Author Topic: Caronavirus - COVID 19  (Read 82138 times)

Offline 1965

  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 5578
  • Don't water the rocks
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #195 on: September 09, 2020, 04:27:28 PM »



531 Victorians have lost their lives in federally funded and regulated aged care homes.


A better regulated system would have seen most of those lives saved.


Morrison and Colbeck could have saved a lot of those lives. FACT.



Online Francois Jackson

  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 13557
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #196 on: September 10, 2020, 06:42:58 PM »
Currently a member of the Roupies, and employed by the great man Roup.

Online Francois Jackson

  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 13557
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #197 on: September 11, 2020, 02:10:13 PM »
Sorry WP, but that is a load of garbage. People are affected here (covid, small business, mental health etc) so anyone and everyone has a right to pass judgement should they wish to.

I wish you would take your own advice, because let me tell you if it was say abbott in charge of Victoria locking up those Flemington towers as an example you would be numero on here complaining about human rights. Your posts earlier this year when you and others couldn't help yourselves having a go at Scomo, is exactly what im talking about.

This is about having accountability like any CEO of any business in this country

Andrews team and their decisions have caused 600 deaths.  It's actually that simple and he will ultimately he be held to account and will resign IMO.



Thank you Frank for reminding me why I don't post in these threads anymore and for not actually bothering to take in what i was saying...

I am not going to try and explain myself, defend myself for having an opinion because I don't need the attacks, character assassinations that i have copped over the journey in these threads. (that is over the 363 pages of the politics thread and the 13 pages here)

thanks again  :thumbsup

Please WP, give me a break.. Its only personal when you cant reply in a dignified manner. Like i said i can guarantee if the shoe was on the other foot you wouldnt be taking a back step, and the proof is in the pudding. You also wouldnt be alone.

Nothing personal. Just being factual. We all have biases.

Currently a member of the Roupies, and employed by the great man Roup.

Online Francois Jackson

  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 13557
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #198 on: September 11, 2020, 02:12:23 PM »
shambles.

https://www.theage.com.au/national/health-officials-shut-sutton-out-of-top-pandemic-response-20200910-p55u91.html


Health officials shut Sutton out of top pandemic response

Health bureaucrats stopped Victorian Chief Health Officer Brett Sutton taking control of the state’s coronavirus response against his wishes and in contradiction to the state’s own pandemic plan.

The revelation came during Victoria's hotel quarantine inquiry on Thursday, as senior health bureaucrats warned that the Andrews government's failure to consult Professor Sutton on critical decisions about infection control had undermined the government's pandemic response.

The inquiry heard that Health Department deputy secretary Melissa Skilbeck advised her department secretary that Professor Sutton would be too busy in his lead advisory role and as the public face of the pandemic response to also serve as state controller.

Professor Sutton didn't agree with the decision, the inquiry was told.

Coronavirus updates LIVE: Victoria records 43 COVID-19 as Brett Sutton's role as CHO called into question; NSW hospital cluster grows as Australian death toll jumps to 797
Add to shortlist
"Would it be fair to say that he was against that decision?" counsel assisting the inquiry Ben Ihle asked Ms Skilbeck.

"Yes, he was," Ms Skilbeck replied.

The Age and The Sydney Morning Herald have previously revealed that under Victoria's plan for an influenza pandemic, the chief health officer should assume the role of state controller and "overall responsibility for emergency response operations".

Speaking about the state's pandemic response last month, Premier Daniel Andrews said: "I wouldn't want anyone to assume that anyone had made an active decision that Brett should be doing certain things." He added that Professor Sutton was central to the state's pandemic response.

Ms Skilbeck, in a statement tendered to the inquiry, said the state controller position was "twinned" by department emergency management officials Andrea Spiteri and Jason Helps.

Ms Skilbeck said this reflected the cross-departmental planning required, the size and complexity of the response to the pandemic and "the significant demands on the time of the CHO" to communicate with the public.

Coronavirus - what can Victorians do in lockdown?
The main dos and dont's as Melbourne struggles toward the end of COVID lockdown. And remember this is all dependent on the case numbers being right...

Professor Sutton did not respond to attempts to contact him on Thursday night. A DHHS spokesperson said Victoria's response to the pandemic was being led by Professor Sutton.

