One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: Ox on April 14, 2010, 04:38:24 PM
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I would like to hear this forums individual views on this.
Firstly i see the move as a failure by the current leadership group and Administration.
It's common knowledge to those with first hand info that Brett Deledio displayed an exuberant amount of self-amorousness upon Bens arrival at the club,in fear of his supposed number one ranking as RFC Superstar. :wallywink
With this type of childish mentality existing and in view of the current suspension(s) one has to ask,"WTF is this club REALLY all about.
Brendan Gale -
While his intelligence goes far beyond that of the average footballer his tactics seem a complete backflip from last weeks defensive statement regarding Cousins.
How can you,one week be praising an individuals efforts and defending them from journalistic allegations and innuendo to the next, passing an unfair judgement on them that virtually makes them a dead man walking?
Weak,Directionless leadership and management.
Ponder the fact Cuz is easily our most experienced player.
Ponder the fact he has gone on record as stating his part in the drama was no more than that of what is expected of such a player with his overall mileage.
Ponder the fact he is drug tested three times a week,which obviously isn't good enough in the view of some......
Next move by the football world - Make Ben an alcoholic.
You're all filthy hypocrites that drink to get drunk,smoke to get high or snort to get horny,so maybe you're pointing the finger at the part of you that you hate.
Connors suspension,while possibly deserved is,as Jake has stated,ludicrous as he has been banned from training with the club for the first six weeks.
What a limp Decision.
Why not just throw the guy into rehab then?FFS!!!!
I understand this club is trying to appear as though it's a new era burt it looks to be simply another era of poo.
This is another failure on behalf of the club and with Gale,Free,Cambo etc on board it's gonna be no surprise when Hardwick gets driven out of the club and the 90s brigade of mercinary,conditioned losers take over in one final act of mutiny.
When this happens...say goodbye to our club for the last time.
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omg , whats going on here ox
i cant agree with u more, lately we have been thinking the same. i must be gettng sick or maybe u r lol
all thi sbs that has happened is the rfc succombing to media pressure to appear tough and be lik eall others and punish
its all bs
if the club new he had a drinking problem why didnt they act first, the club is at fault not ben not luke not dean , connors is just a scapegoat, the rfc failed guys like marty mcgrath, casrl peterson etc cos they could deal with thier issues, and now its happened all over again
i just hope that somehow after this somehow the club /teams comes out firing just as geelong did a few yrs ago after their crisis meeting then came out and thumped us by 157 points
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Hmmmm - My take.
Media storm in a teacup aside, Cuz is gunna be hounded come hell or high water and it was him splattered all over the front of the paper right or WRONG.
If we are starting from scratch and Dimma has set his rules, agree with it or not I have to say it is the right move! Without knowing the full facts there has to be a scapegoat, to get it into the players heads no-one is exempt from the path we have put ourselves on.
In the scheme of things Melbourne this weekend doesn't matter and having one of our best backmen out sends another clear message to the group.
Connors - I wouldn't of banished him for the first 6 weeks of his suspension. I would tell him how it is and get him on the track and make an example of him. Tell him he has had his last chance and he has to show a complete turn around, first to training, last to leave. Let him know exactly how he has to play if/when he gets back and leave him under no illusion as to what is expected.
Just let me re-iterate that I am all for the boys getting together for a drink, think it would be of more value to the team to have the boys getting together and bonding, seeing they are all relatively new to each other. But one bad egg has bought it all to a head and it is time to lay low on the radar while we get this rebuild underway.
An example had to be set .........
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Isn't this the sort of thing Leading Teams were paid gazillions to sort out?
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Weak,Directionless leadership and management.
Disagree entirely. Quite the opposite actually.
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get off the gas ox, or perhaps get on it :o, the club has handled the issue admirably. The facts are that all clubs are subjected to incidents such as this from the reigning premieres to the cellar dwellars no-one is immune which means it comes down to how it is handled. The club could not have possibly made a BIGGER statement.
