Author Topic: Tiges vs Dees - Fight for 2014 flag? (Canberra Times)  (Read 1098 times)

Offline one-eyed

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Tiges vs Dees - Fight for 2014 flag? (Canberra Times)
« on: June 25, 2011, 12:22:14 AM »
Fight for 2014 flag?
GARY LYON
25 Jun, 2011


WHILE today's game between Richmond and Melbourne, rightfully, assumes massive importance in the context of this season's race to the finals, the bigger, more important question that needs to be debated is which of these two promising, on the rise outfits is closest to genuinely challenging for that elusive premiership.

For the Tigers, September action has been a largely foreign concept. Two finals campaigns in 28 years has been an indictment on a proud football club that had delivered five premierships to their army of supporters in a glorious 14-year stretch between 1967 and 1980.

The Demons have not been much better. Granted, they have been reasonably successful in finding their way to the serious end of the year, having participated in 12 finals series in the past 24 years, including two grand finals, but their premiership drought extends to 1964. For a team that celebrated six premierships in 10 years under Norm Smith, from 1955 to 1964, coming up 50 years since their last flag is enormously disappointing.

So it is little wonder that Richmond versus Melbourne on a Saturday afternoon at the MCG, with each team well placed to once again become a genuine contender, has generated such enormous interest and expectation.

But while finals are very much in the frame for both teams, a legitimate tilt at a premiership would still appear to be a couple of years off. So, using 2014 as the year where the lists of these two young teams are best placed to make the move from ''potential'' to ''challenger'', who is ahead in the race right now?

DEFENCE

The Demons' back six, on what we have seen, appears a little stronger. James Frawley has an All-Australian to his name, Jared Rivers has recaptured his NAB Rising Star form, Jack Grimes is a potential club captain and Luke Tapscott shapes as a 150-200-game player.

For Richmond, Dylan Grimes took some giant steps forward before his hamstring injury, Alex Rance has resurrected his career and Reece Conca is every bit as promising as Tapscott. Chris Newman is a beauty, but will be 32 by then. Bachar Houli can be expected to continue to improve.

Verdict: Melbourne, just.

MIDFIELD

This is the area where both clubs are beautifully placed. Richmond's Brett Deledio (pick 1), Trent Cotchin (pick 3) and Dustin Martin (pick 3) form the nucleus of the most potentially devastating midfield in the competition. The flexibility and versatility of all three players is something to behold, with each of them capable of hitting the scoreboard and Deledio having proved he can be an elite rebounding defender.

Shaun Grigg is a prolific ball winner, Nathan Foley a best-and-fairest winner, and Robin Nahas, Daniel Jackson and Matt White provide impressive depth.

Demons Tom Scully (pick 1) and Jack Trengove (pick 2) have left no one in any doubt they will be in the elite bracket of midfielders within 12 months. Jordie McKenzie is rated enormously highly at Melbourne, Jordan Gysberts continues to find the football and there are big expectations for young Sam Blease.

Brent Moloney and Colin Sylvia will both be pushing 30 and their best footy may be behind them but, if their bodies stand up, they will continue to be important contributors. Jack Viney, the father-son selection courtesy of former great Todd, gives every indication he will be an outstanding replacement for both, as a ferocious, inside competitor.

Verdict: Richmond, just.

RUCKS

Max Gawn is being groomed to take the role from Mark Jamar at Melbourne and, in a couple of years, should be the legitimate No. 1 man. Jamar provides plenty as a ''power forward'' and, given the rate of development of Stefan Martin, he could be anything.

I love the heart and work ethic of big Tiger Andrew Browne and Tyrone Vickery may be the most improved player in the competition. Vickery, however, may be more ''forward'' than ruck.

Verdict: Melbourne.

FORWARDS

Tiger Jack Riewoldt is the standout in both teams. For Melbourne, Jack Watts, Liam Jurrah and Jamar look capable on paper, but as yet haven't got the score on the board, while there is plenty to like about Jeremy Howe and Lucas Cook.

