Author Topic: Liam McBean [merged]  (Read 188079 times)

Offline Diocletian

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #405 on: December 09, 2013, 05:05:48 PM »
Hate to go against santa at this time of year but sorry claw, you're on your own on this one. Take it from someone who, like you is a cynical realist, extremely weary of hype and has seen & heard it all before....kid's got what it takes and frankly I'd be staggered if he didn't make it.
"Much of the social history of the Western world, over the past three decades, has been a history of replacing what worked with what sounded good...."

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FJ is the only one that makes sense.

Offline blaisee

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #406 on: December 09, 2013, 07:42:12 PM »
Quote
vickery will never be a #1 ruck no matter how much size he puts on. yes vickery has agility and speed and atm thats about all hes got.


why?




IMO some of tyrones best football has been from the midfield


Franklin goes alright without being able to mark


If you watch young bean at training be looks a pure forward with all the tricks. Knows where the goals are

The kids not debut yet and you are bagging him

usually a giant 'project' type would be given four + years...
jeezus

all ive said there is a lot of love for a kid who hasnt even played a game yet and who hasnt shown any sort of outstanding aerial quality that you would expect from a 200cm player.
we do this, talk em up  as supporters all the time before they have done a thing.  far more often than not we end up with egg on our faces.



As an 18 yr old playing in the vfl he was top 5 in the league for marks inside fifty.

Seriously claw, if you are going to appraise footballers, at least get your facts right.

Offline Judge Roughneck

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #407 on: December 09, 2013, 10:11:16 PM »

gerkin greg

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #408 on: December 10, 2013, 11:36:26 AM »
on grand final day hawthorn played:

bailey
hale
gunston
franklin
roughead

why is

maric
hampson
riewoldt
vickery
mcbean

unrealistic?
Because none of our forwards have the mobility of Franklin, Roughead, Gunston. Franklin is a freak and Roughead rotates into the midfield. Gunston is an athletic medium sized fwd who just happens to be tall for that position.

bullcrap, vickery & mcbean can play midfield and jack is as mobile as they come

has gunston ever even been manned up? (apart from when he got reamed by david treacle arseberry, lol)

the claw

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #409 on: December 10, 2013, 11:51:22 PM »
Hate to go against santa at this time of year but sorry claw, you're on your own on this one. Take it from someone who, like you is a cynical realist, extremely weary of hype and has seen & heard it all before....kid's got what it takes and frankly I'd be staggered if he didn't make it.
dont believe ive said he wont make it.

what i have said is theres an awful lot of love for a bloke who is yet to play a game. all im doing is questioning why we annoint them before they have done a thing. until he does perform at the level hes just another kid with a potential tag.

Offline Phil Mrakov

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #410 on: December 11, 2013, 12:39:50 AM »
Hate to go against santa at this time of year but sorry claw, you're on your own on this one. Take it from someone who, like you is a cynical realist, extremely weary of hype and has seen & heard it all before....kid's got what it takes and frankly I'd be staggered if he didn't make it.
dont believe ive said he wont make it.

what i have said is theres an awful lot of love for a bloke who is yet to play a game. all im doing is questioning why we annoint them before they have done a thing. until he does perform at the level hes just another kid with a potential tag.

totally agree

the guy hasn't done a thing  imho
hhhaaarrgghhh hhhhaaarrggghhh hhhhaaaarrrggghh
HHAAARRRGGGHHHH HHHHAAARRRGGGHHHH HHHHHAAAAARRRRGGGGGHHHHH

Offline tigs2011

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #411 on: December 11, 2013, 01:12:13 AM »
Hate to go against santa at this time of year but sorry claw, you're on your own on this one. Take it from someone who, like you is a cynical realist, extremely weary of hype and has seen & heard it all before....kid's got what it takes and frankly I'd be staggered if he didn't make it.
dont believe ive said he wont make it.

what i have said is theres an awful lot of love for a bloke who is yet to play a game. all im doing is questioning why we annoint them before they have done a thing. until he does perform at the level hes just another kid with a potential tag.
Agree, but McBean has been good at VFL and I'm sure a lot of it is just a pee take. At least I think it is. As long as McBean himself doesn't get ahead of himself he'll be right.

