? Is he the fastest player in the AFL??Omg no what the hell forLatest -hopefully untrue- rumour doing the rounds is that we're into Snelling from the Bumblers.... :biglaugh :facepalm :biglaugh :helpExclusive: Hearing from sources that Will Snelling could request a trade to the Tigers #gotiges
https://twitter.com/RichmondFCSZN/status/1707299877959704981
what amazes me is we didnt feel there were any glaring issues in our f50 to target players like bobby hill who was picked up for virtually nothing.
I'm well aware are you?
The Giants trade Hill and its round-three selection (pick No.40) to Collingwood for its round-three selection (43) and its future second-round selection.
So what pick exactly have the pies given up here? Pick 40 is peanuts then and it' is now. Did you have any issue in what we gave up for hopper, or is that hardly anything as well?
He wouldn't have cost more than 450k per year. We have blokes like Soldo and Graham on similar figures, yet we sat on our arse and tried to chase a 4th flag with this group.
I'm well aware are you?
The Giants trade Hill and its round-three selection (pick No.40) to Collingwood for its round-three selection (43) and its future second-round selection.
So what pick exactly have the pies given up here? Pick 40 is peanuts then and it' is now. Did you have any issue in what we gave up for hopper, or is that hardly anything as well?
He wouldn't have cost more than 450k per year. We have blokes like Soldo and Graham on similar figures, yet we sat on our arse and tried to chase a 4th flag with this group.
We have sat on our arses for three years now and still supporters are living in the past.
It is simple we have stopped evolving we still think we can win another flag with this group. At this rate it will be another 37 years of denial before we win another flag.
Lets look at all the clubs as of now and how long its been since their last flags.
Adelaide - a two town team powerhouse. 1998.
Brisbane - 2003 and still going.
Carlton - 1995 and 28 years long may it last.
Collingwood - premiers ffs. before this year 2010.
Essendon - 2000 23 years another team we all hope it lasts forever.
Fremantle - came into the comp in 1995 28years and counting.
Geelong - 2022 before that 2011. It took 11 years it did not take long enough.
Hawthorn - 2015 and counting.
Melbourne - 2021 before that 1964.
North - 1999 and counting long may it last.
Port - 2004 another two team power house who have been mostly ordinary for the last 19 seasons. Long may it last.
StKilda - last played in a gf 2010. Have one flag in too long to remember.
2018 - WCE 2018 currently a rabble looks like at least 5 years before they get another one. Very rich powerful club could take less time if they ever get their act back together.
FOOTSCRAY - 2016. 7 SEASONS AND COUNTING.
The point is its a falacy when people talk about premiership time frames. Already we are 3 years past our last flag and we have a very ageing list with not a lot of top end talent coming thru and still we think we can turn it around in a year or two. It is a fantasy.
Premierships don't grow on trees they come from years and years of hard work.
Didn't Yze mention that we could be aimimg for a top four finish.Yep, didn’t mention the year though, just said we were going to be competitive
Didn't Yze mention that we could be aimimg for a top four finish..
Would anyone do this trade?
Would anyone do this trade?
No
Have to consider the salaries involved. No club would take their salaries on in full and can't see Richmond paying any of them if they did trade
But IMHO itvis a mute point. Our new coach has made it clear he wants both players
Apparently Clayton Oliver is up for grabs if “the price is right” . From memory he’s on $1m a year? I feel like he will go but am curious who is gonna take up that pay cheque
Apparently Clayton Oliver is up for grabs if “the price is right” . From memory he’s on $1m a year? I feel like he will go but am curious who is gonna take up that pay cheque
Nah I think it's closer to 700-800. I believe he signed a 7 year extension to his already unfinished contract
Wonder why he's so out of favour?
Allegedly does cover you
What did I miss :lol
Apparently Clayton Oliver is up for grabs if “the price is right” . From memory he’s on $1m a year? I feel like he will go but am curious who is gonna take up that pay cheque
Nah I think it's closer to 700-800. I believe he signed a 7 year extension to his already unfinished contract
Wonder why he's so out of favour?
no chance mate, closer to 1 mil.
this contract was signed 6 months after he won a b&f in a flag year.
