Author Topic: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford  (Read 13808 times)

Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #30 on: July 13, 2004, 10:46:43 AM »
Does anyone know where Boy Blunder Pahloff is and what he's up to at the moment - and what he's currently doing to our club?

I am guessing the Boston Tea Party ;D
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Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #31 on: July 13, 2004, 10:56:29 AM »
Yeah I understand the sceptism but guys Casey and co havent performed. His results dont justify another tenure (similar to Dud). The best thing Schwab and co could do is state why they left the board.....if they are able to show that their input was being neglected or that Casey's direction and control was one of the wrong path then I have no qualms that the new party will win.

I have already told my father and friends that if they vote for Casey, Im done with sitting with them at the footy. In 5 years, Casey has one of the worst records I have seen......it must speak volumes.

Firstly welcome to OER om21.

I understand what you are saying and agree the performance of the current board has been average at best and crap at worst. But the facts are that both Schwab & Welsh were members of the Board while Clinton Casey has been president. They are responsible for some of the stupid decisions that have been made because they were party to them. To simply blame Casey and say he is a dictator is a cop out IMO.

I also agree that Schwab needs to tell members why he quit (refer my previous post). He actually should have done earlier rather than letting Caro give us little bits here and there. In a way it seems to me he has conducted his "campaign" through the media rather than directly at the members at that is something I really have a problem with.

However, I don't think any allegiance with Gettysburg Pahoff will help their cause, it is more likely to harm I would think.
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Offline om21

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #32 on: July 13, 2004, 11:33:10 AM »
THanks for the welcome...good to be here.

Im not denying their role in part of the decision making. For one, we dont know how much of a say they had in some of the decisions you mentioend in your previous post (ie Gas contract, Dud extension). The reason why Casey will receive most of the blame is because he is the head. Comparing to the football department, Dud must take responsibility for his team (Crocker, Brittain, Spargs). Their messages may be busted but its his responsibility.

I beleive once he/they come out and state why they left and their aims that a lot of the murkiness will get cleared up (over his departure and other issues that remain grey). I dont know why the wait but I will say that if he is finalising his crew then thats a good thing. I would hate for a new ticket to emerge and not be 100% ready and finalised. Unfortunately we keep getting smacked on-field, our patience is wearing thin and we want it to happen now.....

I dont see how aligning with Pahoff will harm their cause. I agree with the guy, all he did was cock the gun....he just put Casey on notice saying that basically your job hasnt been good enough. Too many people are mis-reading what he has done and is trying to do.
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Offline mightytiges

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March and Nichlos stand behind Casey
« Reply #33 on: July 14, 2004, 01:22:28 AM »
And the phoney war continues  ::)

----------------------------------------------

Board pair stand behind Casey
14 July 2004   Herald Sun
Mark Stevens

 TWO key Richmond board members have thrown their total support behind president Clinton Casey, killing off speculation they could cross to the enemy camp.

Gary March and Alan Nicklos, mooted as possibilities to join rebel Brendan Schwab's alternative ticket, have called for stability at Punt Rd.

March, about to leave for Athens in his role as head of merchandise company Concept Sports, questioned whether Schwab would have the time to match Casey's commitment to the Tigers.

"I certainly have no intention of joining a rival ticket . . . I don't think the rival ticket is doing the club any good at this point in time," March said last night.

"I just think the whole thing is destabilising.

"Love Clinton or hate him, at least he's prepared to put in the time and effort at the moment -- and I do think he's got Richmond's best interests at heart.

"Maybe it's time everyone gets behind the current regime."

March said he had not spoken to Schwab, a former board member believed to be plotting to oust Casey, for six weeks.

He described former board member Schwab as a "great Richmond person" but said he would face an enormous challenge if he won the presidency.

"He barely had time to be on the board," March said.

"Being president takes an inordinate amount of time.

"People ask me why I don't stand as a potential challenger but I just couldn't put the time into the football club that Clinton does.

"If you're going to take it on, you need to be 100 per cent committed.

"I'm not sure if Brendan would be able to devote the time."

Nicklos, managing director of Motorola's mobile phone business, said no one from any alternative ticket had spoken to him.

"I think it's just rumour-mongering," Nicklos said.

