One-Eyed Richmond Forum

Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: one-eyed on September 07, 2008, 04:58:30 AM

Title: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: one-eyed on September 07, 2008, 04:58:30 AM
Players back Wallace
Tony Sheahan | September 07, 2008 12:00am

FOUR former players have thrown their support behind Terry Wallace as he enters the final year of his contract as Richmond coach.

Former Western Bulldogs players Luke Darcy, Paul Dimattina and Steve Kretiuk and former Richmond defender Mark Graham said they could not understand why their former coach's future was the subject of such speculation.

"In terms of being an innovator, he was probably better than just about anyone," Darcy said. "His record is just fantastic."

Dimattina agreed: "I've always believed he is a bit of a genius. We were very close to winning Grand Finals in 1997 and '98 and they were probably the most enjoyable years I played in the game. Unfortunately we didn't get over the line, but they were the best years.

"But they would be mad not to (keep him for '09)."

Graham, who spent a decade at Hawthorn before playing a season under Wallace at Richmond in 2005, described him as "sensational", and pointed to the Tigers' inspirational victory over Hawthorn three weeks ago as evidence.

"Tactically, he is certainly switched on, as he showed against Hawthorn," Graham said.

Wallace's power has been diminished at Richmond in recent weeks, with president Garry March recently assessing the club's 2008 season as a five out of 10.

Kretiuk described Wallace's positive energy as his strong suit.

"He can instil belief in a person like few others," Kretiuk said. "I wasn't blessed with talent or speed, but one thing he did was he trusted me to play on the best forwards.

"He would never degrade you in any way and it was about getting you up each week."

Dimattina agreed: "He is a master tactician and he is great at getting the most out of the playing group and the best out of a negative situation. If you were down on form, he would just make you believe.

"He was a bit of a preacher in a way and you believed whatever he said."

Graham, who played 21 of a possible 22 games in his final season as an AFL player with the Tigers, said: "I know first hand the players at Richmond really respect him."

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sport/afl/story/0,26576,24303869-19742,00.html
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: tigersalive on September 07, 2008, 08:13:04 AM
Solidifying article.

It's powder puff but it's a just a bit of a breaker from the negativity.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Smokey on September 07, 2008, 11:23:36 AM
Just to keep the rumour mill rolling, I read a post on another forum by a good mate of mine whose credibility I would class as A1.  He has been told that the club are holding a meeting on Tuesday morning, Wallace will be gone and we are having talks with Leigh Matthews.  His direct source was an ex-Richmond player living in Perth (where my mate lives).  Interesting times.

http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/tiger-talk/message/88248 (http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/tiger-talk/message/88248)
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: yellowandback on September 07, 2008, 11:38:32 AM
Hun is a Wallace comic. Don't want him sacked but I wouldn't read too much into that article.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Moi on September 07, 2008, 12:14:39 PM
After an article like that, how could the club get rid of him
These are neutral points of view, ie they wouldn't be getting anything out of it by coming forward

Smokey, I'd be very upset about your rumour, even though I think Matthews is a good coach.  As good as he is, what has Matthews got to aspire to.  He's achieved everything now.  Why would he come to the Tiges knowing we are a rabble off field?  I can't imagine there'd be much incentive (even money) that would entice him to the Tiges.  But stranger things have happened.

I reckon though Matthews is a first class person, knows his stuff and very much respected.

But I'd still have Wallace any day.  If you believe in a person, you don't stray from your loyalty, especially when he's done everything you've asked him to do.

We owe Wallace the chance to fulfil his plan I reckon.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: tigerfan1961 on September 07, 2008, 12:30:57 PM
Just to keep the rumour mill rolling, I read a post on another forum by a good mate of mine whose credibility I would class as A1.  He has been told that the club are holding a meeting on Tuesday morning, Wallace will be gone and we are having talks with Leigh Matthews.  His direct source was an ex-Richmond player living in Perth (where my mate lives).  Interesting times.

http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/tiger-talk/message/88248 (http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/tiger-talk/message/88248)
That would be surprising as Matthews has strongly stated that he will be staying in sunny QLD. I agree that TW should be given the chance to see out his contract, although the circumstances and the way that Matthews quit so suddenly does make me suspicious.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: 3rogerd on September 07, 2008, 01:09:24 PM
this whole situation is just getting out of control, such a shame considering the 2nd half of the season which shouldnt have been the kick start needed for 09...

As for leigh Matthews it reeks of the Blighty situation when he went to the saints...

