Author Topic: Richmond lost out by timing a bottoming out during AFL expansion (Advertiser)  (Read 3090 times)

Offline one-eyed

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Giant hit from AFL expansion

Rucci on Saturday
The Advertiser
23 July 2016


IT is all about timing in life ... and football.

In 2008 and 2009, the Fremantle Football Club — known then as the “Shockers” rather than the “Dockers” - “bottomed out” to rank 14th in each season. The spoils at the AFL national draft made a football power.

Stephen Hill, Hayden Ballantyne, Nick Suban, Zac Clarke and Michael Walters at the 2008 national call-up. The unlucky Anthony Morabito and Brownlow Medallist Nat Fyfe in 2009 when the AFL recruiting lottery was not compromised.

And then Ross Lyon arrived as coach at the end of 2011 to establish a consistent, imposing AFL team. Timing ...

In 2009 and 2010, the Richmond Football Club virtually mirrored Fremantle. The Tigers ranked 15th and 15th. And this was the wrong time to “bottom out”.

AFL football was amid expansion to 18 teams with Gold Coast (2011) and Greater Western Sydney (2012) ... and the 2010, 2011 and 2012 national drafts were compromised to load up the Suns and Giants with the cream of Australian football’s best young talent.

Not a good time to be at the foot of the AFL ladder ... or starting an AFL senior coaching career as Damien Hardwick did at Richmond in 2010.

And those who want to dismiss Hardwick — despite his contract including the next two seasons — arguing no AFL coach (including premiership mentors it seems) gets the chance for a second rebuild at the same club may need to consider how the Tigers (and Hardwick) were short changed during the expansion cycle.

Jonathon Patton, Stephen Coniglio, Dom Tyson and Adam Tomlinson — all at the Giants in the first 10 picks at the 2011 AFL national draft as Hardwick waited for his recruiting team to call at No. 15: Brandon Ellis.


The four clubs at the foot of the AFL ladder at the end of the 2010 season — as the game was preparing for Gold Coast’s entry as the 17th team in 2011 — make interesting studies today.

BRISBANE was 13th at the end of 2010 — and has not ranked higher since expansion. The Lions’ issues go far beyond picking the wrong time to be at the bottom of the AFL ladder.

The powerhouse club built by coach Leigh Matthews and captain Michael Voss with AFL dominance from 2001-4 has no meaningful legacy. Rather, there is a football club loaded with debt ($13 million); a football program that requires major correction; and a crisis the AFL Commission will see first-hand next week.

And expansion further hurt the Lions off the field with one-third of the commercial revenue lost to Queensland neighbour, Gold Coast.

ESSENDON was 14th at the end of 2010 — and has the big asterisk from the contentious 2012 supplements program at Windy Hill. This saga destroys any meaningful analysis of how the Bombers dealt with the expansion challenge.

WEST COAST was lumbered with the wooden spoon at the end of 2010 — and has played in AFL finals in every season since except 2013 when the Eagles ranked 13th.

Here, the AFL will use West Coast’s success as the counter to any argument on how the compromised draft created doomsday clubs — such as Brisbane and Richmond.

Clearly, the Eagles’ football program is sounder than that at the Lions — and that debate goes far beyond the recent coaches, Voss and the currently battered Justin Leppitsch.

Certainly the West Coast recruiting team was sharper in stockpiling players on the club’s rookie list — and careful with its trade plays. This brings into question the strategies of the football department leaders around Leppitsch at Brisbane and Hardwick at Richmond.

And — as difficult as it can be at times — there is reason to reflect on the views of Collingwood president Eddie McGuire as the expansion debate began ... and quickly ended with his colleague presidents as soon as the AFL executive highlighted the extra television money to be made (and found in record numbers) with an 18-team competition.

“Expansion could be the greatest thing to ever happen to the AFL competition,” said McGuire, “or it could ruin it.

“It’s a big roll of the dice, just on hope. We want to make sure the dice are loaded when I am rolling them.”

Of the risks with a compromised draft in 2010-12, McGuire added: “AFL football is a very fragile ecology and I often wonder why it is that I am the only one that fights for the integrity of the draft and salary cap.”

