Channel Seven to air Ben Cousins documentary - Aug 25-26

[one-eyed]

Cuz will be on Seven News shortly to discuss his doco with with Sandy Roberts

He couldn't see how the doco glamourised drugs given it showed how drugs pushed him to the limits, his family to their limits, and how his life went down.

A positive affect in that it's got people talking about drug addicition. Got families discussing drug addiction.

Sandy said Cuz told him he's an 80% chance of playing on Sunday.


Edit: I forgot to say Ben also said he'll have a couple of beers with the boys on Mad Monday but he won't be leading the charge. He's aware of the warning signs.

[Infamy]

It's refreshing to hear you're views on these issues. Legalising drugs certainly will reduce drug dealing but IMO it wont stop drug taking, which is the national issue. As you said it will never be stopped but it can be dramatically reduced.

You will never stop drug taking, I don't know how I can make this point any clearer. All prohibition has done is make smugglers billions of dollars every year. 2004-5 figures estimated that Australians spend $7 billion on drugs in one year and we are a small country of only 20 million people. The world drug trade is over $400 billion per year and an estimated 1% of the entire world GDP. This is despite the war on drugs and the billions spent in the war on drugs, Australia spend almost $4 billion, the US spends over $20 billion each year alone. This is all money that could be getting spend on health, education and infrastructure rather than stopping 1% of smuggled drugs from getting into a country and telling kids to just say no.

If I can use smoking as an example. I don;t have facts but it's common knowledge that the % of smokers has declined consistently over time. Education anti smoking campaigns and "prohibition" are the reasons. A higher rate of non-smoking areas haven't stopped smoking but have made it less convenient. Anti Smoking campaigns have had a bigger impact.

Drug taking is the issue, the same as smoking was about 20 years ago. The anti-smoking education program you'll find has been successful over time in educating the use of cigarettes kills (Smoking Kills). If I can use your facts that more people use drugs than cigarettes ("The fact that there are 60-90% more adult drug users than smokers in Australia"). This suggests that the education anti smoking programs have been a success. As I don't have facts I think everyone can agree that this has been successful in reducing the amount of smokers in Australia.

You can't use smoking as an example, it's a legal product, there is no prohibition of smoking because I can just walk down to a milk bar, servo or 7-11 and buy it. The only restrictions are on WHERE you can smoke, that is not prohibition. The fact that smoking is legal is why we can deal with it's health issues properly, because people know it's bad for you, people know it kills you and people are not ashamed to admit they smoke and want to quit. These facts are not always true with all drugs, sure some are dangerous, but some are only dangerous because they are getting made by backyard chemists with who knows what going into it.

Recreational drugs are the same as Alcohol consumption or smoking cigarettes. Alcohol and Cigarettes are legalised but we still have problems with drink driving, alcohol abuse, lung cancer etc.

So? People are taking drugs anyway, we already know the health issues, so what's your point?

So I don't think you can say legalising drugs like ecstacy, cocaine and ice (for examples) will stop youths and experimenters from taking drugs to enhance there "party" experience at a club, event or party. Drugs will still be able to be purchased at clubs for $5, cheaper than alcohol and without the weight gain and hangover in the morning.

I never said legalising drugs will stop youths from taking them, it won't, that's not the point. As I said before, you CAN'T STOP PEOPLE TAKING DRUGS. Also it won't be a pill for $5 that would just be stupid, prices should come down, but simply to world average prices and the bulk of it would be tax, just like alcohol and tobacco.

Just like smoking the more education there is out there on drug taking with time generations will be wiser on how dangerous it is.

Maybe it's naive but I think following the smoking model is the best way to approach drug use.

Yes, you are spot on, have it as a legal substance so the education can be about the risks and harm minimisation strategies rather than just the scare tactics that exist now. Your comparison to tobacco as a reason to keep drugs illegal are ridiculous, there is no comparison, but you are correct in that it should be the model on how all drugs are treated.

I re-read you post, we're having an discussion on ways to stop drug addiction and abuse. "None of it matters" well it does matter when a high percentage of people are dieing from drug abuse.