"Clinton is putting the time and effort in to try and rebuild the club.

"If there is something going on, as Clinton said the other day, 'bring it on'."

March said he would step aside only if a new group could show it had the time, effort and financial resources necessary to make a significant difference.

Schwab's group is expected to front Casey within a fortnight and demand his resignation.

"I'm very worried about the on-going viability of the football club," Schwab said this week.

The 36-year-old, a lawyer and chief executive of the Australian Entertainment Industry Association, is believed to be strongly considering taking on the presidency if the group wins control.

Other names connected to the ticket include former players Peter Welsh and Bryan Wood, liquidation expert Michael Humphris and TAC executive Colin Radford.

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,10131319%255E19771,00.html
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Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #34 on: July 14, 2004, 08:39:54 AM »

He described former board member Schwab as a "great Richmond person" but said he would face an enormous challenge if he won the presidency.

"He barely had time to be on the board," March said.

"Being president takes an inordinate amount of time.

"If you're going to take it on, you need to be 100 per cent committed.

"I'm not sure if Brendan would be able to devote the time."


And from yours truly yesterday......

Secondly, Brendan's track record in attending board meetings over the years is poor to say the least. 2003 he attended 11 of a possible 12. Prior to that it reads 9, 8, 8. If you are going to this job you have commit the time and effort. 8 meetings out of 12 doesn't show great commitment.


 ::) ::) ::) :-\ :-\ :-\

Exactly my point - thank you ;D
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Offline Fishfinger

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #35 on: July 14, 2004, 10:19:31 AM »
I dont see how aligning with Pahoff will harm their cause. I agree with the guy, all he did was cock the gun....
Welcome om21.
No group could not align themselves with Michael Pahoff because, as he has made clear from the beginning, he is not and will not be part of any alternative.
What would make sense is for the group to communicate with Michael to ensure he doesn't present his petition at a time that will leave them not properly prepared to challenge. I'd say this has happened because it seems the possible new ticket wants to present their own petition. They could act on the back of Michael's petition, but to do so with their own petition would give them more credibility in my eyes.

Michael Pahoff has done a good job. I agree all he has done is cocked the gun. Now he should step aside for someone who is prepared to clean up after they fire their own gun.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2004, 10:30:10 AM by Fishfinger »
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Offline Tiger Spirit

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #36 on: July 14, 2004, 11:11:50 AM »
Schwab's group is expected to front Casey within a fortnight and demand his resignation.

"I'm very worried about the on-going viability of the football club," Schwab said this week.

The 36-year-old, a lawyer and chief executive of the Australian Entertainment Industry Association, is believed to be strongly considering taking on the presidency if the group wins control.

Other names connected to the ticket include former players Peter Welsh and Bryan Wood, liquidation expert Michael Humphris and TAC executive Colin Radford.

Not a whole lot about how all of this is panning out gives you confidence that this new ticket could effectively change anything.  If they think Casey is so unsuitable for the role then why are they taking so long to get things moving?  Surely if things were that bad and these were the right people to take us forward, there would be greater urgency in the whole process.  So I can’t help but see this as another case of ego getting in the way of common sense and logic.

What hasn’t been answered in any of this are the reasons why there needs to be a new ticket to bring about change.  It hasn’t worked before and you have to doubt that it will work this time.  If we want to change things then we aren’t going to do it by causing more divisions than there are already.

Casey has repeatedly said that he would step aside if someone suitable presented themselves.  How this person would demonstrate their suitability is anyone’s guess, because even the best made plans can come to nothing, without people with the ability to carry out those plans.  As no doubt Casey has found out.

Since the revelation of the budgeted loss for the year, there has been a negative spin on most things the Club has done, which is understandable.  But how do you know who and what to believe and who and what not to believe?  I guess it’s just a matter of choice.

Terry Wallace raised an interesting point on 3AW the other weekend and queried whether it was better to have a President to take the Club forward who has made mistakes and (hopefully) learned from them along the way, or whether it is best to bring in someone new, who still needs to go through the learning curve?  So, it seems that, unless you have a candidate who has previous proven experience, there are no certainties with anyone at the helm.

