Tick tock!

[YellowandBlackBlood]

so how much would you offer Frawley big tone?

Are you suggesting paying him overs?

That's exactly what I'm suggesting!!!!!!!!!!!
That's how it works WP. 
If it takes 800k pay it.
I really don't care how they get the money, just get it done.

It works that way if Clubs allow it to work that way. 

My take on FA is simple and it works like this and I'll use Frawley as an example.

Q: Does Frawley deserve to be the highest paid player at his current Club?
A: No

Q: What is he worth to his current Club? How much are they prepared to play?
A: In Frawley's case he is probably in their top half dozen to 8 players; so probably $500k a season at best but no more

Q: to get him is he worth becoming the highest paid player at his new Club on a very long term deal ?
A: No - because he is not going to win you premiership on his own. So you offer him only slightly more than what his current Club is offering. If he really wants to be part of the Club the money wont be sole factor of them coming

So IMHO Frawley isn't worth $800k a year. That simple. $600k perhaps but you don't want to throw all your eggs in one basket for one player.

And heaven forbid if a real gun becomes available and actually wants to come to Richmond; nominates Richmond and we can't accommodate because we've locked up a FA player long term (Frawley supposedly wants 5-7 years) by paying overs

Well said. 

[Rampstar]

I dont want Frawley, Id prefer we trade for a kid like Jaksch from GWS

[tony_montana]

I dont want Frawley, Id prefer we trade for a kid like Jaksch from GWS

yep Jaksch, Tomlinson..

[big tone]

so how much would you offer Frawley big tone?

Are you suggesting paying him overs?

That's exactly what I'm suggesting!!!!!!!!!!!
That's how it works WP. 
If it takes 800k pay it.
I really don't care how they get the money, just get it done.

It works that way if Clubs allow it to work that way. 

My take on FA is simple and it works like this and I'll use Frawley as an example.

Q: Does Frawley deserve to be the highest paid player at his current Club?
A: No

Q: What is he worth to his current Club? How much are they prepared to play?
A: In Frawley's case he is probably in their top half dozen to 8 players; so probably $500k a season at best but no more

Q: to get him is he worth becoming the highest paid player at his new Club on a very long term deal ?
A: No - because he is not going to win you premiership on his own. So you offer him only slightly more than what his current Club is offering. If he really wants to be part of the Club the money wont be sole factor of them coming

So IMHO Frawley isn't worth $800k a year. That simple. $600k perhaps but you don't want to throw all your eggs in one basket for one player.

And heaven forbid if a real gun becomes available and actually wants to come to Richmond; nominates Richmond and we can't accommodate because we've locked up a FA player long term (Frawley supposedly wants 5-7 years) by paying overs

Mate, you'll be 6 feet under before your fairy tale comes true. But good on you for not putting all your eggs in one basket.
In relative terms, if you had spent 8 years at a job and still enjoyed being there, and that's all you new, and all your friends were there and you were on 100k, would you leave and go to another job where you would have to earn all the respect again, make new friends, learn all their systems, that for another 20k?
Considering we are not much more advanced than Melbourne you would want more that 100k to move.
It baffles me after 30 years of being pathetic that people don't want the club to take a risk and have a go at a free hit like Frawley... And Goddard when he was available.
Half our problem is we don't rate spending money/draft picks on quality defenders. All our first draft picks have been on onballers or forwards for as long as I can remember.
Spend the money now on a key defender that will do the job for the next 5,6,7 years.... No need to wait for development, he is 1000% ready to go.....And then draft a midfielder with our first pick. 

[WilliamPowell]

Simple fact is I don't think Frawley is worth $800k a year or deserves a 5-7 year deal

I'm happy for them to go after Free Agents and to make a big play for someone who can win you games off their own boot or turn a game

Frawley isn't that sort of player IMHO. Even experts in the media are saying he isn't worth that much.

[big tone]

Simple fact is I don't think Frawley is worth $800k a year or deserves a 5-7 year deal

I'm happy for them to go after Free Agents and to make a big play for someone who can win you games off their own boot or turn a game

Frawley isn't that sort of player IMHO. Even experts in the media are saying he isn't worth that much.