The AFL Commission had no choice but to deliver significant recruiting concessions to the Giants and Suns as both clubs sought to build strong foundations in tough and unfriendly Australian football environments.

But, to use McGuire’s ca-sino theme, where there are winners, there are also losers. And Richmond — and by extension Hardwick — certainly lost by timing a “bottoming out” when there was no gain. Timing is everything in football.

EXPANSION LOSERS

HOW expansion to 18 AFL teams — with Gold Coast in 2011 and Greater Western Sydney in 2012 — has tested the established clubs that were denied early draft picks.

The 2010-2012 AFL national drafts were compromised to give the Suns and Giants the majority of the much-treasured early picks.

BOTTOM FOUR OF 2010

13. BRISBANE


Rankings since: 15, 13, 12, 15 and 17.

Today: 17th.

Best draft picks (10-12): No. 5 in 2010 (Jared Polec, now at Port Adelaide); No. 8 in 2011 (Blly Longer, now at St Kilda); No. 8 in 2012 (Sam Mayes, signed new deal to 2019).

BIG questions about football program — particularly in development of young recruits — leaves doubts on whether early picks would have helped Lions.

14. ESSENDON

Rankings since: 8, 11, 9, 7 and 15.

Today: 18th.

Best draft picks (10-12): No. 8 in 2010 (Dyson Heppell, signed to 2020); No. 19 in 2011 (Elliott Kavanagh, delisted last season); No. 10 in 2012 (Joe Daniher, father-son).

COMPLICATED by the draft sanctions from the 2012 supplements saga.

15. RICHMOND

Rankings since: 12, 12, 7, 8 and 7.

Today: 13th.

Best draft picks (10-12): No. 6 in 2010 (Reece Conca); No. 15 in 2011 (Brandon Ellis); No. 9 in 2012 (Nick Vlastuin).

NO doubt coach Damien Hardwick’s program at Punt Road has been hurt by being denied early access to the game’s best young talent during expansion.


16. WEST COAST


Rankings since: 4, 5, 13, 9 and 2.

Today: Sixth.

Best draft picks (10-12): No. 4 in 2010 (Andrew Gaff); No. 23 in 2011 (Murray Newman); No. 45 (Brad Colledge).

EAGLES strategy during expansion was to work father-son picks, the rookie list and the trade market. West Coast’s selective recruiting minimised hit from “bottoming out” at wrong time.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/sport/afl/expert-opinion/michelangelo-rucci/michelangelo-rucci-how-the-afl-premiership-clock-stopped-for-some-clubs-during-the-giants-suns-expansion/news-story/6a680516cd6f65b0c9b8aebad4e83ae0

Offline Eat_em_Alive

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The article touches on a topic which we have discussed here before, and anyone outside of our followers would call it excuse making. What I would like to have seen is a comprehensive list of what GC and GWS players we specifically missed out on including the mini draft which often gets overlooked.
I believe that would tell an entirely different story altogether not that it makes a difference now.
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Online wayne

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Not having a good recruiting team during this time hurt us the most.
And you may not think I care for you
When you know down inside that I really do

tony_montana

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hmmm, didnt seem to hurt the bulldogs...

Offline YellowandBlackBlood

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hmmm, didnt seem to hurt the bulldogs...
Bottomed out later and had 3 father sons under the old rule. Libba, Wallis and Hunter all would have gone higher. Jake Stringer, MacCrae and Bontempelli plus those guys have given them heaps of equivalent "first rounders" and top ten picks.
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Offline Francois Jackson

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yeah right.

Correct Wayno. bottom 4 in the afl if you ask me. Anyone who has a clue can see this which is probably why fail and peggy sue dismiss it.


Currently a member of the Roupies, and employed by the great man Roup.

Offline mat073

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Yes , we were screwed by the meaningless expansion teams coming in and it caused us to go "moneyball " crazy.

Hopefully that ends with Townsend and Andrew Moore who have been monumental flops.
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Offline yandb

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Hardwick's choice to go the money ball path has been compounded some of the poor choices by our recruiting dept.

Offline Hard Roar Tiger

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Not having a good recruiting team during this time hurt us the most.