Offline Diocletian

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #412 on: December 11, 2013, 09:40:44 PM »
Hate to go against santa at this time of year but sorry claw, you're on your own on this one. Take it from someone who, like you is a cynical realist, extremely weary of hype and has seen & heard it all before....kid's got what it takes and frankly I'd be staggered if he didn't make it.
dont believe ive said he wont make it.

what i have said is theres an awful lot of love for a bloke who is yet to play a game. all im doing is questioning why we annoint them before they have done a thing. until he does perform at the level hes just another kid with a potential tag.

totally agree

the guy hasn't done a thing  imho

37 goals in 14 games strongly suggests otherwise, in fact it strongly suggests he's done more in just two-thirds of a season than both Griffiths & Elton have done in a combined total of six seasons.

Can we guarantee 100% he'll make it - well no, there a very few kids you can 100% guarantee until they actually start playing AFL. Could well be one of those too good for VFL, not good enough for AFL types but I doubt it... IMO barring severe injuries -which is always a possibility with tall skinny kids and trust me, was the only reason he was held back last year- there aren't too many other reasons why he can't.

He has guts, determination & work ethic, this already puts him ahead of the likes of Griffiths & Post - he has great game sense/smarts and knows where to run, this puts him ahead of those two as well as Todd "lost" Elton. He's quicker than Astbury. His agility for his size is remarkable, in fact his level of agilty would be impressive for a 185 cm mid, so it's not merely just "good for his size".

His alleged deficiencies - contested marking (he doesn't really play the kind of role that requires alot of it yet -plus his skill in creating leads and reading the flight is such that he often finds himself out on his own. ) & set shot kicking (technique's fine enough)are not that bad and are more just aspects he'll need to work on the same as every kid his age -even the the highly rated top draft picks - has aspects of their games they need to work on.....and yes he probably won't be playing in the ruck for a fair while yet.

Let's not forget his 37 goals in 14 games came playing on the end of some shocking and often non-existent delivery in the second worst team in the VFL, a team often heavily compromised as to what structures & match-ups they could employ.

Yes there's been a lot of exaggerated urine extracting hype around the traps regarding his talents, but every now & then there are kids you can just tell have what it takes - for me he's one of those kids....and as I said, I'm far from a glass half full brightsider or delusional feral.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2013, 10:11:38 PM by Nihilistic Tiger »
"Much of the social history of the Western world, over the past three decades, has been a history of replacing what worked with what sounded good...."

- Thomas Sowell


FJ is the only one that makes sense.

the claw

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #413 on: December 13, 2013, 01:31:37 AM »
Hate to go against santa at this time of year but sorry claw, you're on your own on this one. Take it from someone who, like you is a cynical realist, extremely weary of hype and has seen & heard it all before....kid's got what it takes and frankly I'd be staggered if he didn't make it.
dont believe ive said he wont make it.

what i have said is theres an awful lot of love for a bloke who is yet to play a game. all im doing is questioning why we annoint them before they have done a thing. until he does perform at the level hes just another kid with a potential tag.
Agree, but McBean has been good at VFL and I'm sure a lot of it is just a pee take. At least I think it is. As long as McBean himself doesn't get ahead of himself he'll be right.
yeah just a little bit of pee taking but theres an element of annoyance as well.
sick to death of players being pronounced before they have done a thing.
one lesson ive learnt fromthe last 30 yrs is players can show heaps they can even have a decent season at the top level  but it means jack. let em prove themselves first and then let em show they can do it consistently.

just to finish and again i will be honest. i have never ever rated mcbean as a ruckman and i continue to have some small concerns about aspects of him. i wont be sure about him until i see what he becomes physically and how he performs some pretty crucial areas of the game for 200cm plus players. i wont be talking him down for at least 3 yrs or more and my expectations for him in the near future are low.
yes hes performed at afl level and as such im all for giving him a role in the seniors if for no other reason the experience but also  to see how he handles it. i was for giving him a few games this yr as well. you know what if he goes alright keep him in. i still think he would make a real good chb. im not so sure about him being a forward at afl level.
its funny most are talking up a beanpole to significantly impact the seniors next yr yet in the same breath they talk about development.
like i said theres an awful lot of love for a bloke whos yet to play a game and is abot 15kg away from where he needs to get.

Offline tigs2011

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #414 on: December 13, 2013, 01:55:55 AM »
I hope he hardly plays a game next year to be honest Claw. I don't think he's a ruck either. He wasn't really one as a junior but he was a good KPP. He needs the weight to get better as a contested mark but he can do pretty much everything else and he's generally a dead eye.

