Luke McGuane [merged]

[Chuck17]

Eff me I was hoping to see the last of at least one or two of McGawn, White or Jackson.

[RedanTiger]

I don't think there have been enough (any) proofs yet that say to me is bad or been a failure at his job.

After saying we would have "two more development coaches" in 2012, he released newett and Clarke and hired Mellor.
Is that a failure on his key role?

[dwaino]

If McGuane is able to produce every game what he did the back part of this season, I don't mind him around as a depth player.

[tony_montana]

So you saw proof that he was actually on the amount that was reported in here a few years back by the one and only Mr Reliable - Jackstar?  Or are you just subscribing to the urban myth that surrounds it?

Do you have proof to suggest he isn't well paid? It's all well and good to shoot down posters for their negative views, but do u have proof to dispel these "urban myths"? Whats good for the goose....

I have heard from other sources that he has been very well paid, whether that was 450k a season like jackstar said I don't know, but I do know he was signed on the back of his best football to date, was young and we were struggling to get to min cap at the time, do the math...

No I don't have proof and that is exactly my point.  Unless the guy himself told me or it was reported in the free press as such then I won't believe it, pure and simple.  I can have an educated guess based on anything I like to accept as a likely truth but I can't say it is true or not without an actual fact.  In this case, that's something you or I don't have and without an actual fact I'm not going criticise Cameron for any decision based solely on my guess the urban myth is true.  I could make a statement like "IF it was true then Cameron was a party to a bad list decision" but that's a significant difference from assuming it and blaming Cameron regardless.  I wasn't having a go at you for having a negative view, it was for making an unsubstantiated statement about Cameron's decision by a.) assuming it was Cameron's decision alone, and b.) McGuane was signed for ~$450k per year.  In both cases I would guess that you don't know the truth or facts of either so the whack at Cameron in my mind is unfair.  You say that with Cameron's track record you won't believe McGuane has taken a significant paycut without the proof, yet you seem to need no proof to make allegations about Cameron.  What's good for the goose.......

You can dance around the semantics of it if you wish smokey, but common sense suggests he would have been on a fair whack this contract and likely closer to the mark than way off for the reasons I mentioned earlier. If you dismiss this as incorrect that's you prerogative and no skin off my nose....
This is my opinion - I'm not claiming it as fact just an educated guess and I'm well within my rights to voice it on a footy forum, you don't agree? That's perfectly fine with me

All good TM, it's what we all come here for.   

FWIW I agree that IF McGuane was on $450k-ish then those responsible should hang their collective heads in shame - he was never worth that and never will be.  I would also never have signed him up for 4 years at the time, regardless of the amount of his contract.  If however it turned out that he was signed at the time for around $300-$350 per year then I would accept that based on his age/size/potential at the time.  The fact that we can view his failure to fully develop or produce the goods in hindsight makes it easy to judge but at the time a figure around that would have been reasonable in my opinion and I reckon that a figure of $350 might still (just) place him in the top 25% of our current list.

Agreed smokey, can't argue with that 

[Smokey]

I don't think there have been enough (any) proofs yet that say to me is bad or been a failure at his job.

After saying we would have "two more development coaches" in 2012, he released newett and Clarke and hired Mellor.
Is that a failure on his key role?

Could be RT, depends on what caused it I would think.  If he was unable to secure the standard of coach that he was seeking and decided not to grab 'just anyone' then I would think it's a success as far as the good of the club and it's culture goes but if he was just gobbing off for the sake of some spin-doctoring publicity then I would say it's a fail.  Again, without knowing the facts I will reserve my judgment.

[RedanTiger]

Knowing the facts that he made the statement and didn't deliver I have made my judgement.

[Smokey]

Knowing the facts that he made the statement and didn't deliver I have made my judgement.

As far as I can work out, the additions to the football department in the coaching/development area for this season were Ross Smith, Mark Williams and Greg Mellor?

So are you saying that you will judge Benny Gale as a failure if we don't achieve 3-0-75?  A plan is only ever something to use as a guiding tool on the path to a hopeful future outcome and when circumstances change (as they almost always will) then the smart operators are the ones who are able to adjust and tinker to keep working towards that outcome.  I would rather the club be responsible enough to make it's decisions based on the facts before it at the time rather than blindly sticking to a verbal pre-committment that could have any number of circumstances change after the event.  If they couldn't get the personnel they were after at the time then saving the money and working towards extra coaches/developmental staff (the ones that tick all your particular boxes) in the future is a far smarter outcome than taking any Johnny-come-lately just for the sake of appeasing the fans.  Just my opinion and why I'm not judging Cameron on it right now, there's plenty of time in history to do that.

