Alternative guernseys

[mightytiges]

The club should use it to find a new sponsor and get some cash. Most will be against it...but if its the edict of the AFL then we may as well get something decent out of it. Maybe people can put up some nice designs.

I agree RT - in a perfect world I wouldn't change it but if the AFL (the 17th team in the competition ) are telling us me must have an alternative then we need to use it to our advantage. Having an alternate strip doesn't mean we have to change our colours - just the design.

Agree. If the AFL forces us to have one and we can find a attractive design (the hard bit) then we should aim to get the best deal out of it for the club.

I'm not a fan of the big tiger head on the front. If we're going to go down this path and make a quid out of it then stick the club's full logo on the left shoulder with one major sponsor (Motorola) across the front and the other major sponsor (AFG) across the back underneath the numbers.

That training guernsey is also a bit plain. Perhaps add a tiger skin stripes pattern on the top left shoulder and bottom right in a similar fashion to the old claw pre-season jumper so there's some link to the sash of our traditional guenrsey. 

[Tiger Spirit]

u missed the boat , those things have already happened . u cant change that. its like the rich get richer and poor get poorer, does not matter who is in government and what policy or tax system is in place its just a fact of life. and b4 the afl became afl, the vfl was always dominated by money- the richer clubs at the time.

Yes, but it was the Clubs who determined their own destiny and that’s the whole point of my argument.

loyalty left afl along time ago but we still support our teams.

we cant live in the past, its very romantic to thinlk that one day loyalty and the jumper will come 1st and not money but those days are over. we can all see whats happening to football, not just u, but thats just the process of evolution one could say, the game continues to evolve.

As far as loyalty goes, you cannot possibly compare Euro soccer with the AFL?

In many ways, you cannot begin to compare the two.  For those who follow the EPL for example, supporters of lowly teams in that competition would just have to content themselves with having and supporting a team, and that’s all.  The notion of winning anything of any note depends almost solely on whether some oil magnate wants to buy and invest heavily in your Club.

I don’t believe we have that same sense of hopelessness with our AFL Clubs.

With the salary cap and draft(s) it makes it very difficult for players to want to leave a certain Club because they have a hard time getting to the Club of their choice.  Unlike in Euro soccer where it’s open slather and the highest bidder generally wins.

Trying to imitate competitions that are run in a completely different way is asking for trouble.

so de we shoot dwn jack dyer(rip) because he invented the punt kick which killed off completely the drop kick. traditions and the game changed then. do we do the same with polly farmer for really bringing handball skills to the game. once apon a time kicking out on the full was a ball up, not a free kick. its romantic to think traditions will stay but they dont, they change , just as they do in culture.

All these changes are evolutions of the game.  They were made by people who played and were involved in the game, not some executive who wouldn’t know a football from a tomato.

You’re assuming I’m opposed to change.  I’m not at all.  I’m opposed to why changes happen and who makes them.  There’s a big difference between being dictated to by those who have no idea where we’ve been, and/or where we’re going and being led by those who have a big picture view of things.  That’s the basis of my argument.

u either jump on the train and enjoy the ride and see where it takes u or u give up supporting the sport full stop , because whether we like it or not, things , rules, traditions, jumpers, players, coaches, game styles will always change.

that life

I expect things to continue to change but, as I’ve said before, I just don’t expect people who shouldn’t be making certain decisions to be making changes they have no right to make on behalf of those who have earned that right.  That’s all.

[letsgetiton!]

u missed the boat , those things have already happened . u cant change that. its like the rich get richer and poor get poorer, does not matter who is in government and what policy or tax system is in place its just a fact of life. and b4 the afl became afl, the vfl was always dominated by money- the richer clubs at the time.

Yes, but it was the Clubs who determined their own destiny and that’s the whole point of my argument.

loyalty left afl along time ago but we still support our teams.

we cant live in the past, its very romantic to thinlk that one day loyalty and the jumper will come 1st and not money but those days are over. we can all see whats happening to football, not just u, but thats just the process of evolution one could say, the game continues to evolve.

As far as loyalty goes, you cannot possibly compare Euro soccer with the AFL?