A genuine, small crumbing forward is a priority in the coming drafts. If Vickery spends more time forward then Richmond is well served in the key posts.

Ben Griffiths and Jayden Post have shown glimpses, and certainly have the right frames and athleticism and there is genuine hope that in a couple of years they will settle in key positions, whether back or forward.

King provides defensive pressure and ''grunt'' in the small forward role, so important in the modern game.

Verdict: Richmond.

DEPTH/TRADEABILITY

Melbourne will monitor closely the performance of Aaron Davey, Nathan Jones, Lynden Dunn, Ricky Petterd, Addam Maric, Matthew Warnock, Matthew Bate, Jack Fitzpatrick, Neville Jetta, Rohan Bail and Clint Bartram.

Richmond has David Astbury, Daniel Connors, David Goudis, Luke McGuane, Mitch Farmer, Ben Nason, Mitch Morton, Jeromey Webberley, Tom Hislop and Matt Dea.

Verdict: Melbourne.

CONCLUSION

T he unknown, of course, is how well the teams perform at the three national drafts before the 2014 season begins, once again underscoring the enormous importance that recruiters assume within a club structure.

Granted, I may be more familiar with the Melbourne list, but having spent considerable time on this exercise I believe that the Demons are ahead in the race for that next elusive premiership.

Richmond's three elite midfielders - Cotchin, Martin and Deledio - along with Riewoldt, its Coleman Medal full-forward, puts it ahead in the ''elite'' stakes, but the Melbourne depth, going forward, gets them the points.

With 14 first-round picks at Melbourne, as opposed to six at Richmond, it suggests the potential for significant improvement is in favour of the Demons, although picks don't necessarily translate to results.

There may also be more currency in the Melbourne list at the draft table if the Demons decide to get aggressive in coming years, with Greater Western Sydney looking to build its list.

The good news is that both clubs have once again become relevant in the competition, and while it may be a long shot, another Saturday meeting between these two teams on a sunny afternoon at the MCG on the final weekend of the 2014 season would be a dream come true for their long-suffering, but faithful supporters.

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/news/national/national/sport/fight-for-2014-flag/2206550.aspx?storypage=0

Hellenic Tiger

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Re: Tiges vs Dees - Fight for 2014 flag? (Canberra Times)
« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2011, 12:31:02 AM »
A bit premature to be honest in 2014. Rivalry could develop into a Hawthorn Essendon 80's type on field rivalry if both clubs make all the right moves. Still a long way to go. I feel the development of Gold Coast and GWS will have a big say on proceedings in the not too distant future also that may hinder a few Vic Clubs like us who are climbing from the rubble caused by previous lacklustre unrealistic and self indulgent regimes .

Offline WA Tiger

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Re: Tiges vs Dees - Fight for 2014 flag? (Canberra Times)
« Reply #2 on: June 25, 2011, 12:37:48 AM »
14 first round picks at Melbourne.....WTF...
DIMMA - You will be held ACCOUNTABLE...

“We are really excited about what we have brought in. We have got great depth of players that can take us where we need to go. We are just putting some cream on the top at the moment,” he said.

"Rucks:
Shaun Hampson is the No.1 man"

Hellenic Tiger

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Re: Tiges vs Dees - Fight for 2014 flag? (Canberra Times)
« Reply #3 on: June 25, 2011, 12:57:05 AM »
Unlike us WAT who under Frawley traded pick 2 for Kane Johnson and yet under Spud and Wallace and what comes to mind.

1999 Fiora
2000 Pettifer
2001 topped up and earliest pick was 33 with Rodan
2002 Schulz
2003 Alex Gimour at 21 Tom Roach Father and son at 37 our first two picks Jacko at 53. Tucky went somewhere like 75 that year from West Adelaide.
2004 Deledio Tambling Meyer Pattison
2005 JON at 8 Cleve Hughes at 24
2006 Jack at 13
2007 Cotch at 2 McMahon at 19
2008 Vickery at 8
So there is the evidence that Melbourne have more first rounders than us and the holes that first Spud and then the Wallace/ Miller regime have left us to fill. Most clubs would have more first rounders than us.

