Australian Politics thread [merged]

[WilliamPowell]

whenever there is an election it has to include a half senate election or a double disolution of both houses, in the 2nd instance the senate is re-elected in full from what I remember from my school days 20+ years ago. In either case, the Greens will get slaughtered. They will lose there seat in the HoR which is currently held by Brandt. If theyre lucky theyll only have to contend with a half senate election, in any case they will lose some representation in the senate. In the case of a full senate election- the Greens will get wiped out in a similar fashion to the Australian Democrats. Australians are sick and tired of all these socialist twits effing up Australia. Seriously get em out NOW! And that includes the ALP who have become a party of unionist hacks and no hopers who carry on like conga line of suckholes to the yuppies.

And replpace them with the Cats Meow 

[10 FLAGS]

Labor should get Keating out of retirement. Thats when Labor Politics was fun. 

[WilliamPowell]

Labor should get Keating out of retirement. Thats when Labor Politics was fun. 

Keating -v- Abbott - not fun = boring, no contest I wouldn't have thought

The master head kicker -v- the apprentice 

[tiga]

Lets look at some facts here regarding global carbon emissions.

97% of Carbon emissions are caused by nature
3% of Carbon emissions are caused by Humans
Australia as a country is responsible for 1.5% of the 3% of human carbon emissions meaning we are responsible for .0005% of global carbon emissions.
You' don't hear these FACTS being mentioned in Parliament by the government do you!
And our incompetent government is prepared to put our economy at risk with a tax that will strike at the heart of every Australian.

Oh but Cate is urging us to say...."Yes"...But "Yes to what??". Put it to the people Dillard and see just how many people are willing to say "Yes" to a Tax based on inaccurate and poorly interpreted data.

You can put me down for a "NO!"    

[mightytiges]

Lets look at some facts here regarding global carbon emissions.

97% of Carbon emissions are caused by nature
3% of Carbon emissions are caused by Humans
Australia as a country is responsible for 1.5% of the 3% of human carbon emissions meaning we are responsible for .0005% of global carbon emissions.
You' don't hear these FACTS being mentioned in Parliament by the government do you!

Ah this old chestnut  . Sorry tiga but that claim conveniently leaves out that the emissions caused by nature have been part of the natural carbon cycle in the atmosphere for thousands arguably millions of years whereas the human component produced from the burning of fossil fuels is not (fossil fuels are buried underground, then mined to the surface, burnt to extract the energy stored within them, and the waste produced CO2 is released unhindered into the air) We are artifically adding to the CO2 levels in the atmosphere which has seen a rise by almost 40% over the past 150 years (280ppm to 390ppm). For those who argue it's not man-made (ie. burning of fossil fuels and deforestation) could they state what natural phenomena has increased CO2 levels in the atmosphere by 40% in 150 years and continues to increase it? I'll give you a help it's not volcanic or solar activity either. And could they then publish their findings in a recognised scientific journal on climate science. I'm sure the scientists would love a good laugh  .

Furthermore by artifically increasing CO2 levels which is a greenhouse gas we are artifically enhancing the greenhouse effort which as we know is a feedback mechanism so the Earth absorbs more thermal energy. As the amount of thermal energy absorbed has to equal the amount emitted to reach an equilibrium, if more thermal energy is being absorbed thanks to significantly increased levels of CO2 then the average global temperature of the Earth has to rise. This is basic physics FFS! More thermal energy = rising average global temperature = global warming and climate change. Of course to the Andrew Bolt's of this world it's all a conspiracy theory because all these nasty scientists aren't telling them what they want to hear  .

[tiger101]

Worst tax at the worst time. Outside of the mining sector the country is not growing. property prices are stable or falling. Swan could do some real damage to the economy if he pushes this tax through. Make no mistake this tax is only to cover there spending and get there surplus. For them to label it as something that will save the planet is nothing short of a lie. But unfortunately people believe anything there told these days.

[mightytiges]

When is there a good time for any new tax?! It's hardly a popular thing to do. The economy was hardly booming when the GST was introduced.

The world is moving towards pricing carbon (dioxide emissions) whether some want to believe it or not.
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2010-05/10/content_9826546.htm
http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-07-01/india-to-raise-535-million-from-carbon-tax-on-coal.html
http://www.cotce.ca.gov/documents/correspondence/staff_and_commissioners/documents/Carbon%20tax.pdf
http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1492651/at-a-glance-carbon-taxes-around-the-world

[tiger101]

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2010-05/10/content_9826546.htm

Have you read that article MT?

Carbon tax likely, expert forecasts

"We expect China will start to levy various taxes"

These things are not promises from the government on doing anything. The article is over a year old and nothing has been done.

[tiger101]

Also MT if china are so happy with having an ETS why are they fighting the EU over extra costs that will hamper there business that it will effect due to there ETS.

China gets tough over EU ETS inclusion
http://www.greenaironline.com/news.php?viewStory=1232

[mightytiges]

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2010-05/10/content_9826546.htm

Have you read that article MT?

Carbon tax likely, expert forecasts

"We expect China will start to levy various taxes"

These things are not promises from the government on doing anything. The article is over a year old and nothing has been done.

What do you mean nothing has been done. I did say the world is moving towards carbon pricing and trading.

Professor Garnaut said the emerging power was trialling carbon trading in five provinces and three cities - Tianjin, Shanghai and Beijing.
http://www.skynews.com.au/businessnews/article.aspx?id=594916


Sun Cuihua, the vice-director of the climate change department at the National Development and Reform Commission, told conference that the trading schemes will begin in the cities of Beijing, Chongqing, Shanghai and Tianjin and the provinces of Hubei and Guangdong.

"We hope to roll out the pilot regional schemes before 2013 and scale up to a national scheme from 2015,"
http://www.climatespectator.com.au/news/china-plans-nationwide-emissions-trading-2015

[tiga]

Mt you are completely missing my point. The percentages are just semantics. My main cause of argument is the effectiveness of a carbon tax here in Australia v the positive change it would have on a global scale v the negative impact it will have on this country. To me the answer is a no brainer and you don't need a physics or chemistry degree to see that we will be adversely affected for little or no impact on the global scale.
China Carbon tax = No
India Carbon Tax = No
United States Carbon Tax = No

Australia??? whoop de doo! We are a matchstick in a bonfire when it comes to CO2 emissions. We pull our matchstick out of the fire and the fire will keep on burning.

So in the wonderful world of less CO2, tell me, where are my affordable energy alternatives? No Nuclear...No Gas....No good! So whilst everything I know of will go up in price and manufacturing will leave this country to go to all those other places where there will be no carbon tax just so they can compete.

[Penelope]

to continue that line of thought tiga, we could improve our economy by reducing all our environmental laws to the level of China and India. How much better would it be for the economy if we were not so strict on what we could do with all the waste industry produces?

Humans will stuff this planet in the name of money and sometimes the anarchist in me says just bring it on and let happen

[tiger101]

Obviously the government aren't worried about air pollution as long as its not carbon. In my local city a new shop has opened up selling  wood fire heaters due to the current store that sells them are booming they have a long waiting list just to get one. The demand have gone up for wood fires due to electricity costs and now the government want the costs to keep going up turning even more people off air pumps to dirty air pollutant wood fires. All asthmatics can thank Gillard.

[Penelope]

 

[tiger101]

Not to worry the Lefty's (labor/green) will come up with a genius idea like they do with every problem. TAX IT MORE.