Maric & Lennon both facing surgery [merged]

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May have been asked but WTF did the club and it's medical visionaries, wait until the season is almost here to do this?

Anyone??

Someone???

Dan Richardson (GM of Footy) said yesterday they thought they'd be able to manage it through the season 

But have worked out they can't, the pain isn't 'going away so they've decided on surgery now rather than later in the season

 

Maybe they should have operated earlier to fix it for good (even if it means the mullet misses pre-season) instead of trying to 'manage' it.

Agree 

The problem is bone spurs for crying out loud, they weren't going away 

Right!

He's only the most important link n the team.....ffs!!

Surely the first of a comedy of errors from this illustrious  corporation !

[tdy]

I dont know if our medical team has turned over since the Wallace era, but it was pretty poor back then. Highlighted by the Richo hammy tear incident.  I would hope we have replaced a few people, shuffled the cards somewhat, since then.

[YellowandBlackBlood]

Hang on one minute!

How do you know that the medical team stuffed up here?  Maybe Maric himself decided not to go with surgery when he was given the option and now realised he wasn't getting any better!

Just don't assume anything!!!!

[Willy]

No no, YBB. The medical experts on here know better. You see if this lot where responsible for managing our players injuries, why, why we wouldn't have any injuries at all!

Is my sarcasm coming through here? 

The truth of the matter is that we don't even know the nature of Ivan's injury, let alone the other contextual factors at play, such as Ivan's own management preferences. To suggest one way or another whether it has been handled correctly is a foolish stab in the dark.
Does than mean that our medicos always get it right? Definitely not. But we are certainly not in any position to comment accurately, because we have next to nothing to go off.

As TBR implied, clubs BS all the time about their players' injuries for tactical purposes. Ivan could have a broken stuffing neck for all we know.

It's funny, we've had a very good run with injuries the last few years, in terms of games missed for best 22. Most would say this is due to good luck and not the good work of our medicos. But when one of our players starts missing games, it isn't just bad luck, it's that our medicos are useless.

[WilliamPowell]

Hang on one minute!

How do you know that the medical team stuffed up here?  Maybe Maric himself decided not to go with surgery when he was given the option and now realised he wasn't getting any better!

Just don't assume anything!!!!

Sadly their "history" is all we have to go by. And history doesn't reflect kindly.

Our current head Doctor is the person who Ok'd (sent) Richo back on the field that fateful day in Sydney when his hammy was stuffed. Going back made it worse and we all know what the end result a career ending tendon off the bone.

So it's no surprise that people are cynical and harsh 

End of the day the doctors are the ones that make the final decision, they have the power, authority to override the players. They are the experts so you would think that really players should not have any say at all

[YellowandBlackBlood]

Hang on one minute!

How do you know that the medical team stuffed up here?  Maybe Maric himself decided not to go with surgery when he was given the option and now realised he wasn't getting any better!

Just don't assume anything!!!!

Sadly their "history" is all we have to go by. And history doesn't reflect kindly.

Our current head Doctor is the person who Ok'd (sent) Richo back on the field that fateful day in Sydney when his hammy was stuffed. Going back made it worse and we all know what the end result a career ending tendon off the bone.

So it's no surprise that people are cynical and harsh 

End of the day the doctors are the ones that make the final decision, they have the power, authority to override the players. They are the experts so you would think that really players should not have any say at all

A doctor can only make decisions on the evidence available at the time. A large part of that evidence is the patient history or account of his ailment.  If the player tells the doctor he has little or no pain the doctor can only go by what he says.  In the case of Richo, we don't know if Richo said he was fine at the time.....

[WilliamPowell]

A doctor can only make decisions on the evidence available at the time. A large part of that evidence is the patient history or account of his ailment.  If the player tells the doctor he has little or no pain the doctor can only go by what he says.  In the case of Richo, we don't know if Richo said he was fine at the time.....

Exactly, and history would have told the Doctor that Richo would always say he was right to go and the history would have always told the Doctor that in Richo case that wasn't necessarily correct.