What is a high percentage? I'm sorry but I couldn't disagree with you more, that is just wrong.
As I've already pointed out, less people die from drugs than both tobacco and alcohol. This is even with more people using drugs than taking tobacco. Again as I've already pointed out, no one has ever died from smoking marijuana, it is almost impossible to die from MDMA use.
Most heroin overdoses are from impurities and fluctuating strength due to it being an unregulated substance. There is no coincidence that when the strength of street heroin goes up, so does the amount of overdoses.

Edit - I can only find US annual death figures but they are as follows.
Tobacco - 390,000 deaths per year
Alcohol - 80,000 deaths per year
Passive smoking - 50,000 deaths per year
Cocaine - 2,200 deaths per year
Heroin - 2,000 deaths per year
Asprin - 2,000 deaths per year
Marijuana - 0 (never been 1)
All drugs combined - 4,500 deaths per year (or under 1% of those killed by tobacco and alcohol combined)

In fact tobacco kills more people in the US each year than all the illegal drugs combined have killed in the last century

Source - National Institute on Drug Abuse + other Federal government sources

[Owl]

I saw on the news that insufferable pole smoker, Eddy had to try and get his turgid head in on the act somehow and volunteered his 'role' in the Cousins saga .... wanker.  'Oh we didn't want him coz he had a bad attitude and I rang Christine Nixon because I'm so arrogant I feel that the Chief of Victorian law enforcement should collect intelligence on private citizens for the Collingwood football club despite the fact they were actually living in Western Australia.' Or words to that effect.

[Infamy]

we let them run around the city taking drugs smashing up people and in return they get slap on the wrist.

I hate to break it to you, but the violence in the city is fueled by alcohol, not recreational drugs. The police off record will always admit that they'd rather deal with a crowd fueled by drugs than alcohol. There was even a case many years ago of a police officer in QLD saying publically regarding the concern of violence in the big crowds at schoolies week that when they were on drugs they weren't interested in getting in a fight and they were pretty easy to control. He was forced to apologise the next day as it sent an "irresponsable message"

Straight to jail for anyone caught with drugs at these big rave parties or on the streets. Simple yet effetive method and soon enough you will see no dealers cause you know why no demand for it. In jail they can get councelling on how to beat the habit.

You say I'm out of my depth on this topic? Unbelievable!
Life imprisonment and the death penalty is working for them so well in Asia isn't it. Most of the heroin and ice in this country comes from Asia. They have just as many drug problems there than we do, so clearly that method doesn't work. It is estimated that 1/3rd of all ampetamine type stimulants are manufactured in asia and there are almost 4 million drug injecting users in eastern Europe and Asia which makes up a quarter of all of those in the world. Not to mention the HIV epidemic that is going along with it.

Decriminalisation of drugs sends users to drug treatment programs INSTEAD of jail. There is no proper treatment in jail, just a good way to meet more drug users and dealers... and hardened criminals who are put away for real crimes like killing people. There is a constant cycle of people who go to jail simply getting released and going straight back to their old habits, because they didn't get proper treatment and now they have a criminal record so have more trouble getting a job. Great method of treatment that one.

[one-eyed]

Eddie McGuire reveals call to Christine Nixon about Ben Cousins

    * Michelle Ainsworth, Nathan Mawby
    * From: Herald Sun
    * August 27, 2010 UPDATE 4.16pm:

EDDIE McGuire has defended Collingwood's decision not to recruit Ben Cousins in late 2008, saying the player's attitude at the time was "absolutely appalling".

His blast comes as Ben Cousins is finally expected to speak to Channel 7 tonight about a documentary screened on the network this week which has charted his brazen drug-taking.

The furore around the documentary has so far delivered Channel 7 top ratings, and the attention is also expected to help draw a large crowd to Cousins' final match for Richmond against Port Power this Sunday.

McGuire revealed today that while he did speak to then-Chief Commissioner Christine Nixon at the time, he didn't receive specific advice from her about hiring Cousins.

Speaking on his Triple M Hot Breakfast radio show this morning, McGuire said he rang Ms Nixon to find out what Victoria Police's feelings were on the issue.

"I can now reveal - because the documentary’s out - that at no stage did Christine Nixon as the Police Commissioner of Victoria advise me one way or the other or divulge any information in regards to the activities of Ben Cousins,” McGuire said.

