One-Eyed Richmond Forum
Football => Richmond Rant => Topic started by: one-eyed on February 06, 2013, 04:54:54 PM
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Hardwick keen to talk with Tigers' sports science department
By Jennifer Phelan
afl.com.au
3:41pm AEDT Wednesday, February 6, 2013
RICHMOND coach Damien Hardwick will "certainly" talk to his sports science staff about their management of his players in the wake of the Essendon supplement scandal.
Hardwick, a former Essendon player and friend of Dons coach James Hird, described the Bombers' plight as a "difficult situation" he hoped would end up being deemed a "mistake".
In the meantime, he said the Tigers would double check there was no concern within their own sports science processes.
"We'll certainly have a conversation, there's no doubt. You do put an enormous amount of trust in the medical staff and our guys are outstanding in what they do and what they deliver," Hardwick said on Wednesday, after the Tigers touched down in Alice Springs.
"It will certainly be a conversation we'll have again just make sure we're crossing the T's and dotting the I's."
Richmond rookie and ex-Bomber Sam Lonergan didn't make the trip to Alice Springs for the Tigers' community camp and Friday night's clash with the Indigenous All Stars.
Lonergan had ankle surgery at the end of last season and remains in the rehabilitation group.
Hardwick said he hadn't spoken to Lonergan, who was cut from Essendon last year, but admitted there was some concern about his player getting caught up in the fallout.
"There's always a concern. There's a human element as well and as a fan of football … it's a concern," he said.
"Probably the sooner we find out about this, the better, we can move on and get our game back up to being great again."
Hardwick said the use of sports science in football had grown "enormously" since he retired at the end of 2004.
He said while every team searched for an edge, there were known boundaries.
"There comes a time where there's a platform there you just can't cross," he said.
"Probably at some stage that is going to happen but the reality is, we've got a certain amount of guidelines we abide by and we adhere to those, so it's just something we hope doesn’t become prevalent in our sport."
When asked if it was possible for a coach to be unaware of the sports science department's processes, he said "everyone club is different so it's hard for me to answer that one".
He also said he hoped the situation resolved itself quickly.
"No one likes to see this in our competition and we just hope that it gets better," he said.
"The one things we've got in AFL is great environment as an organisation. The AFL to their credit have fantastic education programs the players are all across and we just hope it's a mistake."
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-02-06/tigers-set-for-sport-science-talks
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will clubs be rushing to
release pressers to clear themselves.
pandoras box is about to blown open
looking down corio way. :thumbsup
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Herald-Sun report on what Dimma said:
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/afl/more-news/richmond-tigers-to-review-fitness-program-in-wake-of-essendons-drug-scandal/story-e6frf9jf-1226572057873
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wonder if the club will release a press statement
might be waiting to see where this all leads to.
fingers crossed for the RFC. :thumbsup
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Can't see us being immune from this
You only have to look at McG's legs and the fact the Sheddy is a 100 game player to know we are in a bit of strife
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Drama queens unite
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Demetriou just held a press conference. He said the AFL will audit each and every club's sports science department.
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"We'll certainly have a conversation, there's no doubt. You do put an enormous amount of trust in the medical staff and our guys are outstanding in what they do and what they deliver," Hardwick said on Wednesday, after the Tigers touched down in Alice Springs.
So we don't have a sport science or fitness section making these decisions, we only have a "medical" section.
That explains all those decisions to keep playing injured players.
They were all made by the "medical department".
I can't see in that article any quotes from Hardwck about the Sport Science department.
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didn't you recently highlight an article saying medical staff were being overridden by non medical staff in their decision making and having adverse results on the medical decisions?
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A few Tiger related comments on twitter:
Matthew Richardson@mattricho0
"Never in 17 years of playing did I see or hear of any player taking any type of illegal supplement.Nor was I offered any. J.Charles aside."
Former Tiger Nathan Brown reveals on Triple M he was offered Human Growth Hormone by an ex-fitness coach at another club after he broke his leg.
""I did think about it for a fleeting moment, but I just thought about how often you'd be looking over your shoulder and I don't think I could live with that guilt. Certainly I did think about it. It was always in the back of my mind."
The man sacked from the Tigers, Dan Connors, also shared his thoughts (complete with Dusty in the avatar):
"Alot of speculation an no proof surely innocent untill proven otherwise essendon supporters should stick fat #justsayin"
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-02-07/latest-updates
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Yep, and I think that's our problem with the fitness/sport science department.
http://oneeyed-richmond.com/forum/index.php?topic=4219.msg349473#msg349473
With Demetriou now announcing there will be a full blown investigation by the AFL into the operation of clubs' sport science departments I think this will come out.