"The Chief Health Officer has extensive responsibilities for providing public health advice to inform critical decisions of the Victorian government and holds a number of important statutory functions, including the making of directions, in consultation with the Deputy Chief Health Officer," the statement said.

Senior health officials told the inquiry that the sidelining of Professor Sutton on crucial matters such as hotel quarantine and Melbourne's curfew had hampered its handling of the pandemic.

Dr Finn Romanes, a senior medical adviser appointed to the position of Public Health Commander, said in his tendered statement that if Professor Sutton had been made state controller, "public health expertise may have been more embedded in the governance of the hotel quarantine program".

Professor John Mathews, a former national deputy chief medical officer, told The Age and Herald that Professor Sutton's advice had not been sufficiently sought by government throughout the pandemic.

“One of the reasons Victoria has found itself in trouble is because the chief health officer’s advice wasn’t sought when they were making key decisions like about hotel quarantine in Victoria,” Professor Mathews said. “Unfortunately, the lowest common denominator prevailed.”

Professor Mathews, who co-wrote a report warning the Commonwealth of the impending threat of a pandemic while he was deputy chief medical officer in 2004, suspects Professor Sutton's advice may not have been taken seriously enough at the start of the pandemic.

“Before this emergency happened, the chief health officer in Victoria was not at senior enough level to really have the ear of the premier,” the respected epidemiologist said. “He’s obviously got the ear of the Premier now, but only because everyone has realised the magnitude of the problem.”

Another former senior Victorian health official with knowledge of the state's emergency response systems, who commented on the condition of anonymity, also queried why the Andrews government had failed to put Professor Sutton in charge.

'If Victoria’s own chief health officer isn’t involved in hotel quarantine and he's not involved in the curfew, then who is?'

Former DHHS senior bureaucrat
"The chief health officer for many years has just been the voice of authority there. [Queensland Chief Health Officer] Jeanette Young stands up and everybody else stands back. I suspect that's probably greatly helped their response. If Victoria’s own chief health officer isn’t involved in hotel quarantine and he's not involved in the curfew, then who is?”

Criticism of the sidelining of the Chief Health Officer comes amid a furore over the imposition of a night-time stay-at-home direction on Melburnians.

Professor Sutton confirmed the curfew was not a consequence of his public health advice. The Premier said the decision was made to make enforcement easier, but Police Commissioner Shane Patton said police had not requested the measure either.


Professor Sutton also confirmed it was not his decision to put security guards in charge of Melbourne's high-risk quarantine hotels, which led to outbreaks at the Stamford Plaza and the Rydges.

The inquiry was also told on Thursday that before June 23, on a date that wasn't stipulated in the hearing, that Australia's Chief Medical Officer, Brendan Murphy, offered the use of defence personnel in lieu of private security to Professor Sutton.

Victoria abandoned pandemic plan by failing to put Sutton in key role

Other senior health officials The Age and Herald spoke to noted that during previous public crises, such as bushfires, the state emergency commissioner was always the central figure in the public response, while in the pandemic, Premier Daniel Andrews had played the leading role in public messaging.

“The ministers and premiers slot around them and the chain of command is very, very clear,” a former senior health bureaucrat said.

Ms Skilbeck told the inquiry that regardless of who the state controller was, the decisions of the chief health officer could not be "second-guessed and cannot be overridden by the state controller".

Governance issues in Victoria’s Health Department and multiple restructures in DHHS in recent years were also blamed for its pandemic response falling short. Years of chronic underfunding and failures in its contact tracing system were also cited as major shortcomings.

Professor Mathews said that while he thought Professor Sutton was doing an exemplary job, he had been “pulled in to deal with the pandemic and find solutions to problems he had not created”.

“The basic problem is that the way the health system has evolved is that government bureaucracy has tried to de-medicalise it as much as possible,” he said.

"The medically qualified people are not the ones who make the funding or executive decisions. In one sense it is a good thing. But on the other hand, when you really need that expert advice and it's not acted upon sufficiently, governments can find themselves in trouble."

Terry Slevin, head of the Public Health Association of Australia, said the pandemic had exposed weaknesses in Victoria’s public health capabilities.

Underfunding of public health was not unique to Victoria, he said, adding the issue had grown over decades and under successive governments, as preventive health initiatives often struggled to get funding over what were seen as more urgent issues, such as pledges for new hospital wards and beds.

