Author Topic: RFC List Manager  (Read 3078 times)

Offline TigerLand

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RFC List Manager
« on: July 28, 2017, 02:47:24 PM »
I'm not 100% aware of who this as, as my understanding its been Blair Hartley for some part and then changed, I'm not 100% sure.

But the people that have been responsible in managing our list over the last 3 years need to be removed from the club. How can a top 4 side, have 0 KP forward options with Riewoldt and Griffiths out injured. That is just unacceptable. What if Jack gets suspended round 23 for a 1 week jumper punch. How can we possibly go into a final without a KP forward. Not good enough.

Credit to the group and the coaching staff for the achievements thus far with list with unacceptable holes in it. Same with Ruck division. We have 2 ruckman on the list that could have ever played a game this season. Combined total of about 20 games thus far. They get injured we have Grigg to ruck. Again unacceptable.
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Offline one-eyed

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2017, 07:00:08 PM »
It's Blair Hartley who is our list manager  :P.

-------------------------------------------------------

Richmond's recruiting set up underwent change at the end of last year when Neil Balme came to the club as football manager.

It meant Dan Richardson moved more into a general manager role focused on talent, and he handles Tigers contracts and total player payments. He's also responsible for the Tigers' Next Generation Academy program, into which the club has invested plenty of time and sees as a big part of its recruiting future.

Blair Hartley is in charge of the list and its direction, while Matthew Clarke, in his first year as the club's recruiting manager, will have two first-round picks at this year's draft.

Everyone in the Tigers' group has an eye over the national pool, but recruiting officers Luke Williams (Victoria), Richard Taylor (division two states and academies) and Francis Jackson (future drafts) watch over specific areas as well.

Opposition analyst and pro scout Nick Austin rounds out the Tigers' team, with the club having 10 extra scouts in part-time positions.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-07-19/who-makes-the-calls-on-your-clubs-recruits

Offline tdy

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2017, 11:16:51 PM »
There have been a few strange decisions made with the list.  Like why did they keep Maric on if he couldn't play?  Why keep Elton for 3 or is it 4 years before playing him and proving he isn't up to it. 

Why have so few kpps come good McBean, Elton, Darrou, Griffiths. I suppose that's why they culled all the coaches last year. So it hasn't just been list management. 

Saying all that we're 4th so something is working right. The dogs won last year without a backline so maybe list holes don't matter that much in the current climate.  Maybe we're all still enamoured with how good Wayne Carey was and think every good team needs a half forward who can kick run and mark. It might be a false myth the footy fraternity believes.

Offline tdy

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2017, 11:41:55 PM »
Actually it makes me think. Do you really need talls at the moment? Given the congestion these days, is height advantage negated so much that most of the time you can get away with good players not tall good players? Josh Gibson comes to mind. Who would thunk he'd be a 4 time premiership half back. Just a thought. Not sure I believe it myself but congestion may negate height to an extent.

Offline Tigeritis™©®

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #4 on: July 29, 2017, 12:57:05 AM »
I'm not 100% aware of who this as, as my understanding its been Blair Hartley for some part and then changed, I'm not 100% sure.

But the people that have been responsible in managing our list over the last 3 years need to be removed from the club. How can a top 4 side, have 0 KP forward options with Riewoldt and Griffiths out injured. That is just unacceptable. What if Jack gets suspended round 23 for a 1 week jumper punch. How can we possibly go into a final without a KP forward. Not good enough.

Credit to the group and the coaching staff for the achievements thus far with list with unacceptable holes in it. Same with Ruck division. We have 2 ruckman on the list that could have ever played a game this season. Combined total of about 20 games thus far. They get injured we have Grigg to ruck. Again unacceptable.

I've got just one decision that should be enough grounds to move this wanker back to port. HAMSPUD!

Fancy trading away a second rounder for a player that can't mark, can't kick, bend, run nor find the ball. Worst still, the club your dealing with was going to delist him if there weren't any takers. :facepalm

How has this bozo still have a job?  :rollin
The club that keeps giving.

