Gourdis, Cartledge, Collard and Howat gone / List lodgement (Friday 2pm)

[Smokey]

With 6 rookie spots Gourdis may still end up on our rookie list (we grabbed him in the PSD so no other club got him) but I agree we are shooting ourselves in the foot if list management decisions are being based and dictated by finances. It's the non-delistings that are more perplexing for me than the delistings .

I'm with you MT.  I still think any of Collard, Gourdis and Cartledge are a chance to end up on our list (2 maybe as rookies).  We have done it a few times in the past - Howat for one - so it wouldn't surprise to see any of these.  And yes, the non-delistings are much more mystifying - Silvester - WHAT THE????

[tigersalive]

Collard came back fat.

Gourdis had alleged mild depression problems so that might be a factor of the delisting, that he wanted to return to Perth . . .

And Cartledge is not an AFL Ruckman.


I'm fine with all 3 being delisted and Silvester was the best performed out of the 4 for Coburg this year imo.

I hope Collard (no committment) and Cartledge (Just a VFL ruckman) are gone for good.

[Smokey]

Collard came back fat.

Gourdis had alleged mild depression problems so that might be a factor of the delisting, that he wanted to return to Perth . . .

And Cartledge is not an AFL Ruckman.


I'm fine with all 3 being delisted and Silvester was the best performed out of the 4 for Coburg this year imo.

I hope Collard (no committment) and Cartledge (Just a VFL ruckman) are gone for good.

Yeah, I'm not disgareeing with any of that TA - it just wouldn't surprise me to see any of those 3 taken again.  Silvester on the other hand, could have won the Liston for all it mattered but he will never, ever, ever be competitive on the AFL stage.  The VFL is littered with champions at that level who wouldn't be capable of getting a kick in the AFL and Silvester is one of those.  Cartledge could at least compete and has some 'insurance' value - Silvester has none.

[tigersalive]

Collard came back fat.

Gourdis had alleged mild depression problems so that might be a factor of the delisting, that he wanted to return to Perth . . .

And Cartledge is not an AFL Ruckman.


I'm fine with all 3 being delisted and Silvester was the best performed out of the 4 for Coburg this year imo.

I hope Collard (no committment) and Cartledge (Just a VFL ruckman) are gone for good.

Yeah, I'm not disgareeing with any of that TA - it just wouldn't surprise me to see any of those 3 taken again.  Silvester on the other hand, could have won the Liston for all it mattered but he will never, ever, ever be competitive on the AFL stage.  The VFL is littered with champions at that level who wouldn't be capable of getting a kick in the AFL and Silvester is one of those.  Cartledge could at least compete and has some 'insurance' value - Silvester has none.

Cartledge is only a good rookie, but now we cant even have him as that, I cant see him being of any value on the senior list being 23.  I'd rather have a 19-20 year old with a chance developing on our list than a 23 year old who we know isnt going to make it.   I'd rather continue the insurance at a rookie level with a Deluca than clog a senior list spot for a ruckman that will only play if there are injuries.

Interesting you completely write off Silvester's capacity to compete at AFL level.  Why is that? Lack of pace? Lack of skill? I havent watched him much so I'm unaware.

[Chuck17]

After the example of Moore and Whitey I don't think I am going to write off any kid again that is retained on our list

[Smokey]

Cartledge is only a good rookie, but now we cant even have him as that, I cant see him being of any value on the senior list being 23.  I'd rather have a 19-20 year old with a chance developing on our list than a 23 year old who we know isnt going to make it.   I'd rather continue the insurance at a rookie level with a Deluca than clog a senior list spot for a ruckman that will only play if there are injuries.

Interesting you completely write off Silvester's capacity to compete at AFL level.  Why is that? Lack of pace? Lack of skill? I havent watched him much so I'm unaware.

Yep, DeLuca might be good insurance as a rookie, but we know what we will get with Cartledge and depending on the relative costs the club will need to do a risk assessment on potential vs known.  The insurance only comes in to play in a 'now' sense - we shouldn't/won't need it in a couple of years time when our 'potential' ruckman have stepped up so taking DeLuca as insurance would be no different to having Graham or Putt now as insurance - it's all based on potential and the insurance value will probably amount to zero if you need it this year.  And that's if we get to take DeLuca - wouldn't be the first time a club has jumped in and trumped another club's plans.  I haven't got much of an opinion on which of these 2 would be the better options, just saying that it wouldn't surprise me to see Cartledge drafted.