In many ways, you cannot begin to compare the two.  For those who follow the EPL for example, supporters of lowly teams in that competition would just have to content themselves with having and supporting a team, and that’s all.  The notion of winning anything of any note depends almost solely on whether some oil magnate wants to buy and invest heavily in your Club.

I don’t believe we have that same sense of hopelessness with our AFL Clubs.

With the salary cap and draft(s) it makes it very difficult for players to want to leave a certain Club because they have a hard time getting to the Club of their choice.  Unlike in Euro soccer where it’s open slather and the highest bidder generally wins.

Trying to imitate competitions that are run in a completely different way is asking for trouble.

so de we shoot dwn jack dyer(rip) because he invented the punt kick which killed off completely the drop kick. traditions and the game changed then. do we do the same with polly farmer for really bringing handball skills to the game. once apon a time kicking out on the full was a ball up, not a free kick. its romantic to think traditions will stay but they dont, they change , just as they do in culture.

All these changes are evolutions of the game.  They were made by people who played and were involved in the game, not some executive who wouldn’t know a football from a tomato.

You’re assuming I’m opposed to change.  I’m not at all.  I’m opposed to why changes happen and who makes them.  There’s a big difference between being dictated to by those who have no idea where we’ve been, and/or where we’re going and being led by those who have a big picture view of things.  That’s the basis of my argument.

u either jump on the train and enjoy the ride and see where it takes u or u give up supporting the sport full stop , because whether we like it or not, things , rules, traditions, jumpers, players, coaches, game styles will always change.

that life

I expect things to continue to change but, as I’ve said before, I just don’t expect people who shouldn’t be making certain decisions to be making changes they have no right to make on behalf of those who have earned that right.  That’s all.

i know where u are coming from and i know what u say is correct. i dont follow epl, i follow seria A in italy.

personally i dont wanna see us change our strip, and when we got the sash back i felt like a soldier in a whore house  , as happy as a kid in a lolly shop!

unfortunately we are at an era where vladimir dimitriou thinks he is fidel castro, and i just think if we have to change cos they say so , lets try and make the most of it. the afl basically own all the clubs, they are like the mafia, u cant beat them

[Darth Tiger]

Enjoying the debate surrounding the alternative strip on OER.

IMO, an alternative strip would be once every 2 years (away against the Bummers), and would enable a tie-in with the Dreamtime game.

As long as the alternative jumper is allocated to this specific event (and not used in finals), I would happily support the amendment.

[PuntRdRoar]

can someone do up the design on a package i was talking about before

all black jumper
yellow hoop
white hoop

there is a small gap between both hoops according to the goss.  so basically

black top
yellow hoop
small black hoop
white hoop
black bottom


anyway someone will get what i mean. and im sure if we implemented it and gotta a sponsor itd be worth $1 million to a company like Telstra and its Yellow Pages business.

[bluey_21]

u missed the boat , those things have already happened . u cant change that. its like the rich get richer and poor get poorer, does not matter who is in government and what policy or tax system is in place its just a fact of life. and b4 the afl became afl, the vfl was always dominated by money- the richer clubs at the time.

Yes, but it was the Clubs who determined their own destiny and that’s the whole point of my argument.

loyalty left afl along time ago but we still support our teams.

we cant live in the past, its very romantic to thinlk that one day loyalty and the jumper will come 1st and not money but those days are over. we can all see whats happening to football, not just u, but thats just the process of evolution one could say, the game continues to evolve.

As far as loyalty goes, you cannot possibly compare Euro soccer with the AFL?

In many ways, you cannot begin to compare the two.  For those who follow the EPL for example, supporters of lowly teams in that competition would just have to content themselves with having and supporting a team, and that’s all.  The notion of winning anything of any note depends almost solely on whether some oil magnate wants to buy and invest heavily in your Club.

I don’t believe we have that same sense of hopelessness with our AFL Clubs.

With the salary cap and draft(s) it makes it very difficult for players to want to leave a certain Club because they have a hard time getting to the Club of their choice.  Unlike in Euro soccer where it’s open slather and the highest bidder generally wins.

Trying to imitate competitions that are run in a completely different way is asking for trouble.

so de we shoot dwn jack dyer(rip) because he invented the punt kick which killed off completely the drop kick. traditions and the game changed then. do we do the same with polly farmer for really bringing handball skills to the game. once apon a time kicking out on the full was a ball up, not a free kick. its romantic to think traditions will stay but they dont, they change , just as they do in culture.

