can we win without

[the claw]

/ ivan maric ruckmen are always getting hurt can we win without him.
2/ cotchin clubs are always losing their best players at some time.
3/ tuck hes a good foor soldier but important.
4/ riewoldt  while not in his greatest form hes the only decent tall forward we have atm.

some clubs have at times 10 to 15 players on the injured list sometimes more. thats just 4 of our better ones can we win games without them. especially against the better sides.
look at sydney with out goodes and mumford.

[cub]

5/ Grimes Batchelor - Apart from Rance and Newman the anchors of our weakness which is our backline - Hold on wait a sec 

Point ! Who knows until it happens, Maric probably being the most important coz there is no one else

[Loui Tufga]

/ ivan maric ruckmen are always getting hurt can we win without him.
2/ cotchin clubs are always losing their best players at some time.
3/ tuck hes a good foor soldier but important.
4/ riewoldt  while not in his greatest form hes the only decent tall forward we have atm.

some clubs have at times 10 to 15 players on the injured list sometimes more. thats just 4 of our better ones can we win games without them. especially against the better sides.
look at sydney with out goodes and mumford.

But according to you we have a heap of players in the seconds Just waiting to be unearthed! It would all depend though on who has been in the bests 2 or 3 weeks in a row but if it was to happen this week according to your logic the changes would be as follows...
Maric/Derickx
Cotchin/Weberley
Tuck/Arnot
Reiwoldt/ Post

I cant see your issue here

[Hellenic Tiger]

Claw I'm not saying we have arrived far from it.

Neither am I suggesting that you are wrong....

But right now for me the glass is half full and rising albeit slowly slowly.

[Judge Roughneck]

/ ivan maric ruckmen are always getting hurt can we win without him.
2/ cotchin clubs are always losing their best players at some time.
3/ tuck hes a good foor soldier but important.
4/ riewoldt  while not in his greatest form hes the only decent tall forward we have atm.

some clubs have at times 10 to 15 players on the injured list sometimes more. thats just 4 of our better ones can we win games without them. especially against the better sides.
look at sydney with out goodes and mumford.

I love tuck but is not vital.

Helbig. Aarnot. White. Darrou. Connors. OHanlon.

[mightytiges]

Take the 1st ruck, best mid, another inside ballwinner and best key forward out of virtually all sides and they'll take a huge hit. What was pleasing on the weekend was we lost two valuable defenders leading into the game and yet still kept Hawthorn to a lowish score. Our defensive structures held up despite the change in personnel. Those that came into the side did their role.

[tony_montana]

Take the 1st ruck, best mid, another inside ballwinner and best key forward out of virtually all sides and they'll take a huge hit. What was pleasing on the weekend was we lost two valuable defenders leading into the game and yet still kept Hawthorn to a lowish score. Our defensive structures held up despite the change in personnel. Those that came into the side did their role.

This

Pretty pointless argument from the op. Look at Carlton minus carazzo and Jamison, Geelong minus ottens, ling, hawks minus hodge, swans minus mummy, eagles when they had 6 of their key players out got hammered by 10-15 goals. Every side will suffer significantly if you take 4-5 important players out. Take Cloke, pendles, swan and their ruck man out and let's see how the pies would go...

[Penelope]

like a pig looking for mud to wallow in during a drought, some will seek out misery to wallow in regardless.

[the claw]

like a pig looking for mud to wallow in during a drought, some will seek out misery to wallow in regardless.

you see you never get it you probably never will because mediocrity is acceptable to you.

the point being made the depth. we are all happy it seems to scrape into the 8 me im hoping we can build a dynasty that will net 3 or 4 premierships.

what is sustainable at the club. nothing

we have one ruckman there are no others up to afl standard.
we have one proven kpf there are no others up to afl standard.
we have two kpds there are no others up to afl standared.
we have no small/med  forwards of quality.
we have a limited number of mids  no where near enough.

look at collingwood tarrant,brown, reid, now keefe,  running back johnson, mids swan and ball ruckman jolly has missed as well.
they manage to win despite the injuries.
a comparable list would be grimes, rance, griffiths, our next best tall defender  newman, cotchin, tuck and ivan missing games or playing under a cloudwe would get smashed if we had a similar group out . not just by the better sides either.
name one genuine mid we have in the wings ready to come in if we lose a two good mids. who replaces ivan angus sheesh we have been there done that. or tyrone the squib lol.
who replaces rance grimes and griffiths there is no one. its a massive gap from our top 14 or so players to the rest.

we have been blessed the last few yrs we have had minimal injuries and at some stage it will turn around and all im asking is where does it leave us. what do we want mediocrity or something great.

[tony_montana]

we're not all happy to just scrape into the finals claw, take it easy.

From where we are coming from, most are happy to see we are finally on the right track, this doesnt mean we all expect to see jackson, edwards, King, nahas, mcguane, white etc etc stay a part of this over the next several years, we expect the natural progression to continue and that over the next 2-3-4-5 drafts(actually every draft from here on in) we will continue to cut the deadwood and grow the list and with it, grow our DEPTH! Telling us all the bleeding obvious, is a futile excercise - we know -  save that sort of preaching for BF 

[Loui Tufga]

we're not all happy to just scrape into the finals claw, take it easy.

