One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: Judge Roughneck on April 12, 2008, 04:44:44 PM
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I'm getting rather tire of hearing misinformed rubbish from RFC fans. OMG its round 3 in Wallace 4th year and we are still rubbish. The club needed to give the new coach 5 years to build the list because the list was so rubbish. If we are still crap come round 22 2008 then by all means stuff off the coach, but we must complete the 5 year.
I'm not a huge fan of Wallace; some of the stuff he does I don't understand
- both on game day; playing Bowden on Medhurst, Raines on Reiwoldt, playing Hyde / Tivendale / Howat ahead of kids.
- and drafting wise; taking JON types when the arguable #1 rated player in Hurn was still around etc.
However, he also has some good points and is a half decent coach who came to the club and has to sweep dust webs from the room and try and rebuild a horrid list. 5 years is about right, given the position he started.
Personally I believe winning games in 2005 was unexpected and hurt us alot. Being 7-2 followed the snap of Browns leg killed us, were teams like Hawthorn, who finished below us in boh 05/06 had high picks. Last season was shyte but its part of the rebuilding process, Cotchin/Rance will be important cogs. From a long term view another good kid or two would help again this year - as a final top up of Wallaces future plans for the final 2009 year.
Look at the list from an age perspective analysis. Players bought into the club under Wallace:
Mids: Meyer, Polo, Tambling, Morton*, White, Deledio, Casserly, JON, Connors, Edwards, Collins, Collard*, Cotchin
Talls: Pattison, Thursfeild, Hughes, McGaune, Graham, Reiwoldt, Rance, Gourdis
22 yoa and under. (oldest to youngest)
This is the the side Wallace has build and should be held accountable for. Realistically, you cannot expect these players to yet be doing anything major at AFL level. Patto is a decent developing ruckman, Thursty is doing a good job to be holding down FB at such a young age, Hughes has done no worse than any of the other KPP in his draft. The others are still pups.
The midfield is developing, but Deledio still only 20 yoa! (till tomorrow) Even Meyer who has done nothing should still be given one more year to try and get fit and show what he can do before delisting.
Polak, King, McMahon are all under 25 and bought in as you need some sort of spread of age groups, which we bugger all mid range players.
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nice and touchy post there bentleigh however the problem with it is that most of those kids will not develop with wallace as our coach.
please dont mention mcmahon. r u kidding?? what a waste i dont care if he is 40 yrs of age or 20 yrs of age, we have too many players like him in this team and u can talk about rebuilding all u like but facts are we wont win a flag with this list.
im prepared to give the youngsters a go except for JON and meyer. JON is such a poo footballer. might be as nice go but come on mate if he makes it to 100 games i think i might put the boots on as well. he is crap.
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nice and touchy post there bentleigh however the problem with it is that most of those kids will not develop with wallace as our coach.
Who should be coaching knackers? Dean Bailey?
'most of those kids will not develop with wallace as our coach' is a moronic argument.
please dont mention mcmahon. r u kidding?? what a waste i dont care if he is 40 yrs of age or 20 yrs of age, we have too many players like him in this team and u can talk about rebuilding all u like but facts are we wont win a flag with this list.
McMahon is going to be part of the clubs future regardless if you like it. Get used to it.
im prepared to give the youngsters a go except for JON and meyer. JON is such a poo footballer. might be as nice go but come on mate if he makes it to 100 games i think i might put the boots on as well. he is crap.
He might not be great yet but he is 19 ffs. Was in Coburgs best today.
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I'm getting rather tire of hearing misinformed rubbish from RFC fans. OMG its round 3 in Wallace 4th year and we are still rubbish. The club needed to give the new coach 5 years to build the list because the list was so rubbish. If we are still crap come round 22 2008 then by all means eff off the coach, but we must complete the 5 year.
I'm not a huge fan of Wallace; some of the stuff he does I don't understand
- both on game day; playing Bowden on Medhurst, Raines on Reiwoldt, playing Hyde / Tivendale / Howat ahead of kids.
- and drafting wise; taking JON types when the arguable #1 rated player in Hurn was still around etc.
However, he also has some good points and is a half decent coach who came to the club and has to sweep dust webs from the room and try and rebuild a horrid list. 5 years is about right, given the position he started.
Personally I believe winning games in 2005 was unexpected and hurt us alot. Being 7-2 followed the snap of Browns leg killed us, were teams like Hawthorn, who finished below us in boh 05/06 had high picks. Last season was shyte but its part of the rebuilding process, Cotchin/Rance will be important cogs. From a long term view another good kid or two would help again this year - as a final top up of Wallaces future plans for the final 2009 year.
Look at the list from an age perspective analysis. Players bought into the club under Wallace:
Mids: Meyer, Polo, Tambling, Morton*, White, Deledio, Casserly, JON, Connors, Edwards, Collins, Collard*, Cotchin
Talls: Pattison, Thursfeild, Hughes, McGaune, Graham, Reiwoldt, Rance, Gourdis
22 yoa and under. (oldest to youngest)
This is the the side Wallace has build and should be held accountable for. Realistically, you cannot expect these players to yet be doing anything major at AFL level. Patto is a decent developing ruckman, Thursty is doing a good job to be holding down FB at such a young age, Hughes has done no worse than any of the other KPP in his draft. The others are still pups.
The midfield is developing, but Deledio still only 20 yoa! (till tomorrow) Even Meyer who has done nothing should still be given one more year to try and get fit and show what he can do before delisting.
Polak, King, McMahon are all under 25 and bought in as you need some sort of spread of age groups, which we bugger all mid range players.
Absolute garbage post mate.
Half decent coach , lol
You obvious didnt see Shane Tuck last week handball 40 million times :banghead
You obviously dont understand game plans, and hit up targets etc.
You mention age,anyone who mentions age again I will spew :chuck
Have a look at Collingwoods young players. Ours arent up to scratch
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the truth hurts, eventually everyone will realise it, our young kids as a group are an average bunch.
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the problem wiith many of us tiger fans, becaus ewe love our club with so much passion, is that we really really overrate our team, list and coach
fACTS ARE WE ARE S H I T !
THE SOONER MILKLER AND WALLAVE GOES THE BETTER
terry shoule be sued for fraud, he lied and deceived not just the club and board but all us fans. B A S T A R D
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the problem wiith many of us tiger fans, becaus ewe love our club with so much passion, is that we really really overrate our team, list and coach
fACTS ARE WE ARE S H I T !
THE SOONER MILKLER AND WALLAVE GOES THE BETTER
terry shoule be sued for fraud, he lied and deceived not just the club and board but all us fans. B A S T A R D
I agree with you X. thats a worry though, lol ;)
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the problem wiith many of us tiger fans, becaus ewe love our club with so much passion, is that we really really overrate our team, list and coach
fACTS ARE WE ARE S H I T !
THE SOONER MILKLER AND WALLAVE GOES THE BETTER
terry shoule be sued for fraud, he lied and deceived not just the club and board but all us fans. B A S T A R D
Listen retards.
You said the same thing 4years ago bout Frawley. And the same thing for 30 years.
At least let this coach finsh his contract before sacking him.
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the problem wiith many of us tiger fans, becaus ewe love our club with so much passion, is that we really really overrate our team, list and coach
fACTS ARE WE ARE S H I T !
THE SOONER MILKLER AND WALLAVE GOES THE BETTER
terry shoule be sued for fraud, he lied and deceived not just the club and board but all us fans. B A S T A R D
Listen fools.
You said the same thing 4years ago bout Frawley. And the same thing for 30 years.
At least let this coach finsh his contract before sacking him.
Listen fool. we had to put up with honoring Dannys contract and now you say honour Wallets, what drugs are you on.
Can tell you that at least Danny got us to finals, Wallet is taking us no where, and I cant wait till round 12, they may want to rename it ""exit round"" when the biggest fraud coach of all time gets the chop!
Mate you could not be serious could you ?????
Where is Wallets game plan I might add :gobdrop :banghead :banghead
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the problem wiith many of us tiger fans, becaus ewe love our club with so much passion, is that we really really overrate our team, list and coach
fACTS ARE WE ARE S H I T !
THE SOONER MILKLER AND WALLAVE GOES THE BETTER
terry shoule be sued for fraud, he lied and deceived not just the club and board but all us fans. B A S T A R D
Listen fools.
lol mods
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the problem wiith many of us tiger fans, becaus ewe love our club with so much passion, is that we really really overrate our team, list and coach
fACTS ARE WE ARE S H I T !
THE SOONER MILKLER AND WALLAVE GOES THE BETTER
terry shoule be sued for fraud, he lied and deceived not just the club and board but all us fans. B A S T A R D
Listen fools.
You said the same thing 4years ago bout Frawley. And the same thing for 30 years.
At least let this coach finsh his contract before sacking him.
Listen fool. we had to put up with honoring Dannys contract and now you say honour Wallets, what drugs are you on.
Can tell you that at least Danny got us to finals, Wallet is taking us no where, and I cant wait till round 12, they may want to rename it ""exit round"" when the biggest fraud coach of all time gets the chop!
Mate you could not be serious could you ?????
Where is Wallets game plan I might add :gobdrop :banghead :banghead
Less than 4 wins this year wouldn't be bad for the club long term. We missed out on proper rebuilding draft pcks in 05/06 so another top 3 pick along for Wallaces 5th year wouldnt hurt. I still think we are a Hawkins/Kruzer/Franklin/Cloke type kpp or ruckman short. The WA black dude would be nice to develop along side Patto for a decade.
We have a decent U25 line up that has largly been put together in 4 years.
McMahon Thursfeild Polak
King Rance Newman*
Cotchin Cogs* Deledio
Connors Hughes Morton
Edwards Schultz* Riewoldt
Pattison Tambling Foley*
Polo Raines* McGaune Jackson*
Only 6 of those from pre-wallace days.
If the players Wallace traded for; McMahon, Morton, Polak don't make it he he should be sacked. More so the high draft picks in his time in charge; Rance, Cotchin, Deledio, Hughes, Reiwoldt, Pattison, Tambling, Polo.
But he should be allowed the 5 years to get it together. We started in a very poor postion.
We also have a developing deapth group
- White, Graham, casserly, JON, Collins, Collard, Putt, Gorudis, Meyer
chances are some of these players should come good, also.
The problem is the senior crop.
- Richo, Brown, Johnson, Bowden, Simmonds, Tuck, Pettifer
- Hyde, Moore, Howatt, Silvestre, Cartledge, Tivendale
However, we cannot sort this out overnight. In the best U22 side 13 of the players are 21 or under.
It takes time because the list was so pish. Yes mistakes have been made it seems; Meyer, Tambling, JON etc. but some of em might come good, and we have also had some handy trades and late picks.
Deledio was Wallaces #1 pick in his first year. Deledio is still 20!
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oh l'm having fits of laughter who posted that :rollin
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Terry arrived as the Messiah and now the four horsemen of the Apocalypse are blowing their trumpets. I don't care if and when he is replaced I only care about the success of the Richmond footy club. A five year plan was ludicrous to begin with.
Forumites I agree with those commenting on the "game plans" and "tactics" of Terry after all was privy to having Rodney Eade within the confines of a corporate box I was in through work who was laughing at the fact we played our 3 best ball getters and mids in the fwd line last Sunday. Lids Axel and Browny. Heard it and saw it. So there some insight into how we are perceived from others. Not that that should deter or alter us from our main objective, however ppl say we can't eat our own and not sack or dismiss ppl before their time is up but secondly the genuine future of the footy club on field is at stake also. If change is going to get us on the right path or give us an opportunity to get to where we want to go then yes am prepared to go with it rather than sit back be fearful of it and hence accept what I have been given and because ppl have fear of what we may be perceived as if we adopt change and are fearful of what may happen if we do. To not change the Miller Wallace partnership would be more detrimental than if we don't. Rebuilding will take a while believe me. We have only played 3 games but we may as well have played 21. The season is virtually over. Hope is good Bentleigh but when you have the data and stats in front of you regarding RFC on field than optimism and hope should not be two words that come readily /instantly to mind and Wallace and Miller are ultimately responsible for this.
