One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: TigerLand on May 06, 2017, 11:55:35 PM
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Richmond Football Club sitting ranked 18th for Frees for and against ratio.
Currently -48 for free kicks. Absolutely pathetic. Can someone in the club say something, if this was Collingwood, Geelong, Hawthorn. Someone would say something. We lose the count every week....
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Sadly, we are a dumb footy side and cause our own demise with stupidity. That accounts for a number of our frees against. Having said there were 4 howlers that we got screwed on.
1) Miles 40m kick out of defence that was touched by Elton just over the boundary line. Field umpire askes the boundary umpire if the ball was touched before it went out. Boundary ump says no so the field ump pays deliberate. Sorry but 2 milliseconds difference is not deliberate ::).
2) Dusty gathers the ball in the centre and aims to kick it long forward but kicks it off the side of the boot as a Dog attempts to smother it. The ball skews off 60m and bounces end over end out on bounds on wing. That's not deliberate either.
3) Short near the end of the game just fumbled the ball trying to grab it (the story of our night). It wasn't in our interests either to have the ball go out 5 pts down with seconds to play. The ump was probably behind the play and guessed or fell for the cries of deliberate at the end of the ground where the Bulldogs fans were.
4) The worst one wasn't a deliberate out of bounds. It was the one in our D50 where the field ump one metre from the ball clearly is heard in the mike to say "both holding" and called play on. The muppet 60m away then comes running in flapping his arms to pay a free to the Bulldogs for holding. As he's the central umpire his over-rule stands.
I could add the rushed behind to the Dogs after the siren at half-time and the throw-in call against Rance for playing on after the mark behind the goal/boundary line but apparently they are rules according to Ch 7 :-\.
Dimma was most upset post-game with the holding the ball interpretation. The Dogs did get away with a few overhead basketball throws in our tackles. Having said that they didn't fumble badly like we did either which is one of the main reasons that cost us the game.
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There was a free kick after Jacks goal in the last (after the complaint of holding the ball against Butler) that seemed to be simply a square up or apology to the crowd as I still have no idea what that was for.
There was also a deliberate out of bounds against the Dogs on the flank to the right of the interchange. It was 50-50 but they have to be consistent.
The West Coast game at the G was a shockingly 1 sided umpired game as was the one against the Pies. We are due a game where we get rub of the green.
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Martin getting legged = holding the ball ::)
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Holding against Astbury. Umpire no more than 5m said play on, both players holding each other yet ump 50m away over rules, closest umpire looks completely bewildered at the decision.
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Martin getting legged = holding the ball ::)
This. Tackled Martin above the knees (just) and then slipped below the knee.
Umpire has a clear view - holding the ball.
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Unbelievably frustrating and it does change the outcome of games :banghead
I personally hate that you can drop the ball or flick the ball when talked and its play on but every so often they will pay make the correct call...again :banghead
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Im doing my nut over what seems to be an interpretation that if the end act is an infraction then that over rules any prior infraction from the opposing team.
Case being Martins tackled by the leg and last week someone tackled high who got pinged for holding the ball.
Absolute rubbish are all the umps taking lessons from Stevic the rat rooter
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with the Martin one, they ran a replay in slow motion, he literally had a grip on his ankle at the end of it
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The holding the ball and prior opportunity interpretation is all over the shop and just plain stuffed up.
Example 1- a player is running bouncing th ball and gets run down from behind in a ripper tackle dropping the ball cold without disposing of it, yet often we see play on called.
Example 2- a stationary player receives a handball gets smashed in the tackle a millisecond later, ball spills out without disposing of it and it's holding the ball. This happened to butler last night and happens in most games most weeks.
What is going on here?
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Just depends on the umpire and how he feels about who got smashed I spose, or what jumper he has on. THere is no consistency
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That central umpire should never officiate in the AFL again...or at least until he reaches puberty....must be Stevic's son..
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That central umpire should never officiate in the AFL again...or at least until he reaches puberty....must be Stevic's son..
:snidegrin
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These umpire peanuts really annoy me, they stuff up games and alter results unnecessarily.
Aaaa!aaaaaaaarrrrrrrrggggggghhhhhh!
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They need to refine the rules to more black and white and less open to interpretation.
Sick and tired of being screwed over
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After watching the replay I have no doubt that this game was determined by the bad umpiring decisions delivered by that twit with the black hair....And I never usually bag umpires.
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While I love the effect of the keep the ball in rule it is atrocious in the way it is inconsistently applied. We have some pretty stupid rules like the kick out from the square rule. Who cares if they just run off. It's just play on then. Rances free against playing on through the goals is an absolutely bloody stupid rule. Some anal teat invented it. Again who cares if they switch play from behind the goals. We have a few bloody stupid rules to get rid of. The interchange zone is the same just tag the other players hand before you enter the play. White marks along the boundary line are stupidly anal again.
What they ought to get anal about is the runners filling space. I'd get rid of them as they get abused or make it an auto goal if they in anyway affect the play.
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Deliberate out of bounds call, decision Jayden Short Richmond v Western Bulldogs: Was it right or wrong?
KATE SALEMME
Herald Sun
7 May 2017
AFL GAMES record holder Brent Harvey has called for the league to make an immediate change to the deliberate out of bounds rule after a contentious decision against Richmond’s Jayden Short on Saturday night.
Short was penalised when he appeared to fumble the ball under pressure of two Bulldogs players in the last minute of the Tigers’ five-point loss to the Bulldogs.
The free kick essentially ended the game as the Bulldogs were able to hold onto the ball for the final seconds.
“You just can’t call that,” Harvey said. “As an umpire, that can’t be called.
“The initial part he’s trying to handball but in the second part he tries to grab the footy as well and his hand is getting held.
“I’m feeling for the umpires at the minute because their job is too hard. There’s so many rules — the deliberate is getting worse and worse.”
The AFL has this year introduced a stricter interpretation of the deliberate out of bounds rule and penalised players for not making enough effort to keep the ball in play.
Harvey said he “absolutely” felt for Short in that situation.
“That will not get paid again for the whole season,” he said.
“When there is players around you and you fumble the ball, the umpires never pay it. For some reason though (that was paid).
“In a close game, that’s costly.
“It’s unbelievable.”
Harvey, who retired after being moved on by North Melbourne at the end of last year after 432 career games, wants immediate change.
“I don’t think we wait until the end of the season because stuff like this is going to keep happening,” he told Fox Sports.
“So we (the AFL) need to go back and have a quick look at it and change the rule slightly because I still think if you’re not willing to keep the ball in, they’re going to pay it against you.
“And I still think that’s not deliberate out of bounds.
“So they’ve got to go back and tinker with it slightly.”
Richmond coach Damien Hardwick didn’t weigh in on whether the Short call was right or wrong but when pressed on the league’s rules he declared there are too many left to umpire interpretation.
“I don’t know, it was pretty hard to see it from the (coaches) box. I’m not sure exactly what it was from that one,” he said of the call.
“I’m not sure whether it’s that rule or all the rules to be frank.
“I feel really sorry for the umpires, the amount of interpretations they have to make. We just keep adding layer upon layer.
“So I don’t blame the umpires at all, at all. The holding the ball rule. How many interpretations are in that?
“It’s not their fault, they’ve got to go through five decisions to make an actual decision. I actually think they do a pretty good job, under the circumstances.”
Western Bulldogs coach Luke Beveridge was at a loss to explain the deliberate rule and at times had to laugh while trying to answer questions about the rule in his post-match press conference.
“Ultimately if you’re kicking it out of a pressured situation and there’s smothering hands and the ball needs to go a certain way to clear the area,” he said. “Is that insufficient intent?
“I don’t know how it went tonight, how many were paid and weren’t paid but there were definitely ones that weren’t paid that were paid last week. So the insufficient intent, is it clearer or less clear? I don’t know.”
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/teams/richmond/deliberate-out-of-bounds-call-against-richmonds-jayden-short-in-loss-to-western-bulldogs-slammed/news-story/29003ffd78b394aedad5e6a46d2452bd
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'On replay, it looked a bit harsh': AFL football operations boss Simon Lethlean
afl.com.au
8 May 2017
THE DECISION to pay a deliberate out of bounds free kick against Richmond's Jayden Short in the dying seconds against the Western Bulldogs was a borderline call, AFL football operations boss Simon Lethlean says.
With 25 seconds left in Saturday night's match and Richmond trailing by five points, Short pushed the ball forward in attack, before fumbling it out of bounds.
The 21-year-old was penalised for deliberately tapping the ball out deep in his team's forward pocket.
Lethlean said the decision appeared to be correct when watching it in real time.
"Watching the Short one live, I actually thought it was the right call," Lethlean told radio station 3AW on Sunday.
"On replay, it looked a bit harsh, because you can make an argument that he fumbled the ball a bit more than, perhaps, pushed it out."
The umpiring department will review the decision on Monday and speak to the umpire responsible as part of its routine post-round procedure.
Lethlean said the League would continue to instruct umpires to maintain a more stringent interpretation of the deliberate out of bounds rule despite the contentious final-minute decision to penalise Short.
"In that situation in the forward pocket, he had three opponents above him waiting to (ping him) for holding the ball," Lethlean said.
"He may well have thought, 'I'll push it out here, stop the clock and get a stoppage and try and get a goal from that'.