Was it durrsma who dropped the chesty in the PF in 2020? Either way if the price is right I’d happily take him on the wing as an upgrade on an aging kmac or pickett who I think still has a lot to process with his off field woes
Aaron Naughton has signed on for 8 more years in the red, white + blue!"My understanding is there were a couple of clubs offering 10-year deals to Aaron Naughton. West Coast and Sydney were really into Aaron Naughton and Geelong had a fair bit of interest as well."
https://twitter.com/westernbulldogs/status/1709496696496136542
I know this was announced late yesterday but 8 years @ reportedly $1.3m p.a. ..... woah! And the media bagged us for our 7 year deals ::).
Likely heading to the Bombers according to Jon Ralph.Was it durrsma who dropped the chesty in the PF in 2020? Either way if the price is right I’d happily take him on the wing as an upgrade on an aging kmac or pickett who I think still has a lot to process with his off field woes
Yes
Aaron Naughton has signed on for 8 more years in the red, white + blue!
https://twitter.com/westernbulldogs/status/1709496696496136542
I know this was announced late yesterday but 8 years @ reportedly $1.3m p.a. ..... woah! And the media bagged us for our 7 year deals ::).
Port Adelaide wingman Xavier Duursma is reportedly gathering attention from Victorian clubs.
Duursma is contracted for next year but according to AFL Media's Cal Twomey could be open to a move back to his home state.
Duursma’s younger brother Zane is expected to be a top five pick in this year’s AFL Draft.
The family hails from Victoria’s Gippsland region.
https://www.sen.com.au/news/2023/10/04/port-comment-on-duursmas-future-as-trade-potentially-in-play-for-victorian/
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Xavier Dursma for Ivan Soldo pls #gotiges #AFLTrade
https://twitter.com/sscandrew27/status/1709710694508036127
We had 4 picks in the top 30 last year and didn’t seem to make any stunning pick ups, so don’t really see what difference it makes what picks we have as our selectors continually seem to make dumb decisions or am I wrong? But I live in hope…..
We had 4 picks in the top 30 last year and didn’t seem to make any stunning pick ups, so don’t really see what difference it makes what picks we have as our selectors continually seem to make dumb decisions or am I wrong? But I live in hope…..
Let's see what swans cough up for Adams. 30 years old and really not that great.
Then let's watch as we get reamed with someone like soldo who is sought after by 1 maybe 2 clubs, and is a premiership ruckman. Assuming he leaves that is.
Let's see what swans cough up for Adams. 30 years old and really not that great.
Then let's watch as we get reamed with someone like soldo who is sought after by 1 maybe 2 clubs, and is a premiership ruckman. Assuming he leaves that is.
This actually makes no sense. If any player is wanted by 2 clubs vs 1 club, the rules of demand vs supply would dictate that the former goes for a higher price.
Hartley & Livingston sitting around twiddling their thumbs as usual.... :sleep
My fear is that Hartley and Livingston don't have the balls to put a player up for trade and improve our draft position.
Hartley & Livingston sitting around twiddling their thumbs as usual.... :sleep
As usual??
were you asleep last year??
If you were to be ballsy which player would you put up for trade to reap us the best possible draft picks
Never trade back into the draft or take it seriously paid overs for Hopper & probably Taranto as well when they both were uncontracted and wanted to leave and GWS didn't really care if they did, hung on to Ralphsmith & Graham when they were wanted. Re-sign list cloggers & over the hill plodders - still think we have a premiership list, trying to be Geelong/Sydney when we don't have their advantages - past their prime and clearly delusional. :shh
Agree many eggs in the 2021 basket but they all have shown something so far. 2006-2009 produced Shedda, Jack, Cotch, Rance and Dusty. Let’s hope 2021 is the start of that next generation
schulz if he does go the pies for 19, which really is 23 is an absolute bargain. Hartley sleeping again. ooh thats right we have the list to contend as i read today somewhere :lol
you know you are struggling if you cant entice anyone but Kosi.
schulz if he does go the pies for 19, which really is 23 is an absolute bargain. Hartley sleeping again. ooh thats right we have the list to contend as i read today somewhere :lol
you know you are struggling if you cant entice anyone but Kosi.
Who do you think we are missing out on?
