Australian Politics thread [merged]

[1965]

Interesting read.


https://www.theage.com.au/politics/victoria/power-vacuum-can-the-labor-party-really-clean-up-its-factional-mess-20200618-p5542z.html

"Andrews, never one to waste an opportunity, is emerging as a massive winner from the crisis that has crushed Somyurek's power. The Premier's enemies have largely been neutered and sitting MPs guaranteed their seats for the next round of preselections, set to take place late next year ahead of the 2022 election."

[Francois Jackson]

  the unions say hello 

love watching this corrupt scum cop this backlash

[Francois Jackson]

Told ya its the tip of the branch stack iceberg. More to come i reckon.

remember Ramps when dan said, nope thats it im confident we have got to the bottom of it.

then out comes another one from nsw 

[Tigeritis™©®]

Problem with the ALP is that if you read their constitution, it’s unlike any other party’s constitution, because they have stipulations that bind them in so many ways. The factions have rules written into the constitution to protect their interests.
Rudd highlighted this and we know what happened to him.

The difference with the ALP and say the liberal party is that the ALP have stipulations written into their constitution so they are bound by these rules. The other party’s including the liberal party do not have factional stipulations in their constitution so they are not bound by any factions because it’s not written as law within their constitution as the ALP have done.

All party’s have their factions but only one party have factional stipulations written into their constitution. This effects everything the ALP do in terms of their choices ie. preselection etc.

[Francois Jackson]

silence is deafening on dans covid, social and economic performance. We know how TT feels but be good to hear from a few of the others who have lauded his performance.

[WilliamPowell]

silence is deafening on dans covid, social and economic performance. We know how TT feels but be good to hear from a few of the others who have lauded his performance.

Clearly directed at me (again)

You will get a detailed response when  I am home and near my laptop

And my view on how the Prmeier has handled the pandemic hasn't changed

Not sure how it his fault that morons have refused to adhere to rules around family gatherings or people going to work when they have COVID

And please do not hide behind the BLM protests and use that as an excuse. Every state had those protests

People sooked (again will go into this point in more detail later) when we had the tightest restrictions wanted them lifted.... when they get lifted (pre protest) people did what they wanted and here we are.

Stupidity is stupidity. Selfishness ... by morons

But more later

[WilliamPowell]

Frankie; Sorry I've had a few things to deal with in the last week and a bit

Will go on record straight away and make 2 points
1/ You wont' agree with anything I say and that's fine
2/ You won't like some of the examples I am going to use to make some of my points

 IIRC you said a few months back Scomo was worse than Abbott or just about as bad.

Yep did say that and I will now say I got that wrong. Based on how he's handled this pandemic which is in some areas excellent and other areas average. I'd take ScoMo over Abbott any day.

So what are your thoughts on Daniel Andrews? This should be great to hear, because i can assure you if it was the other way caught red handed,  you would be sending Scomo or anyone from the libs to the Guantanamo bay.

Let's go through one by one OK?

First up

I think I've made views on corruption very very clear.  But just in case you missed it see below

So now we are going to rank corruption? And if we think it isn't too bad, we ignore it?

No thanks

Doesn't matter the scale anyone involved in it, from any party should be booted. End of story

On this there should only be one set of rules.

Rules that apply to every single pollie from the PM (basically lying about the sports rorts even though it's been proven he knew about it), to state premiers, to back benchers, to the the no name independent sitting in the senate

You can't pick and choose when you enforce the rules.

We might end up with no one in parliament but when you look at what we've got at the moment (again both sides) that might not be such a bad thing

Currently last week's event's are being investigated by IBAC (rightly) and let's see what comes of that.

Clearly, you believe Andrew's knew about this before the 60 minutes story. At this time there is NO evidence that he did so I will take that on face value. Get that's unacceptable to you but that's the way it is

I am very interested in why you've gone into attack mode over this but continue to excuse the Sports Rorts situation under ScoMo's watch, the failure of 2 of his minister's to co-operate with a AFP investigation, his failure to act against Dutton on his his no disclosure of property interests? And his government's failure to take responsibility of the Ruby Princess fiasco. Facts are Border Control is the responsibility of the Federal Govt; Dutton has failed and by extension on this one so has the PM...but I don't see your outrage here. Why is that?

Applying your very own set of rules this is all unacceptable but why are you applying bias?

Corruption is corruption, we don't get to rank it. there must be one set of rules for every side of politics. Funny now how those up in Canberra (all of them LNP, ALP, INP, greens etc) are falling over themselves to set up and independent Corruption body....