"At the time, the umpire thought he wasn't doing everything he could to keep it in."
After the game, Tigers coach Damien Hardwick said he felt "really sorry" for the whistleblowers because rules required far too much interpretation in the modern game, while Bulldogs coach Luke Beveridge likened the deliberate out of bounds interpretation to an episode of Fawlty Towers.
Lethlean labelled Beveridge's post-match comments "a moment of levity" and said he had no issue with the remarks.
The latest controversial umpiring decision comes just days after the AFL Laws of the Game committee clarified the deliberate out of bounds rule.
On Thursday, Lethlean said players who showed "insufficient intent" to keep the ball in play risked having a free kick paid against them.
Western Bulldogs defender Matt Suckling, who applied pressure on Short near the boundary and appealed for the final-minute free kick, said he believed the young Tiger fumbled the ball.
"I just thought he tapped it out of congestion and it rolled out of bounds," Suckling told Fox Footy.
"These days, you've got to have so much intent to keep the ball in (so) I thought I may as well appeal for it.
"It's in their forward 50 so I suppose he's not really trying to get it out but it doesn't look like he's trying to keep it in."
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-05-07/outs-of-bounds-call-borderline-says-lethlean
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They just pick that one decision out of all of the ones they plucked out of their arses against us lol Geez, it was a umpmolestfest. They should of handed our team the morning after pill after the game finished
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And yet you can punch the ball out deliberately in a marking contest.
Go figure.
If the ball goes out the opposing team of the team who last touched it should be able to handball it in. End of story.
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At the very least just come out and say we got it wrong. FFS! You potentially lost us the game, the least you can do is say it was a bad call. It's doesn't cost the AFL anything!!
I watched it again yesterday and he clearly fumbled the footy out of bounce. Pretty clear and simple.
The one against Miles earlier in the game was equally as bad. How can you pay deliberate out of bounce if your teammate picks it up on the line?? To the point the umpires have to converse about it??
Add that to the 25 to 13 free kick count and imo it has cost us that game.
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And yet you can punch the ball out deliberately in a marking contest.
Go figure.
If the ball goes out the opposing team of the team who last touched it should be able to handball it in. End of story.
The other one I don't get is interfering with the player in a marking contest, essentially it seems that you can destroy someones kidneys in a marking contest as long as you complete the mark, misjudge the flight of the ball and suddenly its a free kick to the defender. With eyes only for the ball i really can't see the difference, Jack jumped early on a couple of occasions but one in particular he clearly had eyes for the ball but in doing supposedly impeded the defender but because he didn't take the mark it was a free against him.
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They just pick that one decision out of all of the ones they plucked out of their arses against us lol Geez, it was a umpmolestfest. They should of handed our team the morning after pill after the game finished
And once you add the ones we didn't get, that the Dogs did... :banghead :banghead
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The melb/haw game yesterday when higans put his hand in the back of the defender, pushed him out of the contest and no free, what a joke. Couldn't have been a clearer infringement/ free kick.
If melb had won that would have been a major talking point.
As Haw won it was swept under the carpet
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And yet you can punch the ball out deliberately in a marking contest.
Go figure.
If the ball goes out the opposing team of the team who last touched it should be able to handball it in. End of story.
Similar to a quick throw in to avoid the line out in rugby
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AFL happy with deliberate out of bounds
John Salvado
AAP
May 9, 2017
AFL boss Gill McLachlan is happy with how the contentious deliberate out-of-bounds rule is being adjudicated, despite acknowledging the umpires made a couple of mistakes in round seven.
Richmond's Jayden Short was harshly penalised for fumbling the ball over the line in the dying seconds of the five-point loss to the Western Bulldogs, denying the Tigers one final shot at victory.
GWS co-captain Callan Ward was also controversially adjudged to have deliberately put the ball out of bounds in the shock loss to St Kilda on Friday night.
"There are always some mistakes," McLachlan told reporters on Monday.
"I think respect for umpires is an incredibly important part of our game at the community level and the elite level. They do a very tough job."
McLachlan believes most supporters have a solid understanding of how the new interpretation of deliberate out of bounds should be applied.
"They understand it and on the weekend there were a couple of mistakes," he said.
"Football is going really well so in the absence of other noise we focus on two mistakes.
"I think we are not talking about the important role the rule changes have made to the quality of the game.
"When you make change there are always challenges."
The AFL Laws of the Game committee gave the new interpretation of the rule its seal of approval last week, although several coaches, including Luke Beveridge from the Western Bulldogs, remain far from convinced.
"The insufficient intent, is it clearer or less clearer? I don't know," Beveridge said on Saturday night.
"I feel like, is this Morecambe and Wise or Fawlty Towers? I'm not sure."
https://au.sports.yahoo.com/afl/a/35358138/afl-happy-with-deliberate-out-of-bounds/#page1
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We have got Rosebury , Deboy and Mollinson umpiring this week . Decent umpires.especially Rosebury
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At the very least just come out and say we got it wrong. FFS! You potentially lost us the game, the least you can do is say it was a bad call. It's doesn't cost the AFL anything!!
I watched it again yesterday and he clearly fumbled the footy out of bounce. Pretty clear and simple.
The one against Miles earlier in the game was equally as bad. How can you pay deliberate out of bounce if your teammate picks it up on the line?? To the point the umpires have to converse about it??
Add that to the 25 to 13 free kick count and imo it has cost us that game.
:clapping sick of it!
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And yet you can just run by the ball and not pick it up after an opponent has kicked it and it rolls towards the boundary with you showing no intent to keeo the ball in but it's your opponent that gets pinged for deliberate. Go figure!
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Hardwick suggested after the loss to the Bulldogs that the game was becoming to hard to umpire.
'I don’t think (the comments) are an attack (on umpires)," Lethlean said.
"To be fair to Damien, he was probably defending the umpires and pointing the finger more at me.
"They need to be making comment, I'm sure, and also hoping the world doesn't get too serious so we can have a laugh every now and then.
"I think the focus has been a little bit hysterical on umpiring compared to how good the (standard of) football is."
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-05-09/que-bevo-gets-a-fawlty-towers-rap
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And yet you can just run by the ball and not pick it up after an opponent has kicked it and it rolls towards the boundary with you showing no intent to keeo the ball in but it's your opponent that gets pinged for deliberate. Go figure!
:clapping :clapping has always irked me this one but it's even more glaring now they claim it's "insufficient attempt" to keep it in instead of "deliberate". The rules need to be more black and white, don't leave it up to the muppets interpretation
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And this week the powers that be have decided to go soft on delibrate out of bounds. Only a week late after we copped 6 of them ::).
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At least Stevic has already umpired a game this week...... just hope we don't get the work experience kid who was central umpire last week again....
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And this week the powers that be have decided to go soft on delibrate out of bounds. Only a week late after we copped 6 of them ::).
Yep, noticed that. This whole round has seen the umpires being very careful about the deliberate free, flip-flopping back to not paying it! Even the rushed behind rule seems to have gone missing too!
I guess the Umpires & Rules Committee are happy now, now that they have thrown us under the bus ... ::)
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Some absolute howlers today from the umpires
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This week's MIA rule = deliberate
Lightening on it last week today they paid 1 :o
That non goal on the siren in 3rd, just relieved it had no impact on the final result ::)
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This week's MIA rule = deliberate
Lightening on it last week today they paid 1 :o
That non goal on the siren in 3rd, just relieved it had no impact on the final result ::)
That was one of the worst we have copped all year and that's saying something. First one of those I have seen in any match all year.
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Lol. The do get stuffed.
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That non goal on the siren in 3rd, just relieved it had no impact on the final result ::)
That was one of the worst we have copped all year and that's saying something. First one of those I have seen in any match all year.
Here's the vision of Caddy's disallowed goal:
VIDEO: http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-05-14/five-talking-points-richmond-v-fremantle
Was it a block or a goal at three-quarter time?
Just seconds before three-quarter time, Richmond's Josh Caddy kicked a long bomb towards the goals with Jack Riewoldt and his Fremantle opponent Joel Hamling contesting the ball. Riewoldt managed to edge Hamling under the ball as it sailed through for a goal. However the umpire paid a free kick against Riewoldt for blocking, and the goal was disallowed. The siren instantly rang as Riewodlt complained. It did not seem so significant at the time but with the margin two points at the end it was a vital decision in determining the result. However the Dockers had their own critical moment too. Brady Grey thought he had snapped a goal in the second quarter and was surprised not only when the umpire signalled a behind but when no review occurred. Dockers' coach Ross Lyon was surprised that behinds are only subject to video reviews if the umpires ask for one, whereas goals are automatically looked at on video.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-05-14/five-talking-points-richmond-v-fremantle
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Another moment from the last 21 seconds that might have been.
Grabbing an opponent's jumper is a free kick isn't it?
(http://www.aflphotos.com.au/images/thumbs/450/2017/05/14/511896.jpg)
http://www.aflphotos.com.au
Not if your name is Fyfe obviously :whistle.
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I still maintain we have some pretty stupid and anal rules in the AFL. It's a better spectical when the umps put their whistle away.
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HTB is farcical.
Also how many shepherds in the goal line do we see every game, how many start shepherding with the ball still 30-40 metres away and no one is ever pinged, yet we have been and not th first time! I recall it happening in 96 out at Waverley vs the swans with richo, cost us the game and finals that season.
