One-Eyed Richmond Forum
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Moi on November 25, 2006, 02:07:24 PM
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Cast my vote this morning.
The Liberal guy was there, and I said to him, "oh, you're the bloke Ted's mum-in-law won't vote for" lol
"Well, I won't either"
:wallywink
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I'd be more polite - wish him the best while scratching my bum with his "How to vote" leaflet.
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He laughed and said "Ted does have a few problems with his mother-in-law" lol
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I run into our local school where the polling booths are. It's the only way to avoid the vultures shoving how to vote cards in your face lol (btw IMO they should be banned. What a waste of paper). I've never seen a actual candidate at these things before but I flew past the Labor candidate today before realising who he was. The poor bloke must of thought I was a stauch Liberal voter :rollin.
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Glad they've got Ted leading the Libs - the thought of Robert Doyle in Speedos was just too much to contemplate lol
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Take em all, mt. Keeping printers in business. ;)
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Take em all, mt. Keeping printers in business. ;)
They certainly are FF. All parties have posted their election stuff 4 times to us both individually as well as to the family :P.
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We actually had a candidate out our polling booth yesterday - he was the Greens candidate and he looked like Blakey from "On the Buses"
They actually spoke to Ted's Mother in Law on channel 7 while she was giving out ALP how to vote cards. Said she wouldn't be voting for Ted and that she hadn't had Xmas Dinner with them for years ;D
And in the end what a non-event it was - the result was guaranteed four years ago
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And in the end what a non-event it was - the result was guaranteed four years ago
Modern election campaigns are so stage managed :sleep.
Reminds me of the Goodies episode where Bill and Tim were opposing candidates and it was Graham's job to make the election campaign exciting. Tim was dressed up like Queen Vic standing between two typists named Tina and Marge and sang "don't cry for me Marge and Tina". The campaign was so entertaining that everybody stayed home on polling day to watch the campaign on tv and only Bill and Tim actually voted so it was a tie - 1 vote a piece lol.
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The pollies must now think I live in a marginal seat as I've never been inundated with so many political pamplets, letters, phone calls, etc... in my life :P. Thank gawd it ends tomorrow.
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Im supporting the working class boy Ted Baillieu - Vote 1 Libs :gotigers
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ive had a gutful of Labour in this state. First time im voting Liberal in my life...
Labours credit rating IMO is as a result of doing nothing therefore building up surplus, much like Johnny Howard
Ted has announced a review of min sentencing. This was the core reason of why im voting for him
Train ticket system a complete waste of time and money
Libs have a better Stamp duty reduction policy
I will never vote for a bloke who did a Bradbury and fell over the line.
Lastly both a tools but that Brumby just rubs me up the wrong way. stuffin tosser Collingwood supporter
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The ones who make me laugh are the Family First pollies. How come they are allowed to reproduce? Where's Fielding's family impact statement on morons who breed?
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I will never vote for a bloke who did a Bradbury and fell over the line.
What does that mean exactly daniel ;D
The elcted Premier of the last election walked out what was it exactly a few months after beng elected
And the current leader was elected unopposed by his colleagues....
That's how our system not just in this state but in this country works so I am not sure how you can say he "fell over the line"
As for the result - I think it will be close
Although to be honest after 11 years and the mistakes of the last 4 years by the current govt why it remains so close is baffling to me...
The opposition should be miles ahead. The fact that they aren't says more about them IMHO.
But will be glad when it's over as I am all electioned out ;D
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I will never vote for a bloke who did a Bradbury and fell over the line.
What does that mean exactly daniel ;D
The elcted Premier of the last election walked out what was it exactly a few months after beng elected
And the current leader was elected unopposed by his colleagues....
That's how our system not just in this state but in this country works so I am not sure how you can say he "fell over the line"
As for the result - I think it will be close
Although to be honest after 11 years and the mistakes of the last 4 years by the current govt why it remains so close is baffling to me...
The opposition should be miles ahead. The fact that they aren't says more about them IMHO.
But will be glad when it's over as I am all electioned out ;D
Like i told my father only an hour in a heated discussion as he was about to head out to assist the labour polling booth, It means he was in the right place at the right time.
He doesnt deserve to be the leader of our state any longer. 11 years of rubbish
He has failed to do anything in his time and i hope to see the back of him and with any luck he can take Overland with him, another loser who took over from possibly the biggest fraud to ever be our commissioner. What that mole did was inexcusable.
Your right Libs should win and would if they alligned with the Greens but such is life and Labour will hold on.
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The party with the majority in the lower house forms the government and elect their leader, in this case Brumby.
We vote for local candidates, we don't vote for premiers.
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Like i told my father only an hour in a heated discussion as he was about to head out to assist the labour polling booth, It means he was in the right place at the right time.
He doesnt deserve to be the leader of our state any longer. 11 years of rubbish
He has failed to do anything in his time and i hope to see the back of him and with any luck he can take Overland with him, another loser who took over from possibly the biggest fraud to ever be our commissioner. What that mole did was inexcusable.
Your right Libs should win and would if they alligned with the Greens but such is life and Labour will hold on.
Brumby has only been premier for what 3 and half years
I think he did a good job while Treasurer though, his job & promise what to ensure the state budget delivered a surplus every year he did that.
Biggest mistake the Govt has made in the last 4 years is MyKi
As for Overland - he ahs a contract and if there is a change then the Coalition would need to pay him out a considerable amount so I can't see it happening. Especially considering the problems with the Libs policy costings.... the Lib Treasurer bloke admitted using his brother or brother-in-laws accountancy firm to do their costings :wallywink
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What exactly did Christine Nixon do as Commissioner that has you all het up, Dan?
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What exactly did Christine Nixon do as Commissioner that has you all het up, Dan?
Was it the haircut? :rollin
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What exactly did Christine Nixon do as Commissioner that has you all het up, Dan?
Was it the haircut? :rollin
:rollin
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What exactly did Christine Nixon do as Commissioner that has you all het up, Dan?
A) Nothing
B) Go out for dinner with her mates while victorians burned to death
is that enough reason for you :banghead :banghead
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Gawd help us if the Libs win with the Greens controlling the upper house.
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are you talking controlling as in majority or holding the balance of power MT?
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are you talking controlling as in majority or holding the balance of power MT?
Libs majority in LA and Greens balance of power in the LC.