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Wallace and Miller are ultimately responsible for this.
10 years of shytehouse drafting pre-Wallce/Miller might have something to do with it.
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You can't forever blame Spud or others for that matter, otherwise we should be be blaming Francis Bourke from half time in the 1982 Grand Final and those who allowed Wood Cloke and Raines to defect to other clubs. Sure some of those responsible for our mediocrity should not be allowed to go anywhere near any footy club again but ULTIMATELY Terry convinced our board in 2004 that he WAS the man TO COACH US OUT OF THE WILDERNESS. His reasoning
1. Wanted to wake the sleeping giant that is RFC
2. Our list was better than Hawthorn's
3. Our recruiting will be better
4. His attacking coaching style will be attractive to the eye
5. 16 goals a game on average
6. His game plan would put us in a position to win more games of football.
Now lets see the results to each of the criteria Terry mentioned as his blueprint for success.
1. :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep
2. :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL
3. :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid
4. :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck
5. :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle
6. :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah
But of course we all know too too well how Terry has gone as the proof has been in his pudding.
Sure previous admins may have some part to play in the monumental task Terry has taken on, but Terry took it on, on his own terms and he is FAILING WOEFULLY under his own terms.
You live by the sword you die by the sword. SIMPLE.
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the problem wiith many of us tiger fans, becaus ewe love our club with so much passion, is that we really really overrate our team, list and coach
fACTS ARE WE ARE S H I T !
THE SOONER MILKLER AND WALLAVE GOES THE BETTER
terry shoule be sued for fraud, he lied and deceived not just the club and board but all us fans. B A S T A R D
Listen fools.
You said the same thing 4years ago bout Frawley. And the same thing for 30 years.
At least let this coach finsh his contract before sacking him.
Listen fool. we had to put up with honoring Dannys contract and now you say honour Wallets, what drugs are you on.
Can tell you that at least Danny got us to finals, Wallet is taking us no where, and I cant wait till round 12, they may want to rename it ""exit round"" when the biggest fraud coach of all time gets the chop!
Mate you could not be serious could you ?????
Where is Wallets game plan I might add :gobdrop :banghead :banghead
Less than 4 wins this year wouldn't be bad for the club long term. We missed out on proper rebuilding draft pcks in 05/06 so another top 3 pick along for Wallaces 5th year wouldnt hurt. I still think we are a Hawkins/Kruzer/Franklin/Cloke type kpp or ruckman short. The WA black dude would be nice to develop along side Patto for a decade.
We have a decent U25 line up that has largly been put together in 4 years.
McMahon Thursfeild Polak
King Rance Newman*
Cotchin Cogs* Deledio
Connors Hughes Morton
Edwards Schultz* Riewoldt
Pattison Tambling Foley*
Polo Raines* McGaune Jackson*
Only 6 of those from pre-wallace days.
If the players Wallace traded for; McMahon, Morton, Polak don't make it he he should be sacked. More so the high draft picks in his time in charge; Rance, Cotchin, Deledio, Hughes, Reiwoldt, Pattison, Tambling, Polo.
But he should be allowed the 5 years to get it together. We started in a very poor postion.
We also have a developing deapth group
- White, Graham, casserly, JON, Collins, Collard, Putt, Gorudis, Meyer
chances are some of these players should come good, also.
The problem is the senior crop.
- Richo, Brown, Johnson, Bowden, Simmonds, Tuck, Pettifer
- Hyde, Moore, Howatt, Silvestre, Cartledge, Tivendale
However, we cannot sort this out overnight. In the best U22 side 13 of the players are 21 or under.
It takes time because the list was so pish. Yes mistakes have been made it seems; Meyer, Tambling, JON etc. but some of em might come good, and we have also had some handy trades and late picks.
Deledio was Wallaces #1 pick in his first year. Deledio is still 20!
Is it comedy week it melbourne.
mate, you have NO IDEA.
This is the funniest thread I have ever read.
It could be Terrys son who is writing it
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You can't forever blame Spud or others for that matter, otherwise we should be be blaming Francis Bourke from half time in the 1982 Grand Final and those who allowed Wood Cloke and Raines to defect to other clubs. Sure some of those responsible for our mediocrity should not be allowed to go anywhere near any footy club again but ULTIMATELY Terry convinced our board in 2004 that he WAS the man TO COACH US OUT OF THE WILDERNESS. His reasoning
1. Wanted to wake the sleeping giant that is RFC
2. Our list was better than Hawthorn's
3. Our recruiting will be better
4. His attacking coaching style will be attractive to the eye
5. 16 goals a game on average
6. His game plan would put us in a position to win more games of football.
Now lets see the results to each of the criteria Terry mentioned as his blueprint for success.
1. :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep :sleep
2. :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL :ROTFL
3. :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid :stupid
4. :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck :chuck
5. :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle :juggle
6. :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah
But of course we all know too too well how Terry has gone as the proof has been in his pudding.
Sure previous admins may have some part to play in the monumental task Terry has taken on, but Terry took it on, on his own terms and he is FAILING WOEFULLY under his own terms.
You live by the sword you die by the sword. SIMPLE.
Totally agree!
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thats a great post HT74 it summed it up greatly l'm in fits of laughter :rollin
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whoever the new coach is should make a statement by sacking the older players on masse and trading blokes like McMahon for anything we can get. The senior core at Richmond will never achieve success, its time to get rid of them before they pass on there attitudes to cotchin and rance and co.
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whoever the new coach is should make a statement by sacking the older players on masse and trading blokes like McMahon for anything we can get. The senior core at Richmond will never achieve success, its time to get rid of them before they pass on there attitudes to cotchin and rance and co.
everyone should read and take note of these words. how true ramps!!!
our older players have gotta go and go now. petts, bowden, richo, johnson, hyde, tivs among others.
if we want to run like the hawks we need to rid our club of the nick holland, john barker and richi vandenburg types.
can everyone see THEY ARE THE CANCER!!
our young players become infested with poor leadership and no skills, because of these players.
the final straw for me was last week, sugar handballing off to petts inside 50. what a leader, what a guy!!!
We may make the finals by 2011 but only if these pathetic footballers leave our rfc and go play with lance whitnall in darwin.
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The name TW on this site is like holding a red rag up to a bull - in they charge!
Our young players will continue to bear the brunt of the pressure for the rest of their careers. We no one to take the heat off them and even if we sacked the senior players now it would make no difference to their performances because it would not free them up any more than they are now.
Getting rid of our average senior players would get rid of some of the bad examples though and give room to recruit...but in reality players like Richo, Brown, Simmonds, Bowden, Johnson and even Tuck and Petts will all be there, baring injury, next year. We just can't recruit enough players in one year to replace them even if they were all playing terribly and we just really wanted to.
In 3 years time our list will appear to improve markedly as our 20/21 year olds mature and can finally compete with the senior players from other clubs. Our new recruits then will suddenly appear fantastic and come on quickly (much better/faster than those Lids, Bling, Foley, Pattison etc did :P) because the opposition will finally not be focusing on them, as the teams best players, but on our more mature players - Lids etc.
Its just all about time and even if you feel our recruits are average, we will have no idea until we are able to compete as a team on level playing terms. And as we all hate being told that won't we until we have our current 18 - 21 year old players continue to gain experience and reaching the mid-year (premiership age : 21 - 24) together. So we need to wait between 3 adn 5 years before we can expect or even hope for any consistant success.
Wallace will not be with us by then but the next coach will seem like a coaching mastermind.
Footballs a funny culture
Stripes
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I posted this on bigfooty in response to some posts, so i'll post it here too:
RICHMONDs Round 1 team this year:
B l King, Thursfield, Bowden
HB l Newman, Polak, Moore
C l Tambling, Tuck, Raines
HF l Pettifer, Richardson, McMahon
F l Deledio, Schulz, Brown
R l Simmonds, Johnson, Foley
Int from l Jackson, Hughes, Pattison, Howat
EM l Hyde, Morton, Edwards
Realistic Tigers 2010 team:
B | Daniel Connors - Will Thursfield - Jake King
HB | Alex Rance - Graham Polak - Jordan McMahon
C | Chris Newman - Mark Coughlan - Brett Deledio
HF | Mitch Morton - Cleve Hughes - Richard Tambling
F | Shane Edwards - Jay Schulz - Jack Riewoldt
R | Adam Pattison - Trent Cotchin - Nathan Foley
Int from| Dean Polo - Jarrad Oakley Nicholls - Kelvin Moore - Angus Graham - David Gourdis - Travis Casserly - Andrew Collins - Danny Meyer - Daniel Jackson - Matt White - Luke McGuane
point of interest:
-Get ride of McMahon
-At the moment when in doubt or just as a preference play the kids with the bodies who could handle AFL
Jack riewoldt rules future team:
B | Luke McGuane - Will Thursfield - Andrew Raines
HB | Dean Polo - Alex Rance - Daniel Connors
C | Daniel Jackson - Brett Deledio - Shane Edwards
HF | Mitch Morton - Cleve Hughes - Richard Tambling
F | Clayton Collard - Jack Riewoldt - Dean Putt
R | Angus Graham- Trent Cotchin - Nathan Foley
Int | David Gourdis - Adam Pattison- Mat White - Jay Schulz
Discuss
Points of interest:
-This is a long term team so i'm going to say swap Cartledge for JON or Graham. firstly you dont need 3 ruckmen, exception is if you have Graham and Pattison rotating in ruck/bench and we develop Putt as a power stuff up back up. First change
-Also having three talls on the bench isn't a good idea. so Collins could come into the team or some future draft picks. so one of Schulz or Gourdis will make way for this player. And Swap Raines and Conners, Because I'd rather have conners silky skills delivering the ball into the forward 50
Looking at both teams where do we draft/trade:
Trades: -Tuck he has some moderate trade value aswell we can get a younger player in his position
could get 3rd round draft pick
-Pettifer he is a bit of a inconsistent, plays well when the team is going well ect. Morton get fill the void or conners.
could get 2nd or 3rd round draft pick
Fremantle Ruckmen Rob Warnock is out of contract at year end, just food for thought 206cm, but if it comes to him or Natanui its the latter one everytime.
Delists: I want to give Meyer this year to recover and hopefully towards the end of the season show some form and give him next year to make seniors or be cut loose.
Delist Hyde and Tiva, they play well at coburg and then are in seniors the next week, they should dominate coburg but they struggle at AFL. And delist any of the juniors not putting in the hard yards. And get a decent list of rookies, Collard is ok investment, and Cartledge is insurance.
Draft:(hopefully priority pick)
-In and under midfielders, who can get the hard ball and feed it out
-Key Forward a 195cm + and the Frame to fillout to about 100kg For back up plan if Hughes, Riewoldt, Shultz, Putt or Gourdis Don't make it.
-Speedy high disposal rate GOOD DISPOSAL SKILLS
-Tall tap ruckmen, who has good skills around the ground.
Who's available:-Daniel Rich -Jack Ziebell -Micheal Hurley -Nick Natanui -Chris Yarran -Mitchell Banner -Hamish Hartlett -Matthew Broadbent – Nick Surban?