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It's fine, now it's happened to us they will change the interpretation again and at some point we will lose a game on the basis the umps don't pay the same free kick.
All we ask each week is consistency yet every week we see a free paid or not paid for some obscure reason. We lost today because we played one quarter of football but sooner or later a grand final is going to be decided by one of these decisions and it just ruins the whole spectacle.
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Lost the free kick count to Freo at the MCG. Would love to find how long ago Freo or WCE ever lost a free kick count at home...
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Was the free kick paid against Richmond’s Jack Riewoldt the right call?
Herald Sun
May 15, 2017
RICHMOND suffered a heartbreaking loss at the MCG today, with a David Mundy goal after the siren sinking the Tigers.
However, should the Tigers have already been home?
Richmond was seemingly robbed of a goal in the final moments of the third quarter when Jack Riewoldt was penalised for a push in the back on the goal line.
The kick from Josh Caddy went through the big sticks but the six points were waved off by the umpires.
Richmond went on to lose the match by two points.
Coach Damien Hardwick intimated post-match Caddy’s goal should have been allowed but conceded his team didn’t deserve to win after playing poorly for three quarters.
“I think we see about 50 goal line shepherds a game, don’t we?,” he said.
“But it’s probably taking away from the result, really. Fremantle were by far the better side today. If we had of stolen that game it was probably a disservice to them in theory.”
Was it the right call from the umpires? Watch the free kick here.
The Richmond fans wasted no time slamming the call.
MattO @STRAYAHUNT
What a joke umpire! @AFL @Richmond_FC @HRTAli1987
Al Paton @al_superfooty
Tigers putrid but great time to pay the first free for a goal-line shepherd in recorded history #AFLTigersDockers
Michael J Voukolos @moggyvouk_82
Dear @AFL What's the beef with .@Richmond_FC? Your umpires have gutted the Tiges like fish two weeks in a row?
Willy Heard @WillyHeard
Disallowed Richmond goal at 3/4 time? AFL wonder why people are getting less interested in the game these days
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/teams/richmond/was-the-free-kick-paid-against-richmonds-jack-riewoldt-the-right-call/news-story/3f4a04553dcf16bb596ffc800eaab084
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The umps are mediators/ moderators only. They are not the game! I'm sick of these pumped up soufflés believing they have a right to stamp their imprimatur on games at crucial moments. We need autistics not 'artists' to officiate this game.
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Take their numbers off their backs ffs
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Free Kick Ladder: Post Round 8 – Tiger troubles roll on as Dogs go top
By Bren O'Brien
footyprophet.com
Posted on May 17, 2017
Richmond remain cast adrift at the bottom of the AFL Free Kick ladder after Round 8, having lost yet another free kick count in the heart-breaking loss to Fremantle at the MCG.
The Tigers lost the free kick count in the game 16-17, the seventh time in eight games where the whistle has gone against them. They clearly have the worst record when it comes to conceding free kicks, with 189 in total. 21 more than any other team.
The big movers on the ladder were the Western Bulldogs who became the first team this year to win a free kick against west Coast at Subiaco. In a low free kick match, the Bulldogs won the whistle 15-12, but lost the game. The Bulldogs were the clear premiership winner in this department last year, winning 16 of 22 free kick counts, before winning all four free kick counts in the finals.
They move on top of the ladder after both Collingwood and Carlton lost their respective counts, to drop to third and fourth respectively, while North Melbourne move to second.
The full free kick ladder as of Round 8 is below. Statistics are from AFL Tables.
Team P W L D Pts FF FA % Movement
Western Bulldogs 8 5 2 1 22 163 127 128.35% 2
North Melbourne 8 5 2 1 22 169 143 118.18% 2
Collingwood 8 5 2 1 22 131 120 109.17% -2
Carlton 8 5 3 0 20 148 127 116.54% -2
Port Adelaide 8 5 3 0 20 159 158 100.63% 3
Melbourne 8 4 3 1 18 152 137 110.95% 3
Gold Coast 8 4 3 1 18 139 137 101.46% -2
Essendon 8 4 3 1 18 145 145 100.00% 3
Fremantle 8 4 3 1 18 143 144 99.31% 1
West Coast 8 4 4 0 16 147 129 113.95% -4
Brisbane Lions 8 4 4 0 16 172 160 107.50% -4
Hawthorn 8 4 4 0 16 138 136 101.47% 1
St Kilda 8 4 4 0 16 143 141 101.42% -1
Adelaide 8 3 5 0 12 141 161 87.58% 0
GWS Giants 8 3 5 0 12 134 166 80.72% 2
Geelong 8 2 5 1 10 151 169 89.35% -1
Sydney 8 2 6 0 8 141 168 83.93% -1
Richmond 8 1 7 0 4 141 189 74.60% 0
http://footyprophet.com/free-kick-ladder-post-round-8/
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THE STRICTER interpretation of deliberate out of bounds has resulted in a significant decrease in free kicks paid under the rule in 2017 as players make increased efforts to keep the ball in play.
The contentious rule has attracted criticism this season as umpires take a hardline stance on kicks that travel out of bounds, but the AFL believes the new interpretation is "tracking the right way".
A comparison of free kick statistics in the opening nine rounds of 2016 and 2017 has revealed a decrease in deliberate out of bounds decisions from 138 at this stage last year to 103 this year.
A number of trends are revealed in the Champion Data statistics, including a decrease in overall free kicks from 20.2 a game in 2016 to 18.4 a game in 2017.
The contentious holding the ball and incorrect disposal rules have seen little variation from 2016 to 2017.
Champion Data has recorded an increase in throwing the ball free kicks from 120 in 2016 to 167 this year.
However, it is not possible to guarantee 100 per cent accuracy when identifying if a free kick has been paid for holding the ball or incorrect disposal.
When the two categories are combined, there was just one fewer free kick paid in the opening nine rounds of 2017 (846) compared to last year, with an average of 5.28 a game.
There has been a sizable decrease in free kicks paid for high tackles in 2017, with a drop from 779 in 2016 to 571 this year (3.6 a game).
High tackles were the most common free kicks paid last year (4.8 a game), but they have been overtaken by holding the ball this year.
Richmond is revealed as the least disciplined team in the AFL, giving away 206 free kicks compared to 18th-ranked Collingwood's 132.
Club Total frees against Deliberate frees Goals conceded from frees
Richmond 206 8 12
Geelong 191 5 15
Sydney 188 3 18
GWS 185 10 11
Brisbane 181 10 15
Adelaide 175 7 15
Fremantle 166 6 16
Essendon 161 9 20
Melbourne 159 7 12
Port Adel. 158 3 10
St Kilda 158 3 8
Hawthorn 153 7 17
North Melb 153 4 18
Carlton 152 5 18
West Coast 147 3 11
W.Bulldogs 144 6 11
Gold Coast 137 4 25
Collingwood 132 3 8
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-05-26/hardline-stance-sends-deliberate-frees-down
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stuffen cheats!
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That deliberate rushed one is probably the worst one yet.
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Overall we had the best of the decisions tonight imo.
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That deliberate rushed one is probably the worst one yet.
Yep and Mark Stevens reporting AFL wont have problems ticking it off either. Becoming a joke.
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That deliberate rushed one is probably the worst one yet.
The umpire who paid that needs to be tarred and feathered, he had it in for us all night, probably had $5 on ess with sportsbet
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Contrary to others I thought the ump got that right... We had enough troops to clear it if Shorty grabbed the ball.
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He was running full steam from 50m to save a rolling ball and a player on his clacker, I can't see any way he could have picked that up.
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That deliberate rushed one is probably the worst one yet.
The umpire who paid that needs to be tarred and feathered, he had it in for us all night, probably had $5 on ess with sportsbet
Umpire number 11. Has been putrid all year :banghead
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He was running full steam from 50m to save a rolling ball and a player on his clacker, I can't see any way he could have picked that up.
This.
I would also add that if the chaser pulls up to cry to the ump for the free rather than attack the ball or player then it shouldn't be called deliberate.
Also tonight's incident was nothing like the Callum Mills one. Mills knocked the ball through from the top of the goalsquare (10m out). Short was only about one metre from the goal line.
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That deliberate rushed one is probably the worst one yet.
The umpire who paid that needs to be tarred and feathered, he had it in for us all night, probably had $5 on ess with sportsbet
Umpire number 11. Has been putrid all year :banghead
That's Deboy. Only umpired 18 AFL games and screwed us in 3 of them over the past month. IIRC this is the second time he's wrongly nailed Short for deliberate. The other time was that crap decision against the Dogs.
http://www.afl.com.au/umpires/profiles
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That deliberate rushed one is probably the worst one yet.
The umpire who paid that needs to be tarred and feathered, he had it in for us all night, probably had $5 on ess with sportsbet
Umpire number 11. Has been putrid all year :banghead
That's Deboy. Only umpired 18 AFL games and screwed us in 3 of them over the past month. IIRC this is the second time he's wrongly nailed Short for deliberate. The other time was that crap decision against the Dogs.
http://www.afl.com.au/umpires/profiles
Deboy is a stuffing cheat and we should ask for a formal investigation into his umpiring of our games.
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Worsfold in his presser said the decision was correct as it was perceived pressure and not physical pressure that Short was under. If that's the case then in similar circumstances as an attacker you just pull up at the last second and it becomes perceived pressure but I bet when we try it they won't call it.
