AFL moves to bring 7 poor clubs including Richmond up to scratch (Herald-Sun)

[RollsRoyce]

Said it before will say it again - start winning games CONSISTENTLY and the draw will take care of itself.

This is another point you've raised before which I have HUGE issues with. Are you suggesting that the AFL should be rewarding and punishing clubs accordingly for what they achieve on the field?  Are you saying that Collingwood somehow DESERVES this favoured draw they get every year, because they've EARNT it by being successful. Conversely, do we deserve to be packed off to back to back road trips to all points of the compass, and trips to Sleepy Hollow because we lose all the time? Aside from the fact that this reduces the clubs to a bunch of little Pavlov's Dogs wagging their tails when the big, benevolent AFL rings a bell, it also assures that the status quo will never change. And if that's the case, then we as supporters might as well give in now. 

[WilliamPowell]

And you're right, I don't have a clue as to what our current bank debt is. There was a time when I used to believe that just buying my membership,going to the matches, and screaming for my team was where my responsibility to the club began and ended. Now it seems we as supporters have to understand every single facet of the organization and how it runs. What is even more confusing is, I go to the AGM every year, and for the past 7 years at least the club has announced an operating profit of varying amounts. So where the hell does this $4m debt come from? And again, I ask, instead of selling off our home games, why can't we just ask the AFL to underwrite our debt as a one-off payment? Unlike NM and the Dogs we are a club with a huge supporter base potential to create huge revenue for them comparable to their 2 pets Carlton and Collingwood, who they bend over backwards for on every conceivable occasion. It just does my head in that they consistently fail to recognize this, and just continue to give us the thin end of the wedge on so many issues.   

Our current bank debt as per the 2010 annual accounts is $4.5mil

Remember that overall we are a company that is in the black and not in the red unlike the Dogs & Roos

I have said many times a company can make a profit but it doesn't mean it is debt free. Just like you can have a strong balance sheet where your assets are great than your liabilities but it doesn't mean you dont have any debt. It is exactly the same as a person having a mortgage (debt) but still having money in their bank account (savings). Debt and profit are 2 very different things. Just like profit doesn't = cash.

As per the The Club's annual report/accounts our current bank facilities are underwritten by the AFL (as most club's are I might add). I havent got the doc with me put can post the paragraph later. What this guarantee means is that if the Bank calls in the facilities and the Club is unable to pay then the AFL will.

What you are wanting is for the AFL to pay off the entire debt - as I said that is not their responsibility, while we can manage it (which we can) then it is ours to deal with. The AFL haven't paid off the Dogs or N0rt's our any other club's debt so why should the rules for us be any different?

And just on C'wood, when they were broke; which wasn't that many years ago, they were not bailed out by the league. They turned around their situation on thier own. No $$$ handouts just a very good business plan

[WilliamPowell]

This is another point you've raised before which I have HUGE issues with. Are you suggesting that the AFL should be rewarding and punishing clubs accordingly for what they achieve on the field?  Are you saying that Collingwood somehow DESERVES this favoured draw they get every year, because they've EARNT it by being successful. Conversely, do we deserve to be packed off to back to back road trips to all points of the compass, and trips to Sleepy Hollow because we lose all the time? Aside from the fact that this reduces the clubs to a bunch of little Pavlov's Dogs wagging their tails when the big, benevolent AFL rings a bell, it also assures that the status quo will never change. And if that's the case, then we as supporters might as well give in now. 

I have said this before that one of the reason Collingwood gets the draw it gets in part because all Vic based Club's want & request to play against them in Melb to maximise their gate receipts; that is to make money. We do it just like every other club does it. Fact is all Clubs do it. Again whether people like it or not C'wood draws crowds and every club wants a piece of that pie.

Do I agree with it? NO but it is the way it is like it or not.

And BTW I stand by my comment that once we start winning on a consistent basis then will be in the same position is C'wood and that is clubs will be requesting to play us, FTA TV will want us on Friday nights and we will get the extra games at the MCG and the more favourable draw

[tony_montana]

This is another point you've raised before which I have HUGE issues with. Are you suggesting that the AFL should be rewarding and punishing clubs accordingly for what they achieve on the field?  Are you saying that Collingwood somehow DESERVES this favoured draw they get every year, because they've EARNT it by being successful. Conversely, do we deserve to be packed off to back to back road trips to all points of the compass, and trips to Sleepy Hollow because we lose all the time? Aside from the fact that this reduces the clubs to a bunch of little Pavlov's Dogs wagging their tails when the big, benevolent AFL rings a bell, it also assures that the status quo will never change. And if that's the case, then we as supporters might as well give in now. 

I have said this before that one of the reason Collingwood gets the draw it gets in part because all Vic based Club's want & request to play against them in Melb to maximise their gate receipts; that is to make money. We do it just like every other club does it. Fact is all Clubs do it. Again whether people like it or not C'wood draws crowds and every club wants a piece of that pie.

Do I agree with it? NO but it is the way it is like it or not.

