Wallace to stay or go???

[Moi]

How can you have a coach who is so self-absorbed and worried about his own coaching record

Probably the most unselfish coach we've had in a long time.  He has totally stripped the club of all the dead wood.  If he was looking after his own coaching record, he would have kept on topping up as previous coaches have done and failed.  You can dislike him all you like - I couldn't give a stuff - but to call him worried about his own coaching record is way off the mark.  You can say his recruiting is crap, but most of his choices are about developing a list for the next 10 years.  Whether he's picked the right players or not, not looking great at the moment, but still remains to be seen. You can bag him if he is unsuccessful after his 5 year tenure, but he hasn't gone about it just for his own personal glory, was done with a long term plan for a solid future, not a quick fix.  The plan is good - the success or otherwise is what he should be judged on in the long run.

[tiga]

How can you have a coach who is so self-absorbed and worried about his own coaching record

Probably the most unselfish coach we've had in a long time.  He has totally stripped the club of all the dead wood.  If he was looking after his own coaching record, he would have kept on topping up as previous coaches have done and failed.  You can dislike him all you like - I couldn't give a stuff - but to call him worried about his own coaching record is way off the mark.  You can say his recruiting is crap, but most of his choices are about developing a list for the next 10 years.  Whether he's picked the right players or not, not looking great at the moment, but still remains to be seen. You can bag him if he is unsuccessful after his 5 year tenure, but he hasn't gone about it just for his own personal glory, was done with a long term plan for a solid future, not a quick fix.  The plan is good - the success or otherwise is what he should be judged on in the long run.

Well said Moi. 

Okay so lets be realistic here. If all you Wallace bashers want him gone then what is YOUR blueprint for success?? If you were given the coaching job when Wallace got it what would you have done?? I bet it wouldn't be all that different to what Terry has already put in place. I still remember the screams..."get rid of the duds that frawley recruitied".."get rid of any player who doesn't want to be in the yellow and black"..."Start a youth recruitment policy"....."give the young guys more consistent game time to prove themselves"...Does any of this sound familiar??? Well guess what....Wallace has done all of this. 

[mightytiges]

every team seems to bounce back after 3 or 4 years but we dont.
is it a culture thing down at punt road. this coach will blame the previous coach and so on.

Because the problem was/is a combination of so many different things. It's just not the coach, not just the recruiter, not just the fitness staff, not just the admin, not just the board, etc... And our poor decisions are also compounded by trying to compensate for past poor decisions by predecessors when a line should be just drawn in the sand. (easier said than done when supporters and especially certain egos within coterie groups put enormous pressure on the club to find quick fixes or else bring on mayhem).

For example in 2001 Benny Gale was forced into retirement because we couldn't pay him on top of other players wanting big $$$. So the club needed to go out unprepared and find a read-made replacement ruckman urgently. On top of that we wanted to offload Daffy and especially his 1999 contract to free up $$$. So we traded away our first pick for Stafford in the superdraft. We then picked up Rodan with our 2nd pick, who slipped to pick 33 because of his lack of height, to compensate missing out on a top kid with our first pick. We also overrated where the team is at after 2001 and top up with Hudson and Houlihan with the rest of our picks. This topping up was on top of other years of topping up which means we are now in 2007 missing those 23-27 year olds who would've come from those drafts and we have Miller chasing each year after someone in that age-bracket to fill the void. So we trade away pick 19 for a 24-year-old McMahon  .

The Club still doesn't seem to be fully functioning as a single unit from top to bottom IMO despite the best intentions of March and the great job done by Wright (it's still though functioning far better than anytime within the past 25 years). Just simple little things in decision making - like we're meant to be rebuilding our list yet despite being ranked 11th in general revenue we are 16th in spending on recruiting resources (why are 5 other clubs with less money spending more on recruiting than we are/were?). We finish wooden spooners yet have just 2 draft picks in the top 50 thanks to trading a good pick for a 24 year old flanker  ???. We had the coach go against the wishes of the board in picking up a 28 year old Kingsley in last year's PSD. These are issues that IMO should not be happening if everyone within the club is on the same wavelength as they need to be to become successful. Perhaps a good sit down of everybody to reaffirm the club's overall rebuilding policy is in order.