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Gillon himself said it was the wrong decision. Said it right in front of me at half time. True.
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That deliberate rushed one is probably the worst one yet.
The umpire who paid that needs to be tarred and feathered, he had it in for us all night, probably had $5 on ess with sportsbet
Umpire number 11. Has been putrid all year :banghead
That's Deboy. Only umpired 18 AFL games and screwed us in 3 of them over the past month. IIRC this is the second time he's wrongly nailed Short for deliberate. The other time was that crap decision against the Dogs.
http://www.afl.com.au/umpires/profiles
Deboy is a stuffing cheat and we should ask for a formal investigation into his umpiring of our games.
was called a cheat by a caller tonight on the way home and you guessed it lloyd jumped to his defence.
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Worsfold in his presser said the decision was correct as it was perceived pressure and not physical pressure that Short was under. If that's the case then in similar circumstances as an attacker you just pull up at the last second and it becomes perceived pressure but I bet when we try it they won't call it.
Reiwoldt does this all the time when defenders are running towards the boundary - never once has it been paid deliberate
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The thing that was so wrong about the rushed decision was that Short had absolutely no hope of stopping or changing direction after running back into the goalsquare at top pace. Short got to the ball about 2mtrs inside the goal line going at top speed, is it even humanly possible to do anything else except run it through for a point?
Waiting for the AFL to have another sneaky meeting & change the interpretation, now that they have thrown us under the bus AGAIN! :banghead
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I'm the resident expert on the deliberate decision and I can confirm that the call was bordering on absurd
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If short had amazingly knocked it sideways and it went out, would that have been deliberate as well??
Pauline Hanson Please Explain Moment
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Dimma forgives umpire's rushed behind 'mistake'
afl.com.au
28 May 2017
RICHMOND coach Damien Hardwick refused to criticise the umpires for paying a controversial deliberate rushed behind free kick against Tigers defender Jayden Short just before half-time on Saturday night at the MCG.
The free kick was paid against Short after he won a foot race from 50 metres out to just metres from the goal line against Essendon's small forward Josh Green as the loose ball tumbled towards goal.
When Short slid into the ball and forced it across the line he was just a couple of metres ahead of Green who had given up the chase.
However, umpire Curtis Deboy decided it was a deliberate rushed behind and paid a free kick to Green, much to Hardwick's disbelief at the time as he was seen throwing his head back in the coaches box.
The resultant goal gave the Bombers the lead at half-time.
However, post-game, with the win in his hands, Hardwick was in a forgiving mood saying he suspected the umpire merely made an error.
"I think they made a mistake, end of story. That's it for mine," Hardwick said.
"It's tough. They have got a tough gig. You have got 85,000 people yelling one way or another. I guarantee you I would rather be playing than umpiring. They do a pretty good job."
Hardwick was asked how it compared with a controversial decision in round two when Sydney Swans' defender Callum Mills was penalised against the Western Bulldogs when he bashed the ball through the goals without being under obvious pressure.
"I am probably not there to judge, I'll let them clarify that. As long as they have got a fair understanding of what the rule is there, that will be fine," Hardwick said.
However, Essendon coach John Worsfold said he thought the decision was consistent with the direction the AFL had given before the season.
"The rule was if you rush it from outside the goalsquare, it's a free kick, (and) if you rush it from inside the goalsquare you have to be under physical pressure, which means a hand on you I'd assume, not perceived pressure," Worsfold said.
He said the decision had an effect on his team with Andy McGrath not rushing a ball in the third quarter when he should have forced it through, which enabled Tigers star Dusty Martin to kick a snap goal.
"We'll clarify it with our players exactly what the rule is," Worsfold said.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-05-27/coaches-not-quite-eye-to-eye-on-free-kick
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Here's a replay of the deliberate incident:
VIDEO: https://twitter.com/AFL/status/868415088931119105/video/1
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Deboy...
Before each game I find a quite moment to pray. FMD.
http://aflua.com.au/portfolio-items/curtis-deboy/
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If he picks up the ball and then gets tackled is he allowed to handball it through the goals?
If so then that's what he should've done.
But we will see the exact same thing next game and it won't be paid against.
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Dimmer can't even pronounce Castagna's name correctly.
He would have been told, just doesn't care to listen.
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Worsfold in his presser said the decision was correct as it was perceived pressure and not physical pressure that Short was under. If that's the case then in similar circumstances as an attacker you just pull up at the last second and it becomes perceived pressure but I bet when we try it they won't call it.
Reiwoldt does this all the time when defenders are running towards the boundary - never once has it been paid deliberate
This
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What a great look for the game where the opponent instead of making a contest instead pulls up and starts appealing for a free before Short has even touched the ball.
You have to really wonder what the stuff is going on when the rules are being played to instead of players playing football
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Spot on chuck, thats what you get when you change rules for the aesthetics of the game - you start stuffing with the very fabric of what made this game Great.
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If short had amazingly knocked it sideways and it went out, would that have been deliberate as well??
Pauline Hanson Please Explain Moment
The answer would be yes. Short was punished for his speed and desire to get to the ball before Green. Green pulls up and Short has no other choice but to do what he did and was at full pace. The rule is a disgrace because a defender has no other option. Short allows Green to get to the ball first he kicks a goal. Short gets to the ball first and Green gets a free kick and gets the goal. What the :banghead
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What the league wants is for short to knock the ball back into play even if it means a 95% chance of being a goal. Stupid rule and will be looked at. How can a player be rewarded for pulling back and obviously appealing to the umpire for a free kick? What a stuff up
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3 of the last 4 weeks we've had umpire number 11, Deboy
In each game he has paid "dubious" decision against us
The deliberate against Short -v- the dogs
The shepherd against Jack -v- Freo
And now last night's deliberate
While he has shown he is an average umpire
his case is not helped by the AFL's constant need to change rules and how they are umpired
league changes the rules and players get taught how to exploit the said rules as Green did last night... he pulled up so not to put an "pressure" on Short... disgraceful
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3 of the last 4 weeks we've had umpire number 11, Deboy
In each game he has paid "dubious" decision against us
The deliberate against Short -v- the dogs
The shepherd against Jack -v- Freo
And now last night's deliberate
While he has shown he is an average umpire
his case is not helped by the AFL's constant need to change rules and how they are umpired
league changes the rules and players get taught how to exploit the said rules as Green did last night... he pulled up so not to put an "pressure" on Short... disgraceful
Someone needs to have a chat to this Deboy bloke.
I'm sure someone knows someone that can have a quiet chat to him.
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Did Hayden Kennedy seriously say it was the right call? :gobdrop
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3 of the last 4 weeks we've had umpire number 11, Deboy
In each game he has paid "dubious" decision against us
The deliberate against Short -v- the dogs
The shepherd against Jack -v- Freo
And now last night's deliberate
While he has shown he is an average umpire
his case is not helped by the AFL's constant need to change rules and how they are umpired
league changes the rules and players get taught how to exploit the said rules as Green did last night... he pulled up so not to put an "pressure" on Short... disgraceful
Also the umpire who ran 60 metres to overrule a decision and award a free kick against v Footscray
The club is weak as urine if they haven't put in a formal complaint to the AFL about him behind the scenes...
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Reckon this call is also what lead Astbury to over run the ball and leak an easy goal. It looked pathetic but he probably had NO clue what he could do in that situation. The AFL is to blame for what was two pathetic pieces of play
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Reckon this call is also what lead Astbury to over run the ball and leak an easy goal. It looked pathetic but he probably had NO clue what he could do in that situation. The AFL is to blame for what was two pathetic pieces of play
I think you are being a little generous to Astbury. He just had an "Astbury" moment. Minimum of one a game guaranteed.
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'There's still confusion': Cotchin questions call
afl.com.au
28 May 2017
RICHMOND skipper Trent Cotchin believes the hotly-debated deliberate rushed behind free kick paid against the Tigers has created even more confusion amongst players.
The ambiguous rule was thrust back into the spotlight when Richmond defender Jayden Short was penalised during Saturday night's clash against Essendon at the MCG.
With the Tigers two points ahead late in the first half, Short guided James Stewart's bouncing long bomb over the Bombers' goal line, only to be pinged for a deliberate rushed behind.
Replays showed Short was hard done by, with Essendon forward Josh Green - who slotted the resulting free kick - chasing him all the way into the goal square.
The decision handed the Bombers a narrow half-time lead before the Tigers regrouped to claim a 11.15 (81) to 10.6 (66) victory.
"I think what we're getting out of this is that there is still confusion," Cotchin said on 3AW on Sunday.
"If I was 'Shorty' I probably would have done the same thing and would have felt pretty hard done by, by the call.
"But they're the adjudicators of the game ... that's the hardest thing when you leave it up to interpretation I suppose.
"I don't think there's any worse position to be in running back towards the opposition goal and not knowing what sort of heat is behind you ... especially when Green pulls up.
"We're trying to encourage people to just play the footy and the one person who did that got pinged."
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-05-28/theres-still-confusion-cotchin-questions-call
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Its just stupid that we are telling players to disguise taking the ball over the line or bring contact on themselves so you get physical pressure. How complicated do we want it.
Either let players rush behinds or keep it exactly the same as the boundary rule, which case in point would have still been deliberate but Short wouldn't have been confused in what to do, he never would have done that if it was the boundary line because the rule is clear.
