Why we missed out on Treloar & others - Richmond always offer le$$ than market value for new tale

[YellowandBlackBlood]

So which list has more potential ? Richmonds or Collingwoods.
If i go by the article the other week where  the number of players taken in the first round in thier initial drafts is any thing to go by then it is pretty even.

Why has not just Treloar, but Greenwood and Adams chosen Collingwood over us, my understanding we were into all three.Surely it is not just about money.

I am not sure why people are so cut up about a player saying he thinks another clubs list has more potential to win a flag. Have a look people, the whole footy world outside of our own don't really rate us. I wonder why that is?. There really is only one way for us to gain RESPECT.

They have  had five first rounders in the last couple of years either retire become F/As or demand trades.They have basically replaced those first rounders with trades,  Out  Karnesis ret, Thomas F/A,  Beams, Freeman, Kennedy trades.  In Aish, Treloar, Adams, Greenwood.

It's about the money. Collingwood freed up a heap of cap space off loading premership players like Jolly, Luke Ball, Didak, Heath Shaw etc etc. They were then able to go and out bid us on all of these players. We have a strict payment plan we adhere to and we don't want to pay a kid a heap more than our captain and other senior players. All recent premiership clubs (Hawks and Cats) have had the same plan. None of their players are on big big money. It was one of the reasons the Hawks didn't even ever consider matching any bid on Buddy.
Now I'm not sure this will work for us but it certainly allows for a more harmonious club with players not getting annoyed that some young upstart who hasn't yet proven much is on bigger money than the best at the club.

Disagree Ball Jolly Didak and Shaw would have been on average money. Shaw actually left for a pay day. the other three were at the arse end of their careers.
Hawthorn could not match the sydney bid they were prepared to pay plenty to keep him though.  I heard as much as 850k the length of contract was the real sticking point.
Geelong were prepared to pay Ablett a massive amount and had endorsment schemes in place to supplement his wage. Im sure Dangerfield would have got just as much at Adelaide if he stayed.
Every club is in the same boat, well with  sydney and gws  the exceptions. every club is paying close to 100% of tpp including us. I would hazard a guess the pay scales at most clubs are similar.

When Treloar says he chose Collingwood because of a better chance at a premiership you can bet your bottom dollar that is what he believes. Rumour is he gets 700k a year, our offer would have been a match  or damn close,  so the difference in getting him is probably the next most important thing to a player.  That is success.He chose Collingwood because he thinks he has a better chance of success.
As we all know we are not rated in the wider footy community so why would this shock people .

Those guys at Collingwood I heard were on back ended contracts so they were on a lot of money. Heath Shaw and Didak won them that premiership that day so I doubt they would have been on peanuts even if my info is not correct. Ablett, Franklin and Dangerfield are probably close to the 3 best players in the league (especially when the deals were done). Treloar could be one of the best but is nowhere near those guys and may never be near those guys.
We were about $100K per year less than the Collingwood offer. That over a few years is a significant amount of money.
Well you can continue to believe that it wasn't for money. I will continue to believe players look at these clubs as employment and if they are seeking new employment the bottom line is still the most common reason that people change jobs.

[YellowandBlackBlood]

Collingwood won the flag in '10 and made the grand final in '11

regardless of what money the senior players were on, buckley and co. were brave to dismantle a successful team in order of future, long term success

If they win another one it may be looked at as brave. If they don't it will be stupid. They could have easily kept the best players and added to the team just like Hawthorn have been doing over the last 4 years. In 2010 they had one of the youngest teams to have won a flag for a while. It's not that they were all ready for retirement and thus should have been turfed out.

[Stalin]

Collingwood won the flag in '10 and made the grand final in '11

regardless of what money the senior players were on, buckley and co. were brave to dismantle a successful team in order of future, long term success

If they win another one it may be looked at as brave. If they don't it will be stupid. They could have easily kept the best players and added to the team just like Hawthorn have been doing over the last 4 years. In 2010 they had one of the youngest teams to have won a flag for a while. It's not that they were all ready for retirement and thus should have been turfed out.

was it stupid or were they as your mate claims " ... were at the arse end of their careers"?

cant have it both ways. for mine they are well positioned and i am rather jealous. the wallace-hardwick soft rebuild method gets you nowhere. but crappy draft picks and elimination finals

they still retain the core of the "youngest teams to have won a flag for a while.", outside of daisy the fairy

[mightytiges]

The one and only reason why Treloar went to the Pies 

Eddie knows the real story apparently

[the claw]

Collingwood won the flag in '10 and made the grand final in '11

regardless of what money the senior players were on, buckley and co. were brave to dismantle a successful team in order of future, long term success

If they win another one it may be looked at as brave. If they don't it will be stupid. They could have easily kept the best players and added to the team just like Hawthorn have been doing over the last 4 years. In 2010 they had one of the youngest teams to have won a flag for a while. It's not that they were all ready for retirement and thus should have been turfed out.

