Author Topic: Stopping the boats  (Read 78273 times)

Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #210 on: September 19, 2013, 09:17:40 AM »
Who gives 2 fat flying f***s about what Indonesia thinks of the policy of our government that has just been elected with a mandate (in part) to stop the boats?  It's our f***ing country, our f***ing borders, our f***ing national security and we'll run it our f***ing way, not kowtow to what ever other countries say we should do (and I include the US, Great Britain, France, New Zealand and all the others in that too).  And maybe the Indonesians should wait until they hear from the government itself in formal talks what the actual policy is instead of relying on media reports and speculation.   :wallywink

And here's one for the 'concerned' Indonesians - provide the asylum yourself and stop the drownings at your own border if the notion of us not accepting the illegal immigrants offends you so deeply.   :banghead :banghead

Don't think I would want to be your neighbour.

Or is that different and you try to get along with your neighbours?

 :cheers

 :huh :huh

"Oh yes I am a dreamer, I still see us flying high!"

from the song "Don't Walk Away" by Pat Benatar 1988 (Wide Awake In Dreamland)

Offline Smokey

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #211 on: September 19, 2013, 09:26:19 AM »
I consider myself to be a good neighbour '65 - I don't tell my neighbours how to live their life, I respect their proximity to mine in my lifestyle choices, and I ask nothing but the same courtesy in return.  And if they were deliberately opening their gates or fences and assisting any form of human or animal traffic through to my block without talking to me first, I would take it up with them initially but then reserve the right to resolve it myself in my way if they didn't want to co-operate.  Sound familiar?   :cheers

Offline 1965

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #212 on: September 19, 2013, 10:01:20 AM »
I consider myself to be a good neighbour '65 - I don't tell my neighbours how to live their life, I respect their proximity to mine in my lifestyle choices, and I ask nothing but the same courtesy in return.  And if they were deliberately opening their gates or fences and assisting any form of human or animal traffic through to my block without talking to me first, I would take it up with them initially but then reserve the right to resolve it myself in my way if they didn't want to co-operate.  Sound familiar?   :cheers

Would it worth starting a conflict over?
Yeah we're already going to vote for him mate, you don't need to keep selling it.....

Offline Smokey

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #213 on: September 19, 2013, 10:42:34 AM »
I take it then, you would roll over and let them keep invading your land - potentially risking your family, your space, your privacy?

And the answer is yes, I will protect and defend my family on my land to the death if necessary so if conflict is the final outcome then conflict it is. 

Offline 1965

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #214 on: September 19, 2013, 10:52:51 AM »
I take it then, you would roll over and let them keep invading your land - potentially risking your family, your space, your privacy?

And the answer is yes, I will protect and defend my family on my land to the death if necessary so if conflict is the final outcome then conflict it is.

No you misunderstand.

Wouldn't a little tact and diplomacy be worth it if it avoids the conflict?

 :cheers
Yeah we're already going to vote for him mate, you don't need to keep selling it.....

Offline Smokey

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #215 on: September 19, 2013, 10:59:27 AM »
Then you didn't read my original reply very well:

"without talking to me first, I would take it up with them initially but then reserve the right to resolve it myself in my way if they didn't want to co-operate"

 :thumbsup

Offline Smokey

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #216 on: September 19, 2013, 11:06:13 AM »

No rambling just an article from the Age about Indonesia's reaction to our new border protection policies.


Tony Abbott's asylum seeker policies 'offensive', says senior Indonesian politician
Date September 19, 2013
 Michael Bachelard
Michael Bachelard

Another senior Indonesian politician has described Tony Abbott’s asylum seeker policies as “very offensive” and an attack on his country’s sovereignty, adding that if they were not changed they would damage the bilateral relationship.

The comment by parliamentarian Tantowi Yahya is the latest in a series of slights to one of the Prime Minister’s signature policies, and Fairfax Media has confirmed antipathy to it exists across Indonesia’s political spectrum.

..............

Mr Tantowi is a member of the Indonesian parliament’s “Commission I”, responsible for foreign affairs. He told the ABC’s Lateline program on Wednesday that there were no circumstances under which Indonesia would accept Mr Abbott’s boat tow-back policy.

“No, we don't agree with that. This is, I can say, something like a consensus between the Government and the parliament not to agree with the plan which is now being projected by the new Prime Minister, Mr Tony Abbott,” Mr Tantowi said.

The policy “annoys our sovereignty as an independent country.”

“I think the policy will be very offensive and we in the parliaments fully support what was said by our foreign ministers, that we will fully reject the policy,” Mr Tantowi said.

Mr Tantowi is a member of the Golkar Party, and in Mr Yudhoyono's governing coalition.


Interesting how differently the ABC (same media) portrayed Mr Tantowi when he criticised Gillard last year:

TONY EASTLEY: In Jakarta's political circles, the case of 'Captain Emad' is seen as evidence that Australia isn't serious about cracking down on the principals of people smuggling.

While Indonesian prosecutors have jailed the smuggler accused of sending a boat that disappeared in late 2010, they are struggling to keep him behind bars, as Indonesia correspondent Matt Brown reports from Jakarta.