Having a poor development coaching program hasn't helped either.
“I find it nearly impossible to make those judgments, but he is certainly up there with the really important ones, he is certainly up there with the Francis Bourkes and the Royce Harts and the Kevin Bartlett and the Kevin Sheedys, there is no doubt about that,” Balme said.

tony_montana

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hmmm, didnt seem to hurt the bulldogs...
Bottomed out later and had 3 father sons under the old rule. Libba, Wallis and Hunter all would have gone higher. Jake Stringer, MacCrae and Bontempelli plus those guys have given them heaps of equivalent "first rounders" and top ten picks.



They also lost higgins and Cooney for next to nothing and werent afraid to trade out griff - theyre scared to get rid of their best players.

there was no need to go moneyball crazy like we have and continue to do, just takes up spots on our list - who knows how many shorts and castagnas we've missed out on simply bc we didnt give them a go instead going down the moneyball path

Offline big tone

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Not having a good recruiting team during this time hurt us the most.

Having a poor development coaching program hasn't helped either.
So poor coaching?

Surely Dimma is to blame for poor development of players??

For me development is as important as anything else a senior coach does.

Dimma would have a massive say on who his assistants and development coaches are and more importantly what he wants the recruits to be taught.

And Dimna also has a massive say on which way type of players our recruiters recruit. Young or old.
And Dimma has shown for a long time that he prefers to play mature players rather than our young kids.

Offline (•))(©™

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hmmm, didnt seem to hurt the bulldogs...

Right
Caracella and Balmey.

Offline Tigeritis™©®

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Not having a good recruiting team during this time hurt us the most.

Having a poor development coaching program hasn't helped either.

Having a poor coaching regime too with a jobs for mates bunch of yes men backslapping Dumma's game plan that all other coaches around Australia are trying to emulate.  :rollin



.... I think we've got the trifecta.

Just as well "DanTheMan" told us it was our fault for not being patient enough or accepting a proper rebuild because, as we all know, we loved just making finals three years in a row.  :rollin
The club that keeps giving.

Offline 🏅Dooks

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Not having a good recruiting team during this time hurt us the most.

Having a poor development coaching program hasn't helped either.

Having a poor coaching regime too with a jobs for mates bunch of yes men backslapping Dumma's game plan that all other coaches around Australia are trying to emulate.  :rollin



.... I think we've got the trifecta.

Just as well "DanTheMan" told us it was our fault for not being patient enough or accepting a proper rebuild because, as we all know, we loved just making finals three years in a row.  :rollin

Its the Richmond Holy Trinity.

Dan The Man reminding us fans that we are born sinners and must repent for our very nature rather than actions.
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Then its made of sh#t" Dont Argue - 2/8/2018

Offline YellowandBlackBlood

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hmmm, didnt seem to hurt the bulldogs...
Bottomed out later and had 3 father sons under the old rule. Libba, Wallis and Hunter all would have gone higher. Jake Stringer, MacCrae and Bontempelli plus those guys have given them heaps of equivalent "first rounders" and top ten picks.



They also lost higgins and Cooney for next to nothing and werent afraid to trade out griff - theyre scared to get rid of their best players.

there was no need to go moneyball crazy like we have and continue to do, just takes up spots on our list - who knows how many shorts and castagnas we've missed out on simply bc we didnt give them a go instead going down the moneyball path
Higgins had not contributed much due to injury for several years. They knew Cooney was finished because of his knee (just look at his Essendon form). Griff asked to leave so they didn't have much choice and because they wanted Boyd, found a way to satisfy a player who was finished and at the same time satisfy GWS with a trade.

I do agree whole heartedly with the moneyball issue. We really went overboard with it to the detriment of bringing young talent in. Combine that with us finishing mid table and out of the top 10 picks repeatedly has hurt us so much.

The one really poor decision in the draft was to ignore Heppell. He was there to be picked and we went with someone that nobody rated in the top 20. To me, that was worse than Tambling-Franklin because many "experts" had Tambling as the top pick in the 2004 draft. At the same time, Franklin's psych profile remains one of the worst ever recorded according to people that I know who made the software for the profiling.

Just goes to show talent spotting is not an exact science and just sometimes you have to go "with your gut" and not with just statistics.
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