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Many of you are very stupid.
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Many of you are very stupid.
Dont get ahead of yourself, will you.
One win against pathetic opposition. Good to see us win but please dont get too carried away like some imbeciles ::)
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Many of you are very stupid.
Dont get ahead of yourself, will you.
One win against pathetic opposition. Good to see us win but please dont get too carried away like some imbeciles ::)
2 wins against 2 pathetic opposition.
How did McMahon go? Should be traded for what ever we can get for him yeah?
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Many of you are very stupid.
Dont get ahead of yourself, will you.
One win against pathetic opposition. Good to see us win but please dont get too carried away like some imbeciles ::)
2 wins against 2 pathetic opposition.
How did McMahon go? Should be traded for what ever we can get for him yeah?
Give me a break, you will find that 99% of his possesions were uncontested :banghead
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*sigh*
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Keep the faith Bentleigh-esque :thumbsup
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Give me a break, you will find that 99% of his possesions were uncontested :banghead
75% (24 out of 32).
So what?
The club has made it clear he was recruited to improve the quality of our disposal.
84% effective this week. 88% effective against the skunks.
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Many of you are very stupid.
Dont get ahead of yourself, will you.
One win against pathetic opposition. Good to see us win but please dont get too carried away like some imbeciles ::)
2 wins against 2 pathetic opposition.
How did McMahon go? Should be traded for what ever we can get for him yeah?
Yep Im sticking with my comments, I cant see how we're are gonna win a flag with McMahon IMHO.
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Many of you are very stupid.
Dont get ahead of yourself, will you.
One win against pathetic opposition. Good to see us win but please dont get too carried away like some imbeciles ::)
2 wins against 2 pathetic opposition.
How did McMahon go? Should be traded for what ever we can get for him yeah?
Yep Im sticking with my comments, I cant see how we're are gonna win a flag with McMahon IMHO.
Based on what? I don't rate his as Michael Voss but the club traded over the top for him so he is going to be part of our future. Might as well accept it and move on.
After 4 rounds he has a dozen more kicks than any other RFC player. He is quick and skillful on a HBF/wing. His link up play is solid.
In '06 he looked a fair player.
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Lets wait until the wash up at R22. McMahon went ok today, lets see how he continues. Lets be honest, he wasnt flash against North or Collingwood and just average against Carlton.
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McMahon was very good against Carlton. One of the major reason for the turn around. Ran alot and hit targets.
Hurt them, much as he did Freo today.
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He was ok after half time vs carlton and imo he was below average in the first half of that game. thats an average performance for mine. the stats are 1 average game, 1 good game and 2 very average games.
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He was ok after half time vs carlton and imo he was below average in the first half of that game. thats an average performance for mine. the stats are 1 average game, 1 good game and 2 very average games.
Check the stats again if you're going to use them as the basis of your opinion.
He was good against Collingwood, going by the stats.
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Weve had plenty of players over the years rack up plenty of kicks across half back and in back pockets, who have been lauded by our supporters and the truth is it hasnt done us any good as a team. I think Ive been fair with McMahon, 1-1-2 thats where it sits. Thats the reality. 1 Good Game, 1 Average Game and 2 Very Average.
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Many of you are very stupid.
Dont get ahead of yourself, will you.
One win against pathetic opposition. Good to see us win but please dont get too carried away like some imbeciles ::)
2 wins against 2 pathetic opposition.
How did McMahon go? Should be traded for what ever we can get for him yeah?
Yep Im sticking with my comments, I cant see how we're are gonna win a flag with McMahon IMHO.
Agree, he isnt a finals player. thats for sure :banghead
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he has been alot better than many of our players this yr, if he isnt a finals player, then no one in our team is either.
jordanwas excellent and his experience has been a positive 4 us, and he runs hard and has damn good skills.
he is our next leon cameron with more pace
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he has been alot better than many of our players this yr, if he isnt a finals player, then no one in our team is either.
jordanwas excellent and his experience has been a positive 4 us, and he runs hard and has damn good skills.
he is our next leon cameron with more pace
Leon Cameron was a gun
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yes he was and jordy can make it to gun status also. he has been pretty good 4 us thus far and will be just what we need off half back
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Funny how hacks like Rodan can make GFs but Jordan doesnt have that abilty.
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I'm getting rather tire of hearing misinformed rubbish from RFC fans. OMG its round 3 in Wallace 4th year and we are still rubbish. The club needed to give the new coach 5 years to build the list because the list was so rubbish. If we are still crap come round 22 2008 then by all means eff off the coach, but we must complete the 5 year.
I'm not a huge fan of Wallace; some of the stuff he does I don't understand
- both on game day; playing Bowden on Medhurst, Raines on Reiwoldt, playing Hyde / Tivendale / Howat ahead of kids.
- and drafting wise; taking JON types when the arguable #1 rated player in Hurn was still around etc.
However, he also has some good points and is a half decent coach who came to the club and has to sweep dust webs from the room and try and rebuild a horrid list. 5 years is about right, given the position he started.
Personally I believe winning games in 2005 was unexpected and hurt us alot. Being 7-2 followed the snap of Browns leg killed us, were teams like Hawthorn, who finished below us in boh 05/06 had high picks. Last season was shyte but its part of the rebuilding process, Cotchin/Rance will be important cogs. From a long term view another good kid or two would help again this year - as a final top up of Wallaces future plans for the final 2009 year.
Look at the list from an age perspective analysis. Players bought into the club under Wallace:
Mids: Meyer, Polo, Tambling, Morton*, White, Deledio, Casserly, JON, Connors, Edwards, Collins, Collard*, Cotchin
Talls: Pattison, Thursfeild, Hughes, McGaune, Graham, Reiwoldt, Rance, Gourdis
22 yoa and under. (oldest to youngest)
This is the the side Wallace has build and should be held accountable for. Realistically, you cannot expect these players to yet be doing anything major at AFL level. Patto is a decent developing ruckman, Thursty is doing a good job to be holding down FB at such a young age, Hughes has done no worse than any of the other KPP in his draft. The others are still pups.
The midfield is developing, but Deledio still only 20 yoa! (till tomorrow) Even Meyer who has done nothing should still be given one more year to try and get fit and show what he can do before delisting.
Polak, King, McMahon are all under 25 and bought in as you need some sort of spread of age groups, which we bugger all mid range players.
Have a look at Collingwoods young players. Ours arent up to scratch
LAST GAME
Round 4
MCG Sun 13 Apr
Attendance 77873
Carlton 111
Collingwood 88
Yeah good point :shh
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Why do I get the feeling Bents that you aint gonna be posting much come R22 lol. Get in now champ, coz if we go back to what weve been in the past Jacko and co. will be well within their rights to give you a pasting in here lol.
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Why do I get the feeling Bents that you aint gonna be posting much come R22 lol. Get in now champ, coz if we go back to what weve been in the past Jacko and co. will be well within their rights to give you a pasting in here lol.
Your mates JAcko and Daniel are deadset retards IMO.
It's easy to say the club is shyte and your not not happy with losing. Extremist views - sack the coach and every player over 24 yoa now isn't the way forward.
I will post in R22. The same thing I am posting now.
Give Wallace untill the end of 2009. See where he is at and then sack him if need be. Not before then.
Last game we played 6 young midfeilders
- Foley, Tambling, Deledio, Morton, Edwards, White
We also had anumber of young talls
- Thursfeild, Reiwoldt, Pattison, Polak, Schulz, McGaune, Moore
By mid way thou the season we might see the same side from last night, but with White, Hyde, Moore, McGaune out, Rance, Connors, Cotchin, Cogs in.
Rance Thursfeild King
Newman Schultz McMahon
Deledio Johnson Cotchin
Connors Polak Morton
Brown Reiwoldt Edwards
Simmonds Tambling Foley
Cogs Richo Patto Tuck
The blue print is there.
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I dont recall using 24 years of age as the criteria, senior players have let our club down very bad over a long period of time, we should move them on.
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Why do I get the feeling Bents that you aint gonna be posting much come R22 lol. Get in now champ, coz if we go back to what weve been in the past Jacko and co. will be well within their rights to give you a pasting in here lol.
Your mates JAcko and Daniel are deadset fools IMO.
It's easy to say the club is shyte and your not not happy with losing. Extremist views - sack the coach and every player over 24 yoa now isn't the way forward.
I will post in R22. The same thing I am posting now.
Give Wallace untill the end of 2009. See where he is at and then sack him if need be. Not before then.
Last game we played 6 young midfeilders
- Foley, Tambling, Deledio, Morton, Edwards, White
We also had anumber of young talls
- Thursfeild, Reiwoldt, Pattison, Polak, Schulz, McGaune, Moore
By mid way thou the season we might see the same side from last night, but with White, Hyde, Moore, McGaune out, Rance, Connors, Cotchin, Cogs in.
Rance Thursfeild King
Newman Schultz McMahon
Deledio Johnson Cotchin
Connors Polak Morton
Brown Reiwoldt Edwards
Simmonds Tambling Foley
Cogs Richo Patto Tuck
The blue print is there.
its funny u have rance in ur team and he has played not one single game.
our senior players are the ones i have a problem. perfect example will come this week if we lost to the buldogs.
Leather face will bring pathetic pettifer in and take out someone like morton or jack.
for the good of the richmond fc get rid of pettifer and leve him out for min 10 weeks. HE WILL BRING US A FLAG..EVER!!!!
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Why do I get the feeling Bents that you aint gonna be posting much come R22 lol. Get in now champ, coz if we go back to what weve been in the past Jacko and co. will be well within their rights to give you a pasting in here lol.
Your mates JAcko and Daniel are deadset fools IMO.
It's easy to say the club is shyte and your not not happy with losing. Extremist views - sack the coach and every player over 24 yoa now isn't the way forward.
I will post in R22. The same thing I am posting now.
Give Wallace untill the end of 2009. See where he is at and then sack him if need be. Not before then.
Last game we played 6 young midfeilders
- Foley, Tambling, Deledio, Morton, Edwards, White
We also had anumber of young talls
- Thursfeild, Reiwoldt, Pattison, Polak, Schulz, McGaune, Moore
By mid way thou the season we might see the same side from last night, but with White, Hyde, Moore, McGaune out, Rance, Connors, Cotchin, Cogs in.
Rance Thursfeild King
Newman Schultz McMahon
Deledio Johnson Cotchin
Connors Polak Morton
Brown Reiwoldt Edwards
Simmonds Tambling Foley
Cogs Richo Patto Tuck
The blue print is there.
Schulz, lol.
Cogs is finished unfortunately
Tuck, lol
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those 3 plus our captain will never be part of a premiership window at punt road.
in saying that schulz has performed admirably this year, however if he backs it up in the next month ill be prepared to say he should stay all year.
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I think Ive been fair with McMahon, 1-1-2 thats where it sits. Thats the reality. 1 Good Game, 1 Average Game and 2 Very Average.
Haha! Sorry to laugh if that's meant to be serious but that's funny. It's your opinion so you reckon it's reality. :D
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I think Ive been fair with McMahon, 1-1-2 thats where it sits. Thats the reality. 1 Good Game, 1 Average Game and 2 Very Average.
Haha! Sorry to laugh if that's meant to be serious but that's funny. It's your opinion so you reckon it's reality. :D
It is my opinion and it is fact lol.
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I think Ive been fair with McMahon, 1-1-2 thats where it sits. Thats the reality. 1 Good Game, 1 Average Game and 2 Very Average.
Haha! Sorry to laugh if that's meant to be serious but that's funny. It's your opinion so you reckon it's reality. :D
It is my opinion and it is fact lol.
