Author Topic: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games  (Read 2741 times)

Offline one-eyed

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Richmond must say 'no tanks'
24 June 2007   Sunday Herald Sun
Jon Ralph

DRAFT picks are over-rated.

Say that within breathing space of a Tiger fan desperate to rebuild through priority picks, and you are likely to cop a Chris Tarrant uppercut to the chin.

But Richmond's brains trust has some decisions to make, because the supporters can't have it both ways.

The Tigers either tank for a priority pick or come home like a freight train, singing their theme song and missing that extra selection.

The beauty of the AFL's recent changes to the priority pick system means - with only pick 17 up for grabs for underperforming - to tank or not to tank is a question up for debate.

Here is the deal: a side that wins four or fewer games in any given year receives the first pick of the second round of the draft (17), with pick one given only for two consecutive seasons under four wins.

If the Tigers were in this situation last year, their worst move would have been to start winning games to disqualify themselves from that pick.

With only pick 17 on offer, will the Tigers benefit more from a second-round pick or from winning 4-6 of their last 10 games to build some momentum for next year.

One of the furphies surrounding recent draft successes at various clubs is that first and second-round picks always come through.

The situation couldn't be further from the truth.

First-round picks are like gold, but from there it is still very much a mixed bag.

Consider pick 17s from 1998-2006: Peter Street, Ezra Bray, James Davies, James Kelly, Cameron Faulkner, Billy Morrison, Andrew McQualter, Darren Pfeiffer and Shaun Hampson.

Not a lot of stars in there, notwithstanding Kelly's form this year.

Richmond - already guaranteed a top-three pick - simply must build for the future by trying to finish the year as Hawthorn did last year: on a roll.

The Hawks won their last four of 2006, stored away that self-belief, worked their butts off over the preseason and came out firing this season.

Richmond must do the same.

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,21956749%255E19771,00.html

Offline Rodgerramjet

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2007, 07:19:26 AM »
If they as a playing group have any pride in themselves they will be trying to win every game. You can't train a winning mindset by losing on purpose. And any coach that coaches in the direction of undermining the winning intention of his players should be sacked.
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Online julzqld

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2007, 08:39:59 AM »
Well said Roger.

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2007, 09:19:40 AM »
If they as a playing group have any pride in themselves they will be trying to win every game. You can't train a winning mindset by losing on purpose. And any coach that coaches in the direction of undermining the winning intention of his players should be sacked.


Totally agree

Offline tigersalive

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2007, 10:40:43 AM »
If they as a playing group have any pride in themselves they will be trying to win every game. You can't train a winning mindset by losing on purpose. And any coach that coaches in the direction of undermining the winning intention of his players should be sacked.


Totally agree

Ditto.
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Offline bluey_21

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2007, 11:21:21 AM »
If they as a playing group have any pride in themselves they will be trying to win every game. You can't train a winning mindset by losing on purpose. And any coach that coaches in the direction of undermining the winning intention of his players should be sacked.


Totally agree

Ditto.

Ditto again  :thumbsup  :lol

Gordon Bennett

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2007, 08:10:07 PM »
I'm willing to give up the priority pick in exchange for another 5 wins.

However, I want Melbourne, Brisbane and Carlton to keep winning so that we at least get pick 2. Our main concern might be gaining the 1st pick in the PSD - that could be crucial re leverage - doing a Simmonds-like  trade deal by threat, then following it up with a ruckman at pick 1 in the PSD.

Offline bluey_21

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2007, 08:17:31 PM »
Personally I want pick 2. there are 2 standout players Cotchin and Kreuzer, and at the end of the day getting either will leave me really rapt. The main reason for this is that I don't mind recruiting either and with pick 2 you get one of those 2 future stars but you don't get the Cotchin or Kreuzer better than the other comparisons.

Offline bluey_21

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2007, 08:38:57 PM »
If there are 2 games I want to win they are Richo vs Port. And out kids vs the Dawks' kids

Online WilliamPowell

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2007, 09:07:56 PM »
Actually said to MT & bg25 on Friday night (prior to the game) that the only game I really want to win is the one against the Hawks - just to shut people up - I am so tired of hearing about how good the Hawks are  :banghead

Facts are they should be with the likes of Mitchell, Hodge etc in that 23-25 bracket starting to fire consistently ::) ::)

On the question of whther to tank or not to tank...