The only thing I was dissapointed on was Ross Monaghan failed in his capacity of football manager to ensure that the touring party were tucked in bed at a reasonable time. If anyone needed to be dishing out haymakers it was he not cuz, luke or polo...but that's another story
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I agree with the action taken, these boys need to learn, theres a time and a place, if they want to write themselves off, do it at home, where there wont be any media, (unless it Cuz's house, where theres one media scumbag behind every tree). I personally dont care if they drink, but when it goes public like this, its damn embarrassing for the club and for us supporters. And I hope stupidhead connors realises what he's done to Cousins, friggin bloody idiot! :banghead
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Media aside.
Lets just everyone forget the media absolutly put it behind us. Don't fall into the trap of wanting to do the exact opposite of what the media want to simply - win the battle.
My take:
- We are a professional football club. In an extremely professional league with incredibly high standards.
- We have a young list with young men not only developing as players but as human beings.
It is the clubs duty to make sure that the direction of the football club is crystal clear to our investments (players). A simple united front going forward with quality and professionalism.
Having a beer at 3am on a Saturday Night before a recovery session is just not acceptable. Albeit in relative private quarters.
Connors has had history with alchohol and copped 8 weeks. Sure you can argue he's a bit of a scape goat and a result of teh club wanting to make him an example. But Steve Johnson copped 7 weeks for continued drinking issues.
The trio that weRE caught up the drama of Connors antics copped a week. Government/Media and Society are doing everything it can to show that being drunk, or drunk to the point were your physical or violent is just completly unacceptable, and rightly so. It is also been shown that mates, partners, family whoever can help stop situations of invulnerability - which is exactly what Connors got himself into. The "Champion Move" campaign springs to mind and there are more examples of always travelling home with a mate if they're drunk etc. For anything out of safety.
The trio were repremaned for letting a mate with a known problem with alchohol get to a state where he had the potential to be invulnerable. Its not there fault he was drunk but the failed the basic skill to look after a mate and pull him into line. They may have tried and failed but you live and die as a team. This needs to be learnt and displayed off field before they we can learn to see it on field.
Surely everyone has been in a situation where they've had to cut a mate off. Surely common sense if your in the public eye you do it every time and quicker than the average person.
I for one have no sympathy. Well done RFC. :clapping
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The only thing I was dissapointed on was Ross Monaghan failed in his capacity of football manager to ensure that the touring party were tucked in bed at a reasonable time.
It's a problem with many today that they are always looking to blame someone else.
Individuals are responsible for their own behaviour.
Can't have a squad of nannies for a bunch of grown men however rules and culture can set standards that have to be met.
Sydney's no idiots policy has seen them successful for a long time. Culture.
AFL players are professional sportsmen, they are not a mere reflection the rest of society no matter how some try to dress it up.
It's their job to firstly look after their health so they can be in peak condition. Secondly they are privileged to represent the RFC.
They earn a heck of a lot of money in the process.
This was on an interstate trip in the middle of the season. It was not an end of year function.
A far better player in Brendan Fevola got sacked for similar antics & Connors can count himself lucky.
If you want to write yourself off every week then go do it in the bush leagues and no one will care less. :wallywink
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The only thing I was dissapointed on was Ross Monaghan failed in his capacity of football manager to ensure that the touring party were tucked in bed at a reasonable time.
It's a problem with many today that they are always looking to blame someone else.
Individuals are responsible for their own behaviour.
Can't have a squad of nannies for a bunch of grown men however rules and culture can set standards that have to be met.
Sydney's no idiots policy has seen them successful for a long time. Culture.
AFL players are professional sportsmen, they are not a mere reflection the rest of society no matter how some try to dress it up.
It's their job to firstly look after their health so they can be in peak condition. Secondly they are privileged to represent the RFC.
They earn a heck of a lot of money in the process.
This was on an interstate trip in the middle of the season. It was not an end of year function.
A far better player in Brendan Fevola got sacked for similar antics & Connors can count himself lucky.
If you want to write yourself off every week then go do it in the bush leagues and no one will care less. :wallywink
well said Mr Magic! :clapping
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It's all part of our generation long tanking program, guaranteed to get us some top draft picks.
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Clubs are obsessed with image these days. Good image means more $$$$.
The media perspective is one of satisfaction and joy. But then how would a pack of wolves feel if the fence around some sheep fell.
