One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: one-eyed on May 19, 2012, 10:59:35 PM
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Grimes out injured obviously.
Any other changes?
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Out: Miller and Grimes
Ins: Vicks and Griff/Post
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Miller out for Vickery.
King out for Marric.
Jackson out for anyone with a heart or a clue.
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Daniel jackson
Miller
King
Grimes
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Play Edwards and Marric as both small fwds. Nahas and King can be dropped. Bring in Arnott to play in the mid.
No idea who to bring in for Grimes. Probably Grimmace or the Hamburglar
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Drop Jack, playing soulless football atm
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Out: King, Grimes
In: Post, White
Post forward, Miller back and White sub.
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Out : Forward line
In : Anybody that can take a contested mark inside 50
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Drop Jack, playing soulless football atm
Agree
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Drop Jack, playing soulless football atm
Agree
if miller had even an ounce of jacks talent I would think it good that he's at richmond but hes a liability. Miller can't read the play, he gets in the way most times. Can't mark or kick. Isn't good enough to draw a defender away from our best forward.
Do you expect Jack to beat 2 or 3 opponents?
We all know that Jack is struggling but he has what Miller will never have..... Talent and many more years of footy.
Get Miller out, put a youngster in ie Griffiths. And watch Jack blossum.
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Out Grimes, Rewoldt, Miller
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Just watching the replay now.2 goals we got in last quarter were due to Milller blocking the opposition to allow Cotch to mark
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Just watching the replay now.2 goals we got in last quarter were due to Milller blocking the opposition to allow Cotch to mark
Yes agreed. :thumbsup
Though he didn't make the distance from 48 in the third and missed a critical one when running into goal with little pressure when we were ten goals in the last.
We need him for now that's the best I can say considering Jack has lost every bit of passion in his body and has become a lazy grub.
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Just watching the replay now.2 goals we got in last quarter were due to Milller blocking the opposition to allow Cotch to mark
why not teach a youngster to play the role Miller is supposed to play. If he comes good then he's a player for the next ten years. How many years has Miller got left?
Facts are he's not good enough and hes too old. Put him in coburg and he can teach all the youngsters there.
We are wasting time here when we could be playing a youngster now. We aren't ready for finals yet anyway.
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:gotigersftp://
Just watching the replay now.2 goals we got in last quarter were due to Milller blocking the opposition to allow Cotch to mark
What about the othee 99% of millers game?
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A good case in point is the development of Carlisle at Essendon under the pressure of performing at the top level. Give Griff a chance to develop in the seniors FCS! I also believe that the collision injuries he has suffered this year from hacks in the VFL will be less likely.
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Will wait for the Coburg boys to play today.
Hopefully Post has a blinder.
Is Vickery playing?
:thumbsup
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Depending on coburg performance now.... And they know it
Out: grimes, miller, king, nahas
In: post, vickery, arnott, maric
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A good case in point is the development of Carlisle at Essendon under the pressure of performing at the top level. Give Griff a chance to develop in the seniors FCS! I also believe that the collision injuries he has suffered this year from hacks in the VFL will be less likely.
top post. :thumbsup
Miller is a try hard, vfl superstar and pointless for our future.
All the good clubs play the the big boddied youngsters early and keep them in the team to learn.
Collingwwood with Cloke
Geelong with Hawkins
west coast with Darling
Hawks with Buddy/roughead
etc ect ect ect.
......Richmond with Miller. :banghead :banghead
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:gotigersftp://Just watching the replay now.2 goals we got in last quarter were due to Milller blocking the opposition to allow Cotch to mark
What about the othee 99% of millers game?
You obviously don't watch Jack Riewoldt
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Are you really that dumb? Jack is twice the player miller is. Jack form might be bad but hes proven and has a decade left. He is playing on the no1 def all the time.
Miller turns like queen mary. He can kick far enough which is pee poor from afl kpp. He is not part of our long term future. He was delistes by melbourne. In the era of forward line pressure miller lack of agilty kills up. His marking is poor cause he likes in on chest rsther than in front.
As for the 2nd /3rd ruckman. Another very important aspect due to new rules he no upgrade on tuck.
I got nothing against miller or jackson but is this our best 22? Or are we playing our best team for the good of our best 22 12 months from now?
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Are you really that dumb? Jack is twice the player miller is. Jack form might be bad but hes proven and has a decade left. He is playing on the no1 def all the time.
Miller turns like queen mary. He can kick far enough which is pee poor from afl kpp. He is not part of our long term future. He was delistes by melbourne. In the era of forward line pressure miller lack of agilty kills up. His marking is poor cause he likes in on chest rsther than in front.
As for the 2nd /3rd ruckman. Another very important aspect due to new rules he no upgrade on tuck.
I got nothing against miller or jackson but is this our best 22? Or are we playing our best team for the good of our best 22 12 months from now?
another top post. :thumbsup
we are wasting time with him and it's detrimental to our teams future success to have old rejects crowding the forward line with absolutely no idea.
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We aren't ready for finals yet anyway.
Talk about a bi-polar poster. Why get all bitter and twisted over a loss when you yourself admit we're not good enough yet.
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Honestly i am not really fussed who comes into the team,as long as they bring that never say die attitude
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We aren't ready for finals yet anyway.
Talk about a bi-polar poster. Why get all bitter and twisted over a loss when you yourself admit we're not good enough yet.
I dont think Tigra's posts regarding Miller are contradictory at all. Miller should be out of the side so that a new, finals competitive key can be developed. To my mind we need: Jack, Vicks (relief Ruckman), another key (Griff/Post/Astbury), a hard to match up on 188-190cm type (Lids/Marto) and 2 crumbers.
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Out King Miller Grimes
In Arnot Vickery Post
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Are you really that dumb? Jack is twice the player miller is. Jack form might be bad but hes proven and has a decade left. He is playing on the no1 def all the time.
Miller turns like queen mary. He can kick far enough which is pee poor from afl kpp. He is not part of our long term future. He was delistes by melbourne. In the era of forward line pressure miller lack of agilty kills up. His marking is poor cause he likes in on chest rsther than in front.
As for the 2nd /3rd ruckman. Another very important aspect due to new rules he no upgrade on tuck.
I got nothing against miller or jackson but is this our best 22? Or are we playing our best team for the good of our best 22 12 months from now?