Long term and short term winning is and will be of much greater benefit to our young team than losing. They should want to win ever game - that should be the plan, goal and mindset
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Offline torch

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #10 on: June 25, 2007, 01:59:53 AM »
tank tank tank tank tank tank tank tank tank ...

why win matches now ???

if we were 5-7 still a chance ...

4-8 sort of ...

anything less ... tank tank tank tank ...

play young players ...

time to say goodbye to Tivendale, Hyde, Hall, Moore, Kingsley, Hartigan, Knoble

tank tank tank tank tank tank tank tank tank tank tank ...

max wins: 4 ... obviously ...

and YES ...

hopefully Carlton, Melbourne, Brisbane win 5/6 matches

so ... 3 more wins then torch ??? who against then ...

well ... its very ones opinion really ... mine would be these 3 ...

Round 14: Kangaroos (TD) (Home) ... don't lose to the most overrated and poo team ...

Round 16: Port Adelaide (MCG) (Home) ... this is just a match we should have a tick next to ...

Round 21: Essendon (MCG) (Away) ... i hate these idiots ... revenge from Round 9 ... and you don't lose to the 2nd most overrated and "kidding themselves football club" ever !

QUESTION: ...

there are matches where i would like us to win ...

but if we finish with 5/6 wins and on the bottom by % ... we still get 1st pick ... but no priority next year ??? ...

so really ... we aren't going to finish last again next year (hopefully) ... so win the matches that make us MATHEMATICALLY possible to finish LAST ... and get that first pick ...

i see there is no point in just losing matches ... but i want us to finish last for that no.1 and also players will be delisted !!!

if we finish 14th - 11th ... those players on "thin ice" will get another year !!!

so ...

other matches i would like to see Richmond win ???

Round 15 Hawthorn (MCG) (Away) ... i agree with "WilliamPowell" ... beat these idiots and shut them up ... yet i think they are a good team ... just hope we beat them !!!

Round 19 Collingwood (MCG) (Home) ... stuff them up making the final positionings for revenge too in Round 3 ... but i don't hate Collingwood ... i think they are coached really well !!!

so ...

6 wins ...

hmmmmmm

could this be history ??? most wins finishing last ???

back the Blues, Demons and Lions now ... we don't play either of them now !!!

also ... good to see us win against a team (underdone) that had the wood on us for 4 years ...

just get that monkey off our backs !!!

and Brown obviously ... just what we needed !!!
« Last Edit: June 25, 2007, 04:15:31 AM by one-eyed »

Offline evaluator

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2007, 06:09:57 PM »
We can only afford 2 more wins. We should Tank. Get something out of the wasted year. Beat Hawthorn / Collingwood and thats it. Why win now? :banghead

Offline mightytiges

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #12 on: June 25, 2007, 07:04:55 PM »
I reckoned Terry was experimenting straight after half-time on Friday night given we were 10 goals up. Changed the personnel at the centre bounces (had Hyde in there for example). So there are less obvious ways to tank if we wanted to. He then went back to the first half set-ups for the last quarter.

As much as winning over the next 10 weeks will build up confidence and momentum, the stupid system will punish us for it if we go beyond 4 wins  :scream. The way the Dees, Blues and Lions performed in their hitout a few late wins could see us finish 13th with no PP. It's one thing to say past pick 17 draftees have been failures but the PP could also be used in combo with a player to trade up for another first round pick. 
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Offline bluey_21

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #13 on: June 25, 2007, 07:09:11 PM »
looks like we have a conundrum on our hands  :help  :help  :help

Offline Stephanie

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Re: To tank or not to tank? - Priority pick vs Winning 4 or more games
« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2007, 10:02:54 PM »
Flip a coin lol

I would say no to tanking... I believe they'll get more out of a winning momentum than tanking and get a PP. That's just my opinoin
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