And unless those on the Board now are of questionable character, have no business sense whatsoever and are just going to sink our Club further into the mire because of it, what could make us think that the new ticket will do better, when it seems that some of those on it have previously been at the Club through similar unsuccessful times.

The current administration has been a lot less conservative than previous ones and a combination of factors; one being a lack of understanding of the nature of the football industry, have seen things go sour.  From what has been said, the Club went ahead with additional spending in the football department when it was recommended it shouldn’t.

Whether it was a case of a really high risk to take, an error of judgement, or just negligence, who knows, but we all know that if the footy department isn’t looked after then we can’t hope to be competitive.

To go ahead in business, there is a need to take risks; otherwise things are likely to stagnate.  As happened with the previous administration, which seemed to be waiting for success to be achieved through the efforts made on the field.  That approach may work to some degree, but what if the team isn’t successful, which is what happened and so it became obvious that there was a need for change.

I certainly don’t want anyone shady running the footy Club, or anyone who puts his/her own interests before that of RFC.  Whether our losses are because of any of that isn’t clear.  I tend to think it’s more a case of inexperience and a “go for it” type attitude.  Maybe that’s wrong, but no one has come out and explained the resentment towards Casey.  Clubs have made losses in the past and will continue to do so.  So do you stop someone from attempting to change things or help him to correct what he is doing wrong?  Casey seems to have the “go for it” attitude, but probably needs people around him to balance this, because the conservative approach didn’t work and now this approach isn’t working either.  Probably somewhere in between would be the way to go.

But no one would see that.  Least of all those forming the new ticket.  If this is the dire situation that this sort of action says it is, why is it taking so long to do anything about it?  You would like to think that if things were that bad that action would already have taken place.  And the people we need to get things done wouldn’t be waiting around for the “right time”.

Doesn’t seem to me like these are men of action, but just talk.  And it is this sort of ‘conservative’ approach that got us into this situation in the first place.

No doubt the ticket is being formed through concern, but to what degree is it concern and how much of it is ego?  Because if that’s all this is then nothing will change long-term, if these people don’t have the ability to make the necessary changes that will make a difference.  It will take some convincing that the people named on the ticket actually know how to go about doing that.  But, the feeling is that they are just wasting everyone’s time and, potentially, the Club’s money.
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Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #37 on: July 14, 2004, 12:16:43 PM »
No group could not align themselves with Michael Pahoff because, as he has made clear from the beginning, he is not and will not be part of any alternative.

Bt he aligned himself to someone FF because he has given his petition to an alternative ticket. That's what has been reported in the papers and has not been disputed by Michael.



Michael Pahoff has done a good job.

Sorry FF but I cannot agree with you here. IMO he hasn't done a good job and here's a few reasons why:

1. When he first raised this petition idea he was on 3AW and said that he was organising a petition to pass a no confidence motion in the current board. When asked by 3AW if was going to put his hand up as an alternative he said "NO but I am sure there are people who will". Sorry this is not good - this is trouble making because unless you have a clear plan and alternative then you run the risk of putting the Club in greater trouble than it is already in.  >:(

2. He then says that he has had plenty of contact with alternative tickets and will hand over the completed petition to them but wont tell us who they are. Why the secrecy? He complains on one hand about Casey and the board not being transperant and then does exactly the same thing >:(

3. Then we are subjected to reading about his comparison between the situation at the RFC to the Battle of Gettysburg while he was on holidays. In a word - embarrassing.

My biggest beef has been all along that he has no clear direction or plan - he has "flipped flopped" all over the place. He gave us no alternative but expected everyone to sign his petition.

I really question whether he truly understands the damage he has done - we have been in limbo for weeks now and I partially blame Mr Pahoff for that


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Offline Fishfinger

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #38 on: July 14, 2004, 01:25:36 PM »
Sorry FF but I cannot agree with you here. IMO he hasn't done a good job and here's a few reasons why:

1. When he first raised this petition idea he was on 3AW and said that he was organising a petition to pass a no confidence motion in the current board. When asked by 3AW if was going to put his hand up as an alternative he said "NO but I am sure there are people who will". Sorry this is not good - this is trouble making because unless you have a clear plan and alternative then you run the risk of putting the Club in greater trouble than it is already in.  >:(

2. He then says that he has had plenty of contact with alternative tickets and will hand over the completed petition to them but wont tell us who they are. Why the secrecy? He complains on one hand about Casey and the board not being transperant and then does exactly the same thing >:(

3. Then we are subjected to reading about his comparison between the situation at the RFC to the Battle of Gettysburg while he was on holidays. In a word - embarrassing.