Your pretty dumb, yep get rid of Miller and thats solves the problem. NOT
How many inisde 50 marks did Jack take last night ? 1 .
Reckon Edwards had more inside 50 Marks than Jack,
If Jack was kikcing 4 goals a week , you wouldnt be mentioning Miller.
Jack Riewoldt has been very ordinary this year, what has happening to ''Jumping Jack "" instead we have "wrestling Jack".
Big problem is Jack
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Are you really that dumb? Jack is twice the player miller is. Jack form might be bad but hes proven and has a decade left. He is playing on the no1 def all the time.
Miller turns like queen mary. He can kick far enough which is pee poor from afl kpp. He is not part of our long term future. He was delistes by melbourne. In the era of forward line pressure miller lack of agilty kills up. His marking is poor cause he likes in on chest rsther than in front.
As for the 2nd /3rd ruckman. Another very important aspect due to new rules he no upgrade on tuck.
I got nothing against miller or jackson but is this our best 22? Or are we playing our best team for the good of our best 22 12 months from now?
Your pretty dumb, yep get rid of Miller and thats solves the problem. NOT
How many inisde 50 marks did Jack take last night ? 1 .
Reckon Edwards had more inside 50 Marks than Jack,
If Jack was kikcing 4 goals a week , you wouldnt be mentioning Miller.
Jack Riewoldt has been very ordinary this year, what has happening to ''Jumping Jack "" instead we have "wrestling Jack".
Big problem is Jack
More like 'Reversing Jack' :-[
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Out King Miller Grimes
In Arnot Vickery Post
If only Gerks :pray
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I have seen many coburg games this season and the one thing I have noticed about Arnott is that he seems to blow up after not much effort ,appears to not have much of an engine at this stage...yes he's hard,tuff and has skill.
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I have seen many coburg games this season and the one thing I have noticed about Arnott is that he seems to blow up after not much effort ,appears to not have much of an engine at this stage...yes he's hard,tuff and has skill.
Should be sub then?
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We'll beat this mob, Gerks Guarantee :thumbsup
(no refunds)
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:gotigersftp://Just watching the replay now.2 goals we got in last quarter were due to Milller blocking the opposition to allow Cotch to mark
What about the othee 99% of millers game?
:lol...thats it, no-one questions his effort but forwards are paid to finish off all the good work up field..to that end they have failed misertably and Miller is part of the guilty party
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forwards are paid to kick goals.
Jack Riewoldt ??
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Jack I agree Riewoldt has been skata this year, but Miller you can say a million things about him but the simple thing is this.....
If Jack pulls his finger out of golo he can win games of footy for us.
Miller at his best has the same impact as a below par Jack.
Miller was woeful last night and that goal he missed in the last quarter for me sealed the deal.
Yes others missed shots too but that goal goes in and the margin gets back to 3 points after they kicked 2 goals to regain the lead. Anything could have happened.
Did I say he can't kick from 40.
You are not going to drop a Coleman Medallist in favour of a bloke getting 5 touches a game with no impact.
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Miller had 13 disposals
Riewoldt 8
King 9
Dont know who got 5 disposals ::)
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The stats are irrelevent Jack.
Ok so it was 13 who cares. He's still a dud. :thumbsup
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Miller had 13 disposals
Riewoldt 8
King 9
Dont know who got 5 disposals ::)
Games are won on the back of the work done in the first half. For much of football. For our CHF (most important postion imo) miller to have only 2 touches of the ball. And be general slow and non agile kills our us.
His lack of possies is not unlike his season or overall average.
At least vickery has potential ffs
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Jack needs to lead harder, but teams scrag and crowd him to death because they know he is our only dangerous forward.
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Maybe composed delivery into the forward line is what is needed to hit whichever target is presented at them.
I think we may say the most composed deliverer of the footy into the forward line at Coburg get a run next week.
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So why dont we play Jack one out in the square isolated with his player?.
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mine are
out
grimes, jackson, king,nahas.
in
post for grimes,
darrou yes darrou we need a third tall defensive option and hes been going alright at coburg. has genuine size at 190/97 we cant keep on risking our structure we need to play with the structure that is likely to take us forward.
derickx the second ruck/third tall forward option that we have to have. we must give maric a hand and im not inclined to just bring vickery straight back in coming off such woeful form and injury.in for jackson who is not the way forward and continues to be very ordinary.
arnot for king who lets face it continues to be very ordinary time to give this kid a game.
grimes apart who is injured, the other three have been mainly in our bottom 6 all season and imo are a reason why we cant get over the line.
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Our entire forward line with the exception of Edwards were poor. If you are going drop Miller then you drop Jack. Miller was poor, Jack was pathetic. Why he persists with trying to take mark of the year at every contest beggars belief. He should be leading more. Surely it isn't that hard. Play to your strengths for crying out loud
Anyhow
Ins: Vickery, Griffiths at chb, White
Outs: Grimes, King, Jackson
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Our entire forward line with the exception of Edwards were poor. If you are going drop Miller then you drop Jack. Miller was poor, Jack was pathetic. Why he persists with trying to take mark of the year at every contest beggars belief. He should be leading more. Surely it isn't that hard. Play to your strengths for crying out loud
Anyhow
Ins: Vickery, Griffiths at chb, White
Outs: Grimes, King, Jackson
Would have Nahas out before Jackson.
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If you are going drop Miller then you drop Jack. Miller was poor, Jack was pathetic.
Outs: Grimes, King, Jackson
Please outline your thought process behind this comment.
Its a good idea to drop both key tall forwards this week?
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maybe people here see something i have missed in darou.I mean he's certainly a big boy and would present a mountain to overcome,however he just seems so slow both in speed and reaction.From what i saw today he seems a long way off,but i dont know what dimmas is thinking on this and he probably rates these guys in a professional manner.
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Jack needs to lead harder, but teams scrag and crowd him to death because they know he is our only dangerous forward.
this is correct.
If griffiths replaces miller he will demand a bigger backman to be accountable on him especially outside 50. All clubs aren't concerned with miller getting the ball anywhere outside 40 m from goal thus dropping his direct opponent onto the forward with all the talent.