Looks like the Libs have won at this stage according to the ABC - Lib 45, ALP 37, 6 in doubt :-\. Frankston line and outer east turned on the Government.
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are you talking controlling as in majority or holding the balance of power MT?
Libs majority in LA and Greens balance of power in the LC.
Looks like the Libs have won at this stage according to the ABC - Lib 45, ALP 37, 6 in doubt :-\. Frankston line and outer east turned on the Government.
How are they going to fix the trains?
I doubt they can unless they can put on more lines
The infrastructure has been neglected for too long by all governments
Glad I drive my car :thumbsup
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Cheers MT.
FNM, I remember reading an article not long after the the tollways came in that the way the contract was the govt could not actively take any action that may affect the bottom line of the toll operators, in other words, anything that takes cars off the tollways (ie. improve public transport).
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Cheers MT.
FNM, I remember reading an article not long after the the tollways came in that the way the contract was the govt could not actively take any action that may affect the bottom line of the toll operators, in other words, anything that takes cars off the tollways (ie. improve public transport).
Better still, build a train line that doesn't stop at Sale and goes all the way to Sydney along the coast
Start building another city between here and Sydney and encourage people to move
Why decentralisation hasn't been a plan for this country years ago buggered if I know
Basically, there's too many people in Melbourne
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Couldnt agree more about decentralisation.
The Central Business District is a relic of the days when documents had to be physically transported to be acted upon.
Now people within the same building email each other.
The best way to solve transport isues is to reduce the need for people to commute.
Just as the best way to solve hospital issues is to reduce the number of sick people.
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Why decentralisation hasn't been a plan for this country years ago buggered if I know
Basically, there's too many people in Melbourne
You commie ;D
It's too late to decentralise the population voluntarily. The major cities are settled in terms of big business head offices, transport, hospitals, entertainment,... etc. They are population gravitational wells.
It's been a poor voter turnout. Could be a combination of the bad weather, apathy and people being electioned out after the Federal poll. Also a 1/4 of Victorians voted before the election in pre-polls so that's why nobody is calling the election result. The ABC is predicting a 6-seat majority to the Coalition but some of their prediction figures are stuffed up by the low voter turnout and the huge number of pre-polls.
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You commie ;D
It's too late to decentralise the population voluntarily. The major cities are settled in terms of big business head offices, transport, hospitals, entertainment,... etc. They are population gravitational wells.
Complete the train line and see what happens
Yeah, I have commie tendencies lol
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You commie ;D
It's too late to decentralise the population voluntarily. The major cities are settled in terms of big business head offices, transport, hospitals, entertainment,... etc. They are population gravitational wells.
Complete the train line and see what happens
Yeah, I have commie tendencies lol
LOL
There is/was a old train line all the way up to Bega in NSW but over time they cut the service back to Orbost then Bairnsdale and then Sale for economic reasons. It's the long way to Sydney so it became redundant.
We do have a city halfway between Melbourne and Sydney already called Canberra :wallywink. And it was designed and built for 1 million people with 4-lane freeways etc... Problem is it only ended up with only a quarter of that number despite the offers of legalised pot, porn and fireworks lol. I had to spend a month living there in the 90s for work. I still remember being in the only car on the main freeway and the whole place shutting down before 7pm :P.
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Going by the VEC it'll end up either the Libs ahead 45-43 or a hung parliament 44-split. It wouldn't be 2010 without another draw. No independents this time either to play kingmaker. We could be back to the polls :P.
The seat of Bentleigh is now the crucial seat. Labor is trailing by 213 votes two-party preferred yet must hold onto the seat otherwise it's game over. Probably roughly 8000 pre-polls and postals still be counted. Eltham and Ballarat East are also close but Labor leads in both of them.
ALP - 41
Lib/Nat - 44
In doubt: 3
Bentleigh - Lib ahead 213 (2-PP, 75% counted)
Eltham - ALP ahead 225
Ballarat East - ALP ahead 388
Right along the Frankston railway line and mid-outer Eastern suburbs turned on Labor. To me that says transport was the main issue this election given those areas cover the two busiest lines - Frankston and Ringwood.
In the past, controlling all of the leafy eastern suburban seats would have handed the Libs government with a large majority but the growth over the past decade in outer western, northern and south-eastern Melbourne plus the larger urban regional cities (which stuck with Labor despite a swing against) has kept the final result tight.
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Why decentralisation hasn't been a plan for this country years ago buggered if I know
Basically, there's too many people in Melbourne
You commie ;D
It's too late to decentralise the population voluntarily. The major cities are settled in terms of big business head offices, transport, hospitals, entertainment,... etc. They are population gravitational wells.
To a certain point it too late to decentalise the existing population spread, but it's not to late to change the centralisation attitutde.
Wherever there is population growth there tends to be an attitude to build somwhere for them to live an build or improve infrastructure to allow these people to communte to established employment areas, rather than createe employment in those areas.
Governments need to look at providing tax incentives for large businesses to locate their offices in outer suburban and regional areas.
They have just build a brand new freeway up here, which will be in part to accommodate the extra traffic in and out of darwin when they build a new satellite city. They should be ensuring the new city has scope to provide employment and thus reduce the need for people to travel.
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The people have spoken.
Brumby along with Abbott and Howard are the 3 biggest imbeciles in politics.
He has turned this state into a farce that bloke.
Libs policies were so far superior than brumbys.
Myki, train debacle, crime rates what a farce.
Its no wonder he kept his aaa rating because he saved all the money instead of spending it where it was needed.
Brumby is a tool of the highest order and deserves to be shown the exit door, sadly he prob won't
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We do have a city halfway between Melbourne and Sydney already called Canberra :wallywink. And it was designed and built for 1 million people with 4-lane freeways etc... Problem is it only ended up with only a quarter of that number despite the offers of legalised pot, porn and fireworks lol. I had to spend a month living there in the 90s for work. I still remember being in the only car on the main freeway and the whole place shutting down before 7pm :P.
Again, they picked the wrong place
Try getting a cargo ship into Canberra port, just doesn't work :wallywink back at ya lol
Get a town near a deep water harbour between Melbourne and Sydney and say, "This is a place for a City". Now, where have I heard that before lol
I think they tried to get everyone up to Albury/Wodonga. Again, the WRONG PLACE.
Idiots. I should run this country lol.
