Author Topic: Richmond vs W.Bulldogs @ MCG - Round 2, 2015 / Discuss loss here.  (Read 20364 times)

Offline Fluffy Tiger

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Re: Discuss loss here.
« Reply #165 on: April 13, 2015, 08:19:30 AM »
Didnt want to comment until I rewatched it this Morning. So many ponits have been made, most of which you have to agree with after a loss like that. With our abity to get the ball and the amount of possession we had we should of won.
There are several reasons we lost.

1. Skill errors. Every single player today  turned the ball over at least once. Some many more than others.
2. Wrong choices. Sometimes im not sure if our players are dumb or trying to follow some sort of team rules. Handballing to players under preasure is not smart.
3. Not taking chances. Bad kicking is bad football. Many guilty here. Again some more than others
4. Game plan. Kicking sidways and slow movement up forward.
5. Lack of leadership. Leaders change the game, ours didnt.
6. Passengers.   Which leads me to

The final point was that this game was lost at the selection committee.  Lets hope it doesnt take till middle of the year to realize the mistakes and fix them. Im sure they think they are doing the right things but they need to step back and have a good hard look .
Here , kitty kitty. Here , kitty kitty.   AAAUGH!

Offline TigerMonk

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Re: Discuss loss here.
« Reply #166 on: April 13, 2015, 10:55:56 AM »
Watching the replay just now with 2 minutes left into the 1st quarter. Wallace should have been taken out with a huge hip & shoulder by the Richmond player who l'm sure is Miles & that is the type of football that makes or breaks a game. Wallace was open & would have gone down the race if hit. If the opposition knows your going in soft they will know they can take the extra chance because your opponent is seen as weak. Those are the actions that set the day & cost games. Vlaustin also goes down the race in the last minute of the opening quarter. Seems to me that some of our players fail to read the game & are over running the ball. l see this as limited practice match in players who have been rested or not doing enough. l'm impressed with Griffiths. But we lack toughness. Also again they are missing goals that should be on the scoreboard. They are not putting scoreboard pressure on & that is killing us weekly.

Offline mightytiges

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Re: Discuss loss here.
« Reply #167 on: April 13, 2015, 11:02:51 AM »
Didnt want to comment until I rewatched it this Morning. So many ponits have been made, most of which you have to agree with after a loss like that. With our abity to get the ball and the amount of possession we had we should of won.
There are several reasons we lost.

1. Skill errors. Every single player today  turned the ball over at least once. Some many more than others.
2. Wrong choices. Sometimes im not sure if our players are dumb or trying to follow some sort of team rules. Handballing to players under preasure is not smart.
3. Not taking chances. Bad kicking is bad football. Many guilty here. Again some more than others
4. Game plan. Kicking sidways and slow movement up forward.
5. Lack of leadership. Leaders change the game, ours didnt.
6. Passengers.   Which leads me to

The final point was that this game was lost at the selection committee.  Lets hope it doesnt take till middle of the year to realize the mistakes and fix them. Im sure they think they are doing the right things but they need to step back and have a good hard look .
This. Well summed up Fluffy.

Our total lack of awareness of where opponents were was incredible  :help.

We still have too many players that are mentally soft and/or lazy. I was behind the goals on Saturday, so I had a good view of what our defenders with the ball were seeing upfield. The number of Tigers standing still or slow walking was astonishing. Either in transition (both offensively and defensively) and on the spread, Bulldog players lead us to position by 20m. It was disgraceful. It just summed up an attitude of leaving it to someone else to do the hard work and just destroyed any chance of us moving the ball quickly and directly.

On the few times we did out-flank the Dogs have someone hard running into space, the ballcarrier failed to hit the target by some margin or we would overuse the handball :banghead until we literally handed possession back to the Bulldogs. The latter was like we were trying to play too perfect football or we were just selfish and passing the buck of responsibility. Trying to avoid taking a risk to the point of ridiculous insanity :help. There were many instances but the two moments that summed up our day was ...
(i) In the 3rd quarter, we had kicked two quick goals to get back into the game and had the momentum. We won the contested ball on the members-side HF flank at the Punt Road end and sweep a chain of handballs back to the central corridor 50m out. Rather than anyone having a shot at goal, we continued handballing sideways and a Bulldog intercepted and they ran it down for a goal  :banghead.
(ii) The one already pointed out where Batch switches a long kick to outer wing. We again had the game momentum at that time. The kick doesn't hit the target and Ellis and Vlastuin ballwatch expecting the other to go for it (Ellis from memory peels off expecting Floss to get and give him the ball). Only the Doggie player goes for the ball and they get an easy goal. Another momentum killer  :banghead.