All these changes are evolutions of the game.  They were made by people who played and were involved in the game, not some executive who wouldn’t know a football from a tomato.

You’re assuming I’m opposed to change.  I’m not at all.  I’m opposed to why changes happen and who makes them.  There’s a big difference between being dictated to by those who have no idea where we’ve been, and/or where we’re going and being led by those who have a big picture view of things.  That’s the basis of my argument.

u either jump on the train and enjoy the ride and see where it takes u or u give up supporting the sport full stop , because whether we like it or not, things , rules, traditions, jumpers, players, coaches, game styles will always change.

that life

I expect things to continue to change but, as I’ve said before, I just don’t expect people who shouldn’t be making certain decisions to be making changes they have no right to make on behalf of those who have earned that right.  That’s all.

personally i dont wanna see us change our strip, and when we got the sash back i felt like a soldier in a whore house  , as happy as a kid in a lolly shop!

Yeah, can't beat the original

[mightytiges]

can someone do up the design on a package i was talking about before

all black jumper
yellow hoop
white hoop

there is a small gap between both hoops according to the goss.  so basically

black top
yellow hoop
small black hoop
white hoop
black bottom


anyway someone will get what i mean. and im sure if we implemented it and gotta a sponsor itd be worth $1 million to a company like Telstra and its Yellow Pages business.

Something like this Ramps?

[mightytiges]

I'm not a fan of the big tiger head on the front. If we're going to go down this path and make a quid out of it then stick the club's full logo on the left shoulder with one major sponsor (Motorola) across the front and the other major sponsor (AFG) across the back underneath the numbers.

That training guernsey is also a bit plain. Perhaps add a tiger skin stripes pattern on the top left shoulder and bottom right in a similar fashion to the old claw pre-season jumper so there's some link to the sash of our traditional guenrsey. 

Here's kind of what I was thinking of for something completely different

[Harry]

I was in the US and was watching some highlights of AFL games with an american mate.  He was amazed how much alot of the teams jumpers clashed.  He said it was ridiculous.  I agreed.  It would improve the spectacle if all teams had alternate tops.

IMO we clash with Essendon, Adelaide and Westcoast.  Watching Melbourne v Essendon is a joke so is Carlton v Black based collingwood.  Carlton v the original st.kilda was also a severe clash.  I don't know why Collingwood don't re-introduce their white base jumper as an alternate as IMO it looks better and creates the perfect alternate top.  Wear the white base jumper when playing away to a predominately dark opposition with the white shorts.

The Hawks and Swans don't have to worry as their jumpers don't clash with anyone.  The roos and saints have adopted the alternate jumpers so they're ok. 

It's such a good marketing opportunity and I don't see why people are getting so precious about it.  It's not like the AFL are telling us to get rid of our original guernsey - that will never happen.  There's nothing wrong with adding some change and spice to the clubs. 

I'm all for a yellow based alternate strip, but the only problem I have is that it doesn't look good with the white shorts.  To overcome this we could incorporate some white in our design to better match the shorts.  Possibly white down the sides with a black border, and/or white borders around the black numbers (like what brisbane and adelaide have) and/or a white border around the black sash (like what west coast have around their gold wings).  Also maybe white borders around the black neckline and shoulderline.  If we were to have the tiger head instead of the black sash, maybe incorporate white into the tiger head, similar to our emblem.

Mighty, could you give this design a go if you've got time.

[letsgetiton!]

I'm not a fan of the big tiger head on the front. If we're going to go down this path and make a quid out of it then stick the club's full logo on the left shoulder with one major sponsor (Motorola) across the front and the other major sponsor (AFG) across the back underneath the numbers.

That training guernsey is also a bit plain. Perhaps add a tiger skin stripes pattern on the top left shoulder and bottom right in a similar fashion to the old claw pre-season jumper so there's some link to the sash of our traditional guenrsey. 

Here's kind of what I was thinking of for something completely different

that looks good mt

that could work!

[julzqld]

You could always have shirts on/shirts off

Seriously, I like MT's yellow design.  The other one looks too much like Adelaide.

