Trouble is brewing

[1980]

The glaring one to me in the ones who are restanding for election is Welsh.  He was football director.  Now, if you're unhappy with what's happened on the footy field 1980 - and ain't we all - wouldn't you think the bloke in charge of a football team that has performed as woefully as we have over the last couple of years is not someone you would want back on the board.  We've had Beck who was in charge of recruiting and most of us have called for his head, and Danny's head - why wouldn't you say the same for Welsh?

The whole lot of them suck, including Casey, but we don't have many choices here unfortunately.  But i sure as hell will not be voting for Welsh, Schwab or Casey under any circumstances. 

Froarsy, its taken me a while, but I've arrived where you've been all along.

But I've got one thing to add. As long as Casey is the dominating president he's been for the past 3 years, making every key decision on behalf of the board and the club, Wallace and Miller, Sheedy, Malthouse or Matthews, or even bringing back Graeme Richmond from the dead wont be enough to make this club the success that it should be, and having 27k+ members when you're on the bottom of the ladder justifies.

[mightytiges]

The glaring one to me in the ones who are restanding for election is Welsh.  He was football director.  Now, if you're unhappy with what's happened on the footy field 1980 - and ain't we all - wouldn't you think the bloke in charge of a football team that has performed as woefully as we have over the last couple of years is not someone you would want back on the board.  We've had Beck who was in charge of recruiting and most of us have called for his head, and Danny's head - why wouldn't you say the same for Welsh?

The whole lot of them suck, including Casey, but we don't have many choices here unfortunately.  But i sure as hell will not be voting for Welsh, Schwab or Casey under any circumstances. 

Well said froars. Any alternative lead by disgruntled ex-board members who have been there and failed before wasn't going to be and isn't much of an alternative. 

[1980]

The glaring one to me in the ones who are restanding for election is Welsh.  He was football director.  Now, if you're unhappy with what's happened on the footy field 1980 - and ain't we all - wouldn't you think the bloke in charge of a football team that has performed as woefully as we have over the last couple of years is not someone you would want back on the board.  We've had Beck who was in charge of recruiting and most of us have called for his head, and Danny's head - why wouldn't you say the same for Welsh?

The whole lot of them suck, including Casey, but we don't have many choices here unfortunately.  But i sure as hell will not be voting for Welsh, Schwab or Casey under any circumstances. 

Well said froars. Any alternative lead by disgruntled ex-board members who have been there and failed before wasn't going to be and isn't much of an alternative. 

Well now that the disgruntled ones causing all the problems wont be there anymore, I expect that Casey will be free to help the club flourish over the next 3 years. We'll see if putting all our eggs in the Casey basket will be any different in the next 3 years, to what it was in the previous 3.

[Tiger Spirit]

Look at it this way 1980, if this all goes pear shaped, you can then come and tell me how gullible I am.

[mightytiges]

By Lyall Johnson
realfooty.theage.com.au
October 22, 2004

Alternative Richmond board head Charles Macek will seek a meeting with Tigers president Clinton Casey to repeat a request that financial statements be made available without confidentiality conditions.

Macek admitted yesterday he had not met Casey in an official capacity as a challenger to the board as he only formally joined the alternative ticket a day before Casey left for an overseas holiday a month ago.

Casey is due to return today.

On top of the list of discussion topics will be the desire of the alternative ticket to get its hands on financial records without being restricted by the confidentiality clause that allows only one person to view the books and prevents that person from discussing the contents even with other members of the alternative ticket.

The alternative ticket has come under pressure from fans and members for not releasing a formal business plan or details of how it would run the club should it be elected but Macek yesterday claimed it was impossible for the group to formulate a position without seeing the books.

"You can't develop a business plan until you actually know what you are dealing with and equally, we can't magically deliver a sponsor because on what basis could we talk to someone? That's one of the great advantages of incumbency," Macek said.

http://realfooty.theage.com.au/realfooty/articles/2004/10/21/1098316786763.html?oneclick=true

[mightytiges]

Alternative Richmond board head Charles Macek will seek a meeting with Tigers president Clinton Casey to repeat a request that financial statements be made available without confidentiality conditions.