And BTW I stand by my comment that once we start winning on a consistent basis then will be in the same position is C'wood and that is clubs will be requesting to play us, FTA TV will want us on Friday nights and we will get the extra games at the MCG and the more favourable draw

exactly right and is the nature of the beast. AFL gets the TV rights $$$ bc they manipulate the games exposure for the winners to get the very best bang for buck. They unashamedly do it and trot out the line "for the good of the game"

[Penelope]

the whole thing is a farce

18 teams but twenty two games to be played?

sureley not even drunks would organise a comp where you can play someone for the second time in the season proper before you have played everyone else at least once?

It's sickening.


...and now people refer to the game as AFL. 


The effers think they own the game....and they probably do.

putrid pepe le pews.

[RollsRoyce]

exactly right and is the nature of the beast. AFL gets the TV rights $$$ bc they manipulate the games exposure for the winners to get the very best bang for buck. They unashamedly do it and trot out the line "for the good of the game"

Let us all bow down and hail the mighty AFL ,whose every magnanimous gesture is for the betterment of the game and for all clubs. Oh great AFL, we are not worthy
But seriously, if they aren't going to pay off our debt, then where exactly is this equalisation money supposedly being pumped into our coffers going to be allocated?

[Loui Tufga]

But seriously, if they aren't going to pay off our debt, then where exactly is this equalisation money supposedly being pumped into our coffers going to be allocated?

A free trip to Arizona

[WilliamPowell]

But seriously, if they aren't going to pay off our debt, then where exactly is this equalisation money supposedly being pumped into our coffers going to be allocated?

Mr RFC_O answered that earlier the money being spoken about in the papers this morning is for footy dept spend

[DCrane]

There was a time when I used to believe that just buying my membership,going to the matches, and screaming for my team was where my responsibility to the club began and ended. Now it seems we as supporters have to understand every single facet of the organization and how it runs.

Great comment about football as a supporter today.

What is even more confusing is, I go to the AGM every year, and for the past 7 years at least the club has announced an operating profit of varying amounts. So where the hell does this $4m debt come from? And again, I ask, instead of selling off our home games, why can't we just ask the AFL to underwrite our debt as a one-off payment?

Rolls like you I believe the AFL has been gifted, and should share.
I'd like to see a dividend shared equally, but as we know some clubs are more equal than others. The 'less equal' clubs should all get compensated accordingly.

[RollsRoyce]

But seriously, if they aren't going to pay off our debt, then where exactly is this equalisation money supposedly being pumped into our coffers going to be allocated?

Mr RFC_O answered that earlier the money being spoken about in the papers this morning is for footy dept spend

But footy dept. spend in what area? Scouting/recruiting? extra coaches or support staff? Or maybe a war chest to appease players and keep GWS at bay? It's hard to see the AFL funding that last one.

[RollsRoyce]

Rolls like you I believe the AFL has been gifted, and should share.
I'd like to see a dividend shared equally, but as we know some clubs are more equal than others. The 'less equal' clubs should all get compensated accordingly.
[/quote]

Careful DCrane. Suggesting that the competition isn't played on a level field seems to raise the ire of many AFL apologists around here.

[one-eyed]

The AFL has been concerned for some time that the balance of the competition stands to be compromised and the effectiveness of the draft and salary cap weakened if football department spending trends become a critical point of difference.

Clubs such as Richmond and Melbourne, which have been tin-rattling and trying to rid themselves of debt on the back of the argument that success is impossible without the money to properly fund a well-rounded football operation, agree.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/sport/james-brayshaw-stands-up-for-poor-clubs-in-debate-over-afl-financial-assistance/story-e6frg7mf-1226111957706

[WilliamPowell]

But footy dept. spend in what area? Scouting/recruiting? extra coaches or support staff? Or maybe a war chest to appease players and keep GWS at bay? It's hard to see the AFL funding that last one.

Whatever area clubs like as long it is within the footy dept

Careful DCrane. Suggesting that the competition isn't played on a level field seems to raise the ire of many AFL apologists around here.

If that's whack directed at me so be it 

An "AFL Apologist" absolutely not! But a realist with regard to the "business side of footy" and how it works in 2011 absolutely.

[10 FLAGS]

Clubs shouldnt have their debts paid out for them and RFC should be better than that anyway. Where are the supposed 48000 members? It seems to me that most of the 48,000 havent donated squat to the tiger fund. I think its shameful to take this money I really do.

[RollsRoyce]

If that's whack directed at me so be it  

An "AFL Apologist" absolutely not! But a realist with regard to the "business side of footy" and how it works in 2011 absolutely.

Not you specifically WP. It's just that whenever I express my disgust at playing in a rigged competition, with the odds continually stacked against us, while the League continually bends the rules to suit their favourite money-spinners and new toys, there seems to be no end of posters here who jump on me and suggest that it's all our fault.
Maybe therein lies the problem. You see footy as a "business", and I see it as a sport. And in my view, sport should always be fair.