As stated in the article, the AFL already has the report about their usurping of medical decisions.
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what do you think is the problem?
That no nmedical staff override the medical staff or the medical staff make the decisions?
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Id like a full blown presser announcing a forensic examination into our sports science department :thumbsup
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what do you think is the problem?
That no nmedical staff override the medical staff or the medical staff make the decisions?
:huh
The problem being that Hardwick thinks the fitness/sport science staff ARE the medical staff and thus qualified to make medical decisions.
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Id like a full blown presser announcing a forensic examination into our sports science department :thumbsup
Do you think they'd find this..
(http://diamonddusted.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/meth_lab.jpg)
... Or this (with the extra funds the clubs got recently)
(http://breakingbadbreakingbad.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/screen-shot-2012-09-16-at-1-33-22-pm.png)
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what do you think is the problem?
That no nmedical staff override the medical staff or the medical staff make the decisions?
:huh
The problem being that Hardwick thinks the fitness/sport science staff ARE the medical staff and thus qualified to make medical decisions.
I think you are reading to much into it.
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I believe I heard Andy D say, and correct me if I'm wrong. That not only would they contatc audits etc etc, but would have full background check done on all club employees? Wowsers. :shh
Gonna be singin AC/DC's jailbreak whilst checkin collingwood cheer squad :lol
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Of course he would/should accept it.. Just as Harvey pocketed his medal after Chris Grant got more votes but couldn't win for belting someone..
Its the criteria to be fairest and best.. although i feel for him if he didnt know he was taking illegal substances.. but the rules state its up to the athlete to know what he is using.. Its called taking ownership. The way i think is if it has enhanced his performance he doesnt deserve it regardless of knowing or not.
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what do you think is the problem?
That no nmedical staff override the medical staff or the medical staff make the decisions?
:huh
The problem being that Hardwick thinks the fitness/sport science staff ARE the medical staff and thus qualified to make medical decisions.
People who are qualified sports scientist's should be able to make medical decisions, what do you think they study when at uni?
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what do you think is the problem?
That no nmedical staff override the medical staff or the medical staff make the decisions?
:huh
The problem being that Hardwick thinks the fitness/sport science staff ARE the medical staff and thus qualified to make medical decisions.
People who are qualified sports scientist's should be able to make medical decisions, what do you think they study when at uni?
At uni people usually study Billiards and Sex and not in that order ;D
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what do you think is the problem?
That no nmedical staff override the medical staff or the medical staff make the decisions?
:huh
The problem being that Hardwick thinks the fitness/sport science staff ARE the medical staff and thus qualified to make medical decisions.
People who are qualified sports scientist's should be able to make medical decisions, what do you think they study when at uni?
At uni people usually study Billiards and Sex and not in that order ;D
If only :'(
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what do you think is the problem?
That no nmedical staff override the medical staff or the medical staff make the decisions?
:huh
The problem being that Hardwick thinks the fitness/sport science staff ARE the medical staff and thus qualified to make medical decisions.
People who are qualified sports scientist's should be able to make medical decisions, what do you think they study when at uni?
Sports scientists are bound by by the same code of ethics as doctors, in particular "do no harm".
Not to say there are not qualified medics who don't overstep the line, but generally they would/should have the individuals health at the forefront of their decisions, where as sports scientists and the like are more likely to be looking to get players on the track and satisfy the club.
Plus sports science is a large field with much of it covering different aspects than what those in the medical field have studied.
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what do you think is the problem?
That no nmedical staff override the medical staff or the medical staff make the decisions?
:huh
The problem being that Hardwick thinks the fitness/sport science staff ARE the medical staff and thus qualified to make medical decisions.
People who are qualified sports scientist's should be able to make medical decisions, what do you think they study when at uni?
At uni people usually study Billiards and Sex and not in that order ;D
If only :'(
Maybe times have changed in the old days going to Uni was one of the great things in life.
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Maybe times have changed in the old days going to Uni was one of the great things in life.
I spent 9 years at Monash in the seventies and the best three years were the three years that I did second year.
:cheers
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Reckon RFCO should just get Dimma to jump on here. Only need to wade through some injured player threads to realise OER has a number of resident medicos. :cheers
Could probably learn a thing or two about list management too :shh
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Sports scientists aren't medical doctors – Doc Larkins was saying that they usually have a PhD in muscle physiology or some such, but just about all of them wouldn't be qualified to prescribe you a cold and flu tablet
Oh, they're not doctors
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Reckon RFCO should just get Dimma to jump on here. Only need to wade through some injured player threads to realise OER has a number of resident medicos. :cheers
Could probably learn a thing or two about list management too :shh
Dwaino, you have been on this forum long enough to know that the club would be in a far better position handing over it's complete management to us at OER. We are all experts across most areas - unlike the specialists the club employs who only know about 1 or 2 things - so the benefit cannot be overestimated.