Re: Silvester, I've seen him in a few Coburg games and he stands out (to me) as someone playing at the top level of his capacity.  His one 'crack' at the title exposed him horribly as too slow in mind and body for the top level and that was only in the pre-season comp.  Heaven help him in the real thing.  Some players don't produce anything spectacular in the VFL level but when you watch them play you just 'know' they will cope with the step up.  IMHO Silvester doesn't.  As always, happy to be proven wrong but this decision just jumped out at me as hard to believe.

[one-eyed]

Word out of South Fremantle is they are in talks with Collard to return to his old WAFL club.

[Chuck17]

Word out of South Fremantle is they are in talks with Collard to return to his old WAFL club.

Not surprised there was always talk he badly wanted to go back to WA

[wayne]

A caller on SEN just rang and said he was staggered that we kept JON and delisted Dean Polo!!

KB and Patrick just jabbered on about how JON is contracted and Polo didn't take his chances?!?! 

[Chuck17]

A caller on SEN just rang and said he was staggered that we kept JON and delisted Dean Polo!!

KB and Patrick just jabbered on about how JON is contracted and Polo didn't take his chances?!?! 

LOL Doh

[tigersalive]

Lol, oh dear. 

[mightytiges]

A caller on SEN just rang and said he was staggered that we kept JON and delisted Dean Polo!!

KB and Patrick just jabbered on about how JON is contracted and Polo didn't take his chances?!?! 

Smith and Denham - what a pair .

[one-eyed]

Here's the rule that allowed Silvester to become a mature rookie.

-------------------------
Players who have not yet made their AFL debut, but may previously have been on a senior or rookie list, will now be eligible to be listed as mature-age rookies. This will apply immediately for the 2008 NAB AFL Draft.

http://oneeyed-richmond.com/forum//index.php?topic=7030.0

[yellowandback]

I find it amazing that:-

1. We have delisted 3 players that were on our list for 12 months - Rookie or no rookie, to me that is like missing a goal from 10 metres out. With the sophistication available to our recruiters and coaching staff, this smacks of incompetence.

2. We are keeping Pettifer for financial reasons? What is going on down there? If you think about it, keeping a player who is injured on th list because it financially helps us - makes a joke of the system. Where is the sanctity of wearing a Tiger jumper cause you earnt it? FOr people who say it is "frowned upon" to de-list a player because he is injured. What about the morality of delisting a player in contract like Casserly. What about the morality of horse trading week? The only thing morally right is doing the right thing by the club to help it win flags (Ask Dick Pratt).

3. While I was initially a bit surprised about Meyer being flicked, I now agree with some of the posters on this thread. 4 years is enough. Silvester I know little about, I really hope it is not a bad as some posters are making out.

Coach is walking a fine line, hope he's across all of this.....

[mightytiges]

1. We have delisted 3 players that were on our list for 12 months - Rookie or no rookie, to me that is like missing a goal from 10 metres out. With the sophistication available to our recruiters and coaching staff, this smacks of incompetence.

Gourdis could still end up on our rookie list so it's wait and see for another 6 weeks on his future. Carlton also dumped Pfeiffer after just one year and he was picked up with the next PSD pick after ours. Collard is the most disappointing one - heaps of skill but after two clubs have given him the flick after just one year he seemingly didn't have the workrate and fitness to make it. We used the rookie list poorly this year a well having too many "back-up" types. Still don't know why Howat got a 3rd year.

2. We are keeping Pettifer for financial reasons? What is going on down there? If you think about it, keeping a player who is injured on th list because it financially helps us - makes a joke of the system. Where is the sanctity of wearing a Tiger jumper cause you earnt it? FOr people who say it is "frowned upon" to de-list a player because he is injured. What about the morality of delisting a player in contract like Casserly. What about the morality of horse trading week? The only thing morally right is doing the right thing by the club to help it win flags (Ask Dick Pratt).

We don't know the full details of Cass' contract. For all we know he may have had a performance based clause in it for him get another year. I agree though that making list decisions based on conserving finances is something that has hampered us in the past and is only shooting ourselves in the foot. Essendon still flicked out of contract Courtney Johns despite his ACL injury. When you add Petts, Polly and possibly Kingy with his ankle we are effectively 2-3 players down already on our senior list (mind you we can elevate rookies if they are placed on the long-term injury list).