As confidentiality conditions are a standard business practice, a touch of wishful thinking there on the Alternative ticket's part.

"You can't develop a business plan until you actually know what you are dealing with and equally, we can't magically deliver a sponsor because on what basis could we talk to someone? That's one of the great advantages of incumbency," Macek said.

As recently departed board members Schwab and Welsh would have a pretty good idea what the Club are dealing with. It's not like the $2 million loss nor the recent changes within the Club have been a secret  ???.
 

[1980]

Look at it this way 1980, if this all goes pear shaped, you can then come and tell me how gullible I am.

I'm just sick of telling ppl I told you so. And I'm even more sick of believing we've turned the corner only to finish up with a wooden spoon, and then opposition supporters telling me I told you so. 20 years of this crap.

I'm going on the record. I dont think we're going to be any better off as long as Casey is there.

And as far as I'm concerned, its time for Miller to justify his reputation. He asked supporters for 3 years, he got them. He's getting another 2 now. Until we're a consistent finals side, then he's just a guy the Roos kicked out.

[Tiger Spirit]

I'm just sick of telling ppl I told you so. And I'm even more sick of believing we've turned the corner only to finish up with a wooden spoon, and then opposition supporters telling me I told you so. 20 years of this crap.

A lot of us would be in the same boat 1980.  And there’s probably been a few times over the years when many thought we had turned the corner.  Mysteriously though, just when things seemed to be travelling along ok, we somehow managed to either de-rail ourselves or just head smack bang into disaster.  Others might have seen it coming, but not us.

Anyway, you can’t continue to be so bad for so long without there being a problem right at the top.  No denying that.

But we can’t just keep making changes, whenever things go wrong, without any real plans to improve things and without getting something better in place.  Otherwise, we can keep changing things and nothing will ever change.  It’s when things go wrong that you can correct them and that’s when things can and will change.

By just changing who or what caused the problem doesn’t change anything really, if you then don’t work out how to solve the problem.  Because it will just occur again.  As we know too well.

And that’s probably why we keep making the same mistakes and never seem to get anywhere.  Because we don’t solve the problem, we just get rid of who caused the problem in the first place.  For some reason, bringing in someone new and different seems to renew everyone’s hopes and suddenly everything’s fine again.  Even though there may not be much difference between them and the person they have just replaced.  And even though nothing has been done to resolve the issue that hasn’t gone away.  But just because someone new has taken over everything suddenly seems to have been smoothed over.

The other problem that this “problem solving” approach has caused too is that those at the top have rarely been held accountable, because they have always made short-term, quick fix decisions such as these to get themselves off the hook.  Whether it was intended that way or not doesn’t really matter.  The effect is the same.

I'm going on the record. I dont think we're going to be any better off as long as Casey is there.

Your concern seems to be that Casey isn’t accountable for what’s happened.  But until we have an election every year then, regardless of who is there, they will continue to get off the hook and be unaccountable.  The way to have an accountable Board/Administration is by members having their say each year, at election time.  It’s really that simple.  Maybe too simple for people to think it will actually solve or change anything.

[Tiger Spirit]

The alternative ticket has come under pressure from fans and members for not releasing a formal business plan or details of how it would run the club should it be elected but Macek yesterday claimed it was impossible for the group to formulate a position without seeing the books.

"You can't develop a business plan until you actually know what you are dealing with and equally, we can't magically deliver a sponsor because on what basis could we talk to someone? That's one of the great advantages of incumbency," Macek said.

 

How can they tell us we are in financial dire straits one moment and the next say they don’t know what the situation really is?

Which is it?  They do or they don’t know?  And if they don’t know then on what basis are they doing this when they originally started out by telling us they were concerned about our viability and were out to come save RFC?  So you have to wonder whether they exaggerated our financial position just to stir things up and put doubt in supporters’ minds.

