Federal Election

[WilliamPowell]

Good news - looks like the independents are behind the NBN

http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-national/independents-seem-to-favour-nbn-20100822-13an7.html

What would be really funny is if the Greens and these independents give the government another term and are big on public infrastructure, social reform, the republic (as Oakeshott is), big Australia etc it could end up worse for the Libs than if Labor had won outright 

Yes was thinking the same thing jake

Also there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of love from the independants and one Barnaby Joyce which is another good laugh 

[mightytiges]

This result proves to all that unless your name is Bob Hawke, Labor aren't any good at running government longer than 3 years! Their history speaks loud and clear.
After a landslide victory in 2007 when we all were hopeful that Rudd could make a real difference he was shafted by his own party revealing to all that Labor can't be trusted to govern with a mandate from the Australian public. It shows that Labor are a fractured, unstable organisation with too many hidden agendas and too many heads trying to drive a ship. Problem is that with a constitution that has a 40/40/20 rule that is discrimminatory and is un Australian, the party members are unable to work together or trust one another. Therefore the ship will always sink  
A great example of this was Maxine McKew who was a strong supporter of Kevin '07. In her own words she was "factionless" and was therefore NOT supported by Julia's growing faction The Emily's list. Not even a train line could save her in the end.  
In conclusion
Luke 11:17
Geez knew their thoughts and said to them: "Any kingdom divided against itself will be ruined, and a house divided against itself will fall.

John Curtin was such a disaster of a Labor PM wasn't he leading the country through WWII before he died in office  . You might also want to check your Australian history of the Gorton/McMahon period if you want to see unstable government in self destruct mode - Malcolm Fraser openingly bagged his own PM John Gorton; Gorton is then challenged by Billy MacMahon but the leadership vote ended up a tie so by Liberal party rules Gorton had to step down; Gorton then runs for and wins the deputy leadership forcing McMahon to make Gorton his defence minister; McMahon then sacks Gorton for disloyalty. Then we had the split in the Libs in 1977 when Don Chipp broke away to form the Democrats.  1968-1982 was a shambles for Australia politically and economically from both sides. Both parties have had major implosions in our history (ALP-DLP split in 1954 was the biggest on the Labor side) and to think otherwise is just showing blatant bias.

If you believe there are no factions in the Liberal party then you're living in la la land. Abbott won the Liberal party leadership by ONE vote over Turnbull. The Liberal party is split between hardcore conservative and moderate small "l" liberal factions just as the ALP is split between left and right wing factions. With the massive egos in politics on all sides there is always someone waiting to knife their own or opponent to jump up the political ladder.

[Fishfinger]

No scriptures at the end, mt?  

I think it's meant to add some kind of substance to waffle, so you don't need to.  
Seeing it just makes me think of Fred Nile.

[mightytiges]

No scriptures at the end, mt?  

"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the iniquities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of the darkness. For he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you."

 

[one-eyed]

Independents Katter, Windsor and Oakeshott are planning to vote as a block.

http://www.theage.com.au/federal-election/trio-joins-forces-as-gillard-claims-right-to-govern-20100822-13axd.html?autostart=1

[Fishfinger]

Samuel L Jackson vs Fred Nile. It's on!

[FNM]

Very good MT 

Watch the video 

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-election/hilarious-taiwanese-spoof-on-australian-election-20100821-139n4.html?autostart=1

[Tigeritis™©®]

This result proves to all that unless your name is Bob Hawke, Labor aren't any good at running government longer than 3 years! Their history speaks loud and clear.
After a landslide victory in 2007 when we all were hopeful that Rudd could make a real difference he was shafted by his own party revealing to all that Labor can't be trusted to govern with a mandate from the Australian public. It shows that Labor are a fractured, unstable organisation with too many hidden agendas and too many heads trying to drive a ship. Problem is that with a constitution that has a 40/40/20 rule that is discrimminatory and is un Australian, the party members are unable to work together or trust one another. Therefore the ship will always sink  
A great example of this was Maxine McKew who was a strong supporter of Kevin '07. In her own words she was "factionless" and was therefore NOT supported by Julia's growing faction The Emily's list. Not even a train line could save her in the end.  
In conclusion
Luke 11:17
Geez knew their thoughts and said to them: "Any kingdom divided against itself will be ruined, and a house divided against itself will fall.

John Curtin was such a disaster of a Labor PM wasn't he leading the country through WWII before he died in office  . You might also want to check your Australian history of the Gorton/McMahon period if you want to see unstable government in self destruct mode - Malcolm Fraser openingly bagged his own PM John Gorton; Gorton is then challenged by Billy MacMahon but the leadership vote ended up a tie so by Liberal party rules Gorton had to step down; Gorton then runs for and wins the deputy leadership forcing McMahon to make Gorton his defence minister; McMahon then sacks Gorton for disloyalty. Then we had the split in the Libs in 1977 when Don Chipp broke away to form the Democrats.  1968-1982 was a shambles for Australia politically and economically from both sides. Both parties have had major implosions in our history (ALP-DLP split in 1954 was the biggest on the Labor side) and to think otherwise is just showing blatant bias.