No that would be FACT! lol. :shh ;) and :banghead for good measure.
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Our list at the start of the Wallace era, post-2004 draft.
3rd February 2005, 09:32
Core Players/Likely Retirements
32 - Campbell - Retire '05
32 - Graham - Retire '05
30 - Stafford - Retire '05
30 - Richardson - Retire '06
28 - Gaspar - Retire '06-'07 (Depending on form)
Core Players
27 - Brown
27 - Johnson
26 - Bowden
23 - Coughlan (Maybe wait until '06)
Solid/Contributing Players
29 - Kellaway (Can't afford to have a really crap year, or his in YTY Players)
26 - Simmonds (Could be a core player depeding on form)
26 - Tivendale
22 - Newman
Year To Year Players
27 - Chaffey
26 - Hilton
24 - Hall
24 - Morrison
23 - Tuck
23 - Pettifer
?? - Knobel
Youngsters who's time it is to take another step up
22 - Hyde
22 - Krakouer
21 - Rodan
21 - Moore
20 - Schulz
Youngsters who only need to do what they did last year
20 - Hartigan
19 - Jackson
Coburg '05 with maybe a couple of Richmond games
19 - Archibald
19 - Foley
19 - Pattison
19 - Raines
19 - Roach
18 - Gilmour
Coburg '05
18 - Meyer
18 - Polo
18 - Limbach
17 - McGuane
?? - Thursfield
I don't have a clue where to put them
18 - Tambling
17 - Deledio
Food for thought.
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This is why I beleive Wallace needs the full 5 years. That list is utter shyte. Players don't start to make a major impact untill about the 4th year.
From that pill of pish:
- We lost then key players in; Stafford, Campbell, Graham, Gaspar, Kellaway.
- Our mid range players were utter rubbish; Tivendale (whoops), Chaffy, Hilton, Hall, Morrison, Knobel, Krakouer, Rodan
- and a number of gash kids; Hartigan, Roach, Gilmour, ARchilbald etc.
Our (aruably) #1 midfeilder and ruckman both retired, and 1/2 our defence. 8, almost all of our mid-aged players were rubbish. We had a lack of talented kids comming thou.
I don't think Wallace i perfect but he had a big job on his hands.
We now had 27 players aged 22 years or younger.
On top of that he bought in Polak, King, McMahon, aged 24 or younger.
By round 1 2009 we should be in decent shape.
---
Rance Thursfeild King
Newman Schultz McMahon
Cotchin Cogs Deledio
Morton Polak Connors
Brown Reiwoldt Edwards
Pattison Tambling Foley
Richo Johnson Tuck Simmonds
Bowden, Raines, Pettifer, Jackson, Moore, Hyde, White, Hughes, Polo, McGaune, Meyer, Graham, Casserly, JON, Collins, Collard, Putt, Gourdis
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Your wasting your time writing that. Those who are impressed by it already know about it, those who aren't are not going to let you get away with it.
lol.
The proof of the pudding will be in the eating. 2011 anyone?
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unfortunately bent, RROFO is right even though i agree with you that wallace should be allowed to have his full measure.
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I think Ive been fair with McMahon, 1-1-2 thats where it sits. Thats the reality. 1 Good Game, 1 Average Game and 2 Very Average.
Haha! Sorry to laugh if that's meant to be serious but that's funny. It's your opinion so you reckon it's reality. :D
Totally agree with Ramps
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Why do I get the feeling Bents that you aint gonna be posting much come R22 lol. Get in now champ, coz if we go back to what weve been in the past Jacko and co. will be well within their rights to give you a pasting in here lol.
Your mates JAcko and Daniel are deadset fools IMO.
It's easy to say the club is shyte and your not not happy with losing. Extremist views - sack the coach and every player over 24 yoa now isn't the way forward.
I will post in R22. The same thing I am posting now.
Give Wallace untill the end of 2009. See where he is at and then sack him if need be. Not before then.
Last game we played 6 young midfeilders
- Foley, Tambling, Deledio, Morton, Edwards, White
We also had anumber of young talls
- Thursfeild, Reiwoldt, Pattison, Polak, Schulz, McGaune, Moore
By mid way thou the season we might see the same side from last night, but with White, Hyde, Moore, McGaune out, Rance, Connors, Cotchin, Cogs in.
Rance Thursfeild King
Newman Schultz McMahon
Deledio Johnson Cotchin
Connors Polak Morton
Brown Reiwoldt Edwards
Simmonds Tambling Foley
Cogs Richo Patto Tuck
The blue print is there.
Schulz, lol.
Cogs is finished unfortunately
Tuck, lol
jack,
are you seriously saying that Jay Shultz has not taken a massive step forward this year?
Seriously mate, You have to be joking. Shultz has improved out of sight
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l like the heading to this thread The rebuild is not taking long. funny l been hearing & reading that message over & over cause its taken 25+ years & there still working on it :lol
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Why do I get the feeling Bents that you aint gonna be posting much come R22 lol. Get in now champ, coz if we go back to what weve been in the past Jacko and co. will be well within their rights to give you a pasting in here lol.
Your mates JAcko and Daniel are deadset fools IMO.
It's easy to say the club is shyte and your not not happy with losing. Extremist views - sack the coach and every player over 24 yoa now isn't the way forward.
I will post in R22. The same thing I am posting now.
Give Wallace untill the end of 2009. See where he is at and then sack him if need be. Not before then.
Last game we played 6 young midfeilders
- Foley, Tambling, Deledio, Morton, Edwards, White
We also had anumber of young talls
- Thursfeild, Reiwoldt, Pattison, Polak, Schulz, McGaune, Moore
By mid way thou the season we might see the same side from last night, but with White, Hyde, Moore, McGaune out, Rance, Connors, Cotchin, Cogs in.
Rance Thursfeild King
Newman Schultz McMahon
Deledio Johnson Cotchin
Connors Polak Morton
Brown Reiwoldt Edwards
Simmonds Tambling Foley
Cogs Richo Patto Tuck
The blue print is there.
Schulz, lol.
Cogs is finished unfortunately
Tuck, lol
jack,
are you seriously saying that Jay Shultz has not taken a massive step forward this year?
Seriously mate, You have to be joking. Shultz has improved out of sight
How many games you seen.?
He hasnt improved out of sight. :banghead
Massive steps :banghead :banghead :banghead
Thats why RFC is where it is today.
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Blaisee, start going to the games :banghead
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l like the heading to this thread The rebuild is not taking long. funny l been hearing & reading that message over & over cause its taken 25+ years & there still working on it :lol
totally right there monk , 25 years and still not right, start gain
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Blaisee, start going to the games :banghead
WTF
I go to every game in melbourne
Jack,
open your eyes
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How many games you seen.?
He hasnt improved out of sight. :banghead
Massive steps :banghead :banghead :banghead
Thats why RFC is where it is today.
In the 8?
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How many games you seen.?
He hasnt improved out of sight. :banghead
Massive steps :banghead :banghead :banghead
Thats why RFC is where it is today.
In the 8?
Lol in the 8, make the most of it
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Blaisee, start going to the games :banghead
WTF
I go to every game in melbourne
Jack,
open your eyes
WTF. lol
You obviously dont watch :banghead
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l like the heading to this thread The rebuild is not taking long. funny l been hearing & reading that message over & over cause its taken 25+ years & there still working on it :lol
The rebuild started 3 years ago.
Before that it was a demolition site with the club reacting to supporters' whims, threats etc.
No more :thumbsup
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The rebuild started 3 years ago.
Before that it was a demolition site with the club reacting to supporters' whims, threats etc.
No more :thumbsup
the masses should run the club, we the humble masses led by Jackstar and co. shall lead the revolution to achieve new heights of glory for the tiges. All hail the new leadership :clapping ;D
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Lol in the 8, make the most of it
If you don't think Schulz has shown improvement this year then I'd suggest you are in a very small minority.
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Lol in the 8, make the most of it
If you don't think Schulz has shown improvement this year then I'd suggest you are in a very small minority.
absolute joke Maurice :thumbsup
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Lol in the 8, make the most of it
If you don't think Schulz has shown improvement this year then I'd suggest you are in a very small minority.
absolute joke Maurice :thumbsup
Wouldnt think he is our best 12 players, would you ?
Your a joke!
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The rebuild started 3 years ago.
Before that it was a demolition site with the club reacting to supporters' whims, threats etc.
No more :thumbsup
the masses should run the club, we the humble masses led by Jackstar and co. shall lead the revolution to achieve new heights of glory for the tiges. All hail the new leadership :clapping ;D
Ramps. If I stood would you vote for me. :thumbsup :shh
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The rebuild started 3 years ago.
Before that it was a demolition site with the club reacting to supporters' whims, threats etc.
No more :thumbsup
the masses should run the club, we the humble masses led by Jackstar and co. shall lead the revolution to achieve new heights of glory for the tiges. All hail the new leadership :clapping ;D
Ramps. If I stood would you vote for me. :thumbsup :shh
Would very much depend on the team standing.
If the team is good then we could afford to carry a little dead wood.
:shh
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The rebuild started 3 years ago.
Before that it was a demolition site with the club reacting to supporters' whims, threats etc.
No more :thumbsup
the masses should run the club, we the humble masses led by Jackstar and co. shall lead the revolution to achieve new heights of glory for the tiges. All hail the new leadership :clapping ;D
Ramps. If I stood would you vote for me. :thumbsup :shh
Would very much depend on the team standing.
If the team is good then we could afford to carry a little dead wood.
:shh
HAHAHA jeez thats funny :thumbsup
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Lol in the 8, make the most of it
If you don't think Schulz has shown improvement this year then I'd suggest you are in a very small minority.
absolute joke Maurice :thumbsup
Wouldnt think he is our best 12 players, would you ?
Your a joke!
Was that what we were saying?
Besides he'd be damn close to the top 12 this year anyway.
How many other guys do we have doing the job at CHB who we can throw forward to kick a goal?
Last year he wasn't even in the 22 and his career looked to be over.
This year he's never looked fitter & been one of our more consistant performers over the first four rounds.
Take your hate blinkers off and tell me again that Schulz hasn't improved this season Jackstar.
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Ramps. If I stood would you vote for me. :thumbsup :shh
You'd need a few votes other than Ramps ;D
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Im voting for whoever lets me and other OERites in the corporate boxes on the cheap lol.
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Im voting for whoever lets me and other OERites in the corporate boxes on the cheap lol.
;D there very compfy Ramps :thumbsup
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Lol in the 8, make the most of it
If you don't think Schulz has shown improvement this year then I'd suggest you are in a very small minority.
is schulz better than last year. possibly but he is still crap and i will never be happy that this guy is still on our list.
big massive test is the next month. if he continues doing what he is doing then i suppose u cant ask for much more than that.
however lets not kid ourselves we played a fremantle side that are really crap. a good win it was but to back it up against buldogs would mean the world to this club and its players.........
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Lol in the 8, make the most of it
If you don't think Schulz has shown improvement this year then I'd suggest you are in a very small minority.
is schulz better than last year. possibly but he is still crap and i will never be happy that this guy is still on our list.
big massive test is the next month. if he continues doing what he is doing then i suppose u cant ask for much more than that.
however lets not kid ourselves we played a fremantle side that are really crap. a good win it was but to back it up against buldogs would mean the world to this club and its players.........
So - he's poo, and he'll always be poo.
But if he plays well thats good.
