Terry Wallace on the Brad Ottens trade (SEN)

[one-eyed]

Terry Wallace on the Brad Ottens trade

Joshua Papanikolaou
SEN
06 Jun 2016

There is a very big risk in trading away star players to overhaul a list clogged with average players deemed not capable of making the club a premiership contender, says Terry Wallace.

That is the situation some believe Richmond is in at the moment, unsure whether to press on with the original plan or make a very bold move and trade a player like Brett Deledio.

Wallace used the situation at the Tigers in 2004 as an example, when big man Brad Ottens was traded to Geelong in exchange for two first-round picks that yielded Danny Meyer and Adam Pattison.

Ottens went on to play 116 games for the Cats and win three premierships and although they got Deledio at pick one with a priority selection other notable draftees that year were also underwhelming.

Richard Tambling was taken at four ahead of Lance Franklin and then Dean Polo was selected with pick 20, just a few spots ahead of Nathan Van Berlo.

“I can give you one of my own examples, Brad Ottens at Richmond,” said Wallace on SEN radio.

“He was gone virtually the day that I arrived, gone before I was even in the seat but what happened when I arrived at the club they said the good news is we got two first-round picks for him.

“So we’ll be able to realign the footy club with those picks, we sat down and went to the draft with picks twelve and sixteen.

“Within three years twelve and sixteen were gone – so no longer did we have Brad Ottens or the players that were meant to be the ten-year replacements.

“It’s okay doing it, but if you’re going to do it you’ve got to get it right.”

The Tigers were convincingly beaten on Friday night against North Melbourne putting more pressure on senior coach Damien Hardwick and the leaders at the club.

“Well it’s a concern, it really is a concern both them and Collingwood,” said Wallace.

“My expectation I had Richmond inside the eight and Collingwood just outside the eight but not in my wildest did I think either of the two sides would be playing as poorly as what they are at the moment.

“The players that they brought, in fairness, it’s quite a while back now Troy Chaplin, Ivan Maric and Hampson.

“They’ve been good and got them to those three finals campaigns but they’re just about done as players and they haven’t been able to replace them.”

http://www.sen.com.au/news/afl/06-16/terry-wallace-on-the-brad-ottens-trade#XxbM0kDSMmgFBKtx.97

[WA Tiger]

Please do not remind me about Ottens, although he wanted to leave he was one of our biggest losses and gee i'm not sure we fought hard enough to keep him.

[big tone]

Recruiting has come a long way since 2004, so getting 2 first round picks these days for most clubs would most likely get you 2 very good long term players but not so at the RFC with FJ in charge.
He is clueless. 

If Lids was to leave, you would want a top 5 pick.

[Francois Jackson]

Recruiting has come a long way since 2004, so getting 2 first round picks these days for most clubs would most likely get you 2 very good long term players but not so at the RFC with FJ in charge.
He is clueless. 

If Lids was to leave, you would want a top 5 pick.

Thats 100% correct well said. I cant wait to see the back of this tool. I remember the smart stuff on here, kept telling me he is okay and not to blame in the wallet era as he was only part time or some rubbish like that. Well now he has stuffed up 2 eras.

[big tone]

If the club was to grow some balls, would people be happy with this result if it was to happen?
I still think you we would need to find another top 10 to 15 pick to add to our pick we would get this year for finishing bottom 4, to have any real chance to turn things around quickly. Edwards??


Pick 5 for Lids
Pick 18 for Vickery
Pick 25 for Griff
Pick 28 for Conca
Pick 30 for BEllis
Pick 50 for Astbury

So potentially 8 picks inside the top 30 with trading Edwards (pick 14), and our first and second round picks for 2016  (pick 4 and 26ish)

Surely we could do some damage! And the only real loses would be Lids and Edwards.
Plus get in Hurley and we would be a "genuine" contender is 3 years.

We can only dream!

[Tigeritis™©®]

Recruiting has come a long way since 2004, so getting 2 first round picks these days for most clubs would most likely get you 2 very good long term players but not so at the RFC with FJ in charge.
He is clueless. 

If Lids was to leave, you would want a top 5 pick.

Thats 100% correct well said. I cant wait to see the back of this tool. I remember the smart stuff on here, kept telling me he is okay and not to blame in the wallet era as he was only part time or some rubbish like that. Well now he has stuffed up 2 eras.

Or if he Ol' man Betamax Jackson was to fluke a selection or maybe copy the phantom draft the players picked would still be hindered by Chocco's awesome development team and a coaching staff that's able to destroy all natural instinct and flare any of the players drafted ever had. 


Richmond FC, ruining careers since '83. 

[Yeahright]

If the club was to grow some balls, would people be happy with this result if it was to happen?
I still think you we would need to find another top 10 to 15 pick to add to our pick we would get this year for finishing bottom 4, to have any real chance to turn things around quickly. Edwards??