Professor Slevin said it was not clear how large Australia’s public health workforce was, and called for a full investigation into the sector’s capacity.

The association also wants a national approach to contact tracing, through a new body similar to the United States' Centres for Disease Control and Prevention.

“We have to be ready for this next time, because there’s likely to be a next time,” Professor Slevin said.

David Davis, former health minister for the Baillieu and Napthine governments, said he had heard from up to a dozen staff in Victoria’s public health team, complaining their advice was being ignored.

“I’m hearing very clear indications that the public health team has been bypassed with a lot of these decisions made over in the premier’s office,” he said. “The knowledgeable people in the public health team have often been ignored and decisions come out from the bunker.”

In other evidence to the inquiry, Ms Skilbeck said it was not possible to have "nil risk" in an environment where coronavirus existed, such as hotel quarantine.

Asked if there was anything tangible "we can hang out hats on" to determine what went wrong in hotel quarantine, Ms Skilbeck said: "I have to say, counsel, if I knew something tangible to hang our hat on there, we would have acted on it by now.

"Clearly [the outbreaks] were contrary to the intent of everyone involved."

A Victorian Department of Health spokeswoman rejected claims that the state's response to the pandemic was not being led by Professor Sutton.

"The Chief Health Officer has extensive responsibilities for providing public health advice to inform critical decisions of the Victorian Government and holds a number of important statutory functions including the making of directions, in consultation with the deputy chief health officer," she said.

"As a member of the Australian Health Protection Principal Committee – which meets regularly – the Chief Health Officer also has a significant role in forming and advising on the national pandemic response."

Currently a member of the Roupies, and employed by the great man Roup.

Offline 1965

  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 5578
  • Don't water the rocks
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #199 on: September 11, 2020, 02:14:24 PM »
Definitely Dictator Dan's fault. He has to go and go now.

Online WilliamPowell

  • Administrator
  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 39034
  • Better to ignore a fool than encourage one
    • One Eyed Richmond
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #200 on: September 11, 2020, 04:42:48 PM »

Please WP, give me a break.. Its only personal when you cant reply in a dignified manner. Like i said i can guarantee if the shoe was on the other foot you wouldnt be taking a back step, and the proof is in the pudding. You also wouldnt be alone.

Nothing personal. Just being factual. We all have biases.

where exactly did I not reply in a "dignified manner"?  :huh3 you were the one who referred to my post as "garbage" and then proceeded to tell me what you believed I would be doing / saying

I have always tried at all times not to get personal, attack people even when I've copped it. And TBH I know I have achieved that the majority of the time if not all of the time

Finally, I have tried to give my reasons why I no longer post on these threads without publicly potting posters.

I apologise if you think I've taken aim at you but your post just reinforced to me; it is better I stay away form these and keep my opinions to myself and avoid the whacks
"Oh yes I am a dreamer, I still see us flying high!"

from the song "Don't Walk Away" by Pat Benatar 1988 (Wide Awake In Dreamland)

Online Hard Roar Tiger

  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 7591
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #201 on: September 27, 2020, 02:56:37 PM »
Definitely Dictator Dan's fault. He has to go and go now.

I’ve always thought that “barracking” for a political party is as dangerous as being a religious zealot. In both cases, blindly following a leader will inevitably lead you off a cliff albeit in formation.

The leadership of Dan Andrews through this pandemic a highlighted how dangerous this political zealotry is proving to be here in Victoria.

The source of our current problem has been linked to those vital quarantine cases.
The secondary issues are in aged care.

The source behind the hotel quarantine protocols put in place relate directly to the DPC office and the strength of character these people have to stand up to their boss.

Our problem isn’t Labour nor is it Liberal, it’s the man in charge and his ego.

I feel angry and blindsided that in a modern democracy we appear to have no lever for intervention when it is so clear our leadership has been culpable in the discharge of their responsibilities.

I was completely gob smacked that Health Minister despite doing the right thing and resigning still felt the need to point out she was somehow being mistreated in all of this.

Victoria’s politicians need to start understanding that they are entitled to nothin by taking the office except the privilege of being in a position of power.
If they abuse that privilege then there should be ramifications - apparently this has been lost on all of them.
“I find it nearly impossible to make those judgments, but he is certainly up there with the really important ones, he is certainly up there with the Francis Bourkes and the Royce Harts and the Kevin Bartlett and the Kevin Sheedys, there is no doubt about that,” Balme said.