I was there that day I would have thought the fact Richo could barely walk without a limp let alone jog was a give away that it was worse than what he was being told 

[Andyy]

Interesting but I agree WP. Richo would have wanted to play. I see him maybe once a year at work so if I see him again soon I might actually ask him.

Although we'll never know if he'd have recovered sufficiently if he hadn't played on anyway.

[YellowandBlackBlood]

A doctor can only make decisions on the evidence available at the time. A large part of that evidence is the patient history or account of his ailment.  If the player tells the doctor he has little or no pain the doctor can only go by what he says.  In the case of Richo, we don't know if Richo said he was fine at the time.....

Exactly, and history would have told the Doctor that Richo would always say he was right to go and the history would have always told the Doctor that in Richo case that wasn't necessarily correct.

I was there that day I would have thought the fact Richo could barely walk without a limp let alone jog was a give away that it was worse than what he was being told 

I agree that it sounds bad but until we know all the facts it's hard to blame anyone. Who knows, Wallet may have demanded he go back on and overrode the medical team!

[dwaino]

Surgery is always a last resort and only at the consent of the player. This doesn't really apply to the Richo case, but regarding Maric we don't know if he chose to manage it and aim for round 1 against advice for surgery.

[The Big Richo]

Professional sports people have clauses in their contracts which require them to follow the direction of their sports medicine team.

The scenario would go something like:

Injury reported
Injury assessed and diagnosed
Treatment plan established
Player option to explore a second opinion

Obviously everyone has the right to consent or not to medical treatment but in the instance of a player refusing to consent to the directed medical advice their contract would either invoke a suspension of injury payments or termination clause.

So you can guarantee the decision was not Marics.

I agree re questions over our medical team. Speaking as someone in the same industry the worst example i saw was the Ben Cousins hamstring.

An ageing, high level aerobic athlete with a history of hamstring issues, who was in his first full intensity contest after a 12 month break has tightness and is sent back on.

I still can't believe it.

[tony_montana]

Also, scans, mri's etc can tell the doc if a player is attempting to cover up the extent of the injury.

[RedanTiger]

I agree that it sounds bad but until we know all the facts it's hard to blame anyone. Who knows, Wallet may have demanded he go back on and overrode the medical team!

So firstly you suggest that Maric made the decision and now you suggest that the senior coach overrode the medical staff.
In the first case the player is an employee and must follow medical advice.
In the second case the doctor has a responsibility to the player - under which numerous lawsuits have been lodged over the years - to treat him in his best long term interests.
To fail to act in the best interests of the player (by allowing the coach to make medical decisions) is to go against medical, employment and legal ethics. 

[YellowandBlackBlood]

I agree that it sounds bad but until we know all the facts it's hard to blame anyone. Who knows, Wallet may have demanded he go back on and overrode the medical team!

So firstly you suggest that Maric made the decision and now you suggest that the senior coach overrode the medical staff.
In the first case the player is an employee and must follow medical advice.
In the second case the doctor has a responsibility to the player - under which numerous lawsuits have been lodged over the years - to treat him in his best long term interests.
To fail to act in the best interests of the player (by allowing the coach to make medical decisions) is to go against medical, employment and legal ethics.

Two different situations. I am a doctor so I think I know the laws better than you. Your first case is wrong.  Nobody can force a person to have any medical treatment.  That is an individuals responsibility. It's his choice what is or isn't done to his body.
In the second scenario the doctor can only again give his or her professional opinion and advice.  It's up to the player again to choose. If the coach is telling him that he needs himand he says he is okay to go, he may choose again to ignore medical advice.
The bottom line is that a doctor can only strongly recommend what he or she thinks is best. If others decide not to heed the advice they do that at their own peril.
As a doctor all I do is clearly document the advice I gave and thus I cannot be sued for putting the player in harms way.

Understand?

[The Big Richo]

You will find history is littered with players who ignored medical advice and played.

You will also find, in modern times anyway very few times when a player has played when they haven't wanted to.

I just came back from working overseas in a sporting competition with players earning huge amounts of money but never once are they pressured to play by the organisation when they are injured and don't feel able to.