Expert comments as always champ :lol
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Lol in the 8, make the most of it
ur such a tosser bentleigh, apparently no one can have a opinion except for urself.
im saying he is playing better than last year however 4 games doesn't justify his position.
if i had a choice right now id say get him off the list asap.
but if he continues this form in the next month against quality opposition then yeah keep him for sure.
its funny after one win hearing the lot of you. the tone in your comments as if we are automatically a top 4 contender after beating fremantle.
lol
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my mates that follow Freo & were at the game said it was the worst performance ever they seen & walked out at 3/4 time
was it the way the tigers played that caused them to be so bad on the day is YES
confidence in a beaten up side could grow like Hawthorn beleive & play so let just enjoy the week & see what comes of it
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Lol in the 8, make the most of it
ur such a tosser bentleigh, apparently no one can have a opinion except for urself.
im saying he is playing better than last year however 4 games doesn't justify his position.
if i had a choice right now id say get him off the list asap.
but if he continues this form in the next month against quality opposition then yeah keep him for sure.
its funny after one win hearing the lot of you. the tone in your comments as if we are automatically a top 4 contender after beating fremantle.
lol
Correct Daniel, one win and they think the problems are solved, reality is just around the corner.
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Correct Daniel, one win and they think the problems are solved, reality is just around the corner.
We're just enjoying the week - it's bliss :thumbsup
No-one is deluded about what we face.
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Lol in the 8, make the most of it
apparently no one can have a opinion except for urself.
Oh my - the irony.
"OMG we are still crap, sack the coach, board and every senior player !!!"
::)
if i had a choice right now id say get him off the list asap.
Why?
He is a 22/23 yo KPP and is starting to show his worth, former 1st round draft pick.
Many many KPP are stars @ 22?
He isn't Johno Brown but he's developing at a decent rate.
the tone in your comments as if we are automatically a top 4 contender after beating fremantle.
Not what I'm saying at all. I think our list is still average. Needs another major clean out of senior players who are not doing enough and need to use the rookie list better.
However the current regime should be given until the end of the 5yr plan to show their worth.
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my mates that follow Freo & were at the game said it was the worst performance ever they seen & walked out at 3/4 time
was it the way the tigers played that caused them to be so bad on the day is YES
confidence in a beaten up side could grow like Hawthorn beleive & play so let just enjoy the week & see what comes of it
* this thread was made before the Freo game
* Freo have had many, many worse games than that one
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One last bit of boring stats to back up my theory about why we need to give the current coach untill the end of his 5 year contract.
The only senior players we have are:
- Richo, Bowden, Johnson, Brown, Simmonds.
Games played in that group 260 to 161.
We have no players in the age games group from 160-120. Geelong have 8, including the like of Ling, Corey, Mooney, Ablett, Chapman etc.
How can you expect a coach in this postion to have success at this stage? (yr.4)
The only players we have: 118-50 are the following
- McMahon, Newman, Pettifer*, Polak, Hyde*, Cogs, Tuck, Deledio, Tambling, Foley, Raines, Schultz.
You cannot expect those last 5 to near their prime untill at least 2009.
Deledio, drafted 3 seasons and 4 rounds ago is our 13th most 'games played' player.
26 other players on the list have played less than 40 games.
Long way to go lads.
---
Perhaps by the 2nd half of the season the side will look something like:
Polak Thursfeild King
Newman Rance McMahon
Deledio Cogs Cotchin
Morton Reiwoldt Connors
Brown Schultz Edwards
Patto Tambling Foley
Richo Simmonds Johnson Tuck
- Raines, Jacko, Polo as the starting midfeild for the Burgers.
-
One last bit of boring stats to back up my theory about why we need to give the current coach untill the end of his 5 year contract.
The only senior players we have are:
- Richo, Bowden, Johnson, Brown, Simmonds.
Games played in that group 260 to 161.
We have no players in the age games group from 160-120. Geelong have 8, including the like of Ling, Corey, Mooney, Ablett, Chapman etc.
How can you expect a coach in this postion to have success at this stage? (yr.4)
The only players we have: 118-50 are the following
- McMahon, Newman, Pettifer*, Polak, Hyde*, Cogs, Tuck, Deledio, Tambling, Foley, Raines, Schultz.
You cannot expect those last 5 to near their prime untill at least 2009.
Deledio, drafted 3 seasons and 4 rounds ago is our 13th most 'games played' player.
26 other players on the list have played less than 40 games.
Long way to go lads.
Don't you go bringing FACTS in to support your argument. That's not very OER at all - stick with the innuendo and 'wink wink', it will make you sound much more passionate and knowledgeable. ;) If you know what I mean.
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Polak Thursfeild King
Newman Rance McMahon
Deledio Cogs Cotchin
Morton Reiwoldt Connors
Brown Schultz Edwards
Patto Tambling Foley
Richo Simmonds Johnson Tuck
Compare that, which is what I think should be roughly our best 22 hopfully sometime soon, to the Hawthorn side this week.
Guerra - 26
Gilham - 24
Brown - 24
Ladson - 24
Croad - 28
Mitchell - 25
Bateman - 26
Crawf - 33
Osborne - 25
Williams - 25
Taylor - 25
Sewel - 24
Hodge - 23
Campbell - 25
Clarke - 26
Not a young side, myth.
But they have a decent middle teir - which we don't.
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Don't you go bringing FACTS in to support your argument. That's not very OER at all - stick with the innuendo and 'wink wink', it will make you sound much more passionate and knowledgeable. ;) If you know what I mean.
I know what you're taking aim at, Smokey.
Got to say though that bringing facts in to support an argument is actually very OER. ;)
The 2 people who run this site deal in facts and researched information. :)
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Got to say though that bringing facts in to support an argument is actually very OER. ;)
The 2 people who run this site deal in facts and researched information. :)
Is that a FACT :rollin
:eyebrow :eyebrow
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Don't you go bringing FACTS in to support your argument. That's not very OER at all - stick with the innuendo and 'wink wink', it will make you sound much more passionate and knowledgeable. ;) If you know what I mean.
I know what you're taking aim at, Smokey.
Got to say though that bringing facts in to support an argument is actually very OER. ;)
The 2 people who run this site deal in facts and researched information. :)
i'll give it a FACT. :thumbsup
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my mates that follow Freo & were at the game said it was the worst performance ever they seen & walked out at 3/4 time
was it the way the tigers played that caused them to be so bad on the day is YES
confidence in a beaten up side could grow like Hawthorn beleive & play so let just enjoy the week & see what comes of it
* this thread was made before the Freo game
* Freo have had many, many worse games than that one
Mate, I have seen enough of Freo and can tell you that was nearly there worst performance EVER
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Don't you go bringing FACTS in to support your argument. That's not very OER at all - stick with the innuendo and 'wink wink', it will make you sound much more passionate and knowledgeable. ;) If you know what I mean.
I know what you're taking aim at, Smokey.
Got to say though that bringing facts in to support an argument is actually very OER. ;)
The 2 people who run this site deal in facts and researched information. :)
Yep. I do know that. You got my point - that's what mattered. I post to a few different forums and have recently dropped off BF because I struggle with overwhelming immaturity (probably my problem due to age, not theirs) and that's why I still enjoy coming on here - the discussions are generally much more balanced. And even though I am over the top passionate I am also old enough to be reasonably balanced. It's all good, especially after wins like last week!!!
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my mates that follow Freo & were at the game said it was the worst performance ever they seen & walked out at 3/4 time
was it the way the tigers played that caused them to be so bad on the day is YES
confidence in a beaten up side could grow like Hawthorn beleive & play so let just enjoy the week & see what comes of it
* this thread was made before the Freo game
* Freo have had many, many worse games than that one
Mate, I have seen enough of Freo and can tell you that was nearly there worst performance EVER
April 15, 2000,
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my mates that follow Freo & were at the game said it was the worst performance ever they seen & walked out at 3/4 time
was it the way the tigers played that caused them to be so bad on the day is YES
confidence in a beaten up side could grow like Hawthorn beleive & play so let just enjoy the week & see what comes of it
* this thread was made before the Freo game
* Freo have had many, many worse games than that one
Mate, I have seen enough of Freo and can tell you that was nearly there worst performance EVER
..and our best for some time.
A ten goal win in WA is never something to be taken lightly.
You are such a pessimist jackie.
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Mark Robinson writes in the Herald Sun today about a situation where clubs will get to protect their nominated 14 players prior to the 2010 draft, in anticipation of at least one and possibly two new clubs needing to add some experience for their 2011 debut seasons.
"UNPRECEDENTED trading mayhem will engulf the AFL in 2010 after proposed recruiting strategies for the Gold Coast and West Sydney franchises were revealed yesterday."
They would basically own these drafts, which is a topic that can be thrashed out at a later time, but this was the quote I found interesting:
"It is believed the AFL is against an "expansion draft", where clubs would have to nominate say, their best 14 players, and allow the rest to be up for selection for the two new teams. "
But how else would thay be competitive? With locals, rejects and 20 year old project players they've been protecting in the local league for 2 years (yes they both may get a look in at the drafts this year!!)
You can read the entire article here:
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sto...-11088,00.html
But in the meantime, I wonder who those 14 protected players would be at the end 2010?
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Who would our 14 most 'untouchable' be at this stage?
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Who would our 14 most 'untouchable' be at this stage?
We have a lot of cubs who have yet to prove themselves so not sure if we have 14 'untouchables' but I think the following are fairly safe at this stage:
Lids, Blingers, Patto, Thursty, Foley
Jack, Edwards, Connors, King, Simmo
Cotchin, Rance, Morton, Richo
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What about Schulz, ::) Some here think he is our best, obviously MT doesnt, lol
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Who would our 14 most 'untouchable' be at this stage?
We have a lot of cubs who have yet to prove themselves so not sure if we have 14 'untouchables' but I think the following are fairly safe at this stage:
Lids, Blingers, Patto, Thursty, Foley
Jack, Edwards, Connors, King, Simmo
Cotchin, Rance, Morton, Richo
When I saw the thread I looked at our list and came up with Deledio, Tambling, Foley, Thursfield, Riewoldt, Edwards, Cotchin, Rance, Morton, Putt (I think he can come up and develop as a full forward) and early picks from 2008 and 2009 drafts.
Putt is my smokie for the list of 14.
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Agree, substitute Putt for Simmo.
Also substitute would possibly look at one of either Hughes/Polak for Richo (only cos Richo will not leave the Tigers at that point in his career).
McGuane, Raines, Pettifer, Schultz, White, Jackson, JON, , Meyer, Polo etc. could be classified as 1st/2nd trade bait for a new club looking for players in the 24 to 28 year old range with 100+ games experience.
Lets hope that Craig Cameron (and not Miller) is all over this if it comes to pass.
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Might as well put it simply about a tall, athletic, strong marking player and take it to the extreme.
He'll either be our own Brad Moran or our own Buddy Franklin. :rollin
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Might as well put it simply about a tall, athletic, strong marking player and take it to the extreme.
He'll either be our own Brad Moran or our own Buddy Franklin. :rollin
Or Will Minson or Josh Fraser or even Angus Graham.
Lets hope that he, at the very least, displays enough form to warrant selection at AFL level.
He may even develop into a 50 or 100 game player, which would defy the odds for a 50+ draftpick.
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Yeah you would hope by 2010 Gus/Putty and Cleve will have developed to a level to earn their spot in the senior side but at this stage they haven't and is Gus and Putty's case they are still raw and unknown quantities. Talls take longer to develop too.
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Tonight was another good opportunity to see where we are at again. Although we've got more classier youngters still to come into the side over the next couple of years IMO we still need to dip deep in the next 2 drafts. We can't question the commitment and effort of the team in the last 3 weeks and there's light at the end of the tunnel but we still need to replace the triers with more classier players of the same type.