Yes picking up more kids with such a young list won't do much for on-field performance in 2008 but these 5 years under Plough were about rebuilding and restructuring our list back into shape by the end of 2009. I didn't have a problem with Terry's 2011 comments. You don't shoot someone down for saying the truth just because you don't like hearing this rebuilding is going to take time. He should have kept it to himself though and kept up the "young developing list that is 70% U23" mantra publicly. Means the same thing but you don't get Caro's "Tigers aiming for 9th" crap and the rest of the media sensationalizing what you say into a back page story.

[Francois Jackson]

How can you have a coach who is so self-absorbed and worried about his own coaching record

Probably the most unselfish coach we've had in a long time.  He has totally stripped the club of all the dead wood.  If he was looking after his own coaching record, he would have kept on topping up as previous coaches have done and failed.  You can dislike him all you like - I couldn't give a stuff - but to call him worried about his own coaching record is way off the mark.  You can say his recruiting is crap, but most of his choices are about developing a list for the next 10 years.  Whether he's picked the right players or not, not looking great at the moment, but still remains to be seen. You can bag him if he is unsuccessful after his 5 year tenure, but he hasn't gone about it just for his own personal glory, was done with a long term plan for a solid future, not a quick fix.  The plan is good - the success or otherwise is what he should be judged on in the long run.

Well said Moi. 

Okay so lets be realistic here. If all you Wallace bashers want him gone then what is YOUR blueprint for success?? If you were given the coaching job when Wallace got it what would you have done?? I bet it wouldn't be all that different to what Terry has already put in place.. 

in some way i agree with what ur saying but i judge him on recruiting and developing
big problem. krak should've been gone last year. tivers, meyer whom he chose. tambling not buddy when we clearly needed a KP

why are our players still with muscles like my 90 year old grandma

these are all his faults. can anyone do a better job. no !! not with this list

[mightytiges]

Onto Spud...

Spud's problem was he had just one gameplan (bomb it long to two big tall agile forwards) and no plan B, he overrated our list after 2001, and he couldn't adapt once other clubs had worked him and us out. He also drafted just one tall (Schulz) in his 5 years. He along with Geischen are also responsible for the lack of the 23-27 age bracket whether people want to call it living in the past or not. No matter what Plough does he can never reach his predecessor's incompentence  .

[Francois Jackson]

fair call but what about the list that he has got and brought to the club
whose to blame for their lack of development and will to play.

who didnt pick up a KPP in the 05 draft
who kept schulz
kent kingsley

i agree with u spud left us in a hole but how many other coaches pick up train wrecks and deal with it successfully. i only hear about wallace complaining.

[rogerd3]

every team seems to bounce back after 3 or 4 years but we dont.
is it a culture thing down at punt road. this coach will blame the previous coach and so on.

Because the problem was/is a combination of so many different things. It's just not the coach, not just the recruiter, not just the fitness staff, not just the admin, not just the board, etc... And our poor decisions are also compounded by trying to compensate for past poor decisions by predecessors when a line should be just drawn in the sand. (easier said than done when supporters and especially certain egos within coterie groups put enormous pressure on the club to find quick fixes or else bring on mayhem).

For example in 2001 Benny Gale was forced into retirement because we couldn't pay him on top of other players wanting big $$$. So the club needed to go out unprepared and find a read-made replacement ruckman urgently. On top of that we wanted to offload Daffy and especially his 1999 contract to free up $$$. So we traded away our first pick for Stafford in the superdraft. We then picked up Rodan with our 2nd pick, who slipped to pick 33 because of his lack of height, to compensate missing out on a top kid with our first pick. We also overrated where the team is at after 2001 and top up with Hudson and Houlihan with the rest of our picks. This topping up was on top of other years of topping up which means we are now in 2007 missing those 23-27 year olds who would've come from those drafts and we have Miller chasing each year after someone in that age-bracket to fill the void. So we trade away pick 19 for a 24-year-old McMahon  .