Hopefully can dominate VFL a bit more and keep Vickery under the pump now that Vickery is going to be played as KPF only. That's the role I expected McBean to grab eventually (2nd fiddle to Jack) with Vickery as 2nd ruck but they've aborted that so now Vickery isn't as certain to play each week IMO.

Offline Stripes

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #415 on: December 13, 2013, 09:35:27 AM »
I hope he hardly plays a game next year to be honest Claw. I don't think he's a ruck either. He wasn't really one as a junior but he was a good KPP. He needs the weight to get better as a contested mark but he can do pretty much everything else and he's generally a dead eye.

Hopefully can dominate VFL a bit more and keep Vickery under the pump now that Vickery is going to be played as KPF only. That's the role I expected McBean to grab eventually (2nd fiddle to Jack) with Vickery as 2nd ruck but they've aborted that so now Vickery isn't as certain to play each week IMO.

Imo Vickery's strengths are his agility, marking capabilities and movement around the ground. If McBean comes on and proves himself a superior option to Vickery up forward then I would love the coaches to begin to focus almost exclusively of Vickery's rucking. As his size increases I think he will make an ideal 2nd ruck/forward but at the moment his tap work is not up to scratch.

McBean needs another year to grow in confidence and size imo. Give him a few games later in the year or if injury demands it but otherwise keep giving him time.

Offline MintOnLamb

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #416 on: December 13, 2013, 10:52:55 AM »
I hope he hardly plays a game next year to be honest Claw. I don't think he's a ruck either. He wasn't really one as a junior but he was a good KPP. He needs the weight to get better as a contested mark but he can do pretty much everything else and he's generally a dead eye.

Hopefully can dominate VFL a bit more and keep Vickery under the pump now that Vickery is going to be played as KPF only. That's the role I expected McBean to grab eventually (2nd fiddle to Jack) with Vickery as 2nd ruck but they've aborted that so now Vickery isn't as certain to play each week IMO.

Imo Vickery's strengths are his agility, marking capabilities and movement around the ground. If McBean comes on and proves himself a superior option to Vickery up forward then I would love the coaches to begin to focus almost exclusively of Vickery's rucking. As his size increases I think he will make an ideal 2nd ruck/forward but at the moment his tap work is not up to scratch.

McBean needs another year to grow in confidence and size imo. Give him a few games later in the year or if injury demands it but otherwise keep giving him time.
Agree, I hate it when they rush these kids in. BTW how heavy is the McBean Stalk?

Offline yellowandback

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #417 on: December 14, 2013, 11:31:09 AM »
"yeah just a little bit of pee taking but theres an element of annoyance as well.
sick to death of players being pronounced before they have done a thing.
one lesson ive learnt fromthe last 30 yrs is players can show heaps they can even have a decent season at the top level  but it means jack. let em prove themselves first and then let em show they can do it consistently."

What exactly are your professional credentials over 30 years?
Do you work professionally on list management?
If not, your learning over 30 years is no more insightful than anyone else who follows the game and our club closely.

And while I'm just a little bit of pee taking there's an element of annoyance that you somehow elevate your view of list management above everyone else's.
It's that simple Spud
"I discussed (it) with my three daughters, my wife and my 82-year-old mum, because it has really affected me … If those comments … were made about one of my daughters, it would make the hairs on the back of my neck stand up. I would not have liked it at all.”

Offline Willy

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #418 on: December 14, 2013, 03:19:55 PM »
"yeah just a little bit of pee taking but theres an element of annoyance as well.
sick to death of players being pronounced before they have done a thing.
one lesson ive learnt fromthe last 30 yrs is players can show heaps they can even have a decent season at the top level  but it means jack. let em prove themselves first and then let em show they can do it consistently."

What exactly are your professional credentials over 30 years?
Do you work professionally on list management?
If not, your learning over 30 years is no more insightful than anyone else who follows the game and our club closely.

And while I'm just a little bit of pee taking there's an element of annoyance that you somehow elevate your view of list management above everyone else's.

 :lol

Rampstar

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Re: Liam McBean [merged]
« Reply #419 on: December 14, 2013, 03:50:00 PM »
who cares if hes a ruckman or not if he can stand in a forward pocket or play as a half forward and he probably could considering his mobility and kick 30 goals a season thats good enough for me.