Is your AFL club in the black? (Herald-Sun)

[Ramps]

Unfortunately for as long as I can remember (and took any interest in this side of footy) we have always lagged significantly in terms of revenue and corporate/sponsorship dollar. Is this directly tied in with the fact we are perenially crapola? Winners are grinners? once we start getting sustained positive resuts will we shoot up the revenue ladder? Truth b told Would be bloody hard to sell the benefits of the organstion when we are always crap, there are only so many times you can play the sleeping giant card 

This is true and in the past the gap was wider. Its a massive concern however that we are $30 million behind Collingwood in annual revenues- how many flags have they won in the past 50 years? Its also a well known fact in footy that very few other clubs have rated our marketing team and that criticism goes back
atleast 15 years from what I can recall- and I dont think that view has really changed. So what are options- 1) is to head hunt new marketing people and see what they can do with the brand going forward- (and thats something we should do anyway) or 2) Richmond needs to start operating businesses which are seperate to the football club and away from the football club.

Good point Ramps. This was definitely the case - I remember getting a call from Richmond marketing 10 years ago selling GF tickets (the breakfast package) for $300. That was about a grand less that he quoted months earlier and this was the day before the game. Unbelievable. Whether you agree with corporate
packages or not for the GF, this was a valuable source of revenue (and one that is pretty much price inelastic if you are planned) and here we were hawking tickets like desperate scalpers.
I heard we sacked the GM of marketing last year (after being in the job less than 12 months) which is a worry. FWIW I have a mate at another very, very successful club who reckons we are a bit of an off field rabble and mentioned we might be a bit tight on the salaries in marketing. He did say Benny Gale was a great appointment. Smart cookie apparently. 

The club has to spend money to get the best people. It needs to be spent. I dont want to knock the marketing people who've worked at the club over the years but I stand by everything I have said regarding what other clubs think of our marketing over the years. We should have headhunted 1 or 2 from Collingwood and Essendon, even Norths marketing people are regarded as better operators.

[mightytiges]

As much as people can't stand Eddie and the major stuff-up over those hotels, he has done wonders at Pieland to tap into and connect with their supporter base. If a club's supporters vote with their feet and remotes it gives that club power and a voice with sponsors and especially in AFL House. It then helps when the League gives you soft draws that help you get into the finals and blockbusters that attract sponsors and bigger crowds.

Every club has its hardcore supporter base who sign up no matter what but it's the bandwagon latent supporter that boosts the coffers when they sign up. And they will only sign up when the side is winning and playing finals. People like associating with winners not losers. Too many false dawns has cost Richmond dearly. That's why the loss to Carlton in round 1 last year was so devastating. As embarrassing as it was we'll get over the on-field loss (as soon as round 1 this year hopefully). However it's the damage it did off-field that will hurt the club for at least another 3-4 years. These latent supporters poked their head out from the closet and hopped aboard all the preseason hoo-laa (86k at the game mostly Tiger supporters is proof of that) only to again see the team collapse without a whimper. Same old same old. So they head back into the closet, the AFL gives us crummy fixtures, sponsorship dollars are reduced, and as a result we remain a low revenue generating club in comparison to most other clubs. It's hard to be good at marketing when the product you're trying to sell is always a lemon  .

[dizza]

As much as people can't stand Eddie and the major stuff-up over those hotels, he has done wonders at Pieland to tap into and connect with their supporter base. If a club's supporters vote with their feet and remotes it gives that club power and a voice with sponsors and especially in AFL House. It then helps when the League gives you soft draws that help you get into the finals and blockbusters that attract sponsors and bigger crowds.

Every club has its hardcore supporter base who sign up no matter what but it's the bandwagon latent supporter that boosts the coffers when they sign up. And they will only sign up when the side is winning and playing finals. People like associating with winners not losers. Too many false dawns has cost Richmond dearly. That's why the loss to Carlton in round 1 last year was so devastating. As embarrassing as it was we'll get over the on-field loss (as soon as round 1 this year hopefully). However it's the damage it did off-field that will hurt the club for at least another 3-4 years. These latent supporters poked their head out from the closet and hopped aboard all the preseason hoo-laa (86k at the game mostly Tiger supporters is proof of that) only to again see the team collapse without a whimper. Same old same old. So they head back into the closet, the AFL gives us crummy fixtures, sponsorship dollars are reduced, and as a result we remain a low revenue generating club in comparison to most other clubs. It's hard to be good at marketing when the product you're trying to sell is always a lemon  .

exactly right. despite the fact that traditionally we are one of the powerhouse clubs, the AFL still gives us second-rate fixtures, with a ton of annoying Sunday games that have nowhere near the appeal or atmosphere of a Friday Night or Saturday Afternoon, and apart from the Thursday night Round 1 match, our only Friday night fixture is on a long weekend! add to that the fact that over half of our games are on Fox, and we have 6 matches outside the MCG or Etihad. this is hardly enticing for "fringe" fans who will only go when it will entertain them.

[yellowandback]

As much as people can't stand Eddie and the major stuff-up over those hotels, he has done wonders at Pieland to tap into and connect with their supporter base. If a club's supporters vote with their feet and remotes it gives that club power and a voice with sponsors and especially in AFL House. It then helps when the League gives you soft draws that help you get into the finals and blockbusters that attract sponsors and bigger crowds.

