Steven Morris [merged]

[Willy]

Being at the game, you could actually see blues defenders rush their kicks when Morris was coming at them. His defensive pressure was immense and it won't be reflected in stats.

Having said this, he still needs to get more of the pill and reduce his FAs. But I can see what Dimma is getting at.

[potsclub]

Nah it's not meant as an excuse.  It's observational, not judgemental.  I can see the value of an intense tackler in the forward 50.  Do I think Steve Morris is the right player.  I have doubts.

Would I prefer to have a Garlett type.  Without the off-field issues, certainly.  But we don't.

Do I agree with this aspect of the gameplan.  Yes and no.  But I'll see how things pan out.  Interesting the debate on this topic on PRE where people at the ground state Morris was more effective than noted in stats/on TV.  Williams indicates something similar in the podcast and quotes stats to support that.

He has to score and help construct and at the moment isn't doing that well enough.  Though I will credit him with 1 goal even though Sam Lloyd actually kicked it.

But when one negative observer of Steve, in a separate thread, claims that the leading contested possession winner and leading clearance player on the day, despite stating that those 2 KPI's are the most important, had an inconsequential game then I question said poster's observational capability.

With you 100% here mate.
Lets see how this one pans out.
Me being at the game live, my thoughts are his pressure was impeccable. His only issue was for mine is that he kept going to ground. If he kept his feet we win by 7 or 8 goals.
His presence was definitely felt.
And for people to criticise him on what they saw on T.V is unfair as I think he had a great positive influence on the game.

  well done to Steve adapting to a role that he isn't used too. Keep up the good pressure and rewards will come.

[the claw]

 

maybe rather than listening or reading your own opinions you could listen to some facts and stats.

I get you don't like it.  That's a stuffing given, given that you sprout it ad nauseum every stuffing day.

Yes it would be great to have a Garlett or Betts or Rioli.  Last time I checked you deleted and added players to your list in October, November and early December.  I look at the calendar at its April.  We have the list we have.

In the link I provided above Mark "Wilbur" Williams discusses stats about retention, attacks, handball receives, attacks against etc.  Data that the club plans by.  Interestingly we got a better attack from defence than planned and Carlton were worse.  They were below their normal metrics.  Given that's what was discussed I'm guessing that's how the club will evaluate this.

Now this is not supporting or decrying the club or the coaching panel.  It's not apologizing for the club.  It's merely observing.  I would have thought that's a pretty simple concept to gain from the above.  Simple comprehension of the English language.

With punctuation and all....

just gotta love the excuse makers. your making excuses nothing more.
very funny all that faith in the coaches,  they are bigger excusers of mediocrity than you lot.
maybe just maybe you could make your own mind up rather than putting faith in those charlatans in charge.  sad you cant fathom excuses when they hit you in the face.

its simple a child can see morris applied no more pressure than what you would expect from any sml fwd in the game today. if i compared his performance against every single sml fwd in the comp he would hold the table up. yet he had  a very good game with the following,  wait for it !!!!!
 3 disposals, 4 tackles all of which resulted in free kicks against haaarrgghh thats great ball retention right there.   0 impact on the scoeboard but thats okay we have enough goal kickers lol., 0 kicks   no inside 50s no  goal assists wow thats great for attacking the game.  in fact most stats columns have a big fat zero in them. throw in unlike everyone else, he was playing on an ice arena falling over all day. something that is a regular thing with our steve. and you get sucked in by comments from that doyen wilbur williams talking about what was it again, that is gold. no wonder we are middling they are just as deluded as people on here.

wow he played some game  did steve yet posters cant for what ever reason concede he had a poor game.
 oh wer'e from tiger land wallowing in mediocrity, thriving on spin oh wer'e from tiger land. hhhaaarrrrggghhhh just gotta love the defenders.as stated if people cant say morris had a bad day they will never ever say he had a bad day for the simple reason you cant get much worse.