Hellenic Tiger

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Re: Tiges vs Dees - Fight for 2014 flag? (Canberra Times)
« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2011, 01:16:14 AM »
For the record Melbourne first rounders still on their list are.
Thats 13 by my reckoning.

Colin Sylvia 2003
Matthew Bate at 13 Lynden Dunn 15 2004
Nathan Jones 2005
James Frawley 2006
Cale Morton at 4 Jack Grimes at 14 2007
Jack Watts 1  Sam Blease priority 2008
Tom Scully 1 Jack Trengove 2 Jordan Gysberts 11 2009
Lucas Cook at 12 2010

 

Compare that to us
Reece Conca at 6 2010
Dustin Martin at 3 2009
Tyrone Vickery at 8 2008
Trent Cotchin at 2  2007
Jack Riewoldt at 13 2006
Brett Deledio at 1 2004

I still think we have the better list. Players like Dunn and Bate are in and out of the side over time and have been around for a long time and haven't reached 100 games yet. They still have their list cloggers. So statistically yes they have more first rounders than us but ours are getting games every week some of there's aren't regulars yet are list cloggers or have still yet to play their first game.

Offline mightytiges

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Re: Tiges vs Dees - Fight for 2014 flag? (Canberra Times)
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2011, 02:15:51 AM »
Rance was selected with a end of first round priority pick in 2007 (pick 18) so if Blease is counted as a first rounder by Lyon then Alex should too.

For me it's no coincidence our main core of talent are our first rounders (thanks to FJ and the recruiting dept.)
FB:    Rance   
CHB: 
Mids: Lids, Martin, Cotch, Conca
CHF:    Vickery
FF:      Riewoldt
R:

And we'll add another in 5 months time.

The Dees have more because they didn't win more than 4 games when they were on the bottom of the ladder 3 years running and so gained priority picks.
All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be - Pink Floyd

Offline Judge Roughneck

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Re: Tiges vs Dees - Fight for 2014 flag? (Canberra Times)
« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2011, 02:43:22 AM »
Grigg. Batchelor. Early picks too in respective draft.

Moore. Grimes. Nahas. King. Foley. Browne fair splatting.

All almost best 18/22



Rance was selected with a end of first round priority pick in 2007 (pick 18) so if Blease is counted as a first rounder by Lyon then Alex should too.

For me it's no coincidence our main core of talent are our first rounders (thanks to FJ and the recruiting dept.)
FB:    Rance   
CHB: 
Mids: Lids, Martin, Cotch, Conca
CHF:    Vickery
FF:      Riewoldt
R:

And we'll add another in 5 months time.

The Dees have more because they didn't win more than 4 games when they were on the bottom of the ladder 3 years running and so gained priority picks.

Offline mightytiges

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Re: Tiges vs Dees - Fight for 2014 flag? (Canberra Times)
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2011, 03:02:41 AM »
Grigg. Batchelor. Early picks too in respective draft.

Moore. Grimes. Nahas. King. Foley. Browne fair splatting.

All almost best 18/22
Yep Grigg was Carlton's pick 19 in the 2006 draft and Griffiths was pick 19 for us in 2009. Batchelor was pick 31 so he was taken in the middle of his draft group as was Astbury who was taken in the 30s the year before.

We can't count on Moore returning due to his hip injury (he was drafted as a rookie). Grimes was a PSD pick while Nahas, King and Browne were originally rookies.
All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be - Pink Floyd

Offline Eat_em_Alive

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Re: Tiges vs Dees - Fight for 2014 flag? (Canberra Times)
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2011, 07:19:29 AM »
14 first round picks at Melbourne.....WTF...

My thoughts exactly WA T  :-\
The anywhere, anytime Tigers.
E A T  E M  A L I V E  M O F O S

Offline Judge Roughneck

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Re: Tiges vs Dees - Fight for 2014 flag? (Canberra Times)
« Reply #9 on: June 25, 2011, 06:33:24 PM »
King is in our future 22 based on today's effort.