You need freight lines (hence the line extension) and deep shipping ports and away you go!
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ive had a gutful of Labour in this state. First time im voting Liberal in my life...
Labours credit rating IMO is as a result of doing nothing therefore building up surplus, much like Johnny Howard
Ted has announced a review of min sentencing. This was the core reason of why im voting for him
Train ticket system a complete waste of time and money
Libs have a better Stamp duty reduction policy
I will never vote for a bloke who did a Bradbury and fell over the line.
Lastly both a tools but that Brumby just rubs me up the wrong way. effin tosser Collingwood supporter
I agree with you Dan. That means we both won't vote Julia's labor back in next federal election because her government was never voted in.
I can't stand Labor state or federal. They are a bunch of factionalized power hungry socialists dogooders that think they speak for the silent majority.
I hope all you Brumby lovers know that your beloved leader is the only state premier who wants to raise GST to 15%. Probably to pay for his desal plant we don't need and a transport ticketing system that doesn't work.
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ive had a gutful of Labour in this state. First time im voting Liberal in my life...
Labours credit rating IMO is as a result of doing nothing therefore building up surplus, much like Johnny Howard
Ted has announced a review of min sentencing. This was the core reason of why im voting for him
Train ticket system a complete waste of time and money
Libs have a better Stamp duty reduction policy
I will never vote for a bloke who did a Bradbury and fell over the line.
Lastly both a tools but that Brumby just rubs me up the wrong way. effin tosser Collingwood supporter
I agree with you Dan. That means we both won't vote Julia's labor back in next federal election because her government was never voted in.
I can't stand Labor state or federal. They are a bunch of factionalized power hungry socialists dogooders that think they speak for the silent majority.
I hope all you Brumby lovers know that your beloved leader is the only state premier who wants to raise GST to 15%. Probably to pay for his desal plant we don't need and a transport ticketing system that doesn't work.
Brumby is a complete imbecile who has done absolutely nothing right in his whole term. At least Bracks had character, listening to Brumby is like watching paint dry.
City streets still a disaster on Saturday nights. Murderers still out in 10 years for good behaviour. What Peter Dupas was allowed to do with our tax payers money was a complete and utter joke. Libs have said they will make changes to our judicial system and i believe they will. Anyone who thinks its okay to vote for a bloke who allows this sentencing debacle to continue, have absolutely no idea
We have police Commissioners going out for dinner and wine while the state burned to death. Then to top it off we hire another idiot Overland. Transport another disaster. I mean when is enough enough. He is an arrogant prick who thinks his poo doesnt stink.
Labour has screwed this state over.
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What exactly did Christine Nixon do as Commissioner that has you all het up, Dan?
A) Nothing
B) Go out for dinner with her mates while victorians burned to death
is that enough reason for you :banghead :banghead
Calm down mate.
I was just curious, i wasn't defending her.
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Libs have extended their lead in Bentleigh after the first count of pre-poll votes.
Should be enough for a majority in the lower house
Don't know why there was so much talk over a hung parliament, it was always going to take a significant result to turn around Bentleigh
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Good result for Victoria yesterday! Good to see good working class boys like Baillieu make good ;D
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Good result for Victoria yesterday! Good to see good working class boys like Baillieu make good ;D
Flags we don't have a result ;D
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Good result for Victoria yesterday! Good to see good working class boys like Baillieu make good ;D
Flags we don't have a result ;D
Technically, we may as well have though
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Pre-polling is favouring the Libs so the result is known. The only thing holding up Brumby's concession is he can't get into his office because some powder was found there. Coalition 45-43 in the lower house and they'll probably have the majority in the upper house as well. So control in both houses and inheriting a strong economy and a budget in the black with a AAA rating = No excuses for the Ted and the Libs. It's going to be fun watching them deal with public transport when they never ever gave a stuff about it before in Victoria and are the main reason it's still in a time warp after 80 years of neglect. First stop is finishing the railway line extension to South Morang that Labor started. That's the one the Libs closed down and ripped up in the 1970s so we now have to build it again ::).
I hope all you Brumby lovers know that your beloved leader is the only state premier who wants to raise GST to 15%.
That was former NSW Liberal leader John Brogden.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/push-to-increase-gst-rate/story-e6frg8zx-1225884008218
Also the Conservative National party in NZ has already lifted the GST over there to 15%.
Btw I believe that red head standing at the treasury box in the House of Reps is Gillard so she must have been voted in as PM. The Constitution has been around for over 100 years so everyone knew the rules (except Abbott obviously lol).
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next year with that big tax summit the GST will come up and no doubt a public debate will erupt about GST raise. I dont think Gillard will be dumb enough to try and push that through with her carbon tax though.
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Pre-polling is favouring the Libs so the result is known. The only thing holding up Brumby's concession is he can't get into his office because some powder was found there. Coalition 45-43 in the lower house and they'll probably have the majority in the upper house as well. So control in both houses and inheriting a strong economy and a budget in the black with a AAA rating = No excuses for the Ted and the Libs. It's going to be fun watching them deal with public transport when they never ever gave a stuff about it before in Victoria and are the main reason it's still in a time warp after 80 years of neglect. First stop is finishing the railway line extension to South Morang that Labor started. That's the one the Libs closed down and ripped up in the 1970s so we now have to build it again ::).
And then once they do that they will start to build new cop shops in the areas that had cops shops but were closed closed under the Kennett govt. And if we are really lucky they might even allow some to go back to being manned 24/7 ;D
Now I cannot see them re-opening the hospitals in the metro area but hey to keep Nat leader little Peter Ryan smirking maybe they'll re-open some of the country ones they closed ;D
Then there's the schools :rollin
Struth :o it could be case of everything old is new again
And I think it is fair to assume the result isn't known because I feel a re-count request coming on :santa :santa :santa
That's politics folks ;D
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There should be no Carbon Tax because the impact on the poor will be shocking! There should be no resources rent tax because it will cause massive unemployment in WA and Qu and there'll be a massive impact on Super funds going forward! The GST should go up to 12.5% with 2.5% of that used to pay down the national debt caused by Labors Communist policys, Company Tax should go to 35% and state governments should legislate a 25% decrease in electricity, gas and water bills for consumers. OER Australia Partyis now ready for Government! ;D
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You commie ;D
It's too late to decentralise the population voluntarily. The major cities are settled in terms of big business head offices, transport, hospitals, entertainment,... etc. They are population gravitational wells.