Heres a list of players Collingwood delisted/traded/retired the three yrs after their premiership.  2010  Anthony, Bartram, Blight, Cook, Corrie, Fraser, Lockyer (ret), Medhurst (ret), Obree (ret, Prestigiacomo (ret), Rusling (ret). 2011 L Brown (ret), Davis, Dick, Farmer, McCarthy, Stubbs. 2012 Buckley, Ceglar, Dawes (trade), Rounds, Tarrant (ret), Ugle, Wellingham wanted to go home trade,  Wood, Yagmoor, Tom Young.
There is just four  players who played in the premiership in 2010 who are gone by the end of 2012 Dawes, Davis,Wellingham and Leigh Brown   yet they are tracking backwards.
 The conclusion was the list they had was ageing well the top 25 players or so, and they  could take them no further.  Thus they entered into a rebuild phase.At the end of 2013 older players were delisted/retired/traded.
Didak 30yo, Johnson 32yo, Jolly 32yo, Krakouer 30yo, Russell 27yo, Shaw 29yo left for money, Thomas 26yo  r f/a who had big injury issues. plus Paine traded to brissie ,Ben  Richmond a rookie.
Up until this point what have they lost what is so wrong about what they have done since the premiership in 2010.
To me they were smart enough to see the list they had had done all it was going to do, they had no choice but rebuild and they have managed to do it without bottoming out.
They havent just willy nilly slashed players from their list 

[Stalin]

Collingwood won the flag in '10 and made the grand final in '11

regardless of what money the senior players were on, buckley and co. were brave to dismantle a successful team in order of future, long term success

If they win another one it may be looked at as brave. If they don't it will be stupid. They could have easily kept the best players and added to the team just like Hawthorn have been doing over the last 4 years. In 2010 they had one of the youngest teams to have won a flag for a while. It's not that they were all ready for retirement and thus should have been turfed out.

Heres a list of players Collingwood delisted/traded/retired the three yrs after their premiership.  2010  Anthony, Bartram, Blight, Cook, Corrie, Fraser, Lockyer (ret), Medhurst (ret), Obree (ret, Prestigiacomo (ret), Rusling (ret). 2011 L Brown (ret), Davis, Dick, Farmer, McCarthy, Stubbs. 2012 Buckley, Ceglar, Dawes (trade), Rounds, Tarrant (ret), Ugle, Wellingham wanted to go home trade,  Wood, Yagmoor, Tom Young.
There is just four  players who played in the premiership in 2010 who are gone by the end of 2012 Dawes, Davis,Wellingham and Leigh Brown   yet they are tracking backwards.
 The conclusion was the list they had was ageing well the top 25 players or so, and they  could take them no further.  Thus they entered into a rebuild phase.At the end of 2013 older players were delisted/retired/traded.
Didak 30yo, Johnson 32yo, Jolly 32yo, Krakouer 30yo, Russell 27yo, Shaw 29yo left for money, Thomas 26yo  r f/a who had big injury issues. plus Paine traded to brissie ,Ben  Richmond a rookie.
Up until this point what have they lost what is so wrong about what they have done since the premiership in 2010.
To me they were smart enough to see the list they had had done all it was going to do, they had no choice but rebuild and they have managed to do it without bottoming out.
They havent just willy nilly slashed players from their list

Essentially building around Pendbury, Siddebottom, Cloke, Swan

bringing in Trelor, Adams, Aish, Varcose, Howe

drafting Moore, Degoey, langdon, Marley Williams, S'burg, Grundy


Buckley > Dimma

[Yeahright]

Why don't people wait and see how these players actually turn out? Some promising young players in there but we've had promising young players that have gone bust

[YellowandBlackBlood]

Collingwood won the flag in '10 and made the grand final in '11

regardless of what money the senior players were on, buckley and co. were brave to dismantle a successful team in order of future, long term success

If they win another one it may be looked at as brave. If they don't it will be stupid. They could have easily kept the best players and added to the team just like Hawthorn have been doing over the last 4 years. In 2010 they had one of the youngest teams to have won a flag for a while. It's not that they were all ready for retirement and thus should have been turfed out.