So which FA should we go for? Who out there that is a FA that can win you games off their own boot and turn a game?
Mate there isn't that many players in the AFL that can do that let alone be up as free agents.

The other way to look at it even if you still live in the good old days is how many members or supporters would re-join or take out a membership after such a horrible year if they saw the club at least have a decent crack at trying to right that wrong?  I know you have said you are not sure you will spend the same money you have been after such a terrible year.
I'm sure an accountant can work that out even if he cannot see a free hit when it's staring him in the face.

[The Big Richo]

This year isn't the year for a FA.

We need to tidy up the list where we can and then reassess next year.

[big tone]

This year isn't the year for a FA.

We need to tidy up the list where we can and then reassess next year.

You don't rate Frawley? An AA defender that can stop the monsters but can actually get involved in the game as well by getting the footy.

Is our backline locked and loaded? Oh yer we have Dave Astbury, I think he's winning our B&F.

Maybe we could take a FA both years? Although we have won 5 in a row, we probably don't need the free hits.

Who is a FA next year? WP tells me there is a few guys available that can win games off their own boot and can turn a game that may come cheap.  because the last thing this club needs is to pay overs.

[Yeahright]

So which FA should we go for? Who out there that is a FA that can win you games off their own boot and turn a game?
Mate there isn't that many players in the AFL that can do that let alone be up as free agents.

So we have to take a free agent every year?

[Willy]

Chappy was woeful early on but his form in the last month has been pretty solid.
Its been a few years since Frawley was one of the best defenders. Would rather pinch Jaksch.

[WilliamPowell]

So which FA should we go for? Who out there that is a FA that can win you games off their own boot and turn a game?
Mate there isn't that many players in the AFL that can do that let alone be up as free agents.

The other way to look at it even if you still live in the good old days is how many members or supporters would re-join or take out a membership after such a horrible year if they saw the club at least have a decent crack at trying to right that wrong?  I know you have said you are not sure you will spend the same money you have been after such a terrible year.
I'm sure an accountant can work that out even if he cannot see a free hit when it's staring him in the face.

As an accountant I can assure you that $800k over say 5 years is not a free hit  . And as an accountant I'd be derelict in my responsibilities to say otherwise 

this year's FA pool is practically non-existent with most of them re-signing. Frawley becomes by default the best of the left over bunch, hence why he looking for $800k a season. However, prior to all the this year's FA's going off the market the list wasn't great. And there wasn't and isn't any that deserve(d) $800k a season. Don't need to target a FA every season; there's always the trade.

Facts are there is a lot of young talent north of the border. GWS cannot keep all of them, that's where I'd be looking, trading with them to bring a couple of there young guns to our Club.

[big tone]

So which FA should we go for? Who out there that is a FA that can win you games off their own boot and turn a game?
Mate there isn't that many players in the AFL that can do that let alone be up as free agents.

The other way to look at it even if you still live in the good old days is how many members or supporters would re-join or take out a membership after such a horrible year if they saw the club at least have a decent crack at trying to right that wrong?  I know you have said you are not sure you will spend the same money you have been after such a terrible year.
I'm sure an accountant can work that out even if he cannot see a free hit when it's staring him in the face.

As an accountant I can assure you that $800k over say 5 years is not a free hit  . And as an accountant I'd be derelict in my responsibilities to say otherwise 

this year's FA pool is practically non-existent with most of them re-signing. Frawley becomes by default the best of the left over bunch, hence why he looking for $800k a season. However, prior to all the this year's FA's going off the market the list wasn't great. And there wasn't and isn't any that deserve(d) $800k a season. Don't need to target a FA every season; there's always the trade.

Facts are there is a lot of young talent north of the border. GWS cannot keep all of them, that's where I'd be looking, trading with them to bring a couple of there young guns to our Club.

I totally understand the potential trade talent from GWS and GCS. But the thing with trading to get something good is you have to give something good 99% of the time.
I won't go on about Frawley because as per usual we haven't got the guts to have a go, let's face it if our long suffering supporters arnt willing to want to put their feet in the water, why should the club?