Offline big tone

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #5 on: July 29, 2017, 10:04:50 AM »
Actually it makes me think. Do you really need talls at the moment? Given the congestion these days, is height advantage negated so much that most of the time you can get away with good players not tall good players? Josh Gibson comes to mind. Who would thunk he'd be a 4 time premiership half back. Just a thought. Not sure I believe it myself but congestion may negate height to an extent.
Watching the Hawks last night with 5 minutes to go showed just how important it is to have talls that can catch the footy. When they didn't have a free short to go to, they kicked it down the line to their talls who actually took the mark and gave them the opportunity to still keep the footy off The Swans.

We need talls that can mark the footy not just in our forwardline but around the ground when we just need to keep the footy out of the oppositions hands whether that be late in games or just when we need to stop a teams run through the game.

We need to add a couple of marking players imo. As bad as Elton was early on this season hitting the scoreboard, he did compete really well between the archs, untill he dropped off. It's time to bring him back for another crack. I'd even think about playing Moore as well as a high half forward. And I'd sit Caddy at CHF to compete in the air in our forwardline.

Our smalls worked better when they had some crumbs to work with, they are much more dangerous when the ball came in quickly with their opponents having to watch the footy as well as their opponents.

Offline the claw

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #6 on: July 29, 2017, 12:05:28 PM »
Have gone on about this every yr ive been posting.Every list manager should have a PROCESS and a damn good idea of the numbers needed in each area of the ground.
They also need a damn good idea of where players are at and how they have developed have they consistently reached the required standard and ask what is the likely hood of further improvement.
Our footy club continues to fail in all of these things.

Will say it one more time the norm  goes something like this, there are the odd exceptions  but not many.

First and foremost you must have a loose description for what a tall is.
 Most regard 190cm plus as being a genuine tall even the clubs themselves.
There are all types of talls Running talls  Third talls KPP,S and ruck/fwd and rucks.

Personally i find the following to be pretty accurate.
Running talls, mids,  I rarely consider these blokes to be talls as they have little to do with structure   and they go into say if its a mid, the mid category as a tall mid, ie Grigg.When we all talk talls we basically talk about structure and fwds, defenders and rucks.

Third talls they tend to be 190 - 194cm but of course there are exceptions.  Blokes who have genuine height play specific roles ie fwd or back are good marks  are mobile and prettyy quick, They have height but dont neccesarily have the size and strength to hold down a kp but could pinch hit there if need be. Jack Gunston comes to mind or our own Callum Moore would fit this mould at AFL level if he made the grade.

Then you have GENUINE kpp's usually 195cm plus but they normally have size and strength to go with it, there are also  a lot of very goof kpps who are less than 195cm but they have the physical attributes for the role our own Alex Rance comes straight to mind. So its very much a combination of genuine height and size rather than just height.

Then you have your rucks and Ruck/fwds/def usually 198cm and above.
Personally they need to be good in one role and be adequate in the second.We have Chol and some would say Griffiths neither have performed to a high enough level in either role.

Now thats a simple  outlier of what a tall is and the roles expected i would have thought it was a simple starting point for our list manager but it never ever seems to be the case.

The next simple questions are how many do we need in each area and not just for the seniors but we need to cater for all areas  that is Juniors, Development, Mature, Vets.
You also need to ask where are these players at?  how have they performed?  and is it likely we will need to cut any of them?
I will use say KPF'S .
We really do need two for senior games, but we do need another two down in the reserves developing, mirroring the seniors  and putting pressure on those in the seniors. The numbers are easy to determine.  But the numbers are just one small part of it.
If you were running the list you would come to the conclusion that we have just one genuine KPF who has performed anywhere near the need level.The others have had a very long time and it is more likely than not that they need to be replaced. Thats just common sense. Imo we have just three KPF'S Riewoldt, Griffiths, Elton. I make the distinction of Moore being more like a third tall and i think Chol a Ruck/fwd/def
When you make the distinctions and you look at the performance line there is need and great need at that, for three new KPF'S. Preferably 1 junior, 1 development and 1 mature.

This type of process is well plain basic thinking but our club does not seem to have any sort of process in place when it comes to list management and where a lot of players are actually at.

Any way its been done to death by me and thats enough on it again people surely get the drift.

Offline 1965

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #7 on: July 29, 2017, 12:29:14 PM »



Very informative.


What do you do for a living?


 :cheers

Offline Chuck17

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #8 on: July 29, 2017, 03:22:46 PM »
I cbf reading all that but does anyone know if he covered off 200cm+ players?