MATT BROWN: When Indonesian politicians talk about people smuggling, their first words are always for the young Indonesians who've been held in Australian jails for crewing the boats, so allegations that Australia has given a refugee protection visa to a smuggler like Captain Emad won't go down well.

A member of the parliamentary committee on Foreign Affairs, Tantowi Yahya, is just one hoping for an explanation.

TANTOWI YAHYA: What we can do in a very short moment is discuss about this with your Australian ambassador here in Jakarta. So we'd like to express our disappointment and we'd like to hear more about it.

MATT BROWN: Tantowi Yahya is a former host of Indonesia's version of Who Wants to be a Millionaire, and he has a populist's eye for how this will play out in Jakarta.

TANTOWI YAHYA: We do agree with the request from Australian Government to be cooperative with them, but then we got the news that Australian Government is giving refugee status to the smugglers. They've been establishing protection and shelter and we are disappointed.

That's the way we see it. Australian Government is not consistent with the spirit of eliminating all the practice of smuggling people from Indonesia.

MATT BROWN: It's an embarrassing controversy for Australia, especially given the still patchy Indonesian effort to curtail the people smuggling trade. For example, the smuggler accused of organising the boat that disappeared with 97 people on board in late 2010 is a repeat offender called Abu Ali Al Kuwaiti.

He's even done time in Australia for people smuggling and he's in custody again after the Indonesian police arrested him in September.

He was caught with a fake Iraqi passport that showed he paid a visit in 2009 to Kuala Lumpur, which is a known hub for the smuggling network - including Captain Emad. He then travelled in and out of Indonesia at least half a dozen times over the next year.

But an immigration intelligence source says the Indonesian police could not muster a people smuggling charge, and prosecutors would only pursue him over the false passport.

In Australia, on the other hand, Four Corners has found witnesses to his key role in the smuggling operation.

(Excerpt from Four Corners report)

SARAH FERGUSON: Who is that man?

MUSTAPHA: Abu Ali al Kuwaiti…

(End of excerpt)

MATT BROWN: An anonymous refugee told Four Corners he'd paid Abu Ali al Kuwaiti $8,000 to travel on the boat that carried Captain Emad to refuge in Australia.

(Man speaking)

Another, named Yahia al Kazami even visited Abu Ali in detention in Jakarta to press him about the boat that went missing, and found him apparently still running a smuggling operation.

Neither the Australian Federal Police nor the Attorney-General's department would say what, if anything, they've done to help Indonesia's case against him.

This is Matt Brown in Jakarta for AM.


http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2012/s3518069.htm

Offline Judge Roughneck

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #217 on: September 19, 2013, 02:02:30 PM »
Tony accepts Indonesian sovereignty

 How very kind  :clapping

Offline tiger101

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #218 on: September 19, 2013, 03:29:29 PM »
I take it then, you would roll over and let them keep invading your land - potentially risking your family, your space, your privacy?

And the answer is yes, I will protect and defend my family on my land to the death if necessary so if conflict is the final outcome then conflict it is.

No you misunderstand.

Wouldn't a little tact and diplomacy be worth it if it avoids the conflict?

 :cheers

I can't see how not allowing boat smugglers to enter our waters will start a conflict. Australia is its own sovereignty we can turn boats around and not permit them to enter it.

Offline Judge Roughneck

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #219 on: September 19, 2013, 04:33:57 PM »
400 million Muslims many of who are on the verge of extremism

 Let's pee them off

Offline 1965

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #220 on: September 19, 2013, 04:39:25 PM »
400 million Muslims many of who are on the verge of extremism

 Let's pee them off

...and they are our next door neighbours as well.

 :cheers
Yeah we're already going to vote for him mate, you don't need to keep selling it.....

Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #221 on: September 19, 2013, 04:47:17 PM »
I take it then, you would roll over and let them keep invading your land - potentially risking your family, your space, your privacy?

And the answer is yes, I will protect and defend my family on my land to the death if necessary so if conflict is the final outcome then conflict it is.

No you misunderstand.

Wouldn't a little tact and diplomacy be worth it if it avoids the conflict?

 :cheers

I can't see how not allowing boat smugglers to enter our waters will start a conflict. Australia is its own sovereignty we can turn boats around and not permit them to enter it.

on the proviso that as long as it is "safe" to do

that's is my understanding
"Oh yes I am a dreamer, I still see us flying high!"

from the song "Don't Walk Away" by Pat Benatar 1988 (Wide Awake In Dreamland)

Offline Smokey

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #222 on: September 19, 2013, 05:04:07 PM »
400 million Muslims many of who are on the verge of extremism

 Let's pee them off

Hitler would have loved you.  Your not a distant relation of Neville Chamberlain per chance?

Offline Chuck17

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #223 on: September 19, 2013, 08:32:43 PM »
400 million Muslims many of who are on the verge of extremism

 Let's pee them off

Hitler would have loved you.  Your not a distant relation of Neville Chamberlain per chance?

 :lol

Offline tiga

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Re: Stopping the boats
« Reply #224 on: September 20, 2013, 12:45:26 PM »
400 million Muslims many of who are on the verge of extremism

 Let's pee them off

Hitler would have loved you.  Your not a distant relation of Neville Chamberlain per chance?
:lol :lol