"I wanted to speak to somebody who I could rely on to give me an unbiased picture of what happens in this situation. She was very, very careful.”

McGuire denied hiring a private investigator to gather information on Cousins.

"What we wanted was an independent person to help collect and put together all the information," he said.

McGuire said Cousins was asking for a lot of money and that the intense media attention on Cousins and his hamstring - which he went on to tear in his first game with Richmond - were factors in Collingwood’s decision not to hire him.

"At no stage did Ben actually ring me to say 'look I really want to come to this club'," McGuire said.

"At that stage it was we’re all auditioning for Ben and his attitude was absolutely appalling. It was not about us at all, it was about us being a vehicle for Ben."

McGuire said they decided the negatives outweighed the positives.

"Put it this way, the West Coast Eagles couldn’t get Ben out quick enough in the end. Why would we want to drag him in?" McGuire said.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/ben-cousins-father-bryan-feared-his-sons-life-would-be-lost-to-drugs/story-e6frf9jf-1225910633779

[Infamy]

Also daniel, considering I've taken you to school on this topic and proved you completely wrong with plenty of evidence, let me enlighten you on a method that is proven to work. I asked you explain how Portugal's rate of drug use dropped after they decriminalised recreational drugs and you conveniently ignored the question, so let me show you how wrong you are.

In 2000 Portugal had some of the highest rates of hard drug use in Europe
In 2001 Portugal decriminalised the manufacture and possession of recreational drugs for personal use

Since this change was made
- Drug use by teenagers has reduced
- Street overdoses have dropped almost 30% from 400 per year to 290
- HIV infections from injectable drugs dropped from 1400 per year to 400
- Deaths from heroin and similar drugs has dropped by more than half.
- The lowest lifetime use of marijuana by people over 15 years old in the entire EU at 10% (in comparison this figure in the US is almost 40%)
- Proportionally, more people in the US have used cocaine than those in Portugal have used marijuana
- Rates of lifetime use of any illegal drug among seventh through ninth graders fell from 14.1% to 10.6%
- Lifetime heroin use among 16-to-18-year-olds fell from 2.5% to 1.8%
- Portugal did NOT become a destination for drug tourists as believed by the conservatives and critics, this is despite a more lenient drug policy than Holland
- Rates of drug use in all other EU countries went UP!!

Regarding treatment, the number of people in Portual on methadone and buprenorphine treatment for drug addiction rose to 14,877 from 6,040 and money saved on enforcement allowed for increased funding of drug-free treatment as well.

In comparison, the US which has a zero tolerance attitude to drugs
- Has the highest rate of use of cocaine & marijuana in the entire world
- Has only 5% of the global population, but 25% of the global prisoners


Out of my depth am I?

[one-eyed]

AFL says re-registering Cousins was key to his recovery from addiction

    * Kate Salemme
    * From: Herald Sun
    * August 27, 2010 4:21PM

AFL boss Andrew Demetriou this morning defended the league's decision to re-register Ben Cousins in 2008, despite revelations last night that he was still taking illicit substances.

Demetriou said the AFL had been handed "very strong advice" that Cousins needed to play football again to have any chance of recovery.

“When we had the hearing, we had substantial information before us, from medical experts, from his counsellors, from the urine samplers,” Demetriou said.

“We were advised about the fact that he had gone to the test shaved down and we had to weigh up all those things on balance, and when we handed down our finding to actually re-register him as a player we had very stringent conditions attached to it, which we took into account.”

Post-season celebrations: Cousins family's Mad Monday fears

He dismissed claims that by shaving his head, Cousins had breached the AFL’s drug rules.

“He actually wasn’t a player at the time, he was de-registered but we wanted to take all of this into account when we sat down for the commission hearing,” he said.

“We weren’t pleased about it and we made that very, very clear but we also had very strong advice that in order for Ben to actually aid his recovery and his rehabilitation it was now very important for him to play football again.”

Demetriou said that re-registering Cousins was paramount to his ability to recover from his addiction.

“We had this advice that said it was very important for him to get back into football as part of his rehabilitation and recovery that we then also insisted that he submit himself for three tests a week,” he said.

