MT's list analysis

[mightytiges]

With the list now filled for 2012, here's a breakdown of our list in terms of Age, Experience, Heights and Weights.

What stands out from this is the average weight of the list has leapt up to 87.8kg. From memory Richmond was down at about 83kg just a year or two ago along with the Dogs while Geelong was/is (?) up at 89kg. So it shows there's been a clear directive to recruit bigger bodies. Only 4 players are sub 80kgs now with just one of those (Nahas)  on the senior list.

As far as height there seems to be a more even spread across all heights compared to recent years just gone past. The question to be answered in 2012-13 is is there enough developing quality across all categories to start pushing up the ladder into finals and become contenders in the next 2-3 years.

From the Age and Experience figures I would argue we are still at least a year or two off becoming genuine finals material. With 22 players (almost half our list) yet to play 25 games there's still a question mark over our ready-made depth especially if say injuries hit next year. The core group (23-28 y.o.) still lacks A-grade quality although Jack joins Lids in this group in 2012 with Cotch to follow in 2013. To use WAT's venacular, 2014 should be the year of no excuses  regarding playing finals if we have recruited, developed and list managed well.



Age - as of April 2012 (start of next season)

30: Tuck (140)
29: Newman (192)
-------------------------------------------
28: King (75), Moore (84), Miller# (147)
27: -
26: Foley (110), Jackson (104), I.Maric (77)
25: Deledio (150), Graham (47), McGuane (84), White (82)
24: Derickx (-), Grigg (64), Nahas (55)
23: Connors (27), Edwards (89), Houli (48 ), Morris (-), Riewoldt (90), Webberley (15)
-------------------------------------------
22: Cotchin (64), Rance (44), Post (22), A.Maric# (21)
21: Astbury (22), Browne (12), Vickery (45)
20: Batchelor (16), Dea (7), Griffiths (9), Grimes (7), Helbig (10), Martin (43)
19: Conca (17), Elton (-), MacDonald (-), Heslin# (-)
18: Arnot (-), Ellis (-), O'Hanlon (-), Darrou# (-), Turner# (-), Verrier# (-), Wright# (-)


Oldies:          2
Prime/Core: 19
Youth:         24


Experience

200+ games:   0
150-199:         2
100-149:         4
50-99:          10
25-49:            6
1-25:            11
Yet to debut: 11

Avg: 45 games



Height (cm)

Rucks       (200+):     5 - Browne (203), Derickx (201), Graham (201), I.Maric (200), Vickery (200)

Big KPPs    (195-200):  5 - Griffiths (200), Elton (197), Astbury (195), Post (195), Riewoldt (195)

KPPs        (190-194):  6 - Miller# (194), Rance (194), Grimes (193), McGuane (192), Moore (190), Darrou# (190)

Tall Mids   (186-190): 12 - Jackson (190), Grigg (190), O'Hanlon (189), Tuck (189), Wright# (189), Batchelor (188 ), Deledio (188 ), Martin (187),
                                        Heslin# (187), Verrier# (187), Connors (186), Dea (186)

Mids        (181-185):  9 - Conca (185), Cotchin (185), Helbig (185), Morris (185), MacDonald (184), Newman (183), Edwards (182), Webberley (182), Ellis (181)

Smalls      (sub 180):  8 - Arnot (180), Houli (180), White (180), Foley (178 ), King (178 ), Turner# (177), Nahas (176), A.Maric# (176)

Avg: 188.3cm


Weight (kg)

100+:   5 - Graham (106), Browne (105), I.Maric (102), Derickx (100), Griffiths (100)

95-99:  4 - Darrou# (97), Wright# (97), Miller (96), Vickery (95)

90-94:  9 - Astbury (93), Post (93), Rance (93), Riewoldt (93), Elton (92), McGuane (92), Tuck (92), Grimes (91), Moore (91)

85-89: 10 - Deledio (88 ), Jackson (88 ), Heslin# (88 ), Arnot (87), O'Hanlon (87), Batchelor (86), MacDonald (86), Martin (86), Dea (85), Grigg (85)