Will this damn club learn...probably not... :banghead
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Ox on September 07, 2008, 01:16:57 PM
If wallace goes,which i doubt,we will be,once again,guilty of mutiny at sea.

I blame past egos,a president unable to decipher reality from propaganda and an embarrassing
quality called,"stupidity"
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Moi on September 07, 2008, 01:39:07 PM
The stuff coming from the media seems to be in support of Wallace
Be a brave club to sack someone in those circumstances, knowing they'll cop a HUGE backlash
Something Richmond does not need.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Francois Jackson on September 07, 2008, 04:45:02 PM
After an article like that, how could the club get rid of him
These are neutral points of view, ie they wouldn't be getting anything out of it by coming forward

Smokey, I'd be very upset about your rumour, even though I think Matthews is a good coach.  As good as he is, what has Matthews got to aspire to.  He's achieved everything now.  Why would he come to the Tiges knowing we are a rabble off field?  I can't imagine there'd be much incentive (even money) that would entice him to the Tiges.  But stranger things have happened.

I reckon though Matthews is a first class person, knows his stuff and very much respected.

But I'd still have Wallace any day.  If you believe in a person, you don't stray from your loyalty, especially when he's done everything you've asked him to do.

We owe Wallace the chance to fulfil his plan I reckon.

Matthews over Wallace. Are you drunk again MOI.

this guy has won 4 flags and another 4 i think as a player vrs a guy who has not pushed us into the finals in 4 years.

very strange comment.,

Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Stripes on September 07, 2008, 08:19:30 PM
I'm looking forward to Tuesday just to hear the end of all these %#&*@%^& rumours.

There are is a very small but posionous group of malcontents that claim to be Tiger supports who demand immediate success from any coach we hire and as a result continue to undermine any basis of future success we can have at Richmond. While other teams supporters fight for unity and rally together to create stability on and off the field, we turn on ourselves and repeatedly die in an sickening orgy of politics and civil hatred.  :chuck

We all want success for the Tigers but we will only get it if we come together, set upon a plan and stick with it until its end.

But just as we seem to be on the right path...enter March and political instability!  :help

I just hope it is just the media's and posionous supporters imaginations for our clubs future sake!  :pray

Stripes
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: tigersalive on September 07, 2008, 08:26:25 PM
Utter rubbish.  Leigh Matthews wont coach again and especially not next year.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: the_boy_jake on September 07, 2008, 08:36:11 PM

As for leigh Matthews it reeks of the Blighty situation when he went to the saints...


Can see the similarity, although I think they are quite different coaches. I never really uderstood what Blight's footy philosophy was. He seemed like a week by week coach whereas Leigh had that run and carry and thump it forward % footy gameplan that worked so well when he had the cattle, and pretty well considering since then.

I reckon Wallace and Blight are actually a pretty similar style of coach - tinkermen and "innovators" ,for better or worse, whereas Leigh is much more singleminded in what he wants. Wallace for me has had trouble implementing a game plan and structure until this season - though that is due in large to the turnover of our list.

I'm not that passionate either way right now on the Wallace issue. I would be surprised if Matthews wants to come south and doubly surprised if he wants to coach in 2009 but he'd be no. 1 in my book out of anyone with experience. We'd need to make a prelim final next season for Wallace to get a contract extension and I think by then the likes of Tambling, Deledio, Foley etc would be primed for a new taskmaster anyway to raise the bar higher. Would be a pretty smooth handover, and if the board get their act together PR wise, with the new facilities, the new operations team, the young list and having given our last two coaches 5 years each, we could make a pretty convincing pitch to the best available coach.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: WilliamPowell on September 07, 2008, 09:30:26 PM
this whole situation is just getting out of control, such a shame considering the 2nd half of the season which shouldnt have been the kick start needed for 09...

Will this damn club learn...probably not... :banghead


Spot on 3rogerd, spot on

I have been disappointed in this footy club alot over the last 25 odd years - a helluva lot

But seriously at the moment I am so bitterly disappointed in what is going on it isn't funny....

And when I say "what's going on" it is more about what isn't going on... what appears to be a the lack of unity, the rumour mongering, the out of control egos, the lack of respect .... I could go on and on ...