[tiga]

Call me a traditionalist, but I would like to see our jumper remain as it always should be with the Full yellow sash on a black jumper.
Alternative gurnseys are just a merchandisers wet dream. Some clubs in other codes have been known to change their jumpers on a regular basis in the deliberate attempt to increase merchandising profits. I don't want out club heading in that direction. Whilst I think that MT's designs look good, I don't believe it is the right move for the club to head in this direction.

[PuntRdRoar]

can someone do up the design on a package i was talking about before

all black jumper
yellow hoop
white hoop

there is a small gap between both hoops according to the goss.  so basically

black top
yellow hoop
small black hoop
white hoop
black bottom


anyway someone will get what i mean. and im sure if we implemented it and gotta a sponsor itd be worth $1 million to a company like Telstra and its Yellow Pages business.

Something like this Ramps?

the white hoop is the same size as the yellow hoop and the gap between the yellow and white hoop is bigger. Anyway thats what people were saying a while back. I would however conside placing the tiger logo where the motorola logo is and then place the sponsor logo just directly underneath it. the one thing in this jumper design which is good is that the sponsors logos are really clear, especially the AFG one, and the number is also easy to see.

[WilliamPowell]

Here's some more from Greg Denham in today's Australian.

I've put in bold what relates to the Tigers and also a comment by Brian Cook from Geelong (about legal advice they've received) who btw always seems to make sense unlike his couterpart at the Pies Mr Swann (who clearly fits in at Lexus because he seems totally deluded)

======================
Strip rule black and white for Magpies
Greg Denham

February 03, 2006

COLLINGWOOD is only prepared to make a minor change to its guernsey despite an AFL order that clubs wear alternate away strips from next season.

The new edict has forced Richmond, which has historically been against any change to its jumper, to review its position, and Geelong has been forced to come up with a new alternative guernsey.

From 2007, the Magpies will occasionally wear an away jumper with a white back, according to chief executive Greg Swann.
"We won't be changing much," Swann said.

"We reckon we don't clash with anyone. Maybe three or four times a season, away against Carlton, Essendon, St Kilda or Richmond, we'll wear the white back which is what we had in the 1990s and have worn as part of the heritage round."

Swann said he was not aware of whether or not Collingwood's proposed strip would meet AFL approval. "That will be as alternate as it gets from us," he said.

However, the Magpies and the AFL appear set for a showdown as it is understood that the AFL has banned hoops and stripes from alternate jumpers.

After several years of controversy surrounding colour clashes between some Victorian clubs, the league announced on Wednesday that it would force clubs to have two playing uniforms.

A letter from AFL general manager of commercial operations Gillon McLachlan was sent to the 16 clubs. In part, it read: "The AFL has taken the position to mandate that all clubs must have a main playing uniform and an alternate playing uniform."

The league never previously enforced change, mainly because of pressure from Collingwood, which had vowed to never wear anything but its traditional black and white strip during the premiership season.

Geelong chief executive Brian Cook yesterday said his club had been directed by the league to abandon its 2005 away uniform because it conflicted with Collingwood and the Kangaroos.

"The decision has the potential to upset members who have the right to vote on a change of guernsey," Cook said. "Our legal advice, however, is that our AFL licence conditions override our constitution."

Richmond president Gary March yesterday said it was not feasible from a manufacturing point to implement the change for this year.

"We'd prefer to wear our normal strip, but we'll raise it at our next board meeting and with members later in the year," March
said. "The constitution is not quite clear. It's mainly about retaining our black and yellow colours, so we need further clarification from the AFL to what they perceive as being a clash. We don't think there are too many clashes, perhaps against Essendon."

Essendon's position on an alternate away strip is not clear. The Bombers have so far resisted any change away from their black and red sash.

Melbourne will wear its predominantly red alternate jumper. Last season it used the guernsey twice, in away games against Carlton and Essendon.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,18022109%255E2722,00.html

[WilliamPowell]

That's what I'd like to see if we have to go down this path which is clearly going to be the case.

However my understanding is the AFL have to approve the design (like they do everythng else ) and they (AFL) will only allow a sponsors logo on the front of the jumper to be a certain size and in a certain position (eg where you currently have the Tiger logo)

MT - you should forward your design the Club