THE PANDEMIC: my view on this has not changed. Andrews has done an outstanding job just like all leaders have. As I said earlier not sure how you or the state opposition can blame the Premier for the actions of selfish morons.

Go back in this thread and you and others "sooked" about our lockdown restrictions not being eased. You complained about schooling at home. You wanted them lifted just like all other states. Then as soon as they are lifted people go off and don't give a stuff about others just themselves and here we are....

Recent test result have shown that the latest spike has nothing to do with the BLM protests but people refusing to continue to practice proper distancing, sticking to the rules around the numbers in gatherings. The easy out for everyone is to say it's because of the protest, no the blame is squarely at those who think of no one but themselves

As i said the other week

Again, not sure how some selfish protester and tests positive COVID is the Premier's fault.... what exactly were he and the cops supposed to do? Fine everyone? How do you manage that? How do you stop 30k+ plus people turning up to a protest, fine them and then move them on?? I'm interested to know

FWIW every state had the same issue; that is a mass protests by people who showed no regard or care about the safety of others in this pandemic

OTHER: I was disgusted by what Andrew's did regarding the CFA and his previous Emergency Services Minister - said it at the time. He was wrong, it was wrong. Clear enough for you?

But the one thing he is doing is sticking to his election promises. And that is a rarity in politics today. Whether they are all good is debatable (and yes there are some I don't agree with) but the things he said he'd deliver on his government is delivering on.

This is Dan the man in 2018, knowing full well about his old mate Somyurek's conduct earlier. But yeah he sacked him straight away this time only after he gave him a second go. hahaha

you really don't understand the fraction wars within the ALP do you

There is only only Premier who said this.

"I will not sit down, never sit down and negotiate with people who refuse to call out denigration of women.”

can we get your views on that now?

Yes you can, seeing the Somyurek text messages take a hammer to Andrews as well I doubt very much that he would have given him a job

Also, the text messages come after the above statement

And just so I am clear your disgust around comments that lead the the denigration of women; does it only apply to politicians or everyone?

Only asking because here are some of the gems from this forum on this thread

The result is another dent in labours future
They will be out of power for a very long time as long as that Witch is in power

So the witch declares the Medicare levy increase will form part of her election policies for us to vote on.

any party that puts an ugly,dumb slut in charge,fully deserve it

yeah i agree she has a real eye for that detail the dumb slag

I could go on...

Then of course i don't remember the same level of disgust a decade ago when the then Op Leader stood in front of signs denigrating the PM... no one called that out. Where was the rage? The disgust? Or was that OK because it was LNP pollie?

I won't even bother with the number of times there has been no call out of the denigration of female journos when they've written articles about our club ... why is that excatly?

We will park leave the homophobic slurs made against AFLW players out

You can't suddenly call this out when either posters on here have been doing it for years or they've applauded the same denigration over the years

Think it's called double standards 

So the question i'm asking you is what do you think of Daniel Andrews and his team now?  Just an honest question.

Answered, know you won't agree but I've answered

But here's a question for you

Why do you not apply the same set of rules to the Federal Govt that you are applying to the State Government especially around corruption and their biggest failure during this pandemic and that is the Ruby Princess?

you can't have it both ways

[1965]

A very impressive thesis.
From now on it is Dr William Powell.
 

[Francois Jackson]

Frankie; Sorry I've had a few things to deal with in the last week and a bit

Will go on record straight away and make 2 points
1/ You wont' agree with anything I say and that's fine
2/ You won't like some of the examples I am going to use to make some of my points

 IIRC you said a few months back Scomo was worse than Abbott or just about as bad.

Yep did say that and I will now say I got that wrong. Based on how he's handled this pandemic which is in some areas excellent and other areas average. I'd take ScoMo over Abbott any day.

So what are your thoughts on Daniel Andrews? This should be great to hear, because i can assure you if it was the other way caught red handed,  you would be sending Scomo or anyone from the libs to the Guantanamo bay.

Let's go through one by one OK?

First up

I think I've made views on corruption very very clear.  But just in case you missed it see below

So now we are going to rank corruption? And if we think it isn't too bad, we ignore it?

No thanks

Doesn't matter the scale anyone involved in it, from any party should be booted. End of story

On this there should only be one set of rules.

Rules that apply to every single pollie from the PM (basically lying about the sports rorts even though it's been proven he knew about it), to state premiers, to back benchers, to the the no name independent sitting in the senate

You can't pick and choose when you enforce the rules.

We might end up with no one in parliament but when you look at what we've got at the moment (again both sides) that might not be such a bad thing

Currently last week's event's are being investigated by IBAC (rightly) and let's see what comes of that.