I know what i'd be doing if I was in charge down there because it is so bloody obvious but no for some it just seems to hard  :banghead

No wonder we are a laughing stock ...  :banghead
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Moi on September 07, 2008, 09:49:52 PM
I know what i'd be doing if I was in charge down there because it is so bloody obvious but no for some it just seems to hard  :banghead
Tell us Willie
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: WilliamPowell on September 07, 2008, 10:01:44 PM
After an article like that, how could the club get rid of him
These are neutral points of view, ie they wouldn't be getting anything out of it by coming forward

Actually I read it with interest because Footscray supporters I know said that Wallace and Darcy didn't get along ( ;D) so for mine for Darcy to actually say something positive has to mean something....

The other one who comment I was really interested in was Mark Graham, he has the most recent knowledge so that must say something....

I'm looking forward to Tuesday just to hear the end of all these %#&*@%^& rumours.

There are is a very small but posionous group of malcontents that claim to be Tiger supports who demand immediate success from any coach we hire and as a result continue to undermine any basis of future success we can have at Richmond. While other teams supporters fight for unity and rally together to create stability on and off the field, we turn on ourselves and repeatedly die in an sickening orgy of politics and civil hatred.  :chuck

We all want success for the Tigers but we will only get it if we come together, set upon a plan and stick with it until its end.

But just as we seem to be on the right path...enter March and political instability!  :help

I just hope it is just the media's and posionous supporters imaginations for our clubs future sake!  :pray

Stripes

 :clapping top post Stripes.

Isn't it and shouldn't it be about what is best for the Club   ???

Not politics, not egos, but what is in the best interest fo the Richmond Football Club?

The percieved lack of unity, the lack of respect eminating out of the RFC in the 2 months isn't good for the RFC

Correct me if I am wrong but at the end of the 2004  season the RFC appointed a coach and gave him a 5 year contract so he could build a list so the Club could strive, achieve and maintain continued success? The irony isn't lost on me that Gary March and the rest of the current board (bar 2) made that decision

The definition of continual success was to play finals consistently rather than play a finals series one year and then miss out for the next 3-6 years?

By playing finals regularly it meant that we'd have decent chance to challenge for a flag?

That was the plan wasn't it?

The coach was given the 5 years because it was felt that is how long it would take to turn things around. There needed to be massive changes to the list I had a look at out list of 2008 and compared it the one from the end of 2004 and that there are not that many players left...

In 2008 I see we have made some steps forward .... we won 3.5 games in 2007 and wooden spoon, this year when most people (tiger fans included) thought a reasonable result would be 6-7 wins and we won 11.5....

Aren't things better?

Terry Wallace is about to enter the 5th year of his contract. The RFC made committment to him and his plan and they should see it through, they should honour it and support the footy department and let them do there bloody job....

IMHO opinion the worst thign the RFC can do at the moment is either sack the coach or force him into an untennable situation.

Can someone please explain to me why the views of a minoirty are deemed more important than everyone else

There are 30k+ members do we count? Does the majorities view matter at all?

Can someone tell me what exactly it is that we as a Club are doing here?

Gessh I am so effin angry :banghead :banghead

Here's a thought......

RFC for Geez sake GROW UP

Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: WilliamPowell on September 07, 2008, 10:11:58 PM
I know what i'd be doing if I was in charge down there because it is so bloody obvious but no for some it just seems to hard  :banghead
Tell us Willie

Well the first thing I'd do Moi, is get the bloody President and Coach to sit down together and work out their differences. I honestly believe if everyone has the best interests of the Club at heart then this can and should happen.

After that meeting I'd have the "faces of the Club" face the media together.

These people would be:

President
Coach
CEO
New Footy Ops Director if there is one
Club Captain

All of them... sit down and show a united Club

And the other thing I'd do is crack down on leaks. I'd find out where they've come from and I'd be showing the "leaks" the door.....

Reasonalbe start I would think  :thumbsup
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: mightytiges on September 08, 2008, 04:18:23 AM
Actually I read it with interest because Footscray supporters I know said that Wallace and Darcy didn't get along ( ;D) so for mine for Darcy to actually say something positive has to mean something....
I thought he posted it here and barracked for Richmond  ;D.


Isn't it and shouldn't it be about what is best for the Club   ???

Not politics, not egos, but what is in the best interest fo the Richmond Football Club?

The percieved lack of unity, the lack of respect eminating out of the RFC in the 2 months isn't good for the RFC
I wonder who has entered the building in that time. Everyone seemed fine and in agreement together over the past 4 years until recently which coincided with the appointment of a new L-plate loose-cannon board member with his own agenda ::).