Please don’t say Schultz :lol
Comment from twitter/X:
Brandon Ellis - 5 year deal, $3m, 176 games got us 2nd round compo. 2 x Premiership player.
McKay - 6 year deal, 71 games, KPD. Pick 3 compo.
Dodee - 4 year deal, 82 games, 2 x knee injuries, end of first round compo.
Don't try tell me the compo system isn't compromised.
https://twitter.com/BFtigercast/status/1711576769189519410
Harmes for a F3 is solid depth.
And P3 compo for McKay bloody hell that's corruption. As bad as Geelol getting that sweet pick for Motlopnto make the Gablett whinge return happen.
Also found WB move interesting securing P4 for 10+17+F1 I think it was? Seems a high price but they must really expect themselves to bounce back into the top 6 next year.
Zac Fisher and Pick 17 to North.
Carlton gets back picks 21 & 25.
https://twitter.com/1116sen/status/1711986002125033780
Not in this draft they reckon. The first ten are standouts and you can throw a blanket over the rest.. so the experts say
Claims we've met with Ginnivan apparently.
-----------------------------------
Jack Ginnivan is becoming increasingly likely to leave @CollingwoodFC with the potential arrival of Lachie Schultz. Ginnivan has met with @Richmond_FC & @HawthornFC throughout the season with both these clubs interested in him joining their ranks.
https://twitter.com/tradepreacher/status/1712039234872439291
Can anyone tell me why we aren't allegedly looking at Holland's from GC.
Claims we've met with Ginnivan apparently.
-----------------------------------
Jack Ginnivan is becoming increasingly likely to leave @CollingwoodFC with the potential arrival of Lachie Schultz. Ginnivan has met with @Richmond_FC & @HawthornFC throughout the season with both these clubs interested in him joining their ranks.
https://twitter.com/tradepreacher/status/1712039234872439291
Apparently, the offer for Soldo is pick 41 and a future 2ndthat is a seriously good deal for us
Apparently, the offer for Soldo is pick 41 and a future 2ndthat is a seriously good deal for us
Tell 'em they're dreamin'.
Apparently, the offer for Soldo is pick 41 and a future 2ndthat is a seriously good deal for us
Agree, take it with glee, and on trade 41 for Koschitzke.
Tell 'em they're dreamin'.
Hawks look likely for Ginnivan. We should be going after him.
Gee, this is such a welcoming place. How dare I have an opinion that differs to the mob's!
I believe that Port should offer an established player for an established player. They want somebody we want to keep? Give something up then. Not just pie-in-the-sky picks that will possibly amount to nothing.
Enjoy your cubby house, boys.
I would be looking at getting Josh Sinn out of Port for Ivan.
Hawks look likely for Ginnivan. We should be going after him.Not coming to us. He's picked the club he barracked for as a kid.
Always love how we do nothing at trade time and it's either the coaches fault or because we didn't appoint a coach early enough
List managers put together lists, coaches have some input. In Yze case he would have been told about our list status contract and salary cap wise. He would know who is up for trade.
But to trade you need currency, you know players that will get you decent picks or you need 1st round picks. Outside our A graders many on here reckon alot on our list are "duds" so what do you expect to get for them 2nd rounders? And
Then there is pesky thing called the salary cap. We have 3 players on big contracts next year, some have suggest each $1mil +. So you'd think we are limited in what we can offer any FA
Wouldn't trade Floss myself.
Graham absolutely.
Ross no, despite mention of Freo.
Wouldn't trade Floss myself.
Graham absolutely.
Ross no, despite mention of Freo.
I wouldn't be trading either of them at the moment, both coming off down seasons is precisely when you don't trade them. Graham is coming off two interrupted preseasons, and Vlastuin was below par for the first 8 weeks at least. We'd be trading at the bottom of their value. It's a typical supporter thing to try to trade blokes after poor seasons and then expect other clubs to cough up great picks. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
Wouldn't trade Floss myself.
Graham absolutely.
Ross no, despite mention of Freo.
I wouldn't be trading either of them at the moment, both coming off down seasons is precisely when you don't trade them. Graham is coming off two interrupted preseasons, and Vlastuin was below par for the first 8 weeks at least. We'd be trading at the bottom of their value. It's a typical supporter thing to try to trade blokes after poor seasons and then expect other clubs to cough up great picks. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
Didn't port just cough up pick 25-28 for soldo.