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Tonight was another good opportunity to see where we are at again. Although we've got more classier youngters still to come into the side over the next couple of years IMO we still need to dip deep in the next 2 drafts. We can't question the commitment and effort of the team in the last 3 weeks and there's light at the end of the tunnel but we still need to replace the triers with more classier players of the same type.
I concur with your thoughts on the draft. We are now 2-1-3. Is it better to come 14th or 9th?
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We are better of finishing closer to the bottom this year with really competitive efforts like last night. As I said in the other thread we need 2 mids a KPP and 200cm+ ruck. Thats the basis of what we need most considering what we have coming through at Coburg.
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We are better of finishing closer to the bottom this year with really competitive efforts like last night. As I said in the other thread we need 2 mids a KPP and 200cm+ ruck. Thats the basis of what we need most considering what we have coming through at Coburg.
funny u mention rucks? whats everyones thoughts on troy.
too inconsistent for me. one week he plays good, next week terrible
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Simmo is doing his job the same goes for Patto
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We are better of finishing closer to the bottom this year with really competitive efforts like last night. As I said in the other thread we need 2 mids a KPP and 200cm+ ruck. Thats the basis of what we need most considering what we have coming through at Coburg.
i would hate to see us continue last years "honourable wins" season ramps just for the sake of getting higher draft picks.
i know you dont mean it like that like were tanking but more if it pans out like that. If it does than yeah good but drafting is a lottery and no matter what anyone says, good players have been nabbed from all positions in the draft not neccessarily round one.
id just love to see this group of kids take their youthful enterprise and the confidence you only gain from actually winning matches and use that confidence to become a feared entity once again.
win, win, win... is always better than honourable loss, honourable loss, honourable loss...
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My opinion is that we need to do well in this draft, if we can do well and the kids we currently have can develop then we will be as KB likes to say be "right in the van" 3 years down the track. Midfielders we will be able to find in R2 and R3 of the draft, but boy if we could land a Hurley that would be sensational.
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Tonight was another good opportunity to see where we are at again. Although we've got more classier youngters still to come into the side over the next couple of years IMO we still need to dip deep in the next 2 drafts. We can't question the commitment and effort of the team in the last 3 weeks and there's light at the end of the tunnel but we still need to replace the triers with more classier players of the same type.
You're right but we actually need to do this every year going forward, without fail. Up until 4 years ago we had a poor record in this area and we are still playing catch up. The recruiters and football department managers are just as (even more maybe) important to the success and longevity of our club than most other departments.
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We are better of finishing closer to the bottom this year with really competitive efforts like last night. As I said in the other thread we need 2 mids a KPP and 200cm+ ruck. Thats the basis of what we need most considering what we have coming through at Coburg.
i would hate to see us continue last years "honourable wins" season ramps just for the sake of getting higher draft picks.
i know you dont mean it like that like were tanking but more if it pans out like that. If it does than yeah good but drafting is a lottery and no matter what anyone says, good players have been nabbed from all positions in the draft not neccessarily round one.
id just love to see this group of kids take their youthful enterprise and the confidence you only gain from actually winning matches and use that confidence to become a feared entity once again.
win, win, win... is always better than honourable loss, honourable loss, honourable loss...
Drafting, my friend, is not a lottery. Top 5 picks, from the last 5 years onwards, and more so in th future - give you a good chance of getting a A Grade 10 year players, and a pretty solid chance of at least getting a servicable 150 game player. Mistakes are made and kids dont come good, but by and large to picks are class. The drafting system is pretty complex these days, and while you can still get good players late you wont see a Deledio or Cooney not be spotted, ie. Hird @ 70.
You you argue against Deledio (pick#1-2004) and Cotchin (pick#2) are not some of most the most talented players on our list currently?
Frankly I think this stuff is stright forward and would not be needed to be said. Why do you debate this point?
I don't like the current AFL system, but it's the way it works.
I spose we will come 9th again :D
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If we play like we have the last 3 weeks we will win as many games as we'll lose but then the AFL will go stuff you we'll punish your young list, trying its guts out, at the draft table and reward the deliberate tankers instead ::).
We are better of finishing closer to the bottom this year with really competitive efforts like last night. As I said in the other thread we need 2 mids a KPP and 200cm+ ruck. Thats the basis of what we need most considering what we have coming through at Coburg.
funny u mention rucks? whats everyones thoughts on troy.
too inconsistent for me. one week he plays good, next week terrible
Simmo is 197cm and often competing against ruckmen who are 2-3 inches taller (202-4cm). Ruckmen need to be taller these days. That's why Ramps is suggesting another 200cm+ one.
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If we play like we have the last 3 weeks we will win as many games as we'll lose but then the AFL will go stuff you we'll punish your young list, trying its guts out, at the draft table and reward the deliberate tankers instead ::).
We are better of finishing closer to the bottom this year with really competitive efforts like last night. As I said in the other thread we need 2 mids a KPP and 200cm+ ruck. Thats the basis of what we need most considering what we have coming through at Coburg.
funny u mention rucks? whats everyones thoughts on troy.
too inconsistent for me. one week he plays good, next week terrible
Simmo is 197cm and often competing against ruckmen who are 2-3 inches taller (202-4cm). Ruckmen need to be taller these days. That's why Ramps is suggesting another 200cm+ one.
AFL cannot do this. Nor would they.
If Carlton can be allowed play like that vs. Melbourne R22 - then anything is allowed.
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We need to win games to build some confidence into the side, we have picked up some good players via the rookie list in previous seasons which is pure luck, them players choose to lift their workrate to become league footballers
Sometimes given a sniff is just as good as a top 10 draft pick & they get a taste of a few extra bonuses & pow
Newman was no top 20 pick but his effort after drafted got him to where he currently is, & after serious injury is a credit for his ability to work hard for something & is being rewarded in his contract
We also need to win games to keep the membership tally rolling cause another year down the bottom would see many turn thier backs on the club
We need to keep playing the way we are at present even if not winning games, the effort the lads are putting in is reward in itself. As they know if they keep producing them efforts it will create finals & you never know can create some upsets & other chances
Richmond have earnt the tag now as being unpredictable & capable of snatching a game. Hopefully this is the end of the days of the floggings & the Richmond supporter can attend games knowing we are a chance in any game :thumbsup :gotigers
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If we play like we have the last 3 weeks we will win as many games as we'll lose but then the AFL will go stuff you we'll punish your young list, trying its guts out, at the draft table and reward the deliberate tankers instead ::).
We are better of finishing closer to the bottom this year with really competitive efforts like last night. As I said in the other thread we need 2 mids a KPP and 200cm+ ruck. Thats the basis of what we need most considering what we have coming through at Coburg.
funny u mention rucks? whats everyones thoughts on troy.
too inconsistent for me. one week he plays good, next week terrible
Simmo is 197cm and often competing against ruckmen who are 2-3 inches taller (202-4cm). Ruckmen need to be taller these days. That's why Ramps is suggesting another 200cm+ one.
AFL cannot do this. Nor would they.
If Carlton can be allowed play like that vs. Melbourne R22 - then anything is allowed.
I didn't mean the AFL will deliberately punish us. What I'm saying is the draft system the way it is will hurt us if we "overachieve". We as reigning wooden spooners who haven't played finals in 7 years could finish mid-ladder the way we are playing at the moment, while the premiers of just 18 months ago who have made the finals the past 5 years and with 16 of that premiership side still playing could end up with pick 2 after having 4 picks in the top 22 last year. The current draft system punishes developing sides that do their best.
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the basic argument here is :
High Draft Picks VS Winning Club Culture and frankly id rather a winning culture to a losing one.
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the basic argument here is :
High Draft Picks VS Winning Club Culture and frankly id rather a winning culture to a losing one.
That's right blx.
People like Ramps would prefer us to tank, so we can get Naitanui, no thanks, losing is a bad disease that this club has had a lot of trouble getting rid of, the sooner we recover from that nasty virus the better.
And btw Ramps I'm not having a go at you about that, I fully understand your logic on topping up on high quality just that one more time, if we can get 8 wins this year and finish 10th, a No.7 draft pick will still inject a fair bit of class you'd hope.
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Time to stop focusing on the bottom of the ladder.
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the basic argument here is :
High Draft Picks VS Winning Club Culture and frankly id rather a winning culture to a losing one.
Myth IMO. Media/Internet forum spin rubbish.
Carlton won the most flags ever, and never had a spoon. This would be best record, hence best 'winning club culture'.
And yet largly due to poor list managment and draft mistakes, the had the worse run of any side ever 02-07 or so.
Fact remains, I hope our young players shine the rest of the year and get us over a few games - or at least shop us from getting smashed. However - come draft day top 3 pick are like gold - kids like Cotchin and Deledio don't come around often.
Another player of the ilk would be very helpful long term.
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richoatthedisco
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Richmond supporters know a lot about hope. We've been living there for a quarter of a century.
It began in disbelief. Premiers in 1980; favourites in 82.
They dropped BT for the grand final. He's kicked 80 for the year. I don't believe it. But we'll still win.
Confidence.
It began with confidence.
Disbelief set in when the Blues kicked away to a three goal lead. Hope was Rioli, our Maurice, weaving his way through traffic like a Balinese taxi driver. He brought us back into the game. Then the Dominator and his Blues kicked away again. We lost.
Disbelief.
Cloke; Raines, walk out.
Incredulity.
Bourke sacked; Wood leaves. WTF?
We still manage to thump Hawthorn a few times (Disco 11), but that dries up quick smart.
KB retires.
BT joins Cloke at Collingwood and kicks a ton. We get Craig Stewart.
stuff me.
A revolving door of former players hauled in from bush leagues to be sacked after a year.
Sheedy coaches Bombers back-to-back. Mum's favourite player. "That'll come back to bite us on the bum," GR had said when Sheeds left. Who would have thought winning the 1980 premiership would have such far-reaching, negative consequences?
KB appointed coach. Hope. 17 year old Knights. Hope. Save our Skins. Despair. Disbelief. A decade to go from dominant to desperate. We lose to Hawthorn 17 times in a row.
Despair.
Recycled duds. Useless top draft picks. Wooden spoons???!!!
But still we hoped.
And then there was Richo.
Hope. Born anew. Like the colt that streets the field in its first race, you were on him for life.
For a decade and a half we hoped, we hung our hats on Richo delivering a flag, hoping for yet never quite seeing a team built around him capable of complementing and cashing in on his unique gifts.
Richo is the Rome that burnt while Richmond's Nero's fiddled.
But he's still there, still burning. And still we hope.
Roam, Rome! and burn bright our shining star!
To see the 33-year-old stallion released from the paddock and galloping the field is to witness hope expressed in its purest physical form. It's Old Regret's colt released from long years at the rodeo getting ridden into the ground by two, three cowboys a week, for another crack with the wild bush horses. And isn't he having a crack!
But I wax.
Hope has its eye on the future. Ricmond's hope is that we can build a team to win a premiership and enjoy a sustained run of success.
If you're anything like me, you hope Richo's still around to enjoy it, but it's not looking likely. We hope the Big Fella can play until he's 40, or at least 36. We hope we can win a flag for him in that time.
We hope.
We hope.
Hope #1: Mark Coughlan. If we are to have any hope of challenging in the next few years this man's successful return to or near his best is the key. The hope engendered watching a 20-year-old Coughlan win 12 clearances in a losing late-season AAMI stadium effort six years ago is still around, transformed into the hope he can get back on the park safely. But if he can... if he can... it will take enourmous pressure off -
Hope #2: Brett Deledio. We hope for - nay, expect a superstar. We hope he will become one. Having Cogs there will benefit him enormously, hopefully allowing his brilliance to fully flourish on the biggest stages and win us a flag. It might. If...