Correct me if I am wrong but at the end of the 2004  season the RFC appointed a coach and gave him a 5 year contract so he could build a list so the Club could strive, achieve and maintain continued success? The irony isn't lost on me that Gary March and the rest of the current board (bar 2) made that decision

The definition of continual success was to play finals consistently rather than play a finals series one year and then miss out for the next 3-6 years?

By playing finals regularly it meant that we'd have decent chance to challenge for a flag?

That was the plan wasn't it?

The coach was given the 5 years because it was felt that is how long it would take to turn things around. There needed to be massive changes to the list I had a look at out list of 2008 and compared it the one from the end of 2004 and that there are not that many players left...

In 2008 I see we have made some steps forward .... we won 3.5 games in 2007 and wooden spoon, this year when most people (tiger fans included) thought a reasonable result would be 6-7 wins and we won 11.5....

Aren't things better?

Terry Wallace is about to enter the 5th year of his contract. The RFC made committment to him and his plan and they should see it through, they should honour it and support the footy department and let them do there bloody job....

IMHO opinion the worst thign the RFC can do at the moment is either sack the coach or force him into an untennable situation.

Can someone please explain to me why the views of a minoirty are deemed more important than everyone else

There are 30k+ members do we count? Does the majorities view matter at all?
Should be an interesting AGM if this instability continues and the average member is allowed to ask questions freely.

Who is up for re-election out of curiosity?

Can someone tell me what exactly it is that we as a Club are doing here?
I doubt the club knows itself. Board members listening to the same old backroom morons and nervous nellies who live in the 60s/70s and want quick fixes and whose only collective expertise is in how to continually stuff up a once proud and successful football club for 3 decades.

Seriously you feel like going down there on Tuesday night, barging in on the board meeting and as a paid up member demanding WTF are you imbeciles playing at!  >:(   
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Moi on September 08, 2008, 04:36:03 AM

Reasonalbe start I would think  :thumbsup
Reasonable.
I was hoping for something more brutal, like stoning of the leakers at family day or something lol

PS:  Agree with everything  :thumbsup
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Fishfinger on September 08, 2008, 05:03:59 AM

Who is up for re-election out of curiosity?

Don Lord
Garry Cameron
Tony Free

Greg Miller was up for re-election. Tony Free took his spot on the board.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Moi on September 08, 2008, 05:08:18 AM
Don Lord is okay
Don't know about the other two
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: mightytiges on September 08, 2008, 05:35:14 AM

Who is up for re-election out of curiosity?

Don Lord
Garry Cameron
Tony Free

Greg Miller was up for re-election. Tony Free took his spot on the board.
Thanks FF.

I wonder if anyone will challenge Free.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: WilliamPowell on September 08, 2008, 07:14:03 AM
Reasonable.
I was hoping for something more brutal, like stoning of the leakers at family day or something lol

PS:  Agree with everything  :thumbsup

No need fro stoning Moi

Public humiliation for some would be more than enough I reckon...

As for Directors up for re-election

Don Lord is fantastic and has done a massive amount of work raising funds for the JDF
Gary Cameron - is a smart operator
Tony Free - once had the upmost repect for Free but not since what has happened over the last 2 months (refer to MT's post earlier about L-Plates ;D
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Ox on September 08, 2008, 11:03:47 AM
Terry is smarter than March,therefore March has his back up.

Terry could play this in a way that March will never work again.

LOL March u Selfish f-wit!
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: blaisee on September 08, 2008, 11:49:45 AM
Terry is smarter than March,therefore March has his back up.

Terry could play this in a way that March will never work again.

LOL March u Selfish f-wit!

march will never work again? ::)

march is a multi millionaire doing a job for free for the club he loves. wallace is being paid 650k a year, surely his boss ( march ) should give him a job description, and the employee ( wallace ) should work within it. I mean if its good enough for Bomber, Ratten, and Clarkson, then FFS it should be good enough for wallace.

If anyone is never gunna work again its wallace. He has been coaching for 15 years and is yet to make a grand final. No wonder march has made him focus on COACHING THE FRICKEN SIDE as opposed to marketing/list management/administrative management.

We have people on place to do those roles for us, now wallace can focus 100% on what he has been paid to do...............coach. When the dust settles, this will be seen as one of the most important structural changes in our history.

The club is no longer run by morons, we will have the best facilities in the afl, we have been given access to 20 million dollars we will have a ground the size of TD and one the size of the MCG to train on. and remember this has been done by an administration on the back of 2 finals appearances in 25 years.

