David King on 3AW RE: Bowden

[tigersalive]

I didn't think much of it pre-game on 3aw until now.

Someone called up and said about Bowden having 37 possessions last week and still not being selected.

King then went on to reply with something along the lines of, "Yes he was good, yes he had 37 quality possessions and did well on his man but that is not all we we want from him."

So it seems Bowdens character on field is being questioned, I cant think of anything else it can be.   

[one-eyed]

Well the 3XX commentators said Joel as well as Petts were playing for Richmond selection and not for the (Coburg) jumper. That's pretty damning if true. Interesting to get the views of those that went today when they get back from the game.

[Mr Magic]

I didn't think much of it pre-game on 3aw until now.

Someone called up and said about Bowden having 37 possessions last week and still not being selected.

King then went on to reply with something along the lines of, "Yes he was good, yes he had 37 quality possessions and did well on his man but that is not all we we want from him."

So it seems Bowdens character on field is being questioned, I cant think of anything else it can be.   

Geez pretty stiff if he got 37 possessions and didn't get selected?

[Judge Roughneck]

I didn't think much of it pre-game on 3aw until now.

Someone called up and said about Bowden having 37 possessions last week and still not being selected.

King then went on to reply with something along the lines of, "Yes he was good, yes he had 37 quality possessions and did well on his man but that is not all we we want from him."

So it seems Bowdens character on field is being questioned, I cant think of anything else it can be.   

Geez pretty stiff if he got 37 possessions and didn't get selected?

Bowden is hard not to rate. Most of those touches would of got to a player, he reads the game well and is a good kick.

What is his postion in our future side? If a player of Richos ilk has had to move a wing to allow the developement, what do u do with Bowden. He is clearly too good for VFL level, even his brother made it look pee easy.

IMO the back 6 has to be allowed developed; it's looking:
FB - Thursty
CHB - Schultz
3rd tall - Moore, McGaune/Rance
runners - McMahon, King, Newman

Bowden is too slow for middle.

Perhaps needs to be fighting for Pettifers spot as the 6th/7th forward. He would be an intersting 3rd tall option up front. Wouldn't play a dissimilar role to what Reiwoldt did last week.

HF: Morton Polak Bowden
 F: Brown Reiwoldt Edwards

Intersting mix.

Hyde needs to do something this week to keep his spot.

[mightytiges]

The question marks over Joel now is the defensive side of his game and the effectiveness of his many disposals. He can get a heap of footy and cleanly dispose of it but if those disposals are hardly influential on the game while his opponent with fewer possessions is influential then he'll stay on the outer. Read Foley's quote in the Australian today. Ablett (again today), Judd (when fit at the Eagles) and Kerr make oppositions pay on the scoreboard when they get their hands on the footy.

[Mr Magic]

The question marks over Joel now is the defensive side of his game and the effectiveness of his many disposals. He can get a heap of footy and cleanly dispose of it but if those disposals are hardly influential on the game while his opponent with fewer possessions is influential then he'll stay on the outer. Read Foley's quote in the Australian today. Ablett (again today), Judd (when fit at the Eagles) and Kerr make oppositions pay on the scoreboard when they get their hands on the footy.

Sure but I do find it all very strange.
TW & co have said Joel needs to go back to regain his touch and then he picks up 37 disposals but doesn't get recalled for today's game?!
What more can you ask for than that? 50?

I guarantee if it was one of our younger players knocking up those sorts of numbers they'd be a walk up start.
He is a far better player than many of the players in our current 22.
Can't help but feel that Joel's being scapegoated here or there's something more to it.
One would hope the team plays well today or I'll be asking further questions.

[jezza]

I think he was scapegoated a bit, there were plenty of senior guys in the first few games that were poor. But mainly I think he's lost that defensive part of his game. Last few seasons he would often but his body on the line in defence and was IMO generally underappreciated for it, but this year he hasn't looked at all interested in doing it. I think until they really see that desperation from him defensively they wait as long as they can before bringing him back.

The current defensive group of Thursty, McGuane, King, Schulz, Newman, all go in hard at the ball. Joel needs to be as well to be considered.

[Tigermonk]

He will be back next week 

[Mr Magic]

The current defensive group of Thursty, McGuane, King, Schulz, Newman, all go in hard at the ball. Joel needs to be as well to be considered.

Hmm.. maybe.
Tim Flemming went hard at the ball too.
The hard ball has never really been where Bowdo excels but what he does he has done very well for some time.

Seems to me Terry Wallace has in the last 3 season played anyone but Joel in the LMID role Bowdo made his own in the years he won his JDMs and AA selections.
Why Wallace hasn't utilised him in that role he is most effective in over the past 3 years is largely because Bowden's been forced out of it to play as a makeshift KPP, largely due to terrible list management and poor recycled recruitment.
To his credit and despite being severely mismatched Joel performed these tasks manfully.