Also think that the penalty is ridiculously unfair for something that has a large grey area. Ball it up. It still achieves what the rule makers want which is no rush behinds but the penalty of a goal is just ridiculous.
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Reckon this call is also what lead Astbury to over run the ball and leak an easy goal. It looked pathetic but he probably had NO clue what he could do in that situation. The AFL is to blame for what was two pathetic pieces of play
I think you are being a little generous to Astbury. He just had an "Astbury" moment. Minimum of one a game guaranteed.
Perhaps. I think most players wouldn't have managed to stuff that up but Astbury's normal moments were probably compounded by the earlier call
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It did effect his headspace but the bottom line is, it shouldn't have.
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league changes the rules and players get taught how to exploit the said rules as Green did last night... he pulled up so not to put an "pressure" on Short... disgraceful
You are giving the Bombers too much credit, they are not that smart.
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Rohan Connolly's view:
Might be in the minority here, but I didn't mind the free kick paid against Richmond's Jayden Short for that deliberate rushed behind on Saturday night. Fact is the umpires set the precedent when they penalised Sydney's Callum Mills similarly back in round two, though Short clearly was running at a faster clip. Yes, he would almost certainly have been nailed in the tackle by Josh Green had he not rushed a behind. That though, is OK, provided the umpires are prepared to afford players in such situations a little more largesse than usual. There's a great good here, namely, in an era of low scores, putting the onus on defenders as much as possible to keep the ball alive and not offer them yet another safety net.
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/rohan-connollys-last-word-on-round-10-20170528-gwf1fq.html
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Wtf, another safety net? Defenders have nothing
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When the coach doesn’t know the rules, what hope for players?
Patrick Smith
The Australian
29 May 2017
When a senior coach doesn’t know the rules, what hope is there for his players to be across them?
That’s the wash-up from Saturday night’s decision to award Essendon an easy goal for a deliberate rushed behind by Tigers player Jayden Short just before halftime at the MCG in Richmond’s 15-point win.
After the Tigers ended a four-game losing streak to remain inside the top eight, coach Damien Hardwick said he believed field umpire Curtis Deboy made an error in presenting Essendon’s Josh Green with a goal.
“I think they made a mistake, end of story,” he said. “That’s it for mine.”
The AFL has stood by the decision under the new interpretations of the rule. Under law 15.8.1, the umpires will work to one or more of four criteria when awarding a free kick.
1. A player cannot rush a behind if he is outside the top of the kick off line (9m) and its extension to the behind posts;
2. A player who has time and space in which to dispose of the ball cannot rush a behind;
3. A player who is not considered under immediate physical pressure cannot rush a behind (work on fact, not perceived);
4. From a ruck contest, if an opposition ruck hits the ball on the full through for a point, then this will be adjudicated as a deliberate rushed behind.
Saturday night’s free kick was paid against Short after he sprinted back towards goal from about 50m to a stationary ball that sat just short of the goal line.
Green was also in pursuit but was several metres behind Short when the Richmond player approached the ball and after giving up the chase, was not putting any physical pressure on the Tigers player.
Short slid in and appeared to knock the ball over the line without assessing his options to clear it.
The resultant goal gave the Bombers the lead at halftime in what was a tight contest right up to the final few minutes despite Richmond’s dominant second half and their 10 more scoring shots.
Hardwick should have known better than to call the decision wrong. As explained by the AFL to The Australian, the decision on whether the player is not considered under immediate physical pressure, is determined only by the umpire.
Hardwick was asked how the decision compared with a similar ruling in round two when Swans defender Callum Mills was penalised against the Western Bulldogs when he tapped the ball through the goals from the goal square without being under physical pressure.
“I am probably not there to judge, I’ll let them clarify that. As long as they have got a fair understanding of what the rule is there, that will be fine,” was his puzzling reply.
Essendon coach John Worsfold got it right when he said the decision was consistent with the direction the AFL had given before the season. “The rule was if you rush it from outside the goal square, it’s a free kick, if you rush it from inside the goal square you have to be under physical pressure, which means a hand on you, I’d assume, not perceived pressure,” Worsfold said.
The harsh penalty is another story. That argument of whether the penalty is too severe was put to the clubs in the pre-season and their reaction was not enough to lessen the result to a ball-up instead of a free kick. In February, the AFL said: “A player will still be allowed to prevent a goal from being scored when the ball is close to the line and no other alternatives are available.”
During the opening two rounds of the JLT series, the league trialled a more lenient penalty for any deliberate rushed behind, whereby a point would be awarded and the ball would be thrown up five metres in front of the goal square.
The AFL football department then canvassed clubs, but their response was not considered strong enough to revert to the more lenient of the two penalties.
“There are no plans to implement this amendment for the 2017 season, unless it was deemed a success and there was very strong support from clubs to do so,” it said.
“The free kick will be taken on the scoring line where the ball was rushed through as it was for 2016.”
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/sport/afl/when-the-coach-doesnt-know-the-rules-what-hope-for-players/news-story/bf3ab1d44e37a02d07663b7009474722
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Wtf, another safety net? Defenders have nothing
Exactly what Richo said in his commentary during the game.
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Has Fatprick finally dumped us and gone back to supporting Essendon?
Hope so.....bad enough having Caro amongst our ranks....
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RULE TEST: 'ARE YOU GOING TO MAKE THAT DECISION IN THE GRAND FINAL?'
By Jay Clark
Herald-Sun
29 May 2017
PREMIERSHIP coach Paul Roos says there is “no possible way” an umpire would pay a tough deliberate rushed behind free kick on Grand Final day.
Roos said he believed the controversial call against Richmond’s Jayden Short against Essendon on Saturday night was correct under the current rule.
The AFL wants to encourage players to keep the ball in play and has already ticked off on the deliberate rushed behind decision.
But Roos said it was almost impossible for players in Short’s position to determine how much pressure they were under on the goal line unless they “had eyes in the back of their head”.
Roos was adamant umpires would not pay the same free kick in the premiership decider.
“If we are sitting at a Grand Final at the end of this year and that decision determines the outcome of that Grand Final, how does our brand look? How do we look as a sport?” Roos said on Triple M.
“Every rule should be based on ‘are you going to make that decision in a Grand Final and if you do make the decision are we happy with that decision in a Grand Final?'
“There is no way known that decision is going to get made in a Grand Final. No possible way."
Players can take the ball over the score line if they are under actual physical pressure.
The player in pursuit of Short, Essendon’s Josh Green, slowed up and appealed to the umpire as the Tigers’ goal sneak took the all over the score line.
Green won the free kick and kicked a goal.
Roos said it was tough for players in Short’s position to know how much actual pressure they were under.
“I don’t know how a player can determine with a bloke screaming behind him whether he is under pressure or not,” he said.
“Because in all reality that player would have thought he was under pressure. He hasn’t got eyes in the back of his head.”
Roos said the rule was an overreaction to Hawthorn players overstepping the goal line to maintain possession a record 11 times against Geelong in the 2008 Grand Final win.
“None of us want to see that, but all of a sudden (it is) overkill (it is) ridiculous, and now we are going to the extreme. I don’t want to see that in a Grand Final,” he said.
North Melbourne champion Wayne Carey backed the call, but also queried whether it would be paid under finals pressure.
He said “there was so much grey in our game” in relation to the rules.
“In front of 100,000 people do they (umpires) pay that?” Carey asked. “They should, but will they?
“I thought the decision was the right one.
“I thought he (Short) had an option to pick the ball up, because he could have got tackled over the line anyway.”
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/more-news/afl-daily-live-rolling-footy-news-from-around-australia/news-story/86e5baf9942333d0dc6fa700fc86f2de
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KB'S SIMPLE SOLUTION FOR DELIBERATE RULE 'LACK OF COMMON SENSE'
AFL Hall of Fame legend Kevin Bartlett has a simple solution for the "total confusion" caused by the deliberate rushed behind rule.
After Richmond's Jayden Short was penalised for a deliberate rushed behind against Essendon on Saturday night, debate has raged over whether it was the right call and brought into question the harshness of the penalty.
Essendon's Josh Green was awarded the free kick and shot on goal from directly in front on the goal line and was obviously no chance of missing.
Bartlett, who played 403 career games, says a shot on goal should no longer be the penalty.
"The players are so confused with this rule and what pressure is," he said on SEN.
"It seems the simplest remedy for this lack of common sense and total confusion is that when a deliberate rushed behind is paid, it stands as a point and then the ball is bounced five metres from the top of the square.
"With that, everyone (from) players, spectators and umpires would all be on the same page and not confused."
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/more-news/afl-daily-live-rolling-footy-news-from-around-australia/news-story/86e5baf9942333d0dc6fa700fc86f2de
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AFL contemplates response to uproar over deliberate rushed behind rule
Anthony Colangelo
The Age
29 May 2017
The AFL's umpiring department is considering a position on the weekend's deliberate rushed behind controversy, as an AFL great called for the penalty imposed for the infringement to change.
Debate around the rule exploded on Saturday night when Richmond's Jayden Short was penalised for a deliberate rushed behind during his side's clash with Essendon.
Short, who chased a kick into Essendon's open 50m arc pursued by the Bombers' Josh Green, chose to knock the ball through for a rushed behind from one metre out.
During most of the pair's 60m chase Green was sprinting behind Short, however once close to goal, Green hung back from his Richmond opponent.