At the end, right or wrong, the club has suspended 3 blokes for not supporting their teammate and these 3 have been left to fend for themselves and have received very little support. The club has told Connors to bugger off for 6 weeks - again no support. I think there is a bit of hypocrisy there.
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image , who cares about image
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- We are a professional football club. In an extremely professional league with incredibly high standards.
- We have a young list with young men not only developing as players but as human beings.
Agree.
Ever seen the film,Scent of a Woman?
Having a beer at 3am on a Saturday Night before a recovery session is just not acceptable. Albeit in relative private quarters..
Disagree.
What is this - Orwells 1984?
FFS.
What if u can't get to sleep because you feel so poo about the stae of teh club along with your own personal career.
Do u suggest taking a sleeping tablet or maybe lying in bed like a convalescent vegetable
just to appease societies impression of how their particular teams players act,even within the boundaries of their own privacy?
You're living in a fantasy world my friend if that's what you expect competitive spirits to lay down and do
Connors has had history with alchohol and copped 8 weeks. Sure you can argue he's a bit of a scape goat and a result of teh club wanting to make him an example. But Steve Johnson copped 7 weeks for continued drinking issues.
Where's the sense in banning him from training for 6 weeks?
Matthew Stokes was moving Lois Lane and is back training nxt week.
Unless Connors committed a crime that rivals this,the club and it's decision look very LIMP!
The trio that weRE caught up the drama of Connors antics copped a week. Government/Media and Society are doing everything it can to show that being drunk, or drunk to the point were your physical or violent is just completly unacceptable, and rightly so. It is also been shown that mates, partners, family whoever can help stop situations of invulnerability - which is exactly what Connors got himself into. The "Champion Move" campaign springs to mind and there are more examples of always travelling home with a mate if they're drunk etc. For anything out of safety.
You're an idealist.
What's the view like from up there ?
I thought the 3 of them WERE travelling home with him ?
The trio were repremaned for letting a mate with a known problem with alchohol get to a state where he had the potential to be invulnerable. Its not there fault he was drunk but the failed the basic skill to look after a mate and pull him into line. They may have tried and failed but you live and die as a team.
They were crucified as Individuals,if you want to use God speak......
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If you want to write yourself off every week then go do it in the bush leagues and no one will care less. :wallywink
This would apply only to Connors...rite?
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Love Machine, good place in Prahan,
Few of the Richmond boys get there as well, LOL.
They probably wont anymore though :cheers
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I used the word - u brought it up.
Talk about the topic or run along to the Love Machine,Pet.
don't tell me what to do big man!
I don't really care what they did re. the connors et al thing. it gives some more kids a chance, gives Cuz a needed break. connors well, it does seem excessive but who knows the truth anyways. As for McG, he needs some time in the magoos and who was the other one? I forget already but who cares. We are in ground zero of a 15 year plan at the moment.
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I am completely opposed to taking punitive measures for what may be a persons shortcomings. We should help those who make a mistake, not demonise them! I believe that stances need to be taken but to punish players for wrong doing of another is even more ludicrous! Drop Connors from the team but allow him to continue to do what he does best for Coburg!
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Oops and Polo. forgot about him. He went ok last week too, sort of, in a Polo sort of game.
the whole lot of them should be sent to kicking school for 8 weeks.
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Snip!.... Stick to the topic ppl
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Snip!.... Stick to the topic ppl
Why do u think Polo hasnt been mentioned much?
Obviously Cuz is high profile, and Connors got 25 to life. but no one is mentioning Polo much.
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As I said before I think the club got this 100% right.
I don't think they caved into the media. I think for the first time in a very long time the'y made a tough call on poor behaviour by our players. IMHO it's been along time coming. As I posted somewhere else:
"the Club has acted swiftly and firmly - as a member I cannot ask for more."
Of the 4 the one I feel most for is Ben Cousins because he copping it from the media not becuase of what he did but because of who is and that is the disgraceful part.