Complete the train line and see what happens
Yeah, I have commie tendencies lol
Moi you're going about this all the wrong way...Only one thing needs to be done to commence decentralisation... Play all Collingwood Home games in Orbost!! The flow on effect would be as follows....
Decentralisation with all Collingwood fans taking up residence in Orbost
Reduced crime rates in Melbourne
The Westpac centre can be turned back into a first class public baths & Gymnasium
Reduced waiting times at Centrelink
You will no longer dread taking public transport before and after games
You will no longer have to dodge discarded retreads when driving around town
The only drawback I can see is Melbourne Denture Clinics and Caravan Park owners could go out of business. ;D
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Brumby has conceded defeat. It's all over.
Bailleu to attended the governer's office in about 5-10 minutes to announce they can form government
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Brumby has conceded defeat. It's all over.
Bailleu to attended the governer's office in about 5-10 minutes to announce they can form government
They may be able to form a govt but as is the case in all these situations ...can they govern, that is do they have clue :rollin
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There should be no Carbon Tax because the impact on the poor will be shocking! There should be no resources rent tax because it will cause massive unemployment in WA and Qu and there'll be a massive impact on Super funds going forward! The GST should go up to 12.5% with 2.5% of that used to pay down the national debt caused by Labors Communist policys, Company Tax should go to 35% and state governments should legislate a 25% decrease in electricity, gas and water bills for consumers. OER Australia Partyis now ready for Government! ;D
Carbon tax will happen cause Labor need for tax money to fund there policy's and will work with the greens in the senate to pass it in the 2nd half of 2011. Carbon tax will not do anything but push power prices higher. Coal is the cheapest and due to the government not investing in any new plants or infrastructure prices have already shot through the roof this carbon tax is going to just hurt us.
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Brumby has conceded defeat. It's all over.
Bailleu to attended the governer's office in about 5-10 minutes to announce they can form government
They may be able to form a govt but as is the case in all these situations ...can they govern, that is do they have clue :rollin
you seem a very intelligent person WP, surely you could see the need for change.
I voted for a party who had clear direction with clear policies and i wasn't going to vote Labour just because i always had or because my father is a volunteer for the ALP. What matters is we fix this min sentencing debacle and the train system mess.
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Brumby has conceded defeat. It's all over.
Bailleu to attended the governer's office in about 5-10 minutes to announce they can form government
They may be able to form a govt but as is the case in all these situations ...can they govern, that is do they have clue :rollin
you seem a very intelligent person WP, surely you could see the need for change.
I voted for a party who had clear direction with clear policies and i wasn't going to vote Labour just because i always had or because my father is a volunteer for the ALP. What matters is we fix this min sentencing debacle and the train system mess.
a lot of people havent forgiven the libs for what they did to the state last time. i doubt whether they wanted change
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What exactly did Christine Nixon do as Commissioner that has you all het up, Dan?
A) Nothing
B) Go out for dinner with her mates while victorians burned to death
is that enough reason for you :banghead :banghead
Calm down mate.
I was just curious, i wasn't defending her.
Just on this issue again, Dan. given that crime rates in the state are down, how do u argue she did nothing?
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a lot of people havent forgiven the libs for what they did to the state last time. i doubt whether they wanted change
So true so true
And no I haven't forgiven then for what they did to basic services the last time they were in
The privatising of public assets, the shutting of schools, hospitals and police stations
And all they've done for the last 18 months in particular is sook about the last govt (Lab) doing nothing when thier actions pre 1999 contributed to a number of the problems
When you see you loved ones lying on hospital trolleys or having to by-pass thier nearest hospital back in 1994 because the then govt has closed emergency departments - it's hard to forgive
But credit where credit is due 18 months ago the Coalition had no hope of winning and they've turned it around. Couple with that based on the perfomranceof the last 18 mths the previous Labor govt didn't really deserve the right to continue
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What exactly did Christine Nixon do as Commissioner that has you all het up, Dan?
A) Nothing
B) Go out for dinner with her mates while victorians burned to death
is that enough reason for you :banghead :banghead
Calm down mate.
I was just curious, i wasn't defending her.
Just on this issue again, Dan. given that crime rates in the state are down, how do u argue she did nothing?
Possibly but i would argue that that includes Murders, manslaughters etc etc
Adding to that i dont care if the crime rates are down they should be virtually non existent. Not enough is being done IMO. The city is still a dangerous place.
now ill repeat any person who is employed to protect and serve our state should not be dining with friends as the state burned to death.
This is the one of the most disgraceful acts ive ever heard anyone in power ever do. A low act that sent her and her fat arse packing.
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Brumby has conceded defeat. It's all over.
Bailleu to attended the governer's office in about 5-10 minutes to announce they can form government
They may be able to form a govt but as is the case in all these situations ...can they govern, that is do they have clue :rollin
you seem a very intelligent person WP, surely you could see the need for change.
I voted for a party who had clear direction with clear policies and i wasn't going to vote Labour just because i always had or because my father is a volunteer for the ALP. What matters is we fix this min sentencing debacle and the train system mess.
a lot of people havent forgiven the libs for what they did to the state last time. i doubt whether they wanted change
i was a teenager when he was in government, kennett that is and believe me he to was a fool who decided to sell off everything to create this surplus. Now we are the ones paying for it with $500 plus electricity bills every quarter.
Kennett is an a A grade wanker make no mistake about that but this shouldnt be about him it should be about the now!!
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Dan, i really love yr passion, but i think you are confusing the role of the police with the role of the courts.
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Can I add just one more thing
It doesn't matter which side of politics you favour.
IMHO there are 4 things that should not be compromised to save money in a budgetary sense and these are both federal and state issues.
They are
1/ Hospitals
2/ Education
3/ Police
4/ Defence
Cut these and you don't deserve to be in office I don't care who you are
It's always amused me that while politicians will slash spending on these items they always somehow manage to find a way to give themselves a pay increase. And trust me ALL sides of politics have done it and continue to do it
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Good point WP. I would add public transport to that list and remove defence (which i see as a Fed. issue)
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You people are in denial.
The only reason this state has a AAA rating is because Kennett had to lift it out of the absolute mess the Cain/Kerner government left it in. The cut backs were necessary at the time to help rebuild the state.