I know it is in the supporters psyche to be cycnical, but for FFS its all good, even if wallet walks. The sponsors will be announced very soon. The amount of positive news about to be released by the club is very very heartening.

I have never been this confident about the future as a richmond supporter/member in 25 years.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Ox on September 08, 2008, 02:48:26 PM
obviously meaning as president of an AFL club :sleep
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Tiger Spirit on September 08, 2008, 05:52:50 PM
I’m with you on this blaisee.  Some see this situation as a negative, when it could be the most positive thing to happen in a long time.

Sure this is shaking things up a bit, which is exactly what’s needed, and hasn’t happened in the past, because some were scared that if anyone so much as breathed it could disrupt everything.  But there’s a difference between a distraction caused by a disgruntled few wanting change for their own gratification and a review by those in charge.  And hopefully that’s what this is.

Anyway, what’s to be scared about?  If the coach walks because he doesn’t like the new working conditions then tough.  He wouldn’t get those conditions at any club other than Richmond, pre 2008. He should try getting a job at another AFL club and see what the circumstances are like.  They’d be exactly what they are at RFC now, I daresay.

And if the improvement was there in the players this season then why should it stop next year, regardless of who the coach is?  And if the improvement is not sustainable, because there’s a new coach then what does that say anyway?

It all points to RFC getting into the AFL and has to be a good thing?

Over the years, it seems we’ve come to place greater reliance on the coach at Richmond than at most other clubs, and it’s almost like many now think that success depends on him.  And that any sign of failure is his fault and any hint of success is his doing.

This is a really old way of thinking, because more than ever, success today is more dependent upon a club’s ability to manage and drive the whole process, rather than relying solely upon the ability of the coach, or any one individual to orchestrate it.  And the reality is that the well run clubs provide their footy departments with all the systems and support structures necessary to get the best out of players and to provide them with the best opportunity to make something of their careers.

In the past, the coach would’ve been the ‘main man’, but as an outsider looking in, it seems that the main requirement of a coach these days is his ability to handle match day, as most other aspects of coaching seem to be taken care of by others.  Without meaning to undersell or understate the role and significance of a coach in any way, in today’s AFL environment some coaches seem nothing more than glorified strategists, for the most part.

Mainly because clubs seem to have an abundance of support structures and systems in place, meaning the role of the coach is not what it once was.  At the same time though, he still plays an important and essential role and needs to know his players, to a large degree, and be able to motivate and inspire them.  And if he can’t communicate his message to them then his strategies will count for nothing, especially in crunch situations.

His overall value to a club would seem limited if he is unable to take his players to the required level, particularly given the resources made available within most footy departments.

Under these circumstances, a club is well within its rights to ask questions of those involved, if results are not forthcoming.  It is also their duty to do so.

And what would be more worrying is if the Club handed over its responsibility to drive success to those with a vested interested in the direction they steer.

So, basically, if this is handled properly and professionally, I don’t see how this whole thing could signify anything but positive and progressive change.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Ox on September 08, 2008, 06:12:20 PM
We're hardly scared....more in terms of annoyed with the treatment of the senior coach...the one whose supposed rapport with the players has been much maligned of late.

It's fine to categorize it as a corporate shakeup but since when does such a movement plead for public beration
as well as the choice of rumor and innuendo being permitted to gain momentum as a means to an end ?

Does March always undermine his employees and customers like this ?
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: blaisee on September 08, 2008, 08:28:06 PM
We're hardly scared....more in terms of annoyed with the treatment of the senior coach...the one whose supposed rapport with the players has been much maligned of late.

It's fine to categorize it as a corporate shakeup but since when does such a movement plead for public beration
as well as the choice of rumor and innuendo being permitted to gain momentum as a means to an end ?

Does March always undermine his employees and customers like this ?

they say that the more intelligent the audience, the easier it is to convince them with a logical argument. Unfortunately, the reverse is also true
 ;)

enough said
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Francois Jackson on September 08, 2008, 09:48:59 PM
We're hardly scared....more in terms of annoyed with the treatment of the senior coach...the one whose supposed rapport with the players has been much maligned of late.

It's fine to categorize it as a corporate shakeup but since when does such a movement plead for public beration
as well as the choice of rumor and innuendo being permitted to gain momentum as a means to an end ?

Does March always undermine his employees and customers like this ?

what has he done thats so wrong?