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Me i wouldnt drop either jack or miller.In fact if available i would add ty to the forward mix..the biggest headache is CHB.I hope dimma and the boys are busily working on this because the alternatives to Dylan arent exactly making me salivate at the mouth
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maybe people here see something i have missed in darou.I mean he's certainly a big boy and would present a mountain to overcome,however he just seems so slow both in speed and reaction.From what i saw today he seems a long way off,but i dont know what dimmas is thinking on this and he probably rates these guys in a professional manner.
just going by what has been said about him at coburg. he has been getting good reports from the coaches.
i still maintain we have a good chb but dont play him there that is rance who imo is a questionable fb. are opinions they are like arseholes we all have em.
had a look at most sites and few actually talk about how much our tall defenders struggled in the first half. and it seems in the second half the times essendon went forward which wasnt a lot they managed to score.
win lose or draw. this yr or in 3 yrs time going with just 2 tall defenders is not good structure.
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AS to griff at this point he seems to be struggling to demand the ball let alone a bigger defender
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If you are going drop Miller then you drop Jack. Miller was poor, Jack was pathetic.
Outs: Grimes, King, Jackson
Please outline your thought process behind this comment.
Its a good idea to drop both key tall forwards this week?
What are you talking about?
What don't you understand?
People are saying Miller should be dropped. What I said was if you are going to drop Miller you may as well drop Jack as well as he was as poor if not worse than MIller last night - can I make it any clearer?
I don't think they will drop either
So my outs are fairly straight forward
Grimes is INJURED so he wont play
Kings was terrible - seemed more interested in bumping blokes rtather than trying to get the pill
Jackson - just makes dumb decisions and has poor skills despite what the coaches think I don't think it was something we could afford yesterday certainly it isn't something you can afford to have against the Hawks
Clear enough ::)
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had a look at most sites and few actually talk about how much our tall defenders struggled in the first half. and it seems in the second half the times essendon went forward which wasnt a lot they managed to score.
are you saying you didn't watch the game? :huh
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Wp your logic is flawed. I am happy you are not coach or ceo of richmond.
It is not a question of did player x have an equal poor game to player y.
The question is which 22 give us the best chance of winning a) next weeks
Game. b) a flag this year or some future date.
We are living in a vacuum? No its the real world and there is only so many player on the richmond list.
Does it not make sense to invest time and games into jack given his record and age?
If martin and tuck.both only get 5 touches each over the next 6 games do you drop both? Or do you drop tuck and keep martin due to.talent? Even in the case of poor form.
If you are going drop Miller then you drop Jack. Miller was poor, Jack was pathetic.
U
Outs: Grimes, King, Jackson
Please outline your thought process behind this comment.
Its a good idea to drop both key tall forwards this week?
What are you talking about?
What don't you understand?
People are saying Miller should be dropped. What I said was if you are going to drop Miller you may as well drop Jack as well as he was as poor if not worse than MIller last night - can I make it any clearer?
I don't think they will drop either
So my outs are fairly straight forward
Grimes is INJURED so he wont play
Kings was terrible - seemed more interested in bumping blokes rtather than trying to get the pill
Jackson - just makes dumb decisions and has poor skills despite what the coaches think I don't think it was something we could afford yesterday certainly it isn't something you can afford to have against the Hawks
Clear enough ::)
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Wp your logic is flawed. I am happy you are not coach or ceo of richmond.
I'm thinking that WP is happy not to be coach or CEO as well.
:lol
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had a look at most sites and few actually talk about how much our tall defenders struggled in the first half. and it seems in the second half the times essendon went forward which wasnt a lot they managed to score.
are you saying you didn't watch the game? :huh
Oh dear, not again :nope
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had a look at most sites and few actually talk about how much our tall defenders struggled in the first half. and it seems in the second half the times essendon went forward which wasnt a lot they managed to score.
are you saying you didn't watch the game? :huh
lol nope i watched it but have to admit was not objectuive at the time. have since watched it again with just a tad less emotion.
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If you are going drop Miller then you drop Jack. Miller was poor, Jack was pathetic.
Outs: Grimes, King, Jackson
Please outline your thought process behind this comment.
Its a good idea to drop both key tall forwards this week?
What are you talking about?
What don't you understand?
People are saying Miller should be dropped. What I said was if you are going to drop Miller you may as well drop Jack as well as he was as poor if not worse than MIller last night - can I make it any clearer?
I don't think they will drop either
So my outs are fairly straight forward
Grimes is INJURED so he wont play
Kings was terrible - seemed more interested in bumping blokes rtather than trying to get the pill
Jackson - just makes dumb decisions and has poor skills despite what the coaches think I don't think it was something we could afford yesterday certainly it isn't something you can afford to have against the Hawks
Clear enough ::)
you dared be critical that is enough for some. have to say i agree100%. WOULD GO ONE FURTHER AND CHOP NAHAS AS WELL WHAT A FREAKIN SPUD.
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Wp your logic is flawed. I am happy you are not coach or ceo of richmond.
It is not a question of did player x have an equal poor game to player y.
The question is which 22 give us the best chance of winning a) next weeks
Game. b) a flag this year or some future date.
We are living in a vacuum? No its the real world and there is only so many player on the richmond list.
Does it not make sense to invest time and games into jack given his record and age?
If martin and tuck.both only get 5 touches each over the next 6 games do you drop both? Or do you drop tuck and keep martin due to.talent? Even in the case of poor
Again what are you talking about?
Not sure what being a CEO has to do with being a coach. They are 2 totally different roles. Do you think Benny Gale has anything to do with team selection ? ::)
I said I don't think they will drop either Jack or Miller and btw nor should they
My point which you seem unwilling to understand is this if you going to drop Miller based solely on his game last night then You look at dropping Jack simply because his game last night was woeful. People seem to be blaming our forward woes last night solely on Miller. Our ENTIRE forward line outside of Edwards was pathetic. That's my point. Why single out one bloke. Whether you want to admit it or not but based on output so far in 2012 Miller has performed better than Jack.
I would think that if we had in form REiwoldt running around at the minute we would have won more than 3 games
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Maric, Connors and Gus or Vicks in for,
Nahas, Miller and Grimes....
Yes Connors, may as well give him a crack.
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Are you really that dumb? Jack is twice the player miller is. Jack form might be bad but hes proven and has a decade left. He is playing on the no1 def all the time.