Hope #3: Matthew Richardson sustains his magnificence for long enough for the rest to catch up. Does anyone seriously doubt his ability to do an Alastair Lynch in a good team? Put a gun team in front of him, sit him in the goal square and he'll kick 70 on his ear.
Hope #4: As always with Batman, we hope for and need Robin to be around to deliver and share in the spoils. That depends on...
Hope #5: The development of another key forward. The fact I can't name a Great White Hope currently on our list doesn't give me much hope. I hope the romance of coming home to help the Tigers win one appeals to Jonathon Brown. That depends on building a strong side, which depends on...
Hope #6: Developing the kids. Cotchin, the best thing since Deledio. We hope he's a wunderkind.
Hope #6: We picked the right kids.
Hope #7: We made the right trades.
Hope #8: Wallace knows what he's doing.
These sub-hopes are the building blocks of the ultimate hope, to win a premiership - soon, or any time. Hell, just to believe we're a chance every year instead of knowing we're not.
And we hope Richo is there.
http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?t=439242
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I like the first 3 points. I would agree with them and add another one.
If we are to have major success within next 3 season period: 2009-2012 I beleive we need:
- Cogs to come back. He will be massive bonus for club if he can back into our side.
- Deledio to develop into the superstar that he should have been as it is written in the stars
- Richo to give us at least 2 more years, hopfully closer to 4. Off the bench we should be able to play him as a wildcard floating wingman. He is 33 but he should be able to provide a Kouta-like impact, but greater. He is amazinly fit and fast still, outsprinted Luke Hodge in 150 meter run at the end of the game - and beat him by miles.
I would also one more - Nathan Brown. Because he missed so long he should have at least another 3 years in him. If we play him mostly as a Forward, with stints in the middle he should be able to play a long time yet. I feel he will be the difference between making finals, and making finals and having chance to win. You cannot replace class.
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the basic argument here is :
High Draft Picks VS Winning Club Culture and frankly id rather a winning culture to a losing one.
That's right blx.
People like Ramps would prefer us to tank, so we can get Naitanui, no thanks, losing is a bad disease that this club has had a lot of trouble getting rid of, the sooner we recover from that nasty virus the better.
And btw Ramps I'm not having a go at you about that, I fully understand your logic on topping up on high quality just that one more time, if we can get 8 wins this year and finish 10th, a No.7 draft pick will still inject a fair bit of class you'd hope.
I just feel that we need one more top up thats all. I understand we wont get Natanui or Rich now, Im still hoping for a Hurley but even a Trengrove may be ok for us in the first round, but Ill say this, theres a big difference in 1 draft spot, Essendon used No 7 to Ryder and we used 8 and got JON. In 2011, 2012 I dont want us to be looking around for the 1 player that can win us a flag having said that if we got a Warnock on the cheap and landed Hurley then it would be party time draft wise at Punt Rd.
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the basic argument here is :
High Draft Picks VS Winning Club Culture and frankly id rather a winning culture to a losing one.
That's right blx.
People like Ramps would prefer us to tank, so we can get Naitanui, no thanks, losing is a bad disease that this club has had a lot of trouble getting rid of, the sooner we recover from that nasty virus the better.
And btw Ramps I'm not having a go at you about that, I fully understand your logic on topping up on high quality just that one more time, if we can get 8 wins this year and finish 10th, a No.7 draft pick will still inject a fair bit of class you'd hope.
I just feel that we need one more top up thats all. I understand we wont get Natanui or Rich now, Im still hoping for a Hurley but even a Trengrove may be ok for us in the first round, but Ill say this, theres a big difference in 1 draft spot, Essendon used No 7 to Ryder and we used 8 and got JON. In 2011, 2012 I dont want us to be looking around for the 1 player that can win us a flag having said that if we got a Warnock on the cheap and landed Hurley then it would be party time draft wise at Punt Rd.
Agreed.
A Palmer or Ryder type pick 6-10 ould be the iceing on the cake.
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looks like TW will see the 5 year exercise through as per the age article, round 12 wasnt it?
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looks like TW will see the 5 year exercise through as per the age article, round 12 wasnt it?
unless "something went completely pear-shaped", - March
In football nothing is guaranteed.
In saying that I've seen enough already this season to suggest Terry is safe.
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I just feel that we need one more top up thats all. I understand we wont get Natanui or Rich now, Im still hoping for a Hurley but even a Trengrove may be ok for us in the first round, but Ill say this, theres a big difference in 1 draft spot, Essendon used No 7 to Ryder and we used 8 and got JON. In 2011, 2012 I dont want us to be looking around for the 1 player that can win us a flag having said that if we got a Warnock on the cheap and landed Hurley then it would be party time draft wise at Punt Rd.
Agree Ramps. Another influx of some classy top notch youth (after one more clean out) and our list will start to look very healthy going forward.
This week could be significant in determining where we finish this year. Win and we'll stay around 50%; lose and we could be have just 2.5 wins after 8 rounds despite much improved efforts that pushed the top sides.
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Ok, well the future will be intersting. To be honest after the Carlton game I was pretty saddened with the club. pee poor to be losing to Carlton without Judd. However, in the first half we looked not too bad at patches. At times this season we have should we might be ok down the track at some stage. It will be funny to see in 18 months how good and how long it has taken.
2 major points:
i. Our spine post-Polak is going to be intersting also.
ii. The paper posted first 3 players in the best as: Deledio, Cotchin, Foley. This alone must be enough to get somewhat happy about in these times of bleakness.
In terms of the playing list we need to get our poo together and stop joking ourself.
The following players must go: Bowden, Hyde, Pettifer, Tivendale, Howatt.
Cogs and Polak look long term 'injury unknowns'.
At this point we must develop and spine and midfeild for the future.
Rest Richo, Simmonds.
McMahon Thursfeild Moore
Connors Rance Newman
Tambling Cotchin Edwards
Morton Reiwoldt Brown
Collins Hughes White
Pattison Deleio Foley
Johnson Polo King Tuck
Play McGaune @ CHB for the Burgers and expect him to dominate to push for a senior game. Ditto Schultz CHF & Graham ruck. Putt and Gourdis must also play coburg 1's, not reserve rest of season. Raines & Jackson must start in middle. Meyer, JON, Casserly, Collard need to start showing something.
In our words - Tank now.
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Our club puts in pee poor efforts because some of them are playing with injuries & shouldnot be out there at all :banghead
The club is at fault for this, if we are going to lose anyway because of injuries, then we may as well play players who need game time & see what they have to offer. We should be protecting our injured players from more serious damage :banghead
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Rubbish, all clubs have to manage niggling injuries.
If we rested everyone who wasn't 100% then we wouldn't have 22 players to field in a game.
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Rubbish, all clubs have to manage niggling injuries.
If we rested everyone who wasn't 100% then we wouldn't have 22 players to field in a game.
thats rubbish other clubs would have rested Simmonds long ago & we not short of Ruckmen
Richo is another being pushed to the brink
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Richo is pushing himself to the limit.
You try telling the biggest Richmond supporter there is that he has to sit out of the centenary match when he's playing his best career ever.
He said himself before the match that he probably wouldn't be playing if it wasn't such a big game
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Richo is pushing himself to the limit.
You try telling the biggest Richmond supporter there is that he has to sit out of the centenary match when he's playing his best career ever.
He said himself before the match that he probably wouldn't be playing if it wasn't such a big game
Thats true he wouldnot like to miss the game & we all want him playing but he should have been rested after the All star game as should Simmonds & we could have won a few games including the centenery with fitter players
would think the coach & selectors would have thought the same but thier not thinkers at all ;D
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we could have won a few games including the centenery with fitter players
would think the coach & selectors would have thought the same but thier not thinkers at all ;D
That's the decision the match commitee have to make every week. Is Simmonds @ 70% worth more to us than Graham @ 100%.
To be honest I think you're off your rocker if you think you choose Graham in that situation.
Players from ALL clubs are managed through injuries, you're kidding yourself if you think otherwise.
Just one example off the top of my head was Chad Cornes who had been playing with his finger not fully healed from surgury on a torn tendon, plus an ongoing knee concern. He's out now that Port are out of the finals, but had they still been in the hunt you can bet he'd still be playing.
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we could have won a few games including the centenery with fitter players
would think the coach & selectors would have thought the same but thier not thinkers at all ;D
That's the decision the match commitee have to make every week. Is Simmonds @ 70% worth more to us than Graham @ 100%.
To be honest I think you're off your rocker if you think you choose Graham in that situation.
Players from ALL clubs are managed through injuries, you're kidding yourself if you think otherwise.
Just one example off the top of my head was Chad Cornes who had been playing with his finger not fully healed from surgury on a torn tendon, plus an ongoing knee concern. He's out now that Port are out of the finals, but had they still been in the hunt you can bet he'd still be playing.
Yes l would have rested Simmonds @ 70% for Graham at 100%, have you seen how off timing Simmonds is in his jumping.
he cant even keep up with the game & it wont be long before he goes down in a screaming heap & lost for the year
l know players are managed with injuries & l'm against it because its the first thing a coach will fall back on in a horrible defeat like Wallet has used in his post match
Chad Cornes :rollin he had no choice, his got so many injuries his a laughing stock even trying to play the Tigers game :lol
His coach is just as stupid, his making all kind of excuses this year ;D l'm sure its his very last gig :lol
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There's an article in the Sunday Age today about the Doggies 1999 draft picks. Of course they were drafted under Wallace's reign at the Dogs by Scott Clayton. A whole 9 years later these choices are being lauded. So much for a quick rebuild.
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The class of '99
Emma Quayle | July 12, 2008 - 7:26PM
AFTER several years in Brisbane, Scott Clayton was in his first year at the Western Bulldogs when he headed off to the 1999 national draft. He went home with what may be the best-ever single draft class: Robert Murphy (pick 13), Daniel Giansiracusa (32), Patrick Wiggins (35), Mitch Hahn (37), Lindsay Gilbee (43), Patrick Bowden (58) and Ryan Hargrave (66).
Not only are five of the seven still there nine years on, but all are key players.
Perhaps the group's rivals are two clusters of Cats - Joel Corey, Paul Chapman, Cameron Ling and Corey Enright (four of seven drafted also in 1999) and the 2001 class of Jimmy Bartel, James Kelly, Charlie Gardiner, Steve Johnson, Gary Ablett, Henry Playfair, Matthew McCarthy and David Johnson.
Full article at:
http://www.realfooty.com.au/news/news/the-class-of-99/2008/07/12/1215658195097.html
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Just for the record the Tigers 1999 draft picks were (Spud's first draft):
3. Aaron Fiora (78 games at RFC)
22. Ezra Poyas (9)
39. Scott Homewood (0)
52. Aaron Mills (14)
68. Ty Zantuck (68)
We traded for Leon Cameron (84) which gave the Dogs the picks they used to get Hahn and Hargrave.
We also swapped Steve McKee for Clinton King (58).
Ben Hollands (8 ) was elevated off the rookie list.
All were gone within 5 years of being recruited.
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So by that you reakon around 7 years...so with Lids, Bling, Polo, Meyer and Patto (2004 draft) that would take us to 2011. Hey isn't that when TW said we would begin our 'sustained era of success'?!
Well you could blow me down with a feather! :o ;)
I can only dream that the footy world could be applauding any of our draft decisions in the future let alone a 'crop'.
