Australian Politics thread [merged]

[mightytiges]

I acknowledge that workchoices wasn't a great idea. They shouldve gone to the voting public with this agenda and put it to the people. I think it's wrong to deceive the people like this.
 
Can you both acknowledge that Julia & the labour party deceived the voting public on carbon tax?
Can you both acknowledge she and her deceiving party should have gone to the election with this agenda?
 

1. Gillard has publicly acknowledged she broke her promise.
2. No as Governments should be allowed to change policies midstream if circumstances change and to make unpopular decisions if they are in the long-term interests of the country. If people want to still vote them out at the next election then they can. Sheesh we'd be going to an election every 5 minutes if it was constitutional law to have one every time a pollie broke a promise lol.

Abbott only wants one now because he may not be leader in 2 years time. 

[mightytiges]

Mt you are completely missing my point. The percentages are just semantics. My main cause of argument is the effectiveness of a carbon tax here in Australia v the positive change it would have on a global scale v the negative impact it will have on this country. To me the answer is a no brainer and you don't need a physics or chemistry degree to see that we will be adversely affected for little or no impact on the global scale.
China Carbon tax = No
India Carbon Tax = No
United States Carbon Tax = No

Australia??? whoop de doo! We are a matchstick in a bonfire when it comes to CO2 emissions. We pull our matchstick out of the fire and the fire will keep on burning.

So in the wonderful world of less CO2, tell me, where are my affordable energy alternatives? No Nuclear...No Gas....No good! So whilst everything I know of will go up in price and manufacturing will leave this country to go to all those other places where there will be no carbon tax just so they can compete.

Energy bills to rise by 30% even without a carbon tax. Hardly an incentive to stay with the status quo either tiga .

I think I've answered most of the rest in my other posts somewhere. One way to boost a post count lol.

to continue that line of thought tiga, we could improve our economy by reducing all our environmental laws to the level of China and India. How much better would it be for the economy if we were not so strict on what we could do with all the waste industry produces?

Humans will eff this planet in the name of money and sometimes the anarchist in me says just bring it on and let happen

Reminds me of the fire drill episode in Fawlty Towers where Basil says to the guests in the lobby - "I don't why we bother, we should just let you all die" 

[Tigeritis™©®]

I think it's hilarious that people get caught up in a scientific idea that keeps changing more times than the weather in Melbourne.

These videos I think are very interesting. But who could argue with Dr Spock?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvsAIyUAGyY&feature=youtube_gdata_player

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ox2gmyCXjWk&feature=youtube_gdata_player

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFN3fGuSSlg&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Didn't mamma tell you not to believe everything the papers and tv tells you  .

 

hilarious. Why don't you take your own advice? I can show you heaps of crap these scientists tell us refuting man made climate change. The facts are this why is it that the government funded experts are in agreement with the governments agenda. Show me one scientist that doesn't beleive in man made climate global warming that is funded by a government or isn't that a convenient truth?

[FNM]

Sounds like the old world-is-flat vs world-is-round argument 

[Tigeritis™©®]

Mt you are completely missing my point. The percentages are just semantics. My main cause of argument is the effectiveness of a carbon tax here in Australia v the positive change it would have on a global scale v the negative impact it will have on this country. To me the answer is a no brainer and you don't need a physics or chemistry degree to see that we will be adversely affected for little or no impact on the global scale.
China Carbon tax = No
India Carbon Tax = No
United States Carbon Tax = No

Australia??? whoop de doo! We are a matchstick in a bonfire when it comes to CO2 emissions. We pull our matchstick out of the fire and the fire will keep on burning.

So in the wonderful world of less CO2, tell me, where are my affordable energy alternatives? No Nuclear...No Gas....No good! So whilst everything I know of will go up in price and manufacturing will leave this country to go to all those other places where there will be no carbon tax just so they can compete.

exactly tiga.
If people were really serious or this country then let's charge china am extra premium for using our coal. No let's not sell them any. And we will be the king of the world in the fight against global warming I mean climate change.!!