As Ben has acknowledge that he probably dind't handle things as well as he should (although he gets a gold star from me for clocking Connors ;D) then that's good enough for me. Is he a deadman walking? No I don't think so because he has shown his actions on the field do the talking for him these days and I have no doubt they will for the remainer of the season
The one who should be copping it is Connors because this isn't the first time he as acted like a dill because he can't handle the grog or to be more precise doesn't know when to stop when he is downing the grog. How many chances do you give him? He has had warnings etc and still hasn't got through his thick skull that he is a professional athlete, who's been given a opportunity and that he has a responsibility to every single person associated with the RFC and that's not just his team mates, but staff, sponsors and us the members.
On the club supporting him I will repeat what I posted in the following thread:
http://oneeyed-richmond.com/forum//index.php?topic=10947.msg182440#msg182440
"I can assure you the club has tried to help Daniel, he has been warned and the help has been there but at the end of the day Dan Connors he has to want to help himself. Hopefully this is the kick up the bum he needs or he will become another waste of obvious natural talent"
As for being banished for six weeks and the comparison to Stokes - well Stokes was banished and not allowed to train at Geelong for about the same amount of time, he is only allowed to train with them again as of this week. But the best comparison to this sort of punishment is another Cat in Stevie Johnson - they banished him for 6 or so weeks and suspended him for 8 week or so in total. IMHO it was a defining moment for the GFC because their leadership group said "you break the rules you will not get away with it anymore" since that time they won 2 flags and are the benchmark of the competition. If we want to base ourselves on club in this comp, then Geelong is bloody good place to start.
As for Polo & McGuane - they missed recovery caused in part by trying to placate and drunken yobbo team mate. Harsh penalty perhaps but for missing recovery I would think it is spot on. Important thing now going forward is that this is the "norm" and not the exception for this sort of thing (missing recovery)
Finally, I think it was x who said "who cares about image?" Well rightly or wrongly image is so bloody important these days. The AFL is a multi million dollar industry and Richmond is a part of that. And in an industry where sponsors are paramount we do have to consider image
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Ox.
It IS totally unacceptable to be up drinking at 3am. They had a recovery session the night before. You could be sympathetic if it was someones birthday celebrations or engagement or 300th game even. What were they celebrating. You don't need to get on the pee at 3am to have a good time. Your an AFL footballer you sacrifice some of the simple pleasures of life, and one of them is the ability to get on the pee at 3am and act like a goose. Can't handle it, well then get out. Go play for a local league club for 50k a year and get sloshed after every game if it's that important. What do I expect players to do if they can't sleep? Ge anything but get on the pee. Watch TV, listen to some tunes there are other forms of entertainment other than getting on the pee cause I'm not tired. Weak as pi$$ excuse Ox.
8 weeks may be strong but ge he if anyone was having doubts about whether getting on the gas and having a bender during the season was a good idea. Well that's completely gone now. That is a good thing.
Crucified as Individuals... That isn't even remotely true. For a start they were punished as a group for not policing Connors. They each made a decision to not act. Surely all us guys that enjoy a drink have been in a situation like this before where a mate that likes a drink is well in front of the rest of us. It is funny seeing a mate ride himself off. As professional footballers in a hotel, interstate, representing the RFC it's not good enough to have not acted. To sit there and think, hmm not my problem he'll embarrass himself and the club but not me - Is not good enough. No leadership was shown as friends and a lesser extent team mates.
If it were me that didn't act and help a mate out that is in the public eye and representing my footy club, I'd cop the 1 week ban on the chin and make sure next time my team mates were enjoying a quiet drink that it stays that way and as professional athletes if anything the healthy amount of alcohol is consumed.
They shouldn't even be drinking during the season anyway.
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good post Popey :)
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Ox.
It IS totally unacceptable to be up drinking at 3am. They had a recovery session the night before. You could be sympathetic if it was someones birthday celebrations or engagement or 300th game even. What were they celebrating. You don't need to get on the pee at 3am to have a good time. Your an AFL footballer you sacrifice some of the simple pleasures of life, and one of them is the ability to get on the pee at 3am and act like a goose. Can't handle it, well then get out. Go play for a local league club for 50k a year and get sloshed after every game if it's that important. What do I expect players to do if they can't sleep? Ge anything but get on the pee. Watch TV, listen to some tunes there are other forms of entertainment other than getting on the pee cause I'm not tired. Weak as pi$$ excuse Ox.