I like the way he has gone about his work March. Nothing wrong with keeping Wallace on his toes at all compadre.

if TW wants to get recognition, the only way is through a finals series in 2009, simple as that.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: WilliamPowell on September 09, 2008, 07:21:18 AM

Sure this is shaking things up a bit, which is exactly what’s needed, and hasn’t happened in the past, because some were scared that if anyone so much as breathed it could disrupt everything.  But there’s a difference between a distraction caused by a disgruntled few wanting change for their own gratification and a review by those in charge.  And hopefully that’s what this is.......

So, basically, if this is handled properly and professionally, I don’t see how this whole thing could signify anything but positive and progressive change.


In principle I agree with what you are saying TS, however what I've underlined is what concerns me...

It has been well documented that there have benn people in the background that have been rumbling for the last 18 months. They would appear to be the "disgruntled". They got digruntled and then suddenly we seem to running around reviewing.

Until this point most things were being kept in house, then suddenly we have the events of the last few months that have been anything but professional.  :banghead

As I said on another post at the moment it looks like amatuer hour at the local under 12's

I have no problems with the idea it is the execution that's been the issue ....






I am all for reviews because yes that it is what the baord is there for but
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: blaisee on September 09, 2008, 09:36:27 AM

Sure this is shaking things up a bit, which is exactly what’s needed, and hasn’t happened in the past, because some were scared that if anyone so much as breathed it could disrupt everything.  But there’s a difference between a distraction caused by a disgruntled few wanting change for their own gratification and a review by those in charge.  And hopefully that’s what this is.......

So, basically, if this is handled properly and professionally, I don’t see how this whole thing could signify anything but positive and progressive change.


In principle I agree with what you are saying TS, however what I've underlined is what concerns me...

It has been well documented that there have benn people in the background that have been rumbling for the last 18 months. They would appear to be the "disgruntled". They got digruntled and then suddenly we seem to running around reviewing.

Until this point most things were being kept in house, then suddenly we have the events of the last few months that have been anything but professional.  :banghead

As I said on another post at the moment it looks like amatuer hour at the local under 12's

I have no problems with the idea it is the execution that's been the issue ....






I am all for reviews because yes that it is what the baord is there for but

i dont understand willie p

execution? there has been no execution of anything yet, other than miller getting sacked. And to be honest that was a huge storm in a tea cup. Miller should have gone 2 years ago, great bloke, finished as a football administrator, much like sheedy, minus the great bloke bit  ;)

March managed miller off the board, and then sacked him, it took a while, but he got the job done.

March has also put wallet back in his box, and  got him to concentrate on what he is being paid to do...coach

Now march will shortly appoint an outstanding candidate to manange the five new departments of the football division, terrys boss.

These are all very important changes, people have been sacked, others have been moved sidewards, others have lost their powerbase and finally Craig Cameron and the new head hincho have been given new responsibilities. There is no way this could have been done without some egos being bruised, and without a bit of fallout. Ultimately the question has to be asked, is the RFC better off with the changes being made? The answer is YES.

Gary March has been superb under the circumstances. Very difficult job to do, full of minefields, and politically savvy football people trying to undermine him ( Wallace ) at every opportunity. Thankfully for us, he has had the balls to stay true to what had to be done, and there is no doubt we are all gunna be much better for it
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: WilliamPowell on September 09, 2008, 11:52:33 AM

i dont understand willie p

execution? there has been no execution of anything yet, other than miller getting sacked. And to be honest that was a huge storm in a tea cup. Miller should have gone 2 years ago, great bloke, finished as a football administrator, much like sheedy, minus the great bloke bit  ;)


blaisee there was the "execution' of the sacking of Miller... you know the leaking of that. That was handled abysmally IMHO... that's what concerns me. This whole thing whould not be played out in the media

Again my view the 5/10 comment was poorly done as it encouraged the media pack to circle whent there was no need

Quote
Gary March has been superb under the circumstances. Very difficult job to do, full of minefields, and politically savvy football people trying to undermine him ( Wallace ) at every opportunity. Thankfully for us, he has had the balls to stay true to what had to be done, and there is no doubt we are all gunna be much better for it

You say Wallace is trying to undermine March, which I don't agree with - so we can agree to disagree on it  :thumbsup

However my view is that there has been some undermining throughout very parts of the club (including the coach) as well and for me some of that hasn't been handled well and that's the main reason I have very little confidence in what is going on now .....