One day.... :sleep
Stripes
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The core of the side is starting to take shape. Spine of:
* Moore CHB. Thusty FB. One of Rance/Schultz/McGaune as the 3rd tall.
* Riewoldt kicked 5 @ CHF and gave two off. 2nd year 19 year old KPP. Hughes (21, 3rd year KPP) also looks to have put his hand up for FF and Morton is solid.
Starting midfeild of: Deledio, Cotchin, Foley for next 12 years. Would be scary of Cogs could be thrown into the mix.
Polo, White, Edwards, Tambling, Pattison, Connors were all in the side that beat WCE by 10+ goals.
Few kids outside 22 knocking on the door too.
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The core of the side is starting to take shape. Spine of:
* Moore CHB. Thusty FB. One of Rance/Schultz/McGaune as the 3rd tall.
* Riewoldt kicked 5 @ CHF and gave two off. 2nd year 19 year old KPP. Hughes (21, 3rd year KPP) also looks to have put his hand up for FF and Morton is solid.
Starting midfeild of: Deledio, Cotchin, Foley for next 12 years. Would be scary of Cogs could be thrown into the mix.
Polo, White, Edwards, Tambling, Pattison, Connors were all in the side that beat WCE by 10+ goals.
Few kids outside 22 knocking on the door too.
Your must be kidding.
Mentioning Schulz and Tambling, Tambling was a disgrace yesterday. Had 2 kicks up to 3/4 time. . If anyone was to star, yesterday was the day for him
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You see jack people on here refuse to budge when it comes to tambling.
Its like his a protected specie or something.
he has not deserved his spot in the side in the last month and should be dropped immediately...
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You see jack people on here refuse to budge when it comes to tambling.
Its like his a protected specie or something.
he has not deserved his spot in the side in the last month and should be dropped immediately...
have to agree with that,ritchie hasnt done much for awhile and wallet has to be consistent with his dropping of players.
lm really starting to think ritchie is a fp or hf flanker.
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The core of the side is starting to take shape. Spine of:
* Moore CHB. Thusty FB. One of Rance/Schultz/McGaune as the 3rd tall.
* Riewoldt kicked 5 @ CHF and gave two off. 2nd year 19 year old KPP. Hughes (21, 3rd year KPP) also looks to have put his hand up for FF and Morton is solid.
Starting midfeild of: Deledio, Cotchin, Foley for next 12 years. Would be scary of Cogs could be thrown into the mix.
Polo, White, Edwards, Tambling, Pattison, Connors were all in the side that beat WCE by 10+ goals.
Few kids outside 22 knocking on the door too.
Your must be kidding.
Mentioning Schulz and Tambling, Tambling was a disgrace yesterday. Had 2 kicks up to 3/4 time. . If anyone was to star, yesterday was the day for him
Unfortunately Jacko is right again. Tambling seems to think that giving of little slinky type handpasses 6 or 7 times a game is acceptable. UM NO IT ISNT. Tambling should be finding the footy 25 times again on average the way the game is being played these days and more often than not Tambling doesnt get past 15 most of which dont hurt the opposition. At the moment- he has no hurt factor - ZERO - when it comes to his possessions.
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yes l see no excuse for Richi Tambling apart from his coach
his slacked off & should be getting the ball alot more & hurting the opposition
maybe going back to Coburg will re-invent his hunger & show him what his got
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Young players tonight:
Brett Deledio (4th year)
Richard Tambling (4th)
Jack Riewoldt (2nd)
Shane Edwards (2nd)
Mitch Morton (4th)
Matthew White (3r)
Trent Cotchin (1st)
Daniel Jackson (5th)
Nathan Foley (5th)
Adam Pattison (4th)
Luke McGuane (4th)
Will Thursfield (4th)
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Young players tonight:
Brett Deledio (4th year)
Richard Tambling (4th)
Jack Riewoldt (2nd)
Shane Edwards (2nd)
Mitch Morton (4th)
Matthew White (3r)
Trent Cotchin (1st)
Daniel Jackson (5th)
Nathan Foley (5th)
Adam Pattison (4th)
Luke McGuane (4th)
Will Thursfield (4th)
Cleve (3rd), Polo (4th), Connors (2nd) have contributed well in recent games also.
But to some nothing has changed in the past 4 years ::).
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Young players tonight:
Brett Deledio (4th year)
Richard Tambling (4th)
Jack Riewoldt (2nd)
Shane Edwards (2nd)
Mitch Morton (4th)
Matthew White (3r)
Trent Cotchin (1st)
Daniel Jackson (5th)
Nathan Foley (5th)
Adam Pattison (4th)
Luke McGuane (4th)
Will Thursfield (4th)
Cleve (3rd), Polo (4th), Connors (2nd) have contributed well in recent games also.
But to some nothing has changed in the past 4 years ::).
And those same "some" have called for heads to roll because of our poor recruiting! Miller might have made some mistakes (I wasn't what I would call a fan) but I think he was unfairly blamed for poor recruiting when in fact his recruiting record would stand up to almost every other club.
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Tambling had a brilliant game. That must have embarassed some...a bit like Bowden's goal spree did to me. :-[
The difference is though is that Bowden is at the Twilight of his career while Bling is still improving. Bling could well be our captain in future years if the club reports are to be believed! :outtahere
Stripes
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For months Ive been saying that the list only has the ability to reach the bottom rungs of the 8 consisitently. I believe that some people at Richmond also believe that to be the case and thats one of the reasons for the review and for the changes.
Richmond cant just be happy to make the 8. Football clubs do not exist to make the 8. Football clubs like Richmond should exist so that it can win Premierships. We dont have a good enough list, the problem will also be excasserbated when Richo and Browny retire.
The football department and recruiting area needed to put in place a strategy that would see 2 clear waves of younger players coming through, unfortunately that is not the case, we only have 1 wave of younger players and a group of senior players that will be leaving the game shortly. Richmond needs to fill some holes that have been left open and we need to find another group of 5 or 6 young players to create a 2nd wave. Thats why change needs to happen, because if we get it wrong, we wont ever get past 7th or 8th place.
Richmond still has plenty of rebuilding to do.
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Ramps, you are concerned about replacing the older players. I say you have nothing to fear. :P
Richo is a unique player and an undeniable champion (and an enigma too!) but since we have moved him from the forwardline we have never been more unpredictable and scored more highly. We now look for the best avenue to goal rather than the same path to goal. We have a broad spread of contributors and Richos absence from the F50 has allowed us to develop a forward structure rather than just a power forward. We have a group of forwards who are developing and learning to work together to assist or kick a winning score and the best part is that they are all younger than 21! Throw in Edwards and even Collard crumbing and we finally have a strong forward team rather than just a strong forward.
Browny is a tremendous finisher (like Bowden in fact) particularly around his body but he struggles to lose a defender now days. Morton reminds me alot of Browny and could fill his role in the future as could Collard potentially.
Johnson will not be a big lose in my opinion. I think Lids, Cogs, Connors, Jackson or even White could all fill his midfield buffering role if required and the leadership he offers Foley could step in to replace quite easily.
Bowden has had a few excellent weeks but is quickly slowing down, is unaccountable and negative. Someone like Rance or Gourdis will easily replace Bowden.
Simmo will be the hardest to replace in the next few years. Patto is great at giving Simmo a rest but will struggle to fill the No. 1 ruck role leaving only Gus and Putt potentially to fill his role. This is why trading for Warnock should be a priority I feel becasue it is the area we are most vulnerable in Simmo's absence.
I also believe we have the two 'waves' you refer to. The '04 draft (Lids, Bling, Meyer, Polo and Patto) coupled with White, Foley, McGuane and Thursfield who were also taken around the same time plus the '07 draft (Cotchin, Rance, Putt and Gourdis) coupled with Morton and Collard is the two waves you are after. Add to this players of similiar age such as Riewoldt, Moore, Schulz, Edwards who are all playing in the first plus players such as King, Meyer, Polo, Raines, Cogs, Connors, Collins, Hughes, JON, Casserly and Gus who are all developing and pushing for selection.
I think our list is looking very good and with some extra draft and trades over the next few years we are no where near finished developing. The future is looking bright and I think time in the top 4 playing off for the flag is fast becoming a reality.
Stripes
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For months Ive been saying that the list only has the ability to reach the bottom rungs of the 8 consisitently. I believe that some people at Richmond also believe that to be the case and thats one of the reasons for the review and for the changes.
Richmond cant just be happy to make the 8. Football clubs do not exist to make the 8. Football clubs like Richmond should exist so that it can win Premierships. We dont have a good enough list, the problem will also be excasserbated when Richo and Browny retire.
The football department and recruiting area needed to put in place a strategy that would see 2 clear waves of younger players coming through, unfortunately that is not the case, we only have 1 wave of younger players and a group of senior players that will be leaving the game shortly. Richmond needs to fill some holes that have been left open and we need to find another group of 5 or 6 young players to create a 2nd wave. Thats why change needs to happen, because if we get it wrong, we wont ever get past 7th or 8th place.
Richmond still has plenty of rebuilding to do.
I am intersting in the list dynamics - have you reached this conclusion?
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I think we have at least two 'waves' but besides the ruck division I can't see an area in the team where we are obviously lacking and will struggle to compensate for when a senior player moves on.
We longer have any senior players who are irreplacable in fact the absence of many of them from their traditional roles have been the making of many of our developing younger players and the revitalisation of the senior players too.
We are developing great depth and competition for spots which is half the battle alone and we delisting players is becoming more difficult with each passing year. These are all great signs of a rapidly improving list.
There is very few clubs in the competition that have a list with as many quality young players who are all developing together about.
I think our team will surprize many of the next few years
Stripes
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Ramps, you are concerned about replacing the older players. I say you have nothing to fear. :P
I also believe we have the two 'waves' you refer to. The '04 draft (Lids, Bling, Meyer, Polo and Patto) coupled with White, Foley, McGuane and Thursfield who were also taken around the same time plus the '07 draft (Cotchin, Rance, Putt and Gourdis) coupled with Morton and Collard is the two waves you are after. Add to this players of similiar age such as Riewoldt, Moore, Schulz, Edwards who are all playing in the first plus players such as King, Meyer, Polo, Raines, Cogs, Connors, Collins, Hughes, JON, Casserly and Gus who are all developing and pushing for selection.
I think our list is looking very good and with some extra draft and trades over the next few years we are no where near finished developing. The future is looking bright and I think time in the top 4 playing off for the flag is fast becoming a reality.
Stripes
I have highlighted the players that need to show that they can play to a higher level, all of these players for one reason or another have question marks, thats why I suggest that we need to get another wave coming through.
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Ramps, the players you have highlighted are currently there for depth. If any of them step up, which I'm sure a good percentage of them will, we will have an incredible amount of quality young players all coming through at the same time. If you throw in the players drafted last year who have not even played a game yet - Rance, Gourdis, Putt and Collard - then we are looking very strong.
I don't think we need to bottom out again to get through quality players. At the moment we just need to top up with good draft choices to continue to add depth to our developing list and we are in for an extremely enjoyable ride over the next decade.
Stripes
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By the last game of the season our best XXII could look something like this:
McMahon Thursfeild McGaune
Moore Schultz Newman
Richo Cotchin Tuck
Tambling Reiwoldt Connors
Morton Brown White
Simmonds Deledio Foley
Cogs Bowden Johnson Patto
Polo, Edwards, Rance, Meyer, JON, Hughes, Raines, Jackson, King should be knocking on the door at coburg at the start of next season - its good to have young promising players on fringe of best 22. And then there is the 2nd wave of youth: Gourdis, Casserly, Collins, Graham. All pretty much kids.