The Club still doesn't seem to be fully functioning as a single unit from top to bottom IMO despite the best intentions of March and the great job done by Wright (it's still though functioning far better than anytime within the past 25 years). Just simple little things in decision making - like we're meant to be rebuilding our list yet despite being ranked 11th in general revenue we are 16th in spending on recruiting resources (why are 5 other clubs with less money spending more on recruiting than we are/were?). We finish wooden spooners yet have just 2 draft picks in the top 50 thanks to trading a good pick for a 24 year old flanker  ???. We had the coach go against the wishes of the board in picking up a 28 year old Kingsley in last year's PSD. These are issues that IMO should not be happening if everyone within the club is on the same wavelength as they need to be to become successful. Perhaps a good sit down of everybody to reaffirm the club's overall rebuilding policy is in order.

Yes picking up more kids with such a young list won't do much for on-field performance in 2008 but these 5 years under Plough were about rebuilding and restructuring our list back into shape by the end of 2009. I didn't have a problem with Terry's 2011 comments. You don't shoot someone down for saying the truth just because you don't like hearing this rebuilding is going to take time. He should have kept it to himself though and kept up the "young developing list that is 70% U23" mantra publicly. Means the same thing but you don't get Caro's "Tigers aiming for 9th" crap and the rest of the media sensationalizing what you say into a back page story.

So many valid points but i fear that it will get lost in the quick fix policy some still have with this club.

Great effort.

[blaisee]

slight exageration but he mentioned it a few times this year but really even saying it once is too much.

u sound like a sore loser. ooh u left me with this train wreck what am i gonna do now.
the list is very bad, no one aged 23-27. true as it maybe u get paid 400k plus to make it happen pal

its really childish and sounds pathetic.

$500K actually!
Then he gets mate Jordon McMahon on a contract of $1,000,000 for 3 years.

cooking the books again Jackstar.

thats right rog 

and sheeds rejected the demons coaching job because he has been promised the richmond job

jackstar is one bitter and twisted ex-employee

[blaisee]

How can you have a coach who is so self-absorbed and worried about his own coaching record

Probably the most unselfish coach we've had in a long time.  He has totally stripped the club of all the dead wood.  If he was looking after his own coaching record, he would have kept on topping up as previous coaches have done and failed.  You can dislike him all you like - I couldn't give a stuff - but to call him worried about his own coaching record is way off the mark.  You can say his recruiting is crap, but most of his choices are about developing a list for the next 10 years.  Whether he's picked the right players or not, not looking great at the moment, but still remains to be seen. You can bag him if he is unsuccessful after his 5 year tenure, but he hasn't gone about it just for his own personal glory, was done with a long term plan for a solid future, not a quick fix.  The plan is good - the success or otherwise is what he should be judged on in the long run.

spot on moi

[Francois Jackson]

and sheeds rejected the demons coaching job because he has been promised the richmond job

jackstar is one bitter and twisted ex-employee

is that true. honestly is that just a opinion or fact.

[Tiger Spirit]

Probably the most unselfish coach we've had in a long time.  He has totally stripped the club of all the dead wood.  If he was looking after his own coaching record, he would have kept on topping up as previous coaches have done and failed.  You can dislike him all you like - I couldn't give a stuff - but to call him worried about his own coaching record is way off the mark.  You can say his recruiting is crap, but most of his choices are about developing a list for the next 10 years.  Whether he's picked the right players or not, not looking great at the moment, but still remains to be seen. You can bag him if he is unsuccessful after his 5 year tenure, but he hasn't gone about it just for his own personal glory, was done with a long term plan for a solid future, not a quick fix.  The plan is good - the success or otherwise is what he should be judged on in the long run.

The way I see it, we’ve just wasted another 3 years for no good reason, other than to preen TW’s ego.  We had the coming of the next generation this year because his previous option suddenly went belly up.  Who woulda seen that coming?

Do some coaches even understand and appreciate the task they are entrusted with, or just go into the caper with the wild notion of revolutionising the game?

It comes across that TW wants to recruit players for positions, and if a player fits a designated role then that’s good enough for TW.  Even if it means completely ignoring any ‘baggage’ or ‘history’ that may come with certain players, and even if it means sacrificing those who deserve better.

To me, coaches such as this are destined for the scrap heap.  And not before time, because their faith and focus are totally misplaced.  It’s one thing to have a grand plan; it’s another to make it work.  Without the belief, will and dedicated input of the players to make it happen then no game plan, no matter how well rehearsed, will work on a consistent basis.  And unless we’re recruiting players who are confident, self-motivated and generally able to coach themselves then, basically, our fortunes seem to be in the lap of the gods.  Without a balanced coaching approach, all players would be receiving is meaningless information overload that separates them from any enjoyment and prevents them from playing hard nosed footy that wins meaningful games.