The umpire presumably ruled that Short was not under "immediate physical pressure" when rushing the behind, therefore paying a free kick.
However many criticised the decision and the interpretation of the rule, arguing that Short couldn't know Green had stopped pressuring him because Green was behind him.
The umpiring department was working through its regular review of each game on Monday morning, and if needed, would issue a statement should they deem clarification on the rushed behind rule be needed.
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/afl-contemplates-response-to-uproar-over-deliberate-rushed-behind-rule-20170529-gwf8h7.html
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From Robbo's "Likes/Dislikes" column today:
2. DELIBERATE
THE rule is wrong. Jayden Short and Josh Green were running full tilt. Short was faster than Green, he busted his gut to best Green and Green took the easy option to stop and play for the free kick. It’s kind of cheating the spirit of the game. He gave up and won the free kick. People will say it was smart. I reckon it’s wrong. Short had noise, drama and pressure all over him as he chased the bouncing ball and knocked it through for a behind. All he knows is he’s under pressure. All of us know Green pulled out. The AFL rules look after the ball player, but not in this situation. It is a contradiction to what the game is about. The AFL was right to strengthen the rule this year, but didn’t count on players exploiting it and being encouraged to exploit it. It’s not right.
Jayden Short can’t believe umpire Curtis DeBoy’s rushed behind decision.
3. YES AND NO
SOCIAL media went berserk as expected and opinions varied. Here’s a snapshot ...
Kane Cornes.
Former umpire Matt Head.
Corey McKernan.
Former coach Robert Shaw
Cameron Ling on 3AW was fiercely opposed to the decision.
Clearly there’s an issue with the footy world split on the decision.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/expert-opinion/mark-robinson/indigenous-stars-light-up-indigenous-round-as-more-umpiring-controversy-splits-the-afl/news-story/da7ba41ef0fa980132e93e48f9bb87fe
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“I thought he (Short) had an option to pick the ball up, because he could have got tackled over the line anyway.”
Yeah and would have probably been called holding the ball. Short was screwed no matter what he did. His only option was to just lay on the ground in front of the ball, without touching it, so Green couldn't soccer it through and what a blight on the game that would be...
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How to fix the deliberate rushed behind
Michael Randall,
Herald Sun
Superfooty podcast
May 29, 2017 2:43pm
IT’S the rule that has divided the footy world.
The deliberate rushed behind.
And it sent fans into meltdown on the weekend when Richmond’s Jayden Short was penalised for pushing the ball through after Essendon speedster Josh Green put the brakes on as they approached the goal late in the second quarter of Dreamtime at the ‘G.
The Bombers were awarded a free kick from the square, which Green duly slotted, turning a two-point Tigers’ lead into a four point deficit, right on the stroke of halftime.
The penalty of a guaranteed goal is too severe, Mick Warner said on the SuperFooty Podcast, and he has the perfect solution.
“The goal is too much,” Warner said.
“Give them the point and ball it up at the top of the square, which we trialled in the NAB Cup.
“No one’s going to worry about it.
“There is an argument that Short should have kept it in, but the penalty doesn’t fit the crime.
“(Ball it up and) It could be a seven-point (play) and then you get a chance to lock it in to your forward line.”
Lauren Wood called for clarity from the AFL around the umpires’ interpretation of the rule.
“We absolutely need some clarity on this,” Lauren said.
“Because my Twitter timeline, it was completely split in those two minutes after the decision and I reckon that’s a perfect indication.
“If you’ve got half of them saying ‘disgraceful’ and the other half saying ‘no, correct’, well clearly we need some light shed on it.”
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/more-news/how-to-fix-the-deliberate-rushed-behind-with-the-superfooty-podcast/news-story/1717d401b44e2e0acf9cc2975c54ba06
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We're finally off the bottom of the 'free kick' ladder.
Team P W L D Pts FF FA % Movement
W.Bulldogs 10 7 2 1 30 199 155 128.39% 0
North Melb 11 7 3 1 30 229 191 119.90% 0
Collingwood 11 7 3 1 30 186 171 108.77% 0
West Coast 11 6 5 0 24 193 169 114.20% 2
Fremantle 11 5 4 2 24 203 203 100.00% -1
Port Adelaide 10 6 4 0 24 196 199 98.49% 6
Essendon 11 5 5 1 22 196 197 99.49% -2
Carlton 10 5 5 0 20 190 175 108.57% -1
Brisbane 10 5 5 0 20 209 201 103.98% -1
Melbourne 10 4 4 2 20 176 173 101.73% -1
Gold Coast 10 4 4 2 20 167 166 100.60% -1
St Kilda 10 5 5 0 20 173 173 100.00% -1
Geelong 11 4 6 1 18 218 230 94.78% 2
Adelaide 11 4 6 1 18 204 219 93.15% -1
Hawthorn 11 4 7 0 16 177 192 92.19% -1
Richmond 11 4 7 0 16 194 235 82.55% 1
GWS 11 4 7 0 16 178 218 81.65% 1
Sydney 10 3 7 0 12 178 199 89.45% -2
http://footyprophet.com/free-kick-ladder-r11-top-dogs-take-lowly-swans/
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We're finally off the bottom of the 'free kick' ladder.
Team P W L D Pts FF FA % Movement
W.Bulldogs 10 7 2 1 30 199 155 128.39% 0
North Melb 11 7 3 1 30 229 191 119.90% 0
Collingwood 11 7 3 1 30 186 171 108.77% 0
West Coast 11 6 5 0 24 193 169 114.20% 2
Fremantle 11 5 4 2 24 203 203 100.00% -1
Port Adelaide 10 6 4 0 24 196 199 98.49% 6
Essendon 11 5 5 1 22 196 197 99.49% -2
Carlton 10 5 5 0 20 190 175 108.57% -1
Brisbane 10 5 5 0 20 209 201 103.98% -1
Melbourne 10 4 4 2 20 176 173 101.73% -1
Gold Coast 10 4 4 2 20 167 166 100.60% -1
St Kilda 10 5 5 0 20 173 173 100.00% -1
Geelong 11 4 6 1 18 218 230 94.78% 2
Adelaide 11 4 6 1 18 204 219 93.15% -1
Hawthorn 11 4 7 0 16 177 192 92.19% -1
Richmond 11 4 7 0 16 194 235 82.55% 1
GWS 11 4 7 0 16 178 218 81.65% 1
Sydney 10 3 7 0 12 178 199 89.45% -2
http://footyprophet.com/free-kick-ladder-r11-top-dogs-take-lowly-swans/
Bulldogs Sydney tonight will be an interesting one to watch. More of the same or a premeditated correction?
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Richmond gave away 33 free kicks today, comfortably eclipsing its previous season high of 28. Only three players for the Tigers did not give away a free kick today.
Frees for:
Richmond 25
GWS 33
http://www.afl.com.au/match-centre/2017/18/rich-v-gws
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The number 8 was whistle happy all day, absolute muppet with no feel of the game, paid soft free kicks all day. Number 32 wasn't far behind in the second half
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The number 8 was whistle happy all day, absolute muppet with no feel of the game, paid soft free kicks all day. Number 32 wasn't far behind in the second half
This.
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The number 8 was whistle happy all day, absolute muppet with no feel of the game, paid soft free kicks all day. Number 32 wasn't far behind in the second half
8 is Roaeberry and I've always thought he's the best in the business
But he was deplorable today.
22 frees in the first qtr sums up how pathetic they were
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The number 8 was whistle happy all day, absolute muppet with no feel of the game, paid soft free kicks all day. Number 32 wasn't far behind in the second half
8 is Roaeberry nad I've always thought he's the best in the business
But he was deplorable today.
22 frees in the first qtr sums up how pathetic they were
My mate said the same, reckons he's the best in the business but had a shocker today
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Suddenly calls for throws when I've always thought we've been the worst team at not exploiting the rule :lol
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What about the call on Rance in the last quarter for deliberate out of bounce when he managed to get in front of his leading opponent to a ball that dropped short and half vollied the footy and it went out.
Unbelievable!
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What about the call on Rance in the last quarter for deliberate out of bounce when he managed to get in front of his leading opponent to a ball that dropped short and half vollied the footy and it went out.
Unbelievable!
Jumped out of my seat when he payed that deliberate. One of the worst decisions I have seen and I have seen plenty :banghead
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What about the call on Rance in the last quarter for deliberate out of bounce when he managed to get in front of his leading opponent to a ball that dropped short and half vollied the footy and it went out.
Unbelievable!
I didn't see today's game (I live interstate), but I am certain that decision made the highlights of the game shown on our local TV news!
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The problem with that decision against Rance was not so much that he paid it but the fact that numerous opportunities to ping players for deliberate were overlooked today.
Consistency is a must.
I feel the game was over officiated but everyone will see it differently.
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AFL looks closely at abnormal number of free kicks paid in round 18
Sam McClure
The Age
25 July 2017
AFL umpires boss Peter Schwab admits his department concentrated on two games during their weekly review, after an unusually high number of free kicks across the weekend.
According to Champion Data statistics, there were 43.3 free kicks per game in round 18, the most in any round this season.
It comes off the back of 40.7 in round 17; the third most.
There were 61 frees paid in Friday night's match between Adelaide and Geelong, and 58 in Sunday's game between Richmond and Greater Western Sydney.