There is one thing that could be done to ease my mind but sadly I doubt it will happen (an I aint talking contract extensions)  :thumbsup
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Moi on September 09, 2008, 12:55:35 PM
The whole thing should have been brought up in Wallace's next contract.
All the roles that were being taken away from him should be in the next contract.
YOu can't tell someone these are you roles, you do them and then call them control freaks for doing the roles you asked them.
There should be no demarcation disputes if it's all set in stone when people are contracted.
If Wallace doesn't like what's proposed in his "next" contract that's when he can walk
But to tell someone midway through a contract I don't think is the way to go
Next year should be about learning to work with these new people, and if he wants to stay and abide by the club's new contract, and who he is accountable to, so be it.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: blaisee on September 09, 2008, 01:18:26 PM
The whole thing should have been brought up in Wallace's next contract.
All the roles that were being taken away from him should be in the next contract.
YOu can't tell someone these are you roles, you do them and then call them control freaks for doing the roles you asked them.
There should be no demarcation disputes if it's all set in stone when people are contracted.
If Wallace doesn't like what's proposed in his "next" contract that's when he can walk
But to tell someone midway through a contract I don't think is the way to go
Next year should be about learning to work with these new people, and if he wants to stay and abide by the club's new contract, and who he is accountable to, so be it.

sorry not that simple

alot of damage can be done

EG

we trade riewalt and cotchin   and our first pick for kerr, and lock him ( kerr )into a 5 yr deal worth 3 million

we are then stuffed for another decade
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: tigersalive on September 09, 2008, 01:20:23 PM
The whole thing should have been brought up in Wallace's next contract.
All the roles that were being taken away from him should be in the next contract.
YOu can't tell someone these are you roles, you do them and then call them control freaks for doing the roles you asked them.
There should be no demarcation disputes if it's all set in stone when people are contracted.
If Wallace doesn't like what's proposed in his "next" contract that's when he can walk
But to tell someone midway through a contract I don't think is the way to go
Next year should be about learning to work with these new people, and if he wants to stay and abide by the club's new contract, and who he is accountable to, so be it.

sorry not that simple

alot of damage can be done

EG

we trade riewalt and cotchin   and our first pick for kerr, and lock him ( kerr )into a 5 yr deal worth 3 million

we are then stuffed for another decade

Amen to that.

The youth policy should hold strong.  :thumbsup
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Moi on September 09, 2008, 01:33:53 PM
we trade riewalt and cotchin   and our first pick for kerr, and lock him ( kerr )into a 5 yr deal worth 3 million
we are then stuffed for another decade
That's scaremongering and do you honestly believe that scenario?
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: blaisee on September 09, 2008, 01:47:45 PM
we trade riewalt and cotchin   and our first pick for kerr, and lock him ( kerr )into a 5 yr deal worth 3 million
we are then stuffed for another decade
That's scaremongering and do you honestly believe that scenario?

dunno mate, do you?

this is why all good organisations are system based as opposed personnel based.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: the_boy_jake on September 09, 2008, 01:58:04 PM

we trade riewalt and cotchin   and our first pick for kerr, and lock him ( kerr )into a 5 yr deal worth 3 million

we are then stuffed for another decade

I agree with that in principle, list control should have been moved out of Wallace's hands as soon as it was clear we weren't gonna have a competitive lilst by the end of his contract.

But I still think March's PR skills leave a lot to be desired.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Tiger Spirit on September 09, 2008, 06:16:06 PM
In principle I agree with what you are saying TS, however what I've underlined is what concerns me...

It has been well documented that there have benn people in the background that have been rumbling for the last 18 months. They would appear to be the "disgruntled". They got digruntled and then suddenly we seem to running around reviewing.

Until this point most things were being kept in house, then suddenly we have the events of the last few months that have been anything but professional.  :banghead

As I said on another post at the moment it looks like amatuer hour at the local under 12's

I have no problems with the idea it is the execution that's been the issue ....

I am all for reviews because yes that it is what the baord is there for but

Maybe how things have happened isn’t ideal, but ultimately, this has to be a good thing.  We have to remember that we’re coming from so far behind other clubs and have to start somewhere, even if it looks somewhat amateurish at this stage.  If this is an attempt to change things for the better then how it has happened is acceptable on this occasion, but not if it becomes a constant.

That aside, I don’t understand why people seem to have so much faith in TW’s direction, and knock March for his efforts.  For all intents and purposes, neither of them has achieved anything yet.  But if the club’s management and board appear incompetent through this then what does it matter who the coach is if management has no idea and various departments within the club are working to their own agendas?