Clearly, you believe Andrew's knew about this before the 60 minutes story. At this time there is NO evidence that he did so I will take that on face value. Get that's unacceptable to you but that's the way it is

I am very interested in why you've gone into attack mode over this but continue to excuse the Sports Rorts situation under ScoMo's watch, the failure of 2 of his minister's to co-operate with a AFP investigation, his failure to act against Dutton on his his no disclosure of property interests? And his government's failure to take responsibility of the Ruby Princess fiasco. Facts are Border Control is the responsibility of the Federal Govt; Dutton has failed and by extension on this one so has the PM...but I don't see your outrage here. Why is that?

Applying your very own set of rules this is all unacceptable but why are you applying bias?

Corruption is corruption, we don't get to rank it. there must be one set of rules for every side of politics. Funny now how those up in Canberra (all of them LNP, ALP, INP, greens etc) are falling over themselves to set up and independent Corruption body....

THE PANDEMIC: my view on this has not changed. Andrews has done an outstanding job just like all leaders have. As I said earlier not sure how you or the state opposition can blame the Premier for the actions of selfish morons.

Go back in this thread and you and others "sooked" about our lockdown restrictions not being eased. You complained about schooling at home. You wanted them lifted just like all other states. Then as soon as they are lifted people go off and don't give a stuff about others just themselves and here we are....

Recent test result have shown that the latest spike has nothing to do with the BLM protests but people refusing to continue to practice proper distancing, sticking to the rules around the numbers in gatherings. The easy out for everyone is to say it's because of the protest, no the blame is squarely at those who think of no one but themselves

As i said the other week

Again, not sure how some selfish protester and tests positive COVID is the Premier's fault.... what exactly were he and the cops supposed to do? Fine everyone? How do you manage that? How do you stop 30k+ plus people turning up to a protest, fine them and then move them on?? I'm interested to know

FWIW every state had the same issue; that is a mass protests by people who showed no regard or care about the safety of others in this pandemic

OTHER: I was disgusted by what Andrew's did regarding the CFA and his previous Emergency Services Minister - said it at the time. He was wrong, it was wrong. Clear enough for you?

But the one thing he is doing is sticking to his election promises. And that is a rarity in politics today. Whether they are all good is debatable (and yes there are some I don't agree with) but the things he said he'd deliver on his government is delivering on.

This is Dan the man in 2018, knowing full well about his old mate Somyurek's conduct earlier. But yeah he sacked him straight away this time only after he gave him a second go. hahaha

you really don't understand the fraction wars within the ALP do you

There is only only Premier who said this.

"I will not sit down, never sit down and negotiate with people who refuse to call out denigration of women.”

can we get your views on that now?

Yes you can, seeing the Somyurek text messages take a hammer to Andrews as well I doubt very much that he would have given him a job

Also, the text messages come after the above statement

And just so I am clear your disgust around comments that lead the the denigration of women; does it only apply to politicians or everyone?

Only asking because here are some of the gems from this forum on this thread

The result is another dent in labours future
They will be out of power for a very long time as long as that Witch is in power

So the witch declares the Medicare levy increase will form part of her election policies for us to vote on.

any party that puts an ugly,dumb slut in charge,fully deserve it

yeah i agree she has a real eye for that detail the dumb slag

I could go on...

Then of course i don't remember the same level of disgust a decade ago when the then Op Leader stood in front of signs denigrating the PM... no one called that out. Where was the rage? The disgust? Or was that OK because it was LNP pollie?

I won't even bother with the number of times there has been no call out of the denigration of female journos when they've written articles about our club ... why is that excatly?

We will park leave the homophobic slurs made against AFLW players out

You can't suddenly call this out when either posters on here have been doing it for years or they've applauded the same denigration over the years

Think it's called double standards 

So the question i'm asking you is what do you think of Daniel Andrews and his team now?  Just an honest question.

Answered, know you won't agree but I've answered

But here's a question for you

Why do you not apply the same set of rules to the Federal Govt that you are applying to the State Government especially around corruption and their biggest failure during this pandemic and that is the Ruby Princess?

you can't have it both ways

ruby princess whether you like it not is still under investigation and it seems like its a state issue. You can harp on it as much as you like but those are the facts. On one hand you are wanting to wait for the completion of a ibac probe into andrews team, then you you go on theatatck over ruby princess when that investigation is still underway  Whoever is at fault they should cop their right whack.

I will repeat it again, only now that dan is on the back foot is it safe to bring up the issues from the "other side"  I could bring up the same on the international thread when people like obama who dropped a bomb every 5 mins on international soil escapes criticism all those years ago, when compared to trump.