What I meant was he has done a good job of getting off his bum and stirring things up that he felt strongly should change.

I have made my views against what Michael has done well known totally for your reason no. 1. If he butts out now I don't think he will have done damage. (yet)
Reason 2 doesn't bother me because I'm naive enough to take him at his word that he will not be involved. My reading of it is that he has made his petition available to any group at all so an EGM can be called if he sees they will challenge Casey , rather than having aligned with them.
Reason 3 I found odd. Embarassing is pretty good, puzzling would fit my thoughts when he referred to all the battlefields. Didn't particularly bother me, but did make me happy that he wasn't going to put himself up as an alternative.
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Offline om21

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #39 on: July 15, 2004, 12:24:10 PM »
Damned if you do...damned if you dont.

If they come out unprepared they will get hammered;
If they sit behind the closed scenes and prepare themselves to be ready for anything they get hammered.....
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Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #40 on: July 15, 2004, 01:03:11 PM »
Damned if you do...damned if you dont.

If they come out unprepared they will get hammered;
If they sit behind the closed scenes and prepare themselves to be ready for anything they get hammered.....

Fair call om21.

But they seem to come out and say very little which makes them seem very unprepared. And it seems they haven't actually stayed behind closed doors - we have been hearing rumours and rumblings from them for weeks now. :-\

Brendan said this the other day in the H/Sun...

"Obviously I'm very worried about the on-going viability of the football club," he said.

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,10120850%255E19771,00.html

But gave no indicatin what he plans to do about it - that just seems unprepared. Perhaps he should not speak to the media until he can give us his plan and processes that he believes will fix the Club.

Also, I think one of the problems this alternative ticket faces is the fact that 2 of them were part of the Casey adminsitration (not that they seem keen on acknowledging that fact).
« Last Edit: July 15, 2004, 01:12:31 PM by WilliamPowell »
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Offline WilliamPowell

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #41 on: July 15, 2004, 01:10:36 PM »
Reason 3 I found odd. Embarassing is pretty good, puzzling would fit my thoughts when he referred to all the battlefields. Didn't particularly bother me, but did make me happy that he wasn't going to put himself up as an alternative.

Agree about him not being an alternative ticket - what a relief.

I put reason 3 in there because he said at the very beginning when I heard him on 3AW that he was "representing the majority of RFC members. Forgetting this is a stupid statement because he is not and has never been representing me - his ramblings about the battlefields indirectly paints the RFC membership in a less than positive light and I find it not only embarrassing but offensive. You know the old saying about one bad apple........... :-\ :-\

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Offline Fishfinger

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #42 on: July 15, 2004, 01:23:43 PM »
I hear what you're saying om21, but I don't see it as a bad thing.

If they come out unprepared they deserve to be hammered.

Any hammering they are getting for sitting behind the closed scenes is because information about them has been released which has turned out to be incorrect or has been denied.

I want them to stay behind the scenes until they are totally ready. That's why I think Michael Pahoff has done all he should.
I believe an alternative ticket will most likely be our next board, so I want them to be better than what we have. Until they emerge and are deemed worthy challengers I think it's fair to be circumspect about them and to question touted actions with regard to an EGM.
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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #43 on: July 15, 2004, 03:05:19 PM »
Just wish they'd sort this stuff out quick, so we know what we're up against, can plan for the future and get on with 2005.
Totally sick of it!

Offline om21

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Re: Alternative ticket: Schwab, Welsh, Clay, Wood, Humphris and Radford
« Reply #44 on: July 15, 2004, 05:12:10 PM »
I understand what you are all saying and thats the problem with this all. I dont think the timing is wrong persay, its just that right now we are frustrated and impatience. We want changes and we want them now (at some level).

And your right WP, two members from Casey's crew doesnt look good but there must be reasons for this and I think we all want to know before we vote. I think thats the only thing holding this back from being a white-wash in favour of the newbies....the past ties.
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