“We also had some significant medical advice before us that said that addicts were prone to relapse and that addicts were going to go through phases as part of their recovery.”

“You’re not going to get an addict that’s going to stay clean for 12 months, they are prone to relapse and that may be part of their recovery,” he said.

The AFL boss applauded Cousins’ ability to turn himself around.

“He’s been in the game for two years, he’s been tested three to four times a week and he’s been very, very good," he said.

"Again, on balance with all the information we had before us, it was the correct decision."

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/afl-says-re-registering-cousins-was-key-to-his-recovery-from-addiction/story-e6frf9jf-1225910891146

[one-eyed]

My Mad Monday wild days are over: Ben Cousins

    * Julie Tullberg
    * From: Herald Sun
    * August 27, 2010 6:56PM

BEN Cousins says the days of him "leading the pack" on Mad Monday are over, as the Richmond star prepares for his farewell game against Port Adelaide on Sunday.

Speaking after his controversial documentary, aired on Channel 7 last night, Cousins said he would restrict his Mad Monday celebrations to just a couple of beers with the boys.

“Some of my best work was done on Mad Mondays,” Cousins joked with Channel 7 reporter Sandy Roberts.

“Yeah, it's a shame. (Mad Monday) it’s a thing of the past for me.

“I'm sure I'll sneak in the opportunity to have a couple of beers in the boys but the days are gone of me leading the pack.”

Cousins, who revealed his painful fight with drug addiction in the doco, Such Is Life - The Ben Cousins story, said the shame and regret of his drug addiction was something he would have to learn to live with.

“It's a cross I have to bear and that’s I guess that's a big part of overcoming addiction, learning to cope with the shame and regret,” Cousins said.

In the graphic doco, which showed the Brownlow medallist twitching and staring blankly after the effects of drugs, Cousins’s father, Bryan, spoke of a time when Cousins said he wanted to die.

But Cousins denied he ever felt like taking his life.

“I'm not a person with suicidal tendencies,” Cousins told Channel 7.

“I do remember the incident that me and my old man had and it was a moment of despair and I think I used the term out of frustration.

“It's unfortunate but I'm a pretty buoyant person by nature but that's not to say I've been in some pretty dark places and yeah, it's been tough.”

Cousins said he was in the best shape, in terms of inner peace, that he had been for a long time.

“Yeah, it (inner peace) has been something I've grappled with in the past,” he said.

“It's obviously not a destination but like you say I think I'm heading towards it and I'd say that I'm probably in a good place as I've been for a long time.”

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/my-mad-monday-wild-days-are-over-ben-cousins/story-e6frf9jf-1225911051655

[TigerLand]

It's refreshing to hear you're views on these issues. Legalising drugs certainly will reduce drug dealing but IMO it wont stop drug taking, which is the national issue. As you said it will never be stopped but it can be dramatically reduced.

You will never stop drug taking, I don't know how I can make this point any clearer. All prohibition has done is make smugglers billions of dollars every year. 2004-5 figures estimated that Australians spend $7 billion on drugs in one year and we are a small country of only 20 million people. The world drug trade is over $400 billion per year and an estimated 1% of the entire world GDP. This is despite the war on drugs and the billions spent in the war on drugs, Australia spend almost $4 billion, the US spends over $20 billion each year alone. This is all money that could be getting spend on health, education and infrastructure rather than stopping 1% of smuggled drugs from getting into a country and telling kids to just say no.

If I can use smoking as an example. I don;t have facts but it's common knowledge that the % of smokers has declined consistently over time. Education anti smoking campaigns and "prohibition" are the reasons. A higher rate of non-smoking areas haven't stopped smoking but have made it less convenient. Anti Smoking campaigns have had a bigger impact.

Drug taking is the issue, the same as smoking was about 20 years ago. The anti-smoking education program you'll find has been successful over time in educating the use of cigarettes kills (Smoking Kills). If I can use your facts that more people use drugs than cigarettes ("The fact that there are 60-90% more adult drug users than smokers in Australia"). This suggests that the education anti smoking programs have been a success. As I don't have facts I think everyone can agree that this has been successful in reducing the amount of smokers in Australia.