But why will a successful side like Geelong or Hawthorn pay him his $800k? Are they the dumb ones? WP I don't think so. Maybe they know that's just what it takes to be a successful club while teams like the tigers pay Grigg $350/$400k, Houli $300k, Chaplin $350/$400k, even  Griff $250k

Anyway have a great day 

[WilliamPowell]

I totally understand the potential trade talent from GWS and GCS. But the thing with trading to get something good is you have to give something good 99% of the time.
I won't go on about Frawley because as per usual we haven't got the guts to have a go, let's face it if our long suffering supporters arnt willing to want to put their feet in the water, why should the club?

Been a huge bug bear fo mine for years, our refusal to be daring at the trade table.

But why will a successful side like Geelong or Hawthorn pay him his $800k? Are they the dumb ones? WP I don't think so. Maybe they know that's just what it takes to be a successful club while teams like the tigers pay Grigg $350/$400k, Houli $300k, Chaplin $350/$400k, even  Griff $250k

Anyway have a great day 

IMHO there is no way Geelong or Hawthorn would pay Frawley $800k. Can see N0rt or the Bombers doing but not the Hawks or Cats. I can see Frawley going to the Cats but not on $800k, he will settle for less to get to a successful club. He (actually more likely his managment) will hold lesser clubs to ransom and demand the big $$$ but will drop his proce to get to a good club.

Also, and I forgot to post it before.

Our number 1 defender in Alex Rance is out of contract next season, would think he is a far greater priority than Frawley right now.

Ditto Martin & Cotchin. We need to lock our guns away and then see what's left over to throw at free agents

Would hate to think our club would be so stupid as to throw mega bucks at a FA and as a result we lose one of our guns in the process because we got our numbers wrong 

[big tone]

I totally understand the potential trade talent from GWS and GCS. But the thing with trading to get something good is you have to give something good 99% of the time.
I won't go on about Frawley because as per usual we haven't got the guts to have a go, let's face it if our long suffering supporters arnt willing to want to put their feet in the water, why should the club?

Been a huge bug bear fo mine for years, our refusal to be daring at the trade table.

But why will a successful side like Geelong or Hawthorn pay him his $800k? Are they the dumb ones? WP I don't think so. Maybe they know that's just what it takes to be a successful club while teams like the tigers pay Grigg $350/$400k, Houli $300k, Chaplin $350/$400k, even  Griff $250k

Anyway have a great day 

IMHO there is no way Geelong or Hawthorn would pay Frawley $800k. Can see N0rt or the Bombers doing but not the Hawks or Cats. I can see Frawley going to the Cats but not on $800k, he will settle for less to get to a successful club. He (actually more likely his managment) will hold lesser clubs to ransom and demand the big $$$ but will drop his proce to get to a good club.

Also, and I forgot to post it before.

Our number 1 defender in Alex Rance is out of contract next season, would think he is a far greater priority than Frawley right now.

Ditto Martin & Cotchin. We need to lock our guns away and then see what's left over to throw at free agents

Would hate to think our club would be so stupid as to throw mega bucks at a FA and as a result we lose one of our guns in the process because we got our numbers wrong 

Me too. Maybe they need a good man like yourself running the books 
We could get rid of the deadwood I mentioned and have some left over for a party to celebrate. 

[Stripes]

I remember preseason when Grimes went down many people here were bemoaning the ability of Astbury. They said he would never make it. Season comes and he becomes our most improved player.

I would take Astbury over Grimes any day of the week. Astbury has the size and strength to trouble the monster forwards like Cloke, Tippett, Hawkins, Petrie and Walker. We are a better balanced defense when we have Astbury at Full Back, Rance CHB and Chaplin the third/floating defender.

Astbury has good disposal and can feed the ball off to Rance, Houli etc to run the ball out of the D50.

I do agree with you about his game output though. Unless he can get his body right and start to string together more games through a season so we can rely upon him he will never become a permanent fixture in the backline. Grimes is the same but his limitations are now starting to mount. Grimes doesn't have the size to compete body on body nor the confidence to mark or depose of the ball cleanly.