[WA Tiger]

Give up Claw, half the people supporting Morris are those that continually accept mediocre players in our team, they hang onto the hope that these players will win a Brownlow, our club has been full of them for years. When we end up with a team of players with the caliber such as the Hawks, people can then look back and say...gee those players were spuds!!!!

[Willy]

Wat and Claw, the dynamic duo!!

[WA Tiger]

Wat and Claw, the dynamic duo!!

Why? because we have different thoughts to the sheep?

[Willy]

Wat and Claw, the dynamic duo!!

Why? because we have different thoughts to the sheep?

Because you're dynamic!

So everyone who doesn't agree with you and Claw is a sheep?

[WilliamPowell]

Wat and Claw, the dynamic duo!!

Why? because we have different thoughts to the sheep?

No

Perhaps it may have something to do with the fact that simply because people have different opinions to claw's in particular, that are constantly being told they are wrong, excuse makers rather than acknowledging it is simply a difference in opinion

Personally, I thought Morris was poor on Friday night that's my opinion but I am not going to whack people and constantly say they are wrong just because they don't agree with me. It's called debating/discussing the issue

Forums are opinion based doesn't make one person right all the time or wrong.

[WA Tiger]

Wat and Claw, the dynamic duo!!

Why? because we have different thoughts to the sheep?

No

Perhaps it may have something to do with the fact that simply because people have different opinions to claw's in particular, that are constantly being told they are wrong, excuse makers rather than acknowledging it is simply a difference in opinion

Personally, I thought Morris was poor on Friday night that's my opinion but I am not going to whack people and constantly say they are wrong just because they don't agree with me. It's called debating/discussing the issue

Forums are opinion based doesn't make one person right all the time or wrong.

Yes but it goes both ways WP, lets not forget that. Claw is continually berated on this forum for having a view, albeit a very strong view. It seems a mob mentality forms and the attacks begin and then the crap starts.

Forums are opinion based so Claw is voicing his opinion. No, it doesn't make one person right all the time I agree, but it also doesn't make everyone right all the time either because the mob is formed and they attack one poster.

[WilliamPowell]

Yes but it goes both ways WP, lets not forget that. Claw is continually berated on this forum for having a view, albeit a very strong view. It seems a mob mentality forms and the attacks begin and then the crap starts.

Forums are opinion based so Claw is voicing his opinion. No, it doesn't make one person right all the time I agree, but it also doesn't make everyone right all the time either because the mob is formed and they attack one poster.

With respect WAT, the posts I've been reading are people giving balanced opinions, there is no pack, there is no crap as you put it. I haven't seen anyone berate anyone. Seen plenty of people giving an opinion though

But and using claw in this instance with the replies to the balanced comment & opinions there has been no acknowledgement of the said opinions just, some of these  , accusing posters of accepting mediocrity, snide comments like "it's simple even a child can see..." Etc ..

This is not supposed to be a whack at claw but it is incredibly frustrating to have people imply you are wrong simply because you don't share the same opinion as them and that their opinion is right no matter what. That was the point of my original reply.

[HKTiger]

Thanks WP.  Appreciate the view point.

claw so as WP says, disagreeing with you makes me an apologist for the club.  Thanks mate.  I didn't know that.  Good to know where I stand.

Now back to real observations.  Wilbur did discuss target % for playing on in defensive 50, middle of ground and forward 50.  He was clear on Morris role being key in stopping the opposition playing on in our forward 50.  That breakdown of goals conceded from playing on in our defensive 50 would be nice to know.  We've all bemoaned the sling-shot goals against.  If this stops a few of those then that cant be bad.  I wonder how far they have broken that down.  Plays on of 1st possession, plays on second possession, etc.  Given the analytical nature of the game nowadays and our coaches penchant for the NFL (one of the ultimate stats and play breakdown games) I wouldn't be surprised if we've broken it down to that level.  I.e. Stop them playing on 5 times a game on first possession in defensive 50 will stop 1 goal.  Given the way the stats were quoted I wouldn't be surprised if it is that level.  (Note to claw, the preceding paragraph is not apologizing for the club.  It's not agreeing with it or disagreeing with it.  It's just trying to analyze why they landed at a position.)