And right about now he needs his anus reefed. Dropped to the magoos would be a good start to let Jack know how much this is a team game and how important it is to play with a team spirit. Very very very disappointed with Jack atm.
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had a look at most sites and few actually talk about how much our tall defenders struggled in the first half. and it seems in the second half the times essendon went forward which wasnt a lot they managed to score.
are you saying you didn't watch the game? :huh
lol nope i watched it but have to admit was not objectuive at the time. have since watched it again with just a tad less emotion.
:cheers
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Luke McGuane, who has yet to play a senior game this season, remains sidelined with a medial ligament problem but key Tigers forward Ty Vickery appears certain to be available after missing the past two rounds with a calf problem.
Link from today's Australian (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/sport/afl/dustin-fletcher-is-the-only-certain-withdrawal-from-game-against-gws/story-fnca0u4y-1226361648932)
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Vickery a definite. Connors for King? Post or Griffiths for Grimes. Would love it if they gave O'Hanlon a game
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Out Grimes (inj), King (omt), Miller (omt)
In Vickery, Maric, Griffiths
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Footy Barometer - Round 9
Herald Sun
May 21, 2012
RICHMOND
INJURIES
Ty Vickery (calf) test
Luke McGuane (knee) 1 week
Dylan Grimes (hamstring) TBC
Kelvin Moore (hip) indefinite
Brad Helbig (foot) indefinite
ON THE BLOCK: Unfortunately Dylan Grimes, who was in the best form of his short career, could be out for some time after his hamstring went twang on Saturday night. Grimes, who was equal favourite for the Rising Star, injured his hammy as he did in last year’s Dreamtime fixture and missed the rest of the season. Him aside the Tiges are in good form, barring Jack Riewoldt. Can the spearhead regain his Coleman medal form? Season 2012 is fast slipping away from Jumping Jack.
ON THE CUSP: Jayden Post looms as the likely replacement for Grimes. Post had been trailed in attack for Coburg – and kicked five goals in a quarter last week – but with Buddy and Rouughead to contend with this week he and Rance look likely to get the jobs. Angus Graham continues to impress but can’t crack the 22 while Dan Connors kicked another four goals in the VFL yesterday.
SAM LANDSBERGER’S FORECAST: How stiff have the Tigers been with their draw? Already faced the Eagles, Cats, Blues, Pies and Bombers and now have to contend with Hawthorn and St Kilda. A 3-5 win-loss ratio is disappointing given their form. They need to start taking scalps to climb into the eight.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/afl/supercoach-news/footy-barometer-round-9/story-fncufbo5-1226362471117
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unlike most i dont think the draw has been a bad thing. in fact its almost a good thing.
if i had my way we would play top 8 sides every week of the yr. my attitude is if we cant beat these sides we dont deserve to make the 8. thse sides are the sides we truly test ourselves against.
yes we have improved again this yr and we have found some pretty decent players but wins against poor sides only papers over the cracks and i tell ya we still have plenty of cracks.
rather than wins and dont get me wrong i want us to win i think this yr its far more impoortant we find another ruckman i live in hope but cant see it happening with the ruckmen we have outside of maric. a real genuine kpf prospect want one of griffiths astbury to show they belong. and id like to get some games into elton.
at least one med/sml forward well o hanlon is the hope i want to see what he can do. we are chasing a real big kpd yeah i know we have gone okay without one but that doesnt mean one is not needed. we dont have one on the list. lastly the midfield depth imo we need to find 4 mids two of real quality to go with, conca, grigg,ellis, cotchin,martin, helbig, foley, tuck, armot,deledio,any mid not mentioned i dont rate as a player or as a mid.
this coming draft i would have had no hesitation in cutting/trading any combination of 7 to 9 players containing.
jackson edwards incredibly both have been re-signed to more than 1 yr performance based contracts.
macdonald is already gone
king,
white,
webberley
two of derickx/browne/graham.
mcguane
nahas
moore depending on injury.
post is another probably in the gun.
connors.
theres 14 names there and i can honestly say if we cut them we would not miss them we get little enough out of all of them as it is atm and none bar browne/post/macdonald are kids anymore.. it does not include rookies like miller heslin whos gone, a maric who looks incapable of adding the strings to his game to make it. depth people it is a dirty word.
as i have stated before we are at the crux in the road. do we take the turn back into oblivion and hang onto an inordinate amount of battlers or do we cut hard and continue to do what has everyone excited. 5 nd picks one psd pick on a mature need, a couple of mature recruits from minor leagues and a a trade if possible.
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Good assesment craw, we could potentially benefit from FA.... Only time will tell if they make the right moves
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Sorry Claw, but I disagree. Looking at our draw, it's almost as if the AFL went out of their way to sabotage us. Of course the more likely explanation is that they just didn't put very much thought into it. As usual, their attention was taken up with catering to the desires of their pet projects.
Sure, we have to play the Blues, Pies, Cats, Eagles,Swans, Bombers, Hawks and Saints at some point. But for God's sake, why in a neverending cluster? Couldn't the AFL have spaced them out a bit, and punctuated them with a few games against the new franchises (in Melbourne), or maybe the Lions or Dockers? And why do we always get sent down to the Cattery? The other big Melbourne clubs haven't been there for years, not even Carlton when they were in the doldrums . I don't know, I just look on enviously at other teams getting soft games (hello North) and think, "why not us"?
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all fair enough we all come from different pespectives. look at our opponent this week they have played coll, geel,adelaide, wce,syd, stk, melb and freo. 5 of last yrs finalists plus a rampaging adelaide.
if anything their draw has turned out to be harder than us with adelaide doing so well. i dont hear hawthorn supporters complaining about draws. has a soft draw helped north to date.
when we start defeating the so called top sides on a regular basis you will know we have truly arrived. we just lack a bit in structure and quality atm and a lot in depth. we most certainly have 12 14 players to build from which is about 10 more than 4 yrs ago.
hawthorn have had their fair share of good senior players miss games and it has hurt them but they have still managed to win 5 games and three against pretty decent teams. we lose just one tall defender and we are stretched down back what happens if we lose say cotchin as well or maric.
its great to see the competetiveness the kids having a real crack and its good to see a fair number of well rounded players coming thru but we have a lot to do still if we want to build something that is sustainable not just for yrs to come but through out a season.
give me the tough games every time when we are good enough we wont be complaining about draws in the mean time lets keep on testing ourselves against the best that way the cracks wont get papered over like they have in the past.