Every club has its hardcore supporter base who sign up no matter what but it's the bandwagon latent supporter that boosts the coffers when they sign up. And they will only sign up when the side is winning and playing finals. People like associating with winners not losers. Too many false dawns has cost Richmond dearly. That's why the loss to Carlton in round 1 last year was so devastating. As embarrassing as it was we'll get over the on-field loss (as soon as round 1 this year hopefully). However it's the damage it did off-

field that will hurt the club for at least another 3-4 years. These latent supporters poked their head out from the closet and hopped aboard all the preseason hoo-laa (86k at the game mostly Tiger supporters is proof of that) only to again see the team collapse without a whimper. Same old same old. So they head back into the closet, the AFL gives us crummy fixtures, sponsorship dollars are reduced, and as a result we remain a low revenue generating club in comparison to most other clubs. It's hard to be good at marketing when the product you're trying to sell is always a lemon  .

you are most probably right but the club has been run poorly in so many areas, including Marketing. It's hard to pin point one part of the club where we even keep pace let alone set the standard. Hawthorn were an on field shambles in the mid 90s but adapted a model whereby they set up " Becker entertainment" which took corporate hospitality beyond the AFL. That is creative thinking. Now most clubs offer that service to clients - recruit them into the club via GF packages and then "add on" with Spring Racing, tennis etc. We need to be bold in creating other avenues of revenue while we are getting our act together on field.

[Ramps]

all good points but y&b has hit the nail on the head, generating revenue outside the football club has to be a priority at Richmond. As far as I can see, not alot of that is happening.

[mightytiges]

As much as people can't stand Eddie and the major stuff-up over those hotels, he has done wonders at Pieland to tap into and connect with their supporter base. If a club's supporters vote with their feet and remotes it gives that club power and a voice with sponsors and especially in AFL House. It then helps when the League gives you soft draws that help you get into the finals and blockbusters that attract sponsors and bigger crowds.

Every club has its hardcore supporter base who sign up no matter what but it's the bandwagon latent supporter that boosts the coffers when they sign up. And they will only sign up when the side is winning and playing finals. People like associating with winners not losers. Too many false dawns has cost Richmond dearly. That's why the loss to Carlton in round 1 last year was so devastating. As embarrassing as it was we'll get over the on-field loss (as soon as round 1 this year hopefully). However it's the damage it did off-

field that will hurt the club for at least another 3-4 years. These latent supporters poked their head out from the closet and hopped aboard all the preseason hoo-laa (86k at the game mostly Tiger supporters is proof of that) only to again see the team collapse without a whimper. Same old same old. So they head back into the closet, the AFL gives us crummy fixtures, sponsorship dollars are reduced, and as a result we remain a low revenue generating club in comparison to most other clubs. It's hard to be good at marketing when the product you're trying to sell is always a lemon  .

you are most probably right but the club has been run poorly in so many areas, including Marketing. It's hard to pin point one part of the club where we even keep pace let alone set the standard. Hawthorn were an on field shambles in the mid 90s but adapted a model whereby they set up " Becker entertainment" which took corporate hospitality beyond the AFL. That is creative thinking. Now most clubs offer that service to clients - recruit them into the club via GF packages and then "add on" with Spring Racing, tennis etc. We need to be bold in creating other avenues of revenue while we are getting our act together on field.

I totally agree we need to find sustainable new non-footy related avenues of revenue. Hopefully the plans Benny Gale was referring to at the AGM follow this line of thought.

It doesn't surprise me we are still behind on the financial front relative to other clubs. As a kid I didn't fully realise the impact the incompetent 80s admins had on our club apart from the obvious off nearing killing the club off. Once the club was saved via SOS and then we were back in the black in 1995 everything seemed fine again but we were really just surviving within our means rather than being able to run a professional football. Proof of that was our club's infrastructure hadn't changed since the 70s  . Only now are we building modern facilities to bring us up with the rest of the comp. In 1985 IIRC we made a loss of $1.5m in a single year out of a revenue base of around $2.5m - 3.0m. Well just doing the maths with our revenue now at least 10 times that amount and that year was like us now making a loss of around $15m+    . It would devastate any club long-term and kill off most. 25 years later we are still trying to catch up  .

[one-eyed]

Sydney made a loss of $750k for 2009 after missing the finals for the first time in about 7 years.

While St Kilda made an operating profit of just 177k in a year they made the grand final and won 21 games in the H/A season.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/swans-in-the-red-saints-in-the-black-20100118-mgpv.html

[smasha]

We all know what the answer to this is.

Get successful onfield and the profits will come.

More members ,better performances,=better fixtures,better sponsorship deals.

[Smokey]

We all know what the answer to this is.

Get successful onfield and the profits revenue will come.

More members ,better performances,=better fixtures,better sponsorship deals.

Edited for accuracy.  Profit is entirely dependent on the fiscal skills of the management team and board of directors in handling the amount of revenue, large or small. 

[WilliamPowell]

While St Kilda made an operating profit of just 177k in a year they made the grand final and won 21 games in the H/A season.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/swans-in-the-red-saints-in-the-black-20100118-mgpv.html

I think you may find that St Kilda made profit due to Govt grants they recevied for their new training thing down at Seaford.. 

[mightytiges]

While St Kilda made an operating profit of just 177k in a year they made the grand final and won 21 games in the H/A season.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/swans-in-the-red-saints-in-the-black-20100118-mgpv.html

I think you may find that St Kilda made profit due to Govt grants they recevied for their new training thing down at Seaford.. 

In fairness St Nick's yearly supply of boxes of tissues is quite expensive and hits their profit margin  .