You can't use smoking as an example, it's a legal product, there is no prohibition of smoking because I can just walk down to a milk bar, servo or 7-11 and buy it. The only restrictions are on WHERE you can smoke, that is not prohibition. The fact that smoking is legal is why we can deal with it's health issues properly, because people know it's bad for you, people know it kills you and people are not ashamed to admit they smoke and want to quit. These facts are not always true with all drugs, sure some are dangerous, but some are only dangerous because they are getting made by backyard chemists with who knows what going into it.

Recreational drugs are the same as Alcohol consumption or smoking cigarettes. Alcohol and Cigarettes are legalised but we still have problems with drink driving, alcohol abuse, lung cancer etc.

So? People are taking drugs anyway, we already know the health issues, so what's your point?

So I don't think you can say legalising drugs like ecstacy, cocaine and ice (for examples) will stop youths and experimenters from taking drugs to enhance there "party" experience at a club, event or party. Drugs will still be able to be purchased at clubs for $5, cheaper than alcohol and without the weight gain and hangover in the morning.

I never said legalising drugs will stop youths from taking them, it won't, that's not the point. As I said before, you CAN'T STOP PEOPLE TAKING DRUGS. Also it won't be a pill for $5 that would just be stupid, prices should come down, but simply to world average prices and the bulk of it would be tax, just like alcohol and tobacco.

Just like smoking the more education there is out there on drug taking with time generations will be wiser on how dangerous it is.

Maybe it's naive but I think following the smoking model is the best way to approach drug use.

Yes, you are spot on, have it as a legal substance so the education can be about the risks and harm minimisation strategies rather than just the scare tactics that exist now. Your comparison to tobacco as a reason to keep drugs illegal are ridiculous, there is no comparison, but you are correct in that it should be the model on how all drugs are treated.

I re-read you post, we're having an discussion on ways to stop drug addiction and abuse. "None of it matters" well it does matter when a high percentage of people are dieing from drug abuse.

What is a high percentage? I'm sorry but I couldn't disagree with you more, that is just wrong.
As I've already pointed out, less people die from drugs than both tobacco and alcohol. This is even with more people using drugs than taking tobacco. Again as I've already pointed out, no one has ever died from smoking marijuana, it is almost impossible to die from MDMA use.
Most heroin overdoses are from impurities and fluctuating strength due to it being an unregulated substance. There is no coincidence that when the strength of street heroin goes up, so does the amount of overdoses.

Edit - I can only find US annual death figures but they are as follows.
Tobacco - 390,000 deaths per year
Alcohol - 80,000 deaths per year
Passive smoking - 50,000 deaths per year
Cocaine - 2,200 deaths per year
Heroin - 2,000 deaths per year
Asprin - 2,000 deaths per year
Marijuana - 0 (never been 1)
All drugs combined - 4,500 deaths per year (or under 1% of those killed by tobacco and alcohol combined)

In fact tobacco kills more people in the US each year than all the illegal drugs combined have killed in the last century

Source - National Institute on Drug Abuse + other Federal government sources

You've missed my point, maybe my post was poorly worded. I don't think I ever claimed that drugs can be eradicated from society by any means. My point is, regardless if recreation drugs are legal or not, drug intake and use will forever be abused. As is alcohol consumption and smoking. We all think we have a notehr beer in us, drug users think the same way, "Yeah I could go 1 more hit I'm not as high as I wanna be"..

Drugs, if legalised will still cause the same problems as high consumption can and will be taken, just the same way smoking and alcohol, you can't disagree with that. Legalising ecstasy will only change the supplier of the problem, the problem is the intake of drugs. It's not as simple as alcohol where if you drink to much you have a hang over, you take 1 too many pills or lines you're dead. This isn't a lesson you can't learn and try again.

As for my "high percentage" reference it wasn't in comparison with other drugs or substances. In no way was I suggesting more people die via drugs than smoking. To be more clearer: A high percentage of drug takers experience an eventual overdose of some kind, compared to those who take drugs somehow responsibly and never overdose.