If that’s the case and the only way they believe they can get people on-side is through scare mongering then what is their real motivation for any of this and what do they really have to offer?

Not like we don’t already know or anything.

[Fwoy3]

Perhaps the circle will be complete...John Howard, George Bush and Clinton Casey all remain in office, because there is really no viable or valuable opposition out there...

[WilliamPowell]

Perhaps the circle will be complete...John Howard, George Bush and Clinton Casey all remain in office, because there is really no viable or valuable opposition out there...

  very good Fwoy

And we can have Charles Macek doing a John Kerry saying I wish I could just wrap my arms around you all  and give you a big hug

 

[WilliamPowell]

How can they tell us we are in financial dire straits one moment and the next say they don’t know what the situation really is?

Easy it depends which way the winds blowing on a particular day  or you simply say whatever makes you look like you have no idea with some sort of hope that it may score you a vote

Which is it?  They do or they don’t know? 

Is this a trick question  or do you have any other options

[Tiger Spirit]

Which is it?  They do or they don’t know?

Is this a trick question or do you have any other options

Sorry WP, you’re right. 

I left off the most relevant and obvious option, which is, “we have absolutely no (expletive deleted) idea, never have really.  Not that that stops us”.

[WilliamPowell]

I left off the most relevant and obvious option, which is, “we have absolutely no (expletive deleted) idea, never have really.  Not that that stops us”.

And that is their whole problem in a nutshell TS and it has alienated me from the ticket since day one. Their arguements (for want of a better term) fall flat at best and are down right embarassing at worse. We had them say the Club's a financial basket case one minute, they have to administer "strong medicine" (Schwab's words not mine) the next. Shuffle along a bit further and we get the latest gem that you highlighted....

"You can't develop a business plan until you actually know what you are dealing with and equally, we can't magically deliver a sponsor because on what basis could we talk to someone? That's one of the great advantages of incumbency," Macek said.

Well at the very beginning Schwab said their ticket knew what was wrong and you would hope as a former board member he (and Welsh) would know because they were part of and privvy to what was going on and for anyone to argue that they didn't it laughable because Schwab's reasoning for leaving the board was because he had "concerns". Guess what to have "concerns" you would assume it is because someone isn't happy with what one is seeing. You can't have it both ways.

Now we are being fed we cannot come with a plan until "we see the books" . What a crock of cow dung  .

They flip, they flop, they contridict and they embarass our Club and you know what after  putting up with 20 years of crap and all that's come along with it I sick to death of this Club being embarassed by people with egos bigger than MCG

[mightytiges]

By just changing who or what caused the problem doesn’t change anything really, if you then don’t work out how to solve the problem.  Because it will just occur again.  As we know too well.

And that’s probably why we keep making the same mistakes and never seem to get anywhere.  Because we don’t solve the problem, we just get rid of who caused the problem in the first place.  For some reason, bringing in someone new and different seems to renew everyone’s hopes and suddenly everything’s fine again.  Even though there may not be much difference between them and the person they have just replaced.  And even though nothing has been done to resolve the issue that hasn’t gone away.  But just because someone new has taken over everything suddenly seems to have been smoothed over.

Well said TS. You just have to look at the number of times "outside influcences" have put pressure on the Club to cave in to their wishes to do this, do that, sack the coach, etc... It's these outside influences, who hold no official office in the Club yet are still able to have a huge say in what happens, that have been and are the cancer at Richmond and if this situation were to continue then nothing will change no matter whoever wins this or any future election. That's why I don't and never will believe not removing that stupid clause in Spud's contract was a mistake despite putting up for one more year with the pain of watching crap footy and listening to coach cliche trying to explain and defend it. In the end the reward for not caving in was Wallace putting his hand up to coach. For the Club's sake of getting out of this abyss of mediocrity and back onto a path towards success, we couldn't and can't have it being held to ransom.