Original Mike to compare us with Carlton / Tigers' list is simply inferior

[mightytiges]

Mike Sheahan has an article in tomorrow's (Wednesday) paper comparing us head to head with the Blues. What an original idea .

[one-eyed]

Tigers' list is simply inferior
18 April 2007   Herald-Sun
Mike Sheahan

AT SOME point each year, pot shots on Punt Rd returns as Victoria's second-biggest winter sporting interest, Mike Sheahan writes.

It is back earlier than usual this year, but that's what losses in the first three rounds of a season will do to a club.

Richmond is under attack on all fronts: the coaching, recruiting and medical and conditioning.

On the surface, the queries seem reasonable enough, particularly in the fitness area.

Richmond has been in a winning position in all three games, yet has failed to finish off its work each time.

The Tigers were overrun by Carlton, outstayed by Sydney and embarrassed by Collingwood.

Maybe the problem is mental, yet the last quarter returns reflect a drop-off in both skill and intensity.

Maybe we should be addressing the most important aspect of all criteria: the talent?

Is the list good enough to carry the club anywhere forward from ninth in 2006 (11 wins)?

Or was coach Terry Wallace right to caution against high expectations this year, suggesting a holding pattern was more realistic?

The situation has been complicated by the failure of the team's most talented player, Nathan Brown, to play to this point, while 2003 best-and-fairest winner Mark Coughlan will miss the entire season, and the team's best ruckman Troy Simmonds missed the first two rounds and was underdone last Friday night.

The highly-rated Will Thursfield also is yet to appear.

However, only Sydney escapes injuries in the modern game. They are a fact of football life.

No, the damning reality for Richmond supporters is that its list probably isn't as good as the Carlton list.

The Blues, who finished on the bottom in 2005-06, seem to be making much better progress.

Apart from the Round 1 win, my rankings of Richmond's best 12 in comparison with their Carlton counterparts suggests the Blues are in front.

They win 7-5, with several line-ball calls: Pettifer/Simpson, Deledio/Murphy, Johnson/Scotland, Raines/Walker, Newman/Houlihan, Schulz/Whitnall.

The exercise suggests two things: Richmond supporters need to be patient -- yes, again -- and Carlton's solid start to the season is based on substance as much as confidence and enthusiasm.

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,21576221%255E19742,00.html

[wayne]

Ok, I've read the article and I have just one comment.

Houlihan beats Newman???!!!

[Life goes on]

I actually reckon he is nearly on the money.
As for Houilhan, is extremely important to Carlton structure in that he is a release player out of D 50 . You might find his use of the ball is expectional as well.
Interesting Scotland over Johnson says something, it actually says what all non richmond supporters think

[mightytiges]

For those without a hardcopy of the Hun, what were the actual 12 head-to-head comparisons?

[wayne]

Battle of the Lists

Richmond/Carlton

J. Bowden v B. Thornton - Bowden
M. Richardson v B. Fevola - Fevola
T. Simmonds v C. Ackland - Simmonds
N. Foley v N. Stevens - Stevens
K. Pettifer v K. Simpson - Pettifer
B. Deledio v M. Murphy - Deledio
K. Johnson v H. Scotland - Scotland
A. Raines v A. Walker - Walker
S. Tuck v J. Waite - Waite
G. Tivendale v B. Fisher - Fisher
C. Newman v R. Houlihan - R. Houlihan
J. Schulz v L. Whitnall - Schulz

Richmond 5 - Carlton 7

[mightytiges]

Battle of the Lists

Richmond/Carlton

J. Bowden (29) v B. Thornton (24) - Bowden
M. Richardson (32) v B. Fevola (26)- Fevola
T. Simmonds (29) v C. Ackland (25) - Simmonds
N. Foley (22) v N. Stevens (27) - Stevens
K. Pettifer (25) v K. Simpson (23) - Pettifer
B. Deledio (20) v M. Murphy (20) - Deledio
K. Johnson (29) v H. Scotland (27) - Scotland
A. Raines (21) v A. Walker (21) - Walker
S. Tuck (25) v J. Waite (24) - Waite
G. Tivendale (28) v B. Fisher (23) - Fisher
C. Newman (25) v R. Houlihan (25) - R. Houlihan
J. Schulz (22) v L. Whitnall (28) - Schulz

