One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: mat073 on April 17, 2018, 12:08:16 AM
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2010 - We start the year worse than Fitzroy ...finish with 6 wins and a Coleman medalist.
2011 - 8.5 wins
2012 - 10.5 wins plus a three week period where we lose each game by a kick
2013 - 15 wins but suffer massive choke in elimination final
2014 - biggest resurrection since Geez . Finals flogging
2015- 15 wins plus the usual finals choke.
2016 - horrendous year .
2017 - premiers .
Melbourne
3 years of the messiah Roos plus 1under his apprentice Goodwin . Still no finals .
Carlton
Bolton in his 3rd year , Blues sit 0-4 . Got no depth . Getting flogged by average teams .
St Kilda
Remind me of us under Wallace . Seem good enough to finish 9th and thats about it . Now that old man Nick has retired, they have no stars . Getting worse , Richardson under the pump .
Brisbane
I think they will get better but they have been a basket case since Voss was given the flick .
Our rebuild was done under compromised drafts conditions , which is even more commendable.
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I reckon despite what they've dished up on Saturday, the Lions will be OK
The other 2; well have no idea what they are trying to achieve
Demons had so many low 1st round picks they've stuffed up which partly explains where they are now. Also think they are mentally weak club
The Saints; well they have always been and will remain a minnow.. no direction, no leadership on or off the field
What would be interesting is to see what their membership numbers during their "rebuilds" are like. Membership numbers say a lot about a club ;D
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I wouldn't dismiss the Demons yet.
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To have a balanced discussion I think we need some input from the Dees supporters that post on here
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I love it, but cmon, is there any point comparing? We won the stuffing flag. None of those teams have come anywhere near what we've achieved (exception of Freo - mentioned in the thread title who played off in 2013. Actually made a decent go of it too. If Ballyntine kicked straight they might have actually pinched it).
Melbourne appear to be in the strongest position. Their list is enviable (after a cornucopia of concessions) and should be pushing for finals. The others wont be playing off in any significant capacity for at LEAST 2 - 3 seasons.
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To have a balanced discussion I think we need some input from the Dees supporters that post on here
That person has done an identical thread on Demontime which has Melbourne just ahead of a "middling" Richmond list.
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To have a balanced discussion I think we need some input from the Dees supporters that post on here
That person has done an identical thread on Demontime which has Melbourne just ahead of a "middling" Richmond list.
I am not surprised at all
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I think the fact is that it is very hard to turn a club around quickly.
My observation is that we were a basket case for many years.
Incorrect drafts, fractured club, mismanagement at all levels, poor facilities due to no funds.
I think the appointment of Peggy and Benny was great but the major factor was the resigning of Dimma and Dimma realising he was part of the problem and changing his attitude. Also the players having a real honesty session and bonding well and Cotchin taking his captaincy to the place it needed to be.
So in summary we have addressed:
Off Field Management
Excellent facilities
Our player draft selection process
A great list (probably going it as a standalone VFL team also helped)
Coach and coaching staff
Fitness and player injury management.
And a lot of luck with player injury
I think the aforementioned clubs could take a look at what we have done and that would be a great start for them.
Carlton= Basket case and Silvagni is doing them no favours (hope he stays on) ML rating 2/10
Melbourne= starting to tick boxes but got a couple of trades really wrong this year. IMO the team is not gelling well each week ML rating 6/10
St Kilda= Have got several things right but for some reason are very inconsistent (they certainly flogged us last year) ML rating 5/10
Brisbane= are searching for the right mix and are nearly there. ML rating 6/10
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I am still not too sure how our drafting rates in the recent past, still a lot of questions over it with;
Conca
Vickery
CEllis
BLennon
And still too early to call on
Higgo
Shai
I will put DRioli down as a success even though some on here do not agree and also Vlad as a success
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I am still not too sure how our drafting rates in the recent past, still a lot of questions over it with;
Conca
Vickery
CEllis
BLennon
And still too early to call on
Higgo
Shai
I will put DRioli down as a success even though some on here do not agree and also Vlad as a success
Don't forget Tambling for Franklin and Fiora for Pavlich.......