Heres a list of players Collingwood delisted/traded/retired the three yrs after their premiership.  2010  Anthony, Bartram, Blight, Cook, Corrie, Fraser, Lockyer (ret), Medhurst (ret), Obree (ret, Prestigiacomo (ret), Rusling (ret). 2011 L Brown (ret), Davis, Dick, Farmer, McCarthy, Stubbs. 2012 Buckley, Ceglar, Dawes (trade), Rounds, Tarrant (ret), Ugle, Wellingham wanted to go home trade,  Wood, Yagmoor, Tom Young.
There is just four  players who played in the premiership in 2010 who are gone by the end of 2012 Dawes, Davis,Wellingham and Leigh Brown   yet they are tracking backwards.
 The conclusion was the list they had was ageing well the top 25 players or so, and they  could take them no further.  Thus they entered into a rebuild phase.At the end of 2013 older players were delisted/retired/traded.
Didak 30yo, Johnson 32yo, Jolly 32yo, Krakouer 30yo, Russell 27yo, Shaw 29yo left for money, Thomas 26yo  r f/a who had big injury issues. plus Paine traded to brissie ,Ben  Richmond a rookie.
Up until this point what have they lost what is so wrong about what they have done since the premiership in 2010.
To me they were smart enough to see the list they had had done all it was going to do, they had no choice but rebuild and they have managed to do it without bottoming out.
They havent just willy nilly slashed players from their list

Essentially building around Pendbury, Siddebottom, Cloke, Swan

bringing in Trelor, Adams, Aish, Varcose, Howe

drafting Moore, Degoey, langdon, Marley Williams, S'burg, Grundy


Buckley > Dimma

Moore was a father son pick up so we had no chance there. DeGoey was taken by them before our pick. We picked up C.Ellis instead so why complain.Scharenberg has hardly set the world on fire and didn't they give away Heath Shaw for him and the latter just won a b&f at GWS? We picked up Vlas instead of Grundy so are you complaining?
As I pointed out, if Treloar came to us people would be saying we have the better youngsters and he made his decision before Aish had gone there.

[Yeahright]

We picked up Vlas instead of Grundy so are you complaining?

I still think we should of got Grundy. Bigger list need . Not that I'm unhappy

[the claw]

Why don't people wait and see how these players actually turn out? Some promising young players in there but we've had promising young players that have gone bust

WOW if only most richmond people would apply that principal to our own. Talk about double standards.

In 2012 Collingwood finished top 4 and won a final.  it has taken them just three years to go below us build and at the least get back on level terms.

Collingwood won the flag in '10 and made the grand final in '11

regardless of what money the senior players were on, buckley and co. were brave to dismantle a successful team in order of future, long term success

If they win another one it may be looked at as brave. If they don't it will be stupid. They could have easily kept the best players and added to the team just like Hawthorn have been doing over the last 4 years. In 2010 they had one of the youngest teams to have won a flag for a while. It's not that they were all ready for retirement and thus should have been turfed out.

Heres a list of players Collingwood delisted/traded/retired the three yrs after their premiership.  2010  Anthony, Bartram, Blight, Cook, Corrie, Fraser, Lockyer (ret), Medhurst (ret), Obree (ret, Prestigiacomo (ret), Rusling (ret). 2011 L Brown (ret), Davis, Dick, Farmer, McCarthy, Stubbs. 2012 Buckley, Ceglar, Dawes (trade), Rounds, Tarrant (ret), Ugle, Wellingham wanted to go home trade,  Wood, Yagmoor, Tom Young.
There is just four  players who played in the premiership in 2010 who are gone by the end of 2012 Dawes, Davis,Wellingham and Leigh Brown   yet they are tracking backwards.
 The conclusion was the list they had was ageing well the top 25 players or so, and they  could take them no further.  Thus they entered into a rebuild phase.At the end of 2013 older players were delisted/retired/traded.
Didak 30yo, Johnson 32yo, Jolly 32yo, Krakouer 30yo, Russell 27yo, Shaw 29yo left for money, Thomas 26yo  r f/a who had big injury issues. plus Paine traded to brissie ,Ben  Richmond a rookie.
Up until this point what have they lost what is so wrong about what they have done since the premiership in 2010.
To me they were smart enough to see the list they had had done all it was going to do, they had no choice but rebuild and they have managed to do it without bottoming out.
They havent just willy nilly slashed players from their list

Essentially building around Pendbury, Siddebottom, Cloke, Swan

bringing in Trelor, Adams, Aish, Varcose, Howe

drafting Moore, Degoey, langdon, Marley Williams, S'burg, Grundy


Buckley > Dimma

We picked up Vlas instead of Grundy so are you complaining?