If you believe there are no factions in the Liberal party then you're living in la la land. Abbott won the Liberal party leadership by ONE vote over Turnbull. The Liberal party is split between hardcore conservative and moderate small "l" liberal factions just as the ALP is split between left and right wing factions. With the massive egos in politics on all sides there is always someone waiting to knife their own or opponent to jump up the political ladder.

comparing the liberal democratic process of voting in a leader to the ALP system of knifing is laughable just read their constitution and you will see all the "hidden" rules regarding factions. There is absolutely nothing in the liberal party constitution that accounts for factions at all. 
The 40/40/20 affirmative action rule is a joke and anyone with eyes can read that garbage.
There may be differences in party politics but as the Abbott and Turnbull experience showed, when the party is ALLOWED TO VOTE democracy wins because ALL have a say.   

On the independants it's most likely you will all have your way and the Gillard government will be returned despite MORE people voting for liberal in Australia than the ALP.
It's likely that the faceless MAFIA men behind the ALP will probably make an offer the independants can't refuse. 

[WilliamPowell]

On the independants it's most likely you will all have your way and the Gillard government will be returned despite MORE people voting for liberal in Australia than the ALP.
It's likely that the faceless MAFIA men behind the ALP will probably make an offer the independants can't refuse.  

Well gee if you are going to use the argument that more people voted for the COALITION (it's not just the Liberal party BTW) then perhaps retrospectively we should allow Kim Beasley to be PM for a period seeing that in IIRC 1996 1998 the Labor party won the majority of the primary vote but Howard & the Coalition won the election with the higer number of two part preferred votes ..

Hmmmm sound familar?

You are using numbers to make your case which using history doesn't stack up  

The bottom line is that neither of the major parties have been given the right by the people of this country to govern in their own right.

Now if Tony wants to do a deal I suggest he throw away the "John Howard/Paul Keating I was Born to Rule; It is my right after Saturday Night" handbook and start showing some respect to our system, our constitution, our country and the people of this country and talk to these people rather harping on about how after Saturday night the result shows that only he has the right to form a government and not the incumbants.

  

[the_boy_jake]

On the independants it's most likely you will all have your way and the Gillard government will be returned despite MORE people voting for liberal in Australia than the ALP. 

That is such a p!ssweak point.

Everybody knows that in a full preferential system it comes down to which of the major parties you put first on the ballot paper, and 150,000 more Australians put Labor ahead of Liberal.

[FNM]

Maybe they may look at the New Zealand system now.  Not sure how it works or if it will work for us, but they have a number of ministers from minority parties, like Maori Party, ACT and United Future. 
They seem to have a pretty stable working relationship.

http://www.elections.org.nz/voting/mmp/history-mmp.html

[the_boy_jake]

Maybe they may look at the New Zealand system now.  Not sure how it works or if it will work for us, but they have a number of ministers from minority parties, like Maori Party, ACT and United Future. 
They seem to have a pretty stable working relationship.

http://www.elections.org.nz/voting/mmp/history-mmp.html

If we adopted exactly the same system we would have (roughly speaking)

Labor :- 65
Liberal :- 51
LNP :- 15
Green :- 19

Although one would expect to see the Nationals pile in with the Liberals to get 5% of the vote, which would see:

Labor :- 62
Lib/Nat/LNP :- 70
Grn :- 18

Personally I'm not sure it makes for better government as it dilutes executive power. The oscillation between left and right in the two-party system tends to have a self-correcting effect, and we already have a form of proportional representation in the upper house.

[FNM]

NZ don't have an upper house either, so it's a system that would operate a lot better than ours when a minor party/independents don't hold the balance of power, like our Senate.
Going to be very complex, and I think, like NZ, people will be frustrated and will be wanting some kind of change to the voting system.
No-one wins in this and we'll be back to the polls pretty soon I'd think.
 

[Tigeritis™©®]

On the independants it's most likely you will all have your way and the Gillard government will be returned despite MORE people voting for liberal in Australia than the ALP.
It's likely that the faceless MAFIA men behind the ALP will probably make an offer the independants can't refuse. 

Well gee if you are going to use the argument that more people voted for the COALITION (it's not just the Liberal party BTW) then perhaps retrospectively we should allow Kim Beasley to be PM for a period seeing that in IIRC 1996 the Labor party won the majority of the primary vote but Howard & the Coalition won the election with the higer number of two part preferred votes ..

Hmmmm sound familar?

You are using numbers to make your case which using history doesn't stack up 

The bottom line is that neither of the major parties have been given the right by the people of this country to govern in their own right.

Now if Tony wants to do a deal I suggest he throw away the "John Howard/Paul Keating I was Born to Rule; It is my right after Saturday Night" handbook and start showing some respect to our system, our constitution, our country and the people of this country and talk to these people rather harping on about how after Saturday night the result shows that only he has the right to form a government and not the incumbants.

   

sorry WP but I was making a point about the ALP factions in reply to what MT was saying. 
the bit about more votes to the coalition (I meant coalition) was just a fact I put in there.
Lastly, I liked Kim Beasley alot. I just don't like the ALP.   

[FNM]

This could bring on an unheard of scenario where the Coalition and Labor will work together on a number of things I'm thinking.
The Greens want to bring on a debate in Parliament about bringing troops home from Afghanistan.  Well, I don't think either the Coalition or Labor want to bring them home, so they will outnumber the Greens in the Senate should a bill get through to them.
Hopefully, they can work together more on other issues.
How long are Senate terms?
Whether we have another federal election sooner rather than later, Senators remain for their period of office
God help us