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unlike most i dont think the draw has been a bad thing. in fact its almost a good thing.
if i had my way we would play top 8 sides every week of the yr. my attitude is if we cant beat these sides we dont deserve to make the 8. thse sides are the sides we truly test ourselves against.
yes we have improved again this yr and we have found some pretty decent players but wins against poor sides only papers over the cracks and i tell ya we still have plenty of cracks.
rather than wins and dont get me wrong i want us to win i think this yr its far more impoortant we find another ruckman i live in hope but cant see it happening with the ruckmen we have outside of maric. a real genuine kpf prospect want one of griffiths astbury to show they belong. and id like to get some games into elton.
at least one med/sml forward well o hanlon is the hope i want to see what he can do. we are chasing a real big kpd yeah i know we have gone okay without one but that doesnt mean one is not needed. we dont have one on the list. lastly the midfield depth imo we need to find 4 mids two of real quality to go with, conca, grigg,ellis, cotchin,martin, helbig, foley, tuck, armot,deledio,any mid not mentioned i dont rate as a player or as a mid.
this coming draft i would have had no hesitation in cutting/trading any combination of 7 to 9 players containing.
jackson edwards incredibly both have been re-signed to more than 1 yr performance based contracts.
macdonald is already gone
king,
white,
webberley
two of derickx/browne/graham.
mcguane
nahas
moore depending on injury.
post is another probably in the gun.
connors.
theres 14 names there and i can honestly say if we cut them we would not miss them we get little enough out of all of them as it is atm and none bar browne/post/macdonald are kids anymore.. it does not include rookies like miller heslin whos gone, a maric who looks incapable of adding the strings to his game to make it. depth people it is a dirty word.
as i have stated before we are at the crux in the road. do we take the turn back into oblivion and hang onto an inordinate amount of battlers or do we cut hard and continue to do what has everyone excited. 5 nd picks one psd pick on a mature need, a couple of mature recruits from minor leagues and a a trade if possible.
In reality it will probably be something like:
macdonald
white
webberley
one of derickx/browne/graham
one of mcguane/moore
connors
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Sorry Claw, but I disagree. Looking at our draw, it's almost as if the AFL went out of their way to sabotage us. Of course the more likely explanation is that they just didn't put very much thought into it. As usual, their attention was taken up with catering to the desires of their pet projects.
Sure, we have to play the Blues, Pies, Cats, Eagles,Swans, Bombers, Hawks and Saints at some point. But for God's sake, why in a neverending cluster? Couldn't the AFL have spaced them out a bit, and punctuated them with a few games against the new franchises (in Melbourne), or maybe the Lions or Dockers? And why do we always get sent down to the Cattery? The other big Melbourne clubs haven't been there for years, not even Carlton when they were in the doldrums . I don't know, I just look on enviously at other teams getting soft games (hello North) and think, "why not us"?
Ditto your thoughts, they keep screwing us in the draw and they love it. We are competing with N0rt for a finals spot, and they get 2 games against GWS and GC . . . 4 guaranteed wins, whereas we have 2. N0rt also get Footscray twice . . . :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead
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unlike most i dont think the draw has been a bad thing. in fact its almost a good thing.
if i had my way we would play top 8 sides every week of the yr. my attitude is if we cant beat these sides we dont deserve to make the 8. thse sides are the sides we truly test ourselves against.
yes we have improved again this yr and we have found some pretty decent players but wins against poor sides only papers over the cracks and i tell ya we still have plenty of cracks.
rather than wins and dont get me wrong i want us to win i think this yr its far more impoortant we find another ruckman i live in hope but cant see it happening with the ruckmen we have outside of maric. a real genuine kpf prospect want one of griffiths astbury to show they belong. and id like to get some games into elton.
at least one med/sml forward well o hanlon is the hope i want to see what he can do. we are chasing a real big kpd yeah i know we have gone okay without one but that doesnt mean one is not needed. we dont have one on the list. lastly the midfield depth imo we need to find 4 mids two of real quality to go with, conca, grigg,ellis, cotchin,martin, helbig, foley, tuck, armot,deledio,any mid not mentioned i dont rate as a player or as a mid.
this coming draft i would have had no hesitation in cutting/trading any combination of 7 to 9 players containing.
jackson edwards incredibly both have been re-signed to more than 1 yr performance based contracts.
macdonald is already gone
king,
white,
webberley
two of derickx/browne/graham.
mcguane
nahas
moore depending on injury.
post is another probably in the gun.
connors.
theres 14 names there and i can honestly say if we cut them we would not miss them we get little enough out of all of them as it is atm and none bar browne/post/macdonald are kids anymore.. it does not include rookies like miller heslin whos gone, a maric who looks incapable of adding the strings to his game to make it. depth people it is a dirty word.
as i have stated before we are at the crux in the road. do we take the turn back into oblivion and hang onto an inordinate amount of battlers or do we cut hard and continue to do what has everyone excited. 5 nd picks one psd pick on a mature need, a couple of mature recruits from minor leagues and a a trade if possible.
In reality it will probably be something like:
macdonald
white
webberley
one of derickx/browne/graham
one of mcguane/moore
connors
your probably right there. would hope 6 is an absolute minimum with say newman going to the vets list. so that would be 7 new faces to the list proper in a strong draft yr. thing is it does not have to be 7 kids a trade and a couple of mature picks from other clubs or minor leagues ie morris maric this yr. someone like tom sundberg would be an outomatic upgrade on players like white connors. would think we will use two or three rookie picks as well. this draft if we get it right we could set ourselves right up.imo the most important draft/trade period we have been in since the draft was introduced.
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Sorry Claw, but I disagree. Looking at our draw, it's almost as if the AFL went out of their way to sabotage us. Of course the more likely explanation is that they just didn't put very much thought into it. As usual, their attention was taken up with catering to the desires of their pet projects.
Sure, we have to play the Blues, Pies, Cats, Eagles,Swans, Bombers, Hawks and Saints at some point. But for God's sake, why in a neverending cluster? Couldn't the AFL have spaced them out a bit, and punctuated them with a few games against the new franchises (in Melbourne), or maybe the Lions or Dockers? And why do we always get sent down to the Cattery? The other big Melbourne clubs haven't been there for years, not even Carlton when they were in the doldrums . I don't know, I just look on enviously at other teams getting soft games (hello North) and think, "why not us"?