Offline 1965

  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 5578
  • Don't water the rocks
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #202 on: September 29, 2020, 05:36:29 PM »
The Feds finally admit some responsibility for the deaths in Federally regulated and funded age care homes.


https://www.theage.com.au/national/coronavirus-updates-live-inquiry-blames-hotel-quarantine-for-deaths-just-five-local-cases-in-australia-world-approaches-1-million-deaths-20200929-p5604p.html (go to 2:56pm)



Health Department Secretary Brendan Murphy has conceded the federal government could have acted faster to contain the deadly spread of COVID-19 through Victoria's aged care facilities.


Asked at a COVID-19 Senate inquiry hearing if the more than 600 deaths in the sector during the state's second wave had been preventable, Professor Murphy said the Commonwealth-led Victorian Aged Care Response Centre could have been activated sooner.


"With the benefit of hindsight, responding with a response centre a little bit earlier, we would have been able to prevent some of the spread [and] respond better," he said, recalling "those particularly devastating weeks where two facilities lost their entire workforces."


Online Chuck17

  • The Shaun Grugg of OER
  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 13176
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #203 on: September 30, 2020, 08:57:23 AM »
good old eagle eye hindsight, coulda, woulda, shoulda

Offline 1965

  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 5578
  • Don't water the rocks
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #204 on: October 02, 2020, 04:12:48 AM »
Colbeck has to go. Morrison should take responsibility and apologise for causing the deaths of so many in aged care homes in Victoria and NSW.


https://www.theage.com.au/national/royal-commission-demands-additional-staff-in-aged-care-immediately-20200930-p560l6.html


The aged care royal commission has called on the federal government to immediately fund additional staff in aged care facilities, and has criticised the government's lack of a dedicated plan or clear leadership which left families and facilities wondering who was in charge.


Offline 1965

  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 5578
  • Don't water the rocks
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #205 on: October 07, 2020, 09:23:51 PM »
Wow


https://www.news.com.au/finance/work/leaders/coronavirus-australia-prime-minister-scott-morrison-accused-of-failing-on-aged-care-on-abcs-730/news-story/c2bd69ded9c4faca39564a6259ac7453


Sales told Mr Morrison that three-quarters of Australia’s COVID-19 fatalities – a total of 673 people – had been linked to aged care facilities, which are the responsibility of the federal government, and demanded to know how the government managed to “fail so comprehensively to prevent this tragedy?”

Offline 1965

  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 5578
  • Don't water the rocks
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #206 on: October 11, 2020, 07:01:55 PM »



Even after all the deaths that Colbeck and Morrison are responsible for.


https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/big-trouble-no-clear-plan-to-prevent-another-nursing-home-disaster-20201010-p563u7.html


Senior doctors charged with responding to Victoria’s deadly nursing home clusters have warned there is no clear plan to counter another wave of coronavirus in aged care, risking a repeat of the crisis that left 646 residents dead and others without food or water.

Online Chuck17

  • The Shaun Grugg of OER
  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 13176
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #207 on: October 11, 2020, 08:32:54 PM »
No they aren’t

Offline 1965

  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 5578
  • Don't water the rocks
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #208 on: October 20, 2020, 04:50:34 PM »
A fair assessment of what Victorians have done.


https://www.news.com.au/world/coronavirus/australia/coronavirus-victoria-melbourne-makes-world-history-crushing-second-wave/news-story/8551d1e094b8ef0ddcd706db631f3a0e



Melbourne has endured one of the longest COVID-19 lockdowns in the world and finally, an end is in sight.


Debate will rage for decades over what worked, whether it was too long or whether the price in terms of jobs or unemployment was too high.


After 100 days confined to their homes and ordered not to leave for more than two hours of daily exercise – it started as a one hour limit – Victorians have lived a grim existence that few Australians outside of the state can understand.


But by enduring it and sticking to the plan, have Victorians also made history as one of the only cities across the globe to bring a second wave of coronavirus under control and return daily case numbers to zero?

Online Andyy

  • RFC Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 8941
Re: Caronavirus - COVID 19
« Reply #209 on: October 21, 2020, 09:11:56 AM »
Re: last paragraph.

Look at the UK and France. Yes we have.

The real question is - will we have a 3rd wave before a viable vaccine is available?

Because there is no way Vic will lockdown like this again.