8 weeks may be strong but ge he if anyone was having doubts about whether getting on the gas and having a bender during the season was a good idea. Well that's completely gone now. That is a good thing.
Crucified as Individuals... That isn't even remotely true. For a start they were punished as a group for not policing Connors. They each made a decision to not act. Surely all us guys that enjoy a drink have been in a situation like this before where a mate that likes a drink is well in front of the rest of us. It is funny seeing a mate ride himself off. As professional footballers in a hotel, interstate, representing the RFC it's not good enough to have not acted. To sit there and think, hmm not my problem he'll embarrass himself and the club but not me - Is not good enough. No leadership was shown as friends and a lesser extent team mates.
If it were me that didn't act and help a mate out that is in the public eye and representing my footy club, I'd cop the 1 week ban on the chin and make sure next time my team mates were enjoying a quiet drink that it stays that way and as professional athletes if anything the healthy amount of alcohol is consumed.
They shouldn't even be drinking during the season anyway.
Ok.
I agree on some points regarding Connors now that i have found out the kid is a A1 alcoholic.
8 Weeks is justified,perhaps but 6 weeks of no training is not only riduculous but plain stupidity especially when the kid was moving forward.
Under the current plan w,he will be lucky to be match fit in 12 weeks.Lucky.-Rd 17 ?
How do you police an alcoholic?
Once it's going down there's no stopping them...and they drink the first 6 as though they were water.
Bang -all of a sudden he's acting like an arshole.
Good luck Popey.
How do we know Cousns didnt stay around to keep an eye on things...i thionk he did.
It's the clubs position to send Minders along when there is a pre existing condition in regards to somebodies "illnes" OR provide counselling.
You say they shouldn't have been drinking during the season - i used to support this view but have since accepted that such a statement is ludicrous.
Every club in the comp has players who soup on and the list increases as the season goes on.
It's the part of the games culture that is and will remain unchanged.Silenced but unchanged.
You're a smart fella Popey.Surely you know this deep down.
Cousins wasn't even peeed....
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Dan has a little bit of history with that sort of thing so we felt ... the whole situation could have been averted if someone had stood up and said, 'Listen, enough's enough'.
U mean like the club should have moths ago ????
"The other guys tried their best, but I just don't think they handled the situation well enough.
"If someone had the balls to stand up and say, 'Dan, enough's enough, go to bed', none of that would have happened.''
Yeh and if we hadn't been such a poo club you would't have ever coached.
Moron,
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8 Weeks is justified,perhaps but 6 weeks of no training is not only riduculous but plain stupidity especially when the kid was moving forward.
Under the current plan w,he will be lucky to be match fit in 12 weeks.Lucky.-Rd 17 ?
I beleive he is allowed to train and play at Coburg, but not Richmond
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Ok.
I agree on some points regarding Connors now that i have found out the kid is a A1 alcoholic.
8 Weeks is justified,perhaps but 6 weeks of no training is not only riduculous but plain stupidity especially when the kid was moving forward.
Under the current plan w,he will be lucky to be match fit in 12 weeks.Lucky.-Rd 17 ?
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that's still enough time to be fit for finals...it's appropriate under the circumstances :cheers
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8 Weeks is justified,perhaps but 6 weeks of no training is not only riduculous but plain stupidity especially when the kid was moving forward.
Under the current plan w,he will be lucky to be match fit in 12 weeks.Lucky.-Rd 17 ?
I beleive he is allowed to train and play at Coburg, but not Richmond
even that's a wishy washy decision.
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There's a difference between having a few quiet ones and getting completely ratarsed at 3am and being outa control, Ox.
Of course the players drink a bit. But Connors shouldn't have got in that state. With him one is too many and twenty is not enough!
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How do we know Cousns didnt stay around to keep an eye on things...i thionk he did.
You think? Ox, with due respect you have NFI what occurred.
Cuz is happy to wear it. That's good enough for me.
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Magic, you are spot on, mate!