[Tigeritis™©®]

Sounds like the old world-is-flat vs world-is-round argument 

I'm in the world is round side 

[10 FLAGS]

Labor is finished IMHO. If Gillard stays beyond this year itll take labor atleast a decade before they get re-elected. The Greens will be slaughtered over the next 2 federal election cycles, theyll be gone like the Australian Democrats. The best thing Gillard can do is call an election, lose but not lose as badly as she will in 12 or 18 months time and Labor can win again in 3 to 6 years. This has been a bad period for Labor. A lack of ready leadership, lack of ideas, being led by the nose by Bob Brown. Its just a bad time for Labor. Labor should go into opposition now so Shorten or Combet can be ready to takeover as PM as they develop their leadership CVs as opposition leader. Thats what Labor should do but Gillard is just for Gillard and as a result Labor and Australia will suffer coalition government for atleast a decade when she gets beaten by Abbott at the Polls and it wont be close result either.

[tiger101]

Labor is finished IMHO. If Gillard stays beyond this year itll take labor atleast a decade before they get re-elected. The Greens will be slaughtered over the next 2 federal election cycles, theyll be gone like the Australian Democrats. The best thing Gillard can do is call an election, lose but not lose as badly as she will in 12 or 18 months time and Labor can win again in 3 to 6 years. This has been a bad period for Labor. A lack of ready leadership, lack of ideas, being led by the nose by Bob Brown. Its just a bad time for Labor. Labor should go into opposition now so Shorten or Combet can be ready to takeover as PM as they develop their leadership CVs as opposition leader. Thats what Labor should do but Gillard is just for Gillard and as a result Labor and Australia will suffer coalition government for atleast a decade when she gets beaten by Abbott at the Polls and it wont be close result either.

Combet has his fingers all over this policy now. So he'll be toxic if this policy gets a backlash and liberals win next election. To be honest after Rudd beat Howard I thought Labor have a very good chance of being an easy 3 term majority government. People wanted change from the Howard government. But somehow Labor have got in and took the chance to be in power for granted. They have also back flipped on some big issues.

[Tigeritis™©®]

Labor is finished IMHO. If Gillard stays beyond this year itll take labor atleast a decade before they get re-elected. The Greens will be slaughtered over the next 2 federal election cycles, theyll be gone like the Australian Democrats. The best thing Gillard can do is call an election, lose but not lose as badly as she will in 12 or 18 months time and Labor can win again in 3 to 6 years. This has been a bad period for Labor. A lack of ready leadership, lack of ideas, being led by the nose by Bob Brown. Its just a bad time for Labor. Labor should go into opposition now so Shorten or Combet can be ready to takeover as PM as they develop their leadership CVs as opposition leader. Thats what Labor should do but Gillard is just for Gillard and as a result Labor and Australia will suffer coalition government for atleast a decade when she gets beaten by Abbott at the Polls and it wont be close result either.

Combet has his fingers all over this policy now. So he'll be toxic if this policy gets a backlash and liberals win next election. To be honest after Rudd beat Howard I thought Labor have a very good chance of being an easy 3 term majority government. People wanted change from the Howard government. But somehow Labor have got in and took the chance to be in power for granted. They have also back flipped on some big issues.

labour are inept at implementing any scheme they think of. Pink bats, BER, cash for clunkers, etc. Is there anything they actually did well? The country voted them in with K Rudd as leader but they couldn't even keep him leader for 1 term!  Instead they decided we were better off with a woman who said there was more chance of her lining up alongside Barry Hall then being labour leader. Within weeks she's knifed the most popular PM in years. Why because Labour couldn't organize a local BBQ without wasting billions of tax payer dollars and then burning all the sausages!

[WilliamPowell]

Can you both acknowledge that Julia & the labour party deceived the voting public on carbon tax?
Can you both acknowledge she and her deceiving party should have gone to the election with this agenda?
 

1/ Yes she broke her promise on the carbon tax - not disputing it for a minute. But will say it again she isn't the first and won't be the last pollie to do it... Howard, Keating, Hawke, Fraser they all did it. Hell even Rudd did it by not having the "balls" to call an election and double disolution over his ETS - would won in a landslide IMHO. But he changed that policy mid term but just putting in a drawer somewhere - he was elected on the back of that ETS policy promise

2/ No - because some times you need to change policy during govt, we don't like it but it's the way it goes. It happens in business and this is what is happening here. Again the current govt aren't the first and wont be the last. Strong govts make tough and at times unpopular decisions - how strong this one is will be determined by this Tax and a number of other policies ...