Heads must roll! :lol
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Don't forget Tambling for Franklin and Fiora for Pavlich.......
Heads must roll! :lol
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Yes we could have had Richo, Buddy and Pavlich in the same team
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I was referring to the Hardwick era ....not the nonsense that happened during the Wallace 5 year plan . Vickery was drafted back then .
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Completed in 2017.
Starting a new build in 2018.
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Don't forget Tambling for Franklin and Fiora for Pavlich.......
Heads must roll! :lol
Could have had Cloke as well. Throw in N Brown at the peak of his powers and its pretty damn formidable.
Richmond under the Benny/Peggy era would have got it done ;)
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Don't forget Tambling for Franklin and Fiora for Pavlich.......
Heads must roll! :lol
Could have had Cloke as well. Throw in N Brown at the peak of his powers and its pretty damn formidable.
Richmond under the Balme era would have got it done
e.f.a. :shh
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To have a balanced discussion I think we need some input from the Dees supporters that post on here
That person has done an identical thread on Demontime which has Melbourne just ahead of a "middling" Richmond list.
lol
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a mate of mine a st kilda supporter says they used to all be Drunks. Even as recently as Justin Peckitt which is a few years ago now but club cultures have a way of persisting...
When was the St Kilda school girl scandal?
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Wonder if we will get a post from the flog Demon supporter who use to post on here before the Tiges played the Dees.
Also was there any truth to the rumor that it was Claw just trolling?
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Fagan was right last week when he said rebuilds (from scratch) take a long time.
When you look back, our first attempt started at the 2004 draft when Wallace took over (13 years ago). Not trying to defend Wallace as a coach, but the Club's original plan when Plough joined was to play finals by 2008 with a combo of oldies (Richo, Browny, Johnson, Gaspar, etc) and the new kids with 3-4 seasons under their belt. They knew it wasn't sustainable as our list in 2004 had been totally decimated with no young guns to speak off given we had previously traded away early picks for fringe players, but it was buy time for the next recruiting wave. Play a final series and then dip down the ladder when the oldies were gone before rising again with a better balanced list that could achieve sustainable success. However, our facilities and recruiting were so substandard back then that they were a joke and as we know we stuffed up both the 2004 & 2005 drafts despite a number of early picks. Then Wallace was a failure of a coach as well over his 5 years so the original plan went AWOL.
The only positive from the Wallace years was that by the time Dimma joined at the end of 2009, we had kept hold of our early picks and thus we had some young future guns on our list - Cotch, Rance, Jack, Sheds - which Dusty was added to straight away. We may have been classed as "worse than Fitzroy" but we actually had some base to finally re-rebuild off. With a cultural shift, Fighting Tiger funding drive, new facilites, a strong emphasis on recruiting and development, etc ... the "second attempted rebuild started in 2010. That of course took about 3 years to build a side capable of making finals and then a further 4 years after that to win a flag (with a major hiccup along the way in 2016).
Of these current bottom sides, I see some small base for Brisbane & Carlton to work off. Both are back where we were in 2010-11. The issue for both is cultural and financial problems remain. The Blues are still trying to recover from their salary cap penalties for cheating and are still run as a oligarchy. Plus Bolton is in his 3rd year not his first or second. Brisbane's problem is also financial plus retaining their young players so it doesn't become a vicious cycle of developing interstate kids for other clubs to poach. Freo is where you would expect for a club that spent mostly a decade challenging before losing so much experience due to retirements. St Kilda on the other hand look lost. I doubt they know what they are doing on or off-field. They are totally rudderless without Nick Riewoldt out there that's for sure. At least when Richo retired, Jack began to take over the mantle as our No.1 forward.
Melbourne is entirely a different beast or should that be pheasant. Their list should be playing finals but they are culturally in a time warp that hasn't changed sine 1964. They are still where we use to be until last year - unable or simply not good enough to handle expectation. I won't be surprised if the rah-rahs play well against us on Tuesday night as playing the reigning premiers means they have nothing to lose (unless they get flogged by us :pray ). But as soon as they are expected to stand up and can't play as downhill skiers like their supporters at Mt Hotham, they fall in a heap. It's why Garry Lyon always pumps us up as favourites in the days/week leading up to playing his beloved Dees. We are their Grand Final ::).