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Cuz and the other 2 got one week.
One stuffing week.
FFS.
ONE stuffing WEEK.
They'll be back next week.
The world hasn't nuked itself.....yet.
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How do we know Cousns didnt stay around to keep an eye on things...i thionk he did.
You think? Ox, with due respect you have NFI what occurred.
Cuz is happy to wear it. That's good enough for me.
I know what happened idiot
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What happened to your avatar, Oxymoron. it's pretty dull. Is it a country's flag or something?
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What happened to your avatar, Oxymoron. it's pretty dull. Is it a country's flag or something?
i cant even see it.
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Ox.
It IS totally unacceptable to be up drinking at 3am. They had a recovery session the night before. You could be sympathetic if it was someones birthday celebrations or engagement or 300th game even. What were they celebrating. You don't need to get on the pee at 3am to have a good time. Your an AFL footballer you sacrifice some of the simple pleasures of life, and one of them is the ability to get on the pee at 3am and act like a goose. Can't handle it, well then get out. Go play for a local league club for 50k a year and get sloshed after every game if it's that important. What do I expect players to do if they can't sleep? Ge anything but get on the pee. Watch TV, listen to some tunes there are other forms of entertainment other than getting on the pee cause I'm not tired. Weak as pi$$ excuse Ox.
8 weeks may be strong but ge he if anyone was having doubts about whether getting on the gas and having a bender during the season was a good idea. Well that's completely gone now. That is a good thing.
Crucified as Individuals... That isn't even remotely true. For a start they were punished as a group for not policing Connors. They each made a decision to not act. Surely all us guys that enjoy a drink have been in a situation like this before where a mate that likes a drink is well in front of the rest of us. It is funny seeing a mate ride himself off. As professional footballers in a hotel, interstate, representing the RFC it's not good enough to have not acted. To sit there and think, hmm not my problem he'll embarrass himself and the club but not me - Is not good enough. No leadership was shown as friends and a lesser extent team mates.
If it were me that didn't act and help a mate out that is in the public eye and representing my footy club, I'd cop the 1 week ban on the chin and make sure next time my team mates were enjoying a quiet drink that it stays that way and as professional athletes if anything the healthy amount of alcohol is consumed.
They shouldn't even be drinking during the season anyway.
Ok.
I agree on some points regarding Connors now that i have found out the kid is a A1 alcoholic.
8 Weeks is justified,perhaps but 6 weeks of no training is not only riduculous but plain stupidity especially when the kid was moving forward.
Under the current plan w,he will be lucky to be match fit in 12 weeks.Lucky.-Rd 17 ?
How do you police an alcoholic?
Once it's going down there's no stopping them...and they drink the first 6 as though they were water.
Bang -all of a sudden he's acting like an arshole.
Good luck Popey.
How do we know Cousns didnt stay around to keep an eye on things...i thionk he did.
It's the clubs position to send Minders along when there is a pre existing condition in regards to somebodies "illnes" OR provide counselling.
You say they shouldn't have been drinking during the season - i used to support this view but have since accepted that such a statement is ludicrous.
Every club in the comp has players who soup on and the list increases as the season goes on.
It's the part of the games culture that is and will remain unchanged.Silenced but unchanged.
You're a smart fella Popey.Surely you know this deep down.
Cousins wasn't even peeed....
Yeah agreed. 6 weeks away from the club may be extreme but could really be the making of him. It could make him more hungry and gain respect for the place which clearly he's let down. I haven't got the right answer as how the 3 should have handled the situation as who knows what really happened. All i know is that being true to the word team mate is that not only on field but off field you look after them. Connors clearly has a problem and wouldn't have made many trips interstate and 2 or 3 drinks would have been enough, cut him off and if he keeps going maybe ring a club official alarming them of the situation then its in there hands. You sit back and do nothing and hope he is OK is just negligent and not good enough from a team mate point of view.
Punishments may be harsh but at the end of the day we have Dea, Taylor and Astbury possibly debuting for us which is fantastic and quiet possibly maybe bring in more tiger supporters then it would have previously. Opportunities are available from many different ways. Hope the kids take it.
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Good to see the kids come in.