[Penelope]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iRle4Yz-tQ

[Smokey]

 

But sadly, there could have been more added to that clip.   

[Tigeritis™©®]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iRle4Yz-tQ

 
I don't know whether to laugh or cry.
 

[WA Tiger]

Eff me I was hoping to see the last of at least one or two of McGawn, White or Jackson.

Jackson had his contract renewed, he is not going anywhere!

[WilliamPowell]

I don't think there have been enough (any) proofs yet that say to me is bad or been a failure at his job.

After saying we would have "two more development coaches" in 2012, he released newett and Clarke and hired Mellor.
Is that a failure on his key role?

Slight correction - He didn't release Clarke. Clarke  he left of his own accord to move the States with his American born wife

[the claw]

So you saw proof that he was actually on the amount that was reported in here a few years back by the one and only Mr Reliable - Jackstar?  Or are you just subscribing to the urban myth that surrounds it?

Do you have proof to suggest he isn't well paid? It's all well and good to shoot down posters for their negative views, but do u have proof to dispel these "urban myths"? Whats good for the goose....

I have heard from other sources that he has been very well paid, whether that was 450k a season like jackstar said I don't know, but I do know he was signed on the back of his best football to date, was young and we were struggling to get to min cap at the time, do the math...

No I don't have proof and that is exactly my point.  Unless the guy himself told me or it was reported in the free press as such then I won't believe it, pure and simple.  I can have an educated guess based on anything I like to accept as a likely truth but I can't say it is true or not without an actual fact.  In this case, that's something you or I don't have and without an actual fact I'm not going criticise Cameron for any decision based solely on my guess the urban myth is true.  I could make a statement like "IF it was true then Cameron was a party to a bad list decision" but that's a significant difference from assuming it and blaming Cameron regardless.  I wasn't having a go at you for having a negative view, it was for making an unsubstantiated statement about Cameron's decision by a.) assuming it was Cameron's decision alone, and b.) McGuane was signed for ~$450k per year.  In both cases I would guess that you don't know the truth or facts of either so the whack at Cameron in my mind is unfair.  You say that with Cameron's track record you won't believe McGuane has taken a significant paycut without the proof, yet you seem to need no proof to make allegations about Cameron.  What's good for the goose.......

You can dance around the semantics of it if you wish smokey, but common sense suggests he would have been on a fair whack this contract and likely closer to the mark than way off for the reasons I mentioned earlier. If you dismiss this as incorrect that's you prerogative and no skin off my nose....
This is my opinion - I'm not claiming it as fact just an educated guess and I'm well within my rights to voice it on a footy forum, you don't agree? That's perfectly fine with me

All good TM, it's what we all come here for.   

FWIW I agree that IF McGuane was on $450k-ish then those responsible should hang their collective heads in shame - he was never worth that and never will be.  I would also never have signed him up for 4 years at the time, regardless of the amount of his contract.  If however it turned out that he was signed at the time for around $300-$350 per year then I would accept that based on his age/size/potential at the time.  The fact that we can view his failure to fully develop or produce the goods in hindsight makes it easy to judge but at the time a figure around that would have been reasonable in my opinion and I reckon that a figure of $350 might still (just) place him in the top 25% of our current list.

imo i dont think mcguane has ever done anything to warrant more than two yrs. he certainly would not warrant more than 300k ever. would only offer him a 1yr performance based contract this time around if we were to keep him.
 personally i believe he should be delisted and should have been 4 yrs ago.

[Smokey]

 personally i believe he should be delisted and should have been 4 yrs ago.

Nice hindsight judgment Claw.  There was nothing in his package 4 years ago to suggest he should not have been tried (re-signed) for a couple of years at a commensurate package.  The error (that hindsight has again allowed us to know) was in the length of time and (rumoured) amount.  2 years @ $300-ish was absolutely worth doing.

[the claw]

 personally i believe he should be delisted and should have been 4 yrs ago.

Nice hindsight judgment Claw.  There was nothing in his package 4 years ago to suggest he should not have been tried (re-signed) for a couple of years at a commensurate package.  The error (that hindsight has again allowed us to know) was in the length of time and (rumoured) amount.  2 years @ $300-ish was absolutely worth doing.

no hindsight smokey. have been calling for his head that long. i call for his head based purely on his football ability and overall performances.
every player is judged by the same criteria and theres a fair few on the list whos head ive called for for yrs now.

i have never seen any circumstance where mcguane has been worth more than 300k a yr and ive never seen enough from him to warrant more than a two yr contract and that was early days.
8 yrs in and for me not much has changed with this dud. the weaknesses in his game that has held him back are all still there holding him back.