Ditto your thoughts, they keep screwing us in the draw and they love it. We are competing with N0rt for a finals spot, and they get 2 games against GWS and GC . . . 4 guaranteed wins, whereas we have 2. N0rt also get Footscray twice . . . :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead :banghead
17 game season or 34.anything else is a joke
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Agreed. This draft is absolutely critical. With a bit of luck, it could 'complete' our list, or at least go close.
We need more class across the board and we need to milk this strong and compromised draft for all its worth.
Another couple of handy mature recruits, as in the previous two years, will help.
Still more work to be done with our list, but we have made strong progress. I've got faith in our recruiters/list managers to get the job done.
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Found the magic fix for Jack & he will kill it against the dawx, mark it down ......
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Sorry Claw, but I disagree. Looking at our draw, it's almost as if the AFL went out of their way to sabotage us. Of course the more likely explanation is that they just didn't put very much thought into it. As usual, their attention was taken up with catering to the desires of their pet projects.
Sure, we have to play the Blues, Pies, Cats, Eagles,Swans, Bombers, Hawks and Saints at some point. But for God's sake, why in a neverending cluster? Couldn't the AFL have spaced them out a bit, and punctuated them with a few games against the new franchises (in Melbourne), or maybe the Lions or Dockers? And why do we always get sent down to the Cattery? The other big Melbourne clubs haven't been there for years, not even Carlton when they were in the doldrums . I don't know, I just look on enviously at other teams getting soft games (hello North) and think, "why not us"?
Agree with your comments re: the Cattery RR - the AFL cannot justify it in any way, shape or form given that their stated aim is to maximize attendances. On the draw though, I have to disagree. I would rather play the top sides more often and when we play them is really quite irrelevant. We are only going to be a genuine premiership chance when we can compete and beat those sides and getting a soft or deliberately spaced draw is only creating a false dawn - cue Nought - they keep making the finals and keep getting bundled out early and unceremoniously without ever looking like a flag contender. Give me a tough draw as a preparation and prelude to a finals campaign any day, that way there can be no doubt in our minds that when we make it we are in the thing up to our god damned ears! And as a bonus, we rake in many more $$s by playing the top sides anyway and that can only make our club stronger in the long term.
:gotigers
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Any one, any where, any time.
No Fear!
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all fair enough we all come from different pespectives. look at our opponent this week they have played coll, geel,adelaide, wce,syd, stk, melb and freo. 5 of last yrs finalists plus a rampaging adelaide.
if anything their draw has turned out to be harder than us with adelaide doing so well. i dont hear hawthorn supporters complaining about draws. has a soft draw helped north to date.
when we start defeating the so called top sides on a regular basis you will know we have truly arrived. we just lack a bit in structure and quality atm and a lot in depth.
Hawthorn are a top side who won a Premiership recently, and have been up and about playing finals for years. I would expect them to have a more challenging draw than us. As it is it's on a par with ours. We are an emerging side, but are looking like being held back from more desperately needed finals experience with an incredibly difficult and unfair draw. (Incidentally, I know a couple of Hawks fans who were furious when their draw was announced.)
By the way, I agree with you about our list still being a work in progress, including pretty much all the names you mentioned as being ones that need to go. So for me it's not a case of a few easy wins papering over the cracks. I'm well aware of what the cracks are. I just want to experience the rush of winning a bit more often. And if we drop too many more games now then this season will be yet another write-off well before it's really gotten started, and once again we fans will be turning our focus towards draft picks in June.
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RICHMOND - In the Mix
The Tigers have a record this season of making as few changes as possible. Although they must look at selecting a replacement for key defender Dylan Grimes, who was one of the feel good stories of the season before tearing his hamstring against Essendon, they might just give more responsibility to those players already playing in defence. Jake Batchelor might step up from being the third tall defender to being the second tall defender, giving him most likely the assignment on Jarryd Roughead. Ben Griffiths, who was named among the best in Coburg Tigers' loss to Williamstown, is the most likely to come in if the Tigers do go for a replacement for Grimes. Tyrone Vickery is likely to be selected if he comes up from his calf injury
-Paul Daffey
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/136532/default.aspx
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Agreed. This draft is absolutely critical. With a bit of luck, it could 'complete' our list, or at least go close.
We need more class across the board and we need to milk this strong and compromised draft for all its worth.
Another couple of handy mature recruits, as in the previous two years, will help.
Still more work to be done with our list, but we have made strong progress. I've got faith in our recruiters/list managers to get the job done.
As long as we stay away from this brighton c salem fwit should br cracking draft
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3 - 5 Hawks and Saints to come No excuses
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Believe we have more of a chance against the saints. To beat the hawks would be a win of the highest order
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The hawks are beatable. Our midfield is comparable or maybe even slightly better, they have a bit of an edge in their D50 so IMO it all comes down to who's forward line performs the best.
If Buddy and Roughead are off song, and Jack, Miller, Vickery & Co actually do what they are supposed to do, we could snatch this one. Mind you that friggin Hale will probably drop in for a bag as one of those average types who always lift against us. :banghead
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Hale is going to forcefully lose his virginity against Ivan
Put him down for 0 goals
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all fair enough we all come from different pespectives. look at our opponent this week they have played coll, geel,adelaide, wce,syd, stk, melb and freo. 5 of last yrs finalists plus a rampaging adelaide.
if anything their draw has turned out to be harder than us with adelaide doing so well. i dont hear hawthorn supporters complaining about draws. has a soft draw helped north to date.
when we start defeating the so called top sides on a regular basis you will know we have truly arrived. we just lack a bit in structure and quality atm and a lot in depth.
Hawthorn are a top side who won a Premiership recently, and have been up and about playing finals for years. I would expect them to have a more challenging draw than us. As it is it's on a par with ours. We are an emerging side, but are looking like being held back from more desperately needed finals experience with an incredibly difficult and unfair draw. (Incidentally, I know a couple of Hawks fans who were furious when their draw was announced.)