People will pay anything. I personally would take 40 for Graham he is that poor now. He is a list clogger these days and his slow play is a thing of the past
Richmond has shown mild interest in Scott Lycett after losing Ivan Soldo
https://twitter.com/RichmondFCSZN/status/1714520082125373825
Kosi deal done - pick 49.61 would have been better so we could use 41&49 to move up the order
Care Blair has bent 2 clubs over this year :lol
Graham & Ralphshyte should've been first two traded. Should've sent Half-season Hammy Prestia back to Dimma Coast too- oh well guess we need enough blokes that we can pee off at the end of next year when we'll have a decent draft hand and some spare cash for free agency....... :shh
Looks like we are going to sign Naismith as a a backup ruck.Richmond set to sign ex-Swan ruck
For me only yes to Naismith if we give Ryan a red hot go and he’s not up to it or for injury cover. Playing Naismith over Ryan and potentially impeding his development is a no from meAgree totally 💯 pc
For me only yes to Naismith if we give Ryan a red hot go and he’s not up to it or for injury cover. Playing Naismith over Ryan and potentially impeding his development is a no from me
I think taking Naismith as a free agent makes perfect sense.
1) Will cost us nothing draft wise.
2) Minimal level salary
3) Backup Ruck insurance
4) Was a better Ruckman than Nankervis in his day.
5) Will keep Nankervis on his toes.
Makes every bit of sense to me. However, keeping Colina on the list would make no sense at all.....
Just saw a clip of RCD and Sydney stack supposedly putting their hand up to try and find a new home as delisted free agents. Do we have anyone who watches sanfl and have any idea how RCD went last year? I have a soft spot for him mainly cause I feel he just wasn’t developed or given opportunity along cotchin when at times his vfl form warranted it
Just saw a clip of RCD and Sydney stack supposedly putting their hand up to try and find a new home as delisted free agents. Do we have anyone who watches sanfl and have any idea how RCD went last year? I have a soft spot for him mainly cause I feel he just wasn’t developed or given opportunity along cotchin when at times his vfl form warranted itRCD apparently going to play for Willy next year.
Just saw a clip of RCD and Sydney stack supposedly putting their hand up to try and find a new home as delisted free agents. Do we have anyone who watches sanfl and have any idea how RCD went last year? I have a soft spot for him mainly cause I feel he just wasn’t developed or given opportunity along cotchin when at times his vfl form warranted it
Averaged 15 disposals in 10 games. I suggest you give up on him!
Just saw a clip of RCD and Sydney stack supposedly putting their hand up to try and find a new home as delisted free agents. Do we have anyone who watches sanfl and have any idea how RCD went last year? I have a soft spot for him mainly cause I feel he just wasn’t developed or given opportunity along cotchin when at times his vfl form warranted itRCD apparently going to play for Willy next year.
-----
VFL: nothing official from Williamstown yet but it's believed the Towners have landed ex-Tiger Riley Collier-Dawkins, who was in the SANFL this year.
https://twitter.com/PaulAmy375/status/1717322999756718276
Just saw a clip of RCD and Sydney stack supposedly putting their hand up to try and find a new home as delisted free agents. Do we have anyone who watches sanfl and have any idea how RCD went last year? I have a soft spot for him mainly cause I feel he just wasn’t developed or given opportunity along cotchin when at times his vfl form warranted it
Averaged 15 disposals in 10 games. I suggest you give up on him!
Yuck that's poor.
I have a soft spot too - feel like we should have tried him as a medium forward/Josh Casey/Towner role.
Just saw a clip of RCD and Sydney stack supposedly putting their hand up to try and find a new home as delisted free agents. Do we have anyone who watches sanfl and have any idea how RCD went last year? I have a soft spot for him mainly cause I feel he just wasn’t developed or given opportunity along cotchin when at times his vfl form warranted it
Averaged 15 disposals in 10 games. I suggest you give up on him!
Yuck that's poor.
I have a soft spot too - feel like we should have tried him as a medium forward/Josh Casey/Towner role.
Its that soft spot that allowed him to list clog for his last two years with us.
Low football IQ and average kicking skills. Should never have drafted him.