I know that jeffs head got too big it finally fell off his shoulders but the facts are the Bracks/Brumby Labor government inherited the state in good financial position.
The new reality is that Big Ted has got to figure out how to fix Myki, what to do with a useless Desal plant, and how to make us feel safe on our trains again.
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You people are in denial.
The only reason this state has a AAA rating is because Kennett had to lift it out of the absolute mess the Cain/Kerner government left it in. The cut backs were necessary at the time to help rebuild the state.
I know that jeffs head got too big it finally fell off his shoulders but the facts are the Bracks/Brumby Labor government inherited the state in good financial position.
The new reality is that Big Ted has got to figure out how to fix Myki, what to do with a useless Desal plant, and how to make us feel safe on our trains again.
good points there. Desal plant..hahaha what a farce. seriously whats worse this or the myki. i cant split them.
Its like splitting Overland with Christine Nixon. One thing is for sure we will pay for brumby and his countless mistakes that he makes.
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cutbacks were necessary? try telling that to the kids and parents of the schools that were closed.
sorry mate, but yr the one in denial.
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this state was bankrupted by labor before Kennett came in. Kennett had no choice but he went to far- especially on health and hospitals. If it wasnt for Kennett, Victorians en masse would be lining up at Soup Kitchens today. As for Electricity, Gas and Water prices, it was the role of state government to control the privatised companies as far as increases were concerned. Brumby and Labor failed to control them and that was the end of the penny section.
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If you privatise companies then control them, does that not defeat the free market principle on which they were privatised in the first place?
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Surprised it took so long for the Kirner/Cain legacy to get mentioned
Funny how Labor supporters won't forgive Kennett, but they're happy to ignore the Kirner government for almost bankrupting the state
Kind of what NSW Liberals will inherit in 3 months time
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Surprised it took so long for the Kirner/Cain legacy
Funny how Labor supporters won't forgive Kennett, but they're happy to ignore the Kirner government for almost bankrupting the state
Kind of what NSW Liberals will inherit in 3 months time
:clapping
The state had a -A rating after Cain/Kirner. Even Tassie was laughing at us.
Kennett did what he had to do but his big head got the better of him in the end.
I like Big Ted though, I sounds like an honest, stand up guy to me. :pray
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Surprised it took so long for the Kirner/Cain legacy
Funny how Labor supporters won't forgive Kennett, but they're happy to ignore the Kirner government for almost bankrupting the state
Kind of what NSW Liberals will inherit in 3 months time
:clapping
The state had a -A rating after Cain/Kirner. Even Tassie was laughing at us.
Kennett did what he had to do but his big head got the better of him in the end.
I like Big Ted though, I sounds like an honest, stand up guy to me. :pray
yep i agree. Something about him i really like. He doesnt seem arrogant at all, just a real nice family guy.
His mrs is quite the milf also :thumbsup
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wish all the stand up family guys had his money :banghead
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this state was bankrupted by labor before Kennett came in. Kennett had no choice but he went to far- especially on health and hospitals. If it wasnt for Kennett, Victorians en masse would be lining up at Soup Kitchens today. As for Electricity, Gas and Water prices, it was the role of state government to control the privatised companies as far as increases were concerned. Brumby and Labor failed to control them and that was the end of the penny section.
In a free market it is real competition and the cost efficiencies that result from it that is meant to control prices; not the state. The problem with Victoria's privatisation of utilities and public transport is there was/is no competition. Each company was virtually set up as a monopoly over a specific region of Melbourne/Victoria rather than them going head to head. Take public transport - Connex was given the south-east and Hillside the north-west. How the hell was that creating competition?! No wonder it fell over and Connex took over the whole system. This lack of competition and choice leads to publicly listed companies being answerable first and foremostly to their shareholders at the detriment of their customers. That's why as the public cut back on their usage of say electricity, the companies jacked up these BS service charges so they maintained/increased their profits, share price and dividends to shareholders. Way to encourage the public to not waste our energy resources ::). Like all the banks, all the utility companies are all the same and us consumers/customers are now considered more of a necessary nuisance that can be screwed with little all threat of a backlash as there's bugger all real choice for the customer to take their business elsewhere. Add to this the CEOs and directors are then rewarded with massive payouts linked to the company's shareprice to further encourage these anti-customer practices. Privatisation of basic services was promised to lower prices via gains in efficiency in delivering these services without the need of a bloated state (government) bureaucracy but the complete opposite has happened :scream.
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Problem is that these private companies are still using state infrastructure to deliver the services, they are screwed. Crazy to try and land the contracts in the first place IMO as they're on a hiding to nothing.
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Just as Brumby could no longer blame Jeff for things after 11 years, Jeff can't claim credit for a AAA economy 11 years after being thrown out. Victoria got through the GFC virtually unscathed.
I have a lot of time for Jeff even if I disgree with some of his views. He did a lot of good while he was premier especially in his first term. He seemed to rest on his laurels in his 2nd term though thinking Labor wasn't a threat to him and started to try and nobble the checks and balances to his authority as well as close down too many schools, hospitals etc and ignored everyone outside of the eastern and south-eastern suburbs of Melbourne. Like Brumby in 2010, Jeff lost the 1999 election when he could have easily won it being more in tune with the electorate. Also both tried to 'sandbag' their way to election victory and it didn't work for either in the end. By 2014 Vic Labor has to learn the lessons the Vic Libs didn't by 2002. Accept they have lost and acknowledge the public's voice (hello Tony Abbott federally ::) ) and not pretend it was a 'protest vote' gone too far. Instead correct and develop new policies in areas that cost them government (eg: on crime) and act as a credible opposition offering positive alternative policies in readiness to govern as well as scrutinizing the new government. Victoria over the next 4 years is only one by-election from a hung parliament and what would be an enforced early election.
As for the Desal plant - one season of drought breaking rains due to a stronger and later in the year la nina effect and all of a sudden some people forget we were in a severe drought and tight water restricitions for over a decade. Baillieu just 3 years ago predicted the Thompson dam would become so low in water that it would be unusable. Ironic his first act as premier is closing a water pipeline. I'm sure future generations will be glad we'll have a water source that doesn't depend on hoping and praying for rain.