Pick 5 for Lids
Pick 18 for Vickery
Pick 25 for Griff
Pick 28 for Conca
Pick 30 for BEllis
Pick 50 for Astbury

So potentially 8 picks inside the top 30 with trading Edwards (pick 14), and our first and second round picks for 2016  (pick 4 and 26ish)

Surely we could do some damage! And the only real loses would be Lids and Edwards.
Plus get in Hurley and we would be a "genuine" contender is 3 years.

We can only dream!

Don't know if Edwards would get that high a pick and even Astbury now . Also, do we even have a 2nd round pick in 2016 due to the yarran trade?

[YellowandBlackBlood]

If the club was to grow some balls, would people be happy with this result if it was to happen?
I still think you we would need to find another top 10 to 15 pick to add to our pick we would get this year for finishing bottom 4, to have any real chance to turn things around quickly. Edwards??


Pick 5 for Lids
Pick 18 for Vickery
Pick 25 for Griff
Pick 28 for Conca
Pick 30 for BEllis
Pick 50 for Astbury

So potentially 8 picks inside the top 30 with trading Edwards (pick 14), and our first and second round picks for 2016  (pick 4 and 26ish)

Surely we could do some damage! And the only real loses would be Lids and Edwards.
Plus get in Hurley and we would be a "genuine" contender is 3 years.

We can only dream!

Don't know if Edwards would get that high a pick and even Astbury now . Also, do we even have a 2nd round pick in 2016 due to the yarran trade?

No second round pick this year. We traded pick 31 and this year's second rounder for 19 and then gave that to Carlton....

[yellowandback]

If the club was to grow some balls, would people be happy with this result if it was to happen?
I still think you we would need to find another top 10 to 15 pick to add to our pick we would get this year for finishing bottom 4, to have any real chance to turn things around quickly. Edwards??


Pick 5 for Lids
Pick 18 for Vickery
Pick 25 for Griff
Pick 28 for Conca
Pick 30 for BEllis
Pick 50 for Astbury

So potentially 8 picks inside the top 30 with trading Edwards (pick 14), and our first and second round picks for 2016  (pick 4 and 26ish)

Surely we could do some damage! And the only real loses would be Lids and Edwards.
Plus get in Hurley and we would be a "genuine" contender is 3 years.

We can only dream!

Sorry mate but none of those would happen. We might get a 1st round pick from a top 8 club for Lids but that's only getting you pick 10+.
All the others won't get anything in the top 30.

[wayne]

2004 was a poo draft, but our guys should have had a bit of an idea about this, and traded for players instead of picks.

[big tone]

If the club was to grow some balls, would people be happy with this result if it was to happen?
I still think you we would need to find another top 10 to 15 pick to add to our pick we would get this year for finishing bottom 4, to have any real chance to turn things around quickly. Edwards??


Pick 5 for Lids
Pick 18 for Vickery
Pick 25 for Griff
Pick 28 for Conca
Pick 30 for BEllis
Pick 50 for Astbury

So potentially 8 picks inside the top 30 with trading Edwards (pick 14), and our first and second round picks for 2016  (pick 4 and 26ish)

Surely we could do some damage! And the only real loses would be Lids and Edwards.
Plus get in Hurley and we would be a "genuine" contender is 3 years.

We can only dream!

Sorry mate but none of those would happen. We might get a 1st round pick from a top 8 club for Lids but that's only getting you pick 10+.
All the others won't get anything in the top 30.

I'll remove my post then.
Or is it possible a top side could do a trade themself and get a pick in the top 5 that they could use on Lids??
And the others could potentially happen. You just have to look a past trades determine that.

[yellowandback]

I hope I'm wrong but history says in a crap year, we will be more desperate to trade than other clubs. This delivers the whip hand to other clubs and in turn a poorly negotiated outcome.
The trading needed to be done last year or in 2014.
It's a shifting of deadwood now.

[Diocletian]

We can bundle later picks together and trade them for earlier picks from clubs that need points for academy & father-son picks, something everybody still seems to be missing.

The full rebuild talk is exaggerated nonsense. We still have the core of a good list and promising young talent, just need better coaching & development and if we had good, smart list managers, we could draft more quality kids, trade for quality players and get a quality free agent or two and climb out of the hole fairly quickly. Unfortunately the rub is that we don't have good coaches & development or competent list managers, so these are the most urgent & first things that need addressing IMO and I fear they won't be in any serious way, so the discussion is moot really.

[tony_montana]

I agree, if we are strong enough and creative enough I firmly believe in one fell swoop we can reset and reaunch - talk of full rebuild is BS, our list is pretty good

[Diocletian]

SEN saying Collingwood's General Manager of List Management Derek Hine is coming over next year.