There is a systemic issue with the andrews government and its been laid bare for all to see. Have all governments been guilty of this, of course. Though this is about andrews, just like when it was your turn to wack scomo, calling him worse than abbott, waving his hands in church, turncoat, and myself with gillard and co. I could go on about the brumby led fiasco on black saturday which didnt get a negative mention, unlike scomo during bushfire month. No different to know so you have to suck it up unfortunately.

Back on Andrews and his fraction wars. I get all that. So, Dan knowing all that, allowed the turk back in twice, firstly after he assaulted that girl, and a second time when he assaulted that other person in his office. Dan followed that up with a glowing endorsement as well. What the public or anyone has to say about woman or anyone in general is just pure deflection to the case in point. Its about what the premier accepts, and clearly it wasnt an issue for him, as he he brushed it off. His government has been littered with controversy after controversy, and im glad you brought up the biggest one.

As for the BLM protestors. Well if it was scomo i can assure you the attacks would have come hard and fast from the usual suspects led by you and TT. Andrews from what i recall let the momentum build up over it during the week, and if i recall his only speech on it came 2pm the day before. (i stand corrected, but thats what i recall) By letting that occur, people became complacent and/or didnt care anymore. Its obvious to many why they took that stance. He was even posting twitter feed on black lives matter, then telling people not to attend.

There was a rule for one and another set of rules for the rest. It was a bad decision not to enforce it from the beginning of that week, that put lives at risk. Compare that to what NSW did which was force it to the federal court. At least they were pro active in trying to stop such a poorly timed protest.

[Francois Jackson]

silence is deafening on dans covid, social and economic performance. We know how TT feels but be good to hear from a few of the others who have lauded his performance.

Clearly directed at me (again)

You will get a detailed response when  I am home and near my laptop

And my view on how the Prmeier has handled the pandemic hasn't changed

Not sure how it his fault that morons have refused to adhere to rules around family gatherings or people going to work when they have COVID

And please do not hide behind the BLM protests and use that as an excuse. Every state had those protests

People sooked (again will go into this point in more detail later) when we had the tightest restrictions wanted them lifted.... when they get lifted (pre protest) people did what they wanted and here we are.

Stupidity is stupidity. Selfishness ... by morons

But more later

i have answered this, but i will answer it again. He had his chance to put a stop to it very early in the week and didnt, so now he is rightly so facing the criticism he deserves.

You or i dont know if that thats the reason, but the chief medical officer of the country said it may have made people care very little about the process. You cant have one rule for one and a new set of rules for everyone else.

A real leader would have condemned it from day one, not allow momentum build up. I have no issue with the protest, but i have an issue when it has unintended consequences.

[Francois Jackson]

Not sure which is worse a totally imcompetant government or a corrupt one

Currently we have one that combines the 2

But I'm sure people will continue to defend them

Not sure how anyone can defend or support any govt that has been proven to be corrupt like our current mob have over the sports sorts fiasco

this hasn't aged well. So to be clear WP will you say the same thing about anyone who supports or defends the andrews government including yourself?

Just curious. These were your words not mine.

[one-eyed]

Victoria has gained another seat while WA and NT have lost one each.


Source: Ghostwhovotes twitter.

[Francois Jackson]

Victoria has requested help from the Australian Army.

My word what a mess this state has became, and it all started with the disgraceful soft messaging allowing those fools to protest, then of course the rorting of tax payer money.

According to some he has done a great job, though the silence tells a difference story


https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/health-wellbeing/coronavirus-cases-in-victoria-surged-after-blm-protests-health-minister-says-c-1122012?fbclid=IwAR3vpQmL23C_7PCD0i9TsXS2cE2sWrU3kV4x9pNpn6MBarpkv3kd0SCx9kY

[1965]

My word what a mess this state has became, and it all started with the disgraceful soft messaging allowing those fools to protest, then of course the rorting of tax payer money.

According to some he has done a great job, though the silence tells a difference story

The current surge in COVID19 cases in Victoria is a direct result of the shoddy job the Federal Libs done in communicating to the ethnic and migrant populations. FACT

[Tigeritis™©®]

My word what a mess this state has became, and it all started with the disgraceful soft messaging allowing those fools to protest, then of course the rorting of tax payer money.

According to some he has done a great job, though the silence tells a difference story

The current surge in COVID19 cases in Victoria is a direct result of the shoddy job the Federal Libs done in communicating to the ethnic and migrant populations. FACT

hilarious