You're correct that overdoses occur from poorly created drugs. Legalising will reduce overdoses from cheap drugs filled with glass or washing powder etc, as dealers/producers wont have the market to create for big profits. This wont stop dealers from home brewing though. It will just reduce the profit by a margin, a percentage of dealing will reduce dramatically. You could also ask producers may make even high percentage of fake drugs with 90% washing poweder and 10% drug instead of 50-50.

Legalising wont stop the problem, legal substances in tobacco and alcohol have enormous death numbers, they are legal substances as they are easily accessible and easily abused. Kids as young as 10 years old can get a cheap pair of cigarettes and have a fag behind teh school shed. Gd forbid some year 7 or 8 kid gets his hands on a packet of cocaine tablets stolen from a local chemist.

To conclude legalising recreational drugs doesn't solve drug abuse, it can solve dealing and cheap creation issues.

[gerkin greg]

yeah cause one more drink has never killed anyone 

[TigerLand]

Also daniel, considering I've taken you to school on this topic and proved you completely wrong with plenty of evidence, let me enlighten you on a method that is proven to work. I asked you explain how Portugal's rate of drug use dropped after they decriminalised recreational drugs and you conveniently ignored the question, so let me show you how wrong you are.

In 2000 Portugal had some of the highest rates of hard drug use in Europe
In 2001 Portugal decriminalised the manufacture and possession of recreational drugs for personal use

Since this change was made
- Drug use by teenagers has reduced
- Street overdoses have dropped almost 30% from 400 per year to 290
- HIV infections from injectable drugs dropped from 1400 per year to 400
- Deaths from heroin and similar drugs has dropped by more than half.
- The lowest lifetime use of marijuana by people over 15 years old in the entire EU at 10% (in comparison this figure in the US is almost 40%)
- Proportionally, more people in the US have used cocaine than those in Portugal have used marijuana
- Rates of lifetime use of any illegal drug among seventh through ninth graders fell from 14.1% to 10.6%
- Lifetime heroin use among 16-to-18-year-olds fell from 2.5% to 1.8%
- Portugal did NOT become a destination for drug tourists as believed by the conservatives and critics, this is despite a more lenient drug policy than Holland
- Rates of drug use in all other EU countries went UP!!

Regarding treatment, the number of people in Portual on methadone and buprenorphine treatment for drug addiction rose to 14,877 from 6,040 and money saved on enforcement allowed for increased funding of drug-free treatment as well.

In comparison, the US which has a zero tolerance attitude to drugs
- Has the highest rate of use of cocaine & marijuana in the entire world
- Has only 5% of the global population, but 25% of the global prisoners


Out of my depth am I?

Its hard to argue against those figures, it certainly has its positives, however it doesn't address the issue of substance abuse.

[Infamy]

You've missed my point, maybe my post was poorly worded. I don't think I ever claimed that drugs can be eradicated from society by any means. My point is, regardless if recreation drugs are legal or not, drug intake and use will forever be abused. As is alcohol consumption and smoking. We all think we have a notehr beer in us, drug users think the same way, "Yeah I could go 1 more hit I'm not as high as I wanna be"..

Drugs, if legalised will still cause the same problems as high consumption can and will be taken, just the same way smoking and alcohol, you can't disagree with that. Legalising ecstasy will only change the supplier of the problem, the problem is the intake of drugs. It's not as simple as alcohol where if you drink to much you have a hang over, you take 1 too many pills or lines you're dead. This isn't a lesson you can't learn and try again.

Ummm I hate to break it to you, but this is happening already. The fact they are illegal doesn't stop people doing what you say here, it's called an overdose. Saying you take 1 to many pills and you're dead is absolute garbage though, I've already told you its almost impossible to overdose on MDMA and drug experts will agree as on a  harm/addiction scale of 1-100, alcohol is 80 and MDMA is 20. Cocaine is similar, it has a higher harm/addiction level similar to alcohol, you need to put about 3g of 100% pure cocaine up your nose before you OD, your nose will close up before that happens. It's the cheap alternatives like GHB which are easy to overdose on, a substance people have turned to due to the price and low quality of regular illegal party drugs. GHB is the substance that makes up 90-100% of the overdoses at the big dance parties you hear about in the news.

