Philosophical question:- Why are we perpetually poo?

[Tigeritis™©®]

Very simple answer to the question

The reason is because we the fans accept mediocrity

We have very very low standards

TIGERITIS: "the frenzy at the debut of Justin Plapp"

TIGERITIS: "the strong belief that Jarrod Silvester was our next great backman".

TIGERITIS: "the fancy that our club can make a player better than they were at their previous club"

We also over rate our players even when we're poo. Remember kb's mosquito fleet. They were alot of average or wed have been killing it in the middle but we didn't.
Frawley over rated his list. Hardwick has over rated it. It's a perennial thing.

TIGERITIS: "we don't need another ruckman because we have Hampson & Maric"

TIGERITIS: "the delusion that we just need a Steven Motlop to give us a chance to get back into the eight again"

TIGERITIS: "happy to just make finals"

TIGERITIS: "gives the coach an extension for making finals"

TIGERITIS: "Let's make this guy a forward"
TIGERITIS: "No, Let's make him a coach!" 

[RollsRoyce]

Very simple answer to the question

The reason is because we the fans accept mediocrity

We have very very low standards

Even if I accepted your premise that we the fans accept mediocrity, and I don't (for every unquestioning clod who thinks our list is just fine, there are hundreds who know it's not), how does what the fans think have any bearing on how the club functions anyway? What can we as observers of the game and nothing more do to tell our clubs management that we demand better? Dump chicken poo on the doorstep? Tried that. At the end of the day our only recourse to protest is to cancel our membership,which is like cutting off your nose to spite your face anyway.

[RollsRoyce]

Would Sheedy have survived a year like 1983 if he was coach of Richmond ?

 These scenarios are all hypothetical of course, so we can only speculate what MIGHT have happened if these sliding door moments had occurred. But my feeling is, if Sheedy had been at Richmond we wouldn't have had the miserable 1983 that we did. For a start we probably wouldn't have lost Raines and Cloke who were driven off by frustration with Francis Bourke. We'd still have had Brian Wood too, who was shown the door at Richmond, but ended up going to Essendon and extending his career under Sheedy.
 

[Hard Roar Tiger]

Very simple answer to the question

The reason is because we the fans accept mediocrity

We have very very low standards

Even if I accepted your premise that we the fans accept mediocrity, and I don't (for every unquestioning clod who thinks our list is just fine, there are hundreds who know it's not), how does what the fans think have any bearing on how the club functions anyway? What can we as observers of the game and nothing more do to tell our clubs management that we demand better? Dump chicken poo on the doorstep? Tried that. At the end of the day our only recourse to protest is to cancel our membership,which is like cutting off your nose to spite your face anyway.

Nailed it. Club is still blaming supporters as late as early this year. It's laughable.

[(•))(©™]

Culture.

Starts at the top.

[Dougeytherichmondfan]

So if culture is the singular issue as to why we are so terrible, did we have a great culture until 82 and then the moment D'Amico ran onto the field our culture became rubbish? How did we go from one of the most dominant and consistently successful clubs to one of the worst.

Just asking the question.

I was born well after our last GF appearance.

[(•))(©™]

So if culture is the singular issue as to why we are so terrible, did we have a great culture until 82 and then the moment D'Amico ran onto the field our culture became rubbish? How did we go from one of the most dominant and consistently successful clubs to one of the worst.

Just asking the question.

I was born well after our last GF appearance.

We had flag success in every decade from 1920 - 1980 bar the 50s.
D'Amico is a crock of poo.
Basically after GR went, unqualified nepotism took over and has continued until now.

[Tigeritis™©®]

So if culture is the singular issue as to why we are so terrible, did we have a great culture until 82 and then the moment D'Amico ran onto the field our culture became rubbish? How did we go from one of the most dominant and consistently successful clubs to one of the worst.

Just asking the question.

I was born well after our last GF appearance.

We had flag success in every decade from 1920 - 1980 bar the 50s.
D'Amico is a crock of poo.
Basically after GR went, unqualified nepotism took over and has continued until now.

[tdy]

I wonder if it was a hangover from a great team retiring moving on etc and like brisbane of now the rot set in looking for a messiah from the past glory years and having no money relative to the other clubs. So the few messiahs who they did produce went elsewhere. Even Hawthorn struggled for years to rebuild after the 80s team retired and they had a few ex premiership players return as coach but it wasn't until Clarkson they came good and Clarkson is ex north and the dees.

[Hard Roar Tiger]

I wonder if it was a hangover from a great team retiring moving on etc and like brisbane of now the rot set in looking for a messiah from the past glory years and having no money relative to the other clubs. So the few messiahs who they did produce went elsewhere. Even Hawthorn struggled for years to rebuild after the 80s team retired and they had a few ex premiership players return as coach but it wasn't until Clarkson they came good and Clarkson is ex north and the dees.

Makes sense. So why is it still a problem?