Richmond 5 - Carlton 7

Thanks wayne. What stands out in that list is the number of "older" (28+) players we have compared to the Blues one. Which is what Plough has been saying all along. Some odd matches too especially age wise. Waite plays virtually KP or 3rd tall whereas Tuck plays as a midfielder? Mind you Petts is lucky to be named ahead of Simpson on current form.

Mike has left out injured players too. At least Browny and Cogs for us; Kouta for them. If he waited a week Stevens would be likely outed too due to his neck problem. That's why comparisons like this are meaningless. Both sides need their best 22 on the park. A few key injuries and the deficiencies become gaping holes.

[mightytiges]

No, the damning reality for Richmond supporters is that its list probably isn't as good as the Carlton list.

The Blues, who finished on the bottom in 2005-06, seem to be making much better progress.

The exercise suggests two things: Richmond supporters need to be patient -- yes, again -- and Carlton's solid start to the season is based on substance as much as confidence and enthusiasm.

Nice one Mike 

On current form

J. Bowden (29) v B. Thornton (24) - Bowden
M. Richardson (32) v B. Fevola (26)- Richo
T. Simmonds (29) v C. Ackland (25) - Draw (Simmo not fit; Ackland a dud)
N. Foley (22) v N. Stevens (27) - Foley
K. Pettifer (25) v K. Simpson (23) - Pettifer
B. Deledio (20) v M. Murphy (20) - Deledio
K. Johnson (29) v H. Scotland (27) - Scotland
A. Raines (21) v A. Walker (21) - Raines
S. Tuck (25) v J. Waite (24) - Waite
G. Tivendale (28) v B. Fisher (23) - Fisher
C. Newman (25) v R. Houlihan (25) - Newman
J. Schulz (22) v L. Whitnall (28) - Draw  (both struggling big time)

7-3 and 2 draws.

[Passionfruit]

You obviously havent watched Andrew Walker play, is a gun.
Would think Rainsey would be a bit disappointed with his form this year As for Whitnall and Shultz, and least Lance can get a game

[Bulluss]

You obviously havent watched Andrew Walker play, is a gun.
Would think Rainsey would be a bit disappointed with his form this year As for Whitnall and Shultz, and least Lance can get a game

Agreed, Walker was slow over his first 2-3 seasons but this year has showed why he was the number one pick in his year.

He is a gun, would swap him for Raines in a heartbeat.

[Ramps]

You obviously havent watched Andrew Walker play, is a gun.
Would think Rainsey would be a bit disappointed with his form this year As for Whitnall and Shultz, and least Lance can get a game

I agree on walker. for mine hes a better player than raines but in the end it all comes down to individual choices.

[bluey_21]

You obviously havent watched Andrew Walker play, is a gun.
Would think Rainsey would be a bit disappointed with his form this year As for Whitnall and Shultz, and least Lance can get a game

Agreed, Walker was slow over his first 2-3 seasons but this year has showed why he was the number one pick in his year.

He is a gun, would swap him for Raines in a heartbeat.

he was the 2nd pick behind Cooney 

[bluey_21]

Also, would take Walker over Rainsey but they are hard to compare.

Both went in the same draft but one went some 70 places later than the other

you'd expect the 2nd pick >>>>>>  70 something pick

[mightytiges]

Walker was pick 2 after Cooney in the 2003 draft. McLean was pick 5. I know who I'd rather have.  Rainesy was pick 76.

I did say on current form which was Mike's criteria . Hard to call anyone a gun in a side that's conceded 54 goals in the past 2 weeks  . Anyway my post was more a go at Mike's stupid comparison. Both sides are down the bottom of the ladder for a reason.

[bluey_21]

Let me guess, you'd rather McLean don't you MT