;D
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Reckon RFCO should just get Dimma to jump on here. Only need to wade through some injured player threads to realise OER has a number of resident medicos. :cheers
Could probably learn a thing or two about list management too :shh
Dwaino, you have been on this forum long enough to know that the club would be in a far better position handing over it's complete management to us at OER. We are all experts across most areas - unlike the specialists the club employs who only know about 1 or 2 things - so the benefit cannot be overestimated.
;D
;D
we just need to get one in the door then it's jobs for the boys :cheers
i nominate ramps
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Reckon RFCO should just get Dimma to jump on here. Only need to wade through some injured player threads to realise OER has a number of resident medicos. :cheers
Could probably learn a thing or two about list management too :shh
Dwaino, you have been on this forum long enough to know that the club would be in a far better position handing over it's complete management to us at OER. We are all experts across most areas - unlike the specialists the club employs who only know about 1 or 2 things - so the benefit cannot be overestimated.
;D
;D
we just need to get one in the door then it's jobs for the boys :cheers
i nominate ramps
Only because Rampsy will bring you in as his right hand man. No doubt I will receive a phone call about being coach.
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I heard a guy on the radio this morning who had run a gym since 1980 and had been involved quite heavily in sport sciences. He said that without the HGH or steroids, Peptides are useless. Used alone, they are like putting a turbo on a car with no engine. However used with HGH or Steroids, they do have a true turbo effect. He went on to say that sports scientists are more like salesman than doctors and as HGH and steroids are detectable, they cannot use them, so to justify their existence, they push the peptides in the hope that they will have some sort of placebo effect at best.
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what do you think is the problem?
That no nmedical staff override the medical staff or the medical staff make the decisions?
:huh
The problem being that Hardwick thinks the fitness/sport science staff ARE the medical staff and thus qualified to make medical decisions.
People who are qualified sports scientist's should be able to make medical decisions, what do you think they study when at uni?
Sports scientists are bound by by the same code of ethics as doctors, in particular "do no harm".
Not to say there are not qualified medics who don't overstep the line, but generally they would/should have the individuals health at the forefront of their decisions, where as sports scientists and the like are more likely to be looking to get players on the track and satisfy the club.
Plus sports science is a large field with much of it covering different aspects than what those in the medical field have studied.
I understand that they cover different things, but considering they learn "everything" to do with the way the body works they should be able to tell if an injury is serious or not and if they can't they shouldn't of got the qualification
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I heard a guy on the radio this morning who had run a gym since 1980 and had been involved quite heavily in sport sciences. He said that without the HGH or steroids, Peptides are useless. Used alone, they are like putting a turbo on a car with no engine. However used with HGH or Steroids, they do have a true turbo effect. He went on to say that sports scientists are more like salesman than doctors and as HGH and steroids are detectable, they cannot use them, so to justify their existence, they push the peptides in the hope that they will have some sort of placebo effect at best.
It's funny you say that because the sports scientist's I know reckon physio's are hacks haha
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I heard a guy on the radio this morning who had run a gym since 1980 and had been involved quite heavily in sport sciences. He said that without the HGH or steroids, Peptides are useless. Used alone, they are like putting a turbo on a car with no engine. However used with HGH or Steroids, they do have a true turbo effect. He went on to say that sports scientists are more like salesman than doctors and as HGH and steroids are detectable, they cannot use them, so to justify their existence, they push the peptides in the hope that they will have some sort of placebo effect at best.
Listen here mate. I went to Rebel Sport last night and bought a foam roller. Don't question me on this sports science stuff.
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Reckon RFCO should just get Dimma to jump on here. Only need to wade through some injured player threads to realise OER has a number of resident medicos. :cheers
Could probably learn a thing or two about list management too :shh
Dwaino, you have been on this forum long enough to know that the club would be in a far better position handing over it's complete management to us at OER. We are all experts across most areas - unlike the specialists the club employs who only know about 1 or 2 things - so the benefit cannot be overestimated.
;D
;D
we just need to get one in the door then it's jobs for the boys :cheers
i nominate ramps
Only because Rampsy will bring you in as his right hand man. No doubt I will receive a phone call about being coach.
theres no doubt Id employ all you blokes at Richmond. Id even employ the socialist for the comedy content required to keep a harmonious workplace ;D
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What the AFL clubs say on doping
The Age
February 9, 2013
Fairfax Media asked each AFL club the following questions:
1. Have any of your club officials or players been interviewed or contacted by the Australian Crime Commission or police acting on ACC intelligence?