Your asking the wrong bloke my choice was Grundy in that draft once he slipped. Before he slipped i was all for Stringer but knew he would not slip so wanted  Vlastuin. No complaints here, but i  still think Grundy was the go though for the same reasons i thought then.  He was a worthy top 10 pick and he filled a far greater need.

I also believe i advocated we take Stef Martin and Brent Moloney before the draft  and rookie a kid called Darcy Cameron after it thinking Grundy would not be available..

[taztiger4]

Why don't people wait and see how these players actually turn out? Some promising young players in there but we've had promising young players that have gone bust

WOW if only most richmond people would apply that principal to our own. Talk about double standards.

In 2012 Collingwood finished top 4 and won a final.  it has taken them just three years to go below us build and at the least get back on level terms.

Collingwood won the flag in '10 and made the grand final in '11

regardless of what money the senior players were on, buckley and co. were brave to dismantle a successful team in order of future, long term success

If they win another one it may be looked at as brave. If they don't it will be stupid. They could have easily kept the best players and added to the team just like Hawthorn have been doing over the last 4 years. In 2010 they had one of the youngest teams to have won a flag for a while. It's not that they were all ready for retirement and thus should have been turfed out.

Heres a list of players Collingwood delisted/traded/retired the three yrs after their premiership.  2010  Anthony, Bartram, Blight, Cook, Corrie, Fraser, Lockyer (ret), Medhurst (ret), Obree (ret, Prestigiacomo (ret), Rusling (ret). 2011 L Brown (ret), Davis, Dick, Farmer, McCarthy, Stubbs. 2012 Buckley, Ceglar, Dawes (trade), Rounds, Tarrant (ret), Ugle, Wellingham wanted to go home trade,  Wood, Yagmoor, Tom Young.
There is just four  players who played in the premiership in 2010 who are gone by the end of 2012 Dawes, Davis,Wellingham and Leigh Brown   yet they are tracking backwards.
 The conclusion was the list they had was ageing well the top 25 players or so, and they  could take them no further.  Thus they entered into a rebuild phase.At the end of 2013 older players were delisted/retired/traded.
Didak 30yo, Johnson 32yo, Jolly 32yo, Krakouer 30yo, Russell 27yo, Shaw 29yo left for money, Thomas 26yo  r f/a who had big injury issues. plus Paine traded to brissie ,Ben  Richmond a rookie.
Up until this point what have they lost what is so wrong about what they have done since the premiership in 2010.
To me they were smart enough to see the list they had had done all it was going to do, they had no choice but rebuild and they have managed to do it without bottoming out.
They havent just willy nilly slashed players from their list

Essentially building around Pendbury, Siddebottom, Cloke, Swan

bringing in Trelor, Adams, Aish, Varcose, Howe

drafting Moore, Degoey, langdon, Marley Williams, S'burg, Grundy


Buckley > Dimma

We picked up Vlas instead of Grundy so are you complaining?

Your asking the wrong bloke my choice was Grundy in that draft once he slipped. Before he slipped i was all for Stringer but knew he would not slip so wanted  Vlastuin. No complaints here, but i  still think Grundy was the go though for the same reasons i thought then.  He was a worthy top 10 pick and he filled a far greater need.

How are they on level terms with us ?, last time we played,  we beat them by 15 effin goals ya flog

[cub]

Maybe get over it.
stuff tree hore and stuff skunks...lets smash them round 2

[the claw]

Why don't people wait and see how these players actually turn out? Some promising young players in there but we've had promising young players that have gone bust

WOW if only most richmond people would apply that principal to our own. Talk about double standards.

In 2012 Collingwood finished top 4 and won a final.  it has taken them just three years to go below us build and at the least get back on level terms.

Collingwood won the flag in '10 and made the grand final in '11

regardless of what money the senior players were on, buckley and co. were brave to dismantle a successful team in order of future, long term success

If they win another one it may be looked at as brave. If they don't it will be stupid. They could have easily kept the best players and added to the team just like Hawthorn have been doing over the last 4 years. In 2010 they had one of the youngest teams to have won a flag for a while. It's not that they were all ready for retirement and thus should have been turfed out.