If you reckon he’s a good bloke then who am I to tell you to think something else.  All I’m saying, from what I’ve seen of his coaching so far is that he’s taking us nowhere.

He de-listed some players.  Well, who on this board, or anyone who has followed RFC for long enough couldn’t have done the same thing?  If you ask me, anyone off the street could do what he has done to now.  When he starts ‘coaching’ and not just ‘list adjusting’ to bring him success then I’ll give it a rest.

[Moi]

Probably the most unselfish coach we've had in a long time.  He has totally stripped the club of all the dead wood.  If he was looking after his own coaching record, he would have kept on topping up as previous coaches have done and failed.  You can dislike him all you like - I couldn't give a stuff - but to call him worried about his own coaching record is way off the mark.  You can say his recruiting is crap, but most of his choices are about developing a list for the next 10 years.  Whether he's picked the right players or not, not looking great at the moment, but still remains to be seen. You can bag him if he is unsuccessful after his 5 year tenure, but he hasn't gone about it just for his own personal glory, was done with a long term plan for a solid future, not a quick fix.  The plan is good - the success or otherwise is what he should be judged on in the long run.

The way I see it, we’ve just wasted another 3 years for no good reason, other than to preen TW’s ego.  We had the coming of the next generation this year because his previous option suddenly went belly up.  Who woulda seen that coming?

Do some coaches even understand and appreciate the task they are entrusted with, or just go into the caper with the wild notion of revolutionising the game?

It comes across that TW wants to recruit players for positions, and if a player fits a designated role then that’s good enough for TW.  Even if it means completely ignoring any ‘baggage’ or ‘history’ that may come with certain players, and even if it means sacrificing those who deserve better.

To me, coaches such as this are destined for the scrap heap.  And not before time, because their faith and focus are totally misplaced.  It’s one thing to have a grand plan; it’s another to make it work.  Without the belief, will and dedicated input of the players to make it happen then no game plan, no matter how well rehebehindd, will work on a consistent basis.  And unless we’re recruiting players who are confident, self-motivated and generally able to coach themselves then, basically, our fortunes seem to be in the lap of the gods.  Without a balanced coaching approach, all players would be receiving is meaningless information overload that separates them from any enjoyment and prevents them from playing hard nosed footy that wins meaningful games.

If you reckon he’s a good bloke then who am I to tell you to think something else.  All I’m saying, from what I’ve seen of his coaching so far is that he’s taking us nowhere.

He de-listed some players.  Well, who on this board, or anyone who has followed RFC for long enough couldn’t have done the same thing?  If you ask me, anyone off the street could do what he has done to now.  When he starts ‘coaching’ and not just ‘list adjusting’ to bring him success then I’ll give it a rest.

I really have no idea what you're trying to say.  It's just rhetoric.  Provide examples.  Like that first para, what does it mean? what first option went belly up.  I'm totally lost!

[Francois Jackson]

Probably the most unselfish coach we've had in a long time.  He has totally stripped the club of all the dead wood.  If he was looking after his own coaching record, he would have kept on topping up as previous coaches have done and failed.  You can dislike him all you like - I couldn't give a stuff - but to call him worried about his own coaching record is way off the mark.  You can say his recruiting is crap, but most of his choices are about developing a list for the next 10 years.  Whether he's picked the right players or not, not looking great at the moment, but still remains to be seen. You can bag him if he is unsuccessful after his 5 year tenure, but he hasn't gone about it just for his own personal glory, was done with a long term plan for a solid future, not a quick fix.  The plan is good - the success or otherwise is what he should be judged on in the long run.

The way I see it, we’ve just wasted another 3 years for no good reason, other than to preen TW’s ego.  We had the coming of the next generation this year because his previous option suddenly went belly up.  Who woulda seen that coming?

Do some coaches even understand and appreciate the task they are entrusted with, or just go into the caper with the wild notion of revolutionising the game?

It comes across that TW wants to recruit players for positions, and if a player fits a designated role then that’s good enough for TW.  Even if it means completely ignoring any ‘baggage’ or ‘history’ that may come with certain players, and even if it means sacrificing those who deserve better.