First day on the job and the Victorian Libs have already closed down the North-South pipeline most likely leaving it to rot. Same old same old. Actually there was a fair bit of caving into NIMBY politics from Ted yesterday: Nth-Sth pipeline closure and the removal of clearance ways in the inner-east suburbs (back to bad old days of trams being held up along Toorak Road :whistle ). If Ted wanted to trump Labor he could have looked into and budgeted for pumps so the Nth-Sth pipe could move water both ways. Melbourne could rely on water from the desal plant while excess water from Sugarloaf could have been pumped up to the Goulburn river, Murray-Darling basin and irrigators.
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Just as Brumby could no longer blame Jeff for things after 11 years, Jeff can't claim credit for a AAA economy 11 years after being thrown out. Victoria got through the GFC virtually unscathed.
I don't think anyone is giving Kennett the credit for getting through the GFC (Howard & Costello on the other hand...), just giving him the credit for getting the state out of it's financial turmoil after Kirner/Cain.
As for the Desal plant - one season of drought breaking rains due to a stronger and later in the year la nina effect and all of a sudden some people forget we were in a severe drought and tight water restricitions for over a decade. Baillieu just 3 years ago predicted the Thompson dam would become so low in water that it would be unusable. Ironic his first act as premier is closing a water pipeline. I'm sure future generations will be glad we'll have a water source that doesn't depend on hoping and praying for rain.
First day on the job and the Victorian Libs have already closed down the North-South pipeline most likely leaving it to rot.
Thing is if the desal plant is going ahead then the North-South pipeline was never needed. Droughts happen, it's not the first and won't be the last.
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Problem is that these private companies are still using state infrastructure to deliver the services, they are screwed. Crazy to try and land the contracts in the first place IMO as they're on a hiding to nothing.
Selling the assets lock, stock and barrel would be a recipe for political suicide though as it's unpopular.
You're right though Infamy. It is a problem with the railways as the basic infrastructure had been neglected for 80 years and so Connex and now Metro had/have to run new rolling stock and timetables on the equivalent of a 19th-early 20th century railway museum. Under the now previous government at least there was finally movement with the replacement of old wooden sleepers with concrete ones over the entire system (a 3-year project) and other local improvements but it's hardly something sexy you can sell to the public no matter how much a necessary first step it was when the trains still run late. All of this should have been done 50 years ago when the city was smaller and less dense and transport corridors were easy to find without needing to resort to ticking off local residents/voters for the greater long-term good :-\. It doesn't help getting the public onside either when you stuff up and delay the new ticketing system that it's not up and running fully before a crucial election. It's going to take decades to fix the mess after 80 years of neglect and that's if all government on both sides from now on actively support the same plan and work towards bringing the system into the 21st century. You've got to wonder now if the new Metro line to Domain (and then joined to Caulfield) and the regional rail link through Tarneit will be built now. The Libs abandoned their own 1969 transport plan although Mulder (new transport minister) now wants to plan to come up with plans for a Rowville and Doncaster lines even those these plans were developed 40 years ago ???.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/2/21/Mtpmap01.jpg/760px-Mtpmap01.jpg)
I can understand people wanting (faster) change when it comes to our public transport system given the stuff-up with Myki and things like no rail extension yet to Merdna but I don't understand the thinking behind believing the party that caused the system to rot in first place through total inaction over decades in power (Victoria was the Liberal "jewel in crown" during the 20th century) will now suddenly see the light and fix it.
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Thing is if the desal plant is going ahead then the North-South pipeline was never needed. Droughts happen, it's not the first and won't be the last.
How often has Victoria experienced a decade plus long drought before though? The desal plant won't be operational until 2012 at the earliest. Yep the drought breaking rains have finally arrived but hindsight is a wonderful thing. Before this year we just couldn't wait and pray for rain as the dam levels fell below 30% full. No one was predicting the end of the drought 18 months ago. Most of the criticism back then was why hadn't another dam been built since 1983 (Thompson). Based on the current rainfall and rising dam levels you could argue those wanting another dam were wrong as well and even the desal plant itself isn't needed. IIRC the desal plant will only be used when dam levels are below 65% so it won't be used all the time either. In any case the North-South pipeline is built now and even if you believe it was not needed closing it down just confirms the money spent as wasted. Closing it down doesn't reverse time nor get the money back. The pipeline is built so why not be pragmatic about it and make it (more) useful and add pumps to send excess Melbourne water up north where during a drought it is needed in our state's foodbowl. Melbourne will have the desal plant operational by then.
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Thing is if the desal plant is going ahead then the North-South pipeline was never needed. Droughts happen, it's not the first and won't be the last.
How often has Victoria experienced a decade plus long drought before though? The desal plant won't be operational until 2012 at the earliest. Yep the drought breaking rains have finally arrived but hindsight is a wonderful thing. Before this year we just couldn't wait and pray for rain as the dam levels fell below 30% full. No one was predicting the end of the drought 18 months ago. Most of the criticism back then was why hadn't another dam been built since 1983 (Thompson). Based on the current rainfall and rising dam levels you could argue those wanting another dam were wrong as well and even the desal plant itself isn't needed. IIRC the desal plant will only be used when dam levels are below 65% so it won't be used all the time either. In any case the North-South pipeline is built now and even if you believe it was not needed closing it down just confirms the money spent as wasted. Closing it down doesn't reverse time nor get the money back. The pipeline is built so why not be pragmatic about it and make it (more) useful and add pumps to send excess Melbourne water up north where during a drought it is needed in our state's foodbowl. Melbourne will have the desal plant operational by then.
Well said. We were perilously close, but people would rather forget that and stick the boot in. And becuase we have it, we'll probably never be in drought conditions again so they'll continue to say why did we need it, knowing full well it's the plant that made it so.
PS: It's Thomson Dam lol
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Thing is if the desal plant is going ahead then the North-South pipeline was never needed. Droughts happen, it's not the first and won't be the last.
How often has Victoria experienced a decade plus long drought before though? The desal plant won't be operational until 2012 at the earliest. Yep the drought breaking rains have finally arrived but hindsight is a wonderful thing. Before this year we just couldn't wait and pray for rain as the dam levels fell below 30% full. No one was predicting the end of the drought 18 months ago. Most of the criticism back then was why hadn't another dam been built since 1983 (Thompson). Based on the current rainfall and rising dam levels you could argue those wanting another dam were wrong as well and even the desal plant itself isn't needed. IIRC the desal plant will only be used when dam levels are below 65% so it won't be used all the time either. In any case the North-South pipeline is built now and even if you believe it was not needed closing it down just confirms the money spent as wasted. Closing it down doesn't reverse time nor get the money back. The pipeline is built so why not be pragmatic about it and make it (more) useful and add pumps to send excess Melbourne water up north where during a drought it is needed in our state's foodbowl. Melbourne will have the desal plant operational by then.