What happened when they made GHB illegal in the UK? People started taking GBL instead, sold as alloy wheel cleaner on the internet at 30 quid for 125ml, this stuff metabolises into GHB in your body, but it is far more potent and at far greater risk of overdosing than GHB. This is the same reason that Mephedrone came to market and kids at raves are eating plant fertilizer advertised as Speed Rush. Drug experts lobbied against the banning of GBL because they knew all it would do is get drug users taking something else that was even more dangerous, they still banned it though.

As for my "high percentage" reference it wasn't in comparison with other drugs or substances. In no way was I suggesting more people die via drugs than smoking. To be more clearer: A high percentage of drug takers experience an eventual overdose of some kind, compared to those who take drugs somehow responsibly and never overdose.

That is just completely wrong, there is no basis for that comment at all. The vast majority of drug users, let's say 99%, NEVER overdose. That's why the current education system doesn't work. Kids know the scare tactics are bullsh!t because they see their mates go out each weekend, drop a few pills, rack a few lines and generally have a great night. This is the whole point of harm minimisation, we know kids are going to try it if they want to, it's often easier for kids to get drugs than alcohol, so let's teach them the dangers of each drug so that if they choose to try it, they know how to avoid putting themself in hospital.

You're correct that overdoses occur from poorly created drugs. Legalising will reduce overdoses from cheap drugs filled with glass or washing powder etc, as dealers/producers wont have the market to create for big profits. This wont stop dealers from home brewing though. It will just reduce the profit by a margin, a percentage of dealing will reduce dramatically. You could also ask producers may make even high percentage of fake drugs with 90% washing poweder and 10% drug instead of 50-50.

Only if the prices remain at black market levels. If it's legally available for a better price at a known quality you will kill the black market. What's the point of trying to import drugs outside the system if the buyers can get better from legal sources? Why take the risk? I don't see black market cigarettes and alcohol making a big impact in the market.

Legalising wont stop the problem

Of course it won't, you can't stop the problem. Don't you get it? The current system is worse though as people get crap drugs made in back yards and then hide their habit as its illegal and don't seek assistance. I don't know how I can spell this out any clearer, do you need me to paint you a picture? At the moment if you have a group of kids taking drugs and someone gets into trouble, they will often be too scared to get medical help because what they are doing is illegal. Medicos don't give a crap, they just want to know what you've taken so they know how to treat you, but because people are scared of legal repercussions they will try and get their friend to just sleep it off or will dump them at the hospital and run. This is the environment we've created for drug users and people are dying because of it.

legal substances in tobacco and alcohol have enormous death numbers, they are legal substances as they are easily accessible and easily abused. Kids as young as 10 years old can get a cheap pair of cigarettes and have a limp behind teh school shed. Gd forbid some year 7 or 8 kid gets his hands on a packet of cocaine tablets stolen from a local chemist.

Hate to break it to you, but they already do get their hands on drugs. It's often easier for kids to get drugs than alcohol. Look at the figures I showed from Portugal, 10-14% of SEVENTH TO NINTH GRADERS are on drugs. Don't be naive to think that it's any different in Australia.

To conclude legalising recreational drugs doesn't solve drug abuse, it can solve dealing and cheap creation issues.

It doesn't solve it, but I don't see the current system working and I don't see you providing any alternatives.

Its hard to argue against those figures, it certainly has its positives, however it doesn't address the issue of substance abuse.

YES IT DOES!!! It gets people who take drugs and puts them in treatment programs to try and get them to stop. That is called dealing with the issue of substance abuse.
It's no magic wand to stop all drug taking, but if you think that exists then you must live in some other parallel dimesion that I don't know about. If you have any solutions you think will work then I'm all ears and so is the rest of the world as no one else knows how to do it.

[one-eyed]

AFL offers Cousins drug tests
Jon Pierik
August 28, 2010
 

THE AFL has offered to help Ben Cousins by drug testing him in retirement although the man himself last night revealed he had almost discovered inner peace.

As debate over Cousins' documentary Such is Life raged yesterday, AFL chief executive Andrew Demetriou revealed he had approached the AFL Players Association and Richmond asking how the league could help Cousins adjust to life without the structure and safety net that football has provided.

