Author Topic: Was Cogs injured today?  (Read 3151 times)

Offline mightytiges

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Was Cogs injured today?
« on: August 21, 2005, 08:29:32 PM »
Appeared to be struggling to run and especially sprint today.

Hope his pubic instability hasn't flaired up again :(.
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Offline Razorblade

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2005, 08:47:22 PM »
My dad said the same thing today, i tend to agree.

Is their any point in playing him next week?

Offline kendrick

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2005, 11:33:41 PM »
i found myself asking my dad the same question...

Coughlan used to be such a gun.. now he has just gone missing.. kinda like Aussie Jones, was a superstar.. then went missing...

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #3 on: August 22, 2005, 07:38:29 AM »
he is a liablility, his condition will never be cured, but when ur on the park ur assumed fit so i believe he has unfortunately played his best footy and his pace skills judgement are just not good enough, trade him now whilst he has some market value, poo if guys like lockett, hall, everitt can be let go 4 the betterment of st kilda, we can let cogs go too. alot better players than him in the past have been let go by clubs

Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #4 on: August 22, 2005, 09:10:03 AM »
Appeared to be struggling to run and especially sprint today.

Hope his pubic instability hasn't flaired up again :(.

It wasn't just yesterday MT - IMO it's been apparent for at least the last 6-7 weeks (hence my frustration ;)). As a result I think it has impacted on his ability in the "2nd effort" area which used to be prior to his injury his absolute strength.

I've been wondering if the fact that he missed all of last season and did a modified pre-season has meant the season has caught up with him because he is not coming off the same fitness base as everyone else ???

Just a thought?
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Offline Tiger Spirit

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #5 on: August 22, 2005, 11:13:19 AM »
He’s been consistent and serviceable, but nothing like the player he was in 2002/2003.  I have no doubt that if he was anywhere near 100% that he would be spending more time in the middle, rather than playing other defensive type roles.

I agree WP, his second efforts aren’t what they used to be.  When you know the way he can play, you have to think he’s either been given a less taxing role to look after him, or he’s just gone backwards.  It’s unlike Cogs to play half-hearted footy, so I’m just hoping that this is a good learning year for him, to keep the injury in check, and that things will be easier for him from this season on.
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Offline JohnF

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #6 on: August 22, 2005, 03:04:10 PM »

I've been wondering if the fact that he missed all of last season and did a modified pre-season has meant the season has caught up with him because he is not coming off the same fitness base as everyone else ???

Just a thought?

That's the theory I'd subscribe to WP. For the first 3/4 of the season Cogs was flying.  Many here and elsewhere had him finishing top 2 or 3 in the best and fairest as little as a month ago.

He's tapered off the last month but with a limited preseason he's had and having missed a large chucnk of the season before, this year has been great comeback year for him and I'm optimistic about his progress for the years ahead.

Offline DallasCrane

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2005, 06:03:25 AM »
I heard one bloke yell out on Sunday "Coughlan needs to stop believing his own publicity"

I agree with him. I thought the club rushed in too quickly to use him as one of their main marketing faces. He hadn't done enough yet, but I suppose it's all about the looks. Anyway it put extra pressure on that he didn't need.

Like everyone else I saw the signs earlier this year that he might have been finding some early career form, but they were just glimpses more than anything. For the second half of the year, (and most of his short career) he has not been accountable to his opponent. He has been towelled in the midfield and his direct opponent keeps getting possessions at will. He covers a fair bit of ground I suppose, but he was puffing so hard on Sunday that it was preventing him from going in for second efforts. I'm sick of the injury excuse- if he's injured he shouldn't be in the midfield. I've gotta say I haven't been impressed with his body language and his attitude lately either.It seems he doesn't care. I'm sure I'm not the only one whose watched Coggers and thought 'where is your mind at the moment lad'

Look, maybe Coughlan is right, football isn't the most important thing in the world, but if you are going to take your $400K,play 15-18 games a year for the mighty tiges with passion, I want to see nothing left on the field.
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Offline om21

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2005, 10:00:37 AM »
Wouldn't care if he got 15 possessions a game as long as he learnt how to kick......
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Offline bg25

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2005, 12:18:28 PM »
Wouldn't care if he got 15 possessions a game as long as he learnt how to kick......

Inclined to agree OM21.

Offline Razorblade

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2005, 03:43:54 PM »
I hope he is rested for this game but i can't see it happening, maybe the club will be over-cautious and not play him in the wizard cup!

Offline DallasCrane

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2005, 04:06:24 PM »
Wouldn't care if he got 15 possessions a game as long as he learnt how to kick......

But his opponent keeps getting 30 possessions om!
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Offline om21

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #12 on: August 24, 2005, 01:03:07 PM »
DC....dont remind me. All our midfields have the worst defensive skills in the game.
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Offline Tiger Spirit

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2005, 01:13:23 PM »
I agree with him. I thought the club rushed in too quickly to use him as one of their main marketing faces. He hadn't done enough yet, but I suppose it's all about the looks. Anyway it put extra pressure on that he didn't need.

Or even want.

Like everyone else I saw the signs earlier this year that he might have been finding some early career form, but they were just glimpses more than anything. For the second half of the year, (and most of his short career) he has not been accountable to his opponent. He has been towelled in the midfield and his direct opponent keeps getting possessions at will. He covers a fair bit of ground I suppose, but he was puffing so hard on Sunday that it was preventing him from going in for second efforts. I'm sick of the injury excuse- if he's injured he shouldn't be in the midfield. I've gotta say I haven't been impressed with his body language and his attitude lately either.It seems he doesn't care. I'm sure I'm not the only one whose watched Coggers and thought 'where is your mind at the moment lad'

Look, maybe Coughlan is right, football isn't the most important thing in the world, but if you are going to take your $400K,play 15-18 games a year for the mighty tiges with passion, I want to see nothing left on the field.