To me, coaches such as this are destined for the scrap heap.  And not before time, because their faith and focus are totally misplaced.  It’s one thing to have a grand plan; it’s another to make it work.  Without the belief, will and dedicated input of the players to make it happen then no game plan, no matter how well rehebehindd, will work on a consistent basis.  And unless we’re recruiting players who are confident, self-motivated and generally able to coach themselves then, basically, our fortunes seem to be in the lap of the gods.  Without a balanced coaching approach, all players would be receiving is meaningless information overload that separates them from any enjoyment and prevents them from playing hard nosed footy that wins meaningful games.

If you reckon he’s a good bloke then who am I to tell you to think something else.  All I’m saying, from what I’ve seen of his coaching so far is that he’s taking us nowhere.

He de-listed some players.  Well, who on this board, or anyone who has followed RFC for long enough couldn’t have done the same thing?  If you ask me, anyone off the street could do what he has done to now.  When he starts ‘coaching’ and not just ‘list adjusting’ to bring him success then I’ll give it a rest.

well said.

[mightytiges]

fair call but what about the list that he has got and brought to the club
whose to blame for their lack of development and will to play.

who didnt pick up a KPP in the 05 draft
who kept schulz
kent kingsley

i agree with u spud left us in a hole but how many other coaches pick up train wrecks and deal with it successfully. i only hear about wallace complaining.

I guess you've got to put all of Plough's choices together to judge. Having a decent senior core would have helped speed up our cubs' development. Mind you Patto and McGuane had to swim this year after being chucked in the deep end. On top of that IMO Plough needs to get back to basics and have us playing as we train with more pressure applied at training.

Here's Plough's recruits:

2004: Lids, Tambo, Meyer, Patto, Polo, McGaune, Limbach, Mark Graham, Knobel, Thursty, Simmo
The "fab 5" will be under pressure to perform next year. Thursty and Simmo have been Plough's best gets so far. McGuane started to show something this year

2005: JON, Hughes, Casserly, White, Angus Graham, Howat, Humm, Paddy Bowden
Lots of question marks on this group. We did pick up a KPP in Cleve btw.

2006: Jack Riewoldt, Edwards, Connors, Peterson, Collins, King, Clingan, Kingsley, Polak
The two gones were cheap yet wasted choices but overall pretty good although early days. Perhaps the only criticism is too many of the same height/type. We should have picked up another young KPP instead of Tas, Kingsley or Collins IMO

2007: McMahon, Morton, picks 2, 18, 51, PSD and 3 rookies.
We don't know yet. Let's hope we have some rookie finds.

Breakdown by height:

199+ cm:     Gus, Knobel
194-198cm: Simmo, Patto, Polak
190-193cm: Thursty, Hughes, McGuane, Riewoldt, Limbach, Paddy Bowden, Kingsley, Mark Graham
186-189cm: Lids, Polo, JON, Casserly
180-185cm: Tambo, Meyer, Collins, Edwards, Connors, Peterson, Howat, McMahon, Morton, Clingan, Humm
<180cm:     White, King

Not the midget recruiting as some claim but we needed to double up with talls to make up for Spud's negligence. Not enough ruckman though and an extra big KPP would be useful. No obvious true high possession ballwinners from the groups of smalls either as yet.

[Passionfruit]

slight exageration but he mentioned it a few times this year but really even saying it once is too much.

u sound like a sore loser. ooh u left me with this train wreck what am i gonna do now.
the list is very bad, no one aged 23-27. true as it maybe u get paid 400k plus to make it happen pal

its really childish and sounds pathetic.

$500K actually!
Then he gets mate Jordon McMahon on a contract of $1,000,000 for 3 years.

cooking the books again Jackstar.

thats right rog 

and sheeds rejected the demons coaching job because he has been promised the richmond job

jackstar is one bitter and twisted ex-employee

You are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine.
For what its worth ""goose"", I left on my own steam as i wasnt going to work for a "" bunch of clowns"". Move on Blaisee. I think the clubs going nowhere at the moment, you think we are flying and you are entitled to your opinion, lets see who they pick up in the pre-season draft this year, Now where is Kent Kingsley ? No wonder we won the spoon, fair dinkum!