Offline 🏅Dooks

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #9 on: July 29, 2017, 03:35:12 PM »
I cbf reading all that but does anyone know if he covered off 200cm+ players?

Im waiting for an executive summary.
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Offline tdy

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #10 on: July 29, 2017, 04:18:51 PM »
I cbf reading all that but does anyone know if he covered off 200cm+ players?

Im waiting for an executive summary.

It's summarised as one sentence. Have a good process.

Offline 🏅Dooks

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #11 on: July 29, 2017, 04:39:19 PM »
I cbf reading all that but does anyone know if he covered off 200cm+ players?

Im waiting for an executive summary.

It's summarised as one sentence. Have a good process.

Cheers.
"Sliding doors moment.
If Damian Barrett had a brain
Then its made of sh#t" Dont Argue - 2/8/2018

Offline Simonator

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #12 on: August 07, 2017, 12:20:50 PM »
Virtually our whole backline has been drafted in. Houli the only one who's been acquired by trade. Looks like they definitely got a few right there. Not to mention 2 Brownlow medalists in cotch and Martin. All drafted and developed by the rfc.

Offline 1885

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Re: RFC List Manager
« Reply #13 on: September 12, 2017, 12:22:57 PM »
Have gone on about this every yr ive been posting.Every list manager should have a PROCESS and a damn good idea of the numbers needed in each area of the ground.
They also need a damn good idea of where players are at and how they have developed have they consistently reached the required standard and ask what is the likely hood of further improvement.
Our footy club continues to fail in all of these things.

Will say it one more time the norm  goes something like this, there are the odd exceptions  but not many.

First and foremost you must have a loose description for what a tall is.
 Most regard 190cm plus as being a genuine tall even the clubs themselves.
There are all types of talls Running talls  Third talls KPP,S and ruck/fwd and rucks.

Personally i find the following to be pretty accurate.
Running talls, mids,  I rarely consider these blokes to be talls as they have little to do with structure   and they go into say if its a mid, the mid category as a tall mid, ie Grigg.When we all talk talls we basically talk about structure and fwds, defenders and rucks.

Third talls they tend to be 190 - 194cm but of course there are exceptions.  Blokes who have genuine height play specific roles ie fwd or back are good marks  are mobile and prettyy quick, They have height but dont neccesarily have the size and strength to hold down a kp but could pinch hit there if need be. Jack Gunston comes to mind or our own Callum Moore would fit this mould at AFL level if he made the grade.

Then you have GENUINE kpp's usually 195cm plus but they normally have size and strength to go with it, there are also  a lot of very goof kpps who are less than 195cm but they have the physical attributes for the role our own Alex Rance comes straight to mind. So its very much a combination of genuine height and size rather than just height.

Then you have your rucks and Ruck/fwds/def usually 198cm and above.
Personally they need to be good in one role and be adequate in the second.We have Chol and some would say Griffiths neither have performed to a high enough level in either role.

Now thats a simple  outlier of what a tall is and the roles expected i would have thought it was a simple starting point for our list manager but it never ever seems to be the case.

The next simple questions are how many do we need in each area and not just for the seniors but we need to cater for all areas  that is Juniors, Development, Mature, Vets.
You also need to ask where are these players at?  how have they performed?  and is it likely we will need to cut any of them?
I will use say KPF'S .
We really do need two for senior games, but we do need another two down in the reserves developing, mirroring the seniors  and putting pressure on those in the seniors. The numbers are easy to determine.  But the numbers are just one small part of it.
If you were running the list you would come to the conclusion that we have just one genuine KPF who has performed anywhere near the need level.The others have had a very long time and it is more likely than not that they need to be replaced. Thats just common sense. Imo we have just three KPF'S Riewoldt, Griffiths, Elton. I make the distinction of Moore being more like a third tall and i think Chol a Ruck/fwd/def
When you make the distinctions and you look at the performance line there is need and great need at that, for three new KPF'S. Preferably 1 junior, 1 development and 1 mature.

This type of process is well plain basic thinking but our club does not seem to have any sort of process in place when it comes to list management and where a lot of players are actually at.

Any way its been done to death by me and thats enough on it again people surely get the drift.

Who would of thought being two wins from the flag with Townsend and caddy as the. 2nd 3rd tall forward and big man Grigg 2nd ruck  :lol