Never thought I’d have to see the day when I read something like that about Cogs.  Just a couple of things though, without wanting to sound like I’m making excuses for him.  Correct me if I’m wrong here, but apart from a few games in the middle part of the season, I don’t know that he’s been spending as much time in the midfield as people think.  He’s been given other less taxing roles and had his training modified, to some degree, to ease the load for him, recently.  I could be wrong here too, but I think it’s more like $300k, if you can believe the papers; not that it makes any difference to what we should be able to expect from a player though.

Anyway, no doubt he’s struggling in some way.  Whether we can put any or all of it down to injury, or whether it’s something else entirely, who knows, but it doesn’t excuse the attitude.  And if you’ve noticed that about him then maybe others may have too.
 
This is where I sometimes wonder whether it’s the footy club who doesn’t see what’s happening or the player who just doesn’t want to know about it.  Clubs shouldn’t be expected to hold players’ hands 24 hours a day, but they shouldn’t throw them in the deep end and then let them drift aimlessly through these sorts of challenges either.  Which is what seems to be happening here, to some degree at least.  Maybe I’m completely on the wrong track, but you just have to wonder sometimes.

No doubt, all players go through highs and lows, and this is probably no big deal and nothing that couldn’t be easily and quickly nipped in the bud, if there is anything there.

While the injury gives Cogs an excuse, to some degree, as it would be frustrating to deal with, it doesn’t excuse or explain the other signs that you pointed out, that are probably more worrying, because once the attitude falls away it generally affects everything else.  The sooner you see the warning signs, the quicker something can be done, if necessary.  And I don’t know that we’ve been too good in that department in the past.

Regardless of who the player is, my main concern is that we get a player to a level where he’s playing reasonable football and then, for whatever reason, his career levels out or he just goes backwards.  The most obvious early signs of decline generally seem to be the attitude and, while I don’t want to sound like I’m making something out of nothing, this is where I’ve had my doubts, over a number of years, about our Club being able to get a player to a level that’s above average.

Obviously, a lot of it comes back to the player himself but, at the same time, I wouldn’t like to think we’re going down the same track here, where a player has played his best football before his career has barely started, when we didn’t need to.
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Offline DallasCrane

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Re: Was Cogs injured today?
« Reply #14 on: August 25, 2005, 12:54:30 AM »
I don't know what makes me an authority on Mark Coughlan all of a sudden, but this feeling about Cogs has been stirring up inside me for a few weeks now and is actually the thing I felt most passionate about at the Hawks game. Very interesting comments TS about how the club handles this situation.
When I said
Anyway it put extra pressure on that he didn't need.
 

and you replied
Or even want.

I'm sorry to have to ask this because you might not be able to reveal it even if you know it to be true. But are you suggesting that Coughlan was forced into all that crap. It really is crap too-but I'm biased I hate marketing in general. But if he was led into that unwillingly that is a disgrace and whoever looked after marketing then is probably already gone anyway. But player/managers are equally to blame and shouldn't let it happen. Aussie Jones comes to mind here too.


This is where I sometimes wonder whether it’s the footy club who doesn’t see what’s happening or the player who just doesn’t want to know about it.  Clubs shouldn’t be expected to hold players’ hands 24 hours a day, but they shouldn’t throw them in the deep end and then let them drift aimlessly through these sorts of challenges either.  Which is what seems to be happening here, to some degree at least.  Maybe I’m completely on the wrong track, but you just have to wonder sometimes.


No,you're on the right track, in fact I think that's where you hit the nail on the head TS. What did happen to Tivendale. He should be a gun footballer. He should be like Leon Cameron or David King in their prime. Or Chaffey, Fiora. Wallace wonders where all the 23-27 yo's are? Where's Dragicevic? Probably doesn't care less about football now! The damage done by Frawley and his predecessors will still linger at the club for years.

The sooner you see the warning signs, the quicker something can be done, if necessary.  And I don’t know that we’ve been too good in that department in the past.

,

hear, hear


Regardless of who the player is, my main concern is that we get a player to a level where he’s playing reasonable football and then, for whatever reason, his career levels out or he just goes backwards.  The most obvious early signs of decline generally seem to be the attitude and, while I don’t want to sound like I’m making something out of nothing, this is where I’ve had my doubts, over a number of years, about our Club being able to get a player to a level that’s above average.


Absolutely TS. Not just a player to a level that's above average, but several players to a level of excellence! Has the club ever promoted it? Obviously that's why there is so much excitement around Deledio winning the rising star award. Heck our last Brownlow medallist was an import, when was our real true last champion ? (I've seen no footy before 1980 and didnt understand properly until about 1990) Well I must admit I thought Knights was gonna pinch a Brownlow one year!

Obviously, a lot of it comes back to the player himself but, at the same time, I wouldn’t like to think we’re going down the same track here, where a player has played his best football before his career has barely started, when we didn’t need to.

I hope not TS, Mark Coughlan's early career form was amongst the most exhilirating, brave and thrilling football that I've ever seen.
Experience is a good school. But the fees are high.
Heinrich Heine