They aren't tearing the thing up, just shutting it down, its not exactly difficult to start using a pipe again.
The power requirements to keep it running are astronomical and it's just not needed, especially with all this rain. I don't get what the big deal is.
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You dont need hindsight to know that the Mitchell River should be damned. Even in the drought years it was being flooded.
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this state was bankrupted by labor before Kennett came in. Kennett had no choice but he went to far- especially on health and hospitals. If it wasnt for Kennett, Victorians en masse would be lining up at Soup Kitchens today. As for Electricity, Gas and Water prices, it was the role of state government to control the privatised companies as far as increases were concerned. Brumby and Labor failed to control them and that was the end of the penny section.
In a free market it is real competition and the cost efficiencies that result from it that is meant to control prices; not the state. The problem with Victoria's privatisation of utilities and public transport is there was/is no competition. Each company was virtually set up as a monopoly over a specific region of Melbourne/Victoria rather than them going head to head. Take public transport - Connex was given the south-east and Hillside the north-west. How the hell was that creating competition?! No wonder it fell over and Connex took over the whole system. This lack of competition and choice leads to publicly listed companies being answerable first and foremostly to their shareholders at the detriment of their customers. That's why as the public cut back on their usage of say electricity, the companies jacked up these BS service charges so they maintained/increased their profits, share price and dividends to shareholders. Way to encourage the public to not waste our energy resources ::). Like all the banks, all the utility companies are all the same and us consumers/customers are now considered more of a necessary nuisance that can be screwed with little all threat of a backlash as there's bugger all real choice for the customer to take their business elsewhere. Add to this the CEOs and directors are then rewarded with massive payouts linked to the company's shareprice to further encourage these anti-customer practices. Privatisation of basic services was promised to lower prices via gains in efficiency in delivering these services without the need of a bloated state (government) bureaucracy but the complete opposite has happened :scream.
This why the selling off publicly listed utilities is a farce.
The bottom line of any company is profit and shareholders. How anyone could believe that privately owned utilities in largely monopolies, or close to it, could ever provide cheaper/better services is beyond me.
A few years ago during a particularly cold winter in the US they had all sorts of supply troubles with electricity and gas.
The problem was the existing plants were running at near capacity for a few years, yet it was not econimically viable for the companies to invest in building new plants, even though they were needed. Public owned utilities don't have these sort of constraints hanging over them, those that still exist that is.
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i dont like this election result at all, and i vividly remember the way kennett ripped the heart out of my community in the 90s.
However i aint gonna jump up and down and bag bailleu at this stage. they won the election, they need to be given a chance to show us what they can do and govern.
all govt these days is of the centre right, both lib and lab, so it wont be especially different.
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Thing is if the desal plant is going ahead then the North-South pipeline was never needed. Droughts happen, it's not the first and won't be the last.
Sorry infamy but the North South pipeline was running full tilt for the most part of winter! Even through the major flood's in September they were still releasing the alloted amount out of Eildon when The Goulburn river was at major flood level and threating townships down stream!! Labour was doing everything the could to get the water to Melbourne before the election. King Teddy won allot of votes in saying he would shut it down and he has already repaid the faith by doing so.
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You dont need hindsight to know that the Mitchell River should be damned. Even in the drought years it was being flooded.
yes yes yes. A dam wouldve been cheaper than a desal plant.
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Thing is if the desal plant is going ahead then the North-South pipeline was never needed. Droughts happen, it's not the first and won't be the last.
Sorry infamy but the North South pipeline was running full tilt for the most part of winter! Even through the major flood's in September they were still releasing the alloted amount out of Eildon when The Goulburn river was at major flood level and threating townships down stream!! Labour was doing everything the could to get the water to Melbourne before the election. King Teddy won allot of votes in saying he would shut it down and he has already repaid the faith by doing so.
As for it running at full tilt over winter, was this really necessary? It's not like the catchments were empty and certainly no where near as bad as elsewhere in Australia.
As for it running through September, it was actually turned off on September 7th. If you look at the Melbourne Water Storage site you can see the Sugarloaf pipeline allocation. This is water that was allocated to Melbourne storages, but hasn't been sent down the pipeline since it was shut down then. So given the pipeline has been shut down for 3 months now, Ted Baillieu hasn't actually changed anything, he's just said it won't get turned back on. Given there is no need for it with our recent rains, I hardly see how that is a big issue.
As you said, he said he was going to shut it down, all the electorates in the Goulburn River area voted in the Nationals with something like a 70-30 two party preferred result, so he's only doing what the people in those electorates wanted and these are the people that the pipeline affected the most.
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all govt these days is of the centre right, both lib and lab, so it wont be especially different.
I'd say the Labor is still centre left and Liberal centre right. Labor is just a tough one to place as they have factions pushing in both directions.
Given the backlash towards Labor based on their pandering to the Greens and influence from the left side of the party causing most of their problems, I'd expect them to shift towards the centre right to try and get back into power
However if they do this then I'm not sure what they are going to stand for that makes them a point of difference. They have been pretty close to a "Liberal Lite" party since Kevin Rudd took over federally and copied all the Liberal policies. Is moving even more to the right what they really stand for, or what they feel they need to be seen as to win back power?
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Thing is if the desal plant is going ahead then the North-South pipeline was never needed. Droughts happen, it's not the first and won't be the last.
Sorry infamy but the North South pipeline was running full tilt for the most part of winter! Even through the major flood's in September they were still releasing the alloted amount out of Eildon when The Goulburn river was at major flood level and threating townships down stream!! Labour was doing everything the could to get the water to Melbourne before the election. King Teddy won allot of votes in saying he would shut it down and he has already repaid the faith by doing so.
As for it running at full tilt over winter, was this really necessary? It's not like the catchments were empty and certainly no where near as bad as elsewhere in Australia.