2. Do your players take supplements or vitamins orally or by injection?
3. Do you require players to sign waivers, consent forms or non-disclosure agreements regarding any such treatments?
4. Do your players undergo injections or intravenous treatments administered by staff other than qualified medical personnel?
5. Are you confident organised criminals have not infiltrated your club?
6. Are you confident your players and staff have not acted illegally?
RICHMOND SPOKESMAN
"The AFL will be conducting an audit with every club, and we look forward to working with them to ensure our practices are compliant."
Read other club's responses here: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/what-the-afl-clubs-say-on-doping-20130208-2e4i3.html#ixzz2KK3IzWkq
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Ch 9 contacted all clubs and all but a few replied saying they believed they were in the clear. Richmond didn't return Ch 9's call though along with I think they said Port, Adelaide and Collingwood.
SuperCoach HQ @supercoach_hq twitter:
"One of Collingwood, Richmond or Port Adelaide believed to be implicated in the drug scandal along with Essendon according to #9news."
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So they got "believe to be implicated" from not returning a call? Cutting edge journalism right there folks.
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Has someone from Richmond footy department quit today? :help
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Is this a fake account?
Bruce McAvaney @BruceMcAvaney_
"Richmond the other club under the AFL drugs cloud. Expect story to unfold in the next 48 hrs"
"RT @TheCoachRonnie: @BruceMcAvaney_ how do you know? // Football Manager Craig Cameron about to quit. Others to follow. Stay tuned"
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Is this a fake account?
Bruce McAvaney @BruceMcAvaney_
"Richmond the other club under the AFL drugs cloud. Expect story to unfold in the next 48 hrs"
"RT @TheCoachRonnie: @BruceMcAvaney_ how do you know? // Football Manager Craig Cameron about to quit. Others to follow. Stay tuned"
The Bruce one is a fake
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Is this a fake account?
Bruce McAvaney @BruceMcAvaney_
"Richmond the other club under the AFL drugs cloud. Expect story to unfold in the next 48 hrs"
"RT @TheCoachRonnie: @BruceMcAvaney_ how do you know? // Football Manager Craig Cameron about to quit. Others to follow. Stay tuned"
The Bruce one is a fake
Cheers WP :cheers. Thank goodness!
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Is this a fake account?
Bruce McAvaney @BruceMcAvaney_
"Richmond the other club under the AFL drugs cloud. Expect story to unfold in the next 48 hrs"
"RT @TheCoachRonnie: @BruceMcAvaney_ how do you know? // Football Manager Craig Cameron about to quit. Others to follow. Stay tuned"
The Bruce one is a fake
Cheers WP :cheers. Thank goodness!
It doesn't have the "blue" tick and have aloo, at some of the tweets and pic posted and its pretty clear it isn't Bruce :laugh:
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Is this a fake account?
Bruce McAvaney @BruceMcAvaney_
"Richmond the other club under the AFL drugs cloud. Expect story to unfold in the next 48 hrs"
"RT @TheCoachRonnie: @BruceMcAvaney_ how do you know? // Football Manager Craig Cameron about to quit. Others to follow. Stay tuned"
The Bruce one is a fake
Cheers WP :cheers. Thank goodness!
It doesn't have the "blue" tick and have aloo, at some of the tweets and pic posted and its pretty clear it isn't Bruce :laugh:
If I used that theory I could say Jackstar's account is fake ;) :lol.
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RT @TheCoachRonnie
The Coach Ronnie ::)
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:lol
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RT @TheCoachRonnie
The Coach Ronnie ::)
Oh dear :lol :lol :lol
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So they got "believe to be implicated" from not returning a call? Cutting edge journalism right there folks.
:lol
I had a missed call on my phone. Should I be worried about being involved?
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A Tiger supporter rang into 3aw and said he rang Richmond this morning asking if we are implicated in any of this and he was told no.
Tony Jones then replied that the media is all over Punt Rd based simply on a single twitter rumour ::).
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Richmond: Has not been contacted by the ACC.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-02-11/drugs-probe-clubs-respond
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Richmond: Has not been contacted by the ACC.
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-02-11/drugs-probe-clubs-respond
Thats been updated, originally it said they declined to comment
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A Tiger supporter rang into 3aw and said he rang Richmond this morning asking if we are implicated in any of this and he was told no.
Tony Jones then replied that the media is all over Punt Rd based simply on a single twitter rumour ::).
And ppl wonder why you can't post rumors in here