Obviously, they all want the same thing but, realistically, how can the current set up possibly work, to anyone’s way of thinking?  How could any coach be expected to deliver anything like success under such disjointed circumstances?

Surely someone has to provide a clear direction and have ultimate control over the whole thing.  Scattering the responsibility just brings a lack of cohesion and direction.  We all want unity, which is what is needed most.  But treading carefully, to avoid confrontation, just keeps us where we are.  So if a bun fight is the only thing that will bring that unity then bring it on.

That way, people can either sort out their differences or part company.  Whatever the outcome, it should create greater understanding, and people can then move on to the next step, in the same direction. :thumbsup
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Tiger Spirit on September 09, 2008, 06:43:25 PM
The whole thing should have been brought up in Wallace's next contract.
All the roles that were being taken away from him should be in the next contract.
YOu can't tell someone these are you roles, you do them and then call them control freaks for doing the roles you asked them.
There should be no demarcation disputes if it's all set in stone when people are contracted.
If Wallace doesn't like what's proposed in his "next" contract that's when he can walk
But to tell someone midway through a contract I don't think is the way to go
Next year should be about learning to work with these new people, and if he wants to stay and abide by the club's new contract, and who he is accountable to, so be it.

How do you know these things were written in his contract?  I doubt such a thing would've been written in his contract.  If the club held hopes of improving their finances in the future, why would they tie up various roles within TW’s contract, thereby stopping them from employing others in these roles, for 5 years?

And if these roles were written in the contract how could they change things midstream anyway, without mutual agreement?  TW would be in his rights to make a fuss and RFC wouldn't have a leg to stand on.

If there's nothing in his contract, and the way things have been run in the past are not in the Club's best interests, going forward, then management is well within their rights to make whatever changes they deem necessary.  That’s their role and their job.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Moi on September 09, 2008, 08:18:18 PM
The whole thing should have been brought up in Wallace's next contract.
All the roles that were being taken away from him should be in the next contract.
YOu can't tell someone these are you roles, you do them and then call them control freaks for doing the roles you asked them.
There should be no demarcation disputes if it's all set in stone when people are contracted.
If Wallace doesn't like what's proposed in his "next" contract that's when he can walk
But to tell someone midway through a contract I don't think is the way to go
Next year should be about learning to work with these new people, and if he wants to stay and abide by the club's new contract, and who he is accountable to, so be it.

How do you know these things were written in his contract?  I doubt such a thing would've been written in his contract.  If the club held hopes of improving their finances in the future, why would they tie up various roles within TW’s contract, thereby stopping them from employing others in these roles, for 5 years?

And if these roles were written in the contract how could they change things midstream anyway, without mutual agreement?  TW would be in his rights to make a fuss and RFC wouldn't have a leg to stand on.

If there's nothing in his contract, and the way things have been run in the past are not in the Club's best interests, going forward, then management is well within their rights to make whatever changes they deem necessary.  That’s their role and their job.

They expected him to be all things to everyone when we had no money for staff, it's a bit rough to say he's too big for his boots now which is what most of you lot are saying. 
Past caring anyway.  Wouldn't matter if you had Leigh Matthews in there or the greatest coach of all time, you and most other supporters would find fault in everything they did.
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: WilliamPowell on September 09, 2008, 08:21:31 PM
Surely someone has to provide a clear direction and have ultimate control over the whole thing.  Scattering the responsibility just brings a lack of cohesion and direction.  We all want unity, which is what is needed most.  But treading carefully, to avoid confrontation, just keeps us where we are.  So if a bun fight is the only thing that will bring that unity then bring it on.

Agree but I have a problem with it being played out in the media.... the bun fight should be behoind closed doors.

And the last 3 months have been played out in the media.... and that is what annoys and disappoints me. It's the leaks :banghead

Get rid of the leaks and for me that would be a start

Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Infamy on September 09, 2008, 10:02:11 PM
Wouldn't matter if you had Leigh Matthews in there or the greatest coach of all time, you and most other supporters would find fault in everything they did.
Isn't that the truth
Title: Re: Players back Wallace (Herald-Sun)
Post by: Ox on September 10, 2008, 09:32:00 AM


sorry not that simple

alot of damage can be done

EG

we trade riewalt and cotchin   and our first pick for kerr, and lock him ( kerr )into a 5 yr deal worth 3 million

we are then stuffed for another decade

As If...