Essendon face AFL probe/Players found Guilty by CAS

[Gigantor]

I think I mentioned this some time ago,that it seems worldwide the clubs that appear to transgress are the wealthier clubs.eg Essendon,Carlton,Juventus,Barcelona,Rangers,.I think in Germany currently senior people from Bayern Munich are being investigated for tax fraud...I think a serious lesson needs to be taught to at least try and stop this.

[Judge Roughneck]

Juventus were punished relegated several leagues

Ditto rangers

Ditto barca - banned from transfers


Seria a, scot fa, la liga (or maybe fifa got barca, dunno) seem to have balls. The afl don't and just after the fast buck. When it comes down to the crunch the afl would rather not ban players cause they thinks its bad for the game misguided fools.

[Gigantor]

Judge by serious lesson I mean..give them (whoever) the boot ,never to be seen again...or do you think that's way too harsh?

[Judge Roughneck]

EFC out tassie fc in is best case scenario for me.

Would teach a lesson to clubs not to cheat for 100s of years. And the added benefit of the mass suiciide of several EFC fans.

Perhaps more realistic put them in the vfl for 5 years, bring in tassie and make 20 team comp down the track with Darwin team or something.

In summary I'd be in favour of de registering the club 

Or relegate them for 5 years as punishment

[Gigantor]

Humans push the boundaries  in all apsects.I guess that's how we progress .However sport seems to have maybe lost its focus .I think it was on radio recently where it was mentioned that many years ago Canada decided that the resources it was putting in to win Olympic Gold can be used to foster sport at a more local level,with community engagement.And apparently the result of doing this have been amazing.
Not saying its right for us but might somewhat subdue this will and striving to win at all costs

[Judge Roughneck]

I am often call rude things for some of my views so take what I say with a grain of salt

But the sport lost its soul a long time ago and it a business. Hence I think the afl don't want two year bans

This is good in regards to Canada: it'd be good for Australian football, soccer to follow the same track. The ammos for example is cool and ditto the VPL and they should be encouraged more

[one-eyed]

It might be interesting to see how an AFL-based tribunal considers any charges of doping violations. 

The player's advocates would start a defence along the lines that the players followed the AFL's procedures to the letter (whether they did or not).  The players received advice from club medical staff and coaching staff that the "supplements" involved were not in violation of the anti-doping code (whether they were or not).

Will an AFL tribunal determine that the AFL's club-based anti-doping procedures were insufficiently rigourous to prevent the players being "duped" by their fitness and medical advisors?  In other words, will the AFL rule that the AFL got it wrong?  Wouldn't happen under Adolf's watch!

For sure, WADA would appeal any finding from the AFL tribunal that let the players off lightly, or completely, but I'm having trouble speculating how an AFL tribunal could rule against players who followed AFL procedures to the letter.

Remembering, of course, that the club and coach have already been spanked soundly with a wet lettuce leaf and an all-expenses paid family holiday on the French Riviera respectively.  I wonder if we'll ever learn who tipped-off the Bummers to destroy all the evidence?

I believe the anti-doping authorities state that the sportsperson is ultimately responsible for what goes into their body. Being 'duped' may see a significant reduction any suspension from the full two years down to six months (or 3 months in the NRL's case) but it's not a defence for the sportsperson to claim ignorance and innocence.

[WilliamPowell]

I believe the anti-doping authorities state that the sportsperson is ultimately responsible for what goes into their body. Being 'duped' may see a significant reduction any suspension from the full two years down to six months (or 3 months in the NRL's case) but it's not a defence for the sportsperson to claim ignorance and innocence.

Actually this exactly what John Coates (AOC chairman) says in an interview (albeit brief) in today's Age with Caro.

Uses a teenage gymnast as example, said she was given a cold tablet by a team doctor, tested positive to a banned substance because of it and was given the mandatory 2 year ban and had to give back her Olympic medal

He said ultimately the athlete is responsible for what they ingest

[Judge Roughneck]

You are overlooking the 'good bloke' clause

[Dougeytherichmondfan]

Actually this exactly what John Coates (AOC chairman) says in an interview (albeit brief) in today's Age with Caro.

Uses a teenage gymnast as example, said she was given a cold tablet by a team doctor, tested positive to a banned substance because of it and was given the mandatory 2 year ban and had to give back her Olympic medal

He said ultimately the athlete is responsible for what they ingest

That's a poor example. She would have grounds for contesting that if it was true, (I'm assuming she was from one of the soviet nations pre 92'?). Of course "my coach gave me some pill for a cold" wouldn't stand up if contested. The difference here is Essendon have those stupid signed acknowledgments.

Edited to correct quote

[WilliamPowell]

That's a poor example. She would have grounds for contesting that if it was true, (I'm assuming she was from one of the soviet nations pre 92'?). Of course "my coach gave me some pill for a cold" wouldn't stand up if contested. The difference here is Essendon have those stupid signed acknowledgments.

No she didn't have grounds to contest as the rules (WADA) are very specific and ignorance is not a valid reason/excuse. Every athlete is ultimately responsible for what they take under the WADA code. Her excuse was a team doctor gave here the tablet and regardless she copped the minimum 2 year penalty

As for the when, it was 2000 and the athlete's name was Andreea Raducan and she was 16-year-old and she got stripped of her gold medal

Here's a link to the article/interview

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/coates-not-surprised-at-time-needed-for-asada-investigation-20141024-11bhfc.html

[Penelope]

it can be taken into account when deciding penalty. extenuating circumstances or such and the athletes apply to a tribunal after the initial decision is made if i recall correctly

[WilliamPowell]

it can be taken into account when deciding penalty. extenuating circumstances or such and the athletes apply to a tribunal after the initial decision is made if i recall correctly

True but in the gymnast's case it made no difference and from what I ca. Gather she didn't appeal either

[Penelope]

from what i understand these rules are drawn up more for individual athletes,where it would be an easy out to blame the coach and let them take the wrap, thus the onus is on the athlete.

IMO WADA need to completely overhaul the system, because at the moment there does not appear to be any capability to punish a club when they set out to rort the system with no concern for the players welfare as essendon have done, leaving the players to take the wrap when those supposed to be ensuring these rules are not broken are in fact the ones responsible.

[WilliamPowell]

IMO WADA need to completely overhaul the system, because at the moment there does not appear to be any capability to punish a club when they set out to rort the system with no concern for the players welfare as essendon have done, leaving the players to take the wrap when those supposed to be ensuring these rules are not broken are in fact the ones responsible.

Agree with you on the overhaul.

Really good points