''We have spoken to the players association. We have had a chat with [Tigers chief executive] Brendon Gale, and am looking forward to having a chat with Ben,'' Demetriou said.

''If there is any way the AFL can help Ben to continue his recovery, we would.''

Cousins, who has admitted he will be a drug addict for life, is tested up to four times a week as part of the terms which allowed him to return to football last year.

But those conditions could end as early as tomorrow when, provided his dodgy hamstring negotiates training at Punt Road this morning, he will retire after the clash against Port Adelaide at Etihad Stadium.

''The policy isn't just about when you are playing football. If you are someone who has an addiction or has had an illicit drug problem, we think it's incumbent on us as a code to make sure that if you leave the system we continue to offer support,'' Demetriou said.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/afl-offers-cousins-drug-tests-20100827-13w0o.html

[one-eyed]

Caro wrote an article today in the Age on the Eagles and the damage done (ie. with their culture) relating to Cousins.

In it she still pushing 6 months later that Cousins was warned by Richmond about heavy drinking even though she's the only one who is saying it  .

"The AFL is determined that the Ben Cousins story will paint the league in a good light after so tarnishing its image in those dark days of 2007. When The Age correctly reported in February that Richmond had warned Cousins about his sometimes heavy drinking the Tigers, having confirmed the story, promptly issued a denial - one they later explained to me was in part to placate the AFL."

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/the-eagles-and-the-damage-done-20100827-13w0q.html

[one-eyed]

Ben Cousins documentary critics expose their ignorance

  * Mike Sheahan
  * Herald Sun
  * August 27, 2010 11:07PM

WHAT an amazing coincidence.

Why is that so many of the people who have applauded Ben Cousins and his father Bryan in the past couple of days all seem to have had first-hand experience of drug addiction?
Extraordinary, really.

It's confusing. The "experts", those wise old heads with microphones and newspaper columns at their disposal on a daily basis, say it's all a nonsense. It's a spoiled brat showing off.

Surely THEY know, because they know EVERYTHING.

Yet people caught up in the drug spiral, those working with and on behalf of those caught up in the drug spiral, keep telling me the Cousins - father and son - are their new heroes, their inspiration.

That's not to suggest for one minute Ben is cured. Simply, he is battling a terrible addiction, and apparently going OK.

I just can't work this one out. He simply offered his story. I didn't see any wild promises. What I do know is that an ongoing problem of any sort is much more likely to be solved by discussion.

Which is why it is so disappointing to hear people who should know better slamming the documentary.

OK, let's not worry about the message. Let's bake him for being "smug", for being a narcissist, for daring to thumb his nose at the system.

That's it. Let's have a public humiliation in Fed Square. That will make us all feel better that naughty Ben will do his penance. Can't have handsome boys from middle-class families who refuse to cry doing drugs, can we.

Let's not worry about the problem. Or the cure.

If awareness of drug addiction, and how it is best handled and treated, hasn't been heightened by the Cousins documentary, then the MCG is in Sydney.

Here's the issue. Those who know the subject best, either personally or professionally, all share the same view - good on Ben, good on his family for laying itself open for two million people to see.

As for glamourising the use of illicit drugs, spare me. If you are of that view, did you see Cousins twitching uncontrollably under the influence of illicit substances?

Did you see him shamed and humiliated in public in Perth?

Do you remember him as the most famous name in West Australian sport being stripped of the captaincy of his football club, then sacked, then deregistered by the AFL?

Did you see him helping carry the coffin of his friend and fellow drug victim, Chris Mainwaring?

Did you listen to the 911 call in the US, when he had to be rushed to hospital by ambulance? Did you see him almost break the spirit of his parents, Stephanie and Bryan, and sister, Melanie?

Glamour, eh?

An old colleague of mine messaged me yesterday with a passionate explanation of how his high-achieving 23-year-old son fell victim to drugs. In Perth. Here's how he finished his letter.

"I know that seeing the Ben Cousins story will help. Seeing Bryan Cousins talk about it has helped me. For whatever part you played in getting this to air (nil), thank you."

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/ben-cousins-documentary-critics-expose-their-ignorance/story-e6frf9ox-1225911106501