As for it running through September, it was actually turned off on September 7th. If you look at the Melbourne Water Storage site you can see the Sugarloaf pipeline allocation. This is water that was allocated to Melbourne storages, but hasn't been sent down the pipeline since it was shut down then. So given the pipeline has been shut down for 3 months now, Ted Baillieu hasn't actually changed anything, he's just said it won't get turned back on. Given there is no need for it with our recent rains, I hardly see how that is a big issue.
As you said, he said he was going to shut it down, all the electorates in the Goulburn River area voted in the Nationals with something like a 70-30 two party preferred result, so he's only doing what the people in those electorates wanted and these are the people that the pipeline affected the most.
Infamy,
It wasn't necessary to be running the pipeline at all and be biggest joke was they were running it while the Goulburn river was in full flood!
On the 7th of September we were about 5 days into the major flooding for the Goulburn there was about 30,000 megaliters of flood water running through Yea and Brumby was still releasing 400 megaliters for the pipeline allocation?? This was just pure greed and a desperate attempt to try and prove the pipeline wasn't a white elephant!
Yes the pipeline was then turned off on the 7th of September but 38 billion liters of water had already been raped from Eildon with a further 37 billione liters set to come down the pipline before the end of the year!
So Ted has actually changed something! By closing down the pipeline he has stoped a further 37 billion litres from being sent down the pipe this year and the 80 billion litre's that was set to come down the pipe in 2011, 2012, 2013 ect, ect................
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all govt these days is of the centre right, both lib and lab, so it wont be especially different.
I'd say the Labor is still centre left and Liberal centre right. Labor is just a tough one to place as they have factions pushing in both directions.
Given the backlash towards Labor based on their pandering to the Greens and influence from the left side of the party causing most of their problems, I'd expect them to shift towards the centre right to try and get back into power
However if they do this then I'm not sure what they are going to stand for that makes them a point of difference. They have been pretty close to a "Liberal Lite" party since Kevin Rudd took over federally and copied all the Liberal policies. Is moving even more to the right what they really stand for, or what they feel they need to be seen as to win back power?
Infamy this is a really interesting debate. It would take some time and hindsight to really work it out. If anything i would argue that the Greens scare labour with some of their more progressive polices, but its all a matter of opinion. The labour lite theme is valid.
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all govt these days is of the centre right, both lib and lab, so it wont be especially different.
I'd say the Labor is still centre left and Liberal centre right. Labor is just a tough one to place as they have factions pushing in both directions.
Given the backlash towards Labor based on their pandering to the Greens and influence from the left side of the party causing most of their problems, I'd expect them to shift towards the centre right to try and get back into power
However if they do this then I'm not sure what they are going to stand for that makes them a point of difference. They have been pretty close to a "Liberal Lite" party since Kevin Rudd took over federally and copied all the Liberal policies. Is moving even more to the right what they really stand for, or what they feel they need to be seen as to win back power?
Infamy this is a really interesting debate. It would take some time and hindsight to really work it out. If anything i would argue that the Greens scare labour with some of their more progressive polices, but its all a matter of opinion. The labour lite theme is valid.
Parties are a spread of the political spectrum and there's a crossover depending on the issue being discussed - Greens are far left to left; Labor are left (socialist left) to centre right (labor right); Libs are centre/centre right (moderates) to right (conservatives); Nationals and Family First are right; One Nation is far right. It is always so black & white. Sometimes you get someone from the Labor right having more in common on an issue with the Liberal moderates than either has with others in their respective parties. Brendon Nelson was a member of young Labor while both parties chased Peter Costello when he was a Uni student like it was an AFL draft. In fact pollies are now often churned out of Uni politics so no wonder they often stand for little except to show off they can win debating comps taking the opposite viewpoint to what they actually believe in ::). This Vic election was hardly a old fashion left vs right battle when you consider Brumby was offering camps for Year 9s and Baillieu full year energy price concessions for concession card holders (more welfare).
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MT, I know what u mean about the spread across the spectrum at any given time, depending on the issue, but i still think it's more complex than that, and even though there is still a left-right continuum, it's mostly huddled around the safe territory of the centre-right.
But it's not that simple. Take an issue like Gay Marriage. I don't think this really fits into what u call a 'far' left position, which i dont think they Greens are anyway.
I dont think an issue like that falls into the old progressive v conservative camps (pun hehehe)
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It's hard to see social conservatives (right-wing) supporting gay marriage. They'll have to be dragged along kicking and screaming as happened with divorce 50 years ago. Eventually these conservatives against it die out or become irrelevant and we move on and the next generation wonders what the big deal was all about.
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It's hard to see social conservatives (right-wing) supporting gay marriage. They'll have to be dragged along kicking and screaming as happened with divorce 50 years ago. Eventually these conservatives against it die out or become irrelevant and we move on and the next generation wonders what the big deal was all about.
True. But a lot of working class left wingers wouldnt support it either.
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I don't think this really fits into what u call a 'far' left position, which i dont think they Greens are anyway.
You may want to re-check what the Greens really stand for
They seem to avoid critisism, but they are a very dangerous party and if they ever get too much power the country is in a LOT of trouble
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I don't think this really fits into what u call a 'far' left position, which i dont think they Greens are anyway.
You may want to re-check what the Greens really stand for
They seem to avoid critisism, but they are a very dangerous party and if they ever get too much power the country is in a LOT of trouble
ok, i shall do some research :)
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hmm a bit of reading to do
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I don't think this really fits into what u call a 'far' left position, which i dont think they Greens are anyway.
You may want to re-check what the Greens really stand for
They seem to avoid critisism, but they are a very dangerous party and if they ever get too much power the country is in a LOT of trouble
Only because we've been brainwashed over the last 30 years to think that Chicago school non-interventionist economic management is the only way. Even after it all went to schit.
Having said that, I wont vote for them because they are making a name for themselves by being a nuisance and I don't think will ever know the meaning of the word compromise.
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i had a quick squiz thru their website, Infamy, and yr certainly right about them being to the left on traditional left wing stuff like health, education and so on.
I havent found anything dangerous tho
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i had a quick squiz thru their website, Infamy, and yr certainly right about them being to the left on traditional left wing stuff like health, education and so on.
I havent found anything dangerous tho
The dangerous stuff is not publically available on their website anymore, they'd never get anywhere if it was, but it's still in their core values.
I'll try and find some more details later when I have a bit of time