80-84: 13 - Connors (84), Cotchin (84), Houli (84), Morris (84), Ellis (83), Helbig (83), Newman (83), King (82), White (82), Foley (81), Conca (80), Edwards (80), Webberley (80)

sub80:  4 - Verrier# (76), Nahas (72), A.Maric# (71), Turner# (69)

Avg: 87.8 kg

[gerkin greg]

Graham is fat

[one-eyed]

SEN earlier had a fantasy footy/dreamteam guy on going through all the teams. For Richmond he said 2012 would be another year of patience for Tiger supporters. We have the youngest list of the established clubs and like Melbourne in recent years needed to get more games into our youngsters. From memory he said under Dimma we've put 573 games into our youngsters. He also said on paper our midfield llooks good but we had a number of non-mids playing in there in 2011. Lids heading into the midfield in 2012 and Conca playing more games in there as well will help improve our midfield depth to a degree. The difference between the bottom and top sides is midfield depth and how many guys you can rotate through the midfield without dropping away.

[Judge Roughneck]

Sounds like piva is more kpp than tall mid

[WA Tiger]

No Excuses....

[Coach]

Sounds like piva is more kpp than tall mid

Yep, that's why he played full back and centre half forward as a junior

[Mr Magic]

Nice work MT.

[tony_montana]

Great breakdown MT

looking at the middle tier we could and should be looking to replace 8-10 of them. Guys like Gus, White, Connors, Moore, Miller, McGuane, Webberley, Jackson & Edwards arent good enough. Guys like Derickx, Morris are unknowns, King is borderline but good enough for now. Which is why realistically i still reckon we're a couple of years off until the quality we have in the 18-22yo bracket matures.

[tigtuff12]

Great breakdown MT

^ agreed - cheers for the breakdown mate...

still need to get games into the "younger guys" (half the list lol)  but I think there has been a definite push in the right direction over the last couple of years...we're starting to look like men as opposed to kids playing against men which can only hold us in good stead...the other promising sign is that the majority of blokes who could/should be around when we are competitive and should be playing regularly finals are growing together and we don't have that massive age gap between our best players that we've had in the past...

[The Big Richo]

Can we get OE's thoughts now please?

[mightytiges]

Sounds like piva is more kpp than tall mid

Yep, that's why he played full back and centre half forward as a junior

Yep my categories aren't foolproof. There'll always one or two guys who crossover. Piva being 189cm tall is undersized for a KPP so that's why he is listed as a 'tall midfielder'. If he is to make it at AFL level it'll need to be as a 3rd tall or if he has the tank as tall midfielder or flanker.

looking at the middle tier we could and should be looking to replace 8-10 of them. Guys like Gus, White, Connors, Moore, Miller, McGuane, Webberley, Jackson & Edwards arent good enough. Guys like Derickx, Morris are unknowns, King is borderline but good enough for now. Which is why realistically i still reckon we're a couple of years off until the quality we have in the 18-22yo bracket matures.

Yep TM our 'senior' core as it stands is inadequate and lacks quality apart from Lids. I agree we need to turn them over in the next couple of years as the young guys below them mature. It's this reason why I believe we are still two years away.

still need to get games into the "younger guys" (half the list lol)  but I think there has been a definite push in the right direction over the last couple of years...we're starting to look like men as opposed to kids playing against men which can only hold us in good stead...the other promising sign is that the majority of blokes who could/should be around when we are competitive and should be playing regularly finals are growing together and we don't have that massive age gap between our best players that we've had in the past...

That's true tigtuff12. In the next couple of years we will have finally fixed the age gap problem created a decade ago. It just goes to show how destructive our poor list management and recruitment has been. It'll take almost a decade all up to re-balance our list.

[Coach]

He's bigger than 189 now I think. pretty sure he's also been reported as being 191cm. Won't be a 3rd tall, the dude is a full back. Bowden was our best defender against tall blokes for a few years and he was 188cm and didn't have Piva size. 6'3 is tall enough to play key position if you've got the ability and the strength.