So what do you make of Malcolm Turnball - traitor amongst the Libs, wanna be Leader or just a lowlife under mining Tony. He supports a carbon tax like he did a ETS - it cost him his job when he was knifed in the back by Tony. Please don't paint the Libs as being "lily whites" in the art of deception especially Tony Abbott 

[Francois Jackson]

Labor is finished IMHO. If Gillard stays beyond this year itll take labor atleast a decade before they get re-elected. The Greens will be slaughtered over the next 2 federal election cycles, theyll be gone like the Australian Democrats. The best thing Gillard can do is call an election, lose but not lose as badly as she will in 12 or 18 months time and Labor can win again in 3 to 6 years. This has been a bad period for Labor. A lack of ready leadership, lack of ideas, being led by the nose by Bob Brown. Its just a bad time for Labor. Labor should go into opposition now so Shorten or Combet can be ready to takeover as PM as they develop their leadership CVs as opposition leader. Thats what Labor should do but Gillard is just for Gillard and as a result Labor and Australia will suffer coalition government for atleast a decade when she gets beaten by Abbott at the Polls and it wont be close result either.

I agree Ramps. Rudd was 100 times the better leader than this devil of a woman.

I cant think of 1 single thing she has done right. Even during the floods she was pretending to be something that she is not, thats a caring  responsible and accountable woman.

Im sorry but i just cant see how people can say with a straight face that she should be in the position that she is in.

I am personally embarrassed to say that she is the leader of this country. She is so robotic, just doing what she is told by others.

[tiger101]

I must have missed Abbott asking for an early election when he broke his promise after the 2004 election about not raising the health safety net or when the Libs introduced Workchoices without a mandate after the same election when they realised they had control of both houses. Oh that's right Tony said back then a Government had a right to change its mind  .

I must have missed that one because I was captivated by the then Prime Minister promising us all he wouldn't abuse the power of having control of both houses of parliament.... come to think of it was that another example of a  politician lying to teh electorate 

 

Yep every pollies manifesto should come with an asterix


* promises may be reneged at any stage after you vote for me

I acknowledge that workchoices wasn't a great idea. They shouldve gone to the voting public with this agenda and put it to the people. I think it's wrong to deceive the people like this.
 
Can you both acknowledge that Julia & the labour party deceived the voting public on carbon tax?
Can you both acknowledge she and her deceiving party should have gone to the election with this agenda?
 

Tigra I agree they should at least acknowledge they have changed there policy from the election instead of claiming they have a mandate which we all know they don't have. Surely Labor have to change leaders again before next election Gillards word and credibility is shot to pieces. By going by the poll numbers if they don't start changing soon they are better off looking at how to set up be a strong opposition that can win government again after one term.

[WilliamPowell]

Is there anything they actually did well?

Yeah I would think that keeping this country out of recession during the GFC when practically every other country went into recession is a bloody good achievement

For memory Tony & his treasuer in waiting (or is that leader in waiting  ) Hockey would have happily sent us into recession instead

[FNM]

In the meantime, mining companies go on their merry way 

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011/06/06/3236142.htm

A landmark community court case against the state government and a coal company planning to expand operations in central western New South Wales begins in Sydney today.

The Hunter Environment Lobby group is appealing against the state government approval last November for coal production to be doubled at a mine near Mudgee.

The Xstrata owned Ulan Mine plans to increase production from 10 million tonnes a year to 20 million tonnes a year for 21 years.

The environment group says the merits based appeal is the first in the state to argue against the greenhouse gas emissions caused by mining and the impact on groundwater systems.

The President, Jan Davis, says the government's approvals process will also come under scrutiny.

[tiger101]

Is there anything they actually did well?

Yeah I would think that keeping this country out of recession during the GFC when practically every other country went into recession is a bloody good achievement

For memory Tony & his treasuer in waiting (or is that leader in waiting  ) Hockey would have happily sent us into recession instead

c'mon WP. You know liberals was only against the BER and the pink batt scheme which was nothing but wasteful spending by the government. We didn't have a subprime mortgage crisis like USA. China's stimulus kept the resources exporting and last of all we wasn't in debt prior to the GFC like most other nations that are in debt now.