From where we are coming from, most are happy to see we are finally on the right track, this doesnt mean we all expect to see jackson, edwards, King, nahas, mcguane, white etc etc stay a part of this over the next several years, we expect the natural progression to continue and that over the next 2-3-4-5 drafts(actually every draft from here on in) we will continue to cut the deadwood and grow the list and with it, grow our DEPTH! Telling us all the bleeding obvious, is a futile excercise - we know -  save that sort of preaching for BF 

Stop making sense Tony, it's hurting the eyes of those to short sighted to see the bigger piture  

[the claw]

we're not all happy to just scrape into the finals claw, take it easy.

From where we are coming from, most are happy to see we are finally on the right track, this doesnt mean we all expect to see jackson, edwards, King, nahas, mcguane, white etc etc stay a part of this over the next several years, we expect the natural progression to continue and that over the next 2-3-4-5 drafts(actually every draft from here on in) we will continue to cut the deadwood and grow the list and with it, grow our DEPTH! Telling us all the bleeding obvious, is a futile excercise - we know -  save that sort of preaching for BF 

i will ask just one question.
not talking best 22 here . is our list a finals list. will refine it. take out rookies and say two or 3 development players who are obviously a way off do we have say 30 - 35  players who can take us to finals.are our bottom 6 in the 22 good enough and if we lose just good players a mixture that is of those up to standard thru to v/good will we crash and dive.
ive seen this before and ive gotta tell ya i carry on so much because ive seen us so many time think the job is done when theres miles to go. i can tell ya now if this rebuild goes off the rails there will be many of us who will say no more see ya later do the hard yards and see it right thru for just once in 27yrs.

if we all run around patting each other on the back we are all going to end up believing we are there. i will at every single opportunity point out to supporters that we have a long way to go. i will only stop when we have the depth and quality to have sustained success based on what has worked for other clubs who have had dynastys. sorry if i pee people off but i wont get burnt by this mob again.

you know what the obvious is we are setting ourselves up for another fall.

[Loui Tufga]

we're not all happy to just scrape into the finals claw, take it easy.

From where we are coming from, most are happy to see we are finally on the right track, this doesnt mean we all expect to see jackson, edwards, King, nahas, mcguane, white etc etc stay a part of this over the next several years, we expect the natural progression to continue and that over the next 2-3-4-5 drafts(actually every draft from here on in) we will continue to cut the deadwood and grow the list and with it, grow our DEPTH! Telling us all the bleeding obvious, is a futile excercise - we know -  save that sort of preaching for BF 

i will ask just one question.
not talking best 22 here . is our list a finals list. will refine it. take out rookies and say two or 3 development players who are obviously a way off do we have say 30 - 35  players who can take us to finals.are our bottom 6 in the 22 good enough and if we lose just good players a mixture that is of those up to standard thru to v/good will we crash and dive.
ive seen this before and ive gotta tell ya i carry on so much because ive seen us so many time think the job is done when theres miles to go. i can tell ya now if this rebuild goes off the rails there will be many of us who will say no more see ya later do the hard yards and see it right thru for just once in 27yrs.

if we all run around patting each other on the back we are all going to end up believing we are there. i will at every single opportunity point out to supporters that we have a long way to go. i will only stop when we have the depth and quality to have sustained success based on what has worked for other clubs who have had dynastys. sorry if i pee people off but i wont get burnt by this mob again.

you know what the obvious is we are setting ourselves up for another fall.

Claw, who is running round patting who on the back? Every body can see the club and the list still have away's to go but FFS just enjoy the development that we have seen so far. We are winning game's we are playing 100% better than this time last year but i'm sure the club is not happy to just stop there. Changes will be made as they have done over the last 3 years, nobody is sitting on there hands be assured of that but there is nothing we can do to improve our list RIGHT NOW, like every other team we have to wait to the seasons end before we can CONTINUE  to improve our list. Our recruiters have done a great job over the past 3 seasons i'm sure it will continue but unfortunately its a process and one that doesn't just happen overnight.....You need to get over it

[the claw]

sorry tas but i cant let this go been thru it too many times. when we have all the pieces in place win lose or draw i will sit back and enjoy the ride. i dont want to go thru another false dawn this is where this freakin club has taken me.
i worry that a little success will see us do what we have always  done the last 30 yrs. that is do half a job.fair enouugh a lot say they acknowledge we have a bit to do still but i wont be happy until we do it.
you lot will have to put up with me for just a little while longer i think.get it right about two draft periods.

[Loui Tufga]

sorry tas but i cant let this go been thru it too many times. when we have all the pieces in place win lose or draw i will sit back and enjoy the ride. i dont want to go thru another false dawn this is where this freakin club has taken me.
i worry that a little success will see us do what we have always  done the last 30 yrs. that is do half a job.fair enouugh a lot say they acknowledge we have a bit to do still but i wont be happy until we do it.
you lot will have to put up with me for just a little while longer i think.get it right about two draft periods.

But surly mate you can see the pieces finally starting to fall where they should? Just because were actually winning a few games and are finally being competitive against the better sides doesn't mean it a bad thing, its called progression! would you rather us not bother try at all and deliberately loose games untill the powers to be feel we have the list with the depth to "Make a tilt at the finals"?
Doing what were doing isn't a bad thing, and if we do get injures and do fall away toward the end of the season well so be it, that's the list we have and that's the list we have been slowly building for the last 3 years. We will continue to grow and build the list and as the younger players come through it will get stronger but mate, its all about patients, it will come, and the way were tracking were not as far off as some would think.