By the way, I agree with you about our list still being a work in progress, including pretty much all the names you mentioned as being ones that need to go. So for me it's not a case of a few easy wins papering over the cracks. I'm well aware of what the cracks are. I just want to experience the rush of winning a bit more often. And if we drop too many more games now then this season will be yet another write-off well before it's really gotten started, and once again we fans will be turning our focus towards draft picks in June.
i fully understand where your coming from and do indeed relate to it. but i think win lose or draw from here on in the improvement is obvious. really think though to advance further and become a good finals side we must address the issues we have of depth and quality.
yep if everything goes well for us ie injuries we may well scrape into finals this yr and i agree that would be great for the club the long suffering supporters and the young players we have.
i dont think it likely and shudder to thjink what will happen when and if we start copping a lot of injuries.
my greatest fear is we make finals and then only turn over 3 or 4 players thinking most of the work is done.
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Looks like it is going to be wet and windy on Saturday.
Won't have to worry too much about beating Buddy in the air (not that he is overly dangerous in the air) but at ground level we need to shut him down.
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Batchelor. Grimes. Rance.
Houli. Astbury. Dea.
Grigg. Martin. Captian.
Deledio. Griffiths. Cotchin
Elton. Riewoldt. Helbig.
MaricIvan. Ellis. Conca.
Edwards. Morris. Vickey.
+Tuck.
Emg- OHanlon. Tuck. Moore.
The buildings blocks are in place claw?
unlike most i dont think the draw has been a bad thing. in fact its almost a good thing.
if i had my way we would play top 8 sides every week of the yr. my attitude is if we cant beat these sides we dont deserve to make the 8. thse sides are the sides we truly test ourselves against.
yes we have improved again this yr and we have found some pretty decent players but wins against poor sides only papers over the cracks and i tell ya we still have plenty of cracks.
rather than wins and dont get me wrong i want us to win i think this yr its far more impoortant we find another ruckman i live in hope but cant see it happening with the ruckmen we have outside of maric. a real genuine kpf prospect want one of griffiths astbury to show they belong. and id like to get some games into elton.
at least one med/sml forward well o hanlon is the hope i want to see what he can do. we are chasing a real big kpd yeah i know we have gone okay without one but that doesnt mean one is not needed. we dont have one on the list. lastly the midfield depth imo we need to find 4 mids two of real quality to go with, conca, grigg,ellis, cotchin,martin, helbig, foley, tuck, armot,deledio,any mid not mentioned i dont rate as a player or as a mid.
this coming draft i would have had no hesitation in cutting/trading any combination of 7 to 9 players containing.
jackson edwards incredibly both have been re-signed to more than 1 yr performance based contracts.
macdonald is already gone
king,
white,
webberley
two of derickx/browne/graham.
mcguane
nahas
moore depending on injury.
post is another probably in the gun.
connors.
theres 14 names there and i can honestly say if we cut them we would not miss them we get little enough out of all of them as it is atm and none bar browne/post/macdonald are kids anymore.. it does not include rookies like miller heslin whos gone, a maric who looks incapable of adding the strings to his game to make it. depth people it is a dirty word.
as i have stated before we are at the crux in the road. do we take the turn back into oblivion and hang onto an inordinate amount of battlers or do we cut hard and continue to do what has everyone excited. 5 nd picks one psd pick on a mature need, a couple of mature recruits from minor leagues and a a trade if possible.
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all fair enough we all come from different pespectives. look at our opponent this week they have played coll, geel,adelaide, wce,syd, stk, melb and freo. 5 of last yrs finalists plus a rampaging adelaide.
if anything their draw has turned out to be harder than us with adelaide doing so well. i dont hear hawthorn supporters complaining about draws. has a soft draw helped north to date.
when we start defeating the so called top sides on a regular basis you will know we have truly arrived. we just lack a bit in structure and quality atm and a lot in depth.
Hawthorn are a top side who won a Premiership recently, and have been up and about playing finals for years. I would expect them to have a more challenging draw than us. As it is it's on a par with ours. We are an emerging side, but are looking like being held back from more desperately needed finals experience with an incredibly difficult and unfair draw. (Incidentally, I know a couple of Hawks fans who were furious when their draw was announced.)
By the way, I agree with you about our list still being a work in progress, including pretty much all the names you mentioned as being ones that need to go. So for me it's not a case of a few easy wins papering over the cracks. I'm well aware of what the cracks are. I just want to experience the rush of winning a bit more often. And if we drop too many more games now then this season will be yet another write-off well before it's really gotten started, and once again we fans will be turning our focus towards draft picks in June.
i fully understand where your coming from and do indeed relate to it. but i think win lose or draw from here on in the improvement is obvious. really think though to advance further and become a good finals side we must address the issues we have of depth and quality.
yep if everything goes well for us ie injuries we may well scrape into finals this yr and i agree that would be great for the club the long suffering supporters and the young players we have.
i dont think it likely and shudder to thjink what will happen when and if we start copping a lot of injuries.
my greatest fear is we make finals and then only turn over 3 or 4 players thinking most of the work is done.
I think Dimma is well aware that even if finals are achieved this year the holes in our list which you so correctly pointed out still need to be addressed and will be.
Regardless of where we finish I still think there will be a turnover of at least 8 at the end of the year.
We have laid the foundations and are building a team next component is too fill needs and create depth in the list. :thumbsup
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See Claw, you COULD argue that negotiating this draw is a bit like the fast-tracking the learning experience to be gained from playing Finals football. After all, we're playing the teams that are going to be up and about in September. However, I still feel there's no substitute for the real thing. The better-placed teams have had at least 2-3 finals campaigns under their belts before they make their tilt at the silverware, and this is where I feel we are missing out. After 11 years of missing out, there's just no sustained grounding.
Essendon are the perfect example of this, I hate to say it. I thought they were bloody lucky to scrape into the 8 last year, were bounced out quickly and brutally accordingly, and I thought, without the existing cattle or much access to the draft last year wouldn't make the 8 this year. But somehow, probably just the experience of tasting the real stuff has galvanised them as a playing group this year. Look at what they did to their Elimination Final tormentors Carlton just a few weeks ago. Whereas we just continue to get blown away by the Blues year after year. Where did that belief come from??? I don't know, but I want our boys to get a piece of it. Yeah, we've improved no doubt. But I'm still not so sure that Richmond believes we can actually win one of these honourable losses that are piling up. I'll be happy to be proven wrong Tige's with a Hawk or Saint scalp in the next fortnight...