As for your point 5, Fluffy. He wasn't the only 'leader' to do it and I love Cotch as a footballer but as captain when we are 3 goals down with 8 mins to go, you can't just chip 15m sideways on a HBF. He did this twice in about a minute. I'd rather he take a risk and stuff up than just concede. It's poor body language to the rest of the team. Then there were other senior players who just produced sloppy aimless kicks out of frustration. Our leaders have to mentally much better than this. 

I hope the match review is shown a number of times. Most of the team should be totally embarrassed and ashamed by their soft, lazy and selfish 'efforts' on Saturday. 
All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be - Pink Floyd

Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Discuss loss here.
« Reply #168 on: April 13, 2015, 11:36:59 AM »
No1 complained of on field leadership last year in the back half when it was impressive. Yet I don't recall anything major Hardwick did tactically to turn our season around.

With respect Pope, I'm always questioning our leadership. Even during that run last year. I have major concerns about it, have for quite some time now. It's just on days like to day the lack of leadership shines like a beacon, unfortunately

 So who should be Captain in your opinion?

 :cheers

Have answered this many times and did so again in another thread on Saturday evening

But based solely on leadership and not current form I'd have Ivan Maric as captain. He is the best leader at our club by a long way IMESHO

I'd also throw Rance out as an option but I don't think it is a position he covets so I am not sure he'd make a good captain
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Re: Discuss loss here.
« Reply #169 on: April 13, 2015, 11:44:11 AM »
Underachieving now and certainly last 2 years.
Was 2012 overachieving or what we should expect every week?
Frankly I want 2012.
The way we played, everything. All it needed was an inexperienced team to grow into that style of play with minor adjustments and we were well on our way. Port circa 2013/14
We have lost that 2012 fluent transition mojo.
Remember the Hawks game and Dusty's 12 second coast to coast goal.
The first quarter against the Swans a fortnight earlier.
Dimma and the coaching staff have tinkered with something the was naturally superior and turned it to something that is average and occassionally better than average for fear of prolonged success.

All we are know is potentially successful and the club seems happy with that.
Do I call it fear of failure or fear of success?
I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Cotch in a nutshell.
Dusty in a nutshell.
Not knowing what to do with Lids.
Maric was on fire.
Defence was coming together nicely.

Will cost Dimma his job at some time in the next 18 months.
Back to where we were in 2012 after that.
Typical RFC. Delayed in everything on field. :help

Offline 1965

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Re: Discuss loss here.
« Reply #170 on: April 13, 2015, 11:58:11 AM »

I'd also throw Rance out as an option but I don't think it is a position he covets so I am not sure he'd make a good captain

Might help keep Rance at the club.

Can someone make the suggestion to Cotch?

 :cheers
Yeah we're already going to vote for him mate, you don't need to keep selling it.....

Offline the claw

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Re: Discuss loss here.
« Reply #171 on: April 13, 2015, 11:58:17 AM »
Didnt want to comment until I rewatched it this Morning. So many ponits have been made, most of which you have to agree with after a loss like that. With our abity to get the ball and the amount of possession we had we should of won.
There are several reasons we lost.

1. Skill errors. Every single player today  turned the ball over at least once. Some many more than others.
2. Wrong choices. Sometimes im not sure if our players are dumb or trying to follow some sort of team rules. Handballing to players under preasure is not smart.
3. Not taking chances. Bad kicking is bad football. Many guilty here. Again some more than others
4. Game plan. Kicking sidways and slow movement up forward.
5. Lack of leadership. Leaders change the game, ours didnt.
6. Passengers.   Which leads me to