Heres a list of players Collingwood delisted/traded/retired the three yrs after their premiership.  2010  Anthony, Bartram, Blight, Cook, Corrie, Fraser, Lockyer (ret), Medhurst (ret), Obree (ret, Prestigiacomo (ret), Rusling (ret). 2011 L Brown (ret), Davis, Dick, Farmer, McCarthy, Stubbs. 2012 Buckley, Ceglar, Dawes (trade), Rounds, Tarrant (ret), Ugle, Wellingham wanted to go home trade,  Wood, Yagmoor, Tom Young.
There is just four  players who played in the premiership in 2010 who are gone by the end of 2012 Dawes, Davis,Wellingham and Leigh Brown   yet they are tracking backwards.
 The conclusion was the list they had was ageing well the top 25 players or so, and they  could take them no further.  Thus they entered into a rebuild phase.At the end of 2013 older players were delisted/retired/traded.
Didak 30yo, Johnson 32yo, Jolly 32yo, Krakouer 30yo, Russell 27yo, Shaw 29yo left for money, Thomas 26yo  r f/a who had big injury issues. plus Paine traded to brissie ,Ben  Richmond a rookie.
Up until this point what have they lost what is so wrong about what they have done since the premiership in 2010.
To me they were smart enough to see the list they had had done all it was going to do, they had no choice but rebuild and they have managed to do it without bottoming out.
They havent just willy nilly slashed players from their list

Essentially building around Pendbury, Siddebottom, Cloke, Swan

bringing in Trelor, Adams, Aish, Varcose, Howe

drafting Moore, Degoey, langdon, Marley Williams, S'burg, Grundy


Buckley > Dimma

We picked up Vlas instead of Grundy so are you complaining?

Your asking the wrong bloke my choice was Grundy in that draft once he slipped. Before he slipped i was all for Stringer but knew he would not slip so wanted  Vlastuin. No complaints here, but i  still think Grundy was the go though for the same reasons i thought then.  He was a worthy top 10 pick and he filled a far greater need.

How are they on level terms with us ?, last time we played,  we beat them by 15 effin goals ya flog

And Melbourne made us look silly. By your logic you effin  fool Melbourne are in front of us.

[Penelope]

ignoring ladder positions that is

[🏅Dooks]

Why don't people wait and see how these players actually turn out? Some promising young players in there but we've had promising young players that have gone bust

WOW if only most richmond people would apply that principal to our own. Talk about double standards.

In 2012 Collingwood finished top 4 and won a final.  it has taken them just three years to go below us build and at the least get back on level terms.

Collingwood won the flag in '10 and made the grand final in '11

regardless of what money the senior players were on, buckley and co. were brave to dismantle a successful team in order of future, long term success

If they win another one it may be looked at as brave. If they don't it will be stupid. They could have easily kept the best players and added to the team just like Hawthorn have been doing over the last 4 years. In 2010 they had one of the youngest teams to have won a flag for a while. It's not that they were all ready for retirement and thus should have been turfed out.

Heres a list of players Collingwood delisted/traded/retired the three yrs after their premiership.  2010  Anthony, Bartram, Blight, Cook, Corrie, Fraser, Lockyer (ret), Medhurst (ret), Obree (ret, Prestigiacomo (ret), Rusling (ret). 2011 L Brown (ret), Davis, Dick, Farmer, McCarthy, Stubbs. 2012 Buckley, Ceglar, Dawes (trade), Rounds, Tarrant (ret), Ugle, Wellingham wanted to go home trade,  Wood, Yagmoor, Tom Young.
There is just four  players who played in the premiership in 2010 who are gone by the end of 2012 Dawes, Davis,Wellingham and Leigh Brown   yet they are tracking backwards.
 The conclusion was the list they had was ageing well the top 25 players or so, and they  could take them no further.  Thus they entered into a rebuild phase.At the end of 2013 older players were delisted/retired/traded.
Didak 30yo, Johnson 32yo, Jolly 32yo, Krakouer 30yo, Russell 27yo, Shaw 29yo left for money, Thomas 26yo  r f/a who had big injury issues. plus Paine traded to brissie ,Ben  Richmond a rookie.
Up until this point what have they lost what is so wrong about what they have done since the premiership in 2010.
To me they were smart enough to see the list they had had done all it was going to do, they had no choice but rebuild and they have managed to do it without bottoming out.
They havent just willy nilly slashed players from their list

Essentially building around Pendbury, Siddebottom, Cloke, Swan

bringing in Trelor, Adams, Aish, Varcose, Howe

drafting Moore, Degoey, langdon, Marley Williams, S'burg, Grundy


Buckley > Dimma

We picked up Vlas instead of Grundy so are you complaining?

Your asking the wrong bloke my choice was Grundy in that draft once he slipped. Before he slipped i was all for Stringer but knew he would not slip so wanted  Vlastuin. No complaints here, but i  still think Grundy was the go though for the same reasons i thought then.  He was a worthy top 10 pick and he filled a far greater need.

How are they on level terms with us ?, last time we played,  we beat them by 15 effin goals ya flog

And Melbourne made us look silly. By your logic you effin  fool Melbourne are in front of us.

Calm down clawski. It's a long off season