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I think Dimma is well aware that even if finals are achieved this year the holes in our list which you so correctly pointed out still need to be addressed and will be.
Regardless of where we finish I still think there will be a turnover of at least 8 at the end of the year.
We have laid the foundations and are building a team next component is too fill needs and create depth in the list. :thumbsup
[/quote]
What a load of BS that we already know.
Even if we win the grand final there will be holes in our list that will need to be replaced.
If we turn over 8 players there will be 6 or so YOUNG UNPROVEN KIDS or a couple of rejects from other clubs on our list AGAIN.....and we will still be in development mode with all of its associated excuses........just like we have been for ages.
Dimma doesn't choose those who stay or go, even though his input is valuable and I'm sure he would get peeed off if he is lumbered with a bunch of Melbourne players that posters would suggest are our saviour.
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I think Dimma is well aware that even if finals are achieved this year the holes in our list which you so correctly pointed out still need to be addressed and will be.
Regardless of where we finish I still think there will be a turnover of at least 8 at the end of the year.
We have laid the foundations and are building a team next component is too fill needs and create depth in the list. :thumbsup
What a load of BS that we already know.
Even if we win the grand final there will be holes in our list that will need to be replaced.
If we turn over 8 players there will be 6 or so YOUNG UNPROVEN KIDS or a couple of rejects from other clubs on our list AGAIN.....and we will still be in development mode with all of its associated excuses........just like we have been for ages.
Dimma doesn't choose those who stay or go, even though his input is valuable and I'm sure he would get peeed off if he is lumbered with a bunch of Melbourne players that posters would suggest are our saviour.
[/quote]not sure about the point of this post. i can name close to 14 players who we get nothing out of and it is mostly made up of 3rd 4th 5ht yr plus players.
sheesh if we cut 8 duds take 8 players and have roughly a 60% hit ratio thats about 5 decent players to add to the 14 or so we have. thats 5 players better off we will be. i expect our first rounder to be a good player at worst. i expect a very high chance od our second rounder and our compensation pick both around 30 to bring us good players. i can see no reason why we cant trade into another maric situation or find a couple of vfl wafl sanfl players like morris.
one thing i do know we will fail with about 40% of all players taken its not all about picking guns with every pick its just as much about value adding. its also about making sure you turn over/put out the trash when you can.
tell me what role have blokes like mcguane, white king jackson edwards nahas connors browne derickx graham webberley miller a maric moore played in our improvement. i could mention a load of others.
we do need to keep on turning the list over but hey if you think otherwise its all good. if you think every single player we will take will be a spud, and thats the way it sounds hey thats all good as well.
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Goodonya Claw,
If we cut 8 players can you guarantee that we will get 8 stars?
We have been cutting players for 30 years.
Surely its about time that we started to develop the majority of the guys of the right age that are on our list rather than discarding those that are ready to roar after all the training they have.
Geelong, Collingwobbles and Brisvegas did it.
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I hope Griffo gets a go.. He could do well against Franklin or Roughead.. He is 7 cms taller than Roughy and 4 cms taller than Buddy and can take a grab + his disposal is pretty good going by the coburg highlights reel on the Richmond app.
In: Griffo, A.Maric, Vickery
Out: Grimes, King, Miller
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I hope Griffo gets a go..
Does he have any match fitness?
Griffo will get a go, when the time is right.
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On draft day in dimmas first year i reckon he thought hed found richmonds 10 year center. Chf. Chb
With the clubs first 3 picks. Still early days.
You cannot say our 8 draft picks.this year will make it but there is a higher chance given the so called class of the dtsfy
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Goodonya Claw,
If we cut 8 players can you guarantee that we will get 8 stars?
We have been cutting players for 30 years.
Surely its about time that we started to develop the majority of the guys of the right age that are on our list rather than discarding those that are ready to roar after all the training they have.
Geelong, Collingwobbles and Brisvegas did it.
a bit of simple maths for ya.
lets say the average time on a list is 10 yrs. read it somewhere and think this is very close to the truth. you have 45 players on your list that would mean you need to find at least 4 or 5 players every single yr just to break even. every single club must turn over players for so many obvious reasons.
if you can agree we have a large amount of players on our list who we need to upgrade on say 14, then if we turned over 8 took 8 and found 5 it goes without saying we are in front. it also says the following yr you only have 9 to turn over.
as you find players the more the overall number comes down until gradually you are in a position depth wise that you are only cutting 3 or 4 each yr list needs and structures determine what you do at this stage.
the overall hit miss ratio for all clubs a few yrs ago for recruits was running at about 60/40. based on that alone if we turn over 10 players who are no good and we have em, then we could realistically expect to find 6 decent players.
please tell me which of the players i mentioned are ready to roar and what major contribution have they made to our improvement. improvement has happened because most of em are not getting a game.glass half fulls actually prevent you from developing and improving if hardwick has done nothing else he has shown this to be true.
you will scoff at this but imo we are still looking for 15 odd players to show they can perform at this level on a consistent basis. the improvement to date has been on the back of 15 odd players after them it has been ordinary.
the 8 players most likely in the gun this yr are.
connors, white,webberley, macdonald.
mcguane, moore retired,
one or two of graham, brown, derickx.
move newman to the vets list and we can cut 8 non performers who have contributed nothing to our improvement quite easily. what development can we put into that lot apart from macdonals who i think is as good as gone already and big brown there is no upside to the others. they have all been around for ages and all are 23 plus.
it leaves poor players on the list who are at least giving just a little in. nahas dud imo, edwards sometimes terrible sometimes ordinary sometimes passable. jackson could be replaced with any very good state league player. king the most overrated player on the list who is ordinary most of the time. miller who we are wasting our time with, they all get to stay another yr but it is clear we should be looking to do much better than them.
if we cant improve on 4 or 5 of those players this trade/draft period we should not be in the comp.
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Agree with all of that the claw. It's pretty effing basic stuff. Not sure why some supporters can't get their heads around it. Probably something wrong with their diets.
Now if we can land Rendell it just increases our chances of hitting that 60/40 mark and we continue climbing up the ladder.
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Find it hard to see one of browne/derickx
We are going to delist young developing ruckmsn (that we pur a few years into). Im favor of new junior ruckman?