The final point was that this game was lost at the selection committee.  Lets hope it doesnt take till middle of the year to realize the mistakes and fix them. Im sure they think they are doing the right things but they need to step back and have a good hard look .
we have seen this many times before
1/ down to pressure . too many have failed time and time again when its applied.
2/ ah dumb footballers again when time and space is taken away the mistakes flow. too many just dont handle pressure we have seen it time and time again.
3/ skills lots of em dont tick the boxes and its worse when you guessed it under pressure.
4/ ah everything falls to pieces when we cant play on our terms. we like bruise free footy and when it fails there is not enough talent to even go one v one.
5/ maybe we dont have leaders or maybe they are under siege.
6/ always had em and atm we always will. its one thing to complain about the quality of player in the side, but is there really enough players below who can do better and make a difference. not imo.
so i cant agree the game was lost at selection. dont think any changes would have made much difference.

Offline Lozza

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Re: Discuss loss here.
« Reply #172 on: April 13, 2015, 12:53:40 PM »
Point 4, we don't have the skill one on one i think is and has been our Achilles heels for many years. Any coach when playing against us would simply go man on man and be confident that on most occasions his players would beat ours one on one. I would have thought this would have received major focus during the off season but it would appear not. Another major area of concern is our inability to apply a tackle whereby the opposition player cannot dispose of the ball legally. We seem to allow the opposition to swivel around and then handball, again i would have though this would be an area covered during the off season. My final comment and no wonder Tiger supporters i know are bald but how many times did we have 3 or 4 Tigers and one opposition player around the attacking 50 arc and streaming through the corridor we still couldn't nail what i would think to be a standard 20-30 metre kick and hit a target. Absolute momentum killers and turn games especially in these times of quick transition. 

Offline TigerMonk

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Re: Discuss loss here.
« Reply #173 on: April 13, 2015, 12:57:12 PM »
Got to stop blaming the coach. These are basic player errors. Basic reading of the game & lack of aggression. Lack of attacking the ball. We have passengers of plenty who fail to commit themselves to win the ball. Basic kicking errors. These are the responsibility of the players.

 

Offline Willy

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Re: Discuss loss here.
« Reply #174 on: April 13, 2015, 01:17:41 PM »
Got to stop blaming the coach. These are basic player errors. Basic reading of the game & lack of aggression. Lack of attacking the ball. We have passengers of plenty who fail to commit themselves to win the ball. Basic kicking errors. These are the responsibility of the players.

No way. The coach must take some responsibility for every one of those factors you just listed. He could start by dropping players who don't commit. He's too soft, Dimma.
Geez, why pay a coach so much if he has no responsibility for what happens on field?
Yes, the players are too blame but so is the coach.

Offline eliminator

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Re: Discuss loss here.
« Reply #175 on: April 13, 2015, 04:21:46 PM »
Our lack of leadership continues to be our biggest issue IMESHO

Indictment that it was Chaplin at 3qtr time trying to fire us the troops


Biggest issues are our disposal efficiency and decision making. We badly missed Lids. The turnovers made by us were critical. We overused the ball particularly over handpassing.

Offline one-eyed

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Re: Richmond vs W.Bulldogs @ MCG - Round 2, 2015
« Reply #176 on: April 13, 2015, 10:08:03 PM »
Coaches' votes: (Hardwick & Beveridge)

9 Marcus Bontempelli (WB)
9 Alex Rance (Rich)
6 Tory Dickson (WB)
3 Rob Murphy (WB)
2 Matthew Boyd (WB)
1 Dustin Martin (Rich)

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-04-13/fyfe-flies-to-the-top

Offline eliminator

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Re: Richmond vs W.Bulldogs @ MCG - Round 2, 2015
« Reply #177 on: April 14, 2015, 06:48:26 AM »
Was a really poor performance. Our decision making and use of the ball was poor. Repeatedly we would handpass to someone under the pump. Our inability to kick a goal in the first three quarters from roving inside our forward 50 is a real worry. The Dogs used the ball better and got it out of defence far too easily. Poor team selections meant we were deficient in leg speed and critically poise. If we are to progress as a club need to take chances and stop putting games into players that are not the future of the club eg Petterd.

Offline pmac21

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Re: Richmond vs W.Bulldogs @ MCG - Round 2, 2015
« Reply #178 on: April 14, 2015, 09:08:34 AM »
Does anyone else notice that Martin get's a lot of his possession's from receiving a handball out the back rather than running to a position upfield??