The bit that did get me in the podcast was the statement that part of Steve's job is just to lead the way and tackle and harass.  That without that sort of example the other forwards wouldn't naturally do it.  That's a concern.

Oh and by the way Shed had the most contested possessions in the game and the greatest number of clearances.  Ohh  and 7 score involvements.

[the claw]

lol he was horrid. should be dropped based on both preseason and that game.how the hell anyone can accept that sort of performance from a player is mind boggling.
ffs give a kid like butler a go in the role. he at least has footy smarts has pace lays a tackle and knows where the goals are. cant possibly do worse than that performance depite morris being harshly dealt by the umps.

when are we ever going to expect 35 -45 goals a yr from our smaller fwds.and while they kick their fair share of goals chase tackle and apply pressure its all part of the one job the last time i looked. just by kicking a few goals you make defenders accountable.
theres room for only so many limited role players better to look for well rounded players.

geez unbelievable what a win papers over with some.

Amazing what an honest post stirrs up.  i was more than happy to leave it at that but others just couldnt let it go. basically all i said was i found it amazing that some people can accept that sort of performance. why because it was such a bad performance.

i also said i thought the win papered over the bad performance for some didnt mention any names but i suppose if the shoe fits eh. yep form the posse and hang me high i dared criticise a favorite son.

[the claw]

Wat and Claw, the dynamic duo!!

Why? because we have different thoughts to the sheep?

No

Perhaps it may have something to do with the fact that simply because people have different opinions to claw's in particular, that are constantly being told they are wrong, excuse makers rather than acknowledging it is simply a difference in opinion

Personally, I thought Morris was poor on Friday night that's my opinion but I am not going to whack people and constantly say they are wrong just because they don't agree with me. It's called debating/discussing the issue

Forums are opinion based doesn't make one person right all the time or wrong.

oh cmon its not all one way.
its also patently clear there are posters who defend players for the sake of defending them.it borders on disingenuity. dont we debate footy matters because we think we are right and others are wrong. sheesh.

morris was putrid there can be no excuses for him because there are none. what else can you think when people defend that stuff. as i have said going by this week there will never ever be criticisms of morris in the future because its going to be damn hard to play worse than that.

when a player is so poor and people defend that player then damn right i think people have the blinkers on. of course im going to say they are wrong after that performance. what you want me to agree with em. basically all ive done is debate his game and ive given as good as ive copped as well. yes i do disagrre with posters on this and i will call it for what it was A GOD AWFUL GAME.

[the claw]

luke dahlhaus
22 disposals, 5 mks, 2 mks i/50, 5 i/50s, 9 tackles  , 1 goal 1 behind, kept his feet chased harassed applied pressure. must be the greatest game of all time. well certainly is when you compare it to morriss game lol.

[Lozza]

I think the issue here is that the role that Morris appears to have been given is on the surface a negative one. If our forward structures were decent enough then surely it should be an opposition defender being the kamikaze on the small forward making them nervous every time they come near. I might have to watch the replay again but I could have sworn at one point that we had the ball from broken play and Morris actually runs toward an opposition defender to prevent them involving in the next passage of play rather than running into space to make himself a target, seems a negative approach to me. Not sure of the stats but most of the small forwards i saw over the weekend did actually get to feel leather on boot, I don't believe he actually did although his one free kick most likely would have given him the one kick for the day. The other problem i see with his role is that he isn't creative either (or overly skillful), so even when he does pressure a turnover he isn't really the best person to take advantage of it so to me its almost counter productive. Anyway that's my point of view, interesting reading everyone else's take on what happened on the weekend.