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Of these current bottom sides, I see some small base for Brisbane & Carlton to work off. Both are back where we were in 2010-11. The issue for both is cultural and financial problems remain. The Blues are still trying to recover from their salary cap penalties for cheating and are still run as a oligarchy. Plus Bolton is in his 3rd year not his first or second. Brisbane's problem is also financial plus retaining their young players so it doesn't become a vicious cycle of developing interstate kids for other clubs to poach. Freo is where you would expect for a club that spent mostly a decade challenging before losing so much experience due to retirements. St Kilda on the other hand look lost. I doubt they know what they are doing on or off-field. They are totally rudderless without Nick Riewoldt out there that's for sure. At least when Richo retired, Jack began to take over the mantle as our No.1 forward.
Right now, I'd take Brisbane's list over quite a few teams, let alone Carlton. They are in a world of pain at the moment, and it serves them right.
I think Brisbane is in a genuine rebuild and on the right track. Carlton, North, St Kilda, Gold Coast, Fremantle and West Coast, despite their start to the season, are in limbo land. They keep taking steps forward and steps backward.
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I agree with most of that,but not about the eagles tho.Eagles have genuinely good talent and always bring good kids through and good recruiting.I think for them it is more of a coaching issue.
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we spent 3 years not doing much under Hardwick. Basically some players got games but we used a fair few recycled players to maintain competitiveness.
Actually I'm surprised how many recycled players we had in the GF. Townsend Prestia Caddy Houli Nankervis Grigg plus the aged recruit Lambert and rookie Grimes and there were a few not in the GF too. It's been a funny way to build a list.
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we spent 3 years not doing much under Hardwick. Basically some players got games but we used a fair few recycled players to maintain competitiveness.
Actually I'm surprised how many recycled players we had in the GF. Townsend Prestia Caddy Houli Nankervis Grigg plus the aged recruit Lambert and rookie Grimes and there were a few not in the GF too. It's been a funny way to build a list.
Grimes was PSD not rookie
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Almost 3/4 time in the Saints GWS game - good endeavor by the saints but it's painfully obvious that they lack class .
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They drew... :shh
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ah I sit corrected. I knew he wasn't a
straight draft pick.
Still 7 of 22 about a third from non ND
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Of these current bottom sides, I see some small base for Brisbane & Carlton to work off. Both are back where we were in 2010-11. The issue for both is cultural and financial problems remain. The Blues are still trying to recover from their salary cap penalties for cheating and are still run as a oligarchy. Plus Bolton is in his 3rd year not his first or second. Brisbane's problem is also financial plus retaining their young players so it doesn't become a vicious cycle of developing interstate kids for other clubs to poach. Freo is where you would expect for a club that spent mostly a decade challenging before losing so much experience due to retirements. St Kilda on the other hand look lost. I doubt they know what they are doing on or off-field. They are totally rudderless without Nick Riewoldt out there that's for sure. At least when Richo retired, Jack began to take over the mantle as our No.1 forward.
Right now, I'd take Brisbane's list over quite a few teams, let alone Carlton. They are in a world of pain at the moment, and it serves them right.
I think Brisbane is in a genuine rebuild and on the right track. Carlton, North, St Kilda, Gold Coast, Fremantle and West Coast, despite their start to the season, are in limbo land. They keep taking steps forward and steps backward.
Agree about North. They are winning games on the back of oldies such as Higgins, Waite, Goldstein, Thompson, etc. Will end up in mid-ladder limbo land.
Eagles are totally dependent of NicNat.
I think the Blues have some talented young talls to build around that will come on once they bulk up. In the meantime, they are in a world of pain and will need to keep investing in the draft with their early pics for finishing bottom.
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Makes me laugh about the Hawks 'rebuild'. Clarko getting praised, but they have the oldest list in the comp and have had no high picks in the last few years.
It can't last.
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Caddy was a good get in our rebuild just as our Spanish recruiter pointed out in the greatest you tube video ever made
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cueSVslcyhw