But now that we've got a couple of genuine KPDs in Schulz and Thursty are doing a job, Joel's been moved out but still being asked to play roles he's not ideally suited to by Terry and co. (eg on Medhurst). Very strange hence the scapegoat call.

As a creative defender Joel Bowden is one of the best in the business off half back. What he does, he does very well so why change it?
The answer why he hasn't been returned to LMID? Jordan McMahon, Terry's new project for this season in the wake of Paddy Bowden & Graham Polak.

[Tigermonk]

The current defensive group of Thursty, McGuane, King, Schulz, Newman, all go in hard at the ball. Joel needs to be as well to be considered.

Hmm.. maybe.
Tim Flemming went hard at the ball too.
The hard ball has never really been where Bowdo excels but what he does he has done very well for some time.

Seems to me Terry Wallace has in the last 3 season played anyone but Joel in the LMID role Bowdo made his own in the years he won his JDMs and AA selections.
Why Wallace hasn't utilised him in that role he is most effective in over the past 3 years is largely because Bowden's been forced out of it to play as a makeshift KPP, largely due to terrible list management and poor recycled recruitment.
To his credit and despite being severely mismatched Joel performed these tasks manfully.

But now that we've got a couple of genuine KPDs in Schulz and Thursty are doing a job, Joel's been moved out but still being asked to play roles he's not ideally suited to by Terry and co. (eg on Medhurst). Very strange hence the scapegoat call.

As a creative defender Joel Bowden is one of the best in the business off half back. What he does, he does very well so why change it?
The answer why he hasn't been returned to LMID? Jordan McMahon, Terry's new project for this season in the wake of Paddy Bowden & Graham Polak.

Great Post  could not been put any better

[richmondrules]

IMO the way the boys played against Freo made it very hard to drop any of them. Would not have been fair. You can argue Freo played like a load of dog droppings but the players can only play against the team that is placed against them on the park. There can be no argument that they did the job last week.

It is entirely JB's fault he was in the seconds when the boys played well, so unfortunately for him he is going to have to guts it out in the seconds until an opportunity arises. We will see the character of the man to see how he responds to a potentially protracted stay at Coburg.

Personally I hope he is there for a while because that will signal the RFC is playing well and we have no injuries. Joel is too good a player to stay at Coburg, he'll be back soon enough but it is with interest that I watch his attitude for it will surely should how much of a team player he really is.

[Smokey]

As a creative defender Joel Bowden is one of the best in the business off half back. What he does, he does very well so why change it?
The answer why he hasn't been returned to LMID? Jordan McMahon, Terry's new project for this season in the wake of Paddy Bowden & Graham Polak.

Yeah, don't really know either but I'll chuck a possibility out there.  Maybe the footy department are looking at a number of things post 'stalwarts' and Bowden is struggling to fill a different role.  Just as we saw Richo fill an entirely different role last week, maybe they have asked Bowden to do the same and he has come up short?  No opinion, just a thought.

[Mr Magic]

As a creative defender Joel Bowden is one of the best in the business off half back. What he does, he does very well so why change it?
The answer why he hasn't been returned to LMID? Jordan McMahon, Terry's new project for this season in the wake of Paddy Bowden & Graham Polak.

Yeah, don't really know either but I'll chuck a possibility out there.  Maybe the footy department are looking at a number of things post 'stalwarts' and Bowden is struggling to fill a different role.  Just as we saw Richo fill an entirely different role last week, maybe they have asked Bowden to do the same and he has come up short?  No opinion, just a thought.

That's a fair point.

[Ox]

Joel has been recognised for the turd he is.
His attitude is his biggest enemy and my biggest friend.
As i said weeks ago - this is mostly politically motivated

[tigerfan1961]

As a creative defender Joel Bowden is one of the best in the business off half back. What he does, he does very well so why change it?
The answer why he hasn't been returned to LMID? Jordan McMahon, Terry's new project for this season in the wake of Paddy Bowden & Graham Polak.

Yeah, don't really know either but I'll chuck a possibility out there.  Maybe the footy department are looking at a number of things post 'stalwarts' and Bowden is struggling to fill a different role.  Just as we saw Richo fill an entirely different role last week, maybe they have asked Bowden to do the same and he has come up short?  No opinion, just a thought.

The biggest problem I have seen with JB is he is quite loose on his man, and when he does get the footy, he completely slows the tempo with which we/TW are trying to move the ball. He just stops and props and by the time he does move it on, the flood has happened.

He has to move the ball on more quickly in my opinion and be more accountable.