They rank one and two respectively for the highest free kick games so far this season.
"When you get that many free kicks, they're a little bit of an outlier to the rest of the week," Schwab told Channel 7's Talking Footy.
"It was certainly discussed. I guess it's like anything, if there are a high number of free kicks or a low number you look through them, and see if they are all there.
"We're pretty much satisfied in the Geelong v Adelaide game, even though there were a lot of free kicks, that most of them were warranted.
"The GWS v Richmond game was probably a little bit more concerning as far as whether we got them as right as we wanted to. But I think after quarter time it seemed to settle down."
Crows coach Don Pyke admitted after the game that he was "perplexed" by some of the free kicks paid in the game against Geelong, but wouldn't go into specifics.
Schwab said that he would continue to keep in contact with all clubs whenever clarification of decisions was required.
"We have open dialogue, but I haven't spoken to Don.
"We would speak to most clubs, some clubs a bit more than others but I'm not prepared to say who or when," Schwab smirked.
Schwab said the umpiring department is always working to improve, but believed after 18 rounds his group was now officiating games on a consistent basis.
"The holding the ball and the marking contest are still the two key areas (we're concentrating on), because statistically they're the areas we umpires the most in. They probably make up half of the decisions in any game."
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/afl-looks-closely-at-abnormal-amount-of-free-kicks-paid-in-round-18-20170724-gxhu1o.html
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lol the stench has hit the nostrils of the AFL Maybe we will see some decent stuffing umpiring from now on.
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No doubt the interpretation of HTB decisions will change yet again this week. Think clubs almost need to meet with the umpire department every week just to know what the focus is on for the upcoming game. Could be the difference early in games if one side adapts quicker than the other.
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No doubt the interpretation of HTB decisions will change yet again this week. Think clubs almost need to meet with the umpire department every week just to know what the focus is on for the upcoming game. Could be the difference early in games if one side adapts quicker than the other.
Sides keep a close eye on how friday night football is umpired to gauge the 'trend of the week' from the umpiring faculty
Its a stuffing joke
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Free Kick Differential after R21.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHPAg2-U0AAaAb5.jpg)
https://twitter.com/Tommy10cents/status/897272818869587968
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That is so damned poor it's ridiculous. There's no way a side can be so ill-disciplined that they are so far in arrears of the next team.
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We are nearly double the next as well. It's telling. Compare Geelong's frees for compared to our frees against and that's our last game in a nut shell.
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We have been bent over and impaled
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I think that the AFL needs to look at umpire Shaftmaster and umpire Gravelfaust and ask the hard question about why we get pumped in the pooper so much
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New season but the same story as last year - The Tigers with the worst free kick differential after 4 rounds:
Free Kick Differential Ladder - Round 4
Which team is on top?
MMM
17 April 2018
1.Collingwood +22 (105 for, 83 against)
2.Western Bulldogs +20 (90, 70)
3.Brisbane Lions +19 (102, 83)
4.Adelaide +12 (81, 69)
5.Port Adelaide +8 (84, 76)
5.West Coast +8 (92, 84)
7.North Melbourne +7 (92, 85)
8.Essendon +2 (77, 75)
9.Sydney 0 (87, 87)
10.Melbourne -1 (90, 91)
11.Carlton -5 (91, 96)
12.Geelong -7 (87, 94)
12.Hawthorn -7 (90, 97)
14.Fremantle -12 (75, 87)
14.Gold Coast -12 (87, 99)
16.St Kilda -17 (77, 94)
17.GWS -18 (73, 91)
18.Richmond -19 (79, 98)
https://www.triplem.com.au/sport/afl/news/free-kick-differential-ladder-round-4-2018
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Still last by a long way on the free kick differential ladder:
Free Kick Differential Ladder - Round 8
Which team is on top?
MMM
15 May 2018
1.Collingwood +35 (187 for, 152 against)
2.North Melbourne +30 (193, 163)
2.Western Bulldogs +30 (173, 143)
4.Adelaide +25 (161, 136)
5.West Coast +22 (180, 158)
6.Brisbane Lions +19 (185, 166)
7.Geelong +10 (175, 165)
7.Melbourne +10 (178, 168)
9.Carlton +4 (172, 168)
10.Port Adelaide -3 (162, 165)
11.Hawthorn -5 (168, 173)
12.Sydney -16 (159, 175)
13.Gold Coast -20 (169, 189)
14.St Kilda -21 (147, 168)
15.Essendon -22 (144, 166)
16.Fremantle -26 (150, 176)
16.GWS -26 (147, 173)
18.Richmond -46 (158, 204)
https://www.triplem.com.au/sport/afl/news/afl-free-kick-differential-ladder-round-8-2018
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It's time we went to the league with this. Maybe Dimma needs a secret meeting with Gil.
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We're a genuine outlier there. Not going to come in much this week playing the umpires darlings.
Although, it is fun reading oppo comments whining about losing to us soley cause of the umpires!
#(wheresthe)freekickrichmond
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Needs an extra column for free kicks missed to fit in instances like the five straight tackles we put on north players who either dropped or threw it right before Rance gets driven in the back and pinged for HTB.
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#thrownunderthebus ... once again ... ::)
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Is it possible our frenetic pressure game style leads to a high number of free kicks against? Just looking at it, we’re about a middle of the road team when it comes to frees for but our frees against is what’s killing us. Don’t get me wrong the umpiring is horrible atm but that goes for both teams on the field with the odd game where a homecrowd influences the ump in favour of the Home team. I just find it hard to believe that the umpires have singled us out for a 2 year vendetta for no apparent reason. How was our free kick count prior to 2017?
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Is it possible our frenetic pressure game style leads to a high number of free kicks against? Just looking at it, we’re about a middle of the road team when it comes to frees for but our frees against is what’s killing us. Don’t get me wrong the umpiring is horrible atm but that goes for both teams on the field with the odd game where a homecrowd influences the ump in favour of the Home team. I just find it hard to believe that the umpires have singled us out for a 2 year vendetta for no apparent reason. How was our free kick count prior to 2017?
Its just Tiger hate
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Is it possible our frenetic pressure game style leads to a high number of free kicks against? Just looking at it, we’re about a middle of the road team when it comes to frees for but our frees against is what’s killing us. Don’t get me wrong the umpiring is horrible atm but that goes for both teams on the field with the odd game where a homecrowd influences the ump in favour of the Home team. I just find it hard to believe that the umpires have singled us out for a 2 year vendetta for no apparent reason. How was our free kick count prior to 2017?
FF FA Ranking FA Ranking FF Tackles + Ranking
2018 19.8 25.5 18th 14th 65.6 9th
2017 18.8 21.1 18th 10th 69.7 7th
2016 19.2 20.0 14th 8th 60.1 18th
2015 21.9 18.8 12th 1st 57.5 17th
2014 19.0 18.6 18th 1st 63.3 14th
2013 18.7 18.5 12th 7th 56.0 18th
Source: https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/fts_team_rankings?type=TA&year=2018&sby=9
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The club should come out before this weeks game and mention the free kick differential we have had to date this year. Putting it on the agenda so the AFL and the unpiring department know the footballing world will be looking closely this weekend at a game on a ground with a crowd that influencences the umpires decisions. Win, lose or draw, all we want is an impartial umpiring group on Sunday.
I find it impossible that we can lose the free kick count every week.
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The club should come out before this weeks game and mention the free kick differential we have had to date this year. Putting it on the agenda so the AFL and the unpiring department know the footballing world will be looking closely this weekend at a game on a ground with a crowd that influencences the umpires decisions. Win, lose or draw, all we want is an impartial umpiring group on Sunday.
I find it impossible that we can lose the free kick count every week.
That’s more of a hawthorn thing to do.....
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Yeah Hardwick's no Clarkson..... :shh
....watch Rance, Astbury, Grimes & Vlastuin cop it from the umps for the rest of the year now....while the defenders who double team Riewoldt every week continue to go unpunished....as they have for the last - oh seems like 5 years.... :shh :shh
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Free kick facts: Who gets 'em, who gives 'em away?
Jennifer Phelan
alf.com.au
31 May 2018
RICHMOND
Frees for per game: 18.2 (18th)
Frees against: 24.4 (1st)
Differential: -6.2 (18th)
Most free kicks for: Toby Nankervis and Alex Rance (16, equal 24th) 2017: Trent Cotchin and Alex Rance (45, 4th)
Most free kicks against: Toby Nankervis (27, 1st) 2017: Dustin Martin (44, 3rd)
Three free kick facts:
1. The Tigers have won 25.5 per cent of their free kicks from holding the ball infringements, which is the third-highest in the League behind St Kilda (26.3 per cent) and Essendon (25.9).
2. Most of their free kicks for have been won in the midfield. They're fourth in the competition with 69.6 per cent of their free kicks being won between the arcs, but have been awarded just 14.9 per cent in defence, which is the third-lowest of all 18 teams.
3. Toby Nankervis has given away the most free kicks in the competition this season, and, across 2017 and the opening 10 rounds of 2018, has been penalised the most for holding the man with 27 of his 64 free kicks awarded for that reason.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-05-30/free-kick-facts-who-gets-em-who-gives-em-away
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Since 2011, West Coast has won 60 of 72 free kick counts when playing against travelling teams at home.
https://www.sen.com.au/news/2018/06/05/afl-cant-ignore-eagles-free-kicks-says-former-umpires-boss/
:chuck
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They are crazy numbers!
The AFL needs to do something. Those numbers are completely unexceptable imo.
The umpires need to be better than to allow a bit of noise to sway the free kick count so badly.
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It's only been happening for 15 years lol #freekickEagles :whistle
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/De5_LIJV4AAMJ7j.jpg)
https://twitter.com/George_BigFooty/with_replies
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Some 2005-05 treatment from the umps would be nice
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Some 2005-05 treatment from the umps would be nice
And yet if you take 04-05 out of the count (2 seasons where we really set the footy world on fire.....) then we drop to about 16th on the table.
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The umps like Cotch it seems compared to Dusty who gets a rough deal.
Games Frees For / Against Diff
Trent Cotchin (Rich) 208 374 219 +155 ......... 4th best in the AFL
Dustin Martin (Rich) 189 174 266 -92 ............ 3rd worst in the AFL
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-06-08/top-cat-purring-as-umpires-biggest-pet
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It’s black and white, Collingwood’s on top of the free kick ladder
SAM EDMUND,
Herald Sun
June 27, 2018
IT doesn’t have a hashtag, but it’s real.
Two years after #freekickhawthorn exploded into the AFL vernacular, Collingwood is quietly getting the rub of the green with the umpires.
A State of the Nation assessment of who the whistles after favouring 14 rounds into the season has put the Magpies on top of the free kick tree.
Collingwood has been awarded 306 free kicks so far this season and 244 against, giving it a league-high free kick differential of +62.
Red-hot ruckman Brodie Grundy leads the way with 31 frees.
The Pies get more frees than any other side in the defensive 50 and also through the midfield where Grundy has been a towering force. In a season where most things are finally going right for Nathan Buckley and co. they have been the umpires’ pet.
West Coast is second at +57, while North Melbourne’s Cinderella season has it third at +48.
But no club has profited more favourably from direct umpiring decisions than Melbourne.
The Demons have kicked an AFL-high 29 goals from free kicks.
There’s not many gifts on offer at Essendon, who have only kicked an AFL-low 11 majors as a result of umpire intervention.
On the flip side, umpiring decisions have cost Carlton more than any other club, with the Blues conceding 32 goals directly from free kicks — two more than the next-worst, Gold Coast.
Curiously, premier and ladder-leader Richmond, have had the worst run with officials this year.
The Tigers have a free kick differential of -70 — a whopping 22 more than their closest rival Greater Western Sydney (-48). One theory is that Richmond’s frenzied pressure game, while regularly overwhelming its opposition each week, also causes some collateral damage via the whistleblowers.
Free kick ladder
Club Frees for Frees against Differential
Collingwood 306 244 +62
West Coast 305 248 +57
North Melbourne 313 265 +48
Brisbane Lions 307 269 +38
Adelaide 265 228 +37
W.Bulldogs 290 253 +37
Carlton 295 286 +9
Hawthorn 283 275 +8
Melbourne 280 284 -4
Geelong 292 297 -5
Gold Coast 293 308 -15
Port Adelaide 280 299 -19
Sydney 271 296 -25
St Kilda 243 277 -34
Essendon 246 284 -38
Fremantle 235 274 -39
GWS Giants 243 291 -48
Richmond 243 313 -70
When it comes to which forward gets the most favourable run with the officials inside 50m, Ben Brown is the man. North Melbourne’s lead-up big man just keeps presenting and just keeps drawing frees.
Collingwood may sit atop the free kick ladder, but defender Lynden Dunn would have a different take. No player has given away more free kicks in the defensive 50 than the Pies’ veteran stopper.
Sydney’s Dane Rampe (11) and Carlton’s Cameron O’Shea (10) are also guilty of copping the wrong end of the whistle.
In the midfield, Carlton wrecking ball Patrick Cripps’ relentless pursuit of the hard ball has seen him rewarded more than any other player.
MOST FREES INSIDE 50M
Ben Brown North Melbourne 14
Eric Hipwood Brisbane Lions 12
Josh Kennedy West Coast 10
Jeremy Cameron GWS 10
Charlie Dixon Port Adelaide 9
MOST FREE AGAINST DEFENSIVE 50M
Lynden Dunn Collingwood 12
Dane Rampe Sydney 11
Cameron O’Shea Carlton 10
Alex Rance Richmond 9
Darcy Gardiner Brisbane Lions 8
MOST FREES IN MIDFIELD
Patrick Cripps Carlton 35
Stefan Martin Brisbane Lions 34
Joel Selwood Geelong 30
Patrick Dangerfield Geelong 26
Brodie Grundy Collingwood 25
https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/expert-opinion/its-black-and-white-collingwood-on-top-of-the-free-kick-ladder/news-story/18ee0d42510aadedbb23fb0a5d7c10e3
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Stuffing maggots
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Gez that ladder says it all -70 frees for joke.
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None of these jounalist are pointing to the 3 real reasons this is occurring in my view/opinion.
1) The Umps hate us full stop.
2) Staging for free kicks has become a artform that certain sides practice at training. Geelong in particular are known for it... The Selwood magotfield stats confirm this.
3) The umpires are clearly controlling and changing the momentum of games via free kicks. Why???
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It's not just our games. Sydney beat the Eagles at the scg via hometown free kicks.
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I blame Whoreforn! When they were on the three-peat they got helped over the line so often the #freekickhawthorn tag was created to highlight the favouritism. Now that we are reigning premier every umpire under the sun wants to butcher us to look like they aren't just favouring the reigning premiers! #freekickagainstrichmond
:banghead
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So how does that explain us also being 18th for free kicks by a big margin last year before we were premiers? :shh
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I’ll give up the free kick count so long as we retain the pressure based, contested style of football that won us the flag.
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Up to a 150 free-kick differential difference now between us and Collingwood ::).
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dh0NAknU8AAI2Wn.jpg)
https://twitter.com/adam_voigt/status/1016983399683092481
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I’ll give up the free kick count so long as we retain the pressure based, contested style of football that won us the flag.
I agree with this, also think that it maybe a bit of a tactic to set up play. Professional free kicks some may call it.
My issue with us giving them away isn't a problem. My issue is the ones we don't get paid! It's an absolute joke! Really frustrating at times!
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Definitely the umps seem to be paying particular types of frees to others but when you see an almost identical instance for our players it goes unrewarded for us only.
Umpires are only human so sometimes i wonder about the opposition's underdog element in assocation with the tall poppy syndrome now we are premiers.
As everyone has said its all about consistency, i dont mind if they get decisions wrong but get it wrong for both teams.
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I don't see the problem here.
We are obviously a bunch of snipers and thugs.
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The good thing is finals are generally umpired better with less soft free kicks given as last seasons final series showed. I don’t mind if that happens again
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Rohan Connolly asked umpire Jacob Mollison about our worst in the league free kick differential and Mollison said he couldn't explain why. He said they don't notice it out on the field and the umps just pay the frees that are there.
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The Sydney game for me had some of the worst umpiring of the year imo. The numbers weren’t that bad from memory, I think we lost the count by 7 or so, but it was more the ones we didn’t get, that they got.
I would like to see Cotch as captain say something occasionally during a game. It shows great restraint not to, but sometimes it’s just blatant cheating and something needs to be said.
Just because we are winning shouldn’t excuse the fact.
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Just because we are winning shouldn’t excuse the fact.
That seems to be the excuse/justification though, BT. Even Mollison said "it hasn't stopped them from winning" as though that makes it all okay.
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Same old same old :P.
(https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/attachments/fb_img_1562158531096-jpg.702789/)
Source: Zerohanger.com
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1 year ok whatever.. 2 years..with same bookends, smells rancid ... 3 years we should be wreckin the joint
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Collingwood smashed on the weekend, in all areas, contested, uncontested, scoreboard, but won the frees 27-11.
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Collingwood smashed on the weekend, in all areas, contested, uncontested, scoreboard, but won the frees 27-11.
:shh
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Collingwood smashed on the weekend, in all areas, contested, uncontested, scoreboard, but won the frees 27-11.
That is an amazing stat.
One thing I will say about us is we give away stupid free kicks.
Whether it’s holding on too long after the tackle or just recklessly tackling too high.
We need to improve in this area.
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Collingwood smashed on the weekend, in all areas, contested, uncontested, scoreboard, but won the frees 27-11.
That is an amazing stat.
One thing I will say about us is we give away stupid free kicks.
Whether it’s holding on too long after the tackle or just recklessly tackling too high.
We need to improve in this area.
Spot on BT
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After Round 4, 2020
Club Differential Frees For Frees Against
North Melbourne 33 86 53
Collingwood 13 75 62
Melbourne 10 48 38
Fremantle 9 67 58
Port Adelaide 9 64 55
St Kilda 5 72 67
Sydney 3 73 70
Carlton 3 67 64
Adelaide 1 75 74
Western Bulldogs 0 69 69
Richmond -1 71 72
Brisbane -4 67 71
Essendon -6 43 49
Geelong -7 68 75
West Coast -12 50 62
Hawthorn -15 66 81
Gold Coast -19 60 79
GWS Giants -22 66 88
https://www.sen.com.au/news/2020/07/01/the-free-kick-ladder-after-four-rounds/
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Let’s see the goals from free kicks differential. We’d be close to last