[tdy]

Well we've had three attempts at rectifying it under Frawley, Wallace and Hardwick all external actors and two have had limited on field success but all three have been screwed by their recruiters and judgement of the list.  Probably even if we did have good recruiters none of them would have succeeded as none appear to be astute match day coaches either.

We just chose badly 3 times I reckon, it appears easy to get it wrong but out of fear of instability we haven't dropped these guys earlier.  Both Frawley and Wallace knew the game was up early in their last year and should have gone a year earlier than they did.  The same is probably true of Hardwick now a senior coach with no assistants, his card is marked.

If anything that is good about Hardwick being extended is it gives Balme and Gale a year to assess the new assistant coaches, players and recruiters before a new senior coach arrives.  At which time they get a free hit to fire any they don't think are any good without affecting the senior coach so they get 2 shots at it.

But will Gale and co survive another bad year of 8 - 10 wins?  If this forum is any bell weather then no but if the gerrymander that is the club constitution holds then they are as solid as Mugabe in Zimbabwe, there til they die.

[Tigershark]

Stability is a "joke" word on this forum .

But the reason why the Tigers have been an embarrassment for 3 decades is rampant instability. At least the current regime is doing its best to rectify this - even if its with a coach who has lost the support of the tiger faithful.

Maybe it all started when Tommy Hafey left the club .....who bloody  knows.

The club should never have sacked TJ in 1981 - could you imagine Hawthorn sacking Clarkson in 2009 for missing the finals .

Richmond probably would of won the grand final in 1982 had Tony Jewell been coach. We were two goals up at half time .

Instead TJ was replaced by Francis Burke who was a recently retired champion player with no coaching experience.....Imagine Newy coaching us now. Burke got many of his former team mates off side with his condecending coaching style.....especially the senior players.

Then in 1983 the club let walk its captain from 1981 , the captain from 1982 and a triple B&F winner.

What happened between Richmond and Collingwood that year with the poaching of players definitely led to financial instability at the club . 7 years later the club was rattling tins and was a charity case .

Poor old KB never had a chance by the time he became coach . Richmond was so under resourced it didn't even own a brench press back then . Bartlett had to buy sporting equipment for the club out of his own pocket.

By the time the game went truly national in the early 90s we were so far off the pace it wasn't funny .
No way we could compete against interstate juggernauts like West Coast or Adelaide.

Against the odds the club looked like it was headed somewhere in the mid 90s .Finally we were playing a brand of football which made us proud plus we has a young superstar called Matthew Richardson who could be anything.
John Northy who had a year to go on his contract asked for an extension. Not unreasonable - especially in this day and age where Dimma gets a 2 year extension after losing 3 elimination finals in a row.

The club said no and Swooper walked . Richmond replaces its most successful coach in over a decade with a coach who had to be talked out of retirement.

I always wonder how the Tigers would of gone in 1996 had Northey still remained as coach .....better than 9th I would suggest.

Even last decade the club was still well behind the elite clubs with money spent on football departments , player development , recruiting etc . Club just did not have the money to compete with the big boys .

Say what you will about the current administration but Benny Gale has always said there is a correlation between on field success and money spend on football department. At least we have a club now that is debt free and has  state of the art facilities.

the rot set in when we traded the Whale.......traded out outool .....

sorry everyone.....bloody spell check......that should have read traded out our soul. 

[tdy]

dya mean traded out our     soul?

soemthing is wierd going on here

I typed in our and then the word soul and it became outool.  Twice

[(•))(©™]

Our tool works better anyway.

[Hard Roar Tiger]

Well we've had three attempts at rectifying it under Frawley, Wallace and Hardwick all external actors and two have had limited on field success but all three have been screwed by their recruiters and judgement of the list.  Probably even if we did have good recruiters none of them would have succeeded as none appear to be astute match day coaches either.

We just chose badly 3 times I reckon, it appears easy to get it wrong but out of fear of instability we haven't dropped these guys earlier.  Both Frawley and Wallace knew the game was up early in their last year and should have gone a year earlier than they did.  The same is probably true of Hardwick now a senior coach with no assistants, his card is marked.

If anything that is good about Hardwick being extended is it gives Balme and Gale a year to assess the new assistant coaches, players and recruiters before a new senior coach arrives.  At which time they get a free hit to fire any they don't think are any good without affecting the senior coach so they get 2 shots at it.

But will Gale and co survive another bad year of 8 - 10 wins?  If this forum is any bell weather then no but if the gerrymander that is the club constitution holds then they are as solid as Mugabe in Zimbabwe, there til they die.

So, like Bourke, Sproule,Patterson,Jewell,Bartlett,Jeans,Geishen,Walls etc we got the coach wrong?
It's like shooting the drug addicts instead of the dealers.

I don